What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Eagles Fans - Michael Lewis? (1 Viewer)

hotdogcollars

Footballguy
1st, love the W.

But, why is Sean Considine on the field? Can any Eagles fan answer that? Seriously, he is always the guy who is 3 seconds late into the play. Not to mention his complete inability to make an open field tackle. Is Michael LEwis hurt or something?

 
I dont think he's been playing too bad. He's better at coverage than Lewis and I've seen some great tackles from him (an open field tackle on Vick comes to mind). He's not the best safety to ever play the game but I still think he's an upgrade on Lewis who's play has declined this year. I can see safety being an area addressed in the draft this year.

 
Simply put, Lewis is a VERY poor man's Roy Williams.

Lewis is a great run support player and big hitter but absolutely can't cover anyone. As a result, he's easily exposed in coverage. With the Eagles' front seven playing better against the run, D/C Johnson would rather take his chances with Considine. Either way, it's a weakness in the Eagles' defense that an opposing O/C should expose.

 
Simply put, Lewis is a VERY poor man's Roy Williams.Lewis is a great run support player and big hitter but absolutely can't cover anyone. As a result, he's easily exposed in coverage. With the Eagles' front seven playing better against the run, D/C Johnson would rather take his chances with Considine. Either way, it's a weakness in the Eagles' defense that an opposing O/C should expose.
Funny you should say that, as I was thinking that was a good description of Considine.Hard hitter, bad cover guy.That's Roy Williams in a nutshell (splash of penalties / dirty rep / horsecaller history aside).That would put Considine about on par with Lewis.Eagles fans need to hope Lito Sheppard gets well soon and Roderick Hood plays above his head next week.
 
Lewis got beat on a few deep balls early in the season (embarassingly beat...) so they've gone with Constandine ever since.

Neither are particularly good...

 
I was looking for Considine last night - he seemed to be on the sideline on both Plax TDs. On the second there were three CBs in the picture, didn't see any safeties at all.

 
I was looking for Considine last night - he seemed to be on the sideline on both Plax TDs. On the second there were three CBs in the picture, didn't see any safeties at all.
The play that stood out to me, if I remember it right, was where he had Plax dead to rights on the sideline on the Giant's last drive yet he flat out missed the tackle. Plax picked up about 7 more yards for the first down. I believe this was the conversion of the "first and 30" possession (3-11 or so).
 
1st, love the W. But, why is Sean Considine on the field? Can any Eagles fan answer that? Seriously, he is always the guy who is 3 seconds late into the play. Not to mention his complete inability to make an open field tackle. Is Michael LEwis hurt or something?
Lewis has gotten more and more exposed in coverage as the years have gone on. This season, he was getting beat consistently. Considine is a more complete player. And for the most part, I think he has played very well. Did you miss the outstanding open field tackle he made on Vick??
 
Last edited by a moderator:
1st, love the W. But, why is Sean Considine on the field? Can any Eagles fan answer that? Seriously, he is always the guy who is 3 seconds late into the play. Not to mention his complete inability to make an open field tackle. Is Michael LEwis hurt or something?
Lewis has gotten more and more exposed in coverage as the years have gone on. This season, he was getting beat consistently. Considine is a more complete player. And for the most part, I think he has played very well. Did you miss the outstanding open field tackle he made on Vick??
Yep, Lewis was doing a damn good Roy Williams impression earlier in the year. Considine had that horrible missed tackle on Plax which led to a 1st down, but other than that he isn't getting blatantly roasted every week. Maybe Quentin Mikell can get some playing time soon.
 
Considine is a much surer tackler in run support than Micheal Lewis, but can't cover as well. Unfortunately Lewis started gambling too much and became a defensive liability. Jim Johnson knows that Considine will abide by his assignment, something he has to have given the aggressiveness of the defense.

 
I loved Lewis in the SS role until this season. I don't know if he's lost confidence, the ability to read a route, or both, but he was atrocious in the passing game, and (surprisingly) only mediocre against the run. He made 2 horrible plays early in the year. One almost cost them the first Cowboy game, and the other really killed them against the Saints.

1 - Leading Dallas in Philly. End of the game, 3rd and long from their own end of the field, Lewis is the deep safety. He somehow lets Glenn get 10 yards behind him, and is forced to take a flagrant pass interference penalty, giving Dallas the ball on about the Eagle 20. Fortunately, Lito Sheppard picks off Bledsoe in the end zone a few plays later to win the game.

2 - Philly scores a huge TD at the start of the 4th quarter to go up 24-17, after being down 17-3 at the half. The defense had settled in, and had completely shut down New Orleans in the 3rd quarter. 5 plays later, Lewis is the deep support and Horn runs an In & Up. Instead staying in his zone, Lewis tries to jump the in, only to watch helplessly as Horn streaks by him with the game tying TD. The play visibly deflated the team. That game ended with the Saints devouring the last 8:26 on the clock as the defense suddenly couldn't get off the field.

{{In hindsight, it was also the game that cost them a 1st round bye, home field vs New Orleans, and (probably) Lito Sheppard. Ugh}}

On top of those, he's also the guy that somehow failed to cover a Burress fumble in the end zone during the Giants collapse in week 2, instead handing them their first TD of the 4th quarter and the beginning of their comeback.

After the benching, Lewis continued to struggle for several weeks with missed assignments in both the run and pass games. He seemed to finally accept his role around Thanksgiving, and his contributions, while limited, have seemed (to me) more solid since then. They've used him more as a linebacker in passing situations. He DID get hurt a couple weeks ago (knee sprain). That's why you haven't seen him more, and why he wasn't able to play as many snaps yesterday.

Considine isn't going to the Pro Bowl any time soon, but hasn't been missing plays that killed the defense (until he absolutely BLEW the tackle on Burress yesterday on the 3rd and 12 play). He's usually around the ball, which is what they used to say about Lewis. There were several times yesterday that he was the safety help on a double team, and the coverage was usually VERY tight. Look at the replay of the Brown INT. Considine is in Burress back pocket if Brown somehow missed that ball.

I definitely think SS is a position they'll look to upgrade in the offseason if they can. Lewis was a 2nd rounder, so the Eagles have shown the value that role in the defense. They'll let Lewis walk, hope to draft/sign a good SS, and have Considine continue as the top reserve safety and strong special teams performer.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Amazing.

NFL network had the replay of the week 6 NO/PHI game on tonight. Actually seeing the play again, it's amazing to see how 1 horrible play can change a game. The Philly defense really was on top of New Orleans in the 2nd half, and the offense was moving pretty well too. Lewis was at least 10 yards out of position.

Unbelievable.

 
Lewis is in a contract year and I believe he started gambling way too much (like others have said) to try and put up better numbers. The Eagles had offered him an extension earlier in the season that he turned down. A couple of bad games later he is sitting on the bench.

 
I think Lewis is the same player he always was before. The problem is that the coaches were putting a natural SS in man to man coverage or deep zones with #1 or high end Wr's. This is not a good matchup for any SS to be in. He might have been gambling a bit more, but how a player goes from being a great safety and pro bowler to riding the bench for someone like Considine is beyond me. Considine might be a better coverage guy, but he surely is not a real SS and doesn't get close to giving the run support (tackling) that Lewis gave in the past. It says more about what position the coaching staff was putting Lewis in and asking him to be a type of player that he is not. IMO

 
Considine's missed tackle of Plax on 3rd down after the 1st and 30 was horrible. And last week we saw why he plays defense and not WR as he had to have 3 balls bounce off his hands, chest and head before finally coming up with a pick. But I think the switch to him, over Lewis, has been a factor in the D's performance during the team's resurgence in the last half of the season. And part of that also has been Lewis' play as a "LB."

 
lewis non-starting status (at this point a nickle LB) begs the question if he changed or something else changed... jason noted that he has gambled more & it was also suggested he was looking to give his stats a boost in a contract year (his stats were plenty good in previous years, & in fact i think his stats had shown an upward tick in just about every category for about three years... maybe he should have been content with status quo if so)...

it is also possible that opposing OCs got better at isolating him & exposing his coverage weaknesses... adam archuleta was not prioritized by STL because of coverage weaknesses, & after being allowed to walk was relegated to the bench in WAS...

oddly, though, a SS like roy williams continues to go to the pro bowl (though he probably shouldn't... he did have career high in INTs in 06 with like 5-6)... adrian wilson set the NFL record for sacks by DB in 05 & i think set or tied one for all players/defenders with two 99 yard return TDs (one on INT & one on FR), but coverage is not his strong suit... perhaps some defensive schemes are better at shielding coverage weaknesses of SS... or related point, some DCs are better at devising such schemes or operating better within existing ones...

the preference these days is for well rounded DBs... SSs that can cover (like polamalu) & FS that can tackle (ed reed & brian dawkins)... the need for this type of player has maybe become more pronounced with the burgeoning trend of spread offenses... some of the rule changes recently have notoriously favored offense & specifically passing attacks...

having a SS (that can cover) in this context is oviously desireable when teams are routinely splitting out four WRs & sometimes more... on the other hand, IND has done a great job in past two seasons of forcing defenses to space out LBs & safeties more to account for all the receiving weapons... & then run through gaping holes... so in THAT context, it is also helpful to have FSs that can tackle...

i'm guessing that it would be a bit harder for OC to isolate a FS in run support than a SS in pass coverage... because for RB to even get into third level presupposes the blocking scheme was able to get past both DL AND LBs... in passing game, a WR3 or TE in some cases just has to beat one man to get downfield, & with rule changes can't be pressed past 5 yards downfield...

but i wouldn't go as far as to say it suggests or we can conclude from that competent SSs are more important than their FS peers...

stud FSs like aforementioned reed & dawkins (& sean taylor) can be best defensive players on their teams... & some teams use SS & FS almost interchangably, which makes this issue (comparitive valuation of safety positions) a moot point...

its not like players like this are common, just because they are essential... :thumbdown:

its probably not an accident that i had to use a recent pro bowl who's who & roll call to illustrate these issues with exemplars (polamalu, reed, dawkins)... some other up 'n comers that have the multi-faceted skill set & array of physical traits & talents to excel in run support & coverage, off the top of my head from recent draft classes, not necessarily by rank or chronological order... sean taylor, kerry rhodes, sean jones, gibril wilson, madieu williams, donte whitner & michael huff... the play of taylor, rhodes & jones arguably merited pro bowl more strongly than others (such as polamalu, who had down year, lynch, who had no business, as well as roy williams)...

safeties used to be like the proverbial ugly, redheaded, freckled step-children of the defense & it was a position you didn't want to play, being typically underappreciated & among lowest paid in NFL (excepting occasional HoFer & pro bowler like lott & easley)... reed's recent monster contract & the one polamalu will soon sign signal a sea change in the current eco-system of relative strategic importance of defensise positions within the overall scheme landscape, & a corresponding shift in valuation...

safeties seem to have been prioritized in draft increasingly past half decade or so... top 10 safety selection used to happen maybe few times a decade, if that... top 10 safeties like bennie blades, mark carrier & the late eric turner were extremely rare... in recent years we have had top 10 safeties in roy williams, taylor, & then TWO in 06 with huff & whitner... in 07, reggie nelson & laron landry are borderline top 10 talents, & it probably wouldn't be a huge shock if either or both were taken around there...

just think how dangerous DAL might be if nelson or landry somehow drops to them... they probably win at least 2-3 games more each of past two season with any semblance of decent FS play to complement the LB-like SS williams...

this thought is slightly out of sequence, but maybe serves as a good coda to convey sense of offense & defense trends battling each other like in an arms race escalation, or in the war of crypto experts constantly trying to keep up with attempts to circumvent these man-made coding systems with inherent flaws & unforseen weaknesses by hackers...

with rule changes favoring offenses & passing attacks, a team like IND with right offensive personnel can almost dictate to the defense their own personnel, formation & schemes (PIT in playoffs last year excepted :thumbup: )... once a defense has SS & FS that can be used interchangably, with SS that can cover & has ball skills & FS that can tackle in run support, it makes that OVERALL defense much harder to attack (it still helps to have good DL that pressure QB & LBs stout in run support & that can themselves cover, so you defenitely need more than just good safeties)...

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Yep he gave up that big pass int call in the saints game that gave them the win

See my earlier ... the pass int was against Dallas (but Lito bailed him out).

Saints game was the blown zone against Horn.

Great review Bob. It's definitely true teams would like their safeties interchangeable. Gone are the (for example) Andre Water/Wes Hopkins combos that everyone used to search for.

I think the SS has seen his coverage responsibilities increase for 2 reasons. One is that teams send more skilled slot receivers and (especially) tight ends into the pass pattern, and/or they have the double coverage job on the better elite WRs. Two, it seems more teams have corners they aren't able to leave on an island. They're having to go to more (and different) zone schemes, and the SS is getting a prime piece of real estate to protect. In the Eagles case, Lewis was never a guy they envisioned in man coverage, BUT he was no longer protecting his "home" in the zone schemes.

100 coaches out of 100 will play the lesser guy who follows his responsibilities in the secondary over the guys that continually blows coverages.

 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top