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DET and those who love ripping on Millen - enlighten us (1 Viewer)

Well?

  • C Johnson

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  • Russell

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  • Quinn

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  • Thomas

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  • Adams

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  • Peterson

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  • Trade down a little, still getting best of the above (explain who you think it should be)

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  • Trade down more, hopefully getting more in the way of picks (explain who/what you think they then sh

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  • Other (explain)

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  • Total voters
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BigRed

BigRed

Footballguy
Pardon any duplications but you can't search on "DET" and didn't see a head count on this and curious (OK bored):

Since there are so many who love to rip on Millen (and/or whoever's pulling his strings, I've heard that not all the "bad" picks were really his, but couldn't say for sure) and apparently know way more than he does, how about enlightending us NOW - ie not in hindsight - about what he should do. For ex I have already heard some ESPN/etc sports "experts" say despite their past selections that they should seriously consider nabbing Calvin J, but I'm sure everyone will have a field day w/it if they do. Just wondering. In the same light it'd also be nice to know how you voted....ie before the draft.

IMO there is no "it should absolutely be this guy" way head-and-shoulders above all other possible picks. Personally I've leaned to Thomas but have to wonder about QB or even yes Johnson. I do not believe any D player is good enough to merit the pick (assuming of course they pick at 1.02).

Probably a trade down is best, but that's a lot easier said than done, esp since teams ask ridiculous compensation for it.

 
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Trading down to #4 from Tampa seems very logical, and they could grab a QB in round 2 (or maybe round 3) if they feel compelled to draft a qb for the future.

 
If the Raiders take Russell, I would kidnap CJ and hold him for ransom. If I don’t get the deal I want, I would just keep him.

If the Raiders take CJ, I would take Thomas unless I was absolutely positive a team would trade up for one of the QBs

 
They should just take Thomas at where they are. Now, could they trade down and get more for where they are? Possibly. But, if they are trading down, it is going to be becuase they want to get Thomas later, so it is going to be difficult to capitalize. Say they trade down beyond #4, and someone other than Tampa trades up to #2 to get CJ. Who does Tampa take? What if they trade Thomas? Thomas is who Detroit needs, IMO, so they need to ensure they get him, and I'm not sure they can by trading down to far.

 
They could get a Joe Thomas or an Adrian Peterson at the 4-5 picks...opening the door for teams to trade up to win the CJ sweepstakes in the event Oakland goes QB.

 
I just don't know. There are strong indications that management will NOT draft a quarterback in the first round. And Detroit's focus on addressing defensive needs likely precludes them from taking Calvin Johnson or Joe Thomas at #2, although either could improve their chances of winning immediately. Taking into consideration the handful of offensive linemen with starting experience that Detroit has signed within the last few months, Joe Thomas wouldn't seem to me the best choice at that spot. But I can't see Detroit drafting Gaines Adams in that spot, either. How do you justify that massive a signing bonus for a player who could give Detroit a real shot in the arm in the pass rush department but may wind up a situational player in their defensive scheme? (Hard to know how management views Gaines Adams to this end; all I have to go by are scouting reports at sites like this one.)

As much as I like what I see in Patrick Willis as a draft prospect for Detroit, the consensus is accurate, I think; there probably isn't a defensive player whose talent merits top-5 consideration. Given the Cover 2 Marinelli is implementing and lack of depth at the position however, Gaines Adams would seem the closest thing. Again, though, I wouldn't think Lions management is in love with the idea of going offense in the first round. This is a real dilemma, especially since in my view teams probably aren't willing to offer as much in terms of trade value as analysts are speculating. The $$ alloted to those top 2 or 3 draft selections is unreal, and I think that ultimately Detroit will settle for much less trade value if it means they can focus on defense in the first round like they'd prefer but maybe not land as many high-round draft picks as compensation. That's just me.

 
I believe if it was not for the fact they have taken WR in the 1st round for the last.... what- 10 years now? :rant: ..... that they would take CJ.

But, I believe they feel they CAN NOT take a WR and will go with Thomas instead after looking for a trade down partner and failing to make a deal.

 
Chadstroma said:
I believe if it was not for the fact they have taken WR in the 1st round for the last.... what- 10 years now? ;) ..... that they would take CJ. But, I believe they feel they CAN NOT take a WR and will go with Thomas instead after looking for a trade down partner and failing to make a deal.
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Yeah, I would think they'd settle for less to trade down (for reasons I outlined in my earlier post) but if there's just not much of a deal on the table ... Joe Thomas really fits what Lions management is looking for in a person & competitor. Plus I really like the thought of he and Jeff Backus anchoring Detroit's O-line for years to come. I'd be fine with that but as a Lions fan, I sure would like things to get turned around on defense!
 
Donnybrook said:
If the Raiders take Russell, I would kidnap CJ and hold him for ransom. If I don’t get the deal I want, I would just keep him. If the Raiders take CJ, I would take Thomas unless I was absolutely positive a team would trade up for one of the QBs
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Hadn't considered this idea. Draft Calvin Johnson irregardless; if you find a trade partner, great ... if not, you just "settled for" the best wide receiver prospect in years. Also echoed in Jason Babler's recent mock draft, I really think this could work for Detroit - perhaps would yield more favorable trade parameters.
 
I think you will see Detroit trade down and take Gaines Adams. If they stay at the #2 pick, I think they will take Thomas but with the Denver trade I don't see Thomas as a need pick. They do have a need for someone like Adams.

I would prefer to see them trade down a couple times and gather more than a couple picks. They could still end up with a Leon Hall or LaRon Landry, both of whom would help their defense. But with them letting James Hall go indicates to me that Adams will be their selection.

 
Voted trade down a little.

Russell would be nice, if OAK passes on him. So would Johnson, but I think we can all agree that WR is certainly towards the bottom of the list as far as areas they need to address. I think they can just as easily get who they want at picks 4-6, so why not trade the pick. I'd love either Thomas or Adams at that spot. We need a QB for the future, that's a given. But there are a handful of guys available later on day 1 that they can target at QB. Stanton and Edwards are both quality QBs, who could sit one year behind Kitna and have a legit chance to earn the job next year. No reason to grab a QB at #2 overall IMO.

 
I just wanted to comment that I don;t have to think I am a better GM than Millen to know he does a crappy job. I don't get paid way too much money to do what he does. The fact that several random posters MAY actually be better at his job than he is speaks volumes.

 
Trade down more, hopefully getting more in the way of picks: My Vote

They need help in a lot of places. The more picks they have the better chances they have of get quality players.

 
I voted trade down for more picks.The only problem is that I don't think there is a team that has 2-3 1st round picks this year in the top 15.if stuck at #2,I'd go with Thomas.The money free agent OL are getting is almost more than you would pay the #2 pick.He would also help their 30th ranked run game,which should improve the time of possesion and help keep the defense off the field.If the Raiders dont take JR i'd grab him and keep him on the bench for a year.

 
If the rumored offer is true the Lions outta jump all over what the Broncs are putting up...

...

Broncos Want Calvin Johnson

23rd April, 2007 - 1:54 pm

Denver Post

...the Broncos offered picks in the first, second and third rounds, plus their first-round pick in 2008, for the Lions' No. 2 selection, a trade contingent on the Oakland Raiders not taking Johnson with their No. 1 choice.

...

from this thread:

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...howtopic=314900

 
heidbrink said:
If the rumored offer is true the Lions outta jump all over what the Broncs are putting up...

...

Broncos Want Calvin Johnson

23rd April, 2007 - 1:54 pm

Denver Post

...the Broncos offered picks in the first, second and third rounds, plus their first-round pick in 2008, for the Lions' No. 2 selection, a trade contingent on the Oakland Raiders not taking Johnson with their No. 1 choice.

...

from this thread:

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...howtopic=314900
Click to expand...
:goodposting:
 
Chadstroma said:
I believe if it was not for the fact they have taken WR in the 1st round for the last.... what- 10 years now? :rolleyes: ..... that they would take CJ. But, I believe they feel they CAN NOT take a WR and will go with Thomas instead after looking for a trade down partner and failing to make a deal.
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I agree with your sentiment but this is how I look at it.... If Millen was fired and I was made GM of the team, what move would I make that would make my team better?The answer in my mind is Calvin Johnson. You draft him and have 2 options:1) Keep him and have one of the top WR tandems in the league in Roy Williams and Calvin Johnson (Of course this is given that Johnson is as good as adverstised) for the next few years2) Trade him and move down. No one in the draft has more value than CJ. Once teams know that they COULD get him, they will be willing to make offers.Now any player can be a bust (or not fully live up to expectations) and the Lions have been burned in the past few years with WRs but I just don't think they can pass Johnson up.He is the best player and represents the best value as both a player and a trading piece. It's a win/win in my opinion. The Lions front office needs to forget the past and do what will make their team the most competitive. I'm sure we can find examples of consecutive 1st rd picks who "busted". These just both happen to be WRs.
 
If the Raiders take CJ, then I think the Lions draft Peterson. If the Raiders take Russell, then I think the Lions will be able to trade down. I don't see a scenario where CJ is a Lion or where the Lions draft a defensive player or QB at #2.

Joe Thomas seems to be the consensus pick but this guy is a year removed from major ACL surgery and is a solid but not spectacular talent. Do the Lions really need another Jeff Backus at #2.

 
TwinTurbo said:
If the Raiders take CJ, then I think the Lions draft Peterson. If the Raiders take Russell, then I think the Lions will be able to trade down. I don't see a scenario where CJ is a Lion or where the Lions draft a defensive player or QB at #2.Joe Thomas seems to be the consensus pick but this guy is a year removed from major ACL surgery and is a solid but not spectacular talent. Do the Lions really need another Jeff Backus at #2.
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What this guy said. I still think the Lions draft CJ with an attempt to trade down after they have him or, if he is not available, Peterson.
 
The Lions were ranked #4 in the NFL in passing last season. Their defense was ranked #28 last year. Since then the defense has lost a starting CB ( Bly ) and DE ( Hall ).

The Lions dont have a MLB on the roster, they also need a pass rushing DE, and could use a CB.

TRADE DOWN to get more picks and then focus on DEFENSE.. guys like LB Patric Willis, DE Jamaal Anderson and Gaines Adams, even a DB like LaRon Landry etc.

 
Trade down to #4(Tampa)get a second and third round pick from them and then try to convince AZ to trade up a spot so they can get J Thomas and get another third rounder from them. You've dropped 3 spots and gained an extra second rounder(giving you 2 total there)and two extra third rounders(giving you 3 there). Take Adams at #4 overall......Griffin,Durant in round #2.......Stanton,Edwards or Beck(one of these 3 QBs will fall to the third)Beekman,Marten,Ramirez(whichever of these OL are there)and possibly a B Patrick,Jacoby Jones,P Williams(a splurge WR or TE with the last 3rd rounder).

 
They should have gone after Schaub and gotten him. He would have been a perfect fit for Detroit. Oh well, just another doh for the Lions.

 
I think they should trade down slightly, such as to TB's #4 slot. However, from what I heard it's no secret they want Adams, so TB may drive a hard bargain. If CJ is there and TB won't give up much because they think DET will pass and CJ could fall to them, I think DET should call their bluff and take him, ala SD with Eli Manning. Of course CJ hasn't given any childish ultimatums like Eli did, so worst comes to worst and DET keeps the best player in the draft. At that point they can probably work out a deal with a team that really wants CJ, though, and get a good deal for him. However, can you imagine CJ in a Martz offense? :wipesawaydrool:

If OAK takes CJ, then I think DET should select Russell. They need a QB for the future and if OAK does take CJ, it probably means they worked out a deal for McCown, so DET could have an opening for a QB anyway. Russell has huge upside and under Martz’ tutelage can achieve that upside. If they prefer to take a QB in the 2nd round, such as Edwards or Stanton, Thomas is a good selection or they can use Russell as the trade bait and move down. CLE would probably be willing to move up 1 spot to get Russell, in which case DET gets Thomas anyway. Either way, they should be in the driver’s seat in this draft, so hopefully they play their cards right.

 
Only 3 positions ever matter, and in this order...

1) Good OL - Makes the entire team look better. Better pass protection = QB look better = WRs looking better; more holes for the run = better running game = easier to select effective plays = more points and mor time off the board = better defense

2) Good DL - Dictates what the offense can run = limiting their playbook = getting off the field quick = more chances for the offense

3) Great QB - Now if there is a great QB out there that can overcome obstacles posed by not having a complete team, that person is special (ie Montana, Elway, Marino, McNabb). That person doesn't seem to exist in this draft, but you never know. Brady is really the only recent example of someone that was completely overlooked IMO. Warner in STL and guys like him that many will state are really more a product of the coaching and the talent around them (OL, Faulk, Holt, Bruce, etc)

Players not on this list = WR, RB, TE, CBs, S, LBs. They have to be beyond special to warrant a top 10 pick.

He should draft Joe Thomas if he can't find any trades. If he trades down, DE and DT seems to be fairly stacked in this draft.

 
I'd trade down to Tampa Bay for a 2nd rounder, really hyping it up that Atlanta wants that No.2 spot to take Johnson.

If that happened, and you assume that Oakland went Russel and Tampa went Johnson.

Cleveland would/could go Quinn.

If I were the Lions I'd then take Joe Thomas.

If there was no trade, I'd still take Thomas. So, I really like trying to get the additional draft pick. If Tampa doesn't bite, then I'd trade the pick away to Atlanta for their first round and as many 2nd and 3rd rounders as I could squeeze out of them.

 
The Lions need so much help I voted for trade way down and add as many picks as possible.

If that Denver deal is legit (or there is another similar deal available) they should go for it.

If they stay at #2 they should select Joe Thomas.

 
More than a few non-commital replies here, like "they should take one of these guys" or "trade down" but not saying who they should target etc. Most of those are probably the ones who a year or 2 from now will go "I can't believe he did that in the 07 draft" - IF it doesn't work out :X Surprised how many are saying they should take CJ. I can imagine all the ripping Millen will get if he does that.

brednbuddah said:
you always go with the best available player. always.
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No, not always. Failing to consider team need is stoopit.eg let's say somehow Quinn plummeted to 32. Should the Colts take him?
 
BigRed said:
Surprised how many are saying they should take CJ. I can imagine all the ripping Millen will get if he does that.
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I think less people will rip him than you think. Especially among the sports writers community. Most agree that he's a rare talent, and #### what they've done in the past. Now, the fans.....different story completely. :confused: You know, I crack up when I think about it. Only Millen could get blasted so much for picking undoubtably the best damn player in the draft.
 
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RussMan said:
The Lions were ranked #4 in the NFL in passing last season. Their defense was ranked #28 last year. Since then the defense has lost a starting CB ( Bly ) and DE ( Hall ).

The Lions dont have a MLB on the roster, they also need a pass rushing DE, and could use a CB.

TRADE DOWN to get more picks and then focus on DEFENSE.. guys like LB Patric Willis, DE Jamaal Anderson and Gaines Adams, even a DB like LaRon Landry etc.
Click to expand...
Could use a CB is an understatement. The best CB on the roster right now is Fernando Bryant who has been embarassingly bad. They need at least one, if not two, in the high rounds.
 
The Lions have been all about offense in the offseason, leaving several gaping holes on defense.

I don't necessarily think their FA moves have been bad in and of themselves. And I don't think drafting an offensive player at No. 2 would be bad in and of itself.

But if the Lions don't come out of this draft with 2-3 impact players on defense, they will have the worst defense in the NFL by far. They can forget about improving on 3-13 in that case. And to me, that would make the whole offseason a failure.

 
brednbuddah said:
you always go with the best available player. always.
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Not when you have as many needs as they have. The Bears can employ this strategy.
Spartans Rule said:
The Lions have been all about offense in the offseason, leaving several gaping holes on defense.I don't necessarily think their FA moves have been bad in and of themselves. And I don't think drafting an offensive player at No. 2 would be bad in and of itself.But if the Lions don't come out of this draft with 2-3 impact players on defense, they will have the worst defense in the NFL by far. They can forget about improving on 3-13 in that case. And to me, that would make the whole offseason a failure.
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I say the Lions (not a fan) really need Quinn - a legimate playmaker. Problem is they have major holes at OL, DB, and DL also. Lions must get 2 impact defensive playmakers along with a stud qb.
 
I'm amazed that Quinn gets 12 votes, but Russell only one.

I'm far from amazed that a number of posts were so non-committal (eg "they should draft, uh, one of these guys" or "trade down" and not say to where or who to target). :lmao:

 
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