Crabtree will be a bust (1 Viewer)

[RockHard]

I have been a lurker on this board for awhile occasionally commenting on certain topics. Therefore I understand that most wont value my opinion but I feel so strongly that Crabtree will be a bust that I have been compelled to start this topic. I am prepared to be ridiculed but let me state my case:

Exhibit A

Tech Texas Offense - Crabtree's college production in Lubbock isnt unprecedented, in fact there are a few players who have put up comparable numbers.

Player Pos Cl Gm Catches Yds TDs Rec/Gm Yds/Catch Yds/Gm YearDanny Amendola, Texas Tech WR SR 13 109 1245 6 8.38 11.42 95.77 2007Joel Filani, Texas Tech WR SR 13 91 1300 13 7.00 14.29 100.00 2006Jarrett Hicks, Texas Tech WR SO 12 76 1177 13 6.33 15.49 98.08 2004The statistics above illustrate that players with marginal talent, by NFL standards, are capable of putting up big numbers. It is my contention that Crabtree is merely a product of the system. Exhibit B

Route Running Ability - Many pundits have questioned the route running ability of Maclin & Harvin but when I watch Texas Tech I dont see many NFL routes. Most of Texas Tech's plays are bubble screens, hitches, and slants; I dont see any outs, come backs, or corner routes. Furthermore I dont believe that Crabtree can beat press coverage. Very seldom did he face press coverage and when he did he used some "hop step" technique, I dont believe that this tactic will work against NFL cornerbacks.

Exhibit C

Attitude - The last few weeks there have been whispers above Crabtree being a diva, furthermore Crabtree's former college roommate was arrested by the DEA and charged with cocaine possession with the intent to deliver. However it is this quote from an ESPN The Magazine that I found telling:

Each morning, Crabtree wakes up at 11:30, then sits in bed, simultaneously watching movies on his flat-screen and Young Jeezy videos on his laptop. At around 2 p.m. he makes a move, but he can’t shower, not with his foot in a cast. So the 6′1″, 215-pound former Texas Tech receiver climbs into the tub—his first baths since grade school—bum foot hanging over the edge. At 3 he leaves his place for the first time, impressively fleet on a set of crutches, for lunch at Pappadeaux. The menu: fried shrimp and mashed potatoes, with two lemonades—one with freshly squeezed straw-berries, the other with uncut berries floating in the drink like ice. Then it’s back home for more movies and videos. At 10 Crabtree orders a pepperoni thick-crust from Pizza Hut, the empty box joining nine others stacked like a Jenga game on his kitchen counter. “That’s my regimen,” he says.

You certainly have to question his work ethic after reading that quote. Finally I dont believe that Crabtree is a great athlete I see no explosion from him when coming out of breaks, he is slow, he carries the ball like a loaf of bread, he isnt big or physically imposing and he wore a lavender shirt to the draft.

 

[Mark Wimer]

... and he wore a lavender shirt to the draft.

Well, that's settled, then, isn't it?LOL

 

[Gopher State]

I have been a lurker on this board for awhile occasionally commenting on certain topics. Therefore I understand that most wont value my opinion but I feel so strongly that Crabtree will be a bust that I have been compelled to start this topic. I am prepared to be ridiculed but let me state my case:

Exhibit A

Tech Texas Offense - Crabtree's college production in Lubbock isnt unprecedented, in fact there are a few players who have put up comparable numbers.

Player Pos Cl Gm Catches Yds TDs Rec/Gm Yds/Catch Yds/Gm YearDanny Amendola, Texas Tech WR SR 13 109 1245 6 8.38 11.42 95.77 2007Joel Filani, Texas Tech WR SR 13 91 1300 13 7.00 14.29 100.00 2006Jarrett Hicks, Texas Tech WR SO 12 76 1177 13 6.33 15.49 98.08 2004The statistics above illustrate that players with marginal talent, by NFL standards, are capable of putting up big numbers. It is my contention that Crabtree is merely a product of the system. Exhibit B

Route Running Ability - Many pundits have questioned the route running ability of Maclin & Harvin but when I watch Texas Tech I dont see many NFL routes. Most of Texas Tech's plays are bubble screens, hitches, and slants; I dont see any outs, come backs, or corner routes. Furthermore I dont believe that Crabtree can beat press coverage. Very seldom did he face press coverage and when he did he used some "hop step" technique, I dont believe that this tactic will work against NFL cornerbacks.

Exhibit C

Attitude - The last few weeks there have been whispers above Crabtree being a diva, furthermore Crabtree's former college roommate was arrested by the DEA and charged with cocaine possession with the intent to deliver. However it is this quote from an ESPN The Magazine that I found telling:

Each morning, Crabtree wakes up at 11:30, then sits in bed, simultaneously watching movies on his flat-screen and Young Jeezy videos on his laptop. At around 2 p.m. he makes a move, but he can’t shower, not with his foot in a cast. So the 6′1″, 215-pound former Texas Tech receiver climbs into the tub—his first baths since grade school—bum foot hanging over the edge. At 3 he leaves his place for the first time, impressively fleet on a set of crutches, for lunch at Pappadeaux. The menu: fried shrimp and mashed potatoes, with two lemonades—one with freshly squeezed straw-berries, the other with uncut berries floating in the drink like ice. Then it’s back home for more movies and videos. At 10 Crabtree orders a pepperoni thick-crust from Pizza Hut, the empty box joining nine others stacked like a Jenga game on his kitchen counter. “That’s my regimen,” he says.

You certainly have to question his work ethic after reading that quote. Finally I dont believe that Crabtree is a great athlete I see no explosion from him when coming out of breaks, he is slow, he carries the ball like a loaf of bread, he isnt big or physically imposing and he wore a lavender shirt to the draft.

this is sooo I sure Crabtree will get the last when he is ROY

 

[Banger]

... and he wore a lavender shirt to the draft.

Well, that's settled, then, isn't it?LOL

I thought the same exact thing...

 

[Bojang0301]

Guy has David Terrell written all over him.

 

[millertyme1]

He eats Pizza Hut!?!?!

I was on the fence, but this is the tipping point for me.

 

[TheFanatic]

... and he wore a lavender shirt to the draft.

Well, that's settled, then, isn't it?LOL

Honestly, outside of that fluff comment, the write up was well written and well thought out....And this will be followed with a lot of conjecture and anecdotal evidence from the Crabtree fans and it will all be wasted...ETA

Didn't even have my comment complete when we get this equally well thought out and well written comment:

this is sooo I sure Crabtree will get the last when he is ROY

Compelling rebuttal. Rock Hard, care to rebut?

 

[puckalicious]

and he wore a lavender shirt to the draft.

You sold me. This guy will suck pretty bad.How many Texas Tech WR's were as good as Crabtree as a freshman and who played QB in high school and were drafted in the first round of the NFL draft?

 

[TheFanatic]

and he wore a lavender shirt to the draft.

You sold me. This guy will suck pretty bad.How many Texas Tech WR's were as good as Crabtree as a freshman and who played QB in high school and were drafted in the first round of the NFL draft?

What does that have to do with anything? He played another position in HS? So? And he was drafted in the first round which means he has a 50-50 chance of making it in the NFL.

 

[FUBAR]

FTR, I think he'll disapoint many but won't be a complete bust. I've watched a lot of his games and while he'll make the occasional great play against a bad defender, he doesn't strike me as a Calvin/Fitz/AJ type. He's more Terrell but I think he'll be better. He's not top 3 pick worthy in this FF rookie class.

 

[FUBAR]

He eats Pizza Hut!?!?!I was on the fence, but this is the tipping point for me.

Poppa John's would make him a pro-bowler.

 

[One]

and he wore a lavender shirt to the draft.

So what.. the guy likes fashion.

Mike Singletary discussing Crabtree:

We sat down and talked, and I said, ‘What is your hobby? What is one of your hobbies?’ And he said, ‘I can sit in front of a computer and really get into fashion. You’re never going to see me wear the same thing twice. I’m really into fashion. I like designing things.’ And I’m looking at him, so I said, ‘Wait a minute, hold on. Fashion? Wait a minute now. How can this, what do you mean fashion?’

49ers.com

 

[fridayfrenzy]

You can nit pick a few things of every single rookie and use that to say a player will be a bust.

 

[BuckeyeArt]

and he wore a lavender shirt to the draft.

You sold me. This guy will suck pretty bad.How many Texas Tech WR's were as good as Crabtree as a freshman and who played QB in high school and were drafted in the first round of the NFL draft?

What does that have to do with anything? He played another position in HS? So? And he was drafted in the first round which means he has a 50-50 chance of making it in the NFL.

I think he's pointing out that Crabtree produced those numbers despite not playing WR in high school.

 

[sparkky]

I'm one of the few but if given a choice I'd take Maclin over Crabby.

 

[FUBAR]

and he wore a lavender shirt to the draft.

So what.. the guy likes fashion.

Mike Singletary discussing Crabtree:

We sat down and talked, and I said, ‘What is your hobby? What is one of your hobbies?’

And he said,

‘I can sit in front of a computer and really get into fashion. You’re never going to see me wear the same thing twice. I’m really into fashion. I like designing things.’ And I’m looking at him, so I said, ‘Wait a minute, hold on. Fashion? Wait a minute now. How can this, what do you mean fashion?’

link

at least he's going to the right city.

 

[foxco]

Pretty well thought out argument. I disagree and think he's going to be an elite WR (maybe not quite Fitzy/Calvin, but top 6ish) for years. The thing that strikes me about him is that he seems to have amazing instincts, the stuff you can't teach. He will come down with the ball. He has amazing physical ability and the intangibles that make one great IMO, which is all you can ask for in a prospect.

 

[Bojang0301]

I'm one of the few but if given a choice I'd take Maclin over Crabby.

I'd take DHB over both.

 

[Banger]

I'm one of the few but if given a choice I'd take Maclin over Crabby.

I'd take DHB over both.

Al? Shouldn't you be taking your nap?

 

[footballguy#1]

I'm one of the few but if given a choice I'd take Maclin over Crabby.

I'd take DHB over both.

Mr. Davis, is that you?

 

[TheFanatic]

and he wore a lavender shirt to the draft.

You sold me. This guy will suck pretty bad.How many Texas Tech WR's were as good as Crabtree as a freshman and who played QB in high school and were drafted in the first round of the NFL draft?

What does that have to do with anything? He played another position in HS? So? And he was drafted in the first round which means he has a 50-50 chance of making it in the NFL.

I think he's pointing out that Crabtree produced those numbers despite not playing WR in high school.

That makes sense. I was just looking at him playing QB so it made him smarter or something. But the 1st round thing just means that he has about a 50-50 chance of succeeding. Guys picked first overall fail all the time. He can too. I really don't have a dog in this fight. I'm not looking to draft the guy but if he were to fall to me I would consider it. I have no real opinion either way on the guy. But the OP has some sound reasoning and then all the hacks come in here with fluff to refute it....

 

[foxco]

and he wore a lavender shirt to the draft.

You sold me. This guy will suck pretty bad.How many Texas Tech WR's were as good as Crabtree as a freshman and who played QB in high school and were drafted in the first round of the NFL draft?

What does that have to do with anything? He played another position in HS? So? And he was drafted in the first round which means he has a 50-50 chance of making it in the NFL.

I think he's pointing out that Crabtree produced those numbers despite not playing WR in high school.

That makes sense. I was just looking at him playing QB so it made him smarter or something. But the 1st round thing just means that he has about a 50-50 chance of succeeding. Guys picked first overall fail all the time. He can too. I really don't have a dog in this fight. I'm not looking to draft the guy but if he were to fall to me I would consider it. I have no real opinion either way on the guy. But the OP has some sound reasoning and then all the hacks come in here with fluff to refute it....

Exhibit C seems a little strange since he had a cast on at the time and really couldn't do much in terms of conditioning. If he's still acting like that without the cast, I'd be concerned, but really him ordering pizzas and watching TV etc. while waiting for his foot to heal doesn't strike me as anything out of the ordinary.

 

[lyon812]

I think that the bit about routes and previous performances by WR of lesser talent is certainly well thought out, and food for thought.

Exhibit C is stretching a bit, though.

 

[RockHard]

Regarding exhibit C, I just cant see Rice or Irvin waking up at noon on the eve of the draft even if they were injured. Everytime Crabtree was profiled on NFLN's Path to the Draft he was doing something totally unrelated to football. I understand he was injured but he never really even talked about the game. He was more concerned about what he was going to wear or where he was going to live. The point that I was trying to make is that Crabtree doesnt appear to have a passion for football.

 

[Bojang0301]

Al? Shouldn't you be taking your nap?

Mr. Davis, is that you?

For the most part I'm kidding and wanted to see what kind of reactions I would get. In reality though no one has shown me what the difference is between the WR's this year. All of them look middle of the road before the draft and are crap shoots now. I still don't see how any logical person, even in PPC would consider them over Beanie or Knowshon at very least. I think Hakeem Nicks and Kenny Britt have just as much chance as the supposed "big three" of making an impact and really like gems like Mike Wallace, Jarrett Dillard, Mike Thomas, Mohammed Massaquoi and Derrick Williams. Just not seeing the value of taking a WR high this year. Heck you can get Harvin around 1.10 - 1.12 and he was a game breaker in college as much as I don't like Florida WR's.

 

[awesomeness]

A) None of those stats you've listed look at all similar to 134 receptions, 1962 yards, 22 TDs to me. Having said that, college stats are one of the worst barometeres to use to figure out if a guy is going to be a NFL success. Crabtree was picked in the top 10 of the NFL draft because of his talent and ability, not because of his statistics.

B) Crabtree cuts his routes sharp, and he's able to create seperation easily as he explodes out of his cuts. He's going to have to work on his route running in training camp and whatnot, but i have little doubt that he'll be able to run the entire route tree in no time at all. Just because Crabtree very rarely had to beat press coverage doesn't mean he won't be able to. The 2 best ways to beat press coverage are with quickness or strength. Those are two of the best qualities that Crabtree possesses, elite quickness and he's stronger than the large majority of cornerbacks.

C) Attitude? Really? Crabtree's got the same attitude that all star WRs have. It's the attitude of a winner, a guys who wants the ball in his hand so he can help the team win. I like his quote when someone from NFLN talked to him after he was still there at about pick #9 and Crabtree said something like "I just look forward to playing against all these teams that are passing on me". That's the kind of attitude i like out of a player, he's angry.

 

[foxco]

The point that I was trying to make is that Crabtree doesnt appear to have a passion for football.

I can see that, though I've read he does have a love for the game, along with a fierce competitiveness to him. Be very interesting to see how he pans out. Physically he is hands down the most talented in this year's class IMO (I do like Maclin, though).

 

[Garrett]

I have been a lurker on this board for awhile occasionally commenting on certain topics. Therefore I understand that most wont value my opinion but I feel so strongly that Crabtree will be a bust that I have been compelled to start this topic. I am prepared to be ridiculed but let me state my case:

Exhibit A

Tech Texas Offense - Crabtree's college production in Lubbock isnt unprecedented, in fact there are a few players who have put up comparable numbers.

Player Pos Cl Gm Catches Yds TDs Rec/Gm Yds/Catch Yds/Gm YearDanny Amendola, Texas Tech WR SR 13 109 1245 6 8.38 11.42 95.77 2007Joel Filani, Texas Tech WR SR 13 91 1300 13 7.00 14.29 100.00 2006Jarrett Hicks, Texas Tech WR SO 12 76 1177 13 6.33 15.49 98.08 2004The statistics above illustrate that players with marginal talent, by NFL standards, are capable of putting up big numbers. It is my contention that Crabtree is merely a product of the system. Exhibit B

Route Running Ability - Many pundits have questioned the route running ability of Maclin & Harvin but when I watch Texas Tech I dont see many NFL routes. Most of Texas Tech's plays are bubble screens, hitches, and slants; I dont see any outs, come backs, or corner routes. Furthermore I dont believe that Crabtree can beat press coverage. Very seldom did he face press coverage and when he did he used some "hop step" technique, I dont believe that this tactic will work against NFL cornerbacks.

Exhibit C

Attitude - The last few weeks there have been whispers above Crabtree being a diva, furthermore Crabtree's former college roommate was arrested by the DEA and charged with cocaine possession with the intent to deliver. However it is this quote from an ESPN The Magazine that I found telling:

Each morning, Crabtree wakes up at 11:30, then sits in bed, simultaneously watching movies on his flat-screen and Young Jeezy videos on his laptop. At around 2 p.m. he makes a move, but he can’t shower, not with his foot in a cast. So the 6′1″, 215-pound former Texas Tech receiver climbs into the tub—his first baths since grade school—bum foot hanging over the edge. At 3 he leaves his place for the first time, impressively fleet on a set of crutches, for lunch at Pappadeaux. The menu: fried shrimp and mashed potatoes, with two lemonades—one with freshly squeezed straw-berries, the other with uncut berries floating in the drink like ice. Then it’s back home for more movies and videos. At 10 Crabtree orders a pepperoni thick-crust from Pizza Hut, the empty box joining nine others stacked like a Jenga game on his kitchen counter. “That’s my regimen,” he says.

You certainly have to question his work ethic after reading that quote. Finally I dont believe that Crabtree is a great athlete I see no explosion from him when coming out of breaks, he is slow, he carries the ball like a loaf of bread, he isnt big or physically imposing and he wore a lavender shirt to the draft.

 

[FUBAR]

That makes sense. I was just looking at him playing QB so it made him smarter or something. But the 1st round thing just means that he has about a 50-50 chance of succeeding. Guys picked first overall fail all the time. He can too.

FWIW, WRs taken top 10 in the last 20 years:1 2007 1 2 Calvin Johnson WR DET 2007 2008 0 0 2 31 7 51 1 126 2087 16 Georgia Tech 2 2007 1 9 Ted Ginn Jr. WR MIA 2007 2008 0 0 2 32 9 76 2 90 1210 4 Ohio State 8 2005 1 3 Braylon Edwards WR CLE 2005 2008 0 1 3 58 3 7 0 228 3558 28 Michigan 9 2005 1 7 Troy Williamson WR MIN 2005 2008 0 0 1 47 6 58 0 84 1097 4 South Carolina 10 2005 1 10 Mike Williams WR DET 2005 2007 0 0 0 30 44 539 2 USC 14 2004 1 3 Larry Fitzgerald WR ARI 2004 2008 1 3 5 76 16 55 0 426 5975 46 Pittsburgh 15 2004 1 7 Roy E. Williams WR DET 2004 2008 0 1 4 70 6 17 0 281 4082 30 Texas 16 2004 1 9 Reggie Williams WR JAX 2004 2008 0 0 3 79 11 44 0 189 2322 18 Washington 21 2003 1 2 Charles Rogers WR DET 2003 2005 0 0 0 15 2 17 0 36 440 4 Michigan State 22 2003 1 3 Andre Johnson WR HOU 2003 2008 1 3 6 86 18 26 0 486 6379 33 Miami (FL) 27 2001 1 8 David Terrell WR CHI 2001 2005 0 0 1 54 4 14 0 128 1602 9 Michigan 28 2001 1 9 Koren Robinson WR SEA 2001 2008 0 1 4 96 23 115 1 294 4244 16 North Carolina State 33 2000 1 4 Peter Warrick WR CIN 2000 2005 0 0 4 79 53 360 2 275 2991 18 Florida State 34 2000 1 8 Plaxico Burress WR PIT 2000 2008 0 0 9 128 1 -7 0 505 7845 55 Michigan State 35 2000 1 10 Travis Taylor WR BAL 2000 2007 0 0 7 101 32 232 0 312 4017 22 Florida 38 1999 1 6 Torry Holt WR STL 1999 2008 1 7 10 158 11 57 0 869 12660 74 North Carolina State 39 1999 1 8 David Boston WR ARI 1999 2005 1 1 3 75 18 91 0 315 4699 25 Ohio State 44 1997 1 7 Ike Hilliard WR NYG 1997 2008 0 0 8 161 16 126 0 546 6397 35 Florida 48 1996 1 1 Keyshawn Johnson WR NYJ 1996 2006 0 3 11 167 13 91 2 814 10571 64 USC 49 1996 1 7 Terry Glenn WR NWE 1996 2007 0 1 9 137 20 139 1 593 8823 44 Ohio State 53 1995 1 4 Michael Westbrook WR WAS 1995 2002 0 0 6 89 22 160 1 285 4374 26 Colorado 54 1995 1 8 Joey Galloway WR SEA 1995 2008 0 0 11 185 63 496 1 682 10710 77 Ohio State 55 1995 1 10 J.J. Stokes WR SFO 1995 2003 0 0 3 118 1 6 0 342 4293 30 UCLA 60 1993 1 7 Curtis Conway WR CHI 1993 2004 0 0 10 167 50 465 3 594 8230 52 USC 63 1992 1 4 Desmond Howard WR WAS 1992 2002 0 1 1 156 12 68 0 123 1597 7 Michigan 64 1991 1 10 Herman Moore WR DET 1991 2002 3 4 8 146 670 9174 62 Virginia This isn't an overly impressive hit rate. maybe 9 studs.

 

[BuckeyeArt]

I have been a lurker on this board for awhile occasionally commenting on certain topics. Therefore I understand that most wont value my opinion but I feel so strongly that Crabtree will be a bust that I have been compelled to start this topic. I am prepared to be ridiculed but let me state my case:

Exhibit A

Tech Texas Offense - Crabtree's college production in Lubbock isnt unprecedented, in fact there are a few players who have put up comparable numbers.

Player Pos Cl Gm Catches Yds TDs Rec/Gm Yds/Catch Yds/Gm Year Danny Amendola, Texas Tech WR SR 13 109 1245 6 8.38 11.42 95.77 2007 Joel Filani, Texas Tech WR SR 13 91 1300 13 7.00 14.29 100.00 2006 Jarrett Hicks, Texas Tech WR SO 12 76 1177 13 6.33 15.49 98.08 2004The statistics above illustrate that players with marginal talent, by NFL standards, are capable of putting up big numbers. It is my contention that Crabtree is merely a product of the system.

Those really aren't comparable to Crabtree's best year (of the only 2 years he played): Michael Crabtree, Texas Tech - WR - FR - 12 - 125 - 1861 - 21 - 10.42 - 14.9 - 155.1

Also, look at their career production and keep in mind you're comparing 2 years of Crabtree to 4 years of the others:

Rec  Yards TD	   Crabtree 218  2996  39	   Amendola 198  2178  14	   Filani   175  2626  23	   Hicks	197  2847  29

It really isn't close.

 

[scratcher]

I'm one of the few but if given a choice I'd take Maclin over Crabby.

You're not one of the few.

the Eagles lucked into Missouri receiver Jeremy Maclin, who was rated No. 1 at his position on 18 teams' draft boards.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/9501382That would be majority of NFL teams.

 

[Darker Knight]

A) None of those stats you've listed look at all similar to 134 receptions, 1962 yards, 22 TDs to me. Having said that, college stats are one of the worst barometeres to use to figure out if a guy is going to be a NFL success. Crabtree was picked in the top 10 of the NFL draft because of his talent and ability, not because of his statistics. B) Crabtree cuts his routes sharp, and he's able to create seperation easily as he explodes out of his cuts. He's going to have to work on his route running in training camp and whatnot, but i have little doubt that he'll be able to run the entire route tree in no time at all. Just because Crabtree very rarely had to beat press coverage doesn't mean he won't be able to. The 2 best ways to beat press coverage are with quickness or strength. Those are two of the best qualities that Crabtree possesses, elite quickness and he's stronger than the large majority of cornerbacks.C) Attitude? Really? Crabtree's got the same attitude that all star WRs have. It's the attitude of a winner, a guys who wants the ball in his hand so he can help the team win. I like his quote when someone from NFLN talked to him after he was still there at about pick #9 and Crabtree said something like "I just look forward to playing against all these teams that are passing on me". That's the kind of attitude i like out of a player, he's angry.

 

[millertyme1]

You're not one of the few.

the Eagles lucked into Missouri receiver Jeremy Maclin, who was rated No. 1 at his position on 18 teams' draft boards.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/9501382That would be majority of NFL teams.

by John CzarneckiGLWT

 

[RockHard]

A) None of those stats you've listed look at all similar to 134 receptions, 1962 yards, 22 TDs to me. Having said that, college stats are one of the worst barometeres to use to figure out if a guy is going to be a NFL success. Crabtree was picked in the top 10 of the NFL draft because of his talent and ability, not because of his statistics. B) Crabtree cuts his routes sharp, and he's able to create seperation easily as he explodes out of his cuts. He's going to have to work on his route running in training camp and whatnot, but i have little doubt that he'll be able to run the entire route tree in no time at all. Just because Crabtree very rarely had to beat press coverage doesn't mean he won't be able to. The 2 best ways to beat press coverage are with quickness or strength. Those are two of the best qualities that Crabtree possesses, elite quickness and he's stronger than the large majority of cornerbacks.C) Attitude? Really? Crabtree's got the same attitude that all star WRs have. It's the attitude of a winner, a guys who wants the ball in his hand so he can help the team win. I like his quote when someone from NFLN talked to him after he was still there at about pick #9 and Crabtree said something like "I just look forward to playing against all these teams that are passing on me". That's the kind of attitude i like out of a player, he's angry.

A - Since you mentioned the statistics from Crabtree's freshman season, could you please explain the discrepancy between his 1st and 2nd seasons. He went from 134 1962 22 to 97 1165 19. He played in the same offense with the same coach and QB yet his recieving yards decreased by nearly 60% could it be that Big 12 defensive coordinators figured out how limit his production. There have been plenty of top 10 picks WR and other position players who were bust. Being drafted in the top 10 doesnt preclude him from being a bust.B - You see Jessica Alba I see Star Jones. How do we know Crabtree has great quickness and strength? What makes him any stronger or quicker than Brit, Harvin etc? Crabtree has average size and I dont see him out muscling and NFL defenders. The Big 12 had 2 defensive back selected in the first two rounds between 2007 & 2008 (I am excluding Crabtree's teammate). I also contend that the Big 12 is totally devoid of any good defense thereby inflating the statistics of its offensive participants.C - I wont really argue C because it is more subjective.

 

[EBF]

he isnt big or physically imposing and he wore a lavender shirt to the draft.

6'1" 215 isn't big or physically imposing? News to me. There's no such thing as a can't-miss prospect, but Crabtree looks like one of the safer skill position guys in this draft. No, he can't run like Calvin or Moss, but neither can Bowe, Boldin, or Cotchery. The people who harp on Crabtree's lack of speed are missing the point entirely. Speed isn't his game. He's a possession WR. I think he'll be a solid player if he works hard. Is he overrated? Probably a little bit. He went WR7 and WR6 in the two new HyperActive dynasty drafts. That's insanely high for a guy who hasn't played a down of NFL football, particularly compared to the relatively cheap price tag for guys like Nicks and Harvin. He's still a good prospect though.

 

[Wu-banger]

I have been a lurker on this board for awhile occasionally commenting on certain topics. Therefore I understand that most wont value my opinion but I feel so strongly that Crabtree will be a bust that I have been compelled to start this topic. I am prepared to be ridiculed but let me state my case:

Exhibit A

Tech Texas Offense - Crabtree's college production in Lubbock isnt unprecedented, in fact there are a few players who have put up comparable numbers.

Player Pos Cl Gm Catches Yds TDs Rec/Gm Yds/Catch Yds/Gm YearDanny Amendola, Texas Tech WR SR 13 109 1245 6 8.38 11.42 95.77 2007Joel Filani, Texas Tech WR SR 13 91 1300 13 7.00 14.29 100.00 2006Jarrett Hicks, Texas Tech WR SO 12 76 1177 13 6.33 15.49 98.08 2004The statistics above illustrate that players with marginal talent, by NFL standards, are capable of putting up big numbers. It is my contention that Crabtree is merely a product of the system. No player listed was a blue chip prospect coming into Tech nor did they ever give the impression the had NFL ability while there.. PS Where's Wes Welker in your comparison?? Crabtree was teh top prospect ever to play in the Tech Offense and all he did was put up video-game like numbers.

Exhibit B

Route Running Ability - Many pundits have questioned the route running ability of Maclin & Harvin but when I watch Texas Tech I dont see many NFL routes. Most of Texas Tech's plays are bubble screens, hitches, and slants; I dont see any outs, come backs, or corner routes. Furthermore I dont believe that Crabtree can beat press coverage. Very seldom did he face press coverage and when he did he used some "hop step" technique, I dont believe that this tactic will work against NFL cornerbacks.

This is just your opinion and speculation....while it is open to your judgment, Crabtree is a much better route runner than Maclin or Harvin (who both also play in gimmick offenses) and the scouts agree with this assesment.

Out of all the top WR's who is the best route runner drafted in RD 1 or 2 ..??

Crab is far better than .. DHB, Maclin, Harvin, Britt, etc ..

Exhibit C

Attitude - The last few weeks there have been whispers above Crabtree being a diva, furthermore Crabtree's former college roommate was arrested by the DEA and charged with cocaine possession with the intent to deliver. However it is this quote from an ESPN The Magazine that I found telling:

Each morning, Crabtree wakes up at 11:30, then sits in bed, simultaneously watching movies on his flat-screen and Young Jeezy videos on his laptop. At around 2 p.m. he makes a move, but he can’t shower, not with his foot in a cast. So the 6′1″, 215-pound former Texas Tech receiver climbs into the tub—his first baths since grade school—bum foot hanging over the edge. At 3 he leaves his place for the first time, impressively fleet on a set of crutches, for lunch at Pappadeaux. The menu: fried shrimp and mashed potatoes, with two lemonades—one with freshly squeezed straw-berries, the other with uncut berries floating in the drink like ice. Then it’s back home for more movies and videos. At 10 Crabtree orders a pepperoni thick-crust from Pizza Hut, the empty box joining nine others stacked like a Jenga game on his kitchen counter. “That’s my regimen,” he says.

You certainly have to question his work ethic after reading that quote. you take a short timef rame when he was clearly off and injured to use this to make your case....that wont hold water in any case...

when you're an athlete and you cant do what you are used to doing when injured it is natrual to get a little depressed or lazy.

Finally I dont believe that Crabtree is a great athlete I see no explosion from him when coming out of breaks, he is slow, he carries the ball like a loaf of bread, he isnt big or physically imposing and he wore a lavender shirt to the draft.

this just shows your "hater" mind-set NTTAWWT

 

[RockHard]

I have been a lurker on this board for awhile occasionally commenting on certain topics. Therefore I understand that most wont value my opinion but I feel so strongly that Crabtree will be a bust that I have been compelled to start this topic. I am prepared to be ridiculed but let me state my case:

Exhibit A

Tech Texas Offense - Crabtree's college production in Lubbock isnt unprecedented, in fact there are a few players who have put up comparable numbers.

Player Pos Cl Gm Catches Yds TDs Rec/Gm Yds/Catch Yds/Gm Year Danny Amendola, Texas Tech WR SR 13 109 1245 6 8.38 11.42 95.77 2007 Joel Filani, Texas Tech WR SR 13 91 1300 13 7.00 14.29 100.00 2006 Jarrett Hicks, Texas Tech WR SO 12 76 1177 13 6.33 15.49 98.08 2004The statistics above illustrate that players with marginal talent, by NFL standards, are capable of putting up big numbers. It is my contention that Crabtree is merely a product of the system.

Those really aren't comparable to Crabtree's best year (of the only 2 years he played): Michael Crabtree, Texas Tech - WR - FR - 12 - 125 - 1861 - 21 - 10.42 - 14.9 - 155.1

Also, look at their career production and keep in mind you're comparing 2 years of Crabtree to 4 years of the others:

Rec  Yards TD	   Crabtree 218  2996  39	   Amendola 198  2178  14	   Filani   175  2626  23	   Hicks	197  2847  29

It really isn't close.

Yes Crabtree's production exceed those players that I mentioned but it is my claim that you dont have to be an NFL caliber reciever to put up 1100 yards and multiple touchdowns at TT. Amendola and Hicks went undrafted and Filani was a 6th round pick how do we know that Crabtree's not a third round talent playing in a pin ball offense.

 

[SPM]

This thread is . You know it's bad when The Fanatic agrees with you.

 

[EBF]

I have been a lurker on this board for awhile occasionally commenting on certain topics. Therefore I understand that most wont value my opinion but I feel so strongly that Crabtree will be a bust that I have been compelled to start this topic. I am prepared to be ridiculed but let me state my case:

Exhibit A

Tech Texas Offense - Crabtree's college production in Lubbock isnt unprecedented, in fact there are a few players who have put up comparable numbers.

Player Pos Cl Gm Catches Yds TDs Rec/Gm Yds/Catch Yds/Gm Year Danny Amendola, Texas Tech WR SR 13 109 1245 6 8.38 11.42 95.77 2007 Joel Filani, Texas Tech WR SR 13 91 1300 13 7.00 14.29 100.00 2006 Jarrett Hicks, Texas Tech WR SO 12 76 1177 13 6.33 15.49 98.08 2004The statistics above illustrate that players with marginal talent, by NFL standards, are capable of putting up big numbers. It is my contention that Crabtree is merely a product of the system.

Those really aren't comparable to Crabtree's best year (of the only 2 years he played): Michael Crabtree, Texas Tech - WR - FR - 12 - 125 - 1861 - 21 - 10.42 - 14.9 - 155.1

Also, look at their career production and keep in mind you're comparing 2 years of Crabtree to 4 years of the others:

Rec  Yards TD	   Crabtree 218  2996  39	   Amendola 198  2178  14	   Filani   175  2626  23	   Hicks	197  2847  29

It really isn't close.

Yes Crabtree's production exceed those players that I mentioned but it is my claim that you dont have to be an NFL caliber reciever to put up 1100 yards and multiple touchdowns at TT. Amendola and Hicks went undrafted and Filani was a 6th round pick how do we know that Crabtree's not a third round talent playing in a pin ball offense.

I think you just answered your own question. Amendola, Hicks, and Filani were low picks despite their production whereas Crabtree was a consensus top 10-15 talent. If the scouts thought he was a product of the system, he would've been a late pick/UDFA like all the other Tech receivers.

 

[Darker Knight]

he isnt big or physically imposing and he wore a lavender shirt to the draft.

6'1-3/8" 215 isn't big or physically imposing? News to me. There's no such thing as a can't-miss prospect, but Crabtree looks like one of the safer skill position guys in this draft. No, he can't run like Calvin or Moss, but neither can Bowe, Boldin, or Cotchery. The people who harp on Crabtree's lack of speed are missing the point entirely. Speed isn't his game. He's a possession WR.

I think he'll be a solid player if he works hard. Is he overrated? Probably a little bit. He went WR7 and WR6 in the two new HyperActive dynasty drafts. That's insanely high for a guy who hasn't played a down of NFL football, particularly compared to the relatively cheap price tag for guys like Nicks and Harvin. He's still a good prospect though.

fixed

 

[scratcher]

You're not one of the few.

the Eagles lucked into Missouri receiver Jeremy Maclin, who was rated No. 1 at his position on 18 teams' draft boards.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/9501382That would be majority of NFL teams.

by John CzarneckiGLWT

Sorry, where was your source that said otherwise?TIA.

 

[Darker Knight]

also I don't know if anyone has pointed this out here...but Crabtree arm length is 34-1/4" the only person with longer arms was Ramses Barden at 34-1/2"....Barden is 6'6"

 

[Liquid Tension]

He eats Pizza Hut!?!?!I was on the fence, but this is the tipping point for me.

Poppa John's would make him a pro-bowler.

Maybe it is because I live in NJ, but no respecting person eats Pizza Hut or any chain pizza around here. You would think he would be able to get some real pizza.On to the important topic and that is whether or not Crabtree will be any good. The points about beating the press and not being sharp out of his cuts will need to be changed at the pro level, but his regiment while in a cast doesn't mean much to me. If that was his same regiment when healthy, then I would have a concern.

 

[RockHard]

I have been a lurker on this board for awhile occasionally commenting on certain topics. Therefore I understand that most wont value my opinion but I feel so strongly that Crabtree will be a bust that I have been compelled to start this topic. I am prepared to be ridiculed but let me state my case:

Exhibit A

Tech Texas Offense - Crabtree's college production in Lubbock isnt unprecedented, in fact there are a few players who have put up comparable numbers.

Player Pos Cl Gm Catches Yds TDs Rec/Gm Yds/Catch Yds/Gm Year Danny Amendola, Texas Tech WR SR 13 109 1245 6 8.38 11.42 95.77 2007 Joel Filani, Texas Tech WR SR 13 91 1300 13 7.00 14.29 100.00 2006 Jarrett Hicks, Texas Tech WR SO 12 76 1177 13 6.33 15.49 98.08 2004The statistics above illustrate that players with marginal talent, by NFL standards, are capable of putting up big numbers. It is my contention that Crabtree is merely a product of the system.

Those really aren't comparable to Crabtree's best year (of the only 2 years he played): Michael Crabtree, Texas Tech - WR - FR - 12 - 125 - 1861 - 21 - 10.42 - 14.9 - 155.1

Also, look at their career production and keep in mind you're comparing 2 years of Crabtree to 4 years of the others:

Rec  Yards TD	   Crabtree 218  2996  39	   Amendola 198  2178  14	   Filani   175  2626  23	   Hicks	197  2847  29

It really isn't close.

Yes Crabtree's production exceed those players that I mentioned but it is my claim that you dont have to be an NFL caliber reciever to put up 1100 yards and multiple touchdowns at TT. Amendola and Hicks went undrafted and Filani was a 6th round pick how do we know that Crabtree's not a third round talent playing in a pin ball offense.

I think you just answered your own question. Amendola, Hicks, and Filani were low picks despite their production whereas Crabtree was a consensus top 10-15 talent. If the scouts thought he was a product of the system, he would've been a late pick/UDFA like all the other Tech receivers.

I think that in the mind of some personnel people statistics beyond a certain threshold are too big to ignore. If you put up 22 touchdowns in a season in a BCS conference then you must automatically be a good player.

 

[Zoomanji]

also I don't know if anyone has pointed this out here...but Crabtree arm length is 34-1/4" the only person with longer arms was Ramses Barden at 34-1/2"....Barden is 6'6"

Well that changed my mind.You know what they say about guys with long arms?

 

[awesomeness]

A) None of those stats you've listed look at all similar to 134 receptions, 1962 yards, 22 TDs to me. Having said that, college stats are one of the worst barometeres to use to figure out if a guy is going to be a NFL success. Crabtree was picked in the top 10 of the NFL draft because of his talent and ability, not because of his statistics. B) Crabtree cuts his routes sharp, and he's able to create seperation easily as he explodes out of his cuts. He's going to have to work on his route running in training camp and whatnot, but i have little doubt that he'll be able to run the entire route tree in no time at all. Just because Crabtree very rarely had to beat press coverage doesn't mean he won't be able to. The 2 best ways to beat press coverage are with quickness or strength. Those are two of the best qualities that Crabtree possesses, elite quickness and he's stronger than the large majority of cornerbacks.C) Attitude? Really? Crabtree's got the same attitude that all star WRs have. It's the attitude of a winner, a guys who wants the ball in his hand so he can help the team win. I like his quote when someone from NFLN talked to him after he was still there at about pick #9 and Crabtree said something like "I just look forward to playing against all these teams that are passing on me". That's the kind of attitude i like out of a player, he's angry.

A - Since you mentioned the statistics from Crabtree's freshman season, could you please explain the discrepancy between his 1st and 2nd seasons. He went from 134 1962 22 to 97 1165 19. He played in the same offense with the same coach and QB yet his recieving yards decreased by nearly 60% could it be that Big 12 defensive coordinators figured out how limit his production. There have been plenty of top 10 picks WR and other position players who were bust. Being drafted in the top 10 doesnt preclude him from being a bust.B - You see Jessica Alba I see Star Jones. How do we know Crabtree has great quickness and strength? What makes him any stronger or quicker than Brit, Harvin etc? Crabtree has average size and I dont see him out muscling and NFL defenders. The Big 12 had 2 defensive back selected in the first two rounds between 2007 & 2008 (I am excluding Crabtree's teammate). I also contend that the Big 12 is totally devoid of any good defense thereby inflating the statistics of its offensive participants.C - I wont really argue C because it is more subjective.

A) A lot of your arguement here is statistically driven, and i've already said how i feel college statistics are a poor barometer to determine whether a player will be a NFL success. See Andre Johnson, Steve Smith (carolina), and JJ Arrington. Although Crabtree did play with an injury in his right ankle for a large portion of the season, which may have impacted his numbers. B) Have you watched Crabtree before? Crabtree is 6'1 and a half and his arms are very long, i'd say he has above average size rather than average size. His elite quickness is hard to argue against imo, his first step and the way he explodes out of cuts is undeniable. Crabtree runs tough and angry, i have little doubt that he'll be able to out muscle NFL defenders but i guess we can wait and see on that.Crabtree is the safest pick in this draft when it comes to a fantasy player imo. I don't know any WR with his size, length, quickness, toughness, intangibles, agility, and insane ability to catch the ball who has failed in the NFL. He may not be a perennial all-pro, but for anyone to say he's going to be a bust is doing a pretty poor job of scouting imo.

 

[KellysHeroes]

After I listened to the interviews on the radio, and saw the one w/ him and his family the day of the draft... I think I would of passed myself on that day.

The best was when they asked is little brother "What time did Mike come in last night" "I don't know, it was real late... he just woke up"

The kid is very gifted, but he seems to have no work ethic. And hes on a team that requires 100% work ethic.

 

[Hoss_Cartwright]

Better watch out, I've already said those things (along with others) and got crucified for it. I still have the scars on my wrists from those stakes.

Link 1.

Link 2

Link 3

 

[ConstruxBoy]

Is this another Johnny U alias?



Edit: LOL, he beat me to it.

 

[stewartcjae]

After I listened to the interviews on the radio, and saw the one w/ him and his family the day of the draft... I think I would of passed myself on that day. The best was when they asked is little brother "What time did Mike come in last night" "I don't know, it was real late... he just woke up"The kid is very gifted, but he seems to have no work ethic. And hes on a team that requires 100% work ethic.

basing his work ethic on his little brothers testimony that his 21yr bother stayed out late. Did most of the other players get up at 6am to get in a nice work out before the draft? Like all picks he has the potential to bust, but this is reaching I think. Ask Tech teammates and coaches about his work ethic or wait until he is healed and see what he does with his new team.