benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
This could effect the top half of the draft.
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
Does Joe Haden drop? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter benson_will_lead_the_way
- Start date
very little, maybe to 15-25 instead of 7-15, still the best cover corner in the draft. Doesnt look like a 4.57 CB on film. He trains with his dad mostly, so maybe he didn't get to learn some of the tricks to cut tenths off his time with a quick start, 40 time is all about the start. Id elated if he fell to the Steelers at 18 on this 40 time negative buzz.
werdnoynek
Footballguy
benson_leading_the_way_to_the_40 > everything thread. 
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospec...ngs/TSX/2010_CB
4.42 on NFLDraftScout.com
as much as i hate how the 40 is over-analyzed, he probably will drop because of it. i think i read people projecting him as a 4.3ish speedster.
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospec...ngs/TSX/2010_CB
4.42 on NFLDraftScout.com
as much as i hate how the 40 is over-analyzed, he probably will drop because of it. i think i read people projecting him as a 4.3ish speedster.
Last edited by a moderator:
treat88
Footballguy
Outside of Berry, that would be the best possible scenario.
JetMaxx
Footballguy
Drop him to the Eagles at 24.
massraider
Footballguy
If he improves his technique at his pro day, all will be forgotten.
5-ish Finkle
Footballguy
Absolutely this.I hope every team in the NFL with a pick prior to Pittsburgh's downgrades him based on his 40 after watching his game film. I HATE the Gators, but Haden's the real deal. A bad 40 in Indy doesn't change that.
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
I don't think the 40 means everything. But Joe Haden is the #1 CB in this draft and the drop off is significant. However, he has been talked about as high as #6 to the Seahawks(I took him there for them in the Mock Draft by FBG's). But I believe he will now go in the teens as Bloom stated.This will in turn change the draft slightly. He will still be the #1 CB IMO.benson_leading_the_way_to_the_40 > everything thread.
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospec...ngs/TSX/2010_CB
4.42 on NFLDraftScout.com
as much as i hate how the 40 is over-analyzed, he probably will drop because of it. i think i read people projecting him as a 4.3ish speedster.
Last edited by a moderator:
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
For all of you that go by game film....to play Devil's advocate....how do you feel about Dwyer now then?
Wadsworth
Footballguy
This is the key part, Haden is faster than that. For his sake I hope he gives dad a break and works with the professionals before his Pro Day.
werdnoynek
Footballguy
just an FYI, 40_will_lead_the_way, dwyer had a 4.48 40 according to nfldraftscout. how do you feel about him now? he's on par with your boy matthews. does that bump him up? 
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospec...ngs/TSX/2010_RB
he did have a not so stellar combine, but i still think he's a top 4 rb.
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospec...ngs/TSX/2010_RB
he did have a not so stellar combine, but i still think he's a top 4 rb.
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
This is exciting, to challenge me in every thread. But I saw Dwyer's film and I know he had slow feet, poor agility. He reaffirmed that at the combine. So whatever 40 time from a website(not on TV that we all could see) is a funny ploy to somehow vindicate his current bad reputation.just an FYI, 40_will_lead_the_way, dwyer had a 4.48 40 according to nfldraftscout. how do you feel about him now? he's on par with your boy matthews. does that bump him up?
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospec...ngs/TSX/2010_RB
he did have a not so stellar combine, but i still think he's a top 4 rb.
werdnoynek
Footballguy
benson,
the only thing i'm disputing is your infatuation with 40 times. are you sitting in front of the TV with a stopwatch? my providing that link is just showing how useless the times are. every site on the internet who is taking their own 40 times are going to be different. they're going off how fast some guy can press the start button on the stop watch. we're talking 10ths of a second here.
i dont doubt your judge of talent. you're the first person to start hyping mathews who i'm beginning to see you were completely correct about. i just think you're putting too much value in 40 times and not enough value in how people look on tape. i've said you may be right about dwyer, but i don't think his poor combine hurt him all that much because of what i've seen on tape. what i've seen and what you've seen seems to be completely different, but its all in the eyes of the beholder.
the only thing i'm disputing is your infatuation with 40 times. are you sitting in front of the TV with a stopwatch? my providing that link is just showing how useless the times are. every site on the internet who is taking their own 40 times are going to be different. they're going off how fast some guy can press the start button on the stop watch. we're talking 10ths of a second here.
i dont doubt your judge of talent. you're the first person to start hyping mathews who i'm beginning to see you were completely correct about. i just think you're putting too much value in 40 times and not enough value in how people look on tape. i've said you may be right about dwyer, but i don't think his poor combine hurt him all that much because of what i've seen on tape. what i've seen and what you've seen seems to be completely different, but its all in the eyes of the beholder.
Last edited by a moderator:
PlasmaDogPlasma
Footballguy
What's the point of linking the DraftScout times? Those aren't recorded times, they are projections from before the combine. They have Demaryius Thomas for 4.59 as well as times for other prospects that didn't run.
werdnoynek
Footballguy
the people who didn't run have a red cross next to their name showing they didnt and were injured/unable. regardless, every site / scout at the combine will have a different time. in case you missed it -http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...howtopic=523112
in my prior post i stated the purpose was to show how useless the "official" times really are.
Last edited by a moderator:
loved him before, love him now, just needs to get in and stay in shape.
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
My problem is he weighed in much less than his playing weight and seemed out of shape. One would think he would've had better numbers with less weight.The only thing I could think of that would account for a weight loss and poor resulting numbers would be either sickness or extreme diet.
5-ish Finkle
Footballguy
Now, how often are they doing that from a 3 point stance?
coolnerd
Footballguy
As I remember, late in the regular season/early off-season Haden was in that former area you mention 15-25 with no other sure thing CB for the 1st round. As the off-season has went along, he has kept creeping up the charts largely because he is the top rated CB. I think this is a case where the grade that the scouting community had on Haden mid first is being confirmed versus some new information coming out on the guy.
coolnerd
Footballguy
I probably have my sense of timeing off, but I know he went from the best of a class without another elite prospect to a no way in hell out of the top 10 player from the starter of the season to now. Not really invested enough to go find lists from earlier to prove one way or the other.SSOG said:
Casting Couch
Footballguy
answer = Kyle WilsonBy popular demand, here is the recipe to the Pumpkin White Chocolate Muffins that was posted on the nail care tips Instagram earlier this week! These delicious treats are perfect for fall, and a great way to satisfy that sweet tooth all the way through the holidays!
Essie usually retails for $8, which is pretty pricey for a drugstore nail polish. However, stores do put essie nail polish reviews on sale every once and awhile, which can make it a little cheaper.
Essie usually retails for $8, which is pretty pricey for a drugstore nail polish. However, stores do put essie nail polish reviews on sale every once and awhile, which can make it a little cheaper.
Last edited by a moderator:
Jason Wood
Zoo York
I believe it was Daniel Jeremiah on Twitter (if not, pardon me b/c I follow a lot of NFL Tweeters) who said that it's very rare for an elite CB to not possess both speed and size, and that the exceptions generally lean more toward size than speed. I'm not disparaging Haden, by all accounts his play jumps out on film, I'm just noting that Jeremiah made that point.
Wadsworth
Footballguy
Haden needs to be faster than that to be a top 10 guy. But I think he is and will run better on his Pro Day and in team workouts. Having watched him play his whole career for the Gators I have a hard time believing he can't at least run a 4.45 40. But then again, having watched him play as well I would have sworn Peter Warrick was faster than he turned out.
treat88
Footballguy
Maybe.Throw Kareem Jackson in the mix as well.I still think teams will recognize that Haden's times were more about jacked up start technique rather than a lack of speed.I'd bet he's still the first CB taken.His Pro Day down there on Florida 38 yard track will ease some fears.answer = Kyle Wilson
benson_will_lead_the_way
Footballguy
I have talked to an NFL scout about this as well. And they don't draft CB's past the second round b/c they rarely become good NFL starters. That had to do with the athletic ability.Jason Wood said:
Yeah, I remember seeing some info on where starters were drafted on average, and it was really eye-opening how few starters at CB and LT actually came from outside the first 2-3 rounds.
RockHard
Footballguy
This may be blasphemous but I'm not surprised by Hayden's 40 time nor do I think he is as good as advertised. I think that a number of Gator defenders during the Charlie Strong era have been grossly overrated. Examples include: Jarvis Moss, Derrick Harvey, and Reggie Nelson. As a UF alumnus I remember watching Lito Sheppard while in school and he was a MUCH better player than Hayden, plus he returned punts. Yet, he never garnered the media acclaim that Hayden is receiving. Hayden is an aggressive corner who is a good run defender but has never had to consistently face good passing attacks in the SEC.
Flame away.
Flame away.
PlasmaDogPlasma
Footballguy
Minor detour for the thread, but I'm curious what you think of Janoris Jenkins and how he'll compare to Joe and/or Lito when his career is over.
