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How Badly Did Jesus Suffer? Do You, in Your Personal Life, Suffer More Than The Three Days? (1 Viewer)

rockaction

rockaction

Footballguy
That he suffered as a human. 

No anti-semitism or anti-atheism in this thread. 

Just as a man.  

 
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Clown Car said:
I'm living a dream I don't deserve. 
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Cool, B.

Eta* Was just thinking that dreams are the reason for living. That moment between sleep and waking up is why I stay alive. That transient moment. That beautiful one.  

 
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proninja said:
I feel the same way. I've been through some stuff, but if I had a chance to do it all over again I wouldn't even consider it. 
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I'd never have lived through what you did and keep the mentality of that alive. 

Simply, bravo, mon frère.  

 
Impaled on a stick for 3 days, hmmm, dislocated shoulder while riding 45 minutes back to the ski lodge and ambulance comes close. 

 
proninja said:
I've got a wonderful life overall.

Calling the few (really) bad things that have happened to me suffering on the level of getting your death demanded by the public, humiliated, tortured, abandoned by those who love you, and eventually crucified in the most agonizing way the Roman government could figure out seems a bit silly. Would not trade places with Jesus. No way no how. I am glad Jesus was Jesus and I am me. 
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That's really, essentially, my point. That this is a breath of air that we all breathe. To be thankful today for all that has been granted us. 

But in ages of doubt, the mind turns on itself. You have the gift of faith. For others like us, it can be torture. Note the "can" in that.  

 
A few people in history have, arguably, suffered worse than what the NT describes how Jesus suffered. 

But since none of them survived the ordeal, I doubt anybody here is going to answer your second question in the affirmative. 

 
timschochet said:
A few people in history have, arguably, suffered worse than what the NT describes how Jesus suffered. 

But since none of them survived the ordeal, I doubt anybody here is going to answer your second question in the affirmative. 
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Oh, I agree. This is getting at a metaphysical question, tim. An existential angst one. It's dumb, not stupid. 

 
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The only thing i took out of my devout Catholic upbringing remains one of the best things about me. Most of it was senseless rules, rituals, reems & ranks but, every Good Friday, me ma used to pick me & sis up at school and take us into Sacred Heart for Stations of the Cross, bring us home to sit still from 3-6 (or get beat by the vaccuum cleaner hose) and think about what Jesus suffered to save our souls. I actually liked this and would fervently wonder about what a God with a human body & heart would feel about the gruesome discorporation of his flesh for the salvation of mankind. Not only is learning to sit quietly a lost art and necessary exercise for child & adult, but the ability i developed to transport into the constructs of others has been the basis for pretty much everything i do. Thanks, Jesusbuddy (and vaccuum cleaner)!

 
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Can't say its as bad as being crucified, but there was a period prior to and after my life saving abdominal surgery that was about as bad as I could possibly imagine. Hard to even explain that level of pain, but there were definitely moments I wondered if it would be best to just die rather than continue feeling the pain, discomfort, nausea that was like a 3-5 day tsunami.  When rushed to the hospital as i was going sepsis, it was beyond excruciating. No matter how sick or hurt Id been before, whenever Id be in an ER Id look and see SOMEone in such horrible shape, such misery and pain, that no matter how bad my ailment Id say to myself... at least Im not that guy. In this case, literally yelling out in painful gasps on the gurney (they had not yet gotten the IV dilauded etc going) I WAS that guy. Made a deal with god then, eitner get me better or just take me now, please. I literally begged in my mind.

Then, three days later, with the pain having been so bad the new head of pain working the shift was worried id been given too much (i was on the pump, set for every 5 min or whatever, and once i could id take another dose. and i hate opioids, was just in that bad a shape). So, contrary to my surgeon and full teams written and direct orders, he goes to switch me to oral... which i couldnt hold down (was eating nothing, just ice chips and i think graduated to water) result was dry heaving after said surgery to remove a foot of lower intestine, stomach literally with a 2-3 inch crater from chest down to lower abdomen held together by rods while not having pain meds for nearly 2 hours ... again, after getting doses every 5 minutes. Horrible is such an underestimation it's hard to say.

Apparently it began when I was not yet even conscious as I was trying to rip the intubation tube out of my throat... i woke up (was more in a semi conscious state of encapsulated misery, like the bad guys in Superman, but in the worst pain and nauseatic misery ever, while trapped in their bubbles) with my hands bundled up with cloth as clubs so I didnt keep fighting the docs and pulling out my tube. And that was before consciousness.

Hell the tree days before and additional 10 days after that were many times worse than anything else Ive ever experienced in terms of pain, nausea, hallucinations and loss of full consciousness at times Id ever felt.

 
Wow. Didn't know in that detail. Was thinking more mental anguish, but okay.

Eta* I almost died from staph, but the pain you describe is visceral.

 
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2 Corinthians 5:21   "For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him."

No doubt the crucifixion was extremely painful but nothing can compare to what He endured when He became sin for us.

 
Beef Ravioli said:
2 Corinthians 5:21   "For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him."

No doubt the crucifixion was extremely painful but nothing can compare to what He endured when He became sin for us.
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This comment was elucidating. Thank you.

 
Of all the wonderful quotes and phrases my Mom used to tell me, the one that has always stayed with me is that "everyone has their cross to bear".

Happy Easter Rock.

 
Higgs said:
Of all the wonderful quotes and phrases my Mom used to tell me, the one that has always stayed with me is that "everyone has their cross to bear".

Happy Easter Rock.
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Happy Easter, Higgs. From a firm agnostic to apparently another.  

Too bad we never met up in CT. Seems like a good time.  

 
I was never crucified like the Jesus of Nazareth character of the NT.  He never had student loans and stalker ex girlfriends.  I figure it's a wash.  That being said, I wouldn't trade places with him because living that long ago must have horribly mundane.

 
Dedfin said:
I was never crucified like the Jesus of Nazareth character of the NT.  He never had student loans and stalker ex girlfriends.  I figure it's a wash.  That being said, I wouldn't trade places with him because living that long ago must have horribly mundane.
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Wow. I was sort of figuring most people would accept him as real, if not his resurrection. He is kind of a huge historical figure.  

 
rockaction said:
Wow. I was sort of figuring most people would accept him as real, if not his resurrection. He is kind of a huge historical figure.  
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Ohh?  Maybe I'm wrong.  You don't have to link.  Let's just say he was a real dude.

eta  I do remember the documentary on Brian that lived during the same time period

 
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rockaction said:
I need one. I meant hit 'er up in drinking terms because Higgs no longer partakes in the sauce, which I still do...on the obviously. 

eta* I knew that sentence looked bad when I typed it. 
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some FFApper moneytron should buy this one as FFA cornhole headquarters. I'll even start a Disco Church of the Midnight Hour ("remember, my children, it is easier to boogie thru the eye of a needle than get thru the gateway of Studio 54!") at it so they can write it off.

ETA: there's even an organ for Rok n Role to rub several times a day

 
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wikkidpissah said:
some FFApper moneytron should buy this one as FFA cornhole headquarters. I'll even start a Disco Church of the Midnight Hour (remember my children, it is easier to boogie thru the eye of a needle than get thru the gateway of Studio 54!) so they can write it off.
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I went to The Berkshire School. No lie. Anything Bakeshure is fine by me. 

As for Studio 54, though, we'll have to see...Derrick May may be in demand around these parts. 

Okay, Moby's good enough.  

 
rockaction said:
That he suffered as a human. 

No anti-semitism or anti-atheism in this thread. 

Just as a man.  
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but the three days are from his death to his alleged resurrection.  

Are you asking if we have suffered more than someone who was dead? And likely in the Good Place with his alleged Father?

 
Henry Ford said:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the three days are from his death to his alleged resurrection.  

Are you asking if we have suffered more than someone who was dead? And likely in the Good Place with his alleged Father?
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No, fair enough. I meant the death struggle, then the three days from death to his alleged resurrection. The three days were supposedly peace. I'm technically not lawyering, just asking if the Passion Play was enough to move non-believers into believers, because I count myself among the former, frankly.

You can understand the question quite clearly, Henry, you just choose not to. 

 
rockaction said:
No, fair enough. I meant the death struggle, then the three days from death to his alleged resurrection. The three days were supposedly peace. I'm technically not lawyering, just asking if the Passion Play was enough to move non-believers into believers, because I count myself among the former, frankly.

You can understand the question quite clearly, Henry, you just choose not to. 
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I'm not sure I do understand the question.  Or at least the motivation behind it as explained here. 

I have never experienced anything like being tortured and beaten, followed by six hours of dehydration, bone breaking stretching from being hung on a cross, and dying from exposure and blood loss. I don't know anyone who has. And it doesn't motivate me to believe in an omniscient, omnipotent, omnibenevolent God if it happened that way.

 
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Henry Ford said:
I'm not sure I do understand the question.  Or at least the motivation behind it as explained here. 

I have never experienced anything like being tortured and beaten, followed by six hours of dehydration, bone breaking stretching from being hung on a cross, and dying from exposure and blood loss. I don't know anyone who has. And it doesn't motivate me to believe in an omniscient, omnipotent, omnibenevolent God if it happened that way.
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The motivation behind the question is belief in something larger then one's self?

It's hard to hear music and think that mere logic and humanism explains it. That divinity plays a role in it. That is all. 

 
rockaction said:
The motivation behind the question is belief in something larger then one's self?

It's hard to hear music and think that mere logic and humanism explains it. That divinity plays a role in it. That is all. 
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Yeah, I understand the "beauty such as this requires a God" argument, though I don't agree with it. I'm just confused about this - this isn't beauty.  It's the most depraved horror of humanity, torture, cruel execution, religious bigotry.  So, no, it doesn't motivate me to believe. 

 
Henry Ford said:
Yeah, I understand the "beauty such as this requires a God" argument, though I don't agree with it. I'm just confused about this - this isn't beauty.  It's the most depraved horror of humanity, torture, cruel execution, religious bigotry.  So, no, it doesn't motivate me to believe. 
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I'm not asking anybody -- anyone -- to believe from the passion play. 

I ask nobody to believe, because I don't. But you saw fit to comment, so I'll comment back.  

 
rockaction said:
I'm not asking anybody -- anyone -- to believe from the passion play. 

I ask nobody to believe, because I don't. But you saw fit to comment, so I'll comment back.  
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Yeah, I'm just responding to your question. Whether the Passion Play motivates non-believers into believers.  For myself, it rather pushes me in the other direction. 

 
Henry Ford said:
Yeah, I'm just responding to your question. Whether the Passion Play motivates non-believers into believers.  For myself, it rather pushes me in the other direction. 
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Fair enough. Just had a fit of existential angst and asked a question of people; faith being the issue.  

 
rockaction said:
The motivation behind the question is belief in something larger then one's self?

It's hard to hear music and think that mere logic and humanism explains it. That divinity plays a role in it. That is all. 
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That is why I consider myself a diest. It's hard for me to see so much beauty in the world and think there's not something beyond our five senses influencing it. But there's a significant leap in believing in a god and believing in heaven, hell and the determination of which one you go to when you die highly favors gullible people. especially when those that aren't very gullible see what they are expected to believe in is pretty barbaric. 

 
rockaction said:
Wow. I was sort of figuring most people would accept him as real, if not his resurrection. He is kind of a huge historical figure.  
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The religious Jesus is well known. The historical Jesus is pretty hard to find much evidence of, unless of course you're willing to accept that the religious Jesus is a collection of many historical figures, and then there's lots of historical evidence. But of course that doesn't help one believe in the religious Jesus at all. 

 
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Henry Ford said:
And, again, it doesn't really make me believe in an omniscient, omnipotent, omnibenevolent God.
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Nor I. As I said, I look at the world and it makes me believe in something more than what my five senses can tell me, but that doesn't mean whatever it is is omniscient, omnipotent, omnibenevolent. Whatever it is could be good, could be bad, or whatever. In fact, the more I studied as a christian, the more I couldn't ignore the jerk side of the old testament god. I mean, just putting aside the fact that he's a bigot, and christians reflect that bigotry, he was a mass murderer on numerous occasions, to which the christian apologetics says "who are we to question gods ways?".... um yeah, not only am I going to question it, I'm going to call it out as being :bs:

 
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