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Donald Brown RB Indianapolis Colts (1 Viewer)
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tim_whatley
Footballguy
Weren't the carries pretty close to even last night?
A 60/40 split is pretty even when the attempt numbers are 6 and 4.
A 60/40 split is pretty even when the attempt numbers are 6 and 4.
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socrates
Footballguy
It is difficult to draw any conclusions from last night's game. The Colts' offense had limited touches. I thought both backs looked good. Donald Brown ran with determination on his impressive TD run. Indy has two very talented backs. That is a problem I am sure they do not mind having, although it could lead to a great deal of frustration for many fantasy owners. These situations usually have a way of working themselves out, either by injury or by one back taking command. Stay tuned . . .
packersfan
Footballguy
The one conclusion that can certainly be drawn is that Brown is the RB the Colts want on the field in the fourth quarter. It's happened in both games so far and both games have been close. To me, that's very telling and it has significant implications because it stands to reason the Colts will be playing with the lead in quite a few games this season. If that happens and Brown is the RB on the field, he could get some nice fourth-quarter production.That said, Addai looked good last night. I thought he ran well and it's tough to argue with over 5 YPC. However, his mental mistakes the first two weeks (fumble in Week 1/missed block on a pass rush last night which resulted in a sack) appear to be costing him.
switz
Footballguy
Are you basing that on his sub 4.0 YPC for the season? His first three carries last night for 3.7 YPC?
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BuckeyeArt
Footballguy
Either that or Addai's 3.2 ypc for the season.
Chunky Soup
Footballguy
Can we please stop giving misleading stat lines? First, great sample size there -- three carries? Really? He did finish the night averaging 6.5 YPC and a TD, fwiw.And his competition for the 50/50 split? Addai (a veteran, mind you) is averaging a paltry 3.2 YPC.Honestly, please stop posting crap. Creates more work for us to look up what you're hiding. And you're deceiving those that don't do their own work.You were wrong on Chris Johnson, wrong on Addai, and potentially wrong on Brown. Stop digging the holes deeper. Please.
switz
Footballguy
Oh, so 4 carries is a better sample size, because the 4th carry was the ONLY good one of the night?
I didn't "hide" anything... you really need to get over me. Your little man crush is causing you to post embarrassing things about yourself. Really. You have no idea what you're talking about.I'd really prefer the OP answer my question. What about Brown makes him think he's now due for a 50-50 split? If you think 3 carries is a small sample, I'm pretty sure you'll agree 1 carry is even smaller of a sample.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
Cherry-picking out three carries from a game is the definition of stupid. You have to look at everything. Brown is averaging .7 more yards per carry than Addai, and with their limited catches, has been much better there, too (6-42 for Addai; 3-40 for Brown). I am sure both will see plenty of touches, but Brown is angling to get more, based on the way he has played. Addai simply hasn't lived up to expectations, otherwise the Colts never would have spent a first round pick on Brown. Note that I have neither RB on any of my teams, nor do I have an agenda based on projecting one or either of them to be however good, unlike some people.ditka...mike ditka
Footballguy
Frank Gore sucks too. He had 14 carries for 48 yds, a 3.4 YPC...why was everyone so excited about his performance last week?*note, I took out his 80yd and 79yd TD runs, but I'm not cherry picking, I always randomly select 1 or 2 carries a game and take them out when calculated YPC. It just so happened I randomly selected those two.Cherry-picking out three carries from a game is the definition of stupid. You have to look at everything. Brown is averaging .7 more yards per carry than Addai, and with their limited catches, has been much better there, too (6-42 for Addai; 3-40 for Brown). I am sure both will see plenty of touches, but Brown is angling to get more, based on the way he has played. Addai simply hasn't lived up to expectations, otherwise the Colts never would have spent a first round pick on Brown. Note that I have neither RB on any of my teams, nor do I have an agenda based on projecting one or either of them to be however good, unlike some people.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
gregjcross
Footballguy
Seriously guys, this is not what this board is about (I hope)Frank Gore sucks too. He had 14 carries for 48 yds, a 3.4 YPC...why was everyone so excited about his performance last week?*note, I took out his 80yd and 79yd TD runs, but I'm not cherry picking, I always randomly select 1 or 2 carries a game and take them out when calculated YPC. It just so happened I randomly selected those two.Can we please stop giving misleading stat lines? First, great sample size there -- three carries? Really? He did finish the night averaging 6.5 YPC and a TD, fwiw.And his competition for the 50/50 split? Addai (a veteran, mind you) is averaging a paltry 3.2 YPC.Honestly, please stop posting crap. Creates more work for us to look up what you're hiding. And you're deceiving those that don't do their own work.You were wrong on Chris Johnson, wrong on Addai, and potentially wrong on Brown. Stop digging the holes deeper. Please.
maxwelledison
Footballguy
You forgot to mention how wrong he was on DeAngelo. Classic thread buried somewhere here.
BuckeyeArt
Footballguy
You can't cherry pick which runs you are going to remove. You can only remove the 4th carry.For example, Steven Jackson was actually 16 for 46 yards, since we have to remove his 4th carry, which went for 58 yards.Frank Gore sucks too. He had 14 carries for 48 yds, a 3.4 YPC...why was everyone so excited about his performance last week?*note, I took out his 80yd and 79yd TD runs, but I'm not cherry picking, I always randomly select 1 or 2 carries a game and take them out when calculated YPC. It just so happened I randomly selected those two.Cherry-picking out three carries from a game is the definition of stupid. You have to look at everything. Brown is averaging .7 more yards per carry than Addai, and with their limited catches, has been much better there, too (6-42 for Addai; 3-40 for Brown). I am sure both will see plenty of touches, but Brown is angling to get more, based on the way he has played. Addai simply hasn't lived up to expectations, otherwise the Colts never would have spent a first round pick on Brown. Note that I have neither RB on any of my teams, nor do I have an agenda based on projecting one or either of them to be however good, unlike some people.
Hoss_Cartwright
Footballguy
OMG, my face just got red for you
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You guys can compare YPC between Addai and Brown all day. Last night Addai missed an assignment and Manning was clobbered by Porter for a sack. It was a straight line of sight sack and Manning could have potentially gotten really injured. A RB stays on the field not just because they can run. You gotta be a complete football player. Addai is a veteran and he should have picked up on that bliz. After that series he was on the sidelines rest of the game.
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whitem0nkey
Footballguy
Tanner9919
Footballguy
by the second half of the season I'd expect Brown to overtake Addai , something like 70%-30%
and by next season, Brown will be the #1 guy in Indy.
and by next season, Brown will be the #1 guy in Indy.
Bermuda_Chub
Footballguy
Addai is garbage. Always has been, always will be. He's been riding Manning's coattails for his entire career, and on virtually any other offense he'd be waiver wire fodder. Lest we forget, this is an offense that made Kenton Keith look like a stud. Bill Polian is too intelligent not to recognize what jumps out to the rest of the football-watching world like a zit on a callipygian behind: Addai is an also-ran, and Donald Brown is the new Edge.
Maroney=Sped
Footballguy
You know, if you take away switz from this message board it's averaging 5 good threads per day.Oh, so 4 carries is a better sample size, because the 4th carry was the ONLY good one of the night?
switz
Footballguy
You know, if you take away switz from this message board it's averaging 5 good threads per day.Oh, so 4 carries is a better sample size, because the 4th carry was the ONLY good one of the night?
Ah, switzstats. Kind of like Brady looking pretty lousy in that first game of 2008 and predicting the season would have been a poor one.
I think Brown looked much better on that td run than Addai did for the entire game. Though I don't think it will be 50/50 from here on out I do think it'll get there by season's end.
I think Brown looked much better on that td run than Addai did for the entire game. Though I don't think it will be 50/50 from here on out I do think it'll get there by season's end.
UnknownCoach
Footballguy
Yes its coming, in 2011 after you've given up on him and are saying he'll never be a starter. Like you are doing with Addai now.
Xue
Footballguy
Addai did not miss an assignment. I'd say that sack was as much Lilja's fault as it is Addai. If he had picked up Porter, the other defender would have gotten to Manning anyway. LG Ryan Lilja pulled to the right side to pick up Ayodele but overshot him and Addai went to help out instead of picking up Porter. He was in no man's land. Looking at the replay it seems both Addai and Lilja went for Porter first and then wasn't sure which one was going to pick up Ayodele, and they both eventually ended up going for Ayodele at the last second leaving Porter free.http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-videos/09000...2-vs-Colts-2009steelwind said:
gonzobill5
Footballguy
Anybody have data on which back is on the field under which circumstances?Tanner9919 said:
On important game winning drives, Donald Brown is on the field. Addai is riding pine.
aldelgreco
Footballguy
I got no dog in this fight, no matter where each player started....the responsibility for porter is squarely on Addai regardless of whether the lineman misunderstood the stunt. porter came from the outside. the outside player in the C gap in this case was most definitely Addai's responsibility. Just because he put himself in the wrong place and creating confusion with Lija doesn't make the sack any less his fault. Acutally makes it more disappointing to a QB like Manning.
Maroney=Sped
Footballguy
Addai has to let Lilja either succeed or fail on his own with his own guy, and has to take on Porter. If Lilja fails to get his guy, then that's on him.To do otherwise is to simply concede the blitzing Porter's route untouched to the QB, which virtually guarantees disaster. That was a major gaffe by Addai.
TakiToki
Footballguy
The sack was Addai's fault, but the description is incorrect. There was no stunt anywhere on the line. It was an overload blitz with WLB and ILB through the C gap. The ILB actually was Addai's responsiblity and the LG was to whip around and pick up the WLB. But Addai started to pick up the WLB, so the LG peeled off to pick up Addai's responsibility. But then Addai realized his assignment too late, and tried to jump up to pick up the ILB.Addai pretty much did the worst thing possible on this play. Once he committed to the wrong blitzer, he should have stuck with him, as the LG was at least trying to cover Addai's guy.
That said, it was just one play, and Addai has shown himself to be a competent pass blocker throughout his career. I wouldn't read too much into this.
I'll preface this with the fact that I own both Addai and Brown.
Last night the Colts ran the ball 10 times! Manning put on one of the greatest QB displays of all time last night. They had the ball for less than 15 min!
Yet Manning pumped out 2 TDs and over 300 yds.
So I'm not sure what can be drawn from that game other than Addai blew a block and basically got benched. IMO.
However, Addai has started and gotten the majority of carries in both games.
Right now the Colts haven't run the ball enough to show us anything.
Personally I think Brown, for now, is nothing more than a complementary back to Addai, the guy who has started both games.
We'll see how it plays out, but I think it's premature to think Brown will get close to 50% of anything yet.
Last night the Colts ran the ball 10 times! Manning put on one of the greatest QB displays of all time last night. They had the ball for less than 15 min!
Yet Manning pumped out 2 TDs and over 300 yds.
So I'm not sure what can be drawn from that game other than Addai blew a block and basically got benched. IMO.
However, Addai has started and gotten the majority of carries in both games.
Right now the Colts haven't run the ball enough to show us anything.
Personally I think Brown, for now, is nothing more than a complementary back to Addai, the guy who has started both games.
We'll see how it plays out, but I think it's premature to think Brown will get close to 50% of anything yet.
With the game on the line in the 4th quarter Brown was the man. Addai was on the pine. I think this speaks volumes.
Raiderfan32904
Footballguy
As season moves forward, Brown's value goes up, Addai's goes down. Nice to have an emerging starter to take place of worn down/injured players that get you to the FF playoffs.
Sarnoff
Footballguy
Wasn't it?Kind of like Brady looking pretty lousy in that first game of 2008 and predicting the season would have been a poor one.
two_dollars
Footballguy
I disagree. I think it's not a good post at all. 1400+ and 8 in 06, 1400+ and 15 in 07, and injury plagued in 08. That's hardly "always has been garbage." Too much painting with a broad brush in here.I don't see either RB taking off with a 70/30 split of the carries this year, and NO WAY one goes to 80/20 barring injury. It's a RBBC, nothing more. I own neither so I'm not biased here. I own zero Colts in fact.
two_dollars
Footballguy
How many series did the Colts have in the 4th quarter? Maybe they trust both backs?
packersfan
Footballguy
Brown's been the RB in the key moments of both games in the fourth quarter. Given how both games have been very close, I think that's quite revealing about how the team feels about Brown and Addai. We saw the same type of thing with Rhodes last season. He finished a lot of games for Indy. So this isn't just a Donald Brown thing. It's about Addai as well. I believe Brown's presence in the fourth quarter has huge implications. If the Colts trust him in those key situations in a close game, it's probably safe to say they'd also use him when they have a lead in that quarter. And if they're playing from the front, that could lead to positive production. Everything is shaping up nicely for Brown owners in my opinion. I thought Addai looked good Monday night but his margin for error is increasingly small. He may need to play a perfect game (which he hasn't thus far; he's made critical mistakes in both games) to keep Brown's role from growing even more.
I think you nailed it. I've been an Addai owner the past two years and I've seen all that he can do.. and it is not very good. He is a major product of the system, a marginal talent that has been extremely lucky. Why did they take Brown in the first round? Seriously, watch the film on Addai. The Colts know what they have, those were very KEY moments that Brown was in, not just because it happened to be his turn or something of that sort. I don't get where all the love is coming from; Addai has average speed, fragile as hell, hops around instead of hitting a hole, goes down to fingertip tackles.. so forget about any yards after contact, and in general runs extremely soft among other things. Brown brings everything to the table: he's very intelligent, built like a brick chithouse, has speed, can block, breaks tackles, gets yards after contact and so on. Kid is going to be a star, you colts fans should be ecstatic. Be glad that you got some production out of Addai.
switz
Footballguy
I would buy into some of the Brown love, if the people selling him weren't so obviously, and blindly biased against Addai. As some one posted earlier, people paint Addai with too large a brush based on last season. Go watch some film on Addai from when he came into the league, he's not soft, he is a jump cutter, but that's not hopping
and he's been very good around the GL.And I honestly don't buy the whole "they drafted him in the first round" reasoning by the same people who ignore that point about other RBs drafted in the first round the last couple years who do not start... and yes there are more than one.Frankly, Brown will be in an RBBC. He's the Colts 4th quarter RB, so him being in there doesn't mean anything at all. It really was just his turn. Go back to the first game - when did Brown see most of his touches? 4th quarter. Last game, when did Brown see most of his carries? 4th quarter. That's just how they're using him.
gianmarco
Footballguy
Maroney=Sped
Footballguy
I would buy into some of the Brown love, if the people selling him weren't so obviously, and blindly biased against Addai. As some one posted earlier, people paint Addai with too large a brush based on last season. Go watch some film on Addai from when he came into the league, he's not soft, he is a jump cutter, but that's not hoppingand he's been very good around the GL.And I honestly don't buy the whole "they drafted him in the first round" reasoning by the same people who ignore that point about other RBs drafted in the first round the last couple years who do not start... and yes there are more than one.Frankly, Brown will be in an RBBC. He's the Colts 4th quarter RB, so him being in there doesn't mean anything at all. It really was just his turn. Go back to the first game - when did Brown see most of his touches? 4th quarter. Last game, when did Brown see most of his carries? 4th quarter. That's just how they're using him.
C'mon, switz! You're completely in the bag for Addai, so you're the last person to be accusing others of bias. To categorically accuse Brown fans of being "biased against Addai" is to assume that reasonable people can't possibly believe that Addai has some important limitations to his talent and his game. Such accusations say far more about your mindset than the mindsets of others. I too am in the camp that says Addai is merely an above-average NFL RB talent (only in the top 35 or so, meaning that there are backups who are better than him) whose major career advantage has been his drafting onto a team with a tremendous offense. The guy couldn't outright beat out Dominic Rhodes as a rookie as you'd expect from a first round pick, and when Rhodes essentially got too old for the Colts to keep him he couldn't keep an exclusive grip on the job - they resigned Rhodes the next year and gave him 150 carries, less than half of which came in the four games in which Addai was inactive. And now, by your own admission, he's back in a RBBC with a rookie RB. Actions speak louder than words here. Let's not forget that the Colts reportedly didn't want Addai with that draft pick and were PO'ed that Belichick unexpectedly snatched their guy, Maroney, before the Colts' pick was up. Addai was clearly reluctantly drafted by Polian as a "need pick" after Edge's departure when their guy was no longer on the board. As for Brown and it just being "his turn" in the 4th quarter, does that make any sense to you at all? He's a rookie in his first two NFL games and the team is just giving him the 4th quarter because it's "his turn"? This isn't a youth soccer league where everybody gets to play. If the Colts are giving him the most important part of the game, or work on the most important part of the field in the red zone, that tells you all you need to know about what that coaching staff thinks about who should have the ball in their hands when the game situation is the most critical . . . including I might add a MNF road game (only the second of Brown's career) where the Dolphins did a near-historic job holding the ball and keeping the Indy offense off the field. What is clear is that absent injury to Brown the current split is going to be as good as it gets for Addai this season. His lot in that offense can only go downhill from here as Brown's experience and capabilities within that offense increase.
Hoss_Cartwright
Footballguy
Obviously they trust him more than Addai when the game counts the most, "the 4th quarter".I would buy into some of the Brown love, if the people selling him weren't so obviously, and blindly biased against Addai. As some one posted earlier, people paint Addai with too large a brush based on last season. Go watch some film on Addai from when he came into the league, he's not soft, he is a jump cutter, but that's not hopping
Frankly, Brown will be in an RBBC. He's the Colts 4th quarter RB, so him being in there doesn't mean anything at all. It really was just his turn. Go back to the first game - when did Brown see most of his touches? 4th quarter. Last game, when did Brown see most of his carries? 4th quarter. That's just how they're using him.
I'm not saying Brown should start, just agreeing with the 50/50 split which I think ends up being better for the whole team this year. Let the rookie experience the grind of the NFL season while keeping both of them fresh. Brown is the future. Why not use Addai when he is still a serviceable back for the most part? All I am saying is that Brown has a lot more ability, is more physically gifted than Addai and can make the plays that Addai can't. There is no need to ride him like a Matt Forte last year, they are a pass first offense with one of the best QB's of all time, as they should be. Having a stud at RB just adds even more to an already stellar O, the future is bright. That defense on the other hand...I would buy into some of the Brown love, if the people selling him weren't so obviously, and blindly biased against Addai. As some one posted earlier, people paint Addai with too large a brush based on last season. Go watch some film on Addai from when he came into the league, he's not soft, he is a jump cutter, but that's not hopping
switz
Footballguy
I'm just going to let the season play itself out.
I believe this is Addai's last season on his contract, so I full expect the Colts to work Brown in more, and hand him the reins when Addai is an FA, as they've done with their past couple RBs. I still don't see Brown as any more talented than Addai, and didn't like him before the draft. I fully expect everyone in here to be saying the same things about Brown in a couple years as they are saying about Addai now.
I believe this is Addai's last season on his contract, so I full expect the Colts to work Brown in more, and hand him the reins when Addai is an FA, as they've done with their past couple RBs. I still don't see Brown as any more talented than Addai, and didn't like him before the draft. I fully expect everyone in here to be saying the same things about Brown in a couple years as they are saying about Addai now.
