Don't be a name brand snob (1 Viewer)

[3quinox]

I've already written some posts asking about slight ways to make your team better. After looking at some trades in my leagues I've noticed players that were once major fantasy forces but now aren't, are still going for their name brand price. Example: Larry Fitzgerald. While he has a very high ceiling and can still play at a high level, whens the last time he's actually had a wr1 season, four years ago? People seem to add inflated value to the name alone and it seems you can sell at a small inflated price. Do any of you do this often with a considerate amount of success?

Other examples: Some owners wanting wanting close to what MJD was worth a couple years ago with the jags, steven jackson a couple years ago with the rams.

 

[Pickle Rody]

Fitzgerald finished WR9 in my (then non-ppr) league last year and helped propel my team to a championship. If someone wanted him they'd have to pay fair market value for him.

 

[cloppbeast]

Theoretically, we all agree on the existence of overpriced brand name guys. But for sure, we will never reach a consensus on who Fitz the description.

I will defend Fitzgerald, as he shouldn't receive most of the blame for his statistical failings. Here's a possible opportunity to buy a guy who has suffered from a bad situation in Arizona. After all, it's not like his talent disappeared overnight. At 30, he still has a lot left in the tank. For a dynasty team ready to win now, in hopes/faith of an improvement in situation, why not go after Fitzgerald?

 

[cloppbeast]

I'll offer an overpriced brand name: Hakeem Nicks. Unlike Fitzgerald, Nicks should receive most of the blame for his lack of production. He seems to have lost his ability to create separation. If you think Luck can turn water in to wine, have at it.

 

[3quinox]

Fitzgerald finished WR9 in my (then non-ppr) league last year and helped propel my team to a championship. If someone wanted him they'd have to pay fair market value for him.

In my PPR league he finished 17th. Of course some of this is subjective as all league scoring is different, but I think we can say that he has had a steady decline the past couple years.

 

[3quinox]

Hakeem knicks in a good one. The owner wanted what the value he gave players and the giants years ago as opposed to his position now. It just seems with house hold names they always look in the past. They aren't selling you Fitzgerald now, they are trying to sell you Fitzgerald when he was with kurt warner stating he will get there again. Same thing for MJD, it's the 2012 league rusher, not the time share raider mess.

 

[Bojang0301]

This always happens. If you want them so bad why don't you pay instead of complaining. You are obviously just looking for a veteran stop gap. Find it somewhere else or look for undervalued guys like Mike Wallace or Kendall Wright. Guys who are the opposite of Fitz and Nicks. I've actually owned Fitzy since after his huge years. Got him for Deangelo Williams after he had his first down year and was still a name. Now I've traded Fitz for what I hope to be a booming Cordarelle Patterson and a few other trinkets, just how it works. I think of FF as a stock market. You already know guys like Fitzgerald have probably peaked out but they still pay good dividends. Why not try and get the next Microsoft or Facebook for them?

 

[cloppbeast]

Hakeem knicks in a good one. The owner wanted what the value he gave players and the giants years ago as opposed to his position now. It just seems with house hold names they always look in the past. They aren't selling you Fitzgerald now, they are trying to sell you Fitzgerald when he was with kurt warner stating he will get there again. Same thing for MJD, it's the 2012 league rusher, not the time share raider mess.

I must have missed your point. :whoosh: It happens.

I'd say there's a difference between a league-mate choosing not to sell one of these players, rather than actively shopping one for the inflated brand-name price. If you don't want to sell a player at his current value, don't pimp him.

 

[Pickle Rody]

Fitzgerald finished WR9 in my (then non-ppr) league last year and helped propel my team to a championship. If someone wanted him they'd have to pay fair market value for him.

In my PPR league he finished 17th. Of course some of this is subjective as all league scoring is different, but I think we can say that he has had a steady decline the past couple years.

I disagree with your premise that he has been in a decline, but you can have your opinion, which is fine. I think a few nagging injuries, poor QB play, poor o-line play and poor offensive coordination had a lot to do with his declining fantasy and real game stats. Those stats corrected themselves last year. But skill wise he has not been in a decline. I expect great things from him again this year. Especially now that my league switched to PPR.For the record I paid two 1st round picks for him 15 months ago but wouldn't expect to get that in return now. Even if I did get a fair offer I think I'd just hang on to him and let him help me win another title.

 

[3quinox]

This always happens. If you want them so bad why don't you pay instead of complaining. You are obviously just looking for a veteran stop gap. Find it somewhere else or look for undervalued guys like Mike Wallace or Kendall Wright. Guys who are the opposite of Fitz and Nicks. I've actually owned Fitzy since after his huge years. Got him for Deangelo Williams after he had his first down year and was still a name. Now I've traded Fitz for what I hope to be a booming Cordarelle Patterson and a few other trinkets, just how it works. I think of FF as a stock market. You already know guys like Fitzgerald have probably peaked out but they still pay good dividends. Why not try and get the next Microsoft or Facebook for them?

Hakeem knicks in a good one. The owner wanted what the value he gave players and the giants years ago as opposed to his position now. It just seems with house hold names they always look in the past. They aren't selling you Fitzgerald now, they are trying to sell you Fitzgerald when he was with kurt warner stating he will get there again. Same thing for MJD, it's the 2012 league rusher, not the time share raider mess.

I must have missed your point. :whoosh: It happens.

I'd say there's a difference between a league-mate choosing not to sell one of these players, rather than actively shopping one for the inflated brand-name price. If you don't want to sell a player at his current value, don't pimp him.

Sorry I guess I must have worded my weirdly. I'm not complaining about prices of older vets, or asking why people sell or perceive them the way they do. I'm asking if its a viable strategy to try to actively stockpile has-beens like MJD, Ray Rice, etc.. just to sell them right back at a larger profit for more than they are worth banking on name value alone. I've never tried it but have seen in isolated incidences that it works great. Someone thinks by giving up picks and promising rookies that Ray Rice will rejuvenate himself overnight and be a steal. Has anyone else seen this or done this in a league?

 

[3quinox]

Fitzgerald finished WR9 in my (then non-ppr) league last year and helped propel my team to a championship. If someone wanted him they'd have to pay fair market value for him.

In my PPR league he finished 17th. Of course some of this is subjective as all league scoring is different, but I think we can say that he has had a steady decline the past couple years.

I disagree with your premise that he has been in a decline, but you can have your opinion, which is fine. I think a few nagging injuries, poor QB play, poor o-line play and poor offensive coordination had a lot to do with his declining fantasy and real game stats. Those stats corrected themselves last year. But skill wise he has not been in a decline. I expect great things from him again this year. Especially now that my league switched to PPR.For the record I paid two 1st round picks for him 15 months ago but wouldn't expect to get that in return now. Even if I did get a fair offer I think I'd just hang on to him and let him help me win another title.

I'm not saying his decline is due to skill, in fact in my mind it is solely based on situation alone (as you stated qb play o line etc), however, he has committed to the Cardinals so I don't see him landing in a great situation before he retires thus creating the decline I was talking about in the first place. He now seems somewhat capped by his situation and has been hamstringed by it for a while now. I think it will get better with the progression of the O line and Floyd but that gets away from what I was trying to originally ask.

 

[Pickle Rody]

Yes I have....as I just mentioned in my last post. I wanted Fitz and knew what it would take to get him, even though his owner was inflating his value. Was it a risk? Sure, but I was willing to take make that gamble. Everyone in the league thought I paid too much. But I'm looking at my championship trophy right now as I type this. I did not then and do not think now that the decline has started. I may be wrong of course.

It's a viable strategy if you think you know what you are doing.

 

[Junior McSpiffy]

This always happens. If you want them so bad why don't you pay instead of complaining. You are obviously just looking for a veteran stop gap. Find it somewhere else or look for undervalued guys like Mike Wallace or Kendall Wright. Guys who are the opposite of Fitz and Nicks. I've actually owned Fitzy since after his huge years. Got him for Deangelo Williams after he had his first down year and was still a name. Now I've traded Fitz for what I hope to be a booming Cordarelle Patterson and a few other trinkets, just how it works. I think of FF as a stock market. You already know guys like Fitzgerald have probably peaked out but they still pay good dividends. Why not try and get the next Microsoft or Facebook for them?

Hakeem knicks in a good one. The owner wanted what the value he gave players and the giants years ago as opposed to his position now. It just seems with house hold names they always look in the past. They aren't selling you Fitzgerald now, they are trying to sell you Fitzgerald when he was with kurt warner stating he will get there again. Same thing for MJD, it's the 2012 league rusher, not the time share raider mess.

I must have missed your point. :whoosh: It happens.

I'd say there's a difference between a league-mate choosing not to sell one of these players, rather than actively shopping one for the inflated brand-name price. If you don't want to sell a player at his current value, don't pimp him.

Sorry I guess I must have worded my weirdly. I'm not complaining about prices of older vets, or asking why people sell or perceive them the way they do. I'm asking if its a viable strategy to try to actively stockpile has-beens like MJD, Ray Rice, etc.. just to sell them right back at a larger profit for more than they are worth banking on name value alone. I've never tried it but have seen in isolated incidences that it works great. Someone thinks by giving up picks and promising rookies that Ray Rice will rejuvenate himself overnight and be a steal. Has anyone else seen this or done this in a league?

If you believe they are in decline, then how would stockpiling them somehow add to their value? They'd get a diminsihing return each year you hold onto them. The price you pay up front to get them is the top price they'd be worth, according to your theory. So how would stockpiling them for trade-only purposes benefit you when you can't sell them for what you paid for them? You can't buy a vet intending to profit on name value without paying the name value up front yourself..

I guess if one of them hits big you can do a small bit of price-gouging, but then you are getting them hoping for top-tier production, not for flipping them.

 

[Gottabesweet]

Window is closing on Ray Rice

 

[Zaphod]

Depending on the type of league you talking about (redraft or dynasty), there will always be a bit of inelasticity in regards to their current value. This can be based on what price was paid in a draft or trade or even perceived value driven by frequenting message boards. This does work in both ways however, players ascending or descending will have some measure of 'stickiness'. Sometimes this is due to past performance, injury, changing teams, or can be as simple as attending a small school in college.

I find the owners that typically do the best in the long run are those that transact in this delta.

 

[Monsters of the Midway]

My leagues generally operate in the inverse-the up and comers get more inflation than the heading to/past the end of their primes guys like Fitzgerald, Andre Johnson etc.

 

[BigSteelThrill]

Name value has TRADE value.

I like to trade.