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Hypothetical: Draft clock runs out on the Ravens tonight (pick 32) (1 Viewer)

bigmarc27

Footballguy
I saw this somewhere else but didn't think it was answered properly and it made me curious...

Clock runs out on pick 32 - can the jags pick? Is the drafted frozen over night and its a race to the podium on day 2?

 

lsutigers

Footballguy
Interesting question.

The Ravens take advantage of situations like this though, they don't let it happen to them #Vikingssuck

 

ghostguy123

Footballguy
I dont know the exact ruling but...................

The first round is 32 picks. If the Ravens go over the time limit, the team with pick 33 can make a pick, and then the Ravens get until the draft starts friday to make their pick, and they better have their pick in right away or the team at 34 can pick.....................but as long as they have their pick in immediately they will get it.

It's honestly (if that is the case) not a bad strategy, cause to me, pick 33 is more valuable than pick 32 cause you have a lot of time to make a move if you want to, that and think harder on your pick

 

Bruce Hammond

Footballguy
In one of my old live draft fantasy leagues, the rule was that if a team busted its time limit the commish assigned them the last PK on his list and we moved on. Hey Goodell, who ya got on your list??

 
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FUBAR

Footballguy
I dont know the exact ruling but...................

The first round is 32 picks. If the Ravens go over the time limit, the team with pick 33 can make a pick, and then the Ravens get until the draft starts friday to make their pick, and they better have their pick in right away or the team at 34 can pick.....................but as long as they have their pick in immediately they will get it.

It's honestly (if that is the case) not a bad strategy, cause to me, pick 33 is more valuable than pick 32 cause you have a lot of time to make a move if you want to, that and think harder on your pick
I doubt thinking harder is an issue here. Their GM is among the best in the business.

Trading though... there is something to that.

 

ghostguy123

Footballguy
I dont know the exact ruling but...................

The first round is 32 picks. If the Ravens go over the time limit, the team with pick 33 can make a pick, and then the Ravens get until the draft starts friday to make their pick, and they better have their pick in right away or the team at 34 can pick.....................but as long as they have their pick in immediately they will get it.

It's honestly (if that is the case) not a bad strategy, cause to me, pick 33 is more valuable than pick 32 cause you have a lot of time to make a move if you want to, that and think harder on your pick
I doubt thinking harder is an issue here. Their GM is among the best in the business.

Trading though... there is something to that.
Exactly, it just gives ore time for other teams to see a guy they want, and for more trade talks to take place.

I think it's a gimmee that pick 33 holds a lot more value

 

Grahamburn

Footballguy
I dont know the exact ruling but...................

The first round is 32 picks. If the Ravens go over the time limit, the team with pick 33 can make a pick, and then the Ravens get until the draft starts friday to make their pick, and they better have their pick in right away or the team at 34 can pick.....................but as long as they have their pick in immediately they will get it.

It's honestly (if that is the case) not a bad strategy, cause to me, pick 33 is more valuable than pick 32 cause you have a lot of time to make a move if you want to, that and think harder on your pick
Maybe in the past, but with the new CBA a first rounder is a 5 year contract. A second rounder is only 4 years. It makes 1st round picks that much more valuable.

 

meyerj31

Footballguy
I dont know the exact ruling but...................

The first round is 32 picks. If the Ravens go over the time limit, the team with pick 33 can make a pick, and then the Ravens get until the draft starts friday to make their pick, and they better have their pick in right away or the team at 34 can pick.....................but as long as they have their pick in immediately they will get it.

It's honestly (if that is the case) not a bad strategy, cause to me, pick 33 is more valuable than pick 32 cause you have a lot of time to make a move if you want to, that and think harder on your pick
And you also get to pay them less since it's a 2nd round instead of a 1st round pick... not a bad strategy indeed, if you had two players rated equally at positions of need. Not a bad strategy at all...

 

meyerj31

Footballguy
I dont know the exact ruling but...................

The first round is 32 picks. If the Ravens go over the time limit, the team with pick 33 can make a pick, and then the Ravens get until the draft starts friday to make their pick, and they better have their pick in right away or the team at 34 can pick.....................but as long as they have their pick in immediately they will get it.

It's honestly (if that is the case) not a bad strategy, cause to me, pick 33 is more valuable than pick 32 cause you have a lot of time to make a move if you want to, that and think harder on your pick
Maybe in the past, but with the new CBA a first rounder is a 5 year contract. A second rounder is only 4 years. It makes 1st round picks that much more valuable.
The last two years on rookie deals are somewhat irrelevant since they can be revisited after three years. I would think the drop in money would be more important than tacking on another year but I could be wrong ... not sure on the numbers exactly.

 

ghostguy123

Footballguy

Grahamburn

Footballguy
I dont know the exact ruling but...................

The first round is 32 picks. If the Ravens go over the time limit, the team with pick 33 can make a pick, and then the Ravens get until the draft starts friday to make their pick, and they better have their pick in right away or the team at 34 can pick.....................but as long as they have their pick in immediately they will get it.

It's honestly (if that is the case) not a bad strategy, cause to me, pick 33 is more valuable than pick 32 cause you have a lot of time to make a move if you want to, that and think harder on your pick
Maybe in the past, but with the new CBA a first rounder is a 5 year contract. A second rounder is only 4 years. It makes 1st round picks that much more valuable.
The last two years on rookie deals are somewhat irrelevant since they can be revisited after three years. I would think the drop in money would be more important than tacking on another year but I could be wrong ... not sure on the numbers exactly.
First round picks get four year deals, but their team holds an option for a fifth year. There are slotted four year deals from rounds 2 through 7.

The option would be at the average salary of the top 10 players at whatever position the player plays.

Basically, if you manage to get a stud at the 32 your team won't lose them to free agency after their 4th season like they would if you draft a stud at pick 33.

 

ghostguy123

Footballguy
I dont know the exact ruling but...................

The first round is 32 picks. If the Ravens go over the time limit, the team with pick 33 can make a pick, and then the Ravens get until the draft starts friday to make their pick, and they better have their pick in right away or the team at 34 can pick.....................but as long as they have their pick in immediately they will get it.

It's honestly (if that is the case) not a bad strategy, cause to me, pick 33 is more valuable than pick 32 cause you have a lot of time to make a move if you want to, that and think harder on your pick
Maybe in the past, but with the new CBA a first rounder is a 5 year contract. A second rounder is only 4 years. It makes 1st round picks that much more valuable.
The last two years on rookie deals are somewhat irrelevant since they can be revisited after three years. I would think the drop in money would be more important than tacking on another year but I could be wrong ... not sure on the numbers exactly.
First round picks get four year deals, but their team holds an option for a fifth year. There are slotted four year deals from rounds 2 through 7.

The option would be at the average salary of the top 10 players at whatever position the player plays.

Basically, if you manage to get a stud at the 32 your team won't lose them to free agency after their 4th season like they would if you draft a stud at pick 33.
they are just going to renegotiate after year 3 anyway.

And besides, the BIGGEST part of the value increase from 32 to 33 is an entire night and day to swing a deal

 

Grahamburn

Footballguy
So you're saying the ability to sleep on it is greater than having the player under team control for an additional year? Got it.

I don't think you can just assume they'll be renegotiating the contract. Getting rookie contracts structured this way was a pretty huge part of the new CBA.

I'm not an NFL GM, but I'd guess if you ran a poll of all 32 most of them would rather have the 5th year than the additional time to swing a deal.

Also, if you were correct here, every team picking at 32 would just let their time run out. ;)

 

GregR

Footballguy
I suspect the draft is suspended the moment that 1.32's pick is submitted or their timer expires. No picks can be made until the draft resumes with the start of 2.01's timer on Friday. So if the Ravens did this, they probably would not be able to make their pick. And they would have to race the Jags to get their pick in on Friday when it resumed.

 

cdubz

Footballguy
Interesting question.

The Ravens take advantage of situations like this though, they don't let it happen to them #Vikingssuck
Nope, they would never let it happen to them: http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/09000d5d81f9116e/article/bears-sorry-for-trade-mess-but-ravens-reportedly-want-a-pick
This isnt necessarily a Ravens-specific question. I am sure Ozzie wont let it some to this, just wondering what would happen
I think you should read the link. The point is that due to a botched trade with the Bears, Ravens let clock run out on their pick 2 years ago where KC was able to then jump ahead of them. Even if it wasn't their fault, LSU was wrong on Ravens not letting the situation happen to them.

ETA: I probably should have used green font on the first post

 
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cdubz

Footballguy
I think this got derailed a bit - not talking strategy or money, just wanting to know the rule.
Not finding anything conclusive, but think the team holding #33 would be able to jump in and make a pick. The first round occurs on Thursday, which in my mind consists of 32 picks. If you look at how the NFL historically deals with teams letting their clocks run, the team sneaking in is recorded as making that # pick. So would think that #32 would just be made by team other than the Ravens assuming #33 holder can get their pick in before Ravens.

ETA:

"If the time expires before the pick is submitted, the next team can begin to submit their pick, but the team who's time expired can still submit their pick at any point"

http://www.draftsite.com/nfl/rules/

 
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flc735

Footballguy
I think I would rather have the extra day at the cost of 1 draft slot. That gives you more time for potential trades and re-evaluation. All unless there is 1 particular guy I loved. If I were Bal ya, I would let Jax jump in front of me.

 

cdubz

Footballguy
I think I would rather have the extra day at the cost of 1 draft slot. That gives you more time for potential trades and re-evaluation. All unless there is 1 particular guy I loved. If I were Bal ya, I would let Jax jump in front of me.
Depending on the board, this could be a good strategy. Props for thinking about this one. The issue is if Baltimore prefers #33 to #32 Jacksonville would most likely as well. That we be one weird game of chicken to see how far you are willing to fall down the order. My guess is that maybe Jacksonville holds off on picking but #34 would just go ahead and pick if it came to it.

Given that it might actually be an issue, I wonder if NFL has a rule to deal with it that is either not public or we have not found yet.

 

Grahamburn

Footballguy
I think this got derailed a bit - not talking strategy or money, just wanting to know the rule.
The rule is the next team in line could jump in and make their pick thus ending the first round, and Baltimore would have to be galactically stupid to let that happen.

 

GregR

Footballguy
I think this got derailed a bit - not talking strategy or money, just wanting to know the rule.
Not finding anything conclusive, but think the team holding #33 would be able to jump in and make a pick. The first round occurs on Thursday, which in my mind consists of 32 picks. If you look at how the NFL historically deals with teams letting their clocks run, the team sneaking in is recorded as making that # pick. So would think that #32 would just be made by team other than the Ravens assuming #33 holder can get their pick in before Ravens.

ETA:

"If the time expires before the pick is submitted, the next team can begin to submit their pick, but the team who's time expired can still submit their pick at any point"

http://www.draftsite.com/nfl/rules/
I think the bolded view is unlikely to have anything to do with the actual rules. It would seem very odd for the NFL to word their rules as "the first 32 picks take place Thursday" instead of "the first round takes place Thursday". The number of picks in a round are not necessarily the same from one year to the next. Expansion teams may get extra picks, teams may lose picks, and compensatory picks may differ by round.

Did we see the 4.01 take place on Friday last year because the Saints didn't get to use their 2nd round pick? No. So it's a good bet it goes by round, not by number of picks.

 

Grahamburn

Footballguy
Or, if Greg is right in that the round would end when Baltimore finally picks... Would the team jumping in front of them have their pick considered a first rounder?

With the rookie wage scale structured the way it is I'd think the NFL would have to consider the first 32 picks "first rounders," regardless.

Interesting to say the least.

 

FattyVM

Footballguy
IMHO. The NFL will not let the 32 pick hold the first round hostage. They WILL let the pick be made either by the actual team or the 'next' team tonight. It's a cable $$ licensing issue.

 

GregR

Footballguy
IMHO. The NFL will not let the 32 pick hold the first round hostage. They WILL let the pick be made either by the actual team or the 'next' team tonight. It's a cable $$ licensing issue.
You're ESPN. You paid to broadcast the NFL draft. Which has more value to you?

a) Having that 32nd pick at the end of the first round when you've probably already maxed out your viewer rating for the show earlier on?

b) Having the sports media world erupt with discussion of how the Ravens missed their pick and how the Jags can race them to get their pick in first as soon as the draft resumes, causing a ton more people to tune in Friday than would have?

I'm voting B.

 

ghostguy123

Footballguy
So you're saying the ability to sleep on it is greater than having the player under team control for an additional year? Got it.

I don't think you can just assume they'll be renegotiating the contract. Getting rookie contracts structured this way was a pretty huge part of the new CBA.

I'm not an NFL GM, but I'd guess if you ran a poll of all 32 most of them would rather have the 5th year than the additional time to swing a deal.

Also, if you were correct here, every team picking at 32 would just let their time run out. ;)
It's more than just the contract, which I have said like three times now. There is also more time to think. There is also more time to make a move (again this is key if a team's main intent is to trade the pick, which I have said a few times, so please get off JUST the contract aspect, especially since they CAn renegotiate in three years).

 

ghostguy123

Footballguy
Oh wow, for whoever mentioned this, nice thought.

The Ravens let the clock expire so the Jags can pick..............but then the Jags dont pick, HAHAHAHA.

I think clearly though if the team holding pick 32 has intent to trade down, it's probably in their best interest to just trade the pick straight up for pick 33. I think they can get a better deal if they have 20 hours to get it done.

But guess what, if I am the GM with pick 33..................I say no (unless there is a player I love that I have to have)

 

cdubz

Footballguy
I think this got derailed a bit - not talking strategy or money, just wanting to know the rule.
Not finding anything conclusive, but think the team holding #33 would be able to jump in and make a pick. The first round occurs on Thursday, which in my mind consists of 32 picks. If you look at how the NFL historically deals with teams letting their clocks run, the team sneaking in is recorded as making that # pick. So would think that #32 would just be made by team other than the Ravens assuming #33 holder can get their pick in before Ravens.

ETA:

"If the time expires before the pick is submitted, the next team can begin to submit their pick, but the team who's time expired can still submit their pick at any point"

http://www.draftsite.com/nfl/rules/
I think the bolded view is unlikely to have anything to do with the actual rules. It would seem very odd for the NFL to word their rules as "the first 32 picks take place Thursday" instead of "the first round takes place Thursday". The number of picks in a round are not necessarily the same from one year to the next. Expansion teams may get extra picks, teams may lose picks, and compensatory picks may differ by round.

Did we see the 4.01 take place on Friday last year because the Saints didn't get to use their 2nd round pick? No. So it's a good bet it goes by round, not by number of picks.
You give a good counter example, 32 teams is the wrong way to put it.

Because no one forfeited their pick in the first round prior to the draft, that is what would make the first round consist of 32 picks in this case. The other way is possible, but I think letting the 32nd pick occur would make more sense.

 

Grahamburn

Footballguy
So you're saying the ability to sleep on it is greater than having the player under team control for an additional year? Got it.

I don't think you can just assume they'll be renegotiating the contract. Getting rookie contracts structured this way was a pretty huge part of the new CBA.

I'm not an NFL GM, but I'd guess if you ran a poll of all 32 most of them would rather have the 5th year than the additional time to swing a deal.

Also, if you were correct here, every team picking at 32 would just let their time run out. ;)
It's more than just the contract, which I have said like three times now. There is also more time to think. There is also more time to make a move (again this is key if a team's main intent is to trade the pick, which I have said a few times, so please get off JUST the contract aspect, especially since they CAn renegotiate in three years).
You don't have time to think up there. If you think, you're dead.

 

flc735

Footballguy
IMHO. The NFL will not let the 32 pick hold the first round hostage. They WILL let the pick be made either by the actual team or the 'next' team tonight. It's a cable $$ licensing issue.
But the Jags likely won't be prepared to pick and unwilling to make an unprepared pick

 

Bri

Footballguy
Much of the rules were created when the draft was far more rounds than it is now.

I do not believe there has ever been an occurrence where a team was allowed to jump a day up in the draft. As has been pointed out, the rule seems to state as such, but I don't think it's in the spirit of drafting nor would it be allowed. I have more confidence in Goodell sending people to the Ravens "war room" and insisting upon a pick.

It's too difficult to project if 5 year or 4 year is better since so many draftees don't pan out.

I too think the extra time to offer and receive trade ideas makes the 2.1 far more valuable. Of course, if it doesn't involve a trade, then 1.32 is more valuable.

 

GregR

Footballguy
Anyone know what happened to the Chiefs pick at the top of the 2nd round?

Why did Jax jump ahead of KC for the first pick in the second round?

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft/rounds/_/round/2/year/2013

I see the Chiefs and Jags switched the 1st and 2nd picks of each round.

Any reason for this?

Just curious.
If teams tie in record, they rotate through which pick they get each round. If 4 teams tie and the first round draft order is 1, 2, 3, 4... then in the second round, the team with the top pick (team 1) goes to the end of the list and the rest move up. 2, 3, 4, 1. Then in the third round, 2 drops down and it goes 3, 4, 1, 2. Wash, rinse, repeat.

 

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