Hillis Value on the Rise? (1 Viewer)

[travisio]

I am having a hard time settling on the proper value for Peyton Hillis. I keep wanting to convince myself that he can't be as good as last year, but is that really the case?

The biggest knock on him was that he would potentially be sharing carries with Hardesty, that possibility is looking less likely by the day.

It looks like there is real potential for Shurmur to get the Brown's offense humming this year (let's not go overboard, obviously - but they could really improve). My gut keeps telling that the passing game is going to be much improved this year and that the end result will be more offensive touchdowns which will in turn mean even more Peyton Hillis touchdowns.

I think his yardage might dip slightly this year because they will be more balanced - but he could be a touchdown monster if he stays healthy. I keep seeing tons of upside with a pretty high floor. What is everyone else thinking about him?

 

[rizzler]

I;m a browns fan, and honestly dont know what to do with Hillis.

BUT, the CLE o-line is BEASTLY and can really open gaps for him to run.

He's a great late 2nd round pick I think, and he truly does have some amazing upside.

 

[LHUCKS]

yes, His ADP is on the rise too.

 

[NeverEnough]

Jackson will soon be taking a lot of touches IMO

 

[shadyridr]

Jackson will soon be taking a lot of touches IMO

 

[NeverEnough]

Jackson will soon be taking a lot of touches IMO

Good info here. It is fine if you disagree. I don't think Hillis will end up anywhere near the numbers he had last year.You could be wrong or I could be wrong.Thanks for adding tremendous value to the thread.

 

[djmich]

Jackson will soon be taking a lot of touches IMO

Any particular reason why? What do you define as alot?

 

[NeverEnough]

Jackson will soon be taking a lot of touches IMO

Any particular reason why? What do you define as alot?

I simply see Hillis' previous season as the exception, not the rule. I define a lot as over 50% of their total carries on the year.

 

[Polyethylene Bag]

No reason to think his numbers will be down from last year. Top 5 candidate. Ridiculous value in Round 2.

 

[shadyridr]

Jackson will soon be taking a lot of touches IMO

Good info here. It is fine if you disagree. I don't think Hillis will end up anywhere near the numbers he had last year.You could be wrong or I could be wrong.Thanks for adding tremendous value to the thread.

funny thing is u didnt offer any value either. all u did was said your opinion was jackson would be taking a lot of touches and i laughed disagreeing with ur opinion. u didnt explain why u thought that. therefore ur post offered just as much value as mine. both were our opinions with no reasoning as to why

 

[PR Sparty]

madden curse. haven't we learned our lesson yet on this?

 

[the spanker]

I'm totally in the dark about this guy. Like you I can't get a handle on his value. If I'm correct his playoff picture this year doesn't look rosey either.

 

[BrainDeadGenius]

I think Hillis is underrated in redraft leagues, but I would avoid him in dynasties as I think a big part of his success is that Cleveland offensive line.

 

[NeverEnough]

Jackson will soon be taking a lot of touches IMO

Good info here. It is fine if you disagree. I don't think Hillis will end up anywhere near the numbers he had last year.You could be wrong or I could be wrong.Thanks for adding tremendous value to the thread.

funny thing is u didnt offer any value either. all u did was said your opinion was jackson would be taking a lot of touches and i laughed disagreeing with ur opinion. u didnt explain why u thought that. therefore ur post offered just as much value as mine. both were our opinions with no reasoning as to why

Right, you clearly added a lot more than I did. Is it really that hard to type "you"?

 

[gianmarco]

Jackson will soon be taking a lot of touches IMO

Any particular reason why? What do you define as alot?

I simply see Hillis' previous season as the exception, not the rule. I define a lot as over 50% of their total carries on the year.

So you're saying Harrison will get more carries than Hillis? Really? Based on what?

 

[AmosMoses]

I define a lot as over 50% of their total carries on the year.

>50& of all of the Browns RB carries? Or >50% of Jackson + Hillis carries? Either way, this is insanity. Are you predicting a catastrophic injury or something?

 

[shnikies]

Jackson will soon be taking a lot of touches IMO

Any particular reason why? What do you define as alot?

I simply see Hillis' previous season as the exception, not the rule. I define a lot as over 50% of their total carries on the year.

So you're saying Harrison will get more carries than Hillis? Really? Based on what?

He obviously isn't aware that Brandon Jackson is simply not a good running back. Maybe he thinks the Browns acquired Steven Jackson? That's all I can think of.

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

So you're saying Harrison will get more carries than Hillis? Really? Based on what?

I see what you did there.Some people are just inexplicably enamored with Brandon Jackson. They don't let the facts that he's never been able to win a starting job, has a sub-4 career average and was mediocre at best when given his opportunity last year sway them from believing this is Brandon Jackson's year.

 

[Polyethylene Bag]

Jackson will soon be taking a lot of touches IMO

Any particular reason why? What do you define as alot?

I simply see Hillis' previous season as the exception, not the rule. I define a lot as over 50% of their total carries on the year.

So you're saying Harrison will get more carries than Hillis? Really? Based on what?

He obviously isn't aware that Brandon Jackson is simply not a good running back. Maybe he thinks the Browns acquired Steven Jackson? That's all I can think of.

Or his draft is coming up and he has leaguemates on this board......

 

[shadyridr]

Jackson will soon be taking a lot of touches IMO

Good info here. It is fine if you disagree. I don't think Hillis will end up anywhere near the numbers he had last year.You could be wrong or I could be wrong.Thanks for adding tremendous value to the thread.

funny thing is u didnt offer any value either. all u did was said your opinion was jackson would be taking a lot of touches and i laughed disagreeing with ur opinion. u didnt explain why u thought that. therefore ur post offered just as much value as mine. both were our opinions with no reasoning as to why

Right, you clearly added a lot more than I did. Is it really that hard to type "you"?

on an ipad? yeah

 

[ratbast]

Both of you...go to your room!

Hillis has proven to be able to get the job done. McCoy may be improving just in time. The Oline is great.

Dont over think it folks. What's not to like? Yes he slowed down at the end and McDanials didnt know what he had but Hillis is an excellent #2 RB in any league and may perform like a #1. He is a receiving threat and the goal line back. What's not to like?

 

[NeverEnough]

So you're saying Harrison will get more carries than Hillis? Really? Based on what?

I see what you did there.Some people are just inexplicably enamored with Brandon Jackson. They don't let the facts that he's never been able to win a starting job, has a sub-4 career average and was mediocre at best when given his opportunity last year sway them from believing this is Brandon Jackson's year.

Not enamored w/Jackson at all. I simply feel Hillis is not going to perform up to his draft spot this season. Don't try to read into things that I didn't say. Obviously people disagree with me. That's why this is a discussion forum.

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

Jackson will soon be taking a lot of touches IMO

Any particular reason why? What do you define as alot?

I simply see Hillis' previous season as the exception, not the rule. I define a lot as over 50% of their total carries on the year.

So you're saying Harrison will get more carries than Hillis? Really? Based on what?

He obviously isn't aware that Brandon Jackson is simply not a good running back. Maybe he thinks the Browns acquired Steven Jackson? That's all I can think of.

I was thinking of James Jackson...

 

[hook014]

If there's a situation more polarizing than the Cle running back situation this year I dont know what it is. Seems to me there are some clear lines being drawn between the Hillis believers / nonbelievers but we really should be talking more about probabilities.

Hardesty simply cant get healthy. The Browns spent a lot to get him but for now he's not in the equation. That leaves Hillis and the newly signed B Jackson. You dont have to be a Jackson believer to know that he signed where he thought he'd get the best chance to start. And it's hard to find a guy behind the 2 of them that looks to be a threat this year. One thing is for sure and that's whoever runs behind that off line should do pretty well.

I personally dont believe a RB in a fullbacks body can stave off the competition for long in todays NFL. The need for speed is too great and seems to get lost in the discussion here.

While I wont be drafting Hillis I will be looking to get Jackson somewhere after round 10 as the backups are being sniped. Simply put, his probability is higher than most backups. Now you believers dont have to agree to that but you should go into the draft aware that there are many guys who feel the same as I do. As far as I'm concerned Jackson is just a notch below Michael Bush and Tolbert. But way in front of a guy like Gerhart.

 

[Buddy Ball 2K3]

If there's a situation more polarizing than the Cle running back situation this year I dont know what it is. Seems to me there are some clear lines being drawn between the Hillis believers / nonbelievers but we really should be talking more about probabilities. Hardesty simply cant get healthy. The Browns spent a lot to get him but for now he's not in the equation. That leaves Hillis and the newly signed B Jackson. You dont have to be a Jackson believer to know that he signed where he thought he'd get the best chance to start. And it's hard to find a guy behind the 2 of them that looks to be a threat this year. One thing is for sure and that's whoever runs behind that off line should do pretty well. I personally dont believe a RB in a fullbacks body can stave off the competition for long in todays NFL. The need for speed is too great and seems to get lost in the discussion here. While I wont be drafting Hillis I will be looking to get Jackson somewhere after round 10 as the backups are being sniped. Simply put, his probability is higher than most backups. Now you believers dont have to agree to that but you should go into the draft aware that there are many guys who feel the same as I do. As far as I'm concerned Jackson is just a notch below Michael Bush and Tolbert. But way in front of a guy like Gerhart.

Just curious what has changed with the Browns since last season to down grade Hillis? I look at the Browns and I see nothing but improvementsO-line will continue to dominateThe QB has a year under his belt and its safe to assume he should continue to get betterWR's - I think this group has improved as wellNo legit back up to worry about stealing goal line carriesand an improved defense Seems like PH should be a top 10 back again

 

[Polyethylene Bag]

If there's a situation more polarizing than the Cle running back situation this year I dont know what it is. Seems to me there are some clear lines being drawn between the Hillis believers / nonbelievers but we really should be talking more about probabilities.

Hardesty simply cant get healthy. The Browns spent a lot to get him but for now he's not in the equation. That leaves Hillis and the newly signed B Jackson. You dont have to be a Jackson believer to know that he signed where he thought he'd get the best chance to start. And it's hard to find a guy behind the 2 of them that looks to be a threat this year. One thing is for sure and that's whoever runs behind that off line should do pretty well.

I personally dont believe a RB in a fullbacks body can stave off the competition for long in todays NFL. The need for speed is too great and seems to get lost in the discussion here.

While I wont be drafting Hillis I will be looking to get Jackson somewhere after round 10 as the backups are being sniped. Simply put, his probability is higher than most backups. Now you believers dont have to agree to that but you should go into the draft aware that there are many guys who feel the same as I do. As far as I'm concerned Jackson is just a notch below Michael Bush and Tolbert. But way in front of a guy like Gerhart.

He just wanted a job. He was slated to be the #3 when he signed.

 

[lazyike]

Jackson will soon be taking a lot of touches IMO

Any particular reason why? What do you define as alot?

I simply see Hillis' previous season as the exception, not the rule. I define a lot as over 50% of their total carries on the year.

Is this the same Brandan Jackson who stunk when Grant went down? 50% ahh..no. I remember it well, I picked Jackson up thinking I'd now have a #2 RB the remainder of the season and dropped him 2 weeks later. I'd give Jackson about 5 touches a game.

 

[Polyethylene Bag]

If there's a situation more polarizing than the Cle running back situation this year I dont know what it is. Seems to me there are some clear lines being drawn between the Hillis believers / nonbelievers but we really should be talking more about probabilities.Hardesty simply cant get healthy. The Browns spent a lot to get him but for now he's not in the equation. That leaves Hillis and the newly signed B Jackson. You dont have to be a Jackson believer to know that he signed where he thought he'd get the best chance to start. And it's hard to find a guy behind the 2 of them that looks to be a threat this year. One thing is for sure and that's whoever runs behind that off line should do pretty well. I personally dont believe a RB in a fullbacks body can stave off the competition for long in todays NFL. The need for speed is too great and seems to get lost in the discussion here.While I wont be drafting Hillis I will be looking to get Jackson somewhere after round 10 as the backups are being sniped. Simply put, his probability is higher than most backups. Now you believers dont have to agree to that but you should go into the draft aware that there are many guys who feel the same as I do. As far as I'm concerned Jackson is just a notch below Michael Bush and Tolbert. But way in front of a guy like Gerhart.

Just curious what has changed with the Browns since last season to down grade Hillis? I look at the Browns and I see nothing but improvementsO-line will continue to dominateThe QB has a year under his belt and its safe to assume he should continue to get betterWR's - I think this group has improved as wellNo legit back up to worry about stealing goal line carriesand an improved defense Seems like PH should be a top 10 back again

The haters are trying hard but aren't putting forth any good arguments. He's got NO competition for carries this year.

 

[LHUCKS]

Hillis' value has is definitely rising, but there are still risks that can't be overlooked.

 

[Polyethylene Bag]

Hillis' value has is definitely rising, but there are still risks that can't be overlooked.

Such as?

 

[LHUCKS]

Hillis' value has is definitely rising, but there are still risks that can't be overlooked.

Such as?

the kid dishes out and absorbs a lot of hits...a lot of peoples' guts are telling them it cant' last...not at a workorse pace anyhow.It's not impossible, he put up a big year last year. Other guys like Marion Barber have had big fantasy years with a lot of hitting.Also, this is a brand new coach with a new offense with only six weeks to prepare before opening week. Again, nobody can be certain how big of a factor this will be, but it could be a factor.It's just a risk that should be considered.

 

[Polyethylene Bag]

Hillis' value has is definitely rising, but there are still risks that can't be overlooked.

Such as?

the kid dishes out and absorbs a lot of hits...a lot of peoples' guts are telling them it cant' last...not at a workorse pace anyhow.It's not impossible, he put up a big year last year. Other guys like Marion Barber have had big fantasy years with a lot of hitting.It's just a risk that should be considered.

Fair enough. I'll agree that he's probably not going to have a long career but, for this year, I don't see him as a significantly higher injury risk than others.

 

[ourmanflint]

Hillis' value has is definitely rising, but there are still risks that can't be overlooked.

Such as?

the kid dishes out and absorbs a lot of hits...a lot of peoples' guts are telling them it cant' last...not at a workorse pace anyhow.It's not impossible, he put up a big year last year. Other guys like Marion Barber have had big fantasy years with a lot of hitting.

Also, this is a brand new coach with a new offense with only six weeks to prepare before opening week. Again, nobody can be certain how big of a factor this will be, but it could be a factor.

It's just a risk that should be considered.

Judging from the execution in their 1st preseason game against Green Bay...I'd say they're picking it up pretty well.

 

[LHUCKS]

Judging from the execution in their 1st preseason game against Green Bay...I'd say they're picking it up pretty well.

vanilla defenses...starters like Woodson sitting.Don't judge a book by its cover my friend.

 

[Polyethylene Bag]

Judging from the execution in their 1st preseason game against Green Bay...I'd say they're picking it up pretty well.

vanilla defenses...starters like Woodson sitting.Don't judge a book by its cover my friend.

Ignore what you see, listen to my gut. Still not hearing a logical argument against Hillis repeating or exceeding last year's numbers.

 

[LHUCKS]

Judging from the execution in their 1st preseason game against Green Bay...I'd say they're picking it up pretty well.

vanilla defenses...starters like Woodson sitting.Don't judge a book by its cover my friend.

Ignore what you see, listen to my gut. Still not hearing a logical argument against Hillis repeating or exceeding last year's numbers.

I think you're confused. I was providing arguments on why expectations for Hillis should be tempered. I was not trying to provide what you stated above.

 

[hook014]

If there's a situation more polarizing than the Cle running back situation this year I dont know what it is. Seems to me there are some clear lines being drawn between the Hillis believers / nonbelievers but we really should be talking more about probabilities.Hardesty simply cant get healthy. The Browns spent a lot to get him but for now he's not in the equation. That leaves Hillis and the newly signed B Jackson. You dont have to be a Jackson believer to know that he signed where he thought he'd get the best chance to start. And it's hard to find a guy behind the 2 of them that looks to be a threat this year. One thing is for sure and that's whoever runs behind that off line should do pretty well. I personally dont believe a RB in a fullbacks body can stave off the competition for long in todays NFL. The need for speed is too great and seems to get lost in the discussion here.While I wont be drafting Hillis I will be looking to get Jackson somewhere after round 10 as the backups are being sniped. Simply put, his probability is higher than most backups. Now you believers dont have to agree to that but you should go into the draft aware that there are many guys who feel the same as I do. As far as I'm concerned Jackson is just a notch below Michael Bush and Tolbert. But way in front of a guy like Gerhart.

Just curious what has changed with the Browns since last season to down grade Hillis? I look at the Browns and I see nothing but improvementsO-line will continue to dominateThe QB has a year under his belt and its safe to assume he should continue to get betterWR's - I think this group has improved as wellNo legit back up to worry about stealing goal line carriesand an improved defense Seems like PH should be a top 10 back again

The haters are trying hard but aren't putting forth any good arguments. He's got NO competition for carries this year.

Let's start from the top. I didnt downgrade Hillis as much as I pointed out how attractive the backup RB spot in Cle will be this year to drafters. On a sliding scale of want to dont want the backup in Cle will be very high. Drafters of Hillis should bear this in mind as the draft unfolds.As to the haters post. Is any phrase more overdone? I dont hate Hillis, I dont even know him. Im sure he's a great guy. Love his mother, blah blah blah.This is a handicapping game. I'm dealing in probabilities, cost and value. The probability of a fullback type to repeat great numbers as RB 2 yrs in a row in todays NFL are low. The cost to acquire said player is high. The value lost to that high pick (should it not pan out) could easily put my team from EV+ to EV-.That's how I calculate. I dont hate.

 

[Polyethylene Bag]

If there's a situation more polarizing than the Cle running back situation this year I dont know what it is. Seems to me there are some clear lines being drawn between the Hillis believers / nonbelievers but we really should be talking more about probabilities.

Hardesty simply cant get healthy. The Browns spent a lot to get him but for now he's not in the equation. That leaves Hillis and the newly signed B Jackson. You dont have to be a Jackson believer to know that he signed where he thought he'd get the best chance to start. And it's hard to find a guy behind the 2 of them that looks to be a threat this year. One thing is for sure and that's whoever runs behind that off line should do pretty well.

I personally dont believe a RB in a fullbacks body can stave off the competition for long in todays NFL. The need for speed is too great and seems to get lost in the discussion here.

While I wont be drafting Hillis I will be looking to get Jackson somewhere after round 10 as the backups are being sniped. Simply put, his probability is higher than most backups. Now you believers dont have to agree to that but you should go into the draft aware that there are many guys who feel the same as I do. As far as I'm concerned Jackson is just a notch below Michael Bush and Tolbert. But way in front of a guy like Gerhart.

Just curious what has changed with the Browns since last season to down grade Hillis? I look at the Browns and I see nothing but improvements

O-line will continue to dominate

The QB has a year under his belt and its safe to assume he should continue to get better

WR's - I think this group has improved as well

No legit back up to worry about stealing goal line carries

and an improved defense

Seems like PH should be a top 10 back again

The haters are trying hard but aren't putting forth any good arguments. He's got NO competition for carries this year.

Let's start from the top. I didnt downgrade Hillis as much as I pointed out how attractive the backup RB spot in Cle will be this year to drafters. On a sliding scale of want to dont want the backup in Cle will be very high. Drafters of Hillis should bear this in mind as the draft unfolds.

As to the haters post. Is any phrase more overdone? I dont hate Hillis, I dont even know him. Im sure he's a great guy. Love his mother, blah blah blah.

This is a handicapping game. I'm dealing in probabilities, cost and value. The probability of a fullback type to repeat great numbers as RB 2 yrs in a row in todays NFL are low. The cost to acquire said player is high. The value lost to that high pick (should it not pan out) could easily put my team from EV+ to EV-.

That's how I calculate. I dont hate.

It's highly difficult to quantify the bolded (a lot of qualifiers in that statement) but I'd love to see an analysis if you have one handy.

 

[Polyethylene Bag]

Judging from the execution in their 1st preseason game against Green Bay...I'd say they're picking it up pretty well.

vanilla defenses...starters like Woodson sitting.Don't judge a book by its cover my friend.

Ignore what you see, listen to my gut. Still not hearing a logical argument against Hillis repeating or exceeding last year's numbers.

I think you're confused. I was providing arguments on why expectations for Hillis should be tempered. I was not trying to provide what you stated above.

Your arguments were that he could get injured and they're playing in a new offense. I just feel like you grasping for arguments, especially when they've looked pretty good, granted in very limited action. I'm not hearing any substantial reasons to temper expectations.

 

[brett5673]

Madden Cover Jinx?

 

[hook014]

If there's a situation more polarizing than the Cle running back situation this year I dont know what it is. Seems to me there are some clear lines being drawn between the Hillis believers / nonbelievers but we really should be talking more about probabilities.

Hardesty simply cant get healthy. The Browns spent a lot to get him but for now he's not in the equation. That leaves Hillis and the newly signed B Jackson. You dont have to be a Jackson believer to know that he signed where he thought he'd get the best chance to start. And it's hard to find a guy behind the 2 of them that looks to be a threat this year. One thing is for sure and that's whoever runs behind that off line should do pretty well.

I personally dont believe a RB in a fullbacks body can stave off the competition for long in todays NFL. The need for speed is too great and seems to get lost in the discussion here.

While I wont be drafting Hillis I will be looking to get Jackson somewhere after round 10 as the backups are being sniped. Simply put, his probability is higher than most backups. Now you believers dont have to agree to that but you should go into the draft aware that there are many guys who feel the same as I do. As far as I'm concerned Jackson is just a notch below Michael Bush and Tolbert. But way in front of a guy like Gerhart.

Just curious what has changed with the Browns since last season to down grade Hillis? I look at the Browns and I see nothing but improvements

O-line will continue to dominate

The QB has a year under his belt and its safe to assume he should continue to get better

WR's - I think this group has improved as well

No legit back up to worry about stealing goal line carries

and an improved defense

Seems like PH should be a top 10 back again

The haters are trying hard but aren't putting forth any good arguments. He's got NO competition for carries this year.

Let's start from the top. I didnt downgrade Hillis as much as I pointed out how attractive the backup RB spot in Cle will be this year to drafters. On a sliding scale of want to dont want the backup in Cle will be very high. Drafters of Hillis should bear this in mind as the draft unfolds.

As to the haters post. Is any phrase more overdone? I dont hate Hillis, I dont even know him. Im sure he's a great guy. Love his mother, blah blah blah.

This is a handicapping game. I'm dealing in probabilities, cost and value. The probability of a fullback type to repeat great numbers as RB 2 yrs in a row in todays NFL are low. The cost to acquire said player is high. The value lost to that high pick (should it not pan out) could easily put my team from EV+ to EV-.

That's how I calculate. I dont hate.

It's highly difficult to quantify the bolded (a lot of qualifiers in that statement) but I'd love to see an analysis if you have one handy.

Not only are there no qualifiers in that statement, but it really is up to you to quantify the bolded. Dont ask me to do the work for you.

Then you ask me if I have an analysis "handy"?

All after offering up this pearl of wisdom:

"The haters are trying hard but aren't putting forth any good arguments. He's got NO competition for carries this year."

Put a little more work in if you want a serious discussion.

 

[bigunreal]

If there's a situation more polarizing than the Cle running back situation this year I dont know what it is. Seems to me there are some clear lines being drawn between the Hillis believers / nonbelievers but we really should be talking more about probabilities.

Hardesty simply cant get healthy. The Browns spent a lot to get him but for now he's not in the equation. That leaves Hillis and the newly signed B Jackson. You dont have to be a Jackson believer to know that he signed where he thought he'd get the best chance to start. And it's hard to find a guy behind the 2 of them that looks to be a threat this year. One thing is for sure and that's whoever runs behind that off line should do pretty well.

I personally dont believe a RB in a fullbacks body can stave off the competition for long in todays NFL. The need for speed is too great and seems to get lost in the discussion here.

While I wont be drafting Hillis I will be looking to get Jackson somewhere after round 10 as the backups are being sniped. Simply put, his probability is higher than most backups. Now you believers dont have to agree to that but you should go into the draft aware that there are many guys who feel the same as I do. As far as I'm concerned Jackson is just a notch below Michael Bush and Tolbert. But way in front of a guy like Gerhart.

You really don't like white running backs, do you? WHY would you think of Toby Gerhart, who is locked into an impossible situation behind AP? How is a career mediocrity like Jackson "way in front" of a guy who was a tremendous college RB and hasn't had any chance to show what he can do yet in the NFL? Btw, how did you complete your post without taking a swipe at Danny Woodhead? FYI, and the edification of those not versed in racial codewords, I bolded the other particularly offensive and ridiculous parts of your post.

The doubts surrounding Peyton Hillis are 100% related to the fact he happens to be the first white RB in 25 years to gain 1000 yards in the NFL. If ANY black RB had the kind of season he did last year, the jock sniffers on ESPN and every fantasy owner in the world would be drooling over him. They'd point out that he accomplished all that in spite of the horrendous offense he played on. Btw, the Browns' offensive line is not the 1970s Miami Dolphins' unit. They have a great left tackle and very good center. Unless they improve the right side of the line, they are only an average unit overall. Again, there is a clear effort on the part of everyone to credit someone else for Hillis' performance last season. If that line was so great, how come Harrison sucked before he left and the legendary Mike Bell couldn't do anything behind it?

Those who ignore the herd mentality, which is to wildly underrate Hillis, will profit handsomely from grabbing him at a spot where he'll vastly outperform those being selected around him.

 

[hook014]

If there's a situation more polarizing than the Cle running back situation this year I dont know what it is. Seems to me there are some clear lines being drawn between the Hillis believers / nonbelievers but we really should be talking more about probabilities.

Hardesty simply cant get healthy. The Browns spent a lot to get him but for now he's not in the equation. That leaves Hillis and the newly signed B Jackson. You dont have to be a Jackson believer to know that he signed where he thought he'd get the best chance to start. And it's hard to find a guy behind the 2 of them that looks to be a threat this year. One thing is for sure and that's whoever runs behind that off line should do pretty well.

I personally dont believe a RB in a fullbacks body can stave off the competition for long in todays NFL. The need for speed is too great and seems to get lost in the discussion here.

While I wont be drafting Hillis I will be looking to get Jackson somewhere after round 10 as the backups are being sniped. Simply put, his probability is higher than most backups. Now you believers dont have to agree to that but you should go into the draft aware that there are many guys who feel the same as I do. As far as I'm concerned Jackson is just a notch below Michael Bush and Tolbert. But way in front of a guy like Gerhart.

You really don't like white running backs, do you? WHY would you think of Toby Gerhart, who is locked into an impossible situation behind AP? How is a career mediocrity like Jackson "way in front" of a guy who was a tremendous college RB and hasn't had any chance to show what he can do yet in the NFL? Btw, how did you complete your post without taking a swipe at Danny Woodhead? FYI, and the edification of those not versed in racial codewords, I bolded the other particularly offensive and ridiculous parts of your post.

The doubts surrounding Peyton Hillis are 100% related to the fact he happens to be the first white RB in 25 years to gain 1000 yards in the NFL. If ANY black RB had the kind of season he did last year, the jock sniffers on ESPN and every fantasy owner in the world would be drooling over him. They'd point out that he accomplished all that in spite of the horrendous offense he played on. Btw, the Browns' offensive line is not the 1970s Miami Dolphins' unit. They have a great left tackle and very good center. Unless they improve the right side of the line, they are only an average unit overall. Again, there is a clear effort on the part of everyone to credit someone else for Hillis' performance last season. If that line was so great, how come Harrison sucked before he left and the legendary Mike Bell couldn't do anything behind it?

Those who ignore the herd mentality, which is to wildly underrate Hillis, will profit handsomely from grabbing him at a spot where he'll vastly outperform those being selected around him.

Wow. I was fully aware that I might get some blowback for my opinion on Hillis because i've seen the charges of reverse discrimination on just about every discussion before now. But this is undoubtedly the most charged up I've seen.

I'm not sure this deserves an answer but I'll try. I dont dislike white running backs but Gerhart has been put in an impossible situation. Behind arguably one of the best RBs of his decade. I could name a lot of starting RBs that would languish behind Peterson. In fact, the other top 5 Rbs in the league would all be benchwarmers behind this guy. Who would get a sniff of the field? Maybe Chris Johnson. No one else.

Woodhead? Good value at his ADP. Draft away.

As far as Hillis, hey, lots of respect for what he did last year. And he could do it again if the new staff gives him the chance. But we need to keep in mind one thing. Guys that have a fullback build and get tons of contact per run dont tend to last in the league. Regardless of race. Nobody is stopping you from drafting for that value.

So get him.

But blasting away with wild charges is really uncool.

MY mantra is always probability, cost and value. That's all I consider when handicapping. My opponents dont care who I beat them with in the final analysis. And I dont care either.

 

[bigunreal]

If there's a situation more polarizing than the Cle running back situation this year I dont know what it is. Seems to me there are some clear lines being drawn between the Hillis believers / nonbelievers but we really should be talking more about probabilities.

Hardesty simply cant get healthy. The Browns spent a lot to get him but for now he's not in the equation. That leaves Hillis and the newly signed B Jackson. You dont have to be a Jackson believer to know that he signed where he thought he'd get the best chance to start. And it's hard to find a guy behind the 2 of them that looks to be a threat this year. One thing is for sure and that's whoever runs behind that off line should do pretty well.

I personally dont believe a RB in a fullbacks body can stave off the competition for long in todays NFL. The need for speed is too great and seems to get lost in the discussion here.

While I wont be drafting Hillis I will be looking to get Jackson somewhere after round 10 as the backups are being sniped. Simply put, his probability is higher than most backups. Now you believers dont have to agree to that but you should go into the draft aware that there are many guys who feel the same as I do. As far as I'm concerned Jackson is just a notch below Michael Bush and Tolbert. But way in front of a guy like Gerhart.

You really don't like white running backs, do you? WHY would you think of Toby Gerhart, who is locked into an impossible situation behind AP? How is a career mediocrity like Jackson "way in front" of a guy who was a tremendous college RB and hasn't had any chance to show what he can do yet in the NFL? Btw, how did you complete your post without taking a swipe at Danny Woodhead? FYI, and the edification of those not versed in racial codewords, I bolded the other particularly offensive and ridiculous parts of your post.

The doubts surrounding Peyton Hillis are 100% related to the fact he happens to be the first white RB in 25 years to gain 1000 yards in the NFL. If ANY black RB had the kind of season he did last year, the jock sniffers on ESPN and every fantasy owner in the world would be drooling over him. They'd point out that he accomplished all that in spite of the horrendous offense he played on. Btw, the Browns' offensive line is not the 1970s Miami Dolphins' unit. They have a great left tackle and very good center. Unless they improve the right side of the line, they are only an average unit overall. Again, there is a clear effort on the part of everyone to credit someone else for Hillis' performance last season. If that line was so great, how come Harrison sucked before he left and the legendary Mike Bell couldn't do anything behind it?

Those who ignore the herd mentality, which is to wildly underrate Hillis, will profit handsomely from grabbing him at a spot where he'll vastly outperform those being selected around him.

Wow. I was fully aware that I might get some blowback for my opinion on Hillis because i've seen the charges of reverse discrimination on just about every discussion before now. But this is undoubtedly the most charged up I've seen.

I'm not sure this deserves an answer but I'll try. I dont dislike white running backs but Gerhart has been put in an impossible situation. Behind arguably one of the best RBs of his decade. I could name a lot of starting RBs that would languish behind Peterson. In fact, the other top 5 Rbs in the league would all be benchwarmers behind this guy. Who would get a sniff of the field? Maybe Chris Johnson. No one else.

Woodhead? Good value at his ADP. Draft away.

As far as Hillis, hey, lots of respect for what he did last year. And he could do it again if the new staff gives him the chance. But we need to keep in mind one thing. Guys that have a fullback build and get tons of contact per run dont tend to last in the league. Regardless of race. Nobody is stopping you from drafting for that value.

So get him.

But blasting away with wild charges is really uncool.

MY mantra is always probability, cost and value. That's all I consider when handicapping. My opponents dont care who I beat them with in the final analysis. And I dont care either.

So you think highly of Gerhart, yet you believe Jackson is a better back? And you agree that he's in an impossible situation, so....why did he spring to mind as an example? Combined with your other racially charged code words, it was a reasonable assumption for me to make that you were treating Hillis differently because of his race, as so many others do. I think it's blatantly obvious that Hillis' race is effecting the way everyone perceives him.

 

[proninja]

I think it's blatantly obvious that Hillis' race is effecting the way everyone perceives him.

Yes. Duh. Whether or not people want to admit it. He's way outside of the norm when it comes to successful running backs, and I don't think it's at all racist to wonder if he can repeat last year's performance given his genetic disadvantage.

 

[wickster33]

Hey, I own Peyton, but I don't feel great about him. Like most current owners, I picked him up as a late handcuff to Harrison last year. Even worse, he wasn't in my starting lineup when he had some of his most impressive games. If I could have found anyone really enamored with his game in the off season, I would have gladly traded him at a discount.

Still, I find myself keeping him in a 3 keeper league because he is the undisputed starter, he's a great blocker and has nice hands giving him the opportunity to stay on the field in 3rd down situations, and his offensive line is a very good run blocking unit. I will ignore Jackson completely this year. His inability to get anything done in Green Bay last year makes me very gun shy. However, I will target Hardesty late, as he has the best chance to take over for the Browns if Peyton struggles. Sure Montario is an injury risk, but so were Gore and McGahee.

 

[Hoss Style]

I can firmly say that I don't think Hillis will match last year's numbers and I have absolutely no "solid" reason why I think this.

It's a "gut" feeling. I watched a lot of the Browns last year. I got to see Hillis in practice with the Broncos a few years back.

I think he has a solid year but not like last year.

I know I've added nothing to the thread and I'll leave now. I just wanted to support the guy who had no real reason for doubting Hillis, as well.

And I'm being serious. The "Gut".

 

[Pickle Rody]

I think it's blatantly obvious that Hillis' race is effecting the way everyone perceives him.

Yes. Duh. Whether or not people want to admit it. He's way outside of the norm when it comes to successful running backs, and I don't think it's at all racist to wonder if he can repeat last year's performance given his genetic disadvantage.

This is classic.

 

[Sultans]

I think Hillis is underrated in redraft leagues, but I would avoid him in dynasties as I think a big part of his success is that Cleveland offensive line.

Heard Bjax looked decent the other night. CLE run blocking is money. I really would't be that surprised if the Browns finished 2nd this year in the North.

 

[Shutout]

His issue is that he clearly wore down last year near the end.

So, he is probably one of the best (if not the best) values you could find as a #2 Rb this year to GET you to the playoffs, but he probably won't help you win your playoffs because the risk here is not owning Hillis in September; its owning him in December when Jackson or a healthy Hardesy or whoever starts eating into the production.

I would also expect the Browns to be a little improved in the passing game so that could help in some cases and hurt in others.

Overall, I expect far less consistency from a ff standpoint this year and while there will be high points, I think anyone drafting him expecting RB1 production throughout the ENTIRE year will be disappointed.