HS girls stage a walkout as trans teen uses girls bathroom (2 Viewers)

[timschochet]

I said several weeks ago that with gay marriage now codified transgender rights would be the next great campaign for progressives and their allies in academia and the media. The agitations never end, even in the face of logic and natural law. Even the military is getting in on the act. How do you think such accommodations are going to work within the confines of a Navy vessel or a forward deployed fire support base?

This isn't a lifestyle, it's a mental disorder. Cross-dressers on the front line. Madness. Then again, our enemies will be laughing so hard they won't be able to fight so maybe it will all work out.

You seem to care an awful lot about this.

 

[rockaction]

I'm outraged.

Don't let your leftist outrage hit you on the idiocy that is your gender construct on the way out of the bathroom door.

 

[timschochet]

If you read the article not every girl walked out. Many were supportive, and many were indifferent.

its not a big deal either way. They'll solve it.

 

[Homer J Simpson]

High School girls don't want some strange dude watching them shower? Who could have seen this coming?

Buncha prudes.

 

[Ditka Butkus]

Put a portolet outside somewhere and tell Alice that is special for him.

 

[Deranged Hermit]

First off, I feel bad for this kid. HS can be a rough place for anyone, much less a kid whose not comfortable with his own sexuality. That being said, kudos to those girls for standing up for themselves. The boy doesn't feel comfortable changing with the other boys? Give him a neutral changing room. Don't exacerbate the situation by making every girl in his gym class uncomfortable just because s/he doesn't want to be uncomfortable changing with the boys.

The school admins are in a tough position to be sure. Any decision they make will likely end in a law suit.

 

[msommer]

Aren't there doors on the stalls in the locker room?

 

[TPW]

I said several weeks ago that with gay marriage now codified transgender rights would be the next great campaign for progressives and their allies in academia and the media. The agitations never end, even in the face of logic and natural law. Even the military is getting in on the act. How do you think such accommodations are going to work within the confines of a Navy vessel or a forward deployed fire support base?

This isn't a lifestyle, it's a mental disorder. Cross-dressers on the front line. Madness. Then again, our enemies will be laughing so hard they won't be able to fight so maybe it will all work out.

You seem to care an awful lot about this.

We have cut back on military recruiting and procurement in recent years due to budgetary reasons but now plan to cover costs for the integration of transgendered personnel, as well as their surgeries and therapy. Explain to me the logic in this.

If you value having an effective national defense rather than a massive, federally funded social experiment then you should care as well.

 

[Deranged Hermit]

If you read the article not every girl walked out. Many were supportive, and many were indifferent.

its not a big deal either way. They'll solve it.

I did read the article. It said 'more than 150 girls walked out'. 40 were supportive. It never mentioned how many were indifferent. Depending of the size of the school, I would say that nearly 200 girls may have been every girl in that particular grade.

Either way, if 150 girls are uncomfortable with the situation, I'd say that's a rather large problem.

 

[Ditka Butkus]

I said several weeks ago that with gay marriage now codified transgender rights would be the next great campaign for progressives and their allies in academia and the media. The agitations never end, even in the face of logic and natural law. Even the military is getting in on the act. How do you think such accommodations are going to work within the confines of a Navy vessel or a forward deployed fire support base?

This isn't a lifestyle, it's a mental disorder. Cross-dressers on the front line. Madness. Then again, our enemies will be laughing so hard they won't be able to fight so maybe it will all work out.

Father son talk 101:

Son: Dad I'm gay

Father: I understand son, and I'm here for you and love you very much.

Son: Dad I want to be a girl

Father: What?

Son: I'm transgender

Father: get away from me you weirdo. What the hell is wrong with you.

 

[timschochet]

I said several weeks ago that with gay marriage now codified transgender rights would be the next great campaign for progressives and their allies in academia and the media. The agitations never end, even in the face of logic and natural law. Even the military is getting in on the act. How do you think such accommodations are going to work within the confines of a Navy vessel or a forward deployed fire support base?

This isn't a lifestyle, it's a mental disorder. Cross-dressers on the front line. Madness. Then again, our enemies will be laughing so hard they won't be able to fight so maybe it will all work out.

You seem to care an awful lot about this.

We have cut back on military recruiting and procurement in recent years due to budgetary reasons but now plan to cover costs for the integration of transgendered personnel, as well as their surgeries and therapy. Explain to me the logic in this.

If you value having an effective national defense rather than a massive, federally funded social experiment then you should care as well.

I am very skeptical that the total costs for anything related to transgender issues would be large enough to have any effect on budget cuts.

 

[sublimeone]

What happens when the class clown (male) decides he's going to identify as female and walks into the girls locker room? Will there be a hearing to decide if he "really" identifies as female? What will be the identifiers? Will (s)he have to have long hair, wear "women's" clothing, makeup? Is it necessary to look like a woman to identify as one?

 

[sublimeone]

I said several weeks ago that with gay marriage now codified transgender rights would be the next great campaign for progressives and their allies in academia and the media. The agitations never end, even in the face of logic and natural law. Even the military is getting in on the act. How do you think such accommodations are going to work within the confines of a Navy vessel or a forward deployed fire support base?

This isn't a lifestyle, it's a mental disorder. Cross-dressers on the front line. Madness. Then again, our enemies will be laughing so hard they won't be able to fight so maybe it will all work out.

Father son talk 101:

Son: Dad I'm gay

Father: I understand son, and I'm here for you and love you very much.

Son: Dad I want to be a girl

Father: What?

Son: I'm transgender

Father: get away from me you weirdo. What the hell is wrong with you.

You're suggesting people with mental disorders should be shunned?

 

[timschochet]

If you read the article not every girl walked out. Many were supportive, and many were indifferent.

its not a big deal either way. They'll solve it.

I did read the article. It said 'more than 150 girls walked out'. 40 were supportive. It never mentioned how many were indifferent. Depending of the size of the school, I would say that nearly 200 girls may have been every girl in that particular grade.Either way, if 150 girls are uncomfortable with the situation, I'd say that's a rather large problem.

Actually it said 150 students, not girls. I really wonder how many of them were actually girls in the locker room? And how many were other students looking for publicity?

 

[Ditka Butkus]

What happens when the class clown (male) decides he's going to identify as female and walks into the girls locker room? Will there be a hearing to decide if he "really" identifies as female? What will be the identifiers? Will (s)he have to have long hair, wear "women's" clothing, makeup? Is it necessary to look like a woman to identify as one?

Don't ask any important questions...The liberals have assured us nothing can go wrong and that it is no big deal.

 

[timschochet]

What happens when the class clown (male) decides he's going to identify as female and walks into the girls locker room? Will there be a hearing to decide if he "really" identifies as female? What will be the identifiers? Will (s)he have to have long hair, wear "women's" clothing, makeup? Is it necessary to look like a woman to identify as one?

So silly. Does this sort of dilemma keep you up nights?

 

[Black Box]

If you read the article not every girl walked out. Many were supportive, and many were indifferent.

its not a big deal either way. They'll solve it.

I did read the article. It said 'more than 150 girls walked out'. 40 were supportive. It never mentioned how many were indifferent. Depending of the size of the school, I would say that nearly 200 girls may have been every girl in that particular grade.Either way, if 150 girls are uncomfortable with the situation, I'd say that's a rather large problem.

Actually it said 150 students, not girls. I really wonder how many of them were actually girls in the locker room? And how many were other students looking for publicity?

The same could be asked of the 40 students in support.

 

[Insein]

What happens when the class clown (male) decides he's going to identify as female and walks into the girls locker room? Will there be a hearing to decide if he "really" identifies as female? What will be the identifiers? Will (s)he have to have long hair, wear "women's" clothing, makeup? Is it necessary to look like a woman to identify as one?

So silly. Does this sort of dilemma keep you up nights?

If you have a high school aged daughter it might.

 

[Deranged Hermit]

What happens when the class clown (male) decides he's going to identify as female and walks into the girls locker room? Will there be a hearing to decide if he "really" identifies as female? What will be the identifiers? Will (s)he have to have long hair, wear "women's" clothing, makeup? Is it necessary to look like a woman to identify as one?

Bingo. Don't think for a second that this won't or can't happen. Never underestimate the lengths a horny kid will go to see boob and cooter.

Hell, when I graduated HS in '93 we had a guy in our class 'become' gay. He wasn't, he was just trying to get drunk girls at parties to 'turn him back' to be straight. Sounds stupid, but it worked. He laid more pipe that year than the rest of us combined. This included banging the two hottest girls in the school.

 

[sublimeone]

What happens when the class clown (male) decides he's going to identify as female and walks into the girls locker room? Will there be a hearing to decide if he "really" identifies as female? What will be the identifiers? Will (s)he have to have long hair, wear "women's" clothing, makeup? Is it necessary to look like a woman to identify as one?

So silly. Does this sort of dilemma keep you up nights?

I believe this is a reasonable question. Why can't you provide a reasonable answer?

 

[timschochet]

What happens when the class clown (male) decides he's going to identify as female and walks into the girls locker room? Will there be a hearing to decide if he "really" identifies as female? What will be the identifiers? Will (s)he have to have long hair, wear "women's" clothing, makeup? Is it necessary to look like a woman to identify as one?

So silly. Does this sort of dilemma keep you up nights?

If you have a high school aged daughter it might.

I do and no. Why would it?

 

[BowieMercs]

There are no urinals in the ladies rooms are there? Toilets still have stalls? I don't see what the issue is.

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

What happens when the class clown (male) decides he's going to identify as female and walks into the girls locker room?

Not only class clowns, but just confused kids looking for attention.

Maybe we should be working on the assumption that minors are too young to be making these kinds of decisions, like we do for so many other things.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

There are no urinals in the ladies rooms are there? Toilets still have stalls? I don't see what the issue is.

That's because the thread title isn't really accurate. It's a locker room, not a restroom.

I can actually see an argument for allowing this sort of thing in restrooms. What difference does it make to me what gender the person in the stall next to me is? Locker rooms, on the other hand, seem qualitatively different to me, and I can't bring myself to tell teenage girls that they're irrational prudes for not wanting to be naked in front of guys.

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

There are no urinals in the ladies rooms are there? Toilets still have stalls? I don't see what the issue is.

Well, it was a locker room. Meaning changing clothes.

 

[Ditkaless Wonders]

I said several weeks ago that with gay marriage now codified transgender rights would be the next great campaign for progressives and their allies in academia and the media. The agitations never end, even in the face of logic and natural law. Even the military is getting in on the act. How do you think such accommodations are going to work within the confines of a Navy vessel or a forward deployed fire support base?

This isn't a lifestyle, it's a mental disorder. Cross-dressers on the front line. Madness. Then again, our enemies will be laughing so hard they won't be able to fight so maybe it will all work out.

You seem to care an awful lot about this.

We have cut back on military recruiting and procurement in recent years due to budgetary reasons but now plan to cover costs for the integration of transgendered personnel, as well as their surgeries and therapy. Explain to me the logic in this.

If you value having an effective national defense rather than a massive, federally funded social experiment then you should care as well.

I am very skeptical that the total costs for anything related to transgender issues would be large enough to have any effect on budget cuts.

Did the ADA have unintended, and unanticipated budgetary effects? Being in commercial real estate you know the answer. Why would you predict a different outcome here. I can easily see a time when all new construction will have to incorporate a more expensive restroom paradigm, and shortly thereafter I can see mandatory retrofitting of existing facilities.

Now it may be that the ADA compliance costs were worth it, and it may be that if we move in this direction these costs will be too, but to believe they will be effectively negligible seems ill-considered.

As an aside I have read that in the Metro Denver area the cost of a single surface parking space at commercial retail costs between $17,000 and $22,000. I believe the current paradigm in our area is one such space for every 10 regular spaces. Studies have shown that 1 in 25 spaces thusly reserved would adequately serve needs. The rest are wasteful. BTW that paradigm holds in large lots. Commercial retail with less than 10 total spaces must still devote a space for handicapped, so there the burden may be somewhat proportionally larger.

 

[Insein]

What happens when the class clown (male) decides he's going to identify as female and walks into the girls locker room? Will there be a hearing to decide if he "really" identifies as female? What will be the identifiers? Will (s)he have to have long hair, wear "women's" clothing, makeup? Is it necessary to look like a woman to identify as one?

So silly. Does this sort of dilemma keep you up nights?

If you have a high school aged daughter it might.

I do and no. Why would it?

Being a high school girl is mentally stressful enough as it is. Now you want to add throwing a boy into their lockerroom while they change?

 

[Ditka Butkus]

I identify with a dog and shouldn't be arrested for sexual assault when I hump a woman's leg and sniff her crotch.

 

[timschochet]

What happens when the class clown (male) decides he's going to identify as female and walks into the girls locker room? Will there be a hearing to decide if he "really" identifies as female? What will be the identifiers? Will (s)he have to have long hair, wear "women's" clothing, makeup? Is it necessary to look like a woman to identify as one?

So silly. Does this sort of dilemma keep you up nights?

I believe this is a reasonable question. Why can't you provide a reasonable answer?

because it's absurd? No class clown is going to go through that kind of effort or ridicule. And if it was fake the administrators would see right through it. No hearing would be required. Transgender is not something that happens overnight anyhow. School counsellors are going to be very aware of any real transgender transformation.

 

[rockaction]

Good.

Rod and reel use the door. Its not a psychological determination on the bathroom. Its a physical one.

The problem is that sometimes the problem goes in the exact opposite direction ... if you have a transgender man who looks to all the world like a man but is forced to use the ladies room he's probably gonna make everyone in there feel pretty uncomfortable. So really the problem is just that women are too squeamish- can't handle a male transgender or a female transgender. Get over yourselves, ladies

So one group being uncomfortable over the other?The equipment determines the room.

I dunno. I don't really think it's much of a big deal, either. Just figure it out case by case. With restrooms in a restaurant or something let people do whatever they feel is best. With something like this- kids in a locker room getting nekkid- I'd say go by the equipment. I don't think we need a hard and fast rule that applies across the board. It's not like we could enforce one even if we had it.

You love case-by-case when confronted with logical absurdity of epic proportions.

No, I love case-by-case when its the best means available to address something.

Look, people are always going to dress and act as transgenders, and there will be more of it as time goes on because fewer people will be driven to hide their urge to do so. You can deny that reality if you choose, but that's all you're doing- denying reality. You can't create a law or rule that does away with reality

So the question is how do you deal with that? And my answer is, deal with it in whatever way you think is best. If you're an owner of a private establishment deal with it however you want. If you're a local government adopt whatever rule you think is best, maybe even different rules for different types of facilities. You're making it harder than it is in an effort to connect your outrage at the very existence of transgenders with some sort of unsolvable problem that results from their existence. I think that's silly.

Actually, the irony of that was too rich to ignore. My point was not one of personal disturbance -- indeed, I think the younger generation gets to deal with their own problems with gender that the '90s gave them. Much like we're intellectual heirs of the community problems that deal with environmentalism, so are they with the community problems of the construct of "gender" replacing biological sex.

But to say that I'm making it harder? I mean, from an efficiency standpoint, it would seem that totally revamping public accommodations to satisfy one's own conception of what "gender" is seems like they're making it harder, not me. I simply want bathrooms for penises and ######s. No questions. Very efficient. Not hard (generally).

You're making it harder by having a rule at all when none is needed in most cases.

Your rule would say that the person at 12:30 of this video has to use the women's room. That can (and apparently did) make women uncomfortable, which is totally understandable. Why not allow a little flexibility for cases like that?

A high school locker room is different, of course, because the government is in charge so we do have to come up with a rule, and in that case I'd agree with you.

I agree with this. In general, this is no threat to the Republic. Honestly. No rule should be needed. Generally, nobody needs to tell people about Western constructs of propriety and privacy. Sometimes, though, these things get muddled and we need a rule. When the rule itself gets muddled by a gender concern, things get a little more, um, up for grabs than I'd like. My problem, I guess, stems from the problematic dogma of "gender as construct," but that's a different debate for a different time.

Seriously, though. Aside from the sitting problem and the potential lines for the men's room, co-ed bathrooms personally don't bother me unless I need to poop. I was kidding before, but I poop nasty. Don't want potential mates smelling that. I really sort of support sex-segregated bathrooms.

Yay?

 

[avoiding injuries]

The port-o-potty is a good idea. And I agree with one of the first comments that teens have a good bullsh meter.

 

[Ditka Butkus]

I said several weeks ago that with gay marriage now codified transgender rights would be the next great campaign for progressives and their allies in academia and the media. The agitations never end, even in the face of logic and natural law. Even the military is getting in on the act. How do you think such accommodations are going to work within the confines of a Navy vessel or a forward deployed fire support base?

This isn't a lifestyle, it's a mental disorder. Cross-dressers on the front line. Madness. Then again, our enemies will be laughing so hard they won't be able to fight so maybe it will all work out.

Father son talk 101:

Son: Dad I'm gay

Father: I understand son, and I'm here for you and love you very much.

Son: Dad I want to be a girl

Father: What?

Son: I'm transgender

Father: get away from me you weirdo. What the hell is wrong with you.

You're suggesting people with mental disorders should be shunned?

Well if he is mentally ill get him some help outside of the school system.

 

[Insein]

What happens when the class clown (male) decides he's going to identify as female and walks into the girls locker room? Will there be a hearing to decide if he "really" identifies as female? What will be the identifiers? Will (s)he have to have long hair, wear "women's" clothing, makeup? Is it necessary to look like a woman to identify as one?

So silly. Does this sort of dilemma keep you up nights?

I believe this is a reasonable question. Why can't you provide a reasonable answer?

because it's absurd? No class clown is going to go through that kind of effort or ridicule. And if it was fake the administrators would see right through it. No hearing would be required. Transgender is not something that happens overnight anyhow. School counsellors are going to be very aware of any real transgender transformation.

You're giving way too much credit to school counselors and very little credence to a school's fear of being sued.

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

I identify with a dog and shouldn't be arrested for sexual assault when I hump a woman's leg and sniff her crotch.

I believe "Bad Dog" statues apply here.

 

[whoknew]

What happens when the class clown (male) decides he's going to identify as female and walks into the girls locker room?

Not only class clowns, but just confused kids looking for attention.

Maybe we should be working on the assumption that minors are too young to be making these kinds of decisions, like we do for so many other things.

You are saying that minors should not be allowed to be transgender? Because they are too young?

A) Is there any basis for that belief?

B) Are you familiar with the suicide rates of transgender youths?

 

[timschochet]

BTW, I'm not arguing that this student should be allowed in the girl's locker room. I haven't really decided. I just think that they'll find a way to solve it. some of you seem to think this effects society n some big way. It doesn't.

 

[Ditka Butkus]

I identify with a dog and shouldn't be arrested for sexual assault when I hump a woman's leg and sniff her crotch.

I believe "Bad Dog" statues apply here.

Swat me on the nose with a rolled up newspaper.

 

[Ditkaless Wonders]

Good.

Rod and reel use the door. Its not a psychological determination on the bathroom. Its a physical one.

The problem is that sometimes the problem goes in the exact opposite direction ... if you have a transgender man who looks to all the world like a man but is forced to use the ladies room he's probably gonna make everyone in there feel pretty uncomfortable. So really the problem is just that women are too squeamish- can't handle a male transgender or a female transgender. Get over yourselves, ladies

So one group being uncomfortable over the other?The equipment determines the room.

I dunno. I don't really think it's much of a big deal, either. Just figure it out case by case. With restrooms in a restaurant or something let people do whatever they feel is best. With something like this- kids in a locker room getting nekkid- I'd say go by the equipment. I don't think we need a hard and fast rule that applies across the board. It's not like we could enforce one even if we had it.

You love case-by-case when confronted with logical absurdity of epic proportions.

No, I love case-by-case when its the best means available to address something.

Look, people are always going to dress and act as transgenders, and there will be more of it as time goes on because fewer people will be driven to hide their urge to do so. You can deny that reality if you choose, but that's all you're doing- denying reality. You can't create a law or rule that does away with reality

So the question is how do you deal with that? And my answer is, deal with it in whatever way you think is best. If you're an owner of a private establishment deal with it however you want. If you're a local government adopt whatever rule you think is best, maybe even different rules for different types of facilities. You're making it harder than it is in an effort to connect your outrage at the very existence of transgenders with some sort of unsolvable problem that results from their existence. I think that's silly.

Actually, the irony of that was too rich to ignore. My point was not one of personal disturbance -- indeed, I think the younger generation gets to deal with their own problems with gender that the '90s gave them. Much like we're intellectual heirs of the community problems that deal with environmentalism, so are they with the community problems of the construct of "gender" replacing biological sex.

But to say that I'm making it harder? I mean, from an efficiency standpoint, it would seem that totally revamping public accommodations to satisfy one's own conception of what "gender" is seems like they're making it harder, not me. I simply want bathrooms for penises and ######s. No questions. Very efficient. Not hard (generally).

You're making it harder by having a rule at all when none is needed in most cases.

Your rule would say that the person at 12:30 of this video has to use the women's room. That can (and apparently did) make women uncomfortable, which is totally understandable. Why not allow a little flexibility for cases like that?

A high school locker room is different, of course, because the government is in charge so we do have to come up with a rule, and in that case I'd agree with you.

I agree with this. In general, this is no threat to the Republic. Honestly. No rule should be needed. Generally, nobody needs to tell people about Western constructs of propriety and privacy. Sometimes, though, these things get muddled and we need a rule. When the rule itself gets muddled by a gender concern, things get a little more, um, up for grabs than I'd like. My problem, I guess, stems from the problematic dogma of "gender as construct," but that's a different debate for a different time.

Seriously, though. Aside from the sitting problem and the potential lines for the men's room, co-ed bathrooms personally don't bother me unless I need to poop. I was kidding before, but I poop nasty. Don't want potential mates smelling that. I really sort of support sex-segregated bathrooms.

Yay?

You need to sell the concept that more virile men take stinker dumps.

 

[timschochet]

I said several weeks ago that with gay marriage now codified transgender rights would be the next great campaign for progressives and their allies in academia and the media. The agitations never end, even in the face of logic and natural law. Even the military is getting in on the act. How do you think such accommodations are going to work within the confines of a Navy vessel or a forward deployed fire support base?

This isn't a lifestyle, it's a mental disorder. Cross-dressers on the front line. Madness. Then again, our enemies will be laughing so hard they won't be able to fight so maybe it will all work out.

You seem to care an awful lot about this.

We have cut back on military recruiting and procurement in recent years due to budgetary reasons but now plan to cover costs for the integration of transgendered personnel, as well as their surgeries and therapy. Explain to me the logic in this.

If you value having an effective national defense rather than a massive, federally funded social experiment then you should care as well.

I am very skeptical that the total costs for anything related to transgender issues would be large enough to have any effect on budget cuts.

Did the ADA have unintended, and unanticipated budgetary effects? Being in commercial real estate you know the answer. Why would you predict a different outcome here. I can easily see a time when all new construction will have to incorporate a more expensive restroom paradigm, and shortly thereafter I can see mandatory retrofitting of existing facilities.Now it may be that the ADA compliance costs were worth it, and it may be that if we move in this direction these costs will be too, but to believe they will be effectively negligible seems ill-considered.

As an aside I have read that in the Metro Denver area the cost of a single surface parking space at commercial retail costs between $17,000 and $22,000. I believe the current paradigm in our area is one such space for every 10 regular spaces. Studies have shown that 1 in 25 spaces thusly reserved would adequately serve needs. The rest are wasteful. BTW that paradigm holds in large lots. Commercial retail with less than 10 total spaces must still devote a space for handicapped, so there the burden may be somewhat proportionally larger.

I don't think it's a proper analogy because transgender are not insisting that new facilities be created for them.

 

[Ditkaless Wonders]

I said several weeks ago that with gay marriage now codified transgender rights would be the next great campaign for progressives and their allies in academia and the media. The agitations never end, even in the face of logic and natural law. Even the military is getting in on the act. How do you think such accommodations are going to work within the confines of a Navy vessel or a forward deployed fire support base?

This isn't a lifestyle, it's a mental disorder. Cross-dressers on the front line. Madness. Then again, our enemies will be laughing so hard they won't be able to fight so maybe it will all work out.

You seem to care an awful lot about this.

We have cut back on military recruiting and procurement in recent years due to budgetary reasons but now plan to cover costs for the integration of transgendered personnel, as well as their surgeries and therapy. Explain to me the logic in this.

If you value having an effective national defense rather than a massive, federally funded social experiment then you should care as well.

I am very skeptical that the total costs for anything related to transgender issues would be large enough to have any effect on budget cuts.

Did the ADA have unintended, and unanticipated budgetary effects? Being in commercial real estate you know the answer. Why would you predict a different outcome here. I can easily see a time when all new construction will have to incorporate a more expensive restroom paradigm, and shortly thereafter I can see mandatory retrofitting of existing facilities.Now it may be that the ADA compliance costs were worth it, and it may be that if we move in this direction these costs will be too, but to believe they will be effectively negligible seems ill-considered.

As an aside I have read that in the Metro Denver area the cost of a single surface parking space at commercial retail costs between $17,000 and $22,000. I believe the current paradigm in our area is one such space for every 10 regular spaces. Studies have shown that 1 in 25 spaces thusly reserved would adequately serve needs. The rest are wasteful. BTW that paradigm holds in large lots. Commercial retail with less than 10 total spaces must still devote a space for handicapped, so there the burden may be somewhat proportionally larger.

I don't think it's a proper analogy because transgender are not insisting that new facilities be created for them.

Perhaps I made assumptions based on the direction of this thread, and your posting speaking of: "total costs for anything related to transgender issues". (emphasis added) I apologize if I made presumptions which were unwarranted. My bad.

 

[rockaction]

I said several weeks ago that with gay marriage now codified transgender rights would be the next great campaign for progressives and their allies in academia and the media. The agitations never end, even in the face of logic and natural law. Even the military is getting in on the act. How do you think such accommodations are going to work within the confines of a Navy vessel or a forward deployed fire support base?

This isn't a lifestyle, it's a mental disorder. Cross-dressers on the front line. Madness. Then again, our enemies will be laughing so hard they won't be able to fight so maybe it will all work out.

You seem to care an awful lot about this.

We have cut back on military recruiting and procurement in recent years due to budgetary reasons but now plan to cover costs for the integration of transgendered personnel, as well as their surgeries and therapy. Explain to me the logic in this.

If you value having an effective national defense rather than a massive, federally funded social experiment then you should care as well.

I am very skeptical that the total costs for anything related to transgender issues would be large enough to have any effect on budget cuts.

Did the ADA have unintended, and unanticipated budgetary effects? Being in commercial real estate you know the answer. Why would you predict a different outcome here. I can easily see a time when all new construction will have to incorporate a more expensive restroom paradigm, and shortly thereafter I can see mandatory retrofitting of existing facilities.Now it may be that the ADA compliance costs were worth it, and it may be that if we move in this direction these costs will be too, but to believe they will be effectively negligible seems ill-considered.

As an aside I have read that in the Metro Denver area the cost of a single surface parking space at commercial retail costs between $17,000 and $22,000. I believe the current paradigm in our area is one such space for every 10 regular spaces. Studies have shown that 1 in 25 spaces thusly reserved would adequately serve needs. The rest are wasteful. BTW that paradigm holds in large lots. Commercial retail with less than 10 total spaces must still devote a space for handicapped, so there the burden may be somewhat proportionally larger.

I don't think it's a proper analogy because transgender are not insisting that new facilities be created for them.

Jesus, tim. Wait until we hear about the ADA and dysphoria having more squat toilets in the men's and more urinals in the ladies'. From only the fringes, of course :rolls eyes:. Which will be poo-pooed as a slippery slope, much as the arguments for school locker rooms and bathrooms were.

It's that predictable.

 

[rockaction]

You need to sell the concept that more virile men take stinker dumps.

Dude, that does not work with the youth of today.

 

[ClownCausedChaos2]

I hear Target is going to unisex bathrooms.

 

[Ditkaless Wonders]

You need to sell the concept that more virile men take stinker dumps.

Dude, that does not work with the youth of today.

You've tried?

 

[TLEF316]

BTW, I'm not arguing that this student should be allowed in the girl's locker room. I haven't really decided. I just think that they'll find a way to solve it. some of you seem to think this effects society n some big way. It doesn't.

Any way they "solve it" will result in someone bring sued.

If they don't allow him in the ladies locker room, he'll sue for discrimination.

If they do, some uncomfortable girl's parent will sue the sue the school for not providing a safe changing area.

The easiest and most logical way to solve this is to make people change in the room that coincides with their current body. (Unless a neutral room is available) I feel for the folks that deal with this issue, but their own personal freedom shouldn't take precedent over common sense and the comfort of everyone else.

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

What happens when the class clown (male) decides he's going to identify as female and walks into the girls locker room?

Not only class clowns, but just confused kids looking for attention.

Maybe we should be working on the assumption that minors are too young to be making these kinds of decisions, like we do for so many other things.

You are saying that minors should not be allowed to be transgender? Because they are too young?

A) Is there any basis for that belief?

B) Are you familiar with the suicide rates of transgender youths?

Well, I don't think high school boys should be allowed to make decisions that allow them to use the girls' locker room or restrooms.

If they want to dress and act like a girl, I don't have an issue with that.

I don't know the answer to B) in your post, but I can't really imagine that coming out as transgender in HS really helps with any of the issues of alienation or bullying that probably are primary contributors to what I assume is a high rate.

 

[rockaction]

You need to sell the concept that more virile men take stinker dumps.

Dude, that does not work with the youth of today.

You've tried?

Sadly, there are no opportunistic moments. Perhaps I will see Paradise By The Dashboard LIght again, but I've sort of been relegated to the third league these days.

I'm cool with that.

 

[timschochet]

Rockaction you keep warning about these slippery slopes. Yet we all know that transgender people do exist and many are high school students. So if you had your way, what should we do about it?

 

[munga30]

I identify with a dog and shouldn't be arrested for sexual assault when I hump a woman's leg and sniff her crotch.

I, too, think you're a dog.

 

[rockaction]

Rockaction you keep warning about these slippery slopes. Yet we all know that transgender people do exist and many are high school students. So if you had your way, what should we do about it?

I'd stick largely to biology as far as the restrooms -- and especially lockers -- go. Then I'd instruct the tenth graders to take a class in it.

That's not flippant, by the way, I really would. If we could get an honest biology class discussing the difference between the sexes, that would be even better, but I wouldn't hold my breath.