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Heyward-Bey dynasty thoughts (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Bri
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DoubleG
Footballguy
In a 10 team dynasty league (which allows each of us to carry 6 WRs in the offseason - more during the regular season). He has beenon the waiver wire since about week 8. You can drop him. He can't catch. Period.
Length of time until he becomes a good receiver when he cant catch? I don't know...when do you think he sleeps and dreams next?
Length of time until he becomes a good receiver when he cant catch? I don't know...when do you think he sleeps and dreams next?
I started a thread earlier this year asking when it's okay to call him a bust...he looks awful. It'd be one thing if he actually flashed a hint of talent. Crabtree, Nicks, the kid for the Titans, Maclin, and several other rookie wr's have shown moments of talent. Even Louis Murphy, a fellow Raider wr, has looked good at times. I expect rookie wr's to struggle but I expect them to at least give us a clue as to why they were drafted.
He cannot do the most important thing a wr is supposed to do - catch the football. I believe you can improve route running, timing, and a slew of other things. But catching the football? You can either do it or you can't. He can't.
He cannot do the most important thing a wr is supposed to do - catch the football. I believe you can improve route running, timing, and a slew of other things. But catching the football? You can either do it or you can't. He can't.
Captain Spaulding
Footballguy
He fell all the way to the 3rd round in your rookie dynasty draft? I think he went top 10 pick in the 1st round in our draft. (like 5 RB's, Crabtree and Heyward Bey or something like that in the beginning).
Depending on your roster depth size of your league, I'd keep him another year.
Depending on your roster depth size of your league, I'd keep him another year.
GreatLakesMike
Footballguy
Heyward-Bey went in the middle 2nd round in most of my drafts. I don't recall one draft where he went in the 1st round.
He went late 2nd, early 3rd in all my drafts. I fear for the talent scouting ability of an owner who took him in the first.
While I got him in the 3rd...With rookies you've gotta consider opportunity and he had as much as any WR. Looking back Javon Walker having a possible comeback (not) was about the only thing standing in his way from being their #1 WR. Schilens fans might disagree but..he had a red carpet out for him.
I don't see a prob with drafting him anywhere from like 5th pick overall down. ( I don't mind if you jump on this and want to discuss, may be interesting)
He's reminding me of Troy Williamson I guess
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Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Problem is he is being outplayed by another rookie on the same team and drafted 3 rounds later. Chaz Schillens is the lead dog too when healthy, DHB has a lot of problems and his inability to catch the football does not make him gain anything on the underside of this situation either. I did see him drafted in the 1st round of many rookie drafts, middle of the 2nd he was gone for sure.
Fear & Loathing
Footballguy
lyon812
Footballguy
I said it a bit tongue-in-cheek, but I don't know about "loser". That depends on roster sizes and starters. Henderson's a Top 40 WR in most of my leagues. That may not be earth-shattering, but it's certainly useful.
Avery
Footballguy
As always, it depends on roster size, but I'm betting in most leagues there are guys on the wire I'd rather have than Heyward-Bay. In fact in a dynasty roster he's probably the 3rd WR I'd want on the Raiders alone, 4th if you want to count Miller.
Matt Waldman
Footballguy
As mentioned throughout this thread, poor hands is a killer for a receiver as a prospect. He didn't have this level of difficulty hanging onto the football in college, but I would have to say that a good NFL receiver with poor technique catching the ball away from his body is the exception to the rule.
In hindsight, I would have rated Heyward-Bey lower as a result. Sidney Rice and and Robert Meachem both at least tried to use good hands technique as they progressed in their college careers, which was a sign they had a better potential to develop into decent pass catchers in the pros. Early Doucet did not show this in college, although he is beginning to look better in limited time with the Cardinals.
Hewyard-Bey repeatedly demonstrates why body-catching a football is bad for your career in the NFL. When you attempt to trap a football against your body you often wind up inadvertently use other parts of your body as a weapon acting against your efforts. I have seen the rookie have the ball bounce off his chest, his stomach, his shoulder pads, and he has even kneed the ball out of his grasp more than once while making a leaping attempt.
Good hands technique takes a lot of practice because you have to learn which direction your hands should be facing (palms up or down, as well as how to position your hands together on certain passes) depending on the height of the pass and direction of your body compared to the football.
I would much rather place my bets on Schilens and Murphy in Oakland, but I wouldn't hesitate to keep him on a deeper dynasty roster. A shallow roster with only 4-5 receivers total? Probably not.
In hindsight, I would have rated Heyward-Bey lower as a result. Sidney Rice and and Robert Meachem both at least tried to use good hands technique as they progressed in their college careers, which was a sign they had a better potential to develop into decent pass catchers in the pros. Early Doucet did not show this in college, although he is beginning to look better in limited time with the Cardinals.
Hewyard-Bey repeatedly demonstrates why body-catching a football is bad for your career in the NFL. When you attempt to trap a football against your body you often wind up inadvertently use other parts of your body as a weapon acting against your efforts. I have seen the rookie have the ball bounce off his chest, his stomach, his shoulder pads, and he has even kneed the ball out of his grasp more than once while making a leaping attempt.
Good hands technique takes a lot of practice because you have to learn which direction your hands should be facing (palms up or down, as well as how to position your hands together on certain passes) depending on the height of the pass and direction of your body compared to the football.
I would much rather place my bets on Schilens and Murphy in Oakland, but I wouldn't hesitate to keep him on a deeper dynasty roster. A shallow roster with only 4-5 receivers total? Probably not.
lyon812
Footballguy
Agreed, and excellent post.
King of the Wolfies
Footballguy
troy williamson part 2
Avery
Footballguy
You could also say about Russell, "Calling it after less than 2 seasons starting throwing the ball to Heyward-Bey, Louis Murphy an Chaz Shillens. Impatient Much?"Does that ring true to you?
If you have elite talent, it'll show. It doesn't matter what team you play for. If you have average to above average talent, it might not show itself if the situation is poor. If you're a no talent hack like DHB, you'd better pray you land in the PERFECT situation if you want to have any chance at fantasy or real life relevance...but he landed in Oakland. Crap talent plus crap situation...yuck.
No. Murphy has the same garbage throwing him the ball and he's looked much better. It's not that DHB hasn't done much - it's the fact he's looked so awful doing it.
The difference is that Russell's passes aren't even close. The joke about him all season was that his passes were so bad they couldn't even be intercepted. Throw in his lack of work ethic and lackadaisical attitude and it's pretty easy to conclude that he's the next Ryan Leaf. On the other hand, it's hard to judge a receiver with the limited number of balls that have been catchable that have been thrown Heyward Bey's way. I know he DID drop some he should have caught but I have to believe it's hard to get in to a rhythm with a QB as bad as Jamarcus. And in a Dynasty league the last thing you want to do is give up on someone too early. I've got heyward-bey and I'm not real happy about it but unless I can replace him with a proven commodity I'm probably gonna stick with him a little longer. I just hope they get a decent QB next year so he can be properly evaluated.
FavreCo
Footballguy
It has nothing to do with Russell. Balls bounce off the guys hands, chest, knees and face regardless of who throws them. Perfect passes are dropped. He has no skills. He is fast though.With game-winning momentum at his back, Heyward-Bey turned sharp on a comeback route, leaped for the pass and - clang - let it bounce down off his chest, up off his knee and out off his hand for a Chiefs interception.
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Avery
Footballguy
That's for the last thing you want to do along with holing onto a guy too long in leu of a much better prospect sitting on the waiver wire.
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Chaka
Footballguy
This is Russell's third year and he has 27 starts under his belt. I think the guy has been a joke of a QB for many reasons (physical talent is not one of them) but I certainly would not eliminate the possibility that he figures it out one day and becomes a decent QB.Heyward-Bey is not Louis Murphy (who has all of 26 catches and is just as notable for his drops), why would you expect them to develop at the same pace?Tremendous impatience. Give players a little time to develop.
Chaka
Footballguy
The guy might never be a good NFL WR but he had 2.9 opportunities per game from some wildly inaccurate QBs. I'm not willing to call it over for him just yet.
Avery
Footballguy
It's not about eliminating the possibility that players like Russell and Heyward-Bey may develop it's about playing the odds and taking an educated guess from what we've seen. Having said that, I think it's a fair assessment that your league would need very large roster to take that risk with Heyward-Bey or Russell over a lot that would be on the wire.
