[DYNASTY] Antonio Bryant (1 Viewer)

[EBF]

I don't think Bryant is a lock to make much noise in 2006, but I can't believe how low he is on the FBG dynasty rankings. He's been productive on some very bad teams in some very bad situations. He now seems poised to take over the WR1 duties in San Francisco. I suppose some people think Battle will claim that job, but I don't think you'll find many 49er homers who think Arnaz is the answer. Bryant has more talent and should be more productive.

Despite his credentials, he's only ranked 45th by FBGs. Here are some of the players ranked ahead of him:

Ernest Wilford - Has never had a 1,000 yard season and will have to battle two 23 year-old former first-round picks for targets (not to mention a power forward of a TE).

Keyshawn Johnson - Almost 34 years-old and the #2 WR on a team that likes to run the ball.

David Givens - Has never had more than 900 receiving yards in any of his four NFL seasons. In a similar situation as Bryant with an inferior track record.

Santonio Holmes - A nice prospect, but Bryant has a similar pedigree and has already proven to be effective in the NFL.

Terry Glenn - An old WR2 with a coach that likes to run.

Some of the above players might be a better play than Bryant in 2006, but I don't think taking them ahead of AB is justified in a dynasty draft. I really can't believe how low some of the staff members have Bryant on their lists. Cecil Lammey has him at 63. Jeff Pasquino has him at 75. That puts him behind the likes of Justin McCareins, Michael Jenkins, Cedrick Wilson, Sinorice Moss, Joe Jurevicius, Brandon Lloyd, and a handful of other guys who appear to have lukewarm long-term prospects.

Bryant is certainly not a superstar and I can understand some skepticism given the poor quality of his team and his track record of character issues. Nevertheless, he's ranked awfully low for a developing WR with a history of decent production and an opportunity to become his team's top target.

 

[EBF]

Here's something mildly interesting:

Donte Stallworth career numbers:

2002 - 13 games - 42 catches, 594 yards, 8 TDs

2003 - 11 games - 25 catches, 485 yards, 3 TDs

2004 - 16 games - 58 catches, 767 yards, 5 TDs

2005 - 16 games - 70 catches, 945 yards, 7 TDs

Antonio Bryant career numbers:

2002 - 16 games - 44 catches, 733 yards, 6 TDs

2003 - 16 games - 39 catches, 550 yards, 2 TDs

2004 - 15 games - 58 catches, 812 yards, 4 TDs

2005 - 16 games - 69 catches, 1009 yards, 4 TDs

Bryant has had more catches and receiving yards every year that these two have been in the league, but Stallworth is ranked 24 slots higher on the dynasty WR list. That strikes me as being a little off.

 

[wannabee]

Two thinks I think you conveniently left out:

Bryant is switching teams. Many WRs find it difficult to perform at a high level with the new team. Last year with Cleve was an ok year, but not to the level of your post.

Bryant is in SF. Have you forgotten? What passing stats do you project for Smith/Dilfer? I cannot see numbers being high enough to make Bryant as viable as you think he is. Many you claim are worse than Bryant might actually be worse in talent, but their situation more thn makes up for it.

 

[EBF]

Two thinks I think you conveniently left out:

Bryant is switching teams. Many WRs find it difficult to perform at a high level with the new team. Last year with Cleve was an ok year, but not to the level of your post.

We're talking dynasty here. Are you going to write off TO because he's changing teams? Javon Walker? I understand a slight downgrade, but nothing this severe.

Bryant is in SF. Have you forgotten? What passing stats do you project for Smith/Dilfer? I cannot see numbers being high enough to make Bryant as viable as you think he is. Many you claim are worse than Bryant might actually be worse in talent, but their situation more thn makes up for it.

He's 25. I figure his QB situation isn't always going to be horrible. On the flipside, Bryant has minimal competition for the WR1 role. Brandon Williams and Arnaz Battle don't strike fear into anyone's heart.

 

[wannabee]

Two thinks I think you conveniently left out:

Bryant is switching teams.  Many WRs find it difficult to perform at a high level with the new team.  Last year with Cleve was an ok year, but not to the level of your post.

We're talking dynasty here. Are you going to write off TO because he's changing teams? Javon Walker? I understand a slight downgrade, but nothing this severe.

Bryant is in SF.  Have you forgotten?  What passing stats do you project for Smith/Dilfer? I cannot see numbers being high enough to make Bryant as viable as you think he is.  Many you claim are worse than Bryant might actually be worse in talent, but their situation more thn makes up for it.

He's 25. I figure his QB situation isn't always going to be horrible. On the flipside, Bryant has minimal competition for the WR1 role. Brandon Williams and Arnaz Battle don't strike fear into anyone's heart.

I will not argue his talent or upside. But, even in dynasty, his QB will limit him severely. And, it might take several years for the QB situation to change. In addition, many (not me) think Davis will be in effect the best receiving option.With all of his talent, and the dirth of wr talent in Cleve, why did they let him go since he is a young stud WR? I might be inclined to think there is a reason we do not know about.

 

[EBF]

I will not argue his talent or upside. But, even in dynasty, his QB will limit him severely. And, it might take several years for the QB situation to change.

Maybe, but Smith was the #1 pick. Bryant did a lot better than WR45 when Dilfer was at the helm for Cleveland.

In addition, many (not me) think Davis will be in effect the best receiving option.

That's a definite possibility, but good TEs and WRs can coexist (Burress/Shockey, Mason/Heap, Kennison/Gonzalez, McCardell/Gates).

With all of his talent, and the dirth of wr talent in Cleve, why did they let him go since he is a young stud WR? I might be inclined to think there is a reason we do not know about.

I heard they thought he was consistent. I also heard they were worried about his character.

 

[Jeff Pasquino]

Here's something mildly interesting:

Donte Stallworth career numbers:

2002 - 13 games - 42 catches, 594 yards, 8 TDs

2003 - 11 games - 25 catches, 485 yards, 3 TDs

2004 - 16 games - 58 catches, 767 yards, 5 TDs

2005 - 16 games - 70 catches, 945 yards, 7 TDs

Antonio Bryant career numbers:

2002 - 16 games - 44 catches, 733 yards, 6 TDs

2003 - 16 games - 39 catches, 550 yards, 2 TDs

2004 - 15 games - 58 catches, 812 yards, 4 TDs

2005 - 16 games - 69 catches, 1009 yards, 4 TDs

Bryant has had more catches and receiving yards every year that these two have been in the league, but Stallworth is ranked 24 slots higher on the dynasty WR list. That strikes me as being a little off.

Hi EBF,Sorry you don't approve of the ranking, but this is a testament more towards the passing game in SF than anything about Bryant.

This has everything to do with the difference:

QB in New Orleans: Drew Brees. Pro-Bowl QB.

QB in San Francisco: Alex Smith. High draft pick in 2005. Not much since.

Most of the Dynasty Guys here at FBG have Bryant as the #1 WR over Battle. Lammey and I have it the other way around.

Given that the Niners just added the #1 TE in the draft, I say he becomes the primary target. Now Battle becomes the most experienced starting WR in SF, and has worked with Smith and the rest of the offense for a year. That makes him the clear #1 in SF at WR IMHO. That puts Bryant as the third option on a team that was 26th last year in passing with less than 1900 total yards passing.

If Davis gets 500 yards and Battle gets about 750 (Lloyd had 700+ last season) that leaves little more than 700 for Bryant, and that gives all the RBs and other receivers nothing.

Put another way, SF had 1900 passing yards last season, with WR1 and WR2 getting almost 1100 yards. Boosting both numbers an ample 20%, that gives WR1 and WR2 1320 yards. Seeing as I have Battle getting 700+, I don't see Bryant getting more that about 600-650 yards max. The 20% is best case, and the TE should be a far bigger contributor in SF this year. Best case scenario has Bryant getting 700 yards and 4-6 TDs. He was far better off in Cleveland.

 

[Jeff Pasquino]

It appears that some of my points were covered while I was posting.

Oh well - nice posting Wannabee.

 

[EBF]

Here's something mildly interesting:

Donte Stallworth career numbers:

2002 - 13 games - 42 catches, 594 yards, 8 TDs

2003 - 11 games - 25 catches, 485 yards, 3 TDs

2004 - 16 games - 58 catches, 767 yards, 5 TDs

2005 - 16 games - 70 catches, 945 yards, 7 TDs

Antonio Bryant career numbers:

2002 - 16 games - 44 catches, 733 yards, 6 TDs

2003 - 16 games - 39 catches, 550 yards, 2 TDs

2004 - 15 games - 58 catches, 812 yards, 4 TDs

2005 - 16 games - 69 catches, 1009 yards, 4 TDs

Bryant has had more catches and receiving yards every year that these two have been in the league, but Stallworth is ranked 24 slots higher on the dynasty WR list. That strikes me as being a little off.

Hi EBF,Sorry you don't approve of the ranking, but this is a testament more towards the passing game in SF than anything about Bryant.

This has everything to do with the difference:

QB in New Orleans: Drew Brees. Pro-Bowl QB.

QB in San Francisco: Alex Smith. High draft pick in 2005. Not much since.

Most of the Dynasty Guys here at FBG have Bryant as the #1 WR over Battle. Lammey and I have it the other way around.

Given that the Niners just added the #1 TE in the draft, I say he becomes the primary target. Now Battle becomes the most experienced starting WR in SF, and has worked with Smith and the rest of the offense for a year. That makes him the clear #1 in SF at WR IMHO. That puts Bryant as the third option on a team that was 26th last year in passing with less than 1900 total yards passing.

If Davis gets 500 yards and Battle gets about 750 (Lloyd had 700+ last season) that leaves little more than 700 for Bryant, and that gives all the RBs and other receivers nothing.

Put another way, SF had 1900 passing yards last season, with WR1 and WR2 getting almost 1100 yards. Boosting both numbers an ample 20%, that gives WR1 and WR2 1320 yards. Seeing as I have Battle getting 700+, I don't see Bryant getting more that about 600-650 yards max. The 20% is best case, and the TE should be a far bigger contributor in SF this year. Best case scenario has Bryant getting 700 yards and 4-6 TDs. He was far better off in Cleveland.

What about future seasons? These are dynasty rankings and the guy is only 25. Do you really think 74 WRs are going to score more fantasy points over the next 3-4 years?

 

[Jeff Pasquino]

Here's something mildly interesting:

Donte Stallworth career numbers:

2002 - 13 games - 42 catches, 594 yards, 8 TDs

2003 - 11 games - 25 catches, 485 yards, 3 TDs

2004 - 16 games - 58 catches, 767 yards, 5 TDs

2005 - 16 games - 70 catches, 945 yards, 7 TDs

Antonio Bryant career numbers:

2002 - 16 games - 44 catches, 733 yards, 6 TDs

2003 - 16 games - 39 catches, 550 yards, 2 TDs

2004 - 15 games - 58 catches, 812 yards, 4 TDs

2005 - 16 games - 69 catches, 1009 yards, 4 TDs

Bryant has had more catches and receiving yards every year that these two have been in the league, but Stallworth is ranked 24 slots higher on the dynasty WR list. That strikes me as being a little off.

Hi EBF,Sorry you don't approve of the ranking, but this is a testament more towards the passing game in SF than anything about Bryant.

This has everything to do with the difference:

QB in New Orleans: Drew Brees. Pro-Bowl QB.

QB in San Francisco: Alex Smith. High draft pick in 2005. Not much since.

Most of the Dynasty Guys here at FBG have Bryant as the #1 WR over Battle. Lammey and I have it the other way around.

Given that the Niners just added the #1 TE in the draft, I say he becomes the primary target. Now Battle becomes the most experienced starting WR in SF, and has worked with Smith and the rest of the offense for a year. That makes him the clear #1 in SF at WR IMHO. That puts Bryant as the third option on a team that was 26th last year in passing with less than 1900 total yards passing.

If Davis gets 500 yards and Battle gets about 750 (Lloyd had 700+ last season) that leaves little more than 700 for Bryant, and that gives all the RBs and other receivers nothing.

Put another way, SF had 1900 passing yards last season, with WR1 and WR2 getting almost 1100 yards. Boosting both numbers an ample 20%, that gives WR1 and WR2 1320 yards. Seeing as I have Battle getting 700+, I don't see Bryant getting more that about 600-650 yards max. The 20% is best case, and the TE should be a far bigger contributor in SF this year. Best case scenario has Bryant getting 700 yards and 4-6 TDs. He was far better off in Cleveland.

What about future seasons? These are dynasty rankings and the guy is only 25. Do you really think 74 WRs are going to score more fantasy points over the next 3-4 years?

The average NFL career is 4.5 years for a WR. This will be his 5th year, and the first in a new 4-year contract in SF with a questionable offense and QB.So, yes, I don't see him improving much. I doubt he cracks the Top 50.

By the way - I have him 74th, not 75th. If he shines in the preseason, he could go all the way up in to the 60s, but I don't see him making Top 50.

 

[EBF]

The average NFL career is 4.5 years for a WR.  This will be his 5th year, and the first in a new 4-year contract in SF with a questionable offense and QB.

So, yes, I don't see him improving much.  I doubt he cracks the Top 50.

By the way - I have him 74th, not 75th.  If he shines in the preseason, he could go all the way up in to the 60s, but I don't see him making Top 50.

I'd be curious to see Bryant's end-of-year ranking in WCOFF scoring for each season of his career. I suspect he's never finished as low as WR74 despite having played with a revolving door of scrub QBs. I think you're making a few mistakes with this ranking:

1. Severely underrating Bryant's talent. Is he a Pro Bowl caliber WR? Probably not, but he was a superstar in college and he's been one of the most productive WRs from his draft class. Mentioning the average career length is a bit silly. There's no indication that he's in any danger of washing out any time soon. He's coming off his best statistical season as a pro. At only 25 years old, it's quite possible that he's still improving.

2. Overrating Arnaz Battle. Battle has 32 career catches. He did fairly well when healthy last year, but I think it's a major stretch to assume that he'll be the team's most productive WR. He's done absolutely nothing to prove that he can handle WR1 duties.

3. Placing far too much emphasis on the short-term situation in San Francisco. I highly doubt that the 49ers are going to throw for 1,900 yards for each of the next few years. Last year was the floor of what they're capable of. I'm guessing that their passing numbers will approach the league average by 2007 or 2008.

Again, I don't think Bryant is a star, but I do think some of these low rankings for him are baffling. He definitely represents good value if you can get him as the 45th WR in your dynasty draft.

 

[cstu]

I hereby give EBF the rights to argue my case for Bryant, who I agree is severly under-rated. The guy is 25, hitting his prime as a WR, and has the #1 overall QB coming into his 2nd year - who by the way only turned 22 a couple weeks ago.

 

[brakeyawself]

Im on the bandwagon for this guy this year. Anyone want to join? And, I do think HE has the talent to be a pro bowl reciever. His situation is another story. But if Smith progresses like its looking he is, I say he'll be a solid number 2 receiver in deep leagues for at minimum. I think he may be this years chris chambers. yay.

 

[Jackal]

i just shipped him off this morning along with stallworth for a no.1 pick next year. i really did'nt want to give him up as i think he will do very well in the next couple of years. i think he is a lock for 1000 and 5 this year, with the potential to go up next year when they get another receiver alongside of him to take the pressure off. brandon lloyd had what 800-900 yards last year? bryant easily topps it.

 

[brakeyawself]

i just shipped him off this morning along with stallworth for a no.1 pick next year. i really did'nt want to give him up as i think he will do very well in the next couple of years. i think he is a lock for 1000 and 5 this year, with the potential to go up next year when they get another receiver alongside of him to take the pressure off. brandon lloyd had what 800-900 yards last year? bryant easily topps it.

I agree, all though I think you got the better end of that deal. Stallworth and bryant are close in my book, and horns getting real real old. Add that to the number 1 pick, and id say you made out nice. STill like bryant better than stallworth though.

 

[lord_helmet]

The Pasquino guy has clearly fallen off the planet on this one, Bryant is clearly underrated... Lower than McCareins ?!? Gimme a friggin break

 

[brakeyawself]

The Pasquino guy has clearly fallen off the planet on this one, Bryant is clearly underrated... Lower than McCareins ?!? Gimme a friggin break

yea i certainly dont get that one. jeffs usually on the ball. but mcareins, well... i think he sucks. Isnt Cotchery set to start now?

 

[wannabee]

The Pasquino guy has clearly fallen off the planet on this one, Bryant is clearly underrated... Lower than McCareins ?!? Gimme a friggin break

yea i certainly dont get that one. jeffs usually on the ball. but mcareins, well... i think he sucks. Isnt Cotchery set to start now?

before you start throwing jabs, you might check the dates. Jeff said that in May. Keep that in mind.

 

[brakeyawself]

The Pasquino guy has clearly fallen off the planet on this one, Bryant is clearly underrated... Lower than McCareins ?!? Gimme a friggin break

yea i certainly dont get that one. jeffs usually on the ball. but mcareins, well... i think he sucks. Isnt Cotchery set to start now?

before you start throwing jabs, you might check the dates. Jeff said that in May. Keep that in mind.

ahhh, sorry. wasnt throwing jabs his way at all. didnt see that list myself, just thought it was a curious ranking. now that i know it was in may, it all makes more sense.

 

[lord_helmet]

I'll admit I didn't catch the dates on this post, but even for may this is outragous

 

[Bizkiteer]

The Pasquino guy has clearly fallen off the planet on this one, Bryant is clearly underrated... Lower than McCareins ?!? Gimme a friggin break

yea i certainly dont get that one. jeffs usually on the ball. but mcareins, well... i think he sucks. Isnt Cotchery set to start now?

before you start throwing jabs, you might check the dates. Jeff said that in May. Keep that in mind.

Why is the last time he updated his rankings in May? Is he not supposed to give more up to date rankings or are they done quarterly? He can question anything that they do, if he pays for the site...he can. He's allowed to have an opinion and it's not going to crumble the FBG world if they hear it. I'm sure Joe, David and the rest of them wouldn't just want to hear praise, but things they can work on.

 

[Tick]

22nd on my list, ahead of everyone else EBF mentioned in the first two posts. Somehow I don't own him in any league, though.

 

[Tick]

Why is the last time he updated his rankings in May? Is he not supposed to give more up to date rankings or are they done quarterly?

It was a feature added this offseason. I'm not sure they get any extra pay for it. I'd be thankful for what we've got - if you want to filter out old rankings, they put in that functionality.

 

[wannabee]

The Pasquino guy has clearly fallen off the planet on this one, Bryant is clearly underrated... Lower than McCareins ?!? Gimme a friggin break

yea i certainly dont get that one. jeffs usually on the ball. but mcareins, well... i think he sucks. Isnt Cotchery set to start now?

before you start throwing jabs, you might check the dates. Jeff said that in May. Keep that in mind.

Why is the last time he updated his rankings in May? Is he not supposed to give more up to date rankings or are they done quarterly? He can question anything that they do, if he pays for the site...he can. He's allowed to have an opinion and it's not going to crumble the FBG world if they hear it. I'm sure Joe, David and the rest of them wouldn't just want to hear praise, but things they can work on.

reading comp down?They are referring to Jeff's comments in this thread he made 3 months ago and acting like he said those today. If people like Bryant, cool, just it seems to bust on a guy for comments made three months ago ... especially the way that preseason action changes opinions so much.If you disagree with Jeff's rankings ask him about it. And the kudos should be on EBF for driving the bandwagon .....

 

[brakeyawself]

The Pasquino guy has clearly fallen off the planet on this one, Bryant is clearly underrated... Lower than McCareins ?!? Gimme a friggin break

yea i certainly dont get that one. jeffs usually on the ball. but mcareins, well... i think he sucks. Isnt Cotchery set to start now?

before you start throwing jabs, you might check the dates. Jeff said that in May. Keep that in mind.

Why is the last time he updated his rankings in May? Is he not supposed to give more up to date rankings or are they done quarterly? He can question anything that they do, if he pays for the site...he can. He's allowed to have an opinion and it's not going to crumble the FBG world if they hear it. I'm sure Joe, David and the rest of them wouldn't just want to hear praise, but things they can work on.

reading comp down?They are referring to Jeff's comments in this thread he made 3 months ago and acting like he said those today. If people like Bryant, cool, just it seems to bust on a guy for comments made three months ago ... especially the way that preseason action changes opinions so much.If you disagree with Jeff's rankings ask him about it. And the kudos should be on EBF for driving the bandwagon .....

Wannabee i love you. I only started here a month or so ago and i dont really bust on anyone, ever. I do question however. And i cant speak for LordHelmut, but i found that ranking of mccareins odd, even in may. all though the fact that i found out it was in may, makes a lot more sense, and i can see how jeff would set that ranking to SOME extent. I think JEff does an amazing job around here, its just a difference of opinion. I Would like to see Jeffs newer rankings too. And, great job EBF, im with you 100 percent.

 

[wannabee]

The Pasquino guy has clearly fallen off the planet on this one, Bryant is clearly underrated... Lower than McCareins ?!? Gimme a friggin break

yea i certainly dont get that one. jeffs usually on the ball. but mcareins, well... i think he sucks. Isnt Cotchery set to start now?

before you start throwing jabs, you might check the dates. Jeff said that in May. Keep that in mind.

Why is the last time he updated his rankings in May? Is he not supposed to give more up to date rankings or are they done quarterly? He can question anything that they do, if he pays for the site...he can. He's allowed to have an opinion and it's not going to crumble the FBG world if they hear it. I'm sure Joe, David and the rest of them wouldn't just want to hear praise, but things they can work on.

reading comp down?They are referring to Jeff's comments in this thread he made 3 months ago and acting like he said those today. If people like Bryant, cool, just it seems to bust on a guy for comments made three months ago ... especially the way that preseason action changes opinions so much.If you disagree with Jeff's rankings ask him about it. And the kudos should be on EBF for driving the bandwagon .....

Wannabee i love you. I only started here a month or so ago and i dont really bust on anyone, ever. I do question however. And i cant speak for LordHelmut, but i found that ranking of mccareins odd, even in may. all though the fact that i found out it was in may, makes a lot more sense, and i can see how jeff would set that ranking to SOME extent. I think JEff does an amazing job around here, its just a difference of opinion. I Would like to see Jeffs newer rankings too. And, great job EBF, im with you 100 percent.

Hey, man ... thanks. My comments were to the above poster. All I was doing was pointing out the date of his post. This happens a lot here at fbg. Older threads are bumped. I am not trying to defend Jeff. He can do that himself. But, as often as some of us post, and post opinions, I realize that it is not wise to knowingly take pot shots at posters/staff for comments 3 months old. I am sure many can do a search and find stuff of mine from May that would look different now. Just the way it is. Again, props to EBF .....

 

[thecatch]

Given that the Niners just added the #1 TE in the draft, I say he becomes the primary target. Now Battle becomes the most experienced starting WR in SF, and has worked with Smith and the rest of the offense for a year. That makes him the clear #1 in SF at WR IMHO. That puts Bryant as the third option on a team that was 26th last year in passing with less than 1900 total yards passing.

I'm not in a hurry to draft Bryant or anything, but as a Niners homer this is not what we've been hearing at all.

 

[brakeyawself]

Given that the Niners just added the #1 TE in the draft, I say he becomes the primary target. Now Battle becomes the most experienced starting WR in SF, and has worked with Smith and the rest of the offense for a year. That makes him the clear #1 in SF at WR IMHO. That puts Bryant as the third option on a team that was 26th last year in passing with less than 1900 total yards passing.

I'm not in a hurry to draft Bryant or anything, but as a Niners homer this is not what we've been hearing at all.

excellent news. and as a niners homer, whats your incite into how bryant is coming along? why not in a hurry to draft him? what are your doubts? any info would be great. trying to learn about this guy more.

 

[thecatch]

Given that the Niners just added the #1 TE in the draft, I say he becomes the primary target. Now Battle becomes the most experienced starting WR in SF, and has worked with Smith and the rest of the offense for a year. That makes him the clear #1 in SF at WR IMHO. That puts Bryant as the third option on a team that was 26th last year in passing with less than 1900 total yards passing.

I'm not in a hurry to draft Bryant or anything, but as a Niners homer this is not what we've been hearing at all.

excellent news. and as a niners homer, whats your incite into how bryant is coming along? why not in a hurry to draft him? what are your doubts? any info would be great. trying to learn about this guy more.

My doubts are that Alex Smith hasn't shown NFL ability in the regular season yet, and unless he improves drastically Bryant will put up numbers similar to Lloyd. From what I've seen/heard though, Bryant is a definite upgrade on Lloyd. Vernon Davis isn't getting the hype that you would expect for a rookie about to be a go to guy in this offense, and indeed most of local TE coverage has been on Eric Johnson. I'd be willing to bet a significant amount that Davis is not going to be the primary target this year.Bryant/Smith definitely seem to be bonding in practice, there is definitely some upside here if those guys can grow together.

 

[brakeyawself]

Given that the Niners just added the #1 TE in the draft, I say he becomes the primary target. Now Battle becomes the most experienced starting WR in SF, and has worked with Smith and the rest of the offense for a year. That makes him the clear #1 in SF at WR IMHO. That puts Bryant as the third option on a team that was 26th last year in passing with less than 1900 total yards passing.

I'm not in a hurry to draft Bryant or anything, but as a Niners homer this is not what we've been hearing at all.

excellent news. and as a niners homer, whats your incite into how bryant is coming along? why not in a hurry to draft him? what are your doubts? any info would be great. trying to learn about this guy more.

My doubts are that Alex Smith hasn't shown NFL ability in the regular season yet, and unless he improves drastically Bryant will put up numbers similar to Lloyd. From what I've seen/heard though, Bryant is a definite upgrade on Lloyd. Vernon Davis isn't getting the hype that you would expect for a rookie about to be a go to guy in this offense, and indeed most of local TE coverage has been on Eric Johnson. I'd be willing to bet a significant amount that Davis is not going to be the primary target this year.Bryant/Smith definitely seem to be bonding in practice, there is definitely some upside here if those guys can grow together.

ahh that makes sense. thanks for the reply.

 

[lord_helmet]

As I posted earlier I didn't see the dates on his replies, I never meant it as a personal attack it just seems like a horrible job on the ranking of that player.

Even for something that was done in May...

 

[lord_helmet]

And the Battle comments ?!?

 

[Holy Schneikes]

He drops the ball a LOT. Nothing physical, just poor concentration. But this is now his 6th year in the league and I don't think he's going to all of the sudden figure out how to avoid dropping the ball.

He was a late 2nd round pick and has performed like a late 2nd round pick. He has talent, but no overwhelming speed and serious attitude issues. Dallas dumped him for basically nothing, and Cleveland didn't seem to be dying to get him back either despite his decent stats.

I guess he's OK if the price is right, but I wouldn't go out of my way to snatch up a 6th year receiver with his credentials.

 

[brakeyawself]

i just traded toomer, grossman, mark bradley, nathan vasher, and jason taylor

for alex smith, bryant, mercedes lewis, and lb daryl smith in a dynasty league.

am i the shark or the guppie?

charles grant is still on the waiver wire, so im just gonna replace taylor with him....

that makes bryant my number 2 reciever. its his 6th year, but hes only 25...im hoping he stops dropping the ball.

 

[jurb26]

He drops the ball a LOT. Nothing physical, just poor concentration. But this is now his 6th year in the league and I don't think he's going to all of the sudden figure out how to avoid dropping the ball.He was a late 2nd round pick and has performed like a late 2nd round pick. He has talent, but no overwhelming speed and serious attitude issues. Dallas dumped him for basically nothing, and Cleveland didn't seem to be dying to get him back either despite his decent stats.I guess he's OK if the price is right, but I wouldn't go out of my way to snatch up a 6th year receiver with his credentials.

For the 2nd year in a row Bryant will prove you wrong HS.

 

[EBF]

i just traded toomer, grossman, mark bradley, nathan vasher, and jason taylor for alex smith, bryant, mercedes lewis, and lb daryl smith in a dynasty league.am i the shark or the guppie?charles grant is still on the waiver wire, so im just gonna replace taylor with him....that makes bryant my number 2 reciever. its his 6th year, but hes only 25...im hoping he stops dropping the ball.

Good deal for you on the offensive side. Bryant will outproduce Toomer in the short term and Bradley in the long term. Marcedes Lewis is valuable in a dynasty. Smith is a better QB prospect than Grossman at this point. You're taking a bit of a hit on the IDP end of this trade, but Grant will be an adequate replacement for an aging Taylor.

 

[Holy Schneikes]

He drops the ball a LOT. Nothing physical, just poor concentration. But this is now his 6th year in the league and I don't think he's going to all of the sudden figure out how to avoid dropping the ball.He was a late 2nd round pick and has performed like a late 2nd round pick. He has talent, but no overwhelming speed and serious attitude issues. Dallas dumped him for basically nothing, and Cleveland didn't seem to be dying to get him back either despite his decent stats.I guess he's OK if the price is right, but I wouldn't go out of my way to snatch up a 6th year receiver with his credentials.

For the 2nd year in a row Bryant will prove you wrong HS.

Actually, I've been saying this for FOUR straight years, every preseason after his rookie year. The hype for Bryant is like a weed, it just keeps coming back. Every year a bunch of guys jump on the bandwagon because of his "superduper potential" and I've been pretty pleased with my results from staying OFF of that particular bandwagon.Yeah, he cracked a 1000 yards last year for the 1st time, but for the majority of the season, his BEST season, the numbers were EASILY something I could live without. He didn't have a 100 yard game until week 17 at home against Baltimore who went 0-8 on the road last year. And as usual, he had more drops than TDs.Maybe you are right. Maybe THIS will finally be the year he puts it all together. Anything's possible. I'm just not going to be one of guys investing heavily in that possibility.

 

[jurb26]

He drops the ball a LOT. Nothing physical, just poor concentration. But this is now his 6th year in the league and I don't think he's going to all of the sudden figure out how to avoid dropping the ball.He was a late 2nd round pick and has performed like a late 2nd round pick. He has talent, but no overwhelming speed and serious attitude issues. Dallas dumped him for basically nothing, and Cleveland didn't seem to be dying to get him back either despite his decent stats.I guess he's OK if the price is right, but I wouldn't go out of my way to snatch up a 6th year receiver with his credentials.

For the 2nd year in a row Bryant will prove you wrong HS.

Actually, I've been saying this for FOUR straight years, every preseason after his rookie year. The hype for Bryant is like a weed, it just keeps coming back. Every year a bunch of guys jump on the bandwagon because of his "superduper potential" and I've been pretty pleased with my results from staying OFF of that particular bandwagon.Yeah, he cracked a 1000 yards last year for the 1st time, but for the majority of the season, his BEST season, the numbers were EASILY something I could live without. He didn't have a 100 yard game until week 17 at home against Baltimore who went 0-8 on the road last year. And as usual, he had more drops than TDs.Maybe you are right. Maybe THIS will finally be the year he puts it all together. Anything's possible. I'm just not going to be one of guys investing heavily in that possibility.

The point to Bryant never has been that he "puts it all together." It's that he outplays his draft position. In dynasty leagues especially last year, if you grabed him you are in awful good shape right now. I only started pimping the guy last year.

 

[Holy Schneikes]

He drops the ball a LOT. Nothing physical, just poor concentration. But this is now his 6th year in the league and I don't think he's going to all of the sudden figure out how to avoid dropping the ball.He was a late 2nd round pick and has performed like a late 2nd round pick. He has talent, but no overwhelming speed and serious attitude issues. Dallas dumped him for basically nothing, and Cleveland didn't seem to be dying to get him back either despite his decent stats.I guess he's OK if the price is right, but I wouldn't go out of my way to snatch up a 6th year receiver with his credentials.

For the 2nd year in a row Bryant will prove you wrong HS.

Actually, I've been saying this for FOUR straight years, every preseason after his rookie year. The hype for Bryant is like a weed, it just keeps coming back. Every year a bunch of guys jump on the bandwagon because of his "superduper potential" and I've been pretty pleased with my results from staying OFF of that particular bandwagon.Yeah, he cracked a 1000 yards last year for the 1st time, but for the majority of the season, his BEST season, the numbers were EASILY something I could live without. He didn't have a 100 yard game until week 17 at home against Baltimore who went 0-8 on the road last year. And as usual, he had more drops than TDs.Maybe you are right. Maybe THIS will finally be the year he puts it all together. Anything's possible. I'm just not going to be one of guys investing heavily in that possibility.

The point to Bryant never has been that he "puts it all together." It's that he outplays his draft position. In dynasty leagues especially last year, if you grabed him you are in awful good shape right now. I only started pimping the guy last year.

Did he outplay his draft position last year? Seems to me he was going pretty high in a lot of drafts. Was a 1000 yd 4TD season enough based on his ADP? Dunno. Maybe it was, but if so, it wasn't by a lot. But I DO know that he underperformed his draft position in most other years.

 

[brakeyawself]

Im foolishly going to predict right now, for my own amusement and hopes, that Bryant puts up 1200 and 10 this year, and either the same or better for at least the next 5 years. (I really like what Alex Smith has to offer. He's 22 years old. He looked lost his rookie year, but he was only 21.) In 2 years Im predicting they both make the pro bowl.

If none if this happens, this thread will get lost anyway.

If this does happen, im gonna post a link to this thread for sure.

It all sounds nice right? :crossing fingers:

 

[jurb26]

Did he outplay his draft position last year? Seems to me he was going pretty high in a lot of drafts. Was a 1000 yd 4TD season enough based on his ADP? Dunno. Maybe it was, but if so, it wasn't by a lot. But I DO know that he underperformed his draft position in most other years.

We would have to find a legit ADP from last year but my guess is yes, he did and by a good margin. Actually I would guess Bryant beat his ADP in 3 of 4 years. Again thats just a guess though. Here are his finishes in Standard scoring:

Year		Value		Pos. Rank	Overall Rank--------------------------------------------------2002		   0			32			 842003		   0			69			1532004		   0			38			1032005		   9			25			 61

WR25 last year. Thats a boarderline WR2 and very good WR3. IIRC he was being drafted as a late WR3 or WR4. I know I got him as my WR5 in a couple of leagues and traded for him in a Dynasty league for Calico. At the time I made the trade for Calico, I was laughed at rather good here at FBG.

 

[EBF]

But I DO know that he underperformed his draft position in most other years.

I'd like to see this claim supported by some evidence. As far as I can remember, Bryant has either exceeded or matched his ADP in the majority of his seasons.

 

[Holy Schneikes]

Did he outplay his draft position last year? Seems to me he was going pretty high in a lot of drafts. Was a 1000 yd 4TD season enough based on his ADP? Dunno. Maybe it was, but if so, it wasn't by a lot. But I DO know that he underperformed his draft position in most other years.

We would have to find a legit ADP from last year but my guess is yes, he did and by a good margin. Actually I would guess Bryant beat his ADP in 3 of 4 years. Again thats just a guess though. Here are his finishes in Standard scoring:

Year		Value		Pos. Rank	Overall Rank--------------------------------------------------2002		   0			32			 842003		   0			69			1532004		   0			38			1032005		   9			25			 61

WR25 last year. Thats a boarderline WR2 and very good WR3. IIRC he was being drafted as a late WR3 or WR4. I know I got him as my WR5 in a couple of leagues and traded for him in a Dynasty league for Calico. At the time I made the trade for Calico, I was laughed at rather good here at FBG.

Anybody know his pre-season FBG ranking in 2005? 25 actually sounds about right to me. Just curious.

 

[jurb26]

Did he outplay his draft position last year? Seems to me he was going pretty high in a lot of drafts. Was a 1000 yd 4TD season enough based on his ADP? Dunno. Maybe it was, but if so, it wasn't by a lot. But I DO know that he underperformed his draft position in most other years.

We would have to find a legit ADP from last year but my guess is yes, he did and by a good margin. Actually I would guess Bryant beat his ADP in 3 of 4 years. Again thats just a guess though. Here are his finishes in Standard scoring:

Year		Value		Pos. Rank	Overall Rank--------------------------------------------------2002		   0			32			 842003		   0			69			1532004		   0			38			1032005		   9			25			 61

WR25 last year. Thats a boarderline WR2 and very good WR3. IIRC he was being drafted as a late WR3 or WR4. I know I got him as my WR5 in a couple of leagues and traded for him in a Dynasty league for Calico. At the time I made the trade for Calico, I was laughed at rather good here at FBG.

Anybody know his pre-season FBG ranking in 2005? 25 actually sounds about right to me. Just curious.

Probably only a mod would know now.

 

[switz]

Bryant/Smith definitely seem to be bonding in practice, there is definitely some upside here if those guys can grow together.

Bryant is the type of receiver that can make a young QB look really good. The problem has always been his desire to play. He's a bit of a prima donna, but he's an incredible talent, and clearly the #1 WR in SF.

 

[daveR]

AB has talent, but he's a drive-killer that drops WAY too many passes. Ultimately, this will decide his fate.

 

[tri-man 47]

Hi EBF,

Sorry you don't approve of the ranking, but this is a testament more towards the passing game in SF than anything about Bryant.

This has everything to do with the difference:

QB in New Orleans: Drew Brees. Pro-Bowl QB.

QB in San Francisco: Alex Smith. High draft pick in 2005. Not much since.

Most of the Dynasty Guys here at FBG have Bryant as the #1 WR over Battle. Lammey and I have it the other way around.

Given that the Niners just added the #1 TE in the draft, I say he becomes the primary target. Now Battle becomes the most experienced starting WR in SF, and has worked with Smith and the rest of the offense for a year. That makes him the clear #1 in SF at WR IMHO. That puts Bryant as the third option on a team that was 26th last year in passing with less than 1900 total yards passing.

If Davis gets 500 yards and Battle gets about 750 (Lloyd had 700+ last season) that leaves little more than 700 for Bryant, and that gives all the RBs and other receivers nothing.

Put another way, SF had 1900 passing yards last season, with WR1 and WR2 getting almost 1100 yards. Boosting both numbers an ample 20%, that gives WR1 and WR2 1320 yards. Seeing as I have Battle getting 700+, I don't see Bryant getting more that about 600-650 yards max. The 20% is best case, and the TE should be a far bigger contributor in SF this year. Best case scenario has Bryant getting 700 yards and 4-6 TDs. He was far better off in Cleveland.

Concerning the "ample 20%" ...I looked at 2004 vs 2005 passing yardage of some teams. NYG increased their yardage by 27% last year (young QBs do improve!). Baltimore went up 34%. Arizona went up 54% (WRs matter!). Meanwhile, SF dropped 61% last year, from about 3,100 yards to 1,900. My point is that a 20% change or more is certainly not uncommon. A potentially improved QB, a strong WR, a talented new TE ...I don't believe it's a stretch to expect more than a 20% improvement in San Fran's passing offense. Let's split the middle and say they'll rebound to 2,500 yards - halfway between 2004 and 2005 numbers. That would mean more yardage to spread around to receivers like Bryant.

If Bryant has matured and can grow with the SF offense - yeah, he could be a great dynasty pick-up.

 

[amnesiac]

1. ssshhhhhhhh

2. i wanted the Browns to keep him. the only reason i ever heard that they let him go was that he wanted more money that what Savage wanted to pay him. keep in mind, they already had (in their minds, at least) a WR #1, and i'm guessing they didn't want to pay a WR #1A.

3. dude has changed teams before, and was able to be effective almost immediately, and it may have already been mentioned that he also has Dilfer (as a backup, i know) in SF with whom is he very comfortable.

 

[Mark Wimer]

Bryant/Smith definitely seem to be bonding in practice, there is definitely some upside here if those guys can grow together.

Bryant is the type of receiver that can make a young QB look really good. The problem has always been his desire to play. He's a bit of a prima donna, but he's an incredible talent, and clearly the #1 WR in SF.

Yes, and he and Smith are very simpatico. Look at the reports from training camp - where he's catching 50+ yard passes in practice with some regularity. Bryant news Digest from Blogger

8/9/06 "There were games when the other team couldn't cover him at all. He would beat his man every time," Dilfer said after practice Tuesday. "Unfortunately, we didn't have a system that could isolate him and make use of his talents." Bryant still managed 69 catches. "It should have been 90," Dilfer said. "I would make up plays just to try to accentuate his ability."

That's from a Super-Bowl winning QB, folks.

8/20/06 "WR Antonio Bryant appears to be the flashiest weapon the San Francisco 49ers have had since WR Terrell Owens left the team. He has remade himself into OC Norv Turner's new playmaker. “I've learned that when you want the ball, you can't keep just telling the quarterback you want the ball,” Bryant said after practice Friday. “You have to show him you want it. You've got to make that dive. You've got to show them there are no bounds going after that ball.''

Look at his numbers from the preseason games. 1/46/0 this past weekend (in a game where Smith looked not-so-hot). 5/54/0 in a game where Smith looked on top of his game week 1 of pre-season. Are Bryant/Smith going to turn the 49ers into contenders this year? No, I don't think so. Is Smith likely to lock onto Bryant and throw him a ton of footballs? Yes, I think so without a doubt.

Is Bryant a prima donna who needed to grow up a lot early in his career? Yes, I think so without a doubt. Has he matured? Yes, I really think so.

FF is about opportunity as well as talent - Bryant is going to see a ton of footballs this year, and be given every opportunity to shine. He's finally being feted and treated as a bona fide #1, which plays to his ego - which isn't a bad thing. We all have egos, and we all enjoy being #1 at something or other.

I've been impressed by all reports on this player this year, and on his role in the 49ers offense (etc., etc.) and I've drafted him in every one of my leagues.

My .02.

 

[Jeff Pasquino]

Guys,

As with any comments early on, they are based upon info at the time.

As for Bryant and his prospects for this season, my ranking was based mostly in part on his QB. WRs can't do much of anything without someone with some NFL skills getting him the ball, and my confidence level in Alex Smith was very low.

Yes it is preseason, but this is the time when adjustments do need to be made if a player performs beyond expectations or shows glimpses of promise.

I'm not going to raise his ranking by leaps and bounds, but there is no question that Bryant deserves a higher ranking then where I have him. Thanks for the heads up. Clearly an oversight.