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DYNASTY: 2012 Top college prospects (2 Viewers)

Ronnie Hillman RB San Diego State has just declared for the NFL Draft.

I wasn't sure if he was going to eligible or not because he was a late enroll, but apparently he is.
Here's a short video clip of him. There's another 10 min video on youtube of his 2011 highlights for those interested. The first thing that sticks out to me is he looks like a small dude, in both height and width. ESPN has him listed at 190 lbs, but he looks less than that. The next thing that sticks out is his speed and quickness which both look legit. I'd guess he'll run somewhere in the 4.3s or low 4.4s at the combine. Other things I noticed are that he dances a bit more than you'd like to see behind the line of scrimmage, and that despite his lack of size he does a decent job of breaking tackles.

Imo, he looks like a scatback that'll be taken in the midrounds. For fantasy purposes, I could see him being good if he can put on some weight and not lose much speed, otherwise he looks like he has Darren Sproles type upside.

 
Ronnie Hillman RB San Diego State has just declared for the NFL Draft.I wasn't sure if he was going to eligible or not because he was a late enroll, but apparently he is.
The draft from the RB position is starting to look better. I had some concerns but now I like how things are shaping up. :football:
 
Pre-injury he was clear cut #2 in my rankings and could've challenged for #1.Now I don't think he beats out David Wilson/Lamar Miller, but he could put up some crazy numbers at the combine too.
:goodposting: Now that Ronnie Hillman is coming out, I'd put Hillman ahead as well.
 
Sanu declares.
Great news! Do you have a link? I thought he was going to stay at Rutgers for another season so this is a nice surprise. The 2012 class is starting to look really good.
http://espn.go.com/blog/bigeast/post/_/id/28492/mohamed-sanu-declares-for-nfl-draft
Awesome! Thanks. I really like Sanu. He could be another Percy Harvin jack-of-all trades guy.
His stats make him look like a text-book possession WR. 10 yard average. In 115 recpetions this year, his long was 32 yards.
The stats aren't impressive but I've talked to a few Rutgers fans on another board who have followed the program closely and they constantly rave about Sanu and his talent. Apparently the QB there was horrible and their offensive game plans didn't involve Sanu going deep so he was mostly utilized as a posession receiver but that he's got the ability to go deep if the situation called for it. Basically the entire offence ran through him, he even played some wildcat QB there and is still very raw as a WR only having played the position a couple of years. He's got great hands though and is a big target. As a late 1st round rookie draft pick I like his upside. I'd be more inclined to take Sanu in the 10-12 range than I would be taking Jeffery 7-10.
 
I'm starting to put together my rankings and right now it looks like Doug Martin will be my #2 RB. David Wilson, Lamar Miller, Bernard Pierce, and LaMichael James all do some things well, but none of them stands out to me as much as Martin, who has no obvious weaknesses. I wonder how high he'll go. Russ Lande has him as a late first rounder while Draft Scout has him on the border of the 2nd/3rd rounds. I'm guessing he'll end up somewhere in the middle of those two poles.

:thumbup: LOVE Martin, his spin moves are sick and he doesn't slow down after the spin + he uses his stiff arm effectively.
 
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I'm starting to put together my rankings and right now it looks like Doug Martin will be my #2 RB. David Wilson, Lamar Miller, Bernard Pierce, and LaMichael James all do some things well, but none of them stands out to me as much as Martin, who has no obvious weaknesses. I wonder how high he'll go. Russ Lande has him as a late first rounder while Draft Scout has him on the border of the 2nd/3rd rounds. I'm guessing he'll end up somewhere in the middle of those two poles.

Although he doesn't have any obvious weakness, he also has no obvious exceptional quality imo. Given enough touches in the NFL he should do a decent enough job, but I could see a NFL team preferring to put him in a RBBC with a more explosive back.
 
I'm starting to put together my rankings and right now it looks like Doug Martin will be my #2 RB. David Wilson, Lamar Miller, Bernard Pierce, and LaMichael James all do some things well, but none of them stands out to me as much as Martin, who has no obvious weaknesses. I wonder how high he'll go. Russ Lande has him as a late first rounder while Draft Scout has him on the border of the 2nd/3rd rounds. I'm guessing he'll end up somewhere in the middle of those two poles.

No really sure what you mean by exceptional quality and of course you stated that it's your opinion. This kid can catch, he runs as hard as any running back in this class and most important to any QB he can stay in the pocket and block. After Richardson, I'm torn between Hillman, Lamar and Martin.
 
I'm starting to put together my rankings and right now it looks like Doug Martin will be my #2 RB. David Wilson, Lamar Miller, Bernard Pierce, and LaMichael James all do some things well, but none of them stands out to me as much as Martin, who has no obvious weaknesses. I wonder how high he'll go. Russ Lande has him as a late first rounder while Draft Scout has him on the border of the 2nd/3rd rounds. I'm guessing he'll end up somewhere in the middle of those two poles.

By exceptional quality I mean the following: I don't think he has great speed, great quickness, great tackle breaking ability, great lateral agility, or great pass catching ability relative to other NFL RBs. Or said more simply, I don't think he's great in any particular relevant characteristic relative to other NFL RBs. Although I will say he could be a great blocker, that's one characteristic I'm unable to give an opinion on.
 
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I'm starting to put together my rankings and right now it looks like Doug Martin will be my #2 RB. David Wilson, Lamar Miller, Bernard Pierce, and LaMichael James all do some things well, but none of them stands out to me as much as Martin, who has no obvious weaknesses. I wonder how high he'll go. Russ Lande has him as a late first rounder while Draft Scout has him on the border of the 2nd/3rd rounds. I'm guessing he'll end up somewhere in the middle of those two poles.

I disagree. I think he shows exceptional vision and burst. He's one of those players that jumps off the screen to me. He seems to get up to top speed very, very quickly. That's exceptional.
 
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Ronnie Hillman RB San Diego State has just declared for the NFL Draft.I wasn't sure if he was going to eligible or not because he was a late enroll, but apparently he is.
Draft eligibility is dependant on year if high school graduation, not start of college career. Three years removed from HS graduation is the policy.
 
'Xue said:
Ronnie Hillman RB San Diego State has just declared for the NFL Draft.I wasn't sure if he was going to eligible or not because he was a late enroll, but apparently he is.
Draft eligibility is dependant on year if high school graduation, not start of college career. Three years removed from HS graduation is the policy.
I know, which is why I thought he was going to be eligible. However, I didn't see him on any other watch lists for the 2012 NFL Draft. So I thought I may have miscalculated.
 
I don't really like this class besides Richardson. It seems similar to last year where one guy stands out and then many who are 2nd/3rd rounders. It seems there are lots of rbs declaring early which makes mid/late 2nd round rookie picks more appealing.

 
I'm starting to put together my rankings and right now it looks like Doug Martin will be my #2 RB. David Wilson, Lamar Miller, Bernard Pierce, and LaMichael James all do some things well, but none of them stands out to me as much as Martin, who has no obvious weaknesses. I wonder how high he'll go. Russ Lande has him as a late first rounder while Draft Scout has him on the border of the 2nd/3rd rounds. I'm guessing he'll end up somewhere in the middle of those two poles.

He might not have any A+ traits, but he's an A- in everything. Strong and quick. Also quite fast. Nobody catches him from behind when he breaks into the open field.
 
I don't really like this class besides Richardson. It seems similar to last year where one guy stands out and then many who are 2nd/3rd rounders. It seems there are lots of rbs declaring early which makes mid/late 2nd round rookie picks more appealing.
I know very little compared to most of you guys in terms of evaluating college prospects and their NFL futures, but IMO I totally agree with the above statement.Every year there are a few prospects that you can clearly see that have SOMETHING that will make them not just NFL players, but successful ones. Like AJ Green's unreal ability to adjust to catches (as well as being good at everything), Julio Jones size/athleticism, things that CLEARLY stick out. That doesn't mean they will translate all the time, but it helps someone like myself that doesn't watch a lot of college football get excited about my dynasty draft. I would love for you all to school me to other prospects but Richarson is the only prospect that makes me go :shock:
 
I don't really like this class besides Richardson. It seems similar to last year where one guy stands out and then many who are 2nd/3rd rounders. It seems there are lots of rbs declaring early which makes mid/late 2nd round rookie picks more appealing.
For my money, Ryan Williams was the most talented RB in last year's class if he hadn't gotten hurt.
 
'EBF said:
I'm starting to put together my rankings and right now it looks like Doug Martin will be my #2 RB. David Wilson, Lamar Miller, Bernard Pierce, and LaMichael James all do some things well, but none of them stands out to me as much as Martin, who has no obvious weaknesses. I wonder how high he'll go. Russ Lande has him as a late first rounder while Draft Scout has him on the border of the 2nd/3rd rounds. I'm guessing he'll end up somewhere in the middle of those two poles.

I'd consider 4.3 speed to be an A+ trait.
 
I'm starting to put together my rankings and right now it looks like Doug Martin will be my #2 RB. David Wilson, Lamar Miller, Bernard Pierce, and LaMichael James all do some things well, but none of them stands out to me as much as Martin, who has no obvious weaknesses. I wonder how high he'll go. Russ Lande has him as a late first rounder while Draft Scout has him on the border of the 2nd/3rd rounds. I'm guessing he'll end up somewhere in the middle of those two poles.

So would I. But I don't see what that has to do with Doug Martin.
 
'BeTheMatch said:
I disagree. I think he shows exceptional vision and burst. He's one of those players that jumps off the screen to me. He seems to get up to top speed very, very quickly. That's exceptional.
I would say getting to top speed very, very quickly is an exceptional talent (as long as his top speed is sufficiently adequate). I don't see that in Martin though. From that highlight video against Georgia, he didn't seem to have much success in beating defenders to the outside. Overall though, he does do a good job of getting up field quickly, so I wouldn't go as far to say that he doesn't have "good" acceleration.
'Lott said:
Martin looked like he had very good lateral agility and very good acceleration as well.
I think his lateral agility looks decent enough, but not particularly exceptional.
 
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I'm starting to put together my rankings and right now it looks like Doug Martin will be my #2 RB. David Wilson, Lamar Miller, Bernard Pierce, and LaMichael James all do some things well, but none of them stands out to me as much as Martin, who has no obvious weaknesses. I wonder how high he'll go. Russ Lande has him as a late first rounder while Draft Scout has him on the border of the 2nd/3rd rounds. I'm guessing he'll end up somewhere in the middle of those two poles.

Doug Martin, David Wilson, they're all the same...Martin reminds me of DeAngelo Williams, who reminded me of Emmitt Smith.
 
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ESPN Link

i guess it is no surprise that Alshon Jeffery declaired... should probably have his own thread since opinions are all over the place on him right now. Of course he wants to be the next Fitz, Megatron or AJ:

"The 6-foot-4, 229-pound Jeffery had 49 catches for 762 yards and eight touchdowns this season. He is rated 25th overall and third among receivers, according to ESPN Scouts Inc.

"I'm ready for the next step. I'm physical and can make plays in the red zone. I can make big plays in big games. I can work on my speed and get quicker. I want to be like (NFL receivers) Larry Fitzgerald, Calvin Johnson and Andre Johnson," Jeffery told ESPN.com Thursday.

Earlier on Twitter, Jeffery tweeted, in part, "I would like to thank the fans, my teammates , coach spurrier and everyone involved for all the opportunities south Carolina has provided me, I am proud to say I will always be a gamecock."

 
'BeTheMatch said:
I disagree. I think he shows exceptional vision and burst. He's one of those players that jumps off the screen to me. He seems to get up to top speed very, very quickly. That's exceptional.
I would say getting to top speed very, very quickly is an exceptional talent (as long as his top speed is sufficiently adequate). I don't see that in Martin though. From that highlight video against Georgia, he didn't seem to have much success in beating defenders to the outside. Overall though, he does do a good job of getting up field quickly, so I wouldn't go as far to say that he doesn't have "good" acceleration.
'Lott said:
Martin looked like he had very good lateral agility and very good acceleration as well.
I think his lateral agility looks decent enough, but not particularly exceptional.
Agree he is a jack of all trades, master of none type. Donald Brown has exceptional acceleration... not comparing him with Martin at all. I see him as a stronger/tougher Moreno, which may be exactly what Moreno was lacking in the NFL. I doubt Martin is a future stud, but he does have a Rudi Johnson/Ced Benson appeal in that he could be a dependable, lunch pail kind of guy that sticks and starts for a team for a long time. Draft position will have a lot to do with his future value. 4.3 comment before is a laugh, but he's fast enough to play, doesn't gear down much to make a move at the 2nd level, has pretty good vision, breaks tackles well and finishes runs. I think the Boise offense left him many big holes to run through, but he did what a good back would do with a big hole and did what a good back would do where the wasn't a good hole - [marty] put your pads down and make a hole. [/marty] Martin isn't in the top 4 of my 1st round rookie choices, but I think he is a value if you can land him in the 6-12 range. Most have Richardson/Blackmon as top 2. Luck/RG3/Miller/Wilson/Martin/Ball/Polk/Floyd/Jeffery/Wright will likely shuffle the rest of the 1st round depending on scoring & personal preference and post-draft situation. I think he could go as high as 1.04 and as low as 2.01.
 
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ESPN Link

i guess it is no surprise that Alshon Jeffery declaired... should probably have his own thread since opinions are all over the place on him right now. Of course he wants to be the next Fitz, Megatron or AJ:

"The 6-foot-4, 229-pound Jeffery had 49 catches for 762 yards and eight touchdowns this season. He is rated 25th overall and third among receivers, according to ESPN Scouts Inc.

"I'm ready for the next step. I'm physical and can make plays in the red zone. I can make big plays in big games. I can work on my speed and get quicker. I want to be like (NFL receivers) Larry Fitzgerald, Calvin Johnson and Andre Johnson," Jeffery told ESPN.com Thursday.

Earlier on Twitter, Jeffery tweeted, in part, "I would like to thank the fans, my teammates , coach spurrier and everyone involved for all the opportunities south Carolina has provided me, I am proud to say I will always be a gamecock."
I don't see anything special about Jeffery other than his size. He has no burst off the line and made his living off smaller CB's. Decent open field skills but not good enough to translate to the NFL.
 
'BeTheMatch said:
I disagree. I think he shows exceptional vision and burst. He's one of those players that jumps off the screen to me. He seems to get up to top speed very, very quickly. That's exceptional.
I would say getting to top speed very, very quickly is an exceptional talent (as long as his top speed is sufficiently adequate). I don't see that in Martin though. From that highlight video against Georgia, he didn't seem to have much success in beating defenders to the outside. Overall though, he does do a good job of getting up field quickly, so I wouldn't go as far to say that he doesn't have "good" acceleration.
'Lott said:
Martin looked like he had very good lateral agility and very good acceleration as well.
I think his lateral agility looks decent enough, but not particularly exceptional.
Agree he is a jack of all trades, master of none type. Donald Brown has exceptional acceleration... not comparing him with Martin at all. I see him as a stronger/tougher Moreno, which may be exactly what Moreno was lacking in the NFL. I doubt Martin is a future stud, but he does have a Rudi Johnson/Ced Benson appeal in that he could be a dependable, lunch pail kind of guy that sticks and starts for a team for a long time. Draft position will have a lot to do with his future value. 4.3 comment before is a laugh, but he's fast enough to play, doesn't gear down much to make a move at the 2nd level, has pretty good vision, breaks tackles well and finishes runs. I think the Boise offense left him many big holes to run through, but he did what a good back would do with a big hole and did what a good back would do where the wasn't a good hole - [marty] put your pads down and make a hole. [/marty] Martin isn't in the top 4 of my 1st round rookie choices, but I think he is a value if you can land him in the 6-12 range. Most have Richardson/Blackmon as top 2. Luck/RG3/Miller/Wilson/Martin/Ball/Polk/Floyd/Jeffery/Wright will likely shuffle the rest of the 1st round depending on scoring & personal preference and post-draft situation. I think he could go as high as 1.04 and as low as 2.01.
:goodposting: Excellent post.
 
You would be lucky to get a Rudi or Benson career out of a 1.04-1.06 rookie pick. I don't buy the comparison though. Martin is faster than either of those players and a much more accomplished pass catcher. He probably doesn't run a 4.3, but watch the highlights. He is never caught from behind in the open field. Defensive backs are unable to close the gap at all when he hits full stride. That means he has above average speed for 215 pound workhorse back. He will likely run a 4.4 IMO.

Guys who are a stocky 215 pounds with 4.4 speed, excellent production, power, versatility, and quickness don't grow on trees, even in the NFL. I don't think Martin is quite good enough to be a first round lock, but he is better than some are giving him credit for. The NFL is full of guys like Arian Foster, Rashard Mendenhall, Ray Rice, Matt Forte, Ryan Mathews, and Frank Gore who have had great careers without being elite in any measurable category. I could definitely see Martin yielding similar results if given an opportunity to play.

Purely in terms of this draft class, the reason I have him as the #2 RB is because he doesn't have any weaknesses. David Wilson (my tentative #3 right now) is small. Lamar Miller lacks power and doesn't seem very good at making people miss in the open field. Bernard Pierce has a more upright build and less explosiveness.

Having said that, Martin is the type of player whose rookie draft position will hinge on his landing spot. He will not be taken ahead of Richardson or Blackmon in PPR leagues. If he lands in a starting role, the 1.03-1.06 slots are in play. Otherwise he could fall pretty far. Luck and Griffin are great, but people rarely use top 4 rookie picks on quarterbacks and will always reach for RBs who land in favorable situations.

 
Robinson, Austin among draft prospects in Sugar, Orange bowls

Tony Pauline

Posted: Monday January 2, 2012 9:02PM ; Updated: Monday January 2, 2012 9:13PM

Excerpts on the offensive skill positions (projected NFL draft round at the end of each player summary):

Denard Robinson*, RB/WR/RS (No. 16) -- Robinson has been an electrifying college quarterback since stepping on the field his freshman season. Quarterback is the one position he won't play at the next level as scouts think Robinson is best suited to handle the ball at a variety of other skill positions. He reminds many of a faster, slicker version of former All-Pro Antwaan Randle El. 2nd Round

David Wilson*, RB (No. 4) -- The Hokies consistently put quality running backs into the NFL draft, and Wilson is the latest edition. He's a slippery runner with a great burst through the hole and the ability to run to daylight. Wilson consistently picks up big chunks of yardage from the line of scrimmage and has a nose for the end zone. The junior possesses the skills to eventually develop into a primary ballcarrier at the next level. 2nd Round

Danny Coale, WR (No. 19) -- Coale is one of the more underrated receivers in the nation. He's a wideout with a complete game, displaying hands of glue, solid route-running skills and a willingness to block down the field. Coale plays smart, hard football, which will help him develop into a third receiver at the next level. 3rd/4th Round

Dwayne Allen*, TE (No. 83) -- Allen has blossomed into one of the best pass-catching threats at tight end on draft boards. The junior has the speed to stretch the defense as evidenced by his 12-yard-per-catch average. He lacks classic size for the position but will be a combination move tight end/H-back in an NFL offense. 2nd Round

Tavon Austin*, WR (No. 1) -- The junior has been a multipurpose threat for the Mountaineers, leading the offense in receptions as well as punt and kick returns last season. He's an elusive skill player with the ability to create yardage when the ball is in his hands. Austin could be a devastating third receiver/return specialist once he gets into the NFL. 3rd Round
 
NFL Draft notebook: Despite numbers Illini's Mercilus not first-rounder

By Rob Rang

Excerpt:

Bowl games help big-name receivers

Strong performances from some of the most celebrated wide receivers in the country -- Oklahoma State's Justin Blackmon, Baylor's Kendall Wright and South Carolina's Alshon Jeffery -- won't help second-tier receivers get the attention they deserve after excellent showings in the postseason. California's Marvin Jones, Texas' Marquise Goodwin and Oregon's Lavasier Tuinei were bright stars in the spotlight of bowl season, delivering the type of impact performances that cause scouts to retrace their steps and take a closer look at their evaluations of these players.

On New Year's Eve, the 6-2, 202-pound Jones caught eight passes for 88 yards against a very athletic Longhorns secondary. Jones has quietly been a very solid receiver for Cal throughout his career, but surprised one scout on hand for the game with his ability to get separation in this game.

"Honestly, I thought they'd shut him down," a scout said, requesting anonymity. "The quarterback was inconsistent, but Jones showed that he could get open. I made have undersold him a little bit."

Despite his build, Jones sinks his hips well and shows good burst laterally to cut away from the defender. As such, he was consistently open on underneath routes such as dig, curl and simple outs.

The scout refused to comment on Texas' Goodwin because the 5-9, 177-pound speedster is a redshirt junior. He didn't have to. The speed and elusiveness Goodwin showed running for 37 yards and catching a 47-yard touchdown pass in the third quarter were enough of a statement.

After winning the long jump with a personal best 27 feet, 4 inches at the U.S. Track and Field Nationals in June, Goodwin had planned to take the football season off and focus on training for the 2012 Olympics.

It might have reasoned that he had Olympic speed, not leaping ability, given the way Goodwin flew through and away from the California secondary in the Holiday Bowl. Goodwin only 30 catches for 372 yards and a touchdown entering the night, but on a national stage he showcased NFL-caliber speed, balance and acceleration, traits scouts won't soon forget.

Another Pac-12 receiver stood out. Lavasier Tuinei caught eight passes for 158 yards and two touchdowns in Oregon's dramatic Rose Bowl victory over Wisconsin and was as silky smooth as the Courvoisier with which his first name rhymes.

The 6-5, 216-pound Tuinei surprised Badgers' defensive backs with his long stride, getting behind the defense on multiple occasions. Tuinei snatched passes out of the air and made the adjustment to a ball thrown over his left shoulder (when he expected it over his right) with a fluidity rarely seen in receivers of his size.

The concern with Tuinei, as with any receiver his size, is speed. Tuinei isn't explosive off the line of scrimmage. He does, however, have the bloodlines to suggest he deserves a shot at the next level. His father, Van Tuinei, played four years on the defensive line for the San Diego Chargers, Indianapolis Colts and Chicago Bears.
 
I like the Moreno comp for Martin. Similar skill set.

As for his running style and the way moves, he's a lighter Jonathan Stewart.

 
NFL Draft Risers and Fallers

Risers and Fallers - Dane Brugler -- (Updated 12/28/2011)

1. RB Doug Martin Boise State

After missing the TCU game, which turned out to be Boise State's lone loss of 2011, Martin ended his season with four-straight 100-yard rushing performances, culminating last week as the MVP of the MAACO Bowl Las Vegas. He finished the game with a bowl-record 301 all-purpose yards, including 151 yards on the ground and 26 receiving yards, but set the tone early with a 100-yard opening kickoff return for a score. After a slow start to the season, Martin proved to be the unsung hero of the Boise State offense, finishing second in the Mountain West Conference in rushing with 1,299 yards on 263 carries (4.9 yards per carry) and 16 touchdowns. He has very good vision to find room to work with the balance and leg drive to pick up a lot of yardage after contact. Martin has explosive change of direction ability and lateral quickness to make sharp jump cuts and get upfield quickly, drawing a lot of comparisons to New Orleans Saints' running back Mark Ingram. He currently stands as the top senior running back for the 2012 NFL Draft and will have a chance to cement that status at the Senior Bowl in January.

2. WR Gerell Robinson Arizona State

Robinson emerged as the Sun Devil's top receiving threat this season as a senior and he certainly ended his career with his best foot forward last week in the MAACO Bow Las Vegas. Despite falling to Boise State, he set single game-bests with 13 catches for a bowl-record 241 yards, adding one touchdown. At 6-4, 220 pounds, Robinson has imposing size and length with an impressive catching radius, presenting a large target for his quarterback. He is a good-sized athlete with above average body control and coordination for his frame. Robinson finished the season with 77 receptions for a Pac 12-best 1,397 yards and seven touchdowns, averaging a remarkable 18.1 yards per catch. Despite a career-high in catches this season, he fights the ball too much and NFL scouts wish he was more consistent completing the catch. Robinson is an intriuging talent for the next level because of his size and athleticism -- his productive senior season will likely earn him a draft pick on the third day.

3. RB Michael Smith Utah State

While junior RB Robert Turbin is the bell cow runner in the Utah State backfield, Smith is a player that shouldn't be overlooked. Despite a loss to Ohio in the Famous Idaho Potato Bowl, the senior ended his senior season last Saturday with a career performance, rushing 12 times for a career-best 157 yards and 2 TDs. Smith, who attended Eastern Arizona Junior College out of high school before transferring to Utah State in 2009, missed most of the 2010 season with a foot injury and redshirted. He returned healthy in 2011 as a senior, but had double-digit carries in just three games as he was stuck in a crowded backfield led by Turbin, the WAC Offensive Player of the Year. However, Smith shined in the bowl game, showing off his explosive burst and balance through contact along with his aggressive and instinctive running style. As coach Gary Anderson said after the game, "to end it like that, that typifies Michael Smith."
 
Top college talents Luck, Blackmon shine on Fiesta stage

By Bucky Brooks NFL.com

Analyst

Published: Jan. 3, 2012 at 02:21 p.m. Updated: Jan. 3, 2012 at 07:18 p.m.

GLENDALE, Ariz. -- As an evaluator, you love any opportunity to watch top prospects square off on a big stage.

These moments occasionally happen throughout the year in rivalry games, but nothing is better than watching top teams loaded with NFL-caliber talent square off in bowls.

When the bowl game schedule was finalized a month ago, I circled the Fiesta Bowl based on the number of stars on both Stanford and Oklahoma State. Here are my observations after getting a first-hand look during the Cowboys' 41-38 win over the Cardinal on Monday night:

» Andrew Luck is the real deal. He is the best quarterback prospect in college football in recent years, and he validated that assessment with his impressive performance at the Fiesta.

In completing 27 of 31 passes for 347 yards with two touchdowns and one interception, Luck showcased the complete array of skills that evaluators covet in top quarterbacks. He was deadly accurate from the pocket, while displaying exceptional velocity and zip on his passes at all ranges. He showed outstanding poise and presence in the pocket and never appeared rattled by the constantly changing defensive tactics used against him.

From heavy blitz pressure to blanket coverage, Luck quickly adjusted to the Cowboys' scheme and exploited the weaknesses of each approach. He defeated the blitz by quickly releasing pinpoint throws prior to the rush collapsing the pocket, which forced the defense to scale back its pressure. Against traditional coverage, he connected the dots brilliantly with accurate throws. His ability to string together completions was remarkable to watch, and it certainly frustrated defenders hoping to pick off an errant toss.

In delving deeper into impressive aspects of Luck's game, I would point to his ability to work effectively off play-action. He is a masterful ball handler effective at fooling defenders with hard fakes, and his ability to work from the pocket or the perimeter makes him a unique playmaker at the position. His ability to connect with tight ends and receivers on crossing routes while on the run suggests that he is more than capable of thriving in a movement-based scheme that featured multiple bootleg-action passes.

Luck was also impressive directing the Cardinal's no-huddle offense in two-minute situations. He operated like an orchestra conductor while handling the play-calling duties, and displayed the kind of situational awareness you expect from veteran quarterbacks. In addition, he showed exceptional poise and play-making ability under pressure by stringing together a series of completions in critical situations. If quarterbacks are defined by their ability to perform in the clutch, then he certainly provided evaluators with enough information to earn regal status as a prospect.

» Justin Blackmon* will be the NFL's next great receiver. There's no doubt in mind. The Oklahoma State junior, who has already announced his intention to apply for the draft, possesses the size, speed and playmaking ability that scouts covet in a No. 1 receiver and is a dominant force capable of serving as the anchor to a dynamic passing game.

In breaking down the positive aspects of his game, I was most impressed by Blackmon's explosiveness after the catch. He plays at another speed when he gets the ball in his hands. His ability to accelerate and separate reminds me of a young Terrell Owens, and he certainly possesses the skills to make an immediate impact as a playmaker in the NFL.

Blackmon is an exceptional route runner despite being a taller receiver. He is quick out of his breaks, and flashes some wiggle at the top of his routes. His ability to set defenders up with subtle moves is pretty advanced for a college player and is one of the reasons NFL position coaches will love refining his game at the next level.

As pass catcher, Blackmon shows strong hands and extraordinary ball skills. He easily tracks and adjusts to errant throws with ease. His combination of field awareness and body control allows him to routinely make acrobatic catches near the sideline while keeping his feet inbounds.

After watching Blackmon work against Stanford double-teams, I'm also impressed with his poise and demeanor. He didn't exhibit poor body language on the field when the ball didn't head in his direction early in the game, and appeared genuinely happy when his teammates made pivotal plays. Given the temperamental nature of some receivers, Blackmon's anti-diva persona will only enhance his value in scouting circles.

» Brandon Weeden has tremendous physical tools, but is not an elite quarterback prospect. That's not to suggest that the Oklahoma State QB isn't worthy of consideration during the second or third rounds, but he must correct several aspects of his game to develop into quality starter as a pro.

From game management to decision-making, he doesn't display a high football IQ when operating from the pocket. This was readily apparent when watching him routinely throw balls into coverage despite having other receivers available within his sight line. While some of his questionable decisions could be attributed to poor play calls against some of the defensive looks, most were the result of Weeden failing to correctly diagnose the coverage and hit the open receiver. He appears to predetermine where he is going with the ball prior to the snap and doesn't show the ability to adjust if his primary option is covered.

In seeing his flaws in person, I'm concerned about his ability to decipher complex coverage as a pro and direct an offense that features more sophisticated concepts than the Cowboys' version of the spread. Most of his completions were accumulated off quick rhythm plays that allowed him to catch the snap, rock and throw from the shotgun.

Although Weeden's statline certainly is impressive when you look at the numbers (399 pass yards with three touchdowns and one interception), the overall performance will lead to more questions than answers in the minds of evaluators.

» Stanford's Jonathan Martin and David DeCastro are two of the best offensive linemen in college football. This certainly is not news in the scouting community, but I'm even more convinced after watching the duo operate in person. Both possess the size and strength dimensions that scouts covet, but are also polished in the technical aspects of their respective positions.

Martin, who plays left tackle and has already declared his intention to apply for the draft, is an athletic people-mover with outstanding feet. He excels on the edge and displays outstanding skills working to the second level in the running game. Although his game is more finesse than power, he routinely swallows up defenders to create seams for the Cardinal runners. In pass protection, his exceptional movement skills allowed him to effectively shadow agile rushers off the edge. This was important to witness first-hand due to his occasional struggles against speedy pass rushers during the season. Scouts believe his flaws are certainly correctable with more experience and repetition, and I'm in agreement after watching him play at a high level against Oklahoma State.

DeCastro is a dominant interior blocker with all of the grit and toughness that coaches covet in guard prospects. He is tenacious at the point of attack, and combines his intensity with a technically sound game that has few noticeable flaws. He overwhelms defensive tackles at the point of attack on power plays but also displays the agility and awareness to thrive in a movement-based scheme. His ability to pull and punish is rare, and coaches will love adding his unique skills to their respective lineups.
 
'EBF said:
You would be lucky to get a Rudi or Benson career out of a 1.04-1.06 rookie pick. I don't buy the comparison though. Martin is faster than either of those players and a much more accomplished pass catcher. He probably doesn't run a 4.3, but watch the highlights. He is never caught from behind in the open field. Defensive backs are unable to close the gap at all when he hits full stride. That means he has above average speed for 215 pound workhorse back. He will likely run a 4.4 IMO. Guys who are a stocky 215 pounds with 4.4 speed, excellent production, power, versatility, and quickness don't grow on trees, even in the NFL. I don't think Martin is quite good enough to be a first round lock, but he is better than some are giving him credit for. The NFL is full of guys like Arian Foster, Rashard Mendenhall, Ray Rice, Matt Forte, Ryan Mathews, and Frank Gore who have had great careers without being elite in any measurable category. I could definitely see Martin yielding similar results if given an opportunity to play. Purely in terms of this draft class, the reason I have him as the #2 RB is because he doesn't have any weaknesses. David Wilson (my tentative #3 right now) is small. Lamar Miller lacks power and doesn't seem very good at making people miss in the open field. Bernard Pierce has a more upright build and less explosiveness. Having said that, Martin is the type of player whose rookie draft position will hinge on his landing spot. He will not be taken ahead of Richardson or Blackmon in PPR leagues. If he lands in a starting role, the 1.03-1.06 slots are in play. Otherwise he could fall pretty far. Luck and Griffin are great, but people rarely use top 4 rookie picks on quarterbacks and will always reach for RBs who land in favorable situations.
I like him the more I watch him EBF. I'm thinking he reminds me of a more athletic/versatile Mark Ingram. They both have that same stocky body and extra yards after contact. But Martin has more elusiveness and explosiveness.
 
He's a good guy for a team to draft and push their under-performing starter. If Cleveland doesn't get RG3 I think Weeden would be a good pick for them in the 3rd or 4th.

» Brandon Weeden has tremendous physical tools, but is not an elite quarterback prospect. That's not to suggest that the Oklahoma State QB isn't worthy of consideration during the second or third rounds, but he must correct several aspects of his game to develop into quality starter as a pro.From game management to decision-making, he doesn't display a high football IQ when operating from the pocket. This was readily apparent when watching him routinely throw balls into coverage despite having other receivers available within his sight line. While some of his questionable decisions could be attributed to poor play calls against some of the defensive looks, most were the result of Weeden failing to correctly diagnose the coverage and hit the open receiver. He appears to predetermine where he is going with the ball prior to the snap and doesn't show the ability to adjust if his primary option is covered.In seeing his flaws in person, I'm concerned about his ability to decipher complex coverage as a pro and direct an offense that features more sophisticated concepts than the Cowboys' version of the spread. Most of his completions were accumulated off quick rhythm plays that allowed him to catch the snap, rock and throw from the shotgun.Although Weeden's statline certainly is impressive when you look at the numbers (399 pass yards with three touchdowns and one interception), the overall performance will lead to more questions than answers in the minds of evaluators.
 
'EBF said:
Purely in terms of this draft class, the reason I have him as the #2 RB is because he doesn't have any weaknesses. David Wilson (my tentative #3 right now) is small. Lamar Miller lacks power and doesn't seem very good at making people miss in the open field. Bernard Pierce has a more upright build and less explosiveness.
Curious to find out where you have Chris Polk ranked at the moment?
 
'EBF said:
Purely in terms of this draft class, the reason I have him as the #2 RB is because he doesn't have any weaknesses. David Wilson (my tentative #3 right now) is small. Lamar Miller lacks power and doesn't seem very good at making people miss in the open field. Bernard Pierce has a more upright build and less explosiveness.
Curious to find out where you have Chris Polk ranked at the moment?
I tentatively have him at RB5 right now. He could drop if Stepfan Taylor declares and/or if Montee Ball changes his mind. I've never been a big fan of Polk's game. On paper he has the dimensions and the production, and a lot of sites list him as a top RB prospect, but I'm just not totally sold. I can't pinpoint why. He just doesn't stand out to me.
 
'EBF said:
Purely in terms of this draft class, the reason I have him as the #2 RB is because he doesn't have any weaknesses. David Wilson (my tentative #3 right now) is small. Lamar Miller lacks power and doesn't seem very good at making people miss in the open field. Bernard Pierce has a more upright build and less explosiveness.
Curious to find out where you have Chris Polk ranked at the moment?
I tentatively have him at RB5 right now. He could drop if Stepfan Taylor declares and/or if Montee Ball changes his mind. I've never been a big fan of Polk's game. On paper he has the dimensions and the production, and a lot of sites list him as a top RB prospect, but I'm just not totally sold. I can't pinpoint why. He just doesn't stand out to me.
I'd probably just stop visiting those site. :shock:
 
'EBF said:
Purely in terms of this draft class, the reason I have him as the #2 RB is because he doesn't have any weaknesses. David Wilson (my tentative #3 right now) is small. Lamar Miller lacks power and doesn't seem very good at making people miss in the open field. Bernard Pierce has a more upright build and less explosiveness.
Curious to find out where you have Chris Polk ranked at the moment?
I tentatively have him at RB5 right now. He could drop if Stepfan Taylor declares and/or if Montee Ball changes his mind. I've never been a big fan of Polk's game. On paper he has the dimensions and the production, and a lot of sites list him as a top RB prospect, but I'm just not totally sold. I can't pinpoint why. He just doesn't stand out to me.
When I watched the bowl game at a below average tackling Baylor defense, Polk did not seem to break very many. He got what was blocked including a long TD run, but while I did not 'chart" or anything his ability to make dudes miss or just power through seemed lacking.
 
I'm starting to put together my rankings and right now it looks like Doug Martin will be my #2 RB. David Wilson, Lamar Miller, Bernard Pierce, and LaMichael James all do some things well, but none of them stands out to me as much as Martin, who has no obvious weaknesses. I wonder how high he'll go. Russ Lande has him as a late first rounder while Draft Scout has him on the border of the 2nd/3rd rounds. I'm guessing he'll end up somewhere in the middle of those two poles.

I see the DeAngelo in his style, but I'm thinking he looks more like a DeMarco Murray trapped in a LeSean McCoy body.
 
'EBF said:
Purely in terms of this draft class, the reason I have him as the #2 RB is because he doesn't have any weaknesses. David Wilson (my tentative #3 right now) is small. Lamar Miller lacks power and doesn't seem very good at making people miss in the open field. Bernard Pierce has a more upright build and less explosiveness.
Curious to find out where you have Chris Polk ranked at the moment?
I tentatively have him at RB5 right now. He could drop if Stepfan Taylor declares and/or if Montee Ball changes his mind. I've never been a big fan of Polk's game. On paper he has the dimensions and the production, and a lot of sites list him as a top RB prospect, but I'm just not totally sold. I can't pinpoint why. He just doesn't stand out to me.
When I watched the bowl game at a below average tackling Baylor defense, Polk did not seem to break very many. He got what was blocked including a long TD run, but while I did not 'chart" or anything his ability to make dudes miss or just power through seemed lacking.
Mentally, I have him pigeonholed as a poor man's Matt Forte. If he's 90% of Matt Forte, then I have a roster spot for him, but if he's 75% Forte, no thanks.
 
'EBF said:
Purely in terms of this draft class, the reason I have him as the #2 RB is because he doesn't have any weaknesses. David Wilson (my tentative #3 right now) is small. Lamar Miller lacks power and doesn't seem very good at making people miss in the open field. Bernard Pierce has a more upright build and less explosiveness.
Curious to find out where you have Chris Polk ranked at the moment?
I tentatively have him at RB5 right now. He could drop if Stepfan Taylor declares and/or if Montee Ball changes his mind. I've never been a big fan of Polk's game. On paper he has the dimensions and the production, and a lot of sites list him as a top RB prospect, but I'm just not totally sold. I can't pinpoint why. He just doesn't stand out to me.
When I watched the bowl game at a below average tackling Baylor defense, Polk did not seem to break very many. He got what was blocked including a long TD run, but while I did not 'chart" or anything his ability to make dudes miss or just power through seemed lacking.
The thing that I like about Polk is his ability to catch the ball. More and more of the good RBs in the NFL have that ability and Polk's got it. Washington's O-Line is pretty bad so it's easy to bottle him up but I think behind a good line he can be a quality starter.
 
I see the DeAngelo in his style, but I'm thinking he looks more like a DeMarco Murray trapped in a LeSean McCoy body.
Martin's body is nothing like McCoy's.
During the game, they said 5'9" and 208. That's pretty close in actual dimentions and in build to Ray Rice. Rice has put on 10 lbs easy since being drafted, and Martin seems to have the same build. Good, low center of gravity with a thick lower body and good muscle tone. Rice/Gore is more the style I see in him, but he lacks elite attributes I saw in those guys. Rice was maybe the best RB I have scouted (not that I've been doing this very long) at vision through the line and setting up the 2nd/3rd guy a la Marshall Faulk. Rice was also the most efficient RB I've seen, in that he knew where the most yardage was to be found and when the play was over and it was time to truck a CB or get down. His patience in utilizing his blockers was also top notch, and the mental game was head and shoulders above the rest where Chris Johnson and McFadden were the measurable guys, Rice was the chess master. I just say this to refute those that say Rice was not elite in any mearsuable, and I agree, but that is an elite attribute. I see Martin as very good in this respect, but nowhere close to the class of Rice. He rips arm tackles like Rice did. He is a tad more agile and elusive than Rice, but Rice is very slippery upon contact. Martin may have a slight edge in outright speed, but very close. I see Martin as Ray Rice light - and by light I mean if Rice is 180 calories, Martin is 150. I think he is a future starter, but I don't believe he is a future star. Production wise, I expect better than Shonn Greene but I don't see a future top 5 FFB RB like I did Rice.
 
'EBF said:
You would be lucky to get a Rudi or Benson career out of a 1.04-1.06 rookie pick. I don't buy the comparison though. Martin is faster than either of those players and a much more accomplished pass catcher. He probably doesn't run a 4.3, but watch the highlights. He is never caught from behind in the open field. Defensive backs are unable to close the gap at all when he hits full stride. That means he has above average speed for 215 pound workhorse back. He will likely run a 4.4 IMO. Guys who are a stocky 215 pounds with 4.4 speed, excellent production, power, versatility, and quickness don't grow on trees, even in the NFL. I don't think Martin is quite good enough to be a first round lock, but he is better than some are giving him credit for. The NFL is full of guys like Arian Foster, Rashard Mendenhall, Ray Rice, Matt Forte, Ryan Mathews, and Frank Gore who have had great careers without being elite in any measurable category. I could definitely see Martin yielding similar results if given an opportunity to play. Purely in terms of this draft class, the reason I have him as the #2 RB is because he doesn't have any weaknesses. David Wilson (my tentative #3 right now) is small. Lamar Miller lacks power and doesn't seem very good at making people miss in the open field. Bernard Pierce has a more upright build and less explosiveness. Having said that, Martin is the type of player whose rookie draft position will hinge on his landing spot. He will not be taken ahead of Richardson or Blackmon in PPR leagues. If he lands in a starting role, the 1.03-1.06 slots are in play. Otherwise he could fall pretty far. Luck and Griffin are great, but people rarely use top 4 rookie picks on quarterbacks and will always reach for RBs who land in favorable situations.
Agreed, not sure what people are looking at. He's the real deal.
 
Weekend bowl games don't boast top prospects, but have talent

Tony Pauline

Posted: Thursday January 5, 2012 5:16PM ; Updated: Thursday January 5, 2012 5:19PM

Excerpts on the offensive skill positions (projected NFL draft round at the end of each player summary):

Jarius Wright, WR (No. 4) -- The Razorbacks receiver impressed NFL scouts this season by putting together a complete game. Wright was the Arkansas' go-to receiver (team-best 63 receptions), their top deep threat (16.3 yards per catch) and the No. 1 red zone target (11 touchdowns). He possesses the substance and style to be a lethal slot receiver at the next level. 3rd Round

Joe Adams, WR (No. 3) -- Adams is not as fast as Wright, nor as productive, but proved to be a devastating return specialist. His average of 16.3 yards on 16 punt returns looks even more impressive considering three were brought back for scores. Adams is another prospective slot receiver whose bread and butter will be made on special teams. 4th Round

J.J. McDermott, QB (No. 15) -- The New Mexico State transfer took over the starting job during the first game of the year and really caught fire the next eight weeks. McDermott is still a bit rough around the edges, but he has NFL size and arm strength. 7th Round



Chandler Harnish, QB (No. 12) -- Harnish is one of the most prolific dual-threat quarterbacks in the nation. He led NIU on the ground with 1,382 rushing yards, complimenting his 2,942 passing yards. His touchdown-to-interception ratio of 26-to-5 is telling of both his accuracy and decision-making. Harnish is one of the best-kept secrets at quarterback, and most scouts think he'll make a dash up draft boards as we move toward April's draft. 4th Round

Nate Palmer, WR (No. 81) -- Palmer is a terrific receiver in all aspects, and the favorite target of Harnish. Outstanding in the underneath passing game, he also displays deceptive speed as well as reliable hands. Palmer is underrated and a potential fourth or fifth receiver in the NFL. 7th Round
 
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