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Houston Texans off-season Thread (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter coolnerd
- Start date
GregR
Footballguy
Interesting article from Lance Zeirlein about what he'd do if he was Texans GM. Agree with a lot of it.The cutting Kevin Walter part I'd probably wait until I'd actually inked his veteran replacement before cutting him though. http://blog.chron.com/ultimatetexans/2013/02/if-i-were-texans-gm-decisions-on-team-free-agents-restructuring-and-cap-cuts/
Yeah, people hate on Kevin Walter a lot here. I think he is one of the most unjustly hated on players. I saw an article a year or two ago where the stats pointed to Walter having the most sure hands in the NFL. He doesn't put up a lot of YAC or get that many targets, but when he does, he catches all the catchable balls. But more importantly, we're a running team and the guy is a hell of a blocker. If Schaub had a cannon arm, then maybe we'd benefit from getting a speedster to replace him, but I think we'd be giving up more long runs than gaining long catches.
Meecrob
Footballguy
I had a dream last night...Teo falls to us in RD1 and we let Barwin walk.We sign Jennings as a FA, or alternate scenario is we trade for Harvin (2nd and 3rd maybe?)Casey walks and we keep Owen and Graham at TE; pickup a prospect in rd 4-7 for depthOur LB's would look like Reed, Cushing, Teo, Mercilus.WR's Andre, Jennings, with Posey/Martin battling it out for the slot.Then I woke up...
GregR
Footballguy
I do hope they let Barwin walk, unless they sign him at a price equating to what he did in 2012 rather than what he did in 2011. Which I doubt would happen.Even if they keep Barwin, if Mercilus has picked up the system by now (I believe that's a big part of why he didn't play a lot this year), I would like to see him competing for the starting job.
coolnerd
Footballguy
Walter was a justifible player from 08-10 or so, but the last two years he has been well below average as WR. His blocking is overrated from both the importance and his skill at it. I think irresponsible to bring him back in 2013.
Scooby1974
Footballguy
Any updates on Devier Posey and how he might fit in should Walter walk and he recover from his injury? Is he worth rostering?
GregR
Footballguy
At the time of Posey's injury at the end of the season, I felt he had moved up pretty close to true timeshare for the WR2 position. It'll all depend on his injury of course, but if I was looking to pick up a Texans receiver for a dynasty league, it would be Posey, or whoever they draft or sign in free agency if anyone.
Teo... meh.I like Jennings well enough but he's going to command a huge contract, so I'd be disappointed if we tied that much money up in that position. We don't throw the ball that much and Schaub's just not that good. It would be a horrible investment to tie up so much of your cap on 30 year old WRs in a run first system.
I'm not sure, either, but I am sure that it's not as big of a deal as the average fan makes it out to be. People don't realize that there just aren't enough targets to go around to justify another big name WR. If we had a big armed QB who threw the ball 650 times a year, absolutely. But we don't. If we can upgrade the position affordably, great. But I'm not going to be upset if Walter restructures to lower his cap number and stays as our WR2.
I don't know anything about his injury other than that it was an achilles injury, but that's pretty serious. I know Demaryius Thomas came back strong from it (his was in the preseason of 2010), but there haven't been many other WRs with that injury to judge his situation from. I feel pretty comfortable saying that Posey will be a non-factor in 2013 at least. Rick Smith should proceed under the line of thought that anything out of Posey this year will just be an unexpected surprise.
dhockster
Footballguy
I have gone through the Texans Contracts and they currently have 50 players with contracts for 2013 with approximately $117,000,000 going against the salary cap. With the cap at about $121 million that gives them about $4 million in cap room. Add to that another $2.4 million which they carried over from the left over 2012 cap year, and they have about $6.4 million to work with. They currently have 3 starting positions to address which are not under contract. Punter, Safety, and outside linebacker.Key free agents not currently signed: Barwin, Quin, McCain, CaseyKey signed players with big contracts who might be cut: Antonio Smith (6 million savings if cut), Owen Daniels (2.25 million savings if cut), and Kevin Walter (2.5 million in savings if cut).What should they do?If I were the Texans I would: -Let Barwin walk. I don't think he will get a huge contract in the open market, but I think it will be bigger than what the Texans can currently afford-Only re-sign Casey if you are going to use him more as a threat out of the back field. Two years ago he was very effective, last year not so much as he was notas involved.-Try to re-sign Quin and McCain. They solidify your secondary and the price should not be cost prohibitive. If Quin does demand a high price I would probably not re-sign.-Cut Daniels if there is a dynamic TE you can target in the first or second round of the draft.-Cut Walter and go after a free agent Wide receiver. Someone who has enough speed to stretch the field. Part of the Texans problems stem from defenses not worrying about the long ball. That is partly a Schaub issue, but I don't see the Texans doing anything about that this year. Obviously structure the contract so it is cap friendly in the first year.-leave the Oline alone under the theory that they will be improved with Brooks and Newton in their second years. Draft depth with later draft picks.-draft a LB in the first or second to replace Barwin.-If necessary for cap purposes, cut Antonio Smith. If you can do the above without cutting him, keep him.-If there is anyway through the draft or free agency to improve the nose tackle position, I would try to do it. I think pressure up the middle other than JJ Watt will help this defense tremendously.The Texans can also restructure contracts to free up cap space but I don't think they want to do this as it only eats up your cap in the future. Andre Johnson's cap figure is $14.6 million this year because of restructing prior contracts. The Texans are walking a tight rope of trying to get better at the same time they are trying to get some wiggle room under the cap. This is not an easy task.
GregR
Footballguy
Agree with a lot of that. I don't think I see NT as as much of a need just based on how much they play. While an upgrade would be nice, the Texans only keep a nose tackle on the field in their base package. As soon as you go to nickel or dime they pull him and move the DEs inside as DTs. I probably wouldn't invest more than a 5th round pick on one, and not sure I'd even spend that much this year. Some aging veteran on a last contract would probably be enough to backup Mitchell.And I'd like to see at least one pick or free agent signing made to help the right side of the line. They might improve, but I think it's worth a 3rd or 4th round pick (where you can still get a decent blocker for a zone scheme) to not only take a shot at improving the right side, but to possibly get someone who can get a year under his belt and be ready to step in at left guard when Wade Smith hits free agency in 2014.
Meecrob
Footballguy
dhockster
Footballguy
Good points. I don't really want Casey full time at tight-end because I don't think he is big enough to be effective as a blocker and a pass receiver. We have seen in the past couple of years how a dynamic TE can help an offense (Gronk, Hernandez, Graham). I think Jennings would be a great fit. I suggest another linebacker because I think the Texans defense regressed at every LB position last season and the overall defense suffered as a result. Barwin regressed, Reed was hurt, Cushing was hurt, Brady James was a downgrade from Demeco. Even with Mercilus playing more and hopefully improving, I would like to see them stacked at linebacker, and be able to get to the QB from the LB position.
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Shutout
Footballguy
I know he's not young but if they were going to get rid of Walter but still keep a WR that could block, I'd like to see them sign Anquan Boldin and hopefully Posey will be able to contribute later in the season. That type of move, to me, would free them up to use draft picks somewhere else on defense or o-line.
dhockster
Footballguy
If that last part about the salary cap is true, then it is unlikely they are going to create cap room by re-doing contracts. I think that increases the likelihood that one or a multiple of Kevin Walter, Antonio Smith, or Owen Daniels will be cut to create cap space to re-sign their own free agents that they want to re-sign, draft picks, and new free agents.
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Drop
Footballguy
I'm a bit surprised that Quin isn't more beloved. His solid play really fixed a big problem they had at safety and he's not going to be so easily replaced and have this team stay on the cusp of a ring. Not that he is irreplaceable, it's just easier said than done and I think it could turn into one of those you don't know what you got until it's gone situations. He's good and has some pop.
coolnerd
Footballguy
http://www.cincyjungle.com/nfl-combine-2013/2013/2/21/4015198/nfl-combine-2013-texans-gary-kubiak-transcriptfull transcript from Garyspeak at the combine
dhockster
Footballguy
I think the Texans will re-sign Quin, unless someone offers him a ridiculus amount of money. I actually think they are more likely to sign him then they are to sign Barwin.I think you are right, he is a good player. If they don't sign him then there is no one on the current roster who wouldn't be a significant downgrade at that position. At least if Barwin goes, you at least have Mercilus to fill in. Since they also have to address inside linebacker, I don't see them opening up a hole at safety, too.'Drop said:
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
Why is T.J. Yates not the target of some QB hungry team?Couldn't he start for an Arizona or KC?All I know is that he looked decent in the playoffs last year.
GregR
Footballguy
He might be but we just don't hear of trade talks. Also wonder if Hou thinks he could be the future?
coolnerd
Footballguy
While Yates handled the situation better than expected and made a handful of key plays in 2011, in big world NFL QB he really did not play quality football. I honestly do not know what his true upside is though, although I am more skeptical than not.
GregR
Footballguy
Agree that as a rookie he basically showed he wasn't incompetent. He had a few good flashes but wasn't called on to win the game a lot. The real question is how much he's grown since then.
Drop
Footballguy
I think that Yates is a good player, but I think teams may view what he did with some questions about his value to their respective teams because of how good a team and system Houston has in place for a QB to step into and perform. Before Yates played, Leinart played and looked good too. The offensive system given the talent they have doesn't overwhelm the QB with unnecessary responsibility. They need to sure up the right side of the line so that continues.
Meecrob
Footballguy
Alright fellas here how its going in the FBG Mock Draft for Houston so far.
Traded 1.27, 4.27 for 1.23 to move up and Grab:
Tavon Austin WR - WVU
Love this guy, hes a home run threat whenever he touches the ball. Fills a need for us at WR and is also a fantastic return guy. He will line up in the slot and wreak havoc. I could also see him taking some touches at RB as he did at WV in select packages or as a change of pace back to Foster. I had to move up to grab him as the vultures were descending; turns out he would have been gone had I waited.
Traded 2.27, 3.27, 6.27 for 2.11, 4.11, and a 7th next year and took:
John Jenkins NT - UGA
At 6-4 360 Jenkins will be the true anchor that the Texans have needed up the middle. Jenkins is a top run stuffer who for a man of his size is also surprisingly light on his feet. This will allow Shaun Cody heath/FA issues to be a non factor. This will also allow Earl Mitchel to potentially shift to the DE spot in our 3-4 base (making the potential cut of Antonio Smith not as big an issue), and rotate inside as the DT in the Nickle/Dime. Crick still there for depth.
Jenkins will often command double teams, most teams are probably going to want to double team JJ Watt as well; this is a simple numbers game and the end result is the Houston LB's should have a lot of lanes to attack in the pass rush. I think this will make one of the best young D's in the league even more potent.
Sitting now with 4.11, 5.27, 7.27
I don't know if the mock will make it past the 3rd but if so ill be looking to add depth at OL, ILB, and CB with these last 3 picks.
ETA: Smith not an FA but probably a cap casualty
Traded 1.27, 4.27 for 1.23 to move up and Grab:
Tavon Austin WR - WVU
Love this guy, hes a home run threat whenever he touches the ball. Fills a need for us at WR and is also a fantastic return guy. He will line up in the slot and wreak havoc. I could also see him taking some touches at RB as he did at WV in select packages or as a change of pace back to Foster. I had to move up to grab him as the vultures were descending; turns out he would have been gone had I waited.
Traded 2.27, 3.27, 6.27 for 2.11, 4.11, and a 7th next year and took:
John Jenkins NT - UGA
At 6-4 360 Jenkins will be the true anchor that the Texans have needed up the middle. Jenkins is a top run stuffer who for a man of his size is also surprisingly light on his feet. This will allow Shaun Cody heath/FA issues to be a non factor. This will also allow Earl Mitchel to potentially shift to the DE spot in our 3-4 base (making the potential cut of Antonio Smith not as big an issue), and rotate inside as the DT in the Nickle/Dime. Crick still there for depth.
Jenkins will often command double teams, most teams are probably going to want to double team JJ Watt as well; this is a simple numbers game and the end result is the Houston LB's should have a lot of lanes to attack in the pass rush. I think this will make one of the best young D's in the league even more potent.
Sitting now with 4.11, 5.27, 7.27
I don't know if the mock will make it past the 3rd but if so ill be looking to add depth at OL, ILB, and CB with these last 3 picks.
ETA: Smith not an FA but probably a cap casualty
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GregR
Footballguy
May want to edit Seth Payne to be Shaun Cody.Edit to add: Also, while I understand the mock not including compensatory picks since we don't know what all they will be, I imagine we're a lock to get the first compensatory pick between the 3rd and 4th round because of Mario. Just mentioning it so you can maybe consider who you'd have taken there, even if it doesn't count in the mock.Alright fellas here how its going in the FBG Mock Draft for Houston so far.
Traded 1.27, 4.27 for 1.23 to move up and Grab:
Tavon Austin WR - WVU
Love this guy, hes a home run threat whenever he touches the ball. Fills a need for us at WR and is also a fantastic return guy. He will line up in the slot and wreak havoc. I could also see him taking some touches at RB as he did at WV in select packages or as a change of pace back to Foster. I had to move up to grab him as the vultures were descending; turns out he would have been gone had I waited.
Traded 2.27, 3.27, 6.27 for 2.11, 4.11, and a 7th next year and took:
John Jenkins NT - UGA
At 6-4 360 Jenkins will be the true anchor that the Texans have needed up the middle. Jenkins is a top run stuffer who for a man of his size is also surprisingly light on his feet. This will allow Seth Payne's heath/FA issues to be a non factor. This will also allow Earl Mitchel to potentially shift to the DE spot in our 3-4 base (making the potential cut of Antonio Smith not as big an issue), and rotate inside as the DT in the Nickle/Dime. Crick still there for depth.
Jenkins will often command double teams, most teams are probably going to want to double team JJ Watt as well; this is a simple numbers game and the end result is the Houston LB's should have a lot of lanes to attack in the pass rush. I think this will make one of the best young D's in the league even more potent.
Sitting now with 4.11, 5.27, 7.27
I don't know if the mock will make it past the 3rd but if so ill be looking to add depth at OL, ILB, and CB with these last 3 picks.
ETA: Smith not an FA but probably a cap casualty
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Meecrob
Footballguy
LOL no idea how Seth Payne jumped into my head there... thanks; yes we were not considering any compensatory picks.May want to edit Seth Payne to be Shaun Cody.Edit to add: Also, while I understand the mock not including compensatory picks since we don't know what all they will be, I imagine we're a lock to get the first compensatory pick between the 3rd and 4th round because of Mario. Just mentioning it so you can maybe consider who you'd have taken there, even if it doesn't count in the mock.Alright fellas here how its going in the FBG Mock Draft for Houston so far.
Traded 1.27, 4.27 for 1.23 to move up and Grab:
Tavon Austin WR - WVU
Love this guy, hes a home run threat whenever he touches the ball. Fills a need for us at WR and is also a fantastic return guy. He will line up in the slot and wreak havoc. I could also see him taking some touches at RB as he did at WV in select packages or as a change of pace back to Foster. I had to move up to grab him as the vultures were descending; turns out he would have been gone had I waited.
Traded 2.27, 3.27, 6.27 for 2.11, 4.11, and a 7th next year and took:
John Jenkins NT - UGA
At 6-4 360 Jenkins will be the true anchor that the Texans have needed up the middle. Jenkins is a top run stuffer who for a man of his size is also surprisingly light on his feet. This will allow Seth Payne's heath/FA issues to be a non factor. This will also allow Earl Mitchel to potentially shift to the DE spot in our 3-4 base (making the potential cut of Antonio Smith not as big an issue), and rotate inside as the DT in the Nickle/Dime. Crick still there for depth.
Jenkins will often command double teams, most teams are probably going to want to double team JJ Watt as well; this is a simple numbers game and the end result is the Houston LB's should have a lot of lanes to attack in the pass rush. I think this will make one of the best young D's in the league even more potent.
Sitting now with 4.11, 5.27, 7.27
I don't know if the mock will make it past the 3rd but if so ill be looking to add depth at OL, ILB, and CB with these last 3 picks.
ETA: Smith not an FA but probably a cap casualty
GregR
Footballguy
I assume most people heard Dunta Robinson was cut by Atlanta. For grins I checked his contract. He ended up making $24.5m in 4 years of his 6 year, $57m contract. I wonder if you could go back in time and tell him he'd only actually make $6.1m a year if the Texans would have matched that.
coolnerd
Footballguy
Honestly, did not need to do so. If somebody gives either Quin or Barwin silly money then wish them well. I want Quin back more personally though.
Any chance we sign Eric Winston back now that the Chiefs have released him? I'd feel a lot better if we did.
coolnerd
Footballguy
I would not mind either...with the for the right cost disclaimer.
GregR
Footballguy
Not sure about if they'd re-sign him, or if he'd want to re-sign or if he holds any kind of hard feelings. Saw this in the Bowe thread where they were talking about how he did last year for the Chiefs:
Would love to have him back but my guess is Winston is too expensive still and we are cap strapped. If we get Winston at the expense of not resigning Quin I won't be too happy. Although I am still scratching my head as to why we haven't resigned Quin already. Maybe they don't like him as much as we think? I shudder to think of going into the season with another rookie DB starter though.
GregR
Footballguy
I think we can say early. Not necessarily first, but definitely early. If they think there is going to be a quality WR there in the 2nd round, and the best player available at their 1st is better than the best WR, I could easily see them waiting to take the WR.I'd hope they go 1st or 2nd round though.
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GregR
Footballguy
Just some general thoughts... I think we're going to lose most of our free agents. We may sign a couple, but it'll surprise me if they are big names. I suspect other than re-signing our own guys, we'll probably see the Texans wait a few days for the over-inflated contracts that open up free agency, wait until the guys left start to get anxious and willing to sign for less. They just don't have the money to do otherwise.
The only good side would be, if we lose a few guys hopefully they get big contracts so we get some compensatory draft picks for them next year.
The only good side would be, if we lose a few guys hopefully they get big contracts so we get some compensatory draft picks for them next year.
I agree Greg. I feel like almost all of our guys will get plucked away. And I think I would be ok with Barwin, McCain, Casey, Dobbins and others signing with other teams. The only guy I really hope we retain is Glover Quin. Losing him would feel like a big punch to the gut. He's such a versatile player and even tho he gets beat sometimes, I feel like he's such a solid and steady safety for us. And besides him and D Manning, the Texans have never really had great safeties in our franchise's history. Maybe Marcus Coleman for like, one season. Matt Stevens? Glenn Earl? CC Brown? All YUCK!!
Yeah, only guy I am worried about is Quin, strange it's been so quiet on that front. I liked Barwin but he was a major liability last year. Even if he came back at a reduced rate I would feel it would be a detriment to the team to have somebody that underperform's at such a critical spot as WOLB in Phillip's scheme. Hopefully Mercilus can be our DeMarcus Ware going forward.
Supposedly GQ has a visit set with the Lions. Take that for what it's worth. If I recall last year Myers visited with either Green Bay, Tennessee or both before re-signing with Houston. I could be wrong about that. Yeah I want no part of Barwin, even at a discount. He missed too many one-on-one plays where it was all on him. Let Mercy-Less have that spot!!
