fantasy football seeding question (1 Viewer)

[richtown]

The rules state:

Playoff Rules and Seatings

1rst Place: Best W-L Record (from the 3 division winners)

2nd Place: 2nd Best W-L Record (from the 3 division winners)

3rd Place: 3rd Best W-L Record (from the 3 division winners)

4th Place: Best W-L Record That Does Not Win A Division

5th Place: Most Point Scored Excluding 1rst-4th Place

6th Place: 2nd Most Point Scored Excluding 1rst-4th Place

In the case of a tie, playoff qualifiers and seedings will be determined by the following tiebreakers:

1) Head to Head

2) Overall Points

3) Division Record

4) Highest Points Scored Against

There are three teams in a division tied at 7-6

Team J is 7-6 with 1,075 points and has a head to head record of 2-1 with the other two teams

Team F is 7-6 with 1,072 points and has a head to head record of 2-1 with the other two teams

Team R is 7-6 with 1,185 points and has a head to head record of 0-2 with the other teams.

Teams J and F split their games (H2H record of 1-1)

The way I see it, Team J gets the division, but the commish has Team R taking the division.

Disregarding the fact that H2H tiebreakers are stupid, who do you think wins this division.

This post has been edited by richtown: Today, 01:34 AM

 

[The Jerk]

H2H tiebreakers are not necessarily stupid. It all depends on what a league wants to do, and which parts of the NFL the given fantasy league chooses to emulate. If H2H is stupid for tiebreakers, than it logically follows it's stupid to do H2H at all. Why not use total points to determine all the seeds, then? But I'm digressing...

It's unfortunate that the rules do not spell out SPECIFICALLY "head to head among all tied teams" or "head to head if only two teams are tied" and I guarantee you others who will come to this thread will disagree with what I consider to be the default, but Head to Head as a tiebreaker descends from the NFL, and in the NFL, it always involves all tied teams. Link (be sure to look at 3 or more teams)

In your scenario, the head to head eliminates team R (R gets the 3rd position in the division).

Then the total points tie-breaker gives the division to J, leaving F in 2nd place.

How does it work that teams in a division don't play each other the same number of times? Are there too many teams in a division for that to work? This sounds like the Big East with the unbalanced schedule for basketball, and there, when teams are tied, they also compare records among all tied teams, but they do not use the tie-breaker if a team could have equaled other teams records in head-to-head play had they played the same number of games. But that doesn't apply here, because even if you give R another game, the best their record can be is 1-2. It's actually pretty simple, in that R lost to both teams, while J and F split their two games against each other, so R is left behind.

 

[grateful zed]

this is not an nfl question.

 

[OddibeMcD]

I agree with the Jerk and that team J should win the division.

 

[Go Blue]

The way I see it, if one team doesn't have the H2H tie-breaker over BOTH the other two teams, then you go straight to total points, so team R gets it.

 

[two_dollars]

Using the order of tie breakers listed, team J is the victor by 3 points.

 

[Eulogys]

You use the tiebreaker(s) not only to identify a winner, but also to eliminate a team. Once you eliminate the team with the worst H2H record, you revert back to the 1st tiebreaker with the remaining teams.

 

[reprisal]

R lost to both J & F, therefore loses tiebreak vs both of them - 3rd place. J & F are tied H2H, F has less points - 2nd. Congrats to J.

In other words, a tie between only J & R yields J. A tie between R & F yields F. A tie between J & F yields J. J is 1st. F is 2nd. If a tie between J & F yields R then you have a flawed system or a logical fallacy.

 

[DoubleG]

Just to add: it's playoff "seedings".

 

[cascaa]

The way I see it because of the fact that the 3 teams did not play each other the same amount of times in the division( not very smart) you must go to points!

 

[notdarkyet]

If for the 3 seed, Team J.

If these are the best non-division winning records, the 4th seed should go to Team F.

If 1185 is the most points out of the remaining teams, Team R gets the 5 seed.

 

[Bri]

The way I see it because of the fact that the 3 teams did not play each other the same amount of times in the division( not very smart) you must go to points!

no, won loss percentage. We always use one loss percentage but don't necessarily realize it because we often speak like 1 win instead of 100%. Won loss percentage in the matchups is not a variation of the rule but exactly what it's asking for. Again, the confusion is simply understanding the 100% thing

 

[Bri]

richtown,

doesn't the computer and/or website script figure this out for you?

 

[Flash]

The way I see it because of the fact that the 3 teams did not play each other the same amount of times in the division( not very smart) you must go to points!

Exactly. You cannot use H2H if the teams didn't play each other the same amount of games.Why on earth that would be considering they are all in the same Division is beyond me, but since that's how it is, Team R has to be the winner here.

 

[SwampDawg]

The way I see it because of the fact that the 3 teams did not play each other the same amount of times in the division( not very smart) you must go to points!

Exactly. You cannot use H2H if the teams didn't play each other the same amount of games.Why on earth that would be considering they are all in the same Division is beyond me, but since that's how it is, Team R has to be the winner here.

Totally agree with this, team R. In our league to win a 3 way tie by H2H it clearly states one team must defeat all the other teams, if there are any combination of losses it moves to the next tie break with all teams still alive. Also not having division teams play each other and equal number of times is dumb.

 

[The Jerk]

The way I see it because of the fact that the 3 teams did not play each other the same amount of times in the division( not very smart) you must go to points!

Exactly. You cannot use H2H if the teams didn't play each other the same amount of games.Why on earth that would be considering they are all in the same Division is beyond me, but since that's how it is, Team R has to be the winner here.

Totally agree with this, team R. In our league to win a 3 way tie by H2H it clearly states one team must defeat all the other teams, if there are any combination of losses it moves to the next tie break with all teams still alive. Also not having division teams play each other and equal number of times is dumb.

The obvious difference is that in the OP's league, the rule is not clearly stated as in your league. I agree that not having division teams play each other an equal number of times is dumb, but in the times they actually did play each other, the results were clear. Team R lost both to both of the other teams. Given the absence of specifics in the rules -- which should absolutely be addressed for future seasons -- I think it is most logical to proceed with what actually happened, which is Team R being 0-2 -- than what didn't happen, which is the other game(s). But as I said early on, there will not be consensus on how to interpret this scenario.

 

[Keepers]

I agree that if going with head-head should have provisions about not playing the same # of games against each other, what happens in a 3-way tie, etc. But since you don't have those there isn't any choice but to go with what the rules state and that is head-head in all circumstances, and in this case the order of teams would be J, F and R.

For next year you may want to vote on changing or cleaning up the tie breaker rules but for this year have no choice.

 

[GoRaiders]

There are three teams in a division tied at 7-6Team J is 7-6 with 1,075 points and has a head to head record of 2-1 with the other two teamsTeam F is 7-6 with 1,072 points and has a head to head record of 2-1 with the other two teamsTeam R is 7-6 with 1,185 points and has a head to head record of 0-2 with the other teams.Teams J and F split their games (H2H record of 1-1)

Not having teams in the same divison play each other the same amount of times is str8 nutz. That is your first problem. Second problem, if you use H-T-H and teams don't play each other the same amount of times, then you need to adjust the H-T-H to be winning % against all tied teams. With that clause, Team R would be out, Team J and F would tie, then go to Total points, with Team J winning.Sounds like your Commish realized the league is a mess, the scheduling is zoo, and the rules are not clearly defined, so just went to total points.