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Giant WRs (1 Viewer)

gregjcross

Footballguy
I think the G-Men wide outs will be the hardest to predict yet could yield some late round producers. Steve Smith, Dom Hixon, Mario Manningham, Hakeem Nicks, Sinorice Moss are all getting ink for their camp work. I think Nicks wont be ready to claim a starting job.

Depending on how my draft goes, i might grab a pair of them in rounds 9/10 of a redraft and hope to hit.

 
I think you revealed the problem right in your post. If 5 guys split the workload (all with a similar sized slice), then none of them will be great fantasy options. I guess as late round roster fillers they might be worth a flyer. If it looked like one of them had the inside track on being productive, then that guy would definitely be worth a late round pick.

 
I thought I read somewhere that many scouts had Nicks rated as the most NFL ready WR in the draft. Maybe I was dreaming?! I like Nicks and Smith to be the top 2 and there is very good late value there.

 
I think you revealed the problem right in your post. If 5 guys split the workload (all with a similar sized slice), then none of them will be great fantasy options. I guess as late round roster fillers they might be worth a flyer. If it looked like one of them had the inside track on being productive, then that guy would definitely be worth a late round pick.
I think it's unlikely that all five guys will split the workload evenly. I don't see Hixon as anything more than a deep threat. Moss and Manningham have done nothing in their careers to cause optimism. Manningham is still a young player with a chance to turn it around, but I don't have much faith in his skills. I think we'll see Nicks and Smith emerge as the clear top two here. Nicks has the higher ceiling IMO. I think he can have the kind of rookie season that Dwayne Bowe had.
 
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Comparing a rookie WR to a player who has been in the league (and on the same team with the same OC/HC/playbook) is tough if they are all considered similar caliber talent.

I like Dom Hixon for his comparative size to Steve Smith (6'2" vs 5'10"). Hicks comes in at 6'1", but has to learn the system. He may be "ready" to learn it, but it is still a process. Manning is also under 6', but has to show he can stay healthy and contribute on the field.

Hixon has the opportunity to step up. I like his "value" since he is so cheap. NYG clearly are a run first offense, but if they throw comparable to 2008, Eli will toss about 300 completions of 500 attempts. Splitting that size of a pie is nice since they don't have a real catching TE threat.

Assumption here: Dom Hixon and Steve Smith as starting WR's. Put 60% of the targets go their way. Both could get close to 90 rec and 1000 yards.

It's worth a bit more than a late round sleeper pick. After you fill in your starters, I would look at players in situations like this who could contribute more than their ADP.

 
If you hadn't seen enough last year; people will realize how much Eli really sucks without Plax.....Plan used to actually make Eli's throws look accurate. Now, we will see the 50% completion rates again.

 
If you hadn't seen enough last year; people will realize how much Eli really sucks without Plax.....Plan used to actually make Eli's throws look accurate. Now, we will see the 50% completion rates again.
There is still fantasy points to be had in NY out of the WR spot. Specifically if 1-2 guys emerge as regular every down players. Eli has consistently thrown for 20 plus TD's throughout his career as well.My guess is the most consistent guy will be S. Smith. I think he will lead the Giants receivers in targets.The red zone package is going to be worth watching as well seeing what they do without Plax. Does a guy like Boss become a little more valuable out of the TE spot?
 
If you hadn't seen enough last year; people will realize how much Eli really sucks without Plax.....Plan used to actually make Eli's throws look accurate. Now, we will see the 50% completion rates again.
There is still fantasy points to be had in NY out of the WR spot. Specifically if 1-2 guys emerge as regular every down players. Eli has consistently thrown for 20 plus TD's throughout his career as well.My guess is the most consistent guy will be S. Smith. I think he will lead the Giants receivers in targets.The red zone package is going to be worth watching as well seeing what they do without Plax. Does a guy like Boss become a little more valuable out of the TE spot?
To me this all depends on how it is played from the fantasy GM perspective. We know Boss wont lead the team in catches, and we know whoever does is probably a Fantasy WR#3 with upside as a low #2. In deep redraft leagues (large roster) you can gamble on two of them, say S.Smith and Manningham and hope to get a WR3 for 10th round or later picks. I believe its same thing with JAX WRs, Holt and MIke Walker, just get both if late enough in draft.xx
 
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I thought I read somewhere that many scouts had Nicks rated as the most NFL ready WR in the draft. Maybe I was dreaming?! I like Nicks and Smith to be the top 2 and there is very good late value there.
I thought it was Kenny Britt, but I can't remember where I read that either... Nicks has a much better QB so he may not be the most NFL ready WR of the two but he will likely put up more FFB points...
 
If you hadn't seen enough last year; people will realize how much Eli really sucks without Plax.....Plan used to actually make Eli's throws look accurate. Now, we will see the 50% completion rates again.
I would take these arguments more seriously if those making those arguments don't go to the extreme of 'Eli sucks'.Clearly Eli suffered without Plax, as any QB would suffer without his #1 WR, but more specifically he seems to throw a loose spiral that tends to wobble in high winds. Fortunately for him, this is his last year is the swirling winds of the Meadowlands.There are definitely holes in his game, but 'Eli sucks without Plax' is simple hyperbole that adds nothing to the conversation.
 
I think you revealed the problem right in your post. If 5 guys split the workload (all with a similar sized slice), then none of them will be great fantasy options. I guess as late round roster fillers they might be worth a flyer. If it looked like one of them had the inside track on being productive, then that guy would definitely be worth a late round pick.
I think it's unlikely that all five guys will split the workload evenly. I don't see Hixon as anything more than a deep threat. Moss and Manningham have done nothing in their careers to cause optimism. Manningham is still a young player with a chance to turn it around, but I don't have much faith in his skills.

I think we'll see Nicks and Smith emerge as the clear top two here. Nicks has the higher ceiling IMO. I think he can have the kind of rookie season that Dwayne Bowe had.
I'd be interested in hearing more about your take on him.From what I've heard/seen, he has great skills but is dumb as a post.

 
I think you revealed the problem right in your post. If 5 guys split the workload (all with a similar sized slice), then none of them will be great fantasy options. I guess as late round roster fillers they might be worth a flyer. If it looked like one of them had the inside track on being productive, then that guy would definitely be worth a late round pick.
I think it's unlikely that all five guys will split the workload evenly. I don't see Hixon as anything more than a deep threat. Moss and Manningham have done nothing in their careers to cause optimism. Manningham is still a young player with a chance to turn it around, but I don't have much faith in his skills.

I think we'll see Nicks and Smith emerge as the clear top two here. Nicks has the higher ceiling IMO. I think he can have the kind of rookie season that Dwayne Bowe had.
I'd be interested in hearing more about your take on him.From what I've heard/seen, he has great skills but is dumb as a post.
I didn't particularly like him when he was coming out and I didn't draft him on any of my teams last year. He's neither big nor fast and I don't like the way he moves. IMO he's a college overachiever who lacks the physical ability to be an effective starter in the NFL. Add in the intelligence concerns and he's not someone I'm excited about at all.
 
If you hadn't seen enough last year; people will realize how much Eli really sucks without Plax.....Plan used to actually make Eli's throws look accurate. Now, we will see the 50% completion rates again.
I would take these arguments more seriously if those making those arguments don't go to the extreme of 'Eli sucks'.Clearly Eli suffered without Plax, as any QB would suffer without his #1 WR, but more specifically he seems to throw a loose spiral that tends to wobble in high winds. Fortunately for him, this is his last year is the swirling winds of the Meadowlands.There are definitely holes in his game, but 'Eli sucks without Plax' is simple hyperbole that adds nothing to the conversation.
Exactly. I really think Smith will emerge as Eli's favorite target and become a highly-coveted PPR threat, while jumping up to a WR2-3 level in non-PPR leagues. 90-1100 is definitely not out of the question. I'm concerned about the effect of the new stadium, though -- or, more accurately, not really knowing what that effect is going to be. I know these are two different sports, but I don't think anyone thought that the new Yankee Stadium was going to become Coors East, and hopefully the dynamics of the new Giants Stadium will not make it even worse than it is now...
 
I think people are writing Hixon off to fast. I think he did a good job of stepping in for Plex. Anybody expecting him to come in cold and put up Plex type numbers were expecting too much. He was able to get open deep and make good plays. Sure he was a little inconsistent but that should have been expected from a inexperienced starter. I think given the same opprotunities this year he will put up respectable numbers. Repetitions mean everything. I still believe you will see Hixon in Burress spot, Smith in Toomers and Nicks in Toomers and Smith in the slot when they go three wide which I think could be often.

 
Hixon is just another DJ Hackett IMO. Lots of hype for a marginal talent. If the Giants felt he was a starting caliber WR then I don't think they would have drafted Nicks and Barden. Nevermind the fact that Denver cut him outright.

 
Hixon is just another DJ Hackett IMO. Lots of hype for a marginal talent. If the Giants felt he was a starting caliber WR then I don't think they would have drafted Nicks and Barden. Nevermind the fact that Denver cut him outright.
He was on the other end of the collision that paralyzed Kevin Everett and the word is he was hit pretty hard by it and had some trouble dealing with some guilt issues. It affected his play and was cut a month later. He may well not amount to much but he's definitely a player who needed a fresh start somewhere.
 
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I'll be surprised if Steve Smith doesn't lead the team in receptions, or at least top his team leading 57 receptions last year.

 
Blurb from Gillbride, bad news about Beckum but good news on Manningham:

June 18

Q: Beckum is a different kind of player than you have had. Effect of him being limited in OTAs and minicamp due to injury?

A: It is hard. You hope that they can recover. But I think we have seen over the last couple of years when a guy has missed this period and missed part of training camp – Steve Smith didn’t really contribute until the end of the season. Mario Manningham didn’t do much at all last year for us. It is hard to make this time up when you have missed it and you keep your fingers crossed, you hope he is a quick learner, you hope that he can maybe develop more quickly than the average guy. But history shows that if you don’t go through this time period or you miss much of camp, it is hard to be ready and contribute during your first year. And so that is why – he is one of the guys - …..but you see a guy – Mario, he is showing some things that we thought he could do which we never saw last year. Now all of a sudden he is doing it because he is actually practicing. He is actually learning. It is one thing to hear it in the meetings, it is completely different to actually experience it on the field; learn, “Oh, this is what you meant.” It is like the light goes on. It didn’t necessarily fall into place for him in the meeting, now it does. So he is one of the guys you say, “Hey, maybe we got a guy. Maybe he can do what we thought he could do.” So it is disappointing because we thought Beckum would be a guy that we would put out in space maybe and prove a difficult matchup for defenses. And I don’t know. He missed this whole time. It certainly sets him back and you don’t want to say he can’t do it, but he will be one of the unusual ones if he can.

Q: Were you putting in new things for him because he is a different kind of guy than you have had?

A: No, not really. Plus it would be a chance – you are always looking to put your best 11 matchup – who matches up best for you, gives you your best chance. And putting him in space – I hate to ever compare – but it kind of gives you a Dallas Clark kind of guy if that makes sense….. Is it a linebacker? You would like he is going to be quicker and hard to match up with. If it is a secondary guy, then he is bigger and strong. Maybe you could run the ball a little bit more. He ought to match up pretty well blocking. So that is what we are anxious to see. We know, like Steve Smith has proven, he can play inside and he is hard to match up. You are always looking for more than one guy or they start ganging up on that one guy that can do it. So we were hoping that he could give us that – be one of those guys for us.

On going deep this season:

Q: You talked a lot about throwing the ball down the field. Is seems like they might be quicker to get down there, but the window is smaller. How do you handle that with your quarterback as far as down the field accuracy?

A: I think it is the same with any throw. It is, “How do you get open?” And each guy is different. And I think we have talked about it. A Larry Fitzgerald is going to get open and catch the ball his way. When I was with the Oilers they were all little and they all got open and Warren Moon had no difficulty throwing them the ball. But you have to create your separation. And so you are not going to create it with strength and jumping up over somebody not necessarily. So can you create it with your quickness, with the sophistication of your movement and the way you set your routes up? Again, knock on wood, this spring a couple of guys showed some things. And that was encouraging to see. Can they do it against somebody else? It remains to be seen. But there is no reason why they can’t. That is what is encouraging. I think they will be able to do that. Now, it is a different kind of a throw if you don’t have that kind of separation? You don’t get the distance from that defender. It is a tougher throw because you are not as big a target. And you are maybe not able to go get the ball just because you are bigger and stronger – like a Plax reaching up and grabbing it. You can’t do that so you have to do it a different way. But I think we feel – and I’m saying the same thing over and over again – that these guys look like they had the quickness and the speed and now we have to make sure that they progress in their sophistication of their route running to give them a chance to get the separation so that the quarterback can feel good about throwing the ball.

Q: So when they don’t get that separation, do you tell your quarterback -- Plax sometimes didn’t look like he was open – there was a guy there, but he was open – one on one. But you tell these quarterbacks that they have to be careful?

A: No. It doesn’t take long to figure out who you can still throw the ball with and they will go get it and who is not going to be strong enough to get it; who can you throw behind and is he quick enough to adjust and to come back and get the ball. I think you will know pretty quickly who is going to do that. And as you throw – that is what I tell the receivers, “You have got to understand, it is not just me and Sully and Chris deciding, ‘hey, this guy can do this,’ quarterbacks are formulating opinions, too. And they see the guys that do it in practice, “Hey, I can count on this guy” or “He doesn’t fight for me, he doesn’t make the play when you are covered like that.” So it not just me saying, “Hey, we can call this or we can call that.” He is making those same decisions. So it is so important that you do things in practice in a way that earns the confidence of the quarterback. Because there is no question that it influences their decision.

 
Newsday reports Giants rookie WRs Hakeem Nicks and Ramses Barden "looked terrific" during the recent minicamp. The report says "the thing you want to see from rookies in this setting is precise route-running and consistent catching. They were excellent at both. In time, this receiver group will be excellent."

 
If Nicks doesn't turn into 'the guy' for the NYG I'd like to be holding Moss and Barden.

Moss would be the shortest successful WR since at least 1998, and Barden would be the tallest. So it'd be unusual, but I still like both of them more than I do Hixon or Steve Smith. Those guys could be useful pieces, but they aren't #1 WR material IMO.

I think drafting Nicks and then covering with Barden and Moss would give a pretty decent shot at finding a long-term top-20 FF WR fairly cheap.

 
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If Nicks doesn't turn into 'the guy' for the NYG I'd like to be holding Moss and Barden.

Moss would be the shortest successful WR since at least 1998, and Barden would be the tallest. So it'd be unusual, but I still like both of them more than I do Hixon or Steve Smith. Those guys could be useful pieces, but they aren't #1 WR material IMO.

I think drafting Nicks and then covering with Barden and Moss would give a pretty decent shot at finding a long-term top-20 FF WR fairly cheap.
What has Moss ever done in the NFL to make you like him more than Hixon or Smith? :thumbup:
 
I think you revealed the problem right in your post. If 5 guys split the workload (all with a similar sized slice), then none of them will be great fantasy options. I guess as late round roster fillers they might be worth a flyer. If it looked like one of them had the inside track on being productive, then that guy would definitely be worth a late round pick.
I think it's unlikely that all five guys will split the workload evenly. I don't see Hixon as anything more than a deep threat. Moss and Manningham have done nothing in their careers to cause optimism. Manningham is still a young player with a chance to turn it around, but I don't have much faith in his skills.

I think we'll see Nicks and Smith emerge as the clear top two here. Nicks has the higher ceiling IMO. I think he can have the kind of rookie season that Dwayne Bowe had.
I'd be interested in hearing more about your take on him.From what I've heard/seen, he has great skills but is dumb as a post.
I didn't particularly like him when he was coming out and I didn't draft him on any of my teams last year. He's neither big nor fast and I don't like the way he moves. IMO he's a college overachiever who lacks the physical ability to be an effective starter in the NFL. Add in the intelligence concerns and he's not someone I'm excited about at all.
Manningham is outperforming Hicks and far better than in 2008. Hicks' fans don't need to get upset, this is how camp competition is supposed to play out. They just need to hope he now improves and earns a starting role. No way should Mario or Smith just give it up to him, he's gotta earn it. Also it's not uncommon for a rook WR to struggle at times in the early offseason.BTW Ramses was forgotten in OP and much of discussion.

I think people are underestimating (also young) Domenik Hixon. Getting cut/released from Denver has done that kid a world of good. He's developing nicely and maybe some need to go re-read the fond comments he received when he was drafted. He did struggle as the #1 WR at times and did well other times. That's typical. The FF world seems to but the Giants sure have not given up on this kid at all.

IMO It is Hixon and Smith and hopefully a youngster affords them the opportunity to move Smith to the slot and play alot of 3WR sets. I highly doubt anyone budges Hixon out of his spot and so he's by far the safest WR draft pick for FF drafts from the Giants.

Anyone else is also possibly benched in the red zone so that big Barden can come in. He might be a different type of TD vulture in 09.

For dynasty, Barden is my pick without any question. Even the Plax haters from Pittsburgh and NY, the Moss haters....even they'd admit that when you're that big with some speed you are a weapon. In time, I think he's going to be very dangerous.

I have a buddy that compares him to a slew of failed tall WRs so maybe I am out on a limb but.....I like that rook alot.

 
If Nicks doesn't turn into 'the guy' for the NYG I'd like to be holding Moss and Barden.

Moss would be the shortest successful WR since at least 1998, and Barden would be the tallest. So it'd be unusual, but I still like both of them more than I do Hixon or Steve Smith. Those guys could be useful pieces, but they aren't #1 WR material IMO.

I think drafting Nicks and then covering with Barden and Moss would give a pretty decent shot at finding a long-term top-20 FF WR fairly cheap.
What has Moss ever done in the NFL to make you like him more than Hixon or Smith? :thumbup:
found a way to NOT be productive and still be in the league? I remember a "his leg leaked jet fuel" joke/comment when he got hurt as a rook. It's kind of funny that it really is as if that happened. Try explaining their logic another way.

 
I think people are underestimating (also young) Domenik Hixon. Getting cut/released from Denver has done that kid a world of good. He's developing nicely and maybe some need to go re-read the fond comments he received when he was drafted. He did struggle as the #1 WR at times and did well other times. That's typical. The FF world seems to but the Giants sure have not given up on this kid at all.

IMO It is Hixon and Smith and hopefully a youngster affords them the opportunity to move Smith to the slot and play alot of 3WR sets. I highly doubt anyone budges Hixon out of his spot and so he's by far the safest WR draft pick for FF drafts from the Giants.
If anything, I think the FF world is more infatuated with Hixon than they should be. You said the Giants haven't given up on him, but they used high draft picks on Nicks and Barden. I'm not sure they would've grabbed those guys if they felt good about their WR situation. Maybe Hixon will surprise, but he looks like a typical journeyman/backup type. From what I can tell he's basically Nate Washington with a little more hype (and that comparison might be unfair to Nate Washington).Nicks was drafted to eventually become a starter. Unless he proves to be a huge bust, I expect him to make a strong push for a starting job as early as this season. Of all the WRs on the Giants, he's the one who makes the most sense as an NFL WR1. Barden could be an interesting project down the road. He has some Colston-like qualities and he'd be my darkhorse pick. As I've been saying for a while though, I think Nicks and Smith are the most likely long term WR1 and WR2 candidates on this team. Those are the guys I would be focusing on in redraft leagues. Hixon and Moss look like roster filler who probably couldn't make the 53 man roster for half the teams in the league based on their WR abilities alone.

 
I didn't mean to give the impression that I was big on Moss or anything - it's more a comment on how I see Smith and, especially, Hixon. Hixon could have some use as an NFL WR2 - a poor man's Berrian, field-stretcher type. But there's absolutely nothing in his performance so far that suggests he's a big time WR. And obviously the Giants don't think so either, or they wouldn't have spent a 1st and a 3rd on WRs.

Leaving Moss's injuries aside for a minute - he's only 5'8" and as far as I can tell there haven't been any guys that short turn into FF relevant WRs in some time, if ever. If he were taller (and healthy) I'd like him a lot, but as it is I think he's a longshot wildcard.

Barden probably needs to bulk up some, but he's a very intriguing guy. Ten productive pounds heavier and he'd be a fantastic prospect IMO, but as it is who knows. He's long and slender enough that he may get pushed around and have trouble getting off the line even at 227.

I think Steve Smith is a nice, tidy NFL-useful WR who probably won't be fantasy-relevant over more than a year or two as a WR3 or something. But I agree he's better than Hixon.

 
I think people are underestimating (also young) Domenik Hixon. Getting cut/released from Denver has done that kid a world of good. He's developing nicely and maybe some need to go re-read the fond comments he received when he was drafted. He did struggle as the #1 WR at times and did well other times. That's typical. The FF world seems to but the Giants sure have not given up on this kid at all.

IMO It is Hixon and Smith and hopefully a youngster affords them the opportunity to move Smith to the slot and play alot of 3WR sets. I highly doubt anyone budges Hixon out of his spot and so he's by far the safest WR draft pick for FF drafts from the Giants.
If anything, I think the FF world is more infatuated with Hixon than they should be. You said the Giants haven't given up on him, but they used high draft picks on Nicks and Barden. I'm not sure they would've grabbed those guys if they felt good about their WR situation. Maybe Hixon will surprise, but he looks like a typical journeyman/backup type. From what I can tell he's basically Nate Washington with a little more hype (and that comparison might be unfair to Nate Washington).Nicks was drafted to eventually become a starter. Unless he proves to be a huge bust, I expect him to make a strong push for a starting job as early as this season. Of all the WRs on the Giants, he's the one who makes the most sense as an NFL WR1. Barden could be an interesting project down the road. He has some Colston-like qualities and he'd be my darkhorse pick. As I've been saying for a while though, I think Nicks and Smith are the most likely long term WR1 and WR2 candidates on this team. Those are the guys I would be focusing on in redraft leagues. Hixon and Moss look like roster filler who probably couldn't make the 53 man roster for half the teams in the league based on their WR abilities alone.
I've seen Hixon go undrafted and/or go last round so; we're not on the same page yet apparently in drafts.Barden(from what I've read) was BPA so while you may be right on the Nate comparison, I don't think it was so extreme.

 
While I am not sure which guy will benefit the most from it, I think the Giants will be better at the deep ball this year.

They finally have a indoor practice field that is 100 yards and they have been practicing the deep ball

 
I really don't understand the thought that Hixon won't produce. I know about 'the drop', but the guy got thrusted into the WR1 position last year after having almost zero playing time. He stats weren't horrible. Now he has a whole offseason in that role with a good QB and a good running game. FBG's predictions are for him to put up a slightly better numbers than he did last year when he only started 7 games??? I'm bewildered why people think its more likely he will lose his job to the likes of Steve Smith or rookies that have never played NFL ball. Hixon didn't bust with his opportunity last year. He did what I would expect a rookie to have done. I think he has the best chance out of the NY WRs to produce this year. I wouldn't be shocked at 1000 yards 9 TDs. The guy's rep is that he works hard and has skills. So he dropped a pass last year, happens to the best of them....

 
I really don't understand the thought that Hixon won't produce. I know about 'the drop', but the guy got thrusted into the WR1 position last year after having almost zero playing time. He stats weren't horrible. Now he has a whole offseason in that role with a good QB and a good running game. FBG's predictions are for him to put up a slightly better numbers than he did last year when he only started 7 games??? I'm bewildered why people think its more likely he will lose his job to the likes of Steve Smith or rookies that have never played NFL ball. Hixon didn't bust with his opportunity last year. He did what I would expect a rookie to have done. I think he has the best chance out of the NY WRs to produce this year. I wouldn't be shocked at 1000 yards 9 TDs. The guy's rep is that he works hard and has skills. So he dropped a pass last year, happens to the best of them....
I was just about to post the same thing. In the 7 games he started for Plax, he was 32-453-2. For 16 games, that pace would amount to 73-1035-5. Except for the TDs, that's about an average year for Plax and it came from a guy who only caught 1 pass in his career prior to last year. It wouldn't be unusual to expect him to improve on that.
 
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I didn't mean to give the impression that I was big on Moss or anything - it's more a comment on how I see Smith and, especially, Hixon. Hixon could have some use as an NFL WR2 - a poor man's Berrian, field-stretcher type. But there's absolutely nothing in his performance so far that suggests he's a big time WR. And obviously the Giants don't think so either, or they wouldn't have spent a 1st and a 3rd on WRs.

Leaving Moss's injuries aside for a minute - he's only 5'8" and as far as I can tell there haven't been any guys that short turn into FF relevant WRs in some time, if ever. If he were taller (and healthy) I'd like him a lot, but as it is I think he's a longshot wildcard.

Barden probably needs to bulk up some, but he's a very intriguing guy. Ten productive pounds heavier and he'd be a fantastic prospect IMO, but as it is who knows. He's long and slender enough that he may get pushed around and have trouble getting off the line even at 227.

I think Steve Smith is a nice, tidy NFL-useful WR who probably won't be fantasy-relevant over more than a year or two as a WR3 or something. But I agree he's better than Hixon.
Not to harp on it, but given what he's shown in the NFL if he was healthy as an ox and 6'10", I haven't seen much to like about Moss, let alone a lot.
 
Camp news has been that Moss is doing well. I think he'll be 5th on the depth chart. I think the depth chart will be Smith, Hixon, Manningham, Nicks, Moss, Barden. I think they go with targets that Manning has more faith in since the seperation these WRs will get won't be as big as Plax. Nicks will be a starter eventually but I don't think it will be this year unless his play demands it. Moss I think will be a change of pace, mismatch and deep route guy in 4 wr sets. Barden, I don't remember reading that he's impressed or disappointed during camp for that matter, I think he's a project guy and won't be relied on as an endzone target this year. I think in the endzone they want their best hands in there over their tallest guys.In my opinion He may take some of the plays where Beckum would have split out if Beckum continues to be hindered by injury.

 
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netnalp said:
Camp news has been that Moss is doing well. I think he'll be 5th on the depth chart. I think the depth chart will be Smith, Hixon, Manningham, Nicks, Moss, Barden. I think they go with targets that Manning has more faith in since the seperation these WRs will get won't be as big as Plax. Nicks will be a starter eventually but I don't think it will be this year unless his play demands it. Moss I think will be a change of pace, mismatch and deep route guy in 4 wr sets. Barden, I don't remember reading that he's impressed or disappointed during camp for that matter, I think he's a project guy and won't be relied on as an endzone target this year. I think in the endzone they want their best hands in there over their tallest guys.In my opinion He may take some of the plays where Beckum would have split out if Beckum continues to be hindered by injury.
... and Moss getting hurt... again.
 
Nicks is really starting to grow on me. Not as much in redraft for this season because who knows with a rookie, but in dynasty he is becoming one of my favorite targets. Seems to have all the physical tools, but also the drive and ambition to be one of the best; I hear he's spending a lot of time watching film, taking extra reps, the things that make good players great.

 
Nicks is really starting to grow on me. Not as much in redraft for this season because who knows with a rookie, but in dynasty he is becoming one of my favorite targets. Seems to have all the physical tools, but also the drive and ambition to be one of the best; I hear he's spending a lot of time watching film, taking extra reps, the things that make good players great.
All the recent Giants WRs rookies have been hyped in mini camp... while it doesnt mean Hakeem Nicks isnt the best of them,its merely gratuitous for the NY and national media to talk about him before pads are on because he hasnt had a chance to screw anything up yet. The history here over last three years/drafts: 2006 - Santana Moss -- I remember reading from Peter King that Sinorice Moss would rapidly become Eli's favorite target and had quickness similar to Devin Hester. This was only after the first two mini camp practices . And it was fueled becasue of the fact that Toomer looked like he was on his last legs.2007: S.Smith -- That he was "the rookie dark horse who was catching everything" (This was true) and most polished newcomer in years (hype); was he wouldnt dissapoint like Sinorice Moss because he was healthier/sturdier.2008: Mario Manningham -- Right after last year's draft: "...one of the most talented three WRs in all the draft and the Giants had a steal, beccause Reese/Coughlin will know how to deal with his immaturity." 2009: Today its Hakeem Nicks, the daily highlight reel from most practices at Mini camp.
 
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I think you could draft K Boss very late get 700/5 out of him and

pair him up with another semi late drafted TE -Carlson, Celek, Shiancoe

and get better results.

EVERYONE looks good right now.

I'd take a flier on Bucs M Clayton first or Jets Stucky/Clowney combo.

 
I think people are underestimating (also young) Domenik Hixon. Getting cut/released from Denver has done that kid a world of good. He's developing nicely and maybe some need to go re-read the fond comments he received when he was drafted. He did struggle as the #1 WR at times and did well other times. That's typical. The FF world seems to but the Giants sure have not given up on this kid at all.

IMO It is Hixon and Smith and hopefully a youngster affords them the opportunity to move Smith to the slot and play alot of 3WR sets. I highly doubt anyone budges Hixon out of his spot and so he's by far the safest WR draft pick for FF drafts from the Giants.
If anything, I think the FF world is more infatuated with Hixon than they should be. You said the Giants haven't given up on him, but they used high draft picks on Nicks and Barden. I'm not sure they would've grabbed those guys if they felt good about their WR situation. Maybe Hixon will surprise, but he looks like a typical journeyman/backup type. From what I can tell he's basically Nate Washington with a little more hype (and that comparison might be unfair to Nate Washington).Nicks was drafted to eventually become a starter. Unless he proves to be a huge bust, I expect him to make a strong push for a starting job as early as this season. Of all the WRs on the Giants, he's the one who makes the most sense as an NFL WR1. Barden could be an interesting project down the road. He has some Colston-like qualities and he'd be my darkhorse pick. As I've been saying for a while though, I think Nicks and Smith are the most likely long term WR1 and WR2 candidates on this team. Those are the guys I would be focusing on in redraft leagues. Hixon and Moss look like roster filler who probably couldn't make the 53 man roster for half the teams in the league based on their WR abilities alone.
Completely agree that Nicks/Smith are the future at the Giants wideout position. They have differing skill sets that compliment each other. There seem to be Smith haters that want to bash his long range prospects because he's not #1WR caliber. Well you can have a damn fine career and still not be a #1 WR. Smith will be Eli's favorite 3rd down target and will continue to develop as a strong possession receiver. Nicks's amazing hands and work ethic will transform him into the #1 WR in a short amount of time. As a general rule I susbcribe to the theory that you shouldn't expect much from rookie receivers so I won't predict greatness from him in year 1 but I don't think 750 yards and 5 scores is unrealistic from Nicks. Hixon is a nice story and I like his work ethic. I haven't allowed his bad drop against the Eagles to jade my opinion of him, but I will say that he struggled to get open consistently while playing in place of Plax. Maybe the Giants were using him incorrectly as they needed a guy who could stretch the field. However the role that he played last year is not one that I see him holding for the long term. He may start opposite Smith in week 1 but he's keeping the seat warm until Nicks is ready to take it. I agree with Avery that it's going to take more than glowing camp reports to get me excited about Sinorice Moss. Seems like the only play the Giants have in the book for him is the quick screen, and even if the guy is lightning fast, he falls down when a defender enters the same county as him. I think he and Barden are fighting for the same roster spot. People are forgetting that the Giants haven't given up on David Tyree either. He missed all of last year with injury but is an outstanding special teams player. If Nicks/Hixon is the 1 and Smith is the 2, Manningham fills in the depth. If Tyree is healthy he'll likely make the roster. That leaves Barden and Moss competing for the same spot. I'm not particularly fond of either but I'm willing to give Barden a shot since Pee Wee hasn't done anything with the opportunity.

 
I think people are underestimating (also young) Domenik Hixon. Getting cut/released from Denver has done that kid a world of good. He's developing nicely and maybe some need to go re-read the fond comments he received when he was drafted. He did struggle as the #1 WR at times and did well other times. That's typical. The FF world seems to but the Giants sure have not given up on this kid at all.

IMO It is Hixon and Smith and hopefully a youngster affords them the opportunity to move Smith to the slot and play alot of 3WR sets. I highly doubt anyone budges Hixon out of his spot and so he's by far the safest WR draft pick for FF drafts from the Giants.
If anything, I think the FF world is more infatuated with Hixon than they should be. You said the Giants haven't given up on him, but they used high draft picks on Nicks and Barden. I'm not sure they would've grabbed those guys if they felt good about their WR situation. Maybe Hixon will surprise, but he looks like a typical journeyman/backup type. From what I can tell he's basically Nate Washington with a little more hype (and that comparison might be unfair to Nate Washington).Nicks was drafted to eventually become a starter. Unless he proves to be a huge bust, I expect him to make a strong push for a starting job as early as this season. Of all the WRs on the Giants, he's the one who makes the most sense as an NFL WR1. Barden could be an interesting project down the road. He has some Colston-like qualities and he'd be my darkhorse pick. As I've been saying for a while though, I think Nicks and Smith are the most likely long term WR1 and WR2 candidates on this team. Those are the guys I would be focusing on in redraft leagues. Hixon and Moss look like roster filler who probably couldn't make the 53 man roster for half the teams in the league based on their WR abilities alone.
Completely agree that Nicks/Smith are the future at the Giants wideout position. They have differing skill sets that compliment each other. There seem to be Smith haters that want to bash his long range prospects because he's not #1WR caliber. Well you can have a damn fine career and still not be a #1 WR. Smith will be Eli's favorite 3rd down target and will continue to develop as a strong possession receiver. Nicks's amazing hands and work ethic will transform him into the #1 WR in a short amount of time. As a general rule I susbcribe to the theory that you shouldn't expect much from rookie receivers so I won't predict greatness from him in year 1 but I don't think 750 yards and 5 scores is unrealistic from Nicks. Hixon is a nice story and I like his work ethic. I haven't allowed his bad drop against the Eagles to jade my opinion of him, but I will say that he struggled to get open consistently while playing in place of Plax. Maybe the Giants were using him incorrectly as they needed a guy who could stretch the field. However the role that he played last year is not one that I see him holding for the long term. He may start opposite Smith in week 1 but he's keeping the seat warm until Nicks is ready to take it. I agree with Avery that it's going to take more than glowing camp reports to get me excited about Sinorice Moss. Seems like the only play the Giants have in the book for him is the quick screen, and even if the guy is lightning fast, he falls down when a defender enters the same county as him. I think he and Barden are fighting for the same roster spot. People are forgetting that the Giants haven't given up on David Tyree either. He missed all of last year with injury but is an outstanding special teams player. If Nicks/Hixon is the 1 and Smith is the 2, Manningham fills in the depth. If Tyree is healthy he'll likely make the roster. That leaves Barden and Moss competing for the same spot. I'm not particularly fond of either but I'm willing to give Barden a shot since Pee Wee hasn't done anything with the opportunity.
Some good points (especially the part where you agreed with me ;) ) but there is no way that the Giants 3rd round pick this year that they traded up to get is going to be fighting for a roster spot.
 
A receiver was left off from the Giants roster and that is the 6 foot 6 inch attempted replica of Plaxico Burress named Ramses Barden. The hopeful reincarnation of Plax cannot be left out as he will have major red zone consideration given his height. While he might not be talked about now because he is raw, injuries may propel him into significant time. If there are no major injuries to the Giant receivers, he is only a red zone threat.

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I think people are underestimating (also young) Domenik Hixon. Getting cut/released from Denver has done that kid a world of good. He's developing nicely and maybe some need to go re-read the fond comments he received when he was drafted. He did struggle as the #1 WR at times and did well other times. That's typical. The FF world seems to but the Giants sure have not given up on this kid at all.

IMO It is Hixon and Smith and hopefully a youngster affords them the opportunity to move Smith to the slot and play alot of 3WR sets. I highly doubt anyone budges Hixon out of his spot and so he's by far the safest WR draft pick for FF drafts from the Giants.
If anything, I think the FF world is more infatuated with Hixon than they should be. You said the Giants haven't given up on him, but they used high draft picks on Nicks and Barden. I'm not sure they would've grabbed those guys if they felt good about their WR situation. Maybe Hixon will surprise, but he looks like a typical journeyman/backup type. From what I can tell he's basically Nate Washington with a little more hype (and that comparison might be unfair to Nate Washington).Nicks was drafted to eventually become a starter. Unless he proves to be a huge bust, I expect him to make a strong push for a starting job as early as this season. Of all the WRs on the Giants, he's the one who makes the most sense as an NFL WR1. Barden could be an interesting project down the road. He has some Colston-like qualities and he'd be my darkhorse pick. As I've been saying for a while though, I think Nicks and Smith are the most likely long term WR1 and WR2 candidates on this team. Those are the guys I would be focusing on in redraft leagues. Hixon and Moss look like roster filler who probably couldn't make the 53 man roster for half the teams in the league based on their WR abilities alone.
Completely agree that Nicks/Smith are the future at the Giants wideout position. They have differing skill sets that compliment each other. There seem to be Smith haters that want to bash his long range prospects because he's not #1WR caliber. Well you can have a damn fine career and still not be a #1 WR. Smith will be Eli's favorite 3rd down target and will continue to develop as a strong possession receiver. Nicks's amazing hands and work ethic will transform him into the #1 WR in a short amount of time. As a general rule I susbcribe to the theory that you shouldn't expect much from rookie receivers so I won't predict greatness from him in year 1 but I don't think 750 yards and 5 scores is unrealistic from Nicks. Hixon is a nice story and I like his work ethic. I haven't allowed his bad drop against the Eagles to jade my opinion of him, but I will say that he struggled to get open consistently while playing in place of Plax. Maybe the Giants were using him incorrectly as they needed a guy who could stretch the field. However the role that he played last year is not one that I see him holding for the long term. He may start opposite Smith in week 1 but he's keeping the seat warm until Nicks is ready to take it. I agree with Avery that it's going to take more than glowing camp reports to get me excited about Sinorice Moss. Seems like the only play the Giants have in the book for him is the quick screen, and even if the guy is lightning fast, he falls down when a defender enters the same county as him. I think he and Barden are fighting for the same roster spot. People are forgetting that the Giants haven't given up on David Tyree either. He missed all of last year with injury but is an outstanding special teams player. If Nicks/Hixon is the 1 and Smith is the 2, Manningham fills in the depth. If Tyree is healthy he'll likely make the roster. That leaves Barden and Moss competing for the same spot. I'm not particularly fond of either but I'm willing to give Barden a shot since Pee Wee hasn't done anything with the opportunity.
Some good points (especially the part where you agreed with me :thumbup: ) but there is no way that the Giants 3rd round pick this year that they traded up to get is going to be fighting for a roster spot.
Looking at it from the draft pick expenditure angle I can't really argue the point. However I also believe the Giants really reached for Barden and that his skill set doesn't keep up with his physical measurables. I will say this, I think Barden is no better than the 6th receiver on the depth chart when the season opens (of course I give Tyree the slot above him for special teams play). I think the latter half of the "Kiwi and Pee Wee" draft is going to be looking for employment at the end of August.

 
If Nicks doesn't turn into 'the guy' for the NYG I'd like to be holding Moss and Barden. Moss would be the shortest successful WR since at least 1998, and Barden would be the tallest. So it'd be unusual, but I still like both of them more than I do Hixon or Steve Smith. Those guys could be useful pieces, but they aren't #1 WR material IMO. I think drafting Nicks and then covering with Barden and Moss would give a pretty decent shot at finding a long-term top-20 FF WR fairly cheap.
Having to roster 3 WRs from the same team is NOT "fairly cheap" if roster space is a premium. Moss is an afterthought IMO. Nicks will emerge as the go to guy sometime in 2009. Smith will get his share of receptions, but his upside is limited.
 
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If Nicks doesn't turn into 'the guy' for the NYG I'd like to be holding Moss and Barden. Moss would be the shortest successful WR since at least 1998, and Barden would be the tallest. So it'd be unusual, but I still like both of them more than I do Hixon or Steve Smith. Those guys could be useful pieces, but they aren't #1 WR material IMO. I think drafting Nicks and then covering with Barden and Moss would give a pretty decent shot at finding a long-term top-20 FF WR fairly cheap.
Having to roster 3 WRs from the same team is NOT "fairly cheap" if roster space is a premium. Moss is an afterthought IMO. Nicks will emerge as the go to guy sometime in 2009. Smith will get his share of receptions, but his upside is limited.
I now think that Steve Smith and Manningham are who i would cast my lot with (and I did in one draft) thinking one is a full time player for the long haul. Hixon i feel will lose the job, because i never thought he was a staring caliber WR. Manningham i think is most ready to take one though Nicks is coming strong. It could even be Nicks and Manningham for the future w/ Steve Smith in the slot.
 
If Nicks doesn't turn into 'the guy' for the NYG I'd like to be holding Moss and Barden. Moss would be the shortest successful WR since at least 1998, and Barden would be the tallest. So it'd be unusual, but I still like both of them more than I do Hixon or Steve Smith. Those guys could be useful pieces, but they aren't #1 WR material IMO. I think drafting Nicks and then covering with Barden and Moss would give a pretty decent shot at finding a long-term top-20 FF WR fairly cheap.
Having to roster 3 WRs from the same team is NOT "fairly cheap" if roster space is a premium. Moss is an afterthought IMO. Nicks will emerge as the go to guy sometime in 2009. Smith will get his share of receptions, but his upside is limited.
I now think that Steve Smith and Manningham are who i would cast my lot with (and I did in one draft) thinking one is a full time player for the long haul. Hixon i feel will lose the job, because i never thought he was a staring caliber WR. Manningham i think is most ready to take one though Nicks is coming strong. It could even be Nicks and Manningham for the future w/ Steve Smith in the slot.
Agree 100%. I'm anxious to see if Mario can transfer his preseason success over to the regular season as I think he'll replace Hixon sooner or later. Nicks should bump Smith to the slot [where he should be IMO] eventually.
 
If you hadn't seen enough last year; people will realize how much Eli really sucks without Plax.....Plan used to actually make Eli's throws look accurate. Now, we will see the 50% completion rates again.
Bump, Eli is no slouch. Innaccurate because he could be with a huge target like Plax and Toomer, but he's adjusted and could finish very high this year.
 

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