What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.

Dynasty: Young, High Upside Backup QB's - Tannenhill, Bradford, Da (1 Viewer)

Englishteacher

Footballguy
Like to get some discussion going on these guys in particular. They fall in the range of mid to late QB2's in dynasty terms.All are about 25 or younger.

Tannenhill - Still very few high comp snaps at QB. Looks the part and didn't play that badly last year given the talent he had around him. Wondering how many "leaps" he has in him as far as development and upside. Team added some talent for him and slowly the Dolphins may be on the rise.

Bradford - Former #1 overall has had ups and downs but a lot of young talent for him to work with. LT long helps. Will we see the Rams spread it out?

Dalton - Has the least individual upside talent of the four but is also on the best team. Also, team has added sick young talent to the offense. Could we see the Bengals go pass happy, with a two TE spread (aka Pats).

Manuel - Up tempo offense. Marrone coached with the Saints. A lot to like there. Very talented but raw mechanics. Good young talent at the skill positions and a steady (when healthy) vet WR.

 
I'm in 16 team dyno.. my QB 2 is Brock Oswiler. just throwing it out there but i think hes a very exciting prospect. they have a LOT of weapons and if manning ever goes down or hands him the torch, look out...

 
Everyone hates my list, I know.

Freeman

Bradford

Dalton

Gabbert

Manuel

Tannehill
Freeman -- finished 3 points behind Dalton last year despite the fact that Dalton had four rushing TDs and Freeman had none. He's also slightly younger than Dalton.

Bradford -- people forget he was a #1 overall pick, he improved a lot last year, and his situation has improved dramatically. Would expect him to have moved into the top 15 QBs a year from now.

Dalton -- what you've seen is what you get IMO.

Gabbert -- will probably need to wait another couple years, but he's got good tools.

Manuel -- don't think he'll develop much over the years or look as good in real games. Rushing ability is a wildcard though.

Tannehill -- just don't believe.

 
i'd parse them in pairs...

bottom two clearly seem (to me) like dalton and manuel...

dalton has questionable arm, which could always limit him and CIN offense (better than pennington, but still limited... this could be bigger issue in howling winds during last month or two in AFC North... or three of season counting playoffs, but i haven't specifically looked for this correlation)... with the outstanding weapons he has in green and good looking rookies eifert and bernard, i'm tempted to put him third on list, tough call...

manuel was only first round QB, but his grade going in to draft process was more like third or less QB, at best... he does have prototypical size, said to be very charismatic with great leadership intangibles... will get some points running, but someone noted (waldman or bloom?) that he is more like freeman than RGIII, cam, kaepernick or even wilson in that respect... i do like the skill position weapons they are putting around him... stevie johnson, second rounder woods, third rounder wilson (i would have taken wheaton with that pick though, PIT got steal one pick later)... spiller is one of best young RBs... would like to see BUF get a TE... better arm talent than dalton, but since he doesn't have elite, blue chip pedigree of luck or RGIII (though better than kaepernick and russell wilson), hard to slot him ahead of dalton sight unseen... if i already had proven, not too old starting QB, i might go for swing for the fences pick in manuel... if not, might have to go for dalton...

bradford and tannehill both could push to become QB1 this year (12 team leagues)...

bradford has #1 overall pedigree, viewed by some as a disappointment, but his first year in same offense, should get huge boost with jake long, cook, austin, another year of development for givens (not sure, but in givens, austin and cook, might be one of faster lineups in league history?)... once manning, brady and brees retire in few years, i think he will be in conversation for top 5 QB... RB big question mark, he may have to throw more this year, my guess is this gets addressed next year if richardson and/or pead don't distinguish themselves...

as for tannehill, he has great positional upside, as he was WR until late in college career... waldman has raved about his developed pocket sense and awareness, which bodes EXTREMELY well for his long range projection, as some NFL QBs never get that... better wheels than bradford (who isn't statuesque, and can roll out, but won't take off and run with the ball much), tannehill also has above average arm, don't think he is known for bradford's accuracy (who i don't think has cracked 60% yet, but again, he hasn't exactly been positioned for greatest success before, i expect to see an uptick going forward)... wallace was a nice add, it will be interesting to see if he can replicate success he had in PIT in MIA, it may have to take a different form, as tannehill different style than bigger, stronger big ben at keeping plays alive, who could shrug off sacks from DL and LBs like a kodiak bear... losing keller hurts... rams let gibson go for what that is worth, i think most would view austin as huge upgrade (but that would be comparing WR3 in MIA to WR2 in STL)... imo, austin far more explosive and dangerous than WR2 hartline, too... ex-MIA LT long coincidentally in STL... so that move helps bradford and hurts tannehill... RB question mark in MIA, too, but i would much rather have lamar miller than richardson AND pead combined... his development has been helped (complete opposite of bradford, who's development has been stunted) by effectively running exact same scheme he did in college... possible he has top 5 upside in a few years, too, so they could be really close... all the talk about supporting cast and surrounding talent could change dramatically for better or worse in few years... but i'm more comfortable placing bradford in top 5 in few years...

 
Last edited by a moderator:
It's always fascinating to watch some player curiously never get appreciated. It was Eli for so long and seems to have shifted to Dalton the last couple years.

A couple years back if I said the Bungles will draft someone that will not only turn them into a winner but take them to the playoffs, you might have reacted-the Bengals? Are they gonna sign Rodgers or Brady? Cmon now.

It's almost unbelievable how under-appreciated Dalton is on these boards. He has the young WR people would argue already has HOF potential and they added a TE this board gushes over.

Footing, arm strength, technique...oh come on. In FF we talk opportunity, success, weapons...he has everything we always talk about in any other thread but in this one (and any other Dalton thread) Dalton is meh. It's crazy.

If/When Dalton wins a Supe, I already look forward to all the "defense won it for them" "Green carried them on his back" posts.

Wow do you guys need to step back and rethink Dalton with the very same criteria you use to judge every other player in FF.

I love Bradford and haven't forgotten he took the Rams to the playoffs I'm not discrediting him but how do you not see Dalton took the Bungles to the playoffs as something you thought you might not see in your lifetime? What does this guy need to do to impress you? Switch to the other Ohio team and take them to the playoffs too? Cmon.

It's fine if you don't think he's Peyton or Brady like but geesh the negativity doesn't in any way matchup with Dalton at all. Was he Ryan Leaf's roommate? Jamarcus Russell's BFF? This is so odd

 
BTW,

FBG staff rankings have them very tightly bunched...

15 - dalton

16 - tannehill

17 - bradford

after flacco and freeman at 18-19...

20 - manuel

an observation that, with the exception of manuel, who as rookie probably expected to be ranked lower (and as noted above, not rookie like luck carrying the "can't miss" imprimatur), the three vets close enough that any difference could be chalked up to beauty being in the eye of the beholder... as opposed to glaringly obvious differences in the prospects...

dynasty rankings are going to always be to some degree, fluid and in flux from year to year... manuel will likely be higher or lower in two years, not in same place... the three vets could be in very different places in a few years...

these rankings are very dependent and sensitive to ongoing events that will happen this year, not just what has come before... it would be different with manning, brady and brees being pretty known commodities...

if bradford breaks out and passes for 4,300 yards and 30+ TDs in 2013, and dalton and tannehill don't, and maybe don't come close, good chance bradford flips to highest ranking of three, and probably ranked even higher than dalton is now at 15...

to be more clear on this point, dalton could also break out with addition of eifert and bernard (cook and austin almost parallel offensive weapon enhancements for bradford)... but imo, all things being equal, if they had similar improvements, i think bradford has superior talent (again, imo, deservedly reflected in pedigree), and will be able to better leverage them to greater heights...

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Manual

Tannehill

Geno

These are the only three worth targeting. With the way the QB position scores, you either need to be 1) running QB; or 2) elite offense. All three of these guys pose the ability to get points on the ground.

The rest of the guys on this list have a ceiling that is pretty much QB10, which is frankly a dime a dozen.

 
Bradford

Dalton

Manuel

Tannehill

Edit: Just saw Dynasty title. Above are redraft. Below are dynasty.

Bradford

Manuel

Tannehill

Dalton

 
Last edited by a moderator:
cstu said:
Abraham said:
Manuel

Tannehill

Dalton

Bradford.
Dalton doesn't seem like he'll ever be more than a low QB1.
Whilst I think there's too much young talent to ever give Dalton true high end QB upside, I've never understood why people are so adamant that Dalton has reached him upside.

He's only had two full (Very good) seasons for his age, with the team looking like it's getting an elite core of talent around him.

I think he's got a decent amount of upside left. Whether he lives up to it...

 
If you are looking for a reason to eliminate Bradford from the debate in a keeper setting, four games a year against Seattle's defense and San Francisco's defense is a pretty good reason. And God forbid he gets one of them in week 16 some year, which is likely. Not to mention that Arizona is collecting some nice playmakers on defense also.

This all kinda sucks, because divisional competition being equal, I'd almost certainly want Bradford over the other 3.

 
On the flip side, you get at least 9 dome games/year with Bradford. With a quick hit joystick in Austin. A tremendous up and coming deep threat -- at a minimum -- in Givens I'm not as sold on Jared Cook, but he's an improvement over Kendricks.

I tend to always shy more away from RB's -- particularly the 2 down ones --in cases like STL (tough divisional opponents). They get far behind, they're passing -- not running.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
I tend to go with the guys I haven't seen much of aka EJ Manuel (at least until they dig their own grave). His running ability sets him apart from the others.

I don't see Dalton suddenly massively improving barring a different offensive scheme.

Bradford can potentially improve a bit, but there's a ton of tape on him already. How much can he actually improve?

Tannehill looked ok last season, he would probably be my #2 behind Manuel since I'd like to see what he can do with some weapons around him.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
traderallenpoe said:
I'm in 16 team dyno.. my QB 2 is Brock Oswiler. just throwing it out there but i think hes a very exciting prospect. they have a LOT of weapons and if manning ever goes down or hands him the torch, look out...
For the price, oz is hard to beat if you have an older qb like Peyton.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
wdcrob said:
Everyone hates my list, I know.

Freeman

Bradford

Dalton

Gabbert

Manuel

Tannehill
Freeman -- finished 3 points behind Dalton last year despite the fact that Dalton had four rushing TDs and Freeman had none. He's also slightly younger than Dalton.

Bradford -- people forget he was a #1 overall pick, he improved a lot last year, and his situation has improved dramatically. Would expect him to have moved into the top 15 QBs a year from now.

Dalton -- what you've seen is what you get IMO.

Gabbert -- will probably need to wait another couple years, but he's got good tools.

Manuel -- don't think he'll develop much over the years or look as good in real games. Rushing ability is a wildcard though.

Tannehill -- just don't believe.
Didn't include Freeman in this list as there are some calling for his head in Tampa. Who knows? Maybe Glennon will be an answer.

Agree Bradford has a lot of upside and some good young weapons accumulating.

Dalton - Limitations. Offense has upside but not sure his passing skills do.

Gabbert?

Manuel has the physical skills and good character. Needs fundamentals but they can be coached. Like that Marrone came from Saints. Good potential in weapons.

You must really not like Tannenhill.

 
Bob Magaw said:
i'd parse them in pairs...

bottom two clearly seem (to me) like dalton and manuel...

dalton has questionable arm, which could always limit him and CIN offense (better than pennington, but still limited... this could be bigger issue in howling winds during last month or two in AFC North... or three of season counting playoffs, but i haven't specifically looked for this correlation)... with the outstanding weapons he has in green and good looking rookies eifert and bernard, i'm tempted to put him third on list, tough call...

manuel was only first round QB, but his grade going in to draft process was more like third or less QB, at best... he does have prototypical size, said to be very charismatic with great leadership intangibles... will get some points running, but someone noted (waldman or bloom?) that he is more like freeman than RGIII, cam, kaepernick or even wilson in that respect... i do like the skill position weapons they are putting around him... stevie johnson, second rounder woods, third rounder wilson (i would have taken wheaton with that pick though, PIT got steal one pick later)... spiller is one of best young RBs... would like to see BUF get a TE... better arm talent than dalton, but since he doesn't have elite, blue chip pedigree of luck or RGIII (though better than kaepernick and russell wilson), hard to slot him ahead of dalton sight unseen... if i already had proven, not too old starting QB, i might go for swing for the fences pick in manuel... if not, might have to go for dalton...

bradford and tannehill both could push to become QB1 this year (12 team leagues)...

bradford has #1 overall pedigree, viewed by some as a disappointment, but his first year in same offense, should get huge boost with jake long, cook, austin, another year of development for givens (not sure, but in givens, austin and cook, might be one of faster lineups in league history?)... once manning, brady and brees retire in few years, i think he will be in conversation for top 5 QB... RB big question mark, he may have to throw more this year, my guess is this gets addressed next year if richardson and/or pead don't distinguish themselves...

as for tannehill, he has great positional upside, as he was WR until late in college career... waldman has raved about his developed pocket sense and awareness, which bodes EXTREMELY well for his long range projection, as some NFL QBs never get that... better wheels than bradford (who isn't statuesque, and can roll out, but won't take off and run with the ball much), tannehill also has above average arm, don't think he is known for bradford's accuracy (who i don't think has cracked 60% yet, but again, he hasn't exactly been positioned for greatest success before, i expect to see an uptick going forward)... wallace was a nice add, it will be interesting to see if he can replicate success he had in PIT in MIA, it may have to take a different form, as tannehill different style than bigger, stronger big ben at keeping plays alive, who could shrug off sacks from DL and LBs like a kodiak bear... losing keller hurts... rams let gibson go for what that is worth, i think most would view austin as huge upgrade (but that would be comparing WR3 in MIA to WR2 in STL)... imo, austin far more explosive and dangerous than WR2 hartline, too... ex-MIA LT long coincidentally in STL... so that move helps bradford and hurts tannehill... RB question mark in MIA, too, but i would much rather have lamar miller than richardson AND pead combined... his development has been helped (complete opposite of bradford, who's development has been stunted) by effectively running exact same scheme he did in college... possible he has top 5 upside in a few years, too, so they could be really close... all the talk about supporting cast and surrounding talent could change dramatically for better or worse in few years... but i'm more comfortable placing bradford in top 5 in few years...
Lots of good stuff in here. Thanks! :blackdot: for later.

 

Users who are viewing this thread

Top