***David Wilson Bandwagon*** (3 Viewers)

[zamboni]

All I know is that as a Wilson owner, I am going to do what I can to get Brown on my roster. Might have to do it earlier than I'd like, but worth the peace of mind.

 

[JohnnyU]

I don't have a horse in this race, don't care who's the starter (though I'll be watching) but one thing I've learned with these situations over the years is not to make up your mind and ignore the tea leaves and think you know better than the coach. I look at players and read as much as I can about them but the most important thing is what the coach says and does. Often times the beat writers are a good source as well...not always, not every situation but it's a puzzle that you have to put together from the various clues you get....some will have more weight/merit than others and through experience/luck/skill you can get the correct read on the situation.

My take on this particular situation is that Wilson is more talented and he'll be given the opportunity (old man Coughlin has said as much). I think it will start as a time sharing situation but the important thing that I'll bet watching and listening for is for confirmed improvement of the things that held him back last year like ball security and pass protection. In these situations I tend to go for the Wilson type if it looks like he may have a chance to emerge or I'll avoid the situation entirely. Drafting the Lendale White (1B part of the backfield) doesn't have the upside but has downside risk of being completely useless.

Again, I must ask, how did he have ball security issues last year with 1 lost fumble in 71 carries?

it's not what I think...it's fact....

NY Giants coach Tom Coughlin benches David Wilson after first-half fumble against Cowboys Rookie and 2012 first-rounder gets message to hold on to the ball after fumble against Cowboys stalls Big Blue momentum Comments (3) By Ebenezer Samuel AND Ralph Vacchiano / NEW YORK DAILY NEWS Thursday, September 6, 2012, 10:18 PM
David Wilson knows to hold onto the ball after being benched for fumbling on second pro carry.


In the moments after Giants rookie running back David Wilson fumbled on Wednesday night, the NBC cameras showed a close-up of his face and a possible tear under his left eye. There was no doubt, as Tom Coughlin said, that Wilson was “very upset.”
But was he crying after he was yanked from the game?

“No, I wasn't crying,” Wilson said Thursday. “I was definitely upset. But, I think it would have been a lot worse if I was smiling or feeling good about it.”


He definitely wasn’t feeling good after he fumbled on his second NFL carry, ruining a Giants drive on which, Coughlin said, “some decent things were happening.” That wasn’t the reason the Giants lost their opener to the Cowboys, 24-17, but it did take away some of their momentum.

PHOTOS: GIANTS MISS CHANCES, LOSE OPENER TO BOYS

“On the sidelines he was very upset about what happened,” Coughlin said. “I did give him credit for that. He was deeply, deeply sorry about what happened. Unfortunately it happened.”

Coughlin admitted Thursday that the fumble was the reason Wilson was benched. “We’re playing the opening game of the year,” Coughlin said. “It’s a divisional game. We had just driven the ball. We’re going to be a bit reluctant. This is not preseason. This is serious business now.”

Wilson seemed to understand all that, and said, “I don’t think they totally gave up on me. They wanted to show me how important it was to hold onto the ball.”

That message was received, even if it didn’t actually bring Wilson to tears.

“I’m passionate about the game and I know (fumbling) is something I have been working on and not wanting to do,” he said. “And for it to happen on my second carry in the opening game, I was highly disappointed.”

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/giants/benching-n-o-crying-shame-giants-david-wilson-article-1.1153792#ixzz2a56I9fKc

Everyone knows that story from beginning to end, but again, 1 fumble in 71 carries doesn't constitute a fumbling problem.

it is when it's a big part of why a talented player totals 17 total carries over the first 10 weeks. I wouldn't have thought it was a big deal but Coughlin clearly did. He sent the message loud and clear and it's undeniable. It doesn't matter what you think or I think, all that matters is what Coughlin thinks. Whether you call it a fumbling issue, a trust issue, whatever, there was an issue there that largely derailed his season otherwise he would've gotten the ball more.

I'm not denying the reason why Coughlin benched him, I know it's because he fumbled. My response was to your comment " improvement of the things that held him back last year like ball security". My point is that 1 fumble in 71 carries didn't hold him back. He obviously did pretty well with ball security for the entire season.

 

[TheFanatic]

It is well documented that Coughlin will not bench his STARTER for fumbling. Tiki had issues and so did bradshaw with holding onto the ball at points in their career. He didn't bench either of them. Wilson is their starter. Even if he puts his first carry on the rug on opening day, he will not be benched....

If he puts the second on the carpet

 

[gianmarco]

I don't have a horse in this race, don't care who's the starter (though I'll be watching) but one thing I've learned with these situations over the years is not to make up your mind and ignore the tea leaves and think you know better than the coach. I look at players and read as much as I can about them but the most important thing is what the coach says and does. Often times the beat writers are a good source as well...not always, not every situation but it's a puzzle that you have to put together from the various clues you get....some will have more weight/merit than others and through experience/luck/skill you can get the correct read on the situation.

My take on this particular situation is that Wilson is more talented and he'll be given the opportunity (old man Coughlin has said as much). I think it will start as a time sharing situation but the important thing that I'll bet watching and listening for is for confirmed improvement of the things that held him back last year like ball security and pass protection. In these situations I tend to go for the Wilson type if it looks like he may have a chance to emerge or I'll avoid the situation entirely. Drafting the Lendale White (1B part of the backfield) doesn't have the upside but has downside risk of being completely useless.

Again, I must ask, how did he have ball security issues last year with 1 lost fumble in 71 carries?

it's not what I think...it's fact....

NY Giants coach Tom Coughlin benches David Wilson after first-half fumble against Cowboys Rookie and 2012 first-rounder gets message to hold on to the ball after fumble against Cowboys stalls Big Blue momentum Comments (3) By Ebenezer Samuel AND Ralph Vacchiano / NEW YORK DAILY NEWS Thursday, September 6, 2012, 10:18 PM

David Wilson knows to hold onto the ball after being benched for fumbling on second pro carry.

In the moments after Giants rookie running back David Wilson fumbled on Wednesday night, the NBC cameras showed a close-up of his face and a possible tear under his left eye. There was no doubt, as Tom Coughlin said, that Wilson was very upset.

But was he crying after he was yanked from the game?

No, I wasn't crying, Wilson said Thursday. I was definitely upset. But, I think it would have been a lot worse if I was smiling or feeling good about it.

He definitely wasnt feeling good after he fumbled on his second NFL carry, ruining a Giants drive on which, Coughlin said, some decent things were happening. That wasnt the reason the Giants lost their opener to the Cowboys, 24-17, but it did take away some of their momentum.

PHOTOS: GIANTS MISS CHANCES, LOSE OPENER TO BOYS

On the sidelines he was very upset about what happened, Coughlin said. I did give him credit for that. He was deeply, deeply sorry about what happened. Unfortunately it happened.

Coughlin admitted Thursday that the fumble was the reason Wilson was benched. Were playing the opening game of the year, Coughlin said. Its a divisional game. We had just driven the ball. Were going to be a bit reluctant. This is not preseason. This is serious business now.

Wilson seemed to understand all that, and said, I dont think they totally gave up on me. They wanted to show me how important it was to hold onto the ball.

That message was received, even if it didnt actually bring Wilson to tears.

Im passionate about the game and I know (fumbling) is something I have been working on and not wanting to do, he said. And for it to happen on my second carry in the opening game, I was highly disappointed.

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/giants/benching-n-o-crying-shame-giants-david-wilson-article-1.1153792#ixzz2a56I9fKc

Everyone knows that story from beginning to end, but again, 1 fumble in 71 carries doesn't constitute a fumbling problem.

it is when it's a big part of why a talented player totals 17 total carries over the first 10 weeks. I wouldn't have thought it was a big deal but Coughlin clearly did. He sent the message loud and clear and it's undeniable. It doesn't matter what you think or I think, all that matters is what Coughlin thinks. Whether you call it a fumbling issue, a trust issue, whatever, there was an issue there that largely derailed his season otherwise he would've gotten the ball more.

You're assuming he was benched those ten weeks because of that one fumble. It's been brought up already that, while it led to his benching in week one, it did not play nearly a role for most of the rest of the year. It was his pass protection (very common for rookies).

If fumbling was the issue for his lack of carries through ten weeks, why did Coughlin have him returning kicks? You think he's putting a guy with "ball security issues" on kick returns? Do you realize how silly that is?

 

[Khy]

You're assuming he was benched those ten weeks because of that one fumble. It's been brought up already that, while it led to his benching in week one, it did not play nearly a role for most of the rest of the year. It was his pass protection (very common for rookies).

If fumbling was the issue for his lack of carries through ten weeks, why did Coughlin have him returning kicks? You think he's putting a guy with "ball security issues" on kick returns? Do you realize how silly that is?

Yeah, it honestly hurts my head when I think about this... it's one of the most illogical conclusions I've seen in a long time when discussing fantasy football. There are SO many reasons to prove that he wasn't benched due to fumbling issues. Somehow it continues to be brought up.

1) Coughlin has never, ever, ever been a coach to bench a starter for fumbling issues. This is extremely well documented with Tiki, Jacobs and Bradshaw. To dispute this is ridiculous.

2) He has 1 fumble over 71 rushes, 4 receptions and 57 kick returns. So on 132 touches he has 1 fumble. He literally has gone 130 carries without putting the ball on the ground.

3) There is a lot of evidence that his benching was more related to trying to grasp control of his personality rather than worrying about his fumbling. David Wilson is an extremely emotional player and they probably wanted to show him early on that they weren't going to stand for any of that crap if he wanted a role on this team. A lot of his benching was to kind of 'humble him up' if you will.

4) While Coughlin doesn't bench starting RBs for fumbles he absolutely will not leave a kick returner with fumbling issues in... so why was Wilson on the field if that was a concern?

Can we please stop this nonsense? Cause that's literally all it is total nonsense. Whether you're buying into the hype or not, saying "Even with Brown there you also have to worry about Wilson's fumbling issues" is just asinine.

 

[Banger]

I don't have a horse in this race, don't care who's the starter (though I'll be watching) but one thing I've learned with these situations over the years is not to make up your mind and ignore the tea leaves and think you know better than the coach. I look at players and read as much as I can about them but the most important thing is what the coach says and does. Often times the beat writers are a good source as well...not always, not every situation but it's a puzzle that you have to put together from the various clues you get....some will have more weight/merit than others and through experience/luck/skill you can get the correct read on the situation.

My take on this particular situation is that Wilson is more talented and he'll be given the opportunity (old man Coughlin has said as much). I think it will start as a time sharing situation but the important thing that I'll bet watching and listening for is for confirmed improvement of the things that held him back last year like ball security and pass protection. In these situations I tend to go for the Wilson type if it looks like he may have a chance to emerge or I'll avoid the situation entirely. Drafting the Lendale White (1B part of the backfield) doesn't have the upside but has downside risk of being completely useless.

Again, I must ask, how did he have ball security issues last year with 1 lost fumble in 71 carries?

it's not what I think...it's fact....

NY Giants coach Tom Coughlin benches David Wilson after first-half fumble against Cowboys Rookie and 2012 first-rounder gets message to hold on to the ball after fumble against Cowboys stalls Big Blue momentum Comments (3) By Ebenezer Samuel AND Ralph Vacchiano / NEW YORK DAILY NEWS Thursday, September 6, 2012, 10:18 PM
David Wilson knows to hold onto the ball after being benched for fumbling on second pro carry.


In the moments after Giants rookie running back David Wilson fumbled on Wednesday night, the NBC cameras showed a close-up of his face and a possible tear under his left eye. There was no doubt, as Tom Coughlin said, that Wilson was “very upset.”
But was he crying after he was yanked from the game?

“No, I wasn't crying,” Wilson said Thursday. “I was definitely upset. But, I think it would have been a lot worse if I was smiling or feeling good about it.”


He definitely wasn’t feeling good after he fumbled on his second NFL carry, ruining a Giants drive on which, Coughlin said, “some decent things were happening.” That wasn’t the reason the Giants lost their opener to the Cowboys, 24-17, but it did take away some of their momentum.

PHOTOS: GIANTS MISS CHANCES, LOSE OPENER TO BOYS

“On the sidelines he was very upset about what happened,” Coughlin said. “I did give him credit for that. He was deeply, deeply sorry about what happened. Unfortunately it happened.”

Coughlin admitted Thursday that the fumble was the reason Wilson was benched. “We’re playing the opening game of the year,” Coughlin said. “It’s a divisional game. We had just driven the ball. We’re going to be a bit reluctant. This is not preseason. This is serious business now.”

Wilson seemed to understand all that, and said, “I don’t think they totally gave up on me. They wanted to show me how important it was to hold onto the ball.”

That message was received, even if it didn’t actually bring Wilson to tears.

“I’m passionate about the game and I know (fumbling) is something I have been working on and not wanting to do,” he said. “And for it to happen on my second carry in the opening game, I was highly disappointed.”

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/giants/benching-n-o-crying-shame-giants-david-wilson-article-1.1153792#ixzz2a56I9fKc

Everyone knows that story from beginning to end, but again, 1 fumble in 71 carries doesn't constitute a fumbling problem.

it is when it's a big part of why a talented player totals 17 total carries over the first 10 weeks. I wouldn't have thought it was a big deal but Coughlin clearly did. He sent the message loud and clear and it's undeniable. It doesn't matter what you think or I think, all that matters is what Coughlin thinks. Whether you call it a fumbling issue, a trust issue, whatever, there was an issue there that largely derailed his season otherwise he would've gotten the ball more.

I'm not denying the reason why Coughlin benched him, I know it's because he fumbled. My response was to your comment " improvement of the things that held him back last year like ball security". My point is that 1 fumble in 71 carries didn't hold him back. He obviously did pretty well with ball security for the entire season.

but as I said it may not be an isolated instance...maybe he was putting the ball on the floor in practice and they talked to him and he didn't listen...who knows...what I know was the punishment was severe...it wasn't a half or a game, it was more than half a season.

What really matters is if will get a longer leash WHEN it happens again. If he fumbles in the 1st qtr of game 1, how are you gonna feel as a Wilson owner? I know if I owned him I'd say "oh F###!!!"

 

[JohnnyU]

I don't have a horse in this race, don't care who's the starter (though I'll be watching) but one thing I've learned with these situations over the years is not to make up your mind and ignore the tea leaves and think you know better than the coach. I look at players and read as much as I can about them but the most important thing is what the coach says and does. Often times the beat writers are a good source as well...not always, not every situation but it's a puzzle that you have to put together from the various clues you get....some will have more weight/merit than others and through experience/luck/skill you can get the correct read on the situation.

My take on this particular situation is that Wilson is more talented and he'll be given the opportunity (old man Coughlin has said as much). I think it will start as a time sharing situation but the important thing that I'll bet watching and listening for is for confirmed improvement of the things that held him back last year like ball security and pass protection. In these situations I tend to go for the Wilson type if it looks like he may have a chance to emerge or I'll avoid the situation entirely. Drafting the Lendale White (1B part of the backfield) doesn't have the upside but has downside risk of being completely useless.

Again, I must ask, how did he have ball security issues last year with 1 lost fumble in 71 carries?

it's not what I think...it's fact....

NY Giants coach Tom Coughlin benches David Wilson after first-half fumble against Cowboys Rookie and 2012 first-rounder gets message to hold on to the ball after fumble against Cowboys stalls Big Blue momentum Comments (3) By Ebenezer Samuel AND Ralph Vacchiano / NEW YORK DAILY NEWS Thursday, September 6, 2012, 10:18 PM
David Wilson knows to hold onto the ball after being benched for fumbling on second pro carry.


In the moments after Giants rookie running back David Wilson fumbled on Wednesday night, the NBC cameras showed a close-up of his face and a possible tear under his left eye. There was no doubt, as Tom Coughlin said, that Wilson was “very upset.”
But was he crying after he was yanked from the game?

“No, I wasn't crying,” Wilson said Thursday. “I was definitely upset. But, I think it would have been a lot worse if I was smiling or feeling good about it.”


He definitely wasn’t feeling good after he fumbled on his second NFL carry, ruining a Giants drive on which, Coughlin said, “some decent things were happening.” That wasn’t the reason the Giants lost their opener to the Cowboys, 24-17, but it did take away some of their momentum.

PHOTOS: GIANTS MISS CHANCES, LOSE OPENER TO BOYS

“On the sidelines he was very upset about what happened,” Coughlin said. “I did give him credit for that. He was deeply, deeply sorry about what happened. Unfortunately it happened.”

Coughlin admitted Thursday that the fumble was the reason Wilson was benched. “We’re playing the opening game of the year,” Coughlin said. “It’s a divisional game. We had just driven the ball. We’re going to be a bit reluctant. This is not preseason. This is serious business now.”

Wilson seemed to understand all that, and said, “I don’t think they totally gave up on me. They wanted to show me how important it was to hold onto the ball.”

That message was received, even if it didn’t actually bring Wilson to tears.

“I’m passionate about the game and I know (fumbling) is something I have been working on and not wanting to do,” he said. “And for it to happen on my second carry in the opening game, I was highly disappointed.”

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/giants/benching-n-o-crying-shame-giants-david-wilson-article-1.1153792#ixzz2a56I9fKc

Everyone knows that story from beginning to end, but again, 1 fumble in 71 carries doesn't constitute a fumbling problem.

it is when it's a big part of why a talented player totals 17 total carries over the first 10 weeks. I wouldn't have thought it was a big deal but Coughlin clearly did. He sent the message loud and clear and it's undeniable. It doesn't matter what you think or I think, all that matters is what Coughlin thinks. Whether you call it a fumbling issue, a trust issue, whatever, there was an issue there that largely derailed his season otherwise he would've gotten the ball more.

I'm not denying the reason why Coughlin benched him, I know it's because he fumbled. My response was to your comment " improvement of the things that held him back last year like ball security". My point is that 1 fumble in 71 carries didn't hold him back. He obviously did pretty well with ball security for the entire season.

but as I said it may not be an isolated instance...maybe he was putting the ball on the floor in practice and they talked to him and he didn't listen...who knows...what I know was the punishment was severe...it wasn't a half or a game, it was more than half a season.

What really matters is if will get a longer leash WHEN it happens again. If he fumbles in the 1st qtr of game 1, how are you gonna feel as a Wilson owner? I know if I owned him I'd say "oh F###!!!"

On the other hand, if he rushes for 1000 yards and 8 tds in the first 8 games and fumbles three times in the 9th game, I don't think anyone blinks an eye

 

[Banger]

I don't have a horse in this race, don't care who's the starter (though I'll be watching) but one thing I've learned with these situations over the years is not to make up your mind and ignore the tea leaves and think you know better than the coach. I look at players and read as much as I can about them but the most important thing is what the coach says and does. Often times the beat writers are a good source as well...not always, not every situation but it's a puzzle that you have to put together from the various clues you get....some will have more weight/merit than others and through experience/luck/skill you can get the correct read on the situation.

My take on this particular situation is that Wilson is more talented and he'll be given the opportunity (old man Coughlin has said as much). I think it will start as a time sharing situation but the important thing that I'll bet watching and listening for is for confirmed improvement of the things that held him back last year like ball security and pass protection. In these situations I tend to go for the Wilson type if it looks like he may have a chance to emerge or I'll avoid the situation entirely. Drafting the Lendale White (1B part of the backfield) doesn't have the upside but has downside risk of being completely useless.

Again, I must ask, how did he have ball security issues last year with 1 lost fumble in 71 carries?

it's not what I think...it's fact....

NY Giants coach Tom Coughlin benches David Wilson after first-half fumble against Cowboys Rookie and 2012 first-rounder gets message to hold on to the ball after fumble against Cowboys stalls Big Blue momentum Comments (3) By Ebenezer Samuel AND Ralph Vacchiano / NEW YORK DAILY NEWS Thursday, September 6, 2012, 10:18 PM

David Wilson knows to hold onto the ball after being benched for fumbling on second pro carry.

In the moments after Giants rookie running back David Wilson fumbled on Wednesday night, the NBC cameras showed a close-up of his face and a possible tear under his left eye. There was no doubt, as Tom Coughlin said, that Wilson was very upset.

But was he crying after he was yanked from the game?

No, I wasn't crying, Wilson said Thursday. I was definitely upset. But, I think it would have been a lot worse if I was smiling or feeling good about it.

He definitely wasnt feeling good after he fumbled on his second NFL carry, ruining a Giants drive on which, Coughlin said, some decent things were happening. That wasnt the reason the Giants lost their opener to the Cowboys, 24-17, but it did take away some of their momentum.

PHOTOS: GIANTS MISS CHANCES, LOSE OPENER TO BOYS

On the sidelines he was very upset about what happened, Coughlin said. I did give him credit for that. He was deeply, deeply sorry about what happened. Unfortunately it happened.

Coughlin admitted Thursday that the fumble was the reason Wilson was benched. Were playing the opening game of the year, Coughlin said. Its a divisional game. We had just driven the ball. Were going to be a bit reluctant. This is not preseason. This is serious business now.

Wilson seemed to understand all that, and said, I dont think they totally gave up on me. They wanted to show me how important it was to hold onto the ball.

That message was received, even if it didnt actually bring Wilson to tears.

Im passionate about the game and I know (fumbling) is something I have been working on and not wanting to do, he said. And for it to happen on my second carry in the opening game, I was highly disappointed.

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/giants/benching-n-o-crying-shame-giants-david-wilson-article-1.1153792#ixzz2a56I9fKc

Everyone knows that story from beginning to end, but again, 1 fumble in 71 carries doesn't constitute a fumbling problem.

it is when it's a big part of why a talented player totals 17 total carries over the first 10 weeks. I wouldn't have thought it was a big deal but Coughlin clearly did. He sent the message loud and clear and it's undeniable. It doesn't matter what you think or I think, all that matters is what Coughlin thinks. Whether you call it a fumbling issue, a trust issue, whatever, there was an issue there that largely derailed his season otherwise he would've gotten the ball more.

You're assuming he was benched those ten weeks because of that one fumble. It's been brought up already that, while it led to his benching in week one, it did not play nearly a role for most of the rest of the year. It was his pass protection (very common for rookies).

If fumbling was the issue for his lack of carries through ten weeks, why did Coughlin have him returning kicks? You think he's putting a guy with "ball security issues" on kick returns? Do you realize how silly that is?

and I said that as well several posts ago... Johnny focused on the fumbling issue and that one fumble in 71 carries <> fumbling problem. I don't really want to get into a huge debate about fumbling because I really don't care that much but even if a guy is the worst pass protector in history you can still get him the ball in non-pass protection situations. They are in control, they call the play so if they know they are going to call a running play they can trot him in there and give him the ball. He had between 0 and 2 carries in 7 of his first 10 games.

Bottom line there were trust issues, whether it was ball security, pass protection, maturity issues, whatever, that clearly impacted his playing time and I'll be watching/reading closely to see if gaining more trust or not and those issues are in the past. If it's luke warm I likely won't have him on my team and I'll let someone else take the risk but if he seems to gained trust and the evidence backs it up he may.

 

[Banger]

I don't have a horse in this race, don't care who's the starter (though I'll be watching) but one thing I've learned with these situations over the years is not to make up your mind and ignore the tea leaves and think you know better than the coach. I look at players and read as much as I can about them but the most important thing is what the coach says and does. Often times the beat writers are a good source as well...not always, not every situation but it's a puzzle that you have to put together from the various clues you get....some will have more weight/merit than others and through experience/luck/skill you can get the correct read on the situation.

My take on this particular situation is that Wilson is more talented and he'll be given the opportunity (old man Coughlin has said as much). I think it will start as a time sharing situation but the important thing that I'll bet watching and listening for is for confirmed improvement of the things that held him back last year like ball security and pass protection. In these situations I tend to go for the Wilson type if it looks like he may have a chance to emerge or I'll avoid the situation entirely. Drafting the Lendale White (1B part of the backfield) doesn't have the upside but has downside risk of being completely useless.

Again, I must ask, how did he have ball security issues last year with 1 lost fumble in 71 carries?

it's not what I think...it's fact....

NY Giants coach Tom Coughlin benches David Wilson after first-half fumble against Cowboys Rookie and 2012 first-rounder gets message to hold on to the ball after fumble against Cowboys stalls Big Blue momentum Comments (3) By Ebenezer Samuel AND Ralph Vacchiano / NEW YORK DAILY NEWS Thursday, September 6, 2012, 10:18 PM
David Wilson knows to hold onto the ball after being benched for fumbling on second pro carry.


In the moments after Giants rookie running back David Wilson fumbled on Wednesday night, the NBC cameras showed a close-up of his face and a possible tear under his left eye. There was no doubt, as Tom Coughlin said, that Wilson was “very upset.”
But was he crying after he was yanked from the game?

“No, I wasn't crying,” Wilson said Thursday. “I was definitely upset. But, I think it would have been a lot worse if I was smiling or feeling good about it.”


He definitely wasn’t feeling good after he fumbled on his second NFL carry, ruining a Giants drive on which, Coughlin said, “some decent things were happening.” That wasn’t the reason the Giants lost their opener to the Cowboys, 24-17, but it did take away some of their momentum.

PHOTOS: GIANTS MISS CHANCES, LOSE OPENER TO BOYS

“On the sidelines he was very upset about what happened,” Coughlin said. “I did give him credit for that. He was deeply, deeply sorry about what happened. Unfortunately it happened.”

Coughlin admitted Thursday that the fumble was the reason Wilson was benched. “We’re playing the opening game of the year,” Coughlin said. “It’s a divisional game. We had just driven the ball. We’re going to be a bit reluctant. This is not preseason. This is serious business now.”

Wilson seemed to understand all that, and said, “I don’t think they totally gave up on me. They wanted to show me how important it was to hold onto the ball.”

That message was received, even if it didn’t actually bring Wilson to tears.

“I’m passionate about the game and I know (fumbling) is something I have been working on and not wanting to do,” he said. “And for it to happen on my second carry in the opening game, I was highly disappointed.”

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/giants/benching-n-o-crying-shame-giants-david-wilson-article-1.1153792#ixzz2a56I9fKc

Everyone knows that story from beginning to end, but again, 1 fumble in 71 carries doesn't constitute a fumbling problem.

it is when it's a big part of why a talented player totals 17 total carries over the first 10 weeks. I wouldn't have thought it was a big deal but Coughlin clearly did. He sent the message loud and clear and it's undeniable. It doesn't matter what you think or I think, all that matters is what Coughlin thinks. Whether you call it a fumbling issue, a trust issue, whatever, there was an issue there that largely derailed his season otherwise he would've gotten the ball more.

I'm not denying the reason why Coughlin benched him, I know it's because he fumbled. My response was to your comment " improvement of the things that held him back last year like ball security". My point is that 1 fumble in 71 carries didn't hold him back. He obviously did pretty well with ball security for the entire season.

but as I said it may not be an isolated instance...maybe he was putting the ball on the floor in practice and they talked to him and he didn't listen...who knows...what I know was the punishment was severe...it wasn't a half or a game, it was more than half a season.

What really matters is if will get a longer leash WHEN it happens again. If he fumbles in the 1st qtr of game 1, how are you gonna feel as a Wilson owner? I know if I owned him I'd say "oh F###!!!"

On the other hand, if he rushes for 1000 yards and 8 tds in the first 8 games and fumbles three times in the 9th game, I don't think anyone blinks an eye

and he very well may and he may be on my team...and if he is I hope he does.

 

[ShaHBucks]

Any chance he was on the bench because there were two better RBs on the team? I just watch the first two games and they tried to get him the ball still. It's not like he never received a snap after that.

 

[TheFanatic]

Bottom line there were trust issues, whether it was ball security, pass protection, maturity issues, whatever, that clearly impacted his playing time and I'll be watching/reading closely to see if gaining more trust or not and those issues are in the past. If it's luke warm I likely won't have him on my team and I'll let someone else take the risk but if he seems to gained trust and the evidence backs it up he may.

And what could the Giants do to show some trust in the player you feel they had trust issues with? Maybe entrust the running game to this guy plus a guy who was on like 4 teams in 3 years because of injuries and in an limited role last... wait for it... wait for it... year got injured?

 

[Banger]

Bottom line there were trust issues, whether it was ball security, pass protection, maturity issues, whatever, that clearly impacted his playing time and I'll be watching/reading closely to see if gaining more trust or not and those issues are in the past. If it's luke warm I likely won't have him on my team and I'll let someone else take the risk but if he seems to gained trust and the evidence backs it up he may.

And what could the Giants do to show some trust in the player you feel they had trust issues with? Maybe entrust the running game to this guy plus a guy who was on like 4 teams in 3 years because of injuries and in an limited role last... wait for it... wait for it... year got injured?

hear that he's made improvements through glowing reports from coaches/beat writers/teammates...see/hear he's getting a bigger role in terms of touches in TC...that he's working more on 3rd downs and pass protection situations...if he fumbles in preseason and Coughlin downplays it and throws him right back out there.

Now don't go all crazy on me but sometimes situations like this remind me of J. Norwood from years back. There was thread after thread (I was involved in some of them) talking about his talent and how he was going to get a bigger role and was going to take over despite the anecdotal evidence that his role was what it was. I'm not saying that Wilson = Norwood but I've learned from situations like that to be more cautious when thinking gaudy ypc and game breaking speed = future stud starter. When the coach pumps the breaks on a player, I tend to do the same. Sometimes these guys have warts that the team is aware of that we don't see as fans so while I have my opinions on players I like to listen closely to what is being said from all angles and that they are actually DOING it and it's not just Ryan Matthews lip service.

 

[Bob Magaw]

wilson has an unusual constellation of traits/attributes, that could point to stardom...

don't have link handy, but sure i could furnish one... he reportedly led nation in 2011 with approx 150 broken tackles and 1,000+ post-contact yards...

freak athlete... one of best triple jumpers in nation, 41" VJ at combine, didn't clock as fast pre-draft, but supposedly he had run sub 4.4 times at VTech (he looks that fast in his best highlights)... broke school records for positional leg strength, lineman like lower body power (you can see how this directly ties in to the broken tackles), acrobatic, contortionist, yoga adept, gumby-like flexibility coupled with elite contact balance (i saw one clip where his his head and upper body were bent towards field at extreme angle, yet kept his feet, gyroscopically righted himself and continued on... not comparing him in any way in total, but just on that one attribute, walter payton and barry sanders had as good a contact balance as i ever saw, and wilson is elite in this critically important trait...

acknowledged that fumbling (as noted, tiki improved) and pass protection issues could slow his seemingly inexorable rise to stardom... it won't surprise me at all if in a few years his yardage numbers (could get eclipsed in TD dept. if denied goal line looks by COUGHlin - than again, maybe he can be competitive with enough of the long distance variety, ala jamaal charles) are comparable to those of higher drafted RBs from class of '12, richardson and martin...

 

[RBM]

Was just watching some footage from last year. Holy hell he's like shot out of a cannon.

 

[TheFanatic]

Was just watching some footage from last year. Holy hell he's like shot out of a cannon.

No, no, no. He's not any better than Brown. He's nothing special. He is just a guy who was taken in the first who is a little fast... All this needs to stop. He fumbles and he can't really make people miss or run with any power. He'll never score a touchdown because Brown is the guy there. Oh, and he can't pass protect to save his life so he'll only play first down, lose yardage and then be relieved by Brown...

 

[Art_VanDalay]

It seems that the DWilson debate is heated with little middle ground. I confess to be a Wilson owner and believe he has elite talent. I don't think anyone would argue that his talent and his track record in college don't support that especially after being drafted in the 1st round by the Giants, who immediately came out after that pick and said that he was their guy and that they had him rated higher than Doug Martin on their draft board. Guys like Cosell and other NFL scouts have all said he has elite skills as a feature back in the NFL.

Now the other angle for FF success at RB is opportunity. This is where most of the debate rages on this summer. I for one am all for not getting ahead of ourselves and using caution in our forecasting but based on the evidence, I think it will be hard for Wilson NOT to succeed this year.

1. He is explosive and the Giants offense is in need of some explosion, particularly from the running game. They lost Bennett at TE and Nicks hasn't looked dominant in 2 years. Cruz is a nice WR but he is not a #1 imo and is well suited as a compliment to a dominant WR on the other side of the field like a Mike Williams in Tampa. This tells me that the Gmen are going to need to rely more heavily on the running game than they have the last few years. I also believe they will be looking to get Wilson in space more with the screen game as well.

2. They let Bradshaw go. Granted his body is breaking down but they could have kept him if they were really that nervous about Wilson playing and especially on 3rd downs. Bradshaw could have been a nice backup and 3rd down player for them if they were that concerned. I think the Giants realize that this guys talent is too explosive to limit and that his good plays will outweigh his bad plays (fumbles, missed blocks) which will also improve with more playing time.

3. Andre Brown! We're talking Andre Brown? I mean I think he is a nice player like many others but a sleeper or a guy that is going to be a huge factor in Wilson's development? He was a 4th Round pick by the Giants in 2009, not a 1st like Wilson, and since then played on not one, not two, but EIGHT teams since returning to the Gmen in 2011. He showed some flashes of being a good player but I would argue that just comes from his level of experience over Wilson which is about to change in 2013 with Wilson getting a lot of PT with Bradshaw gone. I don't see Brown being much more than a series or 2 per game guy and most of the goalline looks...that is if he can stay healthy. In his career since '09, he has only PLAYED in 14 games and only started 2 games which came last year. He is clearly not special since 8 teams actually have cut him before and is being vastly overrated by the FF community this year as the anti-Wilson alternative vote. This is looking a lot like many of our elections in the US but there is no arguing the potential that Wilson brings which Brown has never had and never will have.

4. NYG have a solid OL that may not be a huge asset but isn't a liability to their run game either. They also have a veteran QB in Eli who knows how to read defenses and put them in good positions to succeed with play changes at the LOS.

I think caution is a good thing in FF no doubt but if you want to hit big on tomorrow's FF stars, you have to get to the station a little early before the train leaves the station. Yea there is always downside risk in jumping on guys with special talent early (ahem Ryan Matthews) but when it does pan out, you are possibly in the position to be playing for championships or dare I say, dynasty's in a keeper league. I don't advocate going crazy on drafting him ahead of solid proven vets if they are available but Wilson is definitely a "play to win now" guy for 2013 and could be FF gold in 2014. He has the talent and opportunity to be a star in this league and could be a huge difference maker as a team's #2 RB that may be playing like a #1 when the FF playoffs role around.

As for the downside of his fumbling issues, I think this is getting way ahead of things. While I know he was known for having a tendancy to put the ball on the ground in college, he really only had the one fumble and the timing of the fumble was more detrimental than anything else. It sapped his confidence and the team's confidence in him. Also, I think many are getting his "benching" over the fumble from last year wrong! From what I heard, Coughlin was much less upset about the actual fumble (coaches always tell you they can live with physical mistakes, obviously to a point, but they hate mental mistakes because they are avoidable) and more upset and benched him because of the way he handled the miscue mentally. He was crying on the sideline and showed a lack of maturity which sapped Coughlin's faith in him so early in his career. They decided to put the kid gloves on him to make sure he was going to be good for the longhaul and that time is approaching very quickly in 2013. Fumbles are physical mistakes that can be corrected with technique and like other great RBs that have had a tendancy to fumble more than coaches would like, they also make up for it sometimes with gamebreaking plays for scores. In the end, I keep coming back to how I think it will be very hard for Wilson NOT to succeed this year for fantasy and expect big things from him. 1,000 Rush/250 Rec and 7-9 TDs should be the floor imo.

 

[Banger]

It seems that the DWilson debate is heated with little middle ground. I confess to be a Wilson owner and believe he has elite talent. I don't think anyone would argue that his talent and his track record in college don't support that especially after being drafted in the 1st round by the Giants, who immediately came out after that pick and said that he was their guy and that they had him rated higher than Doug Martin on their draft board. Guys like Cosell and other NFL scouts have all said he has elite skills as a feature back in the NFL.

Now the other angle for FF success at RB is opportunity. This is where most of the debate rages on this summer. I for one am all for not getting ahead of ourselves and using caution in our forecasting but based on the evidence, I think it will be hard for Wilson NOT to succeed this year.

1. He is explosive and the Giants offense is in need of some explosion, particularly from the running game. They lost Bennett at TE and Nicks hasn't looked dominant in 2 years. Cruz is a nice WR but he is not a #1 imo and is well suited as a compliment to a dominant WR on the other side of the field like a Mike Williams in Tampa. This tells me that the Gmen are going to need to rely more heavily on the running game than they have the last few years. I also believe they will be looking to get Wilson in space more with the screen game as well.

2. They let Bradshaw go. Granted his body is breaking down but they could have kept him if they were really that nervous about Wilson playing and especially on 3rd downs. Bradshaw could have been a nice backup and 3rd down player for them if they were that concerned. I think the Giants realize that this guys talent is too explosive to limit and that his good plays will outweigh his bad plays (fumbles, missed blocks) which will also improve with more playing time.

3. Andre Brown! We're talking Andre Brown? I mean I think he is a nice player like many others but a sleeper or a guy that is going to be a huge factor in Wilson's development? He was a 4th Round pick by the Giants in 2009, not a 1st like Wilson, and since then played on not one, not two, but EIGHT teams since returning to the Gmen in 2011. He showed some flashes of being a good player but I would argue that just comes from his level of experience over Wilson which is about to change in 2013 with Wilson getting a lot of PT with Bradshaw gone. I don't see Brown being much more than a series or 2 per game guy and most of the goalline looks...that is if he can stay healthy. In his career since '09, he has only PLAYED in 14 games and only started 2 games which came last year. He is clearly not special since 8 teams actually have cut him before and is being vastly overrated by the FF community this year as the anti-Wilson alternative vote. This is looking a lot like many of our elections in the US but there is no arguing the potential that Wilson brings which Brown has never had and never will have.

4. NYG have a solid OL that may not be a huge asset but isn't a liability to their run game either. They also have a veteran QB in Eli who knows how to read defenses and put them in good positions to succeed with play changes at the LOS.

I think caution is a good thing in FF no doubt but if you want to hit big on tomorrow's FF stars, you have to get to the station a little early before the train leaves the station. Yea there is always downside risk in jumping on guys with special talent early (ahem Ryan Matthews) but when it does pan out, you are possibly in the position to be playing for championships or dare I say, dynasty's in a keeper league. I don't advocate going crazy on drafting him ahead of solid proven vets if they are available but Wilson is definitely a "play to win now" guy for 2013 and could be FF gold in 2014. He has the talent and opportunity to be a star in this league and could be a huge difference maker as a team's #2 RB that may be playing like a #1 when the FF playoffs role around.

As for the downside of his fumbling issues, I think this is getting way ahead of things. While I know he was known for having a tendancy to put the ball on the ground in college, he really only had the one fumble and the timing of the fumble was more detrimental than anything else. It sapped his confidence and the team's confidence in him. Also, I think many are getting his "benching" over the fumble from last year wrong! From what I heard, Coughlin was much less upset about the actual fumble (coaches always tell you they can live with physical mistakes, obviously to a point, but they hate mental mistakes because they are avoidable) and more upset and benched him because of the way he handled the miscue mentally. He was crying on the sideline and showed a lack of maturity which sapped Coughlin's faith in him so early in his career. They decided to put the kid gloves on him to make sure he was going to be good for the longhaul and that time is approaching very quickly in 2013. Fumbles are physical mistakes that can be corrected with technique and like other great RBs that have had a tendancy to fumble more than coaches would like, they also make up for it sometimes with gamebreaking plays for scores. In the end, I keep coming back to how I think it will be very hard for Wilson NOT to succeed this year for fantasy and expect big things from him. 1,000 Rush/250 Rec and 7-9 TDs should be the floor imo.

 

[TheFanatic]

It seems that the DWilson debate is heated with little middle ground. I confess to be a Wilson owner and believe he has elite talent. I don't think anyone would argue that his talent and his track record in college don't support that especially after being drafted in the 1st round by the Giants, who immediately came out after that pick and said that he was their guy and that they had him rated higher than Doug Martin on their draft board. Guys like Cosell and other NFL scouts have all said he has elite skills as a feature back in the NFL.

Now the other angle for FF success at RB is opportunity. This is where most of the debate rages on this summer. I for one am all for not getting ahead of ourselves and using caution in our forecasting but based on the evidence, I think it will be hard for Wilson NOT to succeed this year.

1. He is explosive and the Giants offense is in need of some explosion, particularly from the running game. They lost Bennett at TE and Nicks hasn't looked dominant in 2 years. Cruz is a nice WR but he is not a #1 imo and is well suited as a compliment to a dominant WR on the other side of the field like a Mike Williams in Tampa. This tells me that the Gmen are going to need to rely more heavily on the running game than they have the last few years. I also believe they will be looking to get Wilson in space more with the screen game as well.

2. They let Bradshaw go. Granted his body is breaking down but they could have kept him if they were really that nervous about Wilson playing and especially on 3rd downs. Bradshaw could have been a nice backup and 3rd down player for them if they were that concerned. I think the Giants realize that this guys talent is too explosive to limit and that his good plays will outweigh his bad plays (fumbles, missed blocks) which will also improve with more playing time.

3. Andre Brown! We're talking Andre Brown? I mean I think he is a nice player like many others but a sleeper or a guy that is going to be a huge factor in Wilson's development? He was a 4th Round pick by the Giants in 2009, not a 1st like Wilson, and since then played on not one, not two, but EIGHT teams since returning to the Gmen in 2011. He showed some flashes of being a good player but I would argue that just comes from his level of experience over Wilson which is about to change in 2013 with Wilson getting a lot of PT with Bradshaw gone. I don't see Brown being much more than a series or 2 per game guy and most of the goalline looks...that is if he can stay healthy. In his career since '09, he has only PLAYED in 14 games and only started 2 games which came last year. He is clearly not special since 8 teams actually have cut him before and is being vastly overrated by the FF community this year as the anti-Wilson alternative vote. This is looking a lot like many of our elections in the US but there is no arguing the potential that Wilson brings which Brown has never had and never will have.

4. NYG have a solid OL that may not be a huge asset but isn't a liability to their run game either. They also have a veteran QB in Eli who knows how to read defenses and put them in good positions to succeed with play changes at the LOS.

I think caution is a good thing in FF no doubt but if you want to hit big on tomorrow's FF stars, you have to get to the station a little early before the train leaves the station. Yea there is always downside risk in jumping on guys with special talent early (ahem Ryan Matthews) but when it does pan out, you are possibly in the position to be playing for championships or dare I say, dynasty's in a keeper league. I don't advocate going crazy on drafting him ahead of solid proven vets if they are available but Wilson is definitely a "play to win now" guy for 2013 and could be FF gold in 2014. He has the talent and opportunity to be a star in this league and could be a huge difference maker as a team's #2 RB that may be playing like a #1 when the FF playoffs role around.

As for the downside of his fumbling issues, I think this is getting way ahead of things. While I know he was known for having a tendancy to put the ball on the ground in college, he really only had the one fumble and the timing of the fumble was more detrimental than anything else. It sapped his confidence and the team's confidence in him. Also, I think many are getting his "benching" over the fumble from last year wrong! From what I heard, Coughlin was much less upset about the actual fumble (coaches always tell you they can live with physical mistakes, obviously to a point, but they hate mental mistakes because they are avoidable) and more upset and benched him because of the way he handled the miscue mentally. He was crying on the sideline and showed a lack of maturity which sapped Coughlin's faith in him so early in his career. They decided to put the kid gloves on him to make sure he was going to be good for the longhaul and that time is approaching very quickly in 2013. Fumbles are physical mistakes that can be corrected with technique and like other great RBs that have had a tendancy to fumble more than coaches would like, they also make up for it sometimes with gamebreaking plays for scores. In the end, I keep coming back to how I think it will be very hard for Wilson NOT to succeed this year for fantasy and expect big things from him. 1,000 Rush/250 Rec and 7-9 TDs should be the floor imo.

:GoodPosting:

 

[ShaHBucks]

Half of this thread is about a rookie getting bench ONE GAME for fumbling early. I don't understand this at all. If you watch the Tampa game(Wk 2) he was still being utilized EARLY in the game. The 1st possession Wilson lines up in a empty backfield and drops a easy pass for crying out loud. The second possesion he get 2 carries for 5 yards. Andre Brown was the primary back on the first TD drive that went close to 80 yards. "Don't quote me on this," but he ran for at least half of those 80 yards. Wilson's first two games he had 5 carries for 10 yards and two drops! That's why Wilson was benched! It had little to do with just ONE fumble. Brown was more effective as the Bradshaw replacement. Then Brown goes and looks like the greatest RB ever vs Car the next week. Vs the Eagles Wilson was still dropping passes. I know it drives you guys crazy, but it's true. I like Wilson as a prospect. I think there is a chance he reaches an elite status in the NFL. Right now the hype is not warrented. He was awful as a rookie, outside of 1-3 runs in blowouts that skews his ypc to an "elite" status on a small sample size. Andre Brown was better then him. That's not hard to say.

 

[jacobo_moses]

Now granted I think Andre Brown is a good running back. Pretty well rounded in what he can provided. Impressed when I've seen him get a decent amount of carries. But here is the reality for those hyping up Andre Brown. I just looked at his stats and injuries last year and found this interesting. He only had 3 games last year of 10 or more carries (Wk2 13 carries, Wk3 20 carries, Wk12 13 carries.) And he had 3 injuries last year that took him out of games or eventually the season. (Concussion, Shoulder Injury, and then Foot and Ankle that ended his season.) So he didn't even have that big of a work load and had these 3 injuries that hampered him. I just think those seeing a 50/50 split with Andre Brown need to pump the brakes. They didn't let Bradshaw walk, knowing that Andre Brown is a bigger back and will take harder hits (and be injured more often cause of it) and he isn't a burner. They did it because of David Wilson. That is all I'm saying.

 

[ShaHBucks]

I think I'll take my ball and go home now

 

[TheFanatic]

I think I'll take my ball and go home now

You can cry foul and say he dropped balls early in the season and had the fumble. But you really can't deny the injury history of Brown. Instead you can mope and say, "But he's not that good." Except he's all they have. So someone in the NFL thinks he is. You can't deny that. You can watch the film and say, "I don't see it," but realize that you are on a FFB in July and the guys that decide who gets playing time are preparing for an NFL training camp and have handed him the keys to the car.

 

[Art_VanDalay]

Half of this thread is about a rookie getting bench ONE GAME for fumbling early. I don't understand this at all. If you watch the Tampa game(Wk 2) he was still being utilized EARLY in the game. The 1st possession Wilson lines up in a empty backfield and drops a easy pass for crying out loud. The second possesion he get 2 carries for 5 yards. Andre Brown was the primary back on the first TD drive that went close to 80 yards. "Don't quote me on this," but he ran for at least half of those 80 yards. Wilson's first two games he had 5 carries for 10 yards and two drops! That's why Wilson was benched! It had little to do with just ONE fumble. Brown was more effective as the Bradshaw replacement. Then Brown goes and looks like the greatest RB ever vs Car the next week. Vs the Eagles Wilson was still dropping passes. I know it drives you guys crazy, but it's true. I like Wilson as a prospect. I think there is a chance he reaches an elite status in the NFL. Right now the hype is not warrented. He was awful as a rookie, outside of 1-3 runs in blowouts that skews his ypc to an "elite" status on a small sample size. Andre Brown was better then him. That's not hard to say.

Brown is average on his best day. They are not even in the same universe talent wise. He's been cut more times since 2009 than a naked paper factory worker! What you are espousing is to wait until Wilson proves that he is elite by winning the job and ripping off big runs, etc. before grabbing him. Well that may be possible but I know the asking price to get him at that point, espcially in a keeper league, will be through the roof and at that point you won't have him, possibly for several years in a keeper. But hey, at least you will have Brown and his 14 games played since 2009. I am willing within reason to grab Wilson as my 2nd RB which I guess means around the 4th round hopefully but if I had to get him in the 3rd I would consider it. If he disappoints (I can't see how he would completely "bust") then you overpaid and will need to rework your team AND you will probably have a much easier time selling him to someone else on Potential and Hype still than you will trying to trade FOR him from the guy who grabbed him in the 3rd or 4th and is watching him rip off long runs regularly. Like I said, Wilson is a "play to win" now guy so obviously there is risk. If you want to play it safe, go with Brown, (although how safe is an oft-injured, cut 8 times guy really?) but if you are playing to win a championship, you find a way to get a guy like Wilson on your team before the train leaves the station. Choo Choo!!

 

[Pipes]

Wow Wilson owners really get their panties in a bunch if you question their high opinion of him. Sure he's more talented than Brown and should be the main guy in the backfield. But Brown is there and was solid last year. He's definitely a concern, even if a slight one, for someone who appears will be drafted by the end of round 2 in most leagues. I don't think Wilson "detractors" are saying he sucks it's just they are questioning his high ranking some of you have on him.

 

[Yenrub]

Half of this thread is about a rookie getting bench ONE GAME for fumbling early. I don't understand this at all. If you watch the Tampa game(Wk 2) he was still being utilized EARLY in the game. The 1st possession Wilson lines up in a empty backfield and drops a easy pass for crying out loud. The second possesion he get 2 carries for 5 yards. Andre Brown was the primary back on the first TD drive that went close to 80 yards. "Don't quote me on this," but he ran for at least half of those 80 yards. Wilson's first two games he had 5 carries for 10 yards and two drops! That's why Wilson was benched! It had little to do with just ONE fumble. Brown was more effective as the Bradshaw replacement. Then Brown goes and looks like the greatest RB ever vs Car the next week. Vs the Eagles Wilson was still dropping passes. I know it drives you guys crazy, but it's true. I like Wilson as a prospect. I think there is a chance he reaches an elite status in the NFL. Right now the hype is not warrented. He was awful as a rookie, outside of 1-3 runs in blowouts that skews his ypc to an "elite" status on a small sample size. Andre Brown was better then him. That's not hard to say.

Brown is average on his best day. They are not even in the same universe talent wise. He's been cut more times since 2009 than a naked paper factory worker! What you are espousing is to wait until Wilson proves that he is elite by winning the job and ripping off big runs, etc. before grabbing him. Well that may be possible but I know the asking price to get him at that point, espcially in a keeper league, will be through the roof and at that point you won't have him, possibly for several years in a keeper. But hey, at least you will have Brown and his 14 games played since 2009. I am willing within reason to grab Wilson as my 2nd RB which I guess means around the 4th round hopefully but if I had to get him in the 3rd I would consider it. If he disappoints (I can't see how he would completely "bust") then you overpaid and will need to rework your team AND you will probably have a much easier time selling him to someone else on Potential and Hype still than you will trying to trade FOR him from the guy who grabbed him in the 3rd or 4th and is watching him rip off long runs regularly. Like I said, Wilson is a "play to win" now guy so obviously there is risk. If you want to play it safe, go with Brown, (although how safe is an oft-injured, cut 8 times guy really?) but if you are playing to win a championship, you find a way to get a guy like Wilson on your team before the train leaves the station. Choo Choo!!

Why is the number of times that Brown was cut relevant?

 

[monk]

Half of this thread is about a rookie getting bench ONE GAME for fumbling early. I don't understand this at all. If you watch the Tampa game(Wk 2) he was still being utilized EARLY in the game. The 1st possession Wilson lines up in a empty backfield and drops a easy pass for crying out loud. The second possesion he get 2 carries for 5 yards. Andre Brown was the primary back on the first TD drive that went close to 80 yards. "Don't quote me on this," but he ran for at least half of those 80 yards. Wilson's first two games he had 5 carries for 10 yards and two drops! That's why Wilson was benched! It had little to do with just ONE fumble. Brown was more effective as the Bradshaw replacement. Then Brown goes and looks like the greatest RB ever vs Car the next week. Vs the Eagles Wilson was still dropping passes. I know it drives you guys crazy, but it's true. I like Wilson as a prospect. I think there is a chance he reaches an elite status in the NFL. Right now the hype is not warrented. He was awful as a rookie, outside of 1-3 runs in blowouts that skews his ypc to an "elite" status on a small sample size. Andre Brown was better then him. That's not hard to say.

Whatever you do ... Do Not! I repeat Do Not!!! Look at these links. I will only make it hurt that much more.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uviR8HjLDxk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1bO123KOEM

 

[Art_VanDalay]

Because those are "evaluations" by numerous, well qualified, NFL experts. If he can't make the 55 man roster on 8 different teams, that tells you a lot about what experts think of his talent level. He has 77 Career carries since 2009. 73 came last year and he couldn't even stay healthy for those. I stand by my point which is my only point...Brown is being overvalued by the Wilson detractors and that "safe" move is actually risky when you look at the lack of talent vs. Wilson and the minimal career and body of work for Brown over his subpar career...while Wilson is costing more than he probably should in drafts but the fact remains, he has evident homerun potential and is a "play to win" guy for 2013 with some risk but not as much as people are saying. BTW if Bradshaw were still a Giant, I wouldn't even be writing this because there would be no question that the coaches don't think Wilson could handle the job and actually to go further, even if they thought Bradshaw was broken down, they didn't go out and bring in any other veteran RBs either. They have put their faith in him and I trust their judgment. I think the chances of him hitting it big versus flaming out are much better than people realize when looking at the big picture.

 

[Yenrub]

Because those are "evaluations" by numerous, well qualified, NFL experts. If he can't make the 55 man roster on 8 different teams, that tells you a lot about what experts think of his talent level. He has 77 Career carries since 2009. 73 came last year and he couldn't even stay healthy for those. I stand by my point which is my only point...Brown is being overvalued by the Wilson detractors and that "safe" move is actually risky when you look at the lack of talent vs. Wilson and the minimal career and body of work for Brown over his subpar career...while Wilson is costing more than he probably should in drafts but the fact remains, he has evident homerun potential and is a "play to win" guy for 2013 with some risk but not as much as people are saying. BTW if Bradshaw were still a Giant, I wouldn't even be writing this because there would be no question that the coaches don't think Wilson could handle the job and actually to go further, even if they thought Bradshaw was broken down, they didn't go out and bring in any other veteran RBs either. They have put their faith in him and I trust their judgment. I think the chances of him hitting it big versus flaming out are much better than people realize when looking at the big picture.

Brown wasn’t cut all of those times because he didn’t have the talent. He was cut because he wasn’t fully recovered from his ruptured Achilles’ tendon and wasn’t capable of displaying his talent.

Here is quote from Brown

[SIZE=9pt]"Last year, I was just getting out from surgery so I just felt that I could run straight ahead," Brown said. "I couldn't make cuts like I wanted to, and I am a natural jump-cutter. I like to jump in and out of things, but I didn't feel that pop."[/SIZE]

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/story/_/id/6846011/new-york-giants-running-back-andre-brown-comes-full-circle

 

[Art_VanDalay]

Because those are "evaluations" by numerous, well qualified, NFL experts. If he can't make the 55 man roster on 8 different teams, that tells you a lot about what experts think of his talent level. He has 77 Career carries since 2009. 73 came last year and he couldn't even stay healthy for those. I stand by my point which is my only point...Brown is being overvalued by the Wilson detractors and that "safe" move is actually risky when you look at the lack of talent vs. Wilson and the minimal career and body of work for Brown over his subpar career...while Wilson is costing more than he probably should in drafts but the fact remains, he has evident homerun potential and is a "play to win" guy for 2013 with some risk but not as much as people are saying. BTW if Bradshaw were still a Giant, I wouldn't even be writing this because there would be no question that the coaches don't think Wilson could handle the job and actually to go further, even if they thought Bradshaw was broken down, they didn't go out and bring in any other veteran RBs either. They have put their faith in him and I trust their judgment. I think the chances of him hitting it big versus flaming out are much better than people realize when looking at the big picture.

Brown wasn’t cut all of those times because he didn’t have the talent. He was cut because he wasn’t fully recovered from his ruptured Achilles’ tendon and wasn’t capable of displaying his talent.

Here is quote from Brown

[SIZE=9pt]"Last year, I was just getting out from surgery so I just felt that I could run straight ahead," Brown said. "I couldn't make cuts like I wanted to, and I am a natural jump-cutter. I like to jump in and out of things, but I didn't feel that pop."[/SIZE]

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/story/_/id/6846011/new-york-giants-running-back-andre-brown-comes-full-circle

Uh, he ruptured his Achilles back in 2009. Crabtree is talking about coming back this season from his and Suggs did last year. So we are going to blame his lack of impact on all those teams because he hasn't had any "pop" in his game for 4 years? Based on that, he should be a great pick in the 2016 draft after suffering his broken fibula last year. This is wishful thinking. I will stand by the fact that Brown's talent is limited and nothing special.

 

[Touchdown There]

Because those are "evaluations" by numerous, well qualified, NFL experts. If he can't make the 55 man roster on 8 different teams, that tells you a lot about what experts think of his talent level. He has 77 Career carries since 2009. 73 came last year and he couldn't even stay healthy for those. I stand by my point which is my only point...Brown is being overvalued by the Wilson detractors and that "safe" move is actually risky when you look at the lack of talent vs. Wilson and the minimal career and body of work for Brown over his subpar career...while Wilson is costing more than he probably should in drafts but the fact remains, he has evident homerun potential and is a "play to win" guy for 2013 with some risk but not as much as people are saying. BTW if Bradshaw were still a Giant, I wouldn't even be writing this because there would be no question that the coaches don't think Wilson could handle the job and actually to go further, even if they thought Bradshaw was broken down, they didn't go out and bring in any other veteran RBs either. They have put their faith in him and I trust their judgment. I think the chances of him hitting it big versus flaming out are much better than people realize when looking at the big picture.

Brown wasn’t cut all of those times because he didn’t have the talent. He was cut because he wasn’t fully recovered from his ruptured Achilles’ tendon and wasn’t capable of displaying his talent.

Here is quote from Brown

[SIZE=9pt]"Last year, I was just getting out from surgery so I just felt that I could run straight ahead," Brown said. "I couldn't make cuts like I wanted to, and I am a natural jump-cutter. I like to jump in and out of things, but I didn't feel that pop."[/SIZE]

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/story/_/id/6846011/new-york-giants-running-back-andre-brown-comes-full-circle

Andre Brown owner in the David Wilson Bandwagon thread. Again.

 

[ShaHBucks]

Half of this thread is about a rookie getting bench ONE GAME for fumbling early. I don't understand this at all. If you watch the Tampa game(Wk 2) he was still being utilized EARLY in the game. The 1st possession Wilson lines up in a empty backfield and drops a easy pass for crying out loud. The second possesion he get 2 carries for 5 yards. Andre Brown was the primary back on the first TD drive that went close to 80 yards. "Don't quote me on this," but he ran for at least half of those 80 yards. Wilson's first two games he had 5 carries for 10 yards and two drops! That's why Wilson was benched! It had little to do with just ONE fumble. Brown was more effective as the Bradshaw replacement. Then Brown goes and looks like the greatest RB ever vs Car the next week. Vs the Eagles Wilson was still dropping passes. I know it drives you guys crazy, but it's true. I like Wilson as a prospect. I think there is a chance he reaches an elite status in the NFL. Right now the hype is not warrented. He was awful as a rookie, outside of 1-3 runs in blowouts that skews his ypc to an "elite" status on a small sample size. Andre Brown was better then him. That's not hard to say.

Brown is average on his best day. They are not even in the same universe talent wise. He's been cut more times since 2009 than a naked paper factory worker! What you are espousing is to wait until Wilson proves that he is elite by winning the job and ripping off big runs, etc. before grabbing him. Well that may be possible but I know the asking price to get him at that point, espcially in a keeper league, will be through the roof and at that point you won't have him, possibly for several years in a keeper. But hey, at least you will have Brown and his 14 games played since 2009. I am willing within reason to grab Wilson as my 2nd RB which I guess means around the 4th round hopefully but if I had to get him in the 3rd I would consider it. If he disappoints (I can't see how he would completely "bust") then you overpaid and will need to rework your team AND you will probably have a much easier time selling him to someone else on Potential and Hype still than you will trying to trade FOR him from the guy who grabbed him in the 3rd or 4th and is watching him rip off long runs regularly. Like I said, Wilson is a "play to win" now guy so obviously there is risk. If you want to play it safe, go with Brown, (although how safe is an oft-injured, cut 8 times guy really?) but if you are playing to win a championship, you find a way to get a guy like Wilson on your team before the train leaves the station. Choo Choo!!

Championship! Thanks for the Shark play bro.

 

[ShaHBucks]

Half of this thread is about a rookie getting bench ONE GAME for fumbling early. I don't understand this at all. If you watch the Tampa game(Wk 2) he was still being utilized EARLY in the game. The 1st possession Wilson lines up in a empty backfield and drops a easy pass for crying out loud. The second possesion he get 2 carries for 5 yards. Andre Brown was the primary back on the first TD drive that went close to 80 yards. "Don't quote me on this," but he ran for at least half of those 80 yards. Wilson's first two games he had 5 carries for 10 yards and two drops! That's why Wilson was benched! It had little to do with just ONE fumble. Brown was more effective as the Bradshaw replacement. Then Brown goes and looks like the greatest RB ever vs Car the next week. Vs the Eagles Wilson was still dropping passes. I know it drives you guys crazy, but it's true. I like Wilson as a prospect. I think there is a chance he reaches an elite status in the NFL. Right now the hype is not warrented. He was awful as a rookie, outside of 1-3 runs in blowouts that skews his ypc to an "elite" status on a small sample size. Andre Brown was better then him. That's not hard to say.

Whatever you do ... Do Not! I repeat Do Not!!! Look at these links. I will only make it hurt that much more.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uviR8HjLDxk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1bO123KOEM

If just spent time to say what happened in a actual game I watch. why would I go watch a highlight clip after that? That's the problem, you're watching highlights.

 

[TheFanatic]

Half of this thread is about a rookie getting bench ONE GAME for fumbling early. I don't understand this at all. If you watch the Tampa game(Wk 2) he was still being utilized EARLY in the game. The 1st possession Wilson lines up in a empty backfield and drops a easy pass for crying out loud. The second possesion he get 2 carries for 5 yards. Andre Brown was the primary back on the first TD drive that went close to 80 yards. "Don't quote me on this," but he ran for at least half of those 80 yards. Wilson's first two games he had 5 carries for 10 yards and two drops! That's why Wilson was benched! It had little to do with just ONE fumble. Brown was more effective as the Bradshaw replacement. Then Brown goes and looks like the greatest RB ever vs Car the next week. Vs the Eagles Wilson was still dropping passes. I know it drives you guys crazy, but it's true. I like Wilson as a prospect. I think there is a chance he reaches an elite status in the NFL. Right now the hype is not warrented. He was awful as a rookie, outside of 1-3 runs in blowouts that skews his ypc to an "elite" status on a small sample size. Andre Brown was better then him. That's not hard to say.

Whatever you do ... Do Not! I repeat Do Not!!! Look at these links. I will only make it hurt that much more.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uviR8HjLDxk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1bO123KOEM

If just spent time to say what happened in a actual game I watch. why would I go watch a highlight clip after that? That's the problem, you're watching highlights.

I'll try to be nice to you when bumping this thread all season. I'm not sure others will be as kind. Remember, you reap what you sew...

 

[ShaHBucks]

Half of this thread is about a rookie getting bench ONE GAME for fumbling early. I don't understand this at all. If you watch the Tampa game(Wk 2) he was still being utilized EARLY in the game. The 1st possession Wilson lines up in a empty backfield and drops a easy pass for crying out loud. The second possesion he get 2 carries for 5 yards. Andre Brown was the primary back on the first TD drive that went close to 80 yards. "Don't quote me on this," but he ran for at least half of those 80 yards. Wilson's first two games he had 5 carries for 10 yards and two drops! That's why Wilson was benched! It had little to do with just ONE fumble. Brown was more effective as the Bradshaw replacement. Then Brown goes and looks like the greatest RB ever vs Car the next week. Vs the Eagles Wilson was still dropping passes. I know it drives you guys crazy, but it's true. I like Wilson as a prospect. I think there is a chance he reaches an elite status in the NFL. Right now the hype is not warrented. He was awful as a rookie, outside of 1-3 runs in blowouts that skews his ypc to an "elite" status on a small sample size. Andre Brown was better then him. That's not hard to say.

Whatever you do ... Do Not! I repeat Do Not!!! Look at these links. I will only make it hurt that much more.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uviR8HjLDxk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1bO123KOEM

If just spent time to say what happened in a actual game I watch. why would I go watch a highlight clip after that? That's the problem, you're watching highlights.

I'll try to be nice to you when bumping this thread all season. I'm not sure others will be as kind. Remember, you reap what you sew...

I could careless. Try bumping what I said about Wilson last preseason as well. There a big difference between the process and the outcome. All I did was state what I thought were facts that anyone can go check for themselves. You guys made up a bunch of hypothetical/opinionated stories, not me.

 

[Yenrub]

Because those are "evaluations" by numerous, well qualified, NFL experts. If he can't make the 55 man roster on 8 different teams, that tells you a lot about what experts think of his talent level. He has 77 Career carries since 2009. 73 came last year and he couldn't even stay healthy for those. I stand by my point which is my only point...Brown is being overvalued by the Wilson detractors and that "safe" move is actually risky when you look at the lack of talent vs. Wilson and the minimal career and body of work for Brown over his subpar career...while Wilson is costing more than he probably should in drafts but the fact remains, he has evident homerun potential and is a "play to win" guy for 2013 with some risk but not as much as people are saying. BTW if Bradshaw were still a Giant, I wouldn't even be writing this because there would be no question that the coaches don't think Wilson could handle the job and actually to go further, even if they thought Bradshaw was broken down, they didn't go out and bring in any other veteran RBs either. They have put their faith in him and I trust their judgment. I think the chances of him hitting it big versus flaming out are much better than people realize when looking at the big picture.

Brown wasn’t cut all of those times because he didn’t have the talent. He was cut because he wasn’t fully recovered from his ruptured Achilles’ tendon and wasn’t capable of displaying his talent.

Here is quote from Brown

[SIZE=9pt]"Last year, I was just getting out from surgery so I just felt that I could run straight ahead," Brown said. "I couldn't make cuts like I wanted to, and I am a natural jump-cutter. I like to jump in and out of things, but I didn't feel that pop."[/SIZE]

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/story/_/id/6846011/new-york-giants-running-back-andre-brown-comes-full-circle

Andre Brown owner in the David Wilson Bandwagon thread. Again.

I own both in different leagues so owning one or the other has nothing to do with it plus I am a Giants fan so I really don’t care how it plays out just as long as the Giants running game is strong and they win games…but nice try.

I think Wilson is the more talented back of the two and I think he will receive the majority of the work load (whether that majority is 51% or 70% I have no idea) but I don’t think that Brown is devoid of talent or just another guy as others have suggested. I think Brown is talented enough to be a starter in the NFL.

 

[Yenrub]

Because those are "evaluations" by numerous, well qualified, NFL experts. If he can't make the 55 man roster on 8 different teams, that tells you a lot about what experts think of his talent level. He has 77 Career carries since 2009. 73 came last year and he couldn't even stay healthy for those. I stand by my point which is my only point...Brown is being overvalued by the Wilson detractors and that "safe" move is actually risky when you look at the lack of talent vs. Wilson and the minimal career and body of work for Brown over his subpar career...while Wilson is costing more than he probably should in drafts but the fact remains, he has evident homerun potential and is a "play to win" guy for 2013 with some risk but not as much as people are saying. BTW if Bradshaw were still a Giant, I wouldn't even be writing this because there would be no question that the coaches don't think Wilson could handle the job and actually to go further, even if they thought Bradshaw was broken down, they didn't go out and bring in any other veteran RBs either. They have put their faith in him and I trust their judgment. I think the chances of him hitting it big versus flaming out are much better than people realize when looking at the big picture.

Brown wasn’t cut all of those times because he didn’t have the talent. He was cut because he wasn’t fully recovered from his ruptured Achilles’ tendon and wasn’t capable of displaying his talent.

Here is quote from Brown

[SIZE=9pt]"Last year, I was just getting out from surgery so I just felt that I could run straight ahead," Brown said. "I couldn't make cuts like I wanted to, and I am a natural jump-cutter. I like to jump in and out of things, but I didn't feel that pop."[/SIZE]

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/story/_/id/6846011/new-york-giants-running-back-andre-brown-comes-full-circle

Uh, he ruptured his Achilles back in 2009. Crabtree is talking about coming back this season from his and Suggs did last year. So we are going to blame his lack of impact on all those teams because he hasn't had any "pop" in his game for 4 years? Based on that, he should be a great pick in the 2016 draft after suffering his broken fibula last year. This is wishful thinking. I will stand by the fact that Brown's talent is limited and nothing special.

People recover from injuries at different rates both physically and mentally

 

[jacobo_moses]

Wow Wilson owners really get their panties in a bunch if you question their high opinion of him. Sure he's more talented than Brown and should be the main guy in the backfield. But Brown is there and was solid last year. He's definitely a concern, even if a slight one, for someone who appears will be drafted by the end of round 2 in most leagues. I don't think Wilson "detractors" are saying he sucks it's just they are questioning his high ranking some of you have on him.

My issue is Brown supporters trying to say Brown is going to do an even 50/50 split and that is why you push WIlson down so much. I don't see it like that given A) They let Bradshaw walk B) Brown's injury history as I pointed out last season where he only had 3 games of more then 10 carries and had to leave 3 games last season do to injury.

I think if you view Wilson as an RB2 (with RB1 upside in Dynasty) you are safe. Seeing him less then that, you must have more faith in Brown staying healthy for a full 16 games then I do.

Wilson will get 70% of touches for the NYG RB's on condition he shows good ball security and better pass protection. The signs are there for that.

 

[Andrew74]

I own Wilson and I am hoping for RB2 # this year but bigger things in 14 and beyond.

For those dogging his poor play in the first several games of the year, maybe it just took him time to get accustomed to the NFL. Martin looked like dog crap for weeks until the switch seemed to flip.

 

[monk]

Half of this thread is about a rookie getting bench ONE GAME for fumbling early. I don't understand this at all. If you watch the Tampa game(Wk 2) he was still being utilized EARLY in the game. The 1st possession Wilson lines up in a empty backfield and drops a easy pass for crying out loud. The second possesion he get 2 carries for 5 yards. Andre Brown was the primary back on the first TD drive that went close to 80 yards. "Don't quote me on this," but he ran for at least half of those 80 yards. Wilson's first two games he had 5 carries for 10 yards and two drops! That's why Wilson was benched! It had little to do with just ONE fumble. Brown was more effective as the Bradshaw replacement. Then Brown goes and looks like the greatest RB ever vs Car the next week. Vs the Eagles Wilson was still dropping passes. I know it drives you guys crazy, but it's true. I like Wilson as a prospect. I think there is a chance he reaches an elite status in the NFL. Right now the hype is not warrented. He was awful as a rookie, outside of 1-3 runs in blowouts that skews his ypc to an "elite" status on a small sample size. Andre Brown was better then him. That's not hard to say.

Whatever you do ... Do Not! I repeat Do Not!!! Look at these links. I will only make it hurt that much more.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uviR8HjLDxk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1bO123KOEM

If just spent time to say what happened in a actual game I watch. why would I go watch a highlight clip after that? That's the problem, you're watching highlights.

Because the highlights happened ... in actual games.

Look ... I told you not to look and you did anyway and now you're all upset.

Ok, to be fair ... here are Andre Browns rookie highlights

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7haJGfH384

 

[ShaHBucks]

Half of this thread is about a rookie getting bench ONE GAME for fumbling early. I don't understand this at all. If you watch the Tampa game(Wk 2) he was still being utilized EARLY in the game. The 1st possession Wilson lines up in a empty backfield and drops a easy pass for crying out loud. The second possesion he get 2 carries for 5 yards. Andre Brown was the primary back on the first TD drive that went close to 80 yards. "Don't quote me on this," but he ran for at least half of those 80 yards. Wilson's first two games he had 5 carries for 10 yards and two drops! That's why Wilson was benched! It had little to do with just ONE fumble. Brown was more effective as the Bradshaw replacement. Then Brown goes and looks like the greatest RB ever vs Car the next week. Vs the Eagles Wilson was still dropping passes. I know it drives you guys crazy, but it's true. I like Wilson as a prospect. I think there is a chance he reaches an elite status in the NFL. Right now the hype is not warrented. He was awful as a rookie, outside of 1-3 runs in blowouts that skews his ypc to an "elite" status on a small sample size. Andre Brown was better then him. That's not hard to say.

Whatever you do ... Do Not! I repeat Do Not!!! Look at these links. I will only make it hurt that much more.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uviR8HjLDxkhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1bO123KOEM

If just spent time to say what happened in a actual game I watch. why would I go watch a highlight clip after that? That's the problem, you're watching highlights.

Because the highlights happened ... in actual games.Look ... I told you not to look and you did anyway and now you're all upset.

Ok, to be fair ... here are Andre Browns rookie highlights

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7haJGfH384

I don't watch highlights. I didn't click on either, but thanks.

 

[Abraham]

Any new info on whether he will still return some kicks?

 

[bakes]

Wow Wilson owners really get their panties in a bunch if you question their high opinion of him. Sure he's more talented than Brown and should be the main guy in the backfield. But Brown is there and was solid last year. He's definitely a concern, even if a slight one, for someone who appears will be drafted by the end of round 2 in most leagues. I don't think Wilson "detractors" are saying he sucks it's just they are questioning his high ranking some of you have on him.

My issue is Brown supporters trying to say Brown is going to do an even 50/50 split and that is why you push WIlson down so much. I don't see it like that given A) They let Bradshaw walk B) Brown's injury history as I pointed out last season where he only had 3 games of more then 10 carries and had to leave 3 games last season do to injury.

I think if you view Wilson as an RB2 (with RB1 upside in Dynasty) you are safe. Seeing him less then that, you must have more faith in Brown staying healthy for a full 16 games then I do.

Wilson will get 70% of touches for the NYG RB's on condition he shows good ball security and better pass protection. The signs are there for that.

As a lifelong Giants fan I'm pretty much on board with this. I can see occasions where, on passing downs, they will bring in Brown purely for pass protection. Oddly, I think Wilson's productivity may have a lot less to do with Brown and a lot more to do with how well and when Rhino comes back from his injury; having a solid lead fullback will help Wilson immeasureably.

 

[Leonidas]

Bottom line there were trust issues, whether it was ball security, pass protection, maturity issues, whatever, that clearly impacted his playing time and I'll be watching/reading closely to see if gaining more trust or not and those issues are in the past. If it's luke warm I likely won't have him on my team and I'll let someone else take the risk but if he seems to gained trust and the evidence backs it up he may.

And what could the Giants do to show some trust in the player you feel they had trust issues with? Maybe entrust the running game to this guy plus a guy who was on like 4 teams in 3 years because of injuries and in an limited role last... wait for it... wait for it... year got injured?

hear that he's made improvements through glowing reports from coaches/beat writers/teammates...see/hear he's getting a bigger role in terms of touches in TC...that he's working more on 3rd downs and pass protection situations...if he fumbles in preseason and Coughlin downplays it and throws him right back out there.

Now don't go all crazy on me but sometimes situations like this remind me of J. Norwood from years back. There was thread after thread (I was involved in some of them) talking about his talent and how he was going to get a bigger role and was going to take over despite the anecdotal evidence that his role was what it was. I'm not saying that Wilson = Norwood but I've learned from situations like that to be more cautious when thinking gaudy ypc and game breaking speed = future stud starter. When the coach pumps the breaks on a player, I tend to do the same. Sometimes these guys have warts that the team is aware of that we don't see as fans so while I have my opinions on players I like to listen closely to what is being said from all angles and that they are actually DOING it and it's not just Ryan Matthews lip service.

If the team was putting the brakes on and knew about warts he had, I'm willing to bet they would have addressed that in the off-season. Instead they seem to have done the opposite.

 

[netnalp]

Bottom line there were trust issues, whether it was ball security, pass protection, maturity issues, whatever, that clearly impacted his playing time and I'll be watching/reading closely to see if gaining more trust or not and those issues are in the past. If it's luke warm I likely won't have him on my team and I'll let someone else take the risk but if he seems to gained trust and the evidence backs it up he may.

And what could the Giants do to show some trust in the player you feel they had trust issues with? Maybe entrust the running game to this guy plus a guy who was on like 4 teams in 3 years because of injuries and in an limited role last... wait for it... wait for it... year got injured?

hear that he's made improvements through glowing reports from coaches/beat writers/teammates...see/hear he's getting a bigger role in terms of touches in TC...that he's working more on 3rd downs and pass protection situations...if he fumbles in preseason and Coughlin downplays it and throws him right back out there.

Now don't go all crazy on me but sometimes situations like this remind me of J. Norwood from years back. There was thread after thread (I was involved in some of them) talking about his talent and how he was going to get a bigger role and was going to take over despite the anecdotal evidence that his role was what it was. I'm not saying that Wilson = Norwood but I've learned from situations like that to be more cautious when thinking gaudy ypc and game breaking speed = future stud starter. When the coach pumps the breaks on a player, I tend to do the same. Sometimes these guys have warts that the team is aware of that we don't see as fans so while I have my opinions on players I like to listen closely to what is being said from all angles and that they are actually DOING it and it's not just Ryan Matthews lip service.

If the team was putting the brakes on and knew about warts he had, I'm willing to bet they would have addressed that in the off-season. Instead they seem to have done the opposite.

I agree. The moves made at the RB position by the Giants indicate that they are "all in" on Wilson. Typical move by Reese, acquire talent in the draft that will play heavily into the teams plans the following season.

 

[DropKick]

I don't have a horse in this race, don't care who's the starter (though I'll be watching) but one thing I've learned with these situations over the years is not to make up your mind and ignore the tea leaves and think you know better than the coach. I look at players and read as much as I can about them but the most important thing is what the coach says and does. Often times the beat writers are a good source as well...not always, not every situation but it's a puzzle that you have to put together from the various clues you get....some will have more weight/merit than others and through experience/luck/skill you can get the correct read on the situation.

My take on this particular situation is that Wilson is more talented and he'll be given the opportunity (old man Coughlin has said as much). I think it will start as a time sharing situation but the important thing that I'll bet watching and listening for is for confirmed improvement of the things that held him back last year like ball security and pass protection. In these situations I tend to go for the Wilson type if it looks like he may have a chance to emerge or I'll avoid the situation entirely. Drafting the Lendale White (1B part of the backfield) doesn't have the upside but has downside risk of being completely useless.

Again, I must ask, how did he have ball security issues last year with 1 lost fumble in 71 carries?

it's not what I think...it's fact....

NY Giants coach Tom Coughlin benches David Wilson after first-half fumble against Cowboys Rookie and 2012 first-rounder gets message to hold on to the ball after fumble against Cowboys stalls Big Blue momentum Comments (3) By Ebenezer Samuel AND Ralph Vacchiano / NEW YORK DAILY NEWS Thursday, September 6, 2012, 10:18 PM

David Wilson knows to hold onto the ball after being benched for fumbling on second pro carry.

In the moments after Giants rookie running back David Wilson fumbled on Wednesday night, the NBC cameras showed a close-up of his face and a possible tear under his left eye. There was no doubt, as Tom Coughlin said, that Wilson was very upset.

But was he crying after he was yanked from the game?

No, I wasn't crying, Wilson said Thursday. I was definitely upset. But, I think it would have been a lot worse if I was smiling or feeling good about it.

He definitely wasnt feeling good after he fumbled on his second NFL carry, ruining a Giants drive on which, Coughlin said, some decent things were happening. That wasnt the reason the Giants lost their opener to the Cowboys, 24-17, but it did take away some of their momentum.

PHOTOS: GIANTS MISS CHANCES, LOSE OPENER TO BOYS

On the sidelines he was very upset about what happened, Coughlin said. I did give him credit for that. He was deeply, deeply sorry about what happened. Unfortunately it happened.

Coughlin admitted Thursday that the fumble was the reason Wilson was benched. Were playing the opening game of the year, Coughlin said. Its a divisional game. We had just driven the ball. Were going to be a bit reluctant. This is not preseason. This is serious business now.

Wilson seemed to understand all that, and said, I dont think they totally gave up on me. They wanted to show me how important it was to hold onto the ball.

That message was received, even if it didnt actually bring Wilson to tears.

Im passionate about the game and I know (fumbling) is something I have been working on and not wanting to do, he said. And for it to happen on my second carry in the opening game, I was highly disappointed.

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/giants/benching-n-o-crying-shame-giants-david-wilson-article-1.1153792#ixzz2a56I9fKc

Everyone knows that story from beginning to end, but again, 1 fumble in 71 carries doesn't constitute a fumbling problem.

it is when it's a big part of why a talented player totals 17 total carries over the first 10 weeks. I wouldn't have thought it was a big deal but Coughlin clearly did. He sent the message loud and clear and it's undeniable. It doesn't matter what you think or I think, all that matters is what Coughlin thinks. Whether you call it a fumbling issue, a trust issue, whatever, there was an issue there that largely derailed his season otherwise he would've gotten the ball more.

You're assuming he was benched those ten weeks because of that one fumble. It's been brought up already that, while it led to his benching in week one, it did not play nearly a role for most of the rest of the year. It was his pass protection (very common for rookies).

If fumbling was the issue for his lack of carries through ten weeks, why did Coughlin have him returning kicks? You think he's putting a guy with "ball security issues" on kick returns? Do you realize how silly that is?

Exactly...

 

[Pipes]

Wow Wilson owners really get their panties in a bunch if you question their high opinion of him. Sure he's more talented than Brown and should be the main guy in the backfield. But Brown is there and was solid last year. He's definitely a concern, even if a slight one, for someone who appears will be drafted by the end of round 2 in most leagues. I don't think Wilson "detractors" are saying he sucks it's just they are questioning his high ranking some of you have on him.

My issue is Brown supporters trying to say Brown is going to do an even 50/50 split and that is why you push WIlson down so much. I don't see it like that given A) They let Bradshaw walk B) Brown's injury history as I pointed out last season where he only had 3 games of more then 10 carries and had to leave 3 games last season do to injury. I think if you view Wilson as an RB2 (with RB1 upside in Dynasty) you are safe. Seeing him less then that, you must have more faith in Brown staying healthy for a full 16 games then I do.

Wilson will get 70% of touches for the NYG RB's on condition he shows good ball security and better pass protection. The signs are there for that.

I agree with this. Wilson certainly has #1 potential and I'd be thrilled to have his as my number 2 but there are still some questions. PPR I wouldn't worry but in TD heavy leagues there is a lot of risk with Brown potentially handling the goaline duties.

 

[netnalp]

Wow Wilson owners really get their panties in a bunch if you question their high opinion of him. Sure he's more talented than Brown and should be the main guy in the backfield. But Brown is there and was solid last year. He's definitely a concern, even if a slight one, for someone who appears will be drafted by the end of round 2 in most leagues. I don't think Wilson "detractors" are saying he sucks it's just they are questioning his high ranking some of you have on him.

My issue is Brown supporters trying to say Brown is going to do an even 50/50 split and that is why you push WIlson down so much. I don't see it like that given A) They let Bradshaw walk B) Brown's injury history as I pointed out last season where he only had 3 games of more then 10 carries and had to leave 3 games last season do to injury. I think if you view Wilson as an RB2 (with RB1 upside in Dynasty) you are safe. Seeing him less then that, you must have more faith in Brown staying healthy for a full 16 games then I do.

Wilson will get 70% of touches for the NYG RB's on condition he shows good ball security and better pass protection. The signs are there for that.

I agree with this. Wilson certainly has #1 potential and I'd be thrilled to have his as my number 2 but there are still some questions. PPR I wouldn't worry but in TD heavy leagues there is a lot of risk with Brown potentially handling the goaline duties.

I agree with it too. Brown will vulture some TDs but I'm not convinced he'll be a lock to get all the short yardage. But Brown is the better reciever, so he might get more 3rd down catches than Wilson. But I think the threat Wilson presents will make defenses play more honest and they can't play pass first with him in there.

Pass protection is important but I think people are making it a bigger issue than it is. The team knows the pass protection at the RB won't be as good as with Bradshaw so they'll make adjustments for it. Also Eli's ability at getting rid of the ball is a major reason for the low sack numbers, he helps his blockers immensely.

 

[Biabreakable]

I just want to point out that it is a rare occurrence for any RB to get 70% of the rushing attempts. Much less one on a team that has always employed some form of RBBC. Expecting that from a RB who has never had more than 70 some carries in a season thus far in his career seems overly optimistic.

 

[jacobo_moses]

I just want to point out that it is a rare occurrence for any RB to get 70% of the rushing attempts. Much less one on a team that has always employed some form of RBBC. Expecting that from a RB who has never had more than 70 some carries in a season thus far in his career seems overly optimistic.

I would also like to point out that the Giants have never had as dynamic an RB as Wilson too. Tiki Barber even said that. So I wouldnt rule it out either.

 

[monk]

Half of this thread is about a rookie getting bench ONE GAME for fumbling early. I don't understand this at all. If you watch the Tampa game(Wk 2) he was still being utilized EARLY in the game. The 1st possession Wilson lines up in a empty backfield and drops a easy pass for crying out loud. The second possesion he get 2 carries for 5 yards. Andre Brown was the primary back on the first TD drive that went close to 80 yards. "Don't quote me on this," but he ran for at least half of those 80 yards. Wilson's first two games he had 5 carries for 10 yards and two drops! That's why Wilson was benched! It had little to do with just ONE fumble. Brown was more effective as the Bradshaw replacement. Then Brown goes and looks like the greatest RB ever vs Car the next week. Vs the Eagles Wilson was still dropping passes. I know it drives you guys crazy, but it's true. I like Wilson as a prospect. I think there is a chance he reaches an elite status in the NFL. Right now the hype is not warrented. He was awful as a rookie, outside of 1-3 runs in blowouts that skews his ypc to an "elite" status on a small sample size. Andre Brown was better then him. That's not hard to say.

Whatever you do ... Do Not! I repeat Do Not!!! Look at these links. I will only make it hurt that much more.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uviR8HjLDxkhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1bO123KOEM

If just spent time to say what happened in a actual game I watch. why would I go watch a highlight clip after that? That's the problem, you're watching highlights.

Because the highlights happened ... in actual games.Look ... I told you not to look and you did anyway and now you're all upset.

Ok, to be fair ... here are Andre Browns rookie highlights

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7haJGfH384

I don't watch highlights. I didn't click on either, but thanks.

But than how did you know they were highlights? I think you're a liar and I think you are very upset after watching those "highlights"