Ethical Questions Regarding Sale of Home (1 Viewer)

[bigbottom]

As you may know, a member of our family was terminally ill, and passed away in our home. We are contemplating putting up our house for sale. Texas law does not require that a seller disclose a death in the home if the death was from natural causes or suicide (i.e., not homicide). I think I'm pretty sure I'm going to disclose anyway, because it feels like the right thing to do, and it's not like they're not going to find out once they get to know the neighbors. That said, I'm wondering what to expect in terms of push back from potential buyers, hence the poll questions. Any thoughts are welcome.

 

[spOOfy]

i see no reason why you should disclose this.

also, if you do, the specifics will definitely be questioned. just human nature.

 

[NCCommish]

If they asked I wouldn't lie but I wouldn't mention it. If I were the buyer it wouldn't bother me either way and I wouldn't expect a lower price because of it.

 

[GroveDiesel]

i see no reason why you should disclose this.

also, if you do, the specifics will definitely be questioned. just human nature.

I would agree. Zero reason to disclose. People die from natural causes in homes all the time. Screw anyone that would make a fake issue of it. Anyone that would be upset if they found out after purchase is a nutcase.Frankly, as a buyer, I'd rather just not know. Knowing wouldn't probably make me consciously devalue the home, but it would possibly invoke some sadness in me imagining it.

I imagine part of you wanting to move is to get away from those particular memories. I think it's almost unfair to disclose that info unnecessarily and pass those memories on to someone else. Let the slate be wiped clean as you walk away.

 

[johnnycakes]

My dad died in his house, February of 2012. I am the only child. Sold the place last December, finally. Had one buyer ask if my dad passed in the home... I told the truf. The final buyer never asked, and I never told. hth.

 

[glumpy]

i see no reason why you should disclose this.

also, if you do, the specifics will definitely be questioned. just human nature.

I would agree. Zero reason to disclose. People die from natural causes in homes all the time. Screw anyone that would make a fake issue of it. Anyone that would be upset if they found out after purchase is a nutcase.

This pretty well sums up my immediate reaction. Let's talk about older homes with longer histories--when is the statute of limitations before it becomes irrelevant to the sale? I can see where one may want to mention it if a death is part of the motivation behind selling the house, and if the asking price is already reduced below market value because of it.

 

[Mr.Pack]

If they asked I wouldn't lie but I wouldn't mention it. If I were the buyer it wouldn't bother me either way and I wouldn't expect a lower price because of it.

This

 

[Bob Sacamano]

i see no reason why you should disclose this.

also, if you do, the specifics will definitely be questioned. just human nature.

Frankly, as a buyer, I'd rather just not know. Knowing wouldn't probably make me consciously devalue the home, but it would possibly invoke some sadness in me imagining it.

Yeah, I don't think it would matter much to me. I certainly can't imagine ever asking. But if someone just offered it up unprompted, it might weird me out a little.

Are you using a realtor? We never even met the people to whom we sold our first house. No idea who they were other than a name, and all the communication went back and forth between "our people". In similar circumstances, I have no idea how that would have even come out, absent our realtor telling others.

 

[matuski]

I do not expect it to be disclosed.

You are damn right I'd use any leverage I can get in negotiating price.

 

[bigbottom]

Yeah, maybe this is a solution in search of a problem. If we go through realtors, perhaps the issue never comes up. That said, while I respect the "I'd rather not know" sentiment, I don't see how that is any way a realistic possibility for someone living in our neighborhood. They're goint to find out at some point. Whether that's something I should be concerned with is another question entirely, but I do think I'd feel bad about it if it bothered them for some reason.

 

[spOOfy]

Yeah, maybe this is a solution in search of a problem. If we go through realtors, perhaps the issue never comes up. That said, while I respect the "I'd rather not know" sentiment, I don't see how that is any way a realistic possibility for someone living in our neighborhood. They're goint to find out at some point. Whether that's something I should be concerned with is another question entirely, but I do think I'd feel bad about it if it bothered them for some reason.

living in your neighborhood, i'm sure you're right that a neighbor will speak of your son's passing at some point, but that doesn't necessarily mean they will share that he passed while at home.

 

[njherdfan]

I think if a buyer is the type of person who wouldn't want to buy a house where a person passed away of natural causes, the obligation falls on the buyer to ask.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Yeah, maybe this is a solution in search of a problem. If we go through realtors, perhaps the issue never comes up. That said, while I respect the "I'd rather not know" sentiment, I don't see how that is any way a realistic possibility for someone living in our neighborhood. They're goint to find out at some point. Whether that's something I should be concerned with is another question entirely, but I do think I'd feel bad about it if it bothered them for some reason.

From my perspective, it's less that I'd rather not know than that I'd prefer to not have the uncomfortable conversation that starts, "So, I feel like there's something I need to tell you, and it's kind of personal, but..." But I can see where the bigger deal for somebody else might be finding out post-purchase.

 

[jon_mx]

Seems like the state thought about the issue and concluded there was no reason to disclose. It isn't like the state hasn't thought about this situation. There is a crap load you have to disclose.

 

[Phil Elliott]

I think there is a Texas law that requires you to disclose if there was a murder in the home. See no reason to disclose deaths due to natural causes. Good luck on whatever you decide to do.

 

[comfortably numb]

You want the most money for your house.

Disclosing at this point lessens that opportunity.
Selling a home is already a huge emotional move to make, try to keep this as business related as possible.

Law is on your side. You are doing nothing wrong morally by NOT disclosing.
If asked I would tell.

This is not a leaky roof 4 years ago. This a serious and private familial matter you want to remain within your families best interest.

 

[B-Deep]

Honestly biggie, you have 0 obligation to mention this. However, if you feel you should, if it would assist you in dealing with all of this, then I have no problem with you doing it. This situation, this house, your memories good and bad in it, and everything you are dealing with is very personal to you. No one can or should tell you how to deal with it. If the law required it then I would say yeah, you had better say something. But it does not, so my only advice is do what you feel is right.

 

[B-Deep]

i see no reason why you should disclose this.

also, if you do, the specifics will definitely be questioned. just human nature.

Frankly, as a buyer, I'd rather just not know. Knowing wouldn't probably make me consciously devalue the home, but it would possibly invoke some sadness in me imagining it.

Yeah, I don't think it would matter much to me. I certainly can't imagine ever asking. But if someone just offered it up unprompted, it might weird me out a little.

Are you using a realtor? We never even met the people to whom we sold our first house. No idea who they were other than a name, and all the communication went back and forth between "our people". In similar circumstances, I have no idea how that would have even come out, absent our realtor telling others.

that is a very good point. I never saw the people buying my house till they closing. All the communication went through the Realtors, and if the Realtor is not required to say anything he or she will not.

 

[Tom Skerritt]

Yeah, maybe this is a solution in search of a problem. If we go through realtors, perhaps the issue never comes up. That said, while I respect the "I'd rather not know" sentiment, I don't see how that is any way a realistic possibility for someone living in our neighborhood. They're goint to find out at some point. Whether that's something I should be concerned with is another question entirely, but I do think I'd feel bad about it if it bothered them for some reason.

People die in their homes all of the time. That is why you are not required to disclose. And I strongly recommend you do NOT disclose this information. It is irrelevant to the sale of the home.

 

[Long Ball Larry]

why do you think that it would be an issue either way for the prospective buyer? At first blush, it doesn't seem to me like something that would be particularly relevant to the transaction.

 

[kutta]

My wife's mom died in ine of our previous homes and I did not feel an obligation to tell the buyers.

But you are a good person and I'm not.

 

[GroveDiesel]

Yeah, maybe this is a solution in search of a problem. If we go through realtors, perhaps the issue never comes up. That said, while I respect the "I'd rather not know" sentiment, I don't see how that is any way a realistic possibility for someone living in our neighborhood. They're goint to find out at some point. Whether that's something I should be concerned with is another question entirely, but I do think I'd feel bad about it if it bothered them for some reason.

It's very possible that someone in your neighborhood may tell the buyer about the passing just in discussing their friendship with you or talking to the new owner about why you sold. I would think it would be weird for them to specifically mention that it happened in the house.

If they do and that's something that bothers the new owner, I'd say that's on the neighbor for oversharing something that they had no business sharing rather than on you for not giving them the heads up.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

No, No, Would Not Bother.

 

[Ignoramus]

If they asked I wouldn't lie but I wouldn't mention it. If I were the buyer it wouldn't bother me either way and I wouldn't expect a lower price because of it.

Really there is no reason for this even to be a topic of discussion for a buyer.

 

[Tiger Fan]

I imagine people dying in houses all the time. Wouldn't even sweat it IMO

 

[mr roboto]

I wouldn't. That said, if you google your address, are there any stories about your family member that someone would find? Not that it should matter, but if so it's good to be aware of it.

 

[bigbottom]

Wow, thanks for all the replies. If anything, this thread and all of your insightful points help put my mind at ease if we end up going the non-disclosure route (which, I now imagine we will). I guess I'd never given the matter much thought. People do die in their homes all the time I guess.

 

[Ramsay Hunt Experience]

I would never think to ask whether someone died in hospice care in a home. To be fair, I've also always said that I'd happily buy a murder home if the deal were good, so I'm not a great barometer.

 

[17seconds]

I don't know why any buyer would care about this. Just not something that even comes to mind when I'm buying a house.

 

[Cjw_55106]

We bought our house from the owner's son when he passed away. We didn't ask where he died and they didn't offer. I don't see why it would matter.

My neighbor died a few years ago pretty young of cancer. She died in the home. I doubt her husband mentioned into the current owners when he sold. The neighborhood certainly didn't tell the new owners. Just seems like an odd thing to bring up.

 

[GroveDiesel]

I don't know why any buyer would care about this. Just not something that even comes to mind when I'm buying a house.

Yeah, it's possible the previous homeowner for my house used to perform voodoo rituals in the garage, get drunk and vomit into the kitchen sink, or write secret messages in semen on the walls. I have no idea and just don't care. I cleaned and sanitized every surface of the house before moving in and none of that affects me in any way. bbb's situation is exactly the same. What happened should have zero affect on the next homeowners and there is zero reason for them to ever be told by anyone.

 

[Sarnoff]

Just bought a house last year in which the prior owner passed of natural causes in the home the year previous. Did not care. My grandfather and grandmother both also passed of natural causes in their home in 2012 and my parents are renting out the home and I don't think they disclosed to renters. Actually, my sister and her family had to relocate back home last year and are living in the house now, and they don't seem to care that they're sleeping in the room our grandparents passed away in.

 

[comfortably numb]

As a realtor, if you were my client I would advise you not to disclose.

 

[Sarnoff]

I think if a buyer is the type of person who wouldn't want to buy a house where a person passed away of natural causes, the obligation falls on the buyer to ask.

Pretty much agree with this. As long as you tell the truth when asked I think it's fair.

 

[Sinn Fein]

I would not disclose.

While the majority of people say they don't care, I suspect some of those people would care if they "knew" someone died. Not in an Amityville way - just in a "I all of a sudden get a bad vibe now that I know". Not everyone, but it may be enough to influence a person from making a bid - no reason to disclose, no reason to risk potential missed bid. No upside, only downside to disclosing.

 

[DiStefano]

I wouldn't mention the leprosy.

 

[krista4]

People die from natural causes in homes all the time. Screw anyone that would make a fake issue of it. Anyone that would be upset if they found out after purchase is a nutcase.

/thread

 

[Uruk-Hai]

Wow, thanks for all the replies. If anything, this thread and all of your insightful points help put my mind at ease if we end up going the non-disclosure route (which, I now imagine we will). I guess I'd never given the matter much thought. People do die in their homes all the time I guess.

Yep. The house I grew up in was over 200 years old and part of my family had lived there since its first construction. I'd be wrong on any guess as to how many folks had died in that place over a couple of centuries, but it had to be dozens and dozens.

The first house I bought was from a family whose kid committed suicide in one of the bedrooms. Small town, so I knew about it beforehand. My RE agent (from the same small town) asked if I had any problems with that issue & I said no. I don't know if he was required by law to inform me - maybe so, as it came out of the blue.

 

[GroveDiesel]

The more I think about it, I'm not even sure why disclosure is mandatory for a violent death. Is the state concerned that there is enough of a chance of an angry poltergeist possessing the house that they feel disclosure is necessary? What's the rationale here?

 

[17seconds]

The more I think about it, I'm not even sure why disclosure is mandatory for a violent death. Is the state concerned that there is enough of a chance of an angry poltergeist possessing the house that they feel disclosure is necessary? What's the rationale here?

How easy would it be to sell Jeffrey Dahmer's house? Wouldn't that suck if you bought a house in a new area and found out later that everyone knew it had a history? I can see a financial reason even if you don't care.

 

[Psychopav]

Chalk up one more in the "no need to disclose" column here. Good luck, bb.

 

[pats3in4]

If you have a prospective buying family with whom at least one family member is big on Feng Shui, lack of disclosure is going to be an issue...more for them than you depending on disclosure laws.

As an example, it's more common in the older generations of Chinese to put a lot of weight into Feng Shui. It's also more common in Chinese culture to have grandparents live with their children's families. You could sell your house to a Chinese family who plans on having grandma live with them, then grandma freaking out upon learning someone died in the house.

While you do not need to volunteer the info freely, I suggest telling the truth if asked. There's a reason they are asking.

 

[comfortably numb]

If you have a prospective buying family with whom at least one family member is big on Feng Shui, lack of disclosure is going to be an issue...more for them than you depending on disclosure laws.

As an example, it's more common in the older generations of Chinese to put a lot of weight into Feng Shui. It's also more common in Chinese culture to have grandparents live with their children's families. You could sell your house to a Chinese family who plans on having grandma live with them, then grandma freaking out upon learning someone died in the house.

While you do not need to volunteer the info freely, I suggest telling the truth if asked. There's a reason they are asking.

johnnycakes has a point

 

[kutta]

I don't know why any buyer would care about this. Just not something that even comes to mind when I'm buying a house.

Yeah, it's possible the previous homeowner for my house used to perform voodoo rituals in the garage, get drunk and vomit into the kitchen sink, or write secret messages in semen on the walls. I have no idea and just don't care. I cleaned and sanitized every surface of the house before moving in and none of that affects me in any way. bbb's situation is exactly the same. What happened should have zero affect on the next homeowners and there is zero reason for them to ever be told by anyone.

Well not quite...

 

[eoMMan]

People pass away all the time in their homes. Don't sweat it. I wouldn't say anything.

 

[-fish-]

My brother in law was recently murdered in his living room, while the house was in escrow. The buyers were given 3 days to opt out of the contract. They said they didn't care and just went on with the escrow.

 

[bigbottom]

My brother in law was recently murdered in his living room, while the house was in escrow. The buyers were given 3 days to opt out of the contract. They said they didn't care and just went on with the escrow.

Whoa. So sorry to hear about that.

 

[-fish-]

My brother in law was recently murdered in his living room, while the house was in escrow. The buyers were given 3 days to opt out of the contract. They said they didn't care and just went on with the escrow.

Whoa. So sorry to hear about that.

thanks. we weren't close, but my sister is a wreck.

we all assumed that the buyers would bail out. I think I would be concerned about stigma with a murder or a serial rapist or something. I don't think I'd care about someone dying of natural causes.

 

[VA703]

I do not expect it to be disclosed.

You are damn right I'd use any leverage I can get in negotiating price.

agree.. if I have different houses i'm looking at & the only reason your house stands out is because of a death, ill pass.

 

[parasaurolophus]

No way would I disclose this.