In defense of Albert Haynesworth... (1 Viewer)

[jackdubl]

Let's say your name is Warren Moon and the Redskins bring you in to be the franchise QB. You sign a big $100 million dollar contract. Then, after you sign, the team hires a new coach. The new coach says he thinks you have quick feet and he is going to play you at CB. When you signed your contract you made it clear that you wanted to play only QB, and the team assured you that was the case. Now, the new regime wants you to shut up and collect your $100 million and play CB. Instead, Moon resists at every turn, refusing to play hard and not talking with coaches, until he is finally suspended for insubordination.

Not exactly the same situation but it is similar. Is Moon just selfish?

 

[tdhartis]

No, but Haynesworth is. Completely different situations as playing a lineman in a different scheme is not even comparable to the switch from QB to CB IMO.

 

[Holy Schneikes]

Let's say your name is Warren Moon and the Redskins bring you in to be the franchise QB. You sign a big $100 million dollar contract. Then, after you sign, the team hires a new coach. The new coach says he thinks you have quick feet and he is going to play you at CB. When you signed your contract you made it clear that you wanted to play only QB, and the team assured you that was the case. Now, the new regime wants you to shut up and collect your $100 million and play CB. Instead, Moon resists at every turn, refusing to play hard and not talking with coaches, until he is finally suspended for insubordination.Not exactly the same situation but it is similar. Is Moon just selfish?

First, they are asking him to play defensive tackle. Same (or at least similar) position, different scheme. Your job is to tackle people with the ball, or help other people do it. Going from QB to CB would be a LOT different scenario.A better analogy would be in Moon signed on to a system that was very pass friendly and then got a new coach who wanted to ground and pound. He might not be happy about it, but he got paid to play, so he'd play and try to help his team win.2nd, Albert had the option to NOT collect the big check he got at the beginning of the season AFTER he know the score on the new scheme. He chose to take the money, and if he REALLY didn't want to play in that scheme he could have easily opted out and played somewhere else in his preferred scheme.Fairly cut and dry on that front IMO.

 

[Fat Nick]

Let's say your name is Warren Moon and the Redskins bring you in to be the franchise QB. You sign a big $100 million dollar contract. Then, after you sign, the team hires a new coach. The new coach says he thinks you have quick feet and he is going to play you at CB. When you signed your contract you made it clear that you wanted to play only QB, and the team assured you that was the case. Now, the new regime wants you to shut up and collect your $100 million and play CB. Instead, Moon resists at every turn, refusing to play hard and not talking with coaches, until he is finally suspended for insubordination.Not exactly the same situation but it is similar. Is Moon just selfish?

First, they are asking him to play defensive tackle. Same (or at least similar) position, different scheme. Your job is to tackle people with the ball, or help other people do it. Going from QB to CB would be a LOT different scenario.A better analogy would be in Moon signed on to a system that was very pass friendly and then got a new coach who wanted to ground and pound. He might not be happy about it, but he got paid to play, so he'd play and try to help his team win.2nd, Albert had the option to NOT collect the big check he got at the beginning of the season AFTER he know the score on the new scheme. He chose to take the money, and if he REALLY didn't want to play in that scheme he could have easily opted out and played somewhere else in his preferred scheme.Fairly cut and dry on that front IMO.

As much as I disagree with Shanny's approach to this whole matter, belittling Haynesworth and all at the beginning of the season, it was still Haynesworth's choices that impacted this along the way. If he had just showed up at training camp, ready to give it his best try, none of this would have EVER been an issue.

 

[jackdubl]

Let's say your name is Warren Moon and the Redskins bring you in to be the franchise QB. You sign a big $100 million dollar contract. Then, after you sign, the team hires a new coach. The new coach says he thinks you have quick feet and he is going to play you at CB. When you signed your contract you made it clear that you wanted to play only QB, and the team assured you that was the case. Now, the new regime wants you to shut up and collect your $100 million and play CB. Instead, Moon resists at every turn, refusing to play hard and not talking with coaches, until he is finally suspended for insubordination.Not exactly the same situation but it is similar. Is Moon just selfish?

First, they are asking him to play defensive tackle. Same (or at least similar) position, different scheme. Your job is to tackle people with the ball, or help other people do it. Going from QB to CB would be a LOT different scenario.A better analogy would be in Moon signed on to a system that was very pass friendly and then got a new coach who wanted to ground and pound. He might not be happy about it, but he got paid to play, so he'd play and try to help his team win.2nd, Albert had the option to NOT collect the big check he got at the beginning of the season AFTER he know the score on the new scheme. He chose to take the money, and if he REALLY didn't want to play in that scheme he could have easily opted out and played somewhere else in his preferred scheme.Fairly cut and dry on that front IMO.

I agree that your analogy is better. I disagree that defensive tackle and nose tackle to the same thing. Nose tackle's job is to occupy several blockers at once so others can make plays. You're basically a blocking dummy. A defensive tackle is more a part of a unit where everyone's job is to make plays.

 

[gotexansgo]

Let's say your name is Warren Moon and the Redskins bring you in to be the franchise QB. You sign a big $100 million dollar contract. Then, after you sign, the team hires a new coach. The new coach says he thinks you have quick feet and he is going to play you at CB. When you signed your contract you made it clear that you wanted to play only QB, and the team assured you that was the case. Now, the new regime wants you to shut up and collect your $100 million and play CB. Instead, Moon resists at every turn, refusing to play hard and not talking with coaches, until he is finally suspended for insubordination.Not exactly the same situation but it is similar. Is Moon just selfish?

First, they are asking him to play defensive tackle. Same (or at least similar) position, different scheme. Your job is to tackle people with the ball, or help other people do it. Going from QB to CB would be a LOT different scenario.A better analogy would be in Moon signed on to a system that was very pass friendly and then got a new coach who wanted to ground and pound. He might not be happy about it, but he got paid to play, so he'd play and try to help his team win.2nd, Albert had the option to NOT collect the big check he got at the beginning of the season AFTER he know the score on the new scheme. He chose to take the money, and if he REALLY didn't want to play in that scheme he could have easily opted out and played somewhere else in his preferred scheme.Fairly cut and dry on that front IMO.

As much as I disagree with Shanny's approach to this whole matter, belittling Haynesworth and all at the beginning of the season, it was still Haynesworth's choices that impacted this along the way. If he had just showed up at training camp, ready to give it his best try, none of this would have EVER been an issue.

 

[ScottyDog]

DUDE, HE STILL CASHED THE $21 MILLION "EF ING " CHECK after the fact. He has NO defense. A POS and model of what is wrong with this generation of "money for nothing".

Let's say your name is Warren Moon and the Redskins bring you in to be the franchise QB. You sign a big $100 million dollar contract. Then, after you sign, the team hires a new coach. The new coach says he thinks you have quick feet and he is going to play you at CB. When you signed your contract you made it clear that you wanted to play only QB, and the team assured you that was the case. Now, the new regime wants you to shut up and collect your $100 million and play CB. Instead, Moon resists at every turn, refusing to play hard and not talking with coaches, until he is finally suspended for insubordination.Not exactly the same situation but it is similar. Is Moon just selfish?

 

[Holy Schneikes]

Let's say your name is Warren Moon and the Redskins bring you in to be the franchise QB. You sign a big $100 million dollar contract. Then, after you sign, the team hires a new coach. The new coach says he thinks you have quick feet and he is going to play you at CB. When you signed your contract you made it clear that you wanted to play only QB, and the team assured you that was the case. Now, the new regime wants you to shut up and collect your $100 million and play CB. Instead, Moon resists at every turn, refusing to play hard and not talking with coaches, until he is finally suspended for insubordination.Not exactly the same situation but it is similar. Is Moon just selfish?

First, they are asking him to play defensive tackle. Same (or at least similar) position, different scheme. Your job is to tackle people with the ball, or help other people do it. Going from QB to CB would be a LOT different scenario.A better analogy would be in Moon signed on to a system that was very pass friendly and then got a new coach who wanted to ground and pound. He might not be happy about it, but he got paid to play, so he'd play and try to help his team win.2nd, Albert had the option to NOT collect the big check he got at the beginning of the season AFTER he know the score on the new scheme. He chose to take the money, and if he REALLY didn't want to play in that scheme he could have easily opted out and played somewhere else in his preferred scheme.Fairly cut and dry on that front IMO.

I agree that your analogy is better. I disagree that defensive tackle and nose tackle to the same thing. Nose tackle's job is to occupy several blockers at once so others can make plays. You're basically a blocking dummy. A defensive tackle is more a part of a unit where everyone's job is to make plays.

It's a different role for sure, but whether it is a different position or not is a bit of semantics. If he went to pro bowl, it would be as a DT either way. I get what you are saying, and there WOULD have been some merit to that end of the debate had he NOT taken the big check, but he did.Like I said, QB to CB (or even WR) is a MUCH bigger change than 4-3 DT to 3-4 NT. Yeah, you are "occupying blockers" but your job is still to go get the QB and/or ball carrier - it's just a lot harder to actually do it while making it easier for others to do it.

 

[jackdubl]

Let's say your name is Warren Moon and the Redskins bring you in to be the franchise QB. You sign a big $100 million dollar contract. Then, after you sign, the team hires a new coach. The new coach says he thinks you have quick feet and he is going to play you at CB. When you signed your contract you made it clear that you wanted to play only QB, and the team assured you that was the case. Now, the new regime wants you to shut up and collect your $100 million and play CB. Instead, Moon resists at every turn, refusing to play hard and not talking with coaches, until he is finally suspended for insubordination.

Not exactly the same situation but it is similar. Is Moon just selfish?

First, they are asking him to play defensive tackle. Same (or at least similar) position, different scheme. Your job is to tackle people with the ball, or help other people do it. Going from QB to CB would be a LOT different scenario.A better analogy would be in Moon signed on to a system that was very pass friendly and then got a new coach who wanted to ground and pound. He might not be happy about it, but he got paid to play, so he'd play and try to help his team win.

2nd, Albert had the option to NOT collect the big check he got at the beginning of the season AFTER he know the score on the new scheme. He chose to take the money, and if he REALLY didn't want to play in that scheme he could have easily opted out and played somewhere else in his preferred scheme.

Fairly cut and dry on that front IMO.

I agree that your analogy is better. I disagree that defensive tackle and nose tackle to the same thing. Nose tackle's job is to occupy several blockers at once so others can make plays. You're basically a blocking dummy. A defensive tackle is more a part of a unit where everyone's job is to make plays.

It's a different role for sure, but whether it is a different position or not is a bit of semantics. If he went to pro bowl, it would be as a DT either way. I get what you are saying, and there WOULD have been some merit to that end of the debate had he NOT taken the big check, but he did.Like I said, QB to CB (or even WR) is a MUCH bigger change than 4-3 DT to 3-4 NT. Yeah, you are "occupying blockers" but your job is still to go get the QB and/or ball carrier - it's just a lot harder to actually do it while making it easier for others to do it.

Agreed.

 

[Velvet Revolver]

Fully agree with ScottyDog -

$21 million dollars !! To PLAY A GAME - and this disgusting excuse for a human being won't see it in his heart to do what his employer asks? Who works for who? He signed a contract did he not? What else could this spoiled self-centered moron do to make that kind of $$?! He barely passed his physical and he wants to call the shots?

There are firemen, police officers and many other professionals who RISK THEIR LIVES everyday and have had to take pay decreases to keep their jobs in this f'ckd up economy -

America is the place for entitlements without regard to ethics & morals.

 

[fatness]

Let's say your name is Warren Moon and the Redskins bring you in to be the franchise QB.

Haynesworth's argument has always been not that the Redskins' front office promised him something after he signed, but that the team owner promised they'd play him in a 4-3 before Haynesworth would sign with them. As far as the bonus in April, they were contracturally obligated to pay that to him. Nothing said at the meeting with Shanahan in April changed that.Haynesworth is a turd and they should have dropped or traded him awhile back. But this fantasy of getting money back from him is just childish. Both sides of this situation have obligations, and if the Redskins are unhappy with what they were obligated to pay him then boo hoo, get over it and be done with this clown show.

 

[cvnpoka]

Let's say your name is Warren Moon and the Redskins bring you in to be the franchise QB. You sign a big $100 million dollar contract. Then, after you sign, the team hires a new coach. The new coach says he thinks you have quick feet and he is going to play you at CB. When you signed your contract you made it clear that you wanted to play only QB, and the team assured you that was the case. Now, the new regime wants you to shut up and collect your $100 million and play CB. Instead, Moon resists at every turn, refusing to play hard and not talking with coaches, until he is finally suspended for insubordination.Not exactly the same situation but it is similar. Is Moon just selfish?

i think you are on the right track but your hypothetical is a bit hyperbolic. its more like if moon is brought in to be a run and shoot qb and then a new coach comes in and changes the scheme to an option style attack. something he obv isnt as good at and will hurt his career. i think i heard haynesworth cite issues with the increased pounding the nose tackle position takes.theres more to it than that ofc. it sure seems like shanahan singled him out with regards to the infamous "conditioning test" that only he was required to pass. criticism for missing voluntary workouts, when shanny wasnt even the coach yet. playing him 4 qtrs in the final preseason game despite a known knee injury.

 

[Insein]

Let's say your name is Warren Moon and the Redskins bring you in to be the franchise QB. You sign a big $100 million dollar contract. Then, after you sign, the team hires a new coach. The new coach says he thinks you have quick feet and he is going to play you at CB. When you signed your contract you made it clear that you wanted to play only QB, and the team assured you that was the case. Now, the new regime wants you to shut up and collect your $100 million and play CB. Instead, Moon resists at every turn, refusing to play hard and not talking with coaches, until he is finally suspended for insubordination.Not exactly the same situation but it is similar. Is Moon just selfish?

First, they are asking him to play defensive tackle. Same (or at least similar) position, different scheme. Your job is to tackle people with the ball, or help other people do it. Going from QB to CB would be a LOT different scenario.A better analogy would be in Moon signed on to a system that was very pass friendly and then got a new coach who wanted to ground and pound. He might not be happy about it, but he got paid to play, so he'd play and try to help his team win.2nd, Albert had the option to NOT collect the big check he got at the beginning of the season AFTER he know the score on the new scheme. He chose to take the money, and if he REALLY didn't want to play in that scheme he could have easily opted out and played somewhere else in his preferred scheme.Fairly cut and dry on that front IMO.

/thread

 

[Holy Schneikes]

Let's say your name is Warren Moon and the Redskins bring you in to be the franchise QB.

As far as the bonus in April, they were contracturally obligated to pay that to him. Nothing said at the meeting with Shanahan in April changed that.

I don't think that's true. They could have waived him right there and then without paying that bonus (still on the hook for the signing bonus of course). That's why they ASKED him if we was willing to play within the new scheme BEFORE they sent the check. At least that's how the story goes.If that story is true (and I don't have any reason to believe it isn't), then Albert really has nothing to complain about in terms of what they are asking him to do. He wanted to eat his cake and have it too.If I've gotten something wrong in there, then I believe he has some LIMITED legit gripe with the organization for a bait-and-swtich.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

Let's say your name is Warren Moon and the Redskins bring you in to be the franchise QB. You sign a big $100 million dollar contract. Then, after you sign, the team hires a new coach. The new coach says he thinks you have quick feet and he is going to play you at CB. When you signed your contract you made it clear that you wanted to play only QB, and the team assured you that was the case. Now, the new regime wants you to shut up and collect your $100 million and play CB. Instead, Moon resists at every turn, refusing to play hard and not talking with coaches, until he is finally suspended for insubordination.Not exactly the same situation but it is similar. Is Moon just selfish?

If Moon wanted it guaranteed that he'd play only QB, he should have included that in his contract. He may have to give up a few mil in return for that assurance; but if it's worth it, it can be negotiated. If he doesn't give up whatever it takes to get that assurance, if he plans to collect the whole $100 million, then he needs to live up to his part of the contract as well. His part of the contract includes giving his best effort as a player. Refusing to play hard, or refusing to talk to coaches, doesn't cut it.

 

[Bri]

like I said in the other thread, the Redskins knew they signed a big baby and should have signed a baby sitter.

This pretentious "he should be more professional" attitude ignores the guy's entire career which happens to be the reason he got 100mil. It's not like they only watched tapes with no sound, had no internet and read no papers for the last several years. They knew Big Al was a big baby.

 

[Sudsy]

Best efforts.

 

[jackdubl]

Let's say your name is Warren Moon and the Redskins bring you in to be the franchise QB. You sign a big $100 million dollar contract. Then, after you sign, the team hires a new coach. The new coach says he thinks you have quick feet and he is going to play you at CB. When you signed your contract you made it clear that you wanted to play only QB, and the team assured you that was the case. Now, the new regime wants you to shut up and collect your $100 million and play CB. Instead, Moon resists at every turn, refusing to play hard and not talking with coaches, until he is finally suspended for insubordination.

Not exactly the same situation but it is similar. Is Moon just selfish?

If Moon wanted it guaranteed that he'd play only QB, he should have included that in his contract. He may have to give up a few mil in return for that assurance; but if it's worth it, it can be negotiated. If he doesn't give up whatever it takes to get that assurance, if he plans to collect the whole $100 million, then he needs to live up to his part of the contract as well. His part of the contract includes giving his best effort as a player. Refusing to play hard, or refusing to talk to coaches, doesn't cut it.

Good point.

 

[fatness]

Let's say your name is Warren Moon and the Redskins bring you in to be the franchise QB.

As far as the bonus in April, they were contracturally obligated to pay that to him. Nothing said at the meeting with Shanahan in April changed that.

I don't think that's true. They could have waived him right there and then without paying that bonus (still on the hook for the signing bonus of course).

No, they could not have.

 

[Brunell4MVP]

Let's say your name is Warren Moon and the Redskins bring you in to be the franchise QB.

As far as the bonus in April, they were contracturally obligated to pay that to him. Nothing said at the meeting with Shanahan in April changed that.

I don't think that's true. They could have waived him right there and then without paying that bonus (still on the hook for the signing bonus of course).

No, they could not have.

Yes, they could have. The $20M was a roster bonus. Not on the roster, no bonus. However, they were still obligated to pay some of his salary going forward, whether he was on the roster or not.

 

[fatness]

It was guaranteed money.

the bottom line is that $21 million guaranteed is $21 million guaranteed whether it's listed as an option bonus, signing bonus or an ice cream sundae bonus.

That's why it was a bad contract and why the Redskins regret it.

As part of the megadeal that Haynesworth signed in the opening hours of free agency in 2009 – a contract that still has the league buzzing – Haynesworth received a $21-million – yes, $21 million -- option bonus that had to be exercised in the first 10 days of the 2010 league year, a time period that has now passed.

Also as part of that deal, the Redskins had a right to “supersede” that option payment and convert it to a signing bonus of the same amount. They did exactly that, payable in full on April 1 (last Thursday).

Second link.

 

[cobalt_27]

Let's say your name is Warren Moon and the Redskins bring you in to be the franchise QB. You sign a big $100 million dollar contract. Then, after you sign, the team hires a new coach. The new coach says he thinks you have quick feet and he is going to play you at CB. When you signed your contract you made it clear that you wanted to play only QB, and the team assured you that was the case. Now, the new regime wants you to shut up and collect your $100 million and play CB. Instead, Moon resists at every turn, refusing to play hard and not talking with coaches, until he is finally suspended for insubordination.Not exactly the same situation but it is similar. Is Moon just selfish?

Is Haynesworth not playing defensive tackle?The more correct analogy is if Moon is signed to play QB for a run-and-shoot style of offense, and a new coach comes in and devises a more conventional offensive scheme.Yeah, I'd say Moon would be in the wrong to refuse to play, not talk to coaches, and otherwise be an insubordinate ****. That was easy. Got any more?

 

[Brunell4MVP]

It was guaranteed money.

the bottom line is that $21 million guaranteed is $21 million guaranteed whether it's listed as an option bonus, signing bonus or an ice cream sundae bonus.

That's why it was a bad contract and why the Redskins regret it.

From your article..."If Washington chose not to pay the bonus, future base salaries in Haynesworth's contract, up to $21 million, would have become guaranteed, according to two league sources who have reviewed Haynesworth's contract."

And this is exactly what I'm saying. They didn't have to pay him a $21M lump sum since he wouldn't have been on the roster. The option roster bonus would have been paid over the next few years as part of his guaranteed salary (in conjunction with the way it hits the salary cap).

Albert does still get the money either way. I just think making him wait to collect the payments over time and trading him prior to April 20th date would have been smart. I think Shanny used this same thinking as leverage for getting him to agree to what he would do for the lump payment. then Albert went back on his word.

 

[TommyGilmore]

First, they are asking him to play defensive tackle. Same (or at least similar) position, different scheme. Your job is to tackle people with the ball, or help other people do it. Going from QB to CB would be a LOT different scenario.A better analogy would be in Moon signed on to a system that was very pass friendly and then got a new coach who wanted to ground and pound. He might not be happy about it, but he got paid to play, so he'd play and try to help his team win.

Other position players do this ALL THE TIME. West-Coast QBs are asked to run the Run-And-Shoot. Pass catching TEs are asked to block. Goalline RBs are asked to catch passes. They might disagree with how they are being deployed, but they do their best to fit into whatever system they're in.

 

[atl3695]

You guys are acting like you have to chip in to pay Hayneworth's salary!

It's the Redskins money and an organization supposedly run by professionals who do their research. Haynesworth has had issues his whole career. Why did they think that was going to change after he got millions guaranteed? The Warren Moon run and shoot to option offense was a good analogy. Haynesworth got franchise qb money.If you invest that much in a player, obviously you expect him to be the cornerstone of your defense.

So why take him out the the 4-3 that he has been successful at his whole career and switch to a 3-4 that doesnt use his skills correctly and violates a promise he claims was made to him by the owner. So now you have a pissed off superstar with guaranteed money and a history of causing problems. Makes no sense to switch to the 3-4 in the first place.

Hayneworth is who he is. He has been consistent about that. It wasnt like he was some model player who suddenly went crazy. The Redskins should have known what they were getting into when they signed him and made decisions accordingly.

 

[Sweet Love]

I'll tell you this, going into the CBA, Fat Albert gave a lot of ammo to the owners in regards to guaranteed contracts. He is the posterboy for not having them at all (which will not happen) or at least some type of "out" clause for the owners in cases like this (monies paid back or cap breaks for cutting someone like this).

If he was on my team, I would sever all ties. The guy could take down the gravy-train all by himself, and at LEAST, no one will be given such a contract again. Think if he played, and played well; these deals would be coming out of the woodwork in years to come. As of now, I can't see another one being done like this, unless it is to a Manning or Brady-type.

 

[fatness]

Albert does still get the money either way. I just think making him wait to collect the payments over time and trading him prior to April 20th date would have been smart. I think Shanny used this same thinking as leverage for getting him to agree to what he would do for the lump payment. then Albert went back on his word.

OK, I misunderstood you, thanks. Since this is an uncapped year the Redskins wanted the full salary cap hit to happen this year, which they got. They restructured the contracts of several other players to accomplish this as well.

 

[fatness]

From Haynesworth's agent, also using some legalese like Shanahan used in his memo about the suspension.

“Albert and I have discussed the claims made in the Notice of Suspension and we disagree with the Redskins’ decision. He was surprised by the suspension, the maximum permitted under the CBA, and will certainly appeal it.

“The accusations made by Coach Shanahan and Bruce Allen are vague and without merit. Since training camp began, today’s notice was the first that Albert received informing him that his conduct was not consistent with the ‘terms of his contract’ as Coach Shanahan claims. Bruce confirmed to me today, that there have been no other letters or formal notices of any kind sent to Albert during the regular season suggesting that he was engaging in conduct detrimental to the team. We will begin the appeal process immediately and expect the facts to come to light during arbitration. Albert has repeatedly asked for a bigger role in the defense — he simply wants to play and maximize his contribution to the team. It is unfortunate that he has not been utilized more, as the Redskins defense causes more turnovers and gives up fewer total yards, rushing yards, passing yards, first downs, third down conversions and points when Albert plays in the game.”

So Haynesworth appeals the suspension, the team goes after his bonus, and this takes months and months more to work out.

 

[Kool-Aid Larry]

Let's say your name is Warren Moon and the Redskins bring you in to be the franchise QB. You sign a big $100 million dollar contract. Then, after you sign, the team hires a new coach. The new coach says he thinks you have quick feet and he is going to play you at CB. When you signed your contract you made it clear that you wanted to play only QB, and the team assured you that was the case. Now, the new regime wants you to shut up and collect your $100 million and play CB. Instead, Moon resists at every turn, refusing to play hard and not talking with coaches, until he is finally suspended for insubordination.

Not exactly the same situation but it is similar. Is Moon just selfish?

it's not even close to being similar.I see this kind of thing on the net all the time ---- people love to get into all these net arguments to kill time, or whatever their reasons, and one of the most popular posts is to take a situation, change everything about it so it fits whatever point you need to make, then present it as an 'analogy' that I guess is supposed to help enlighten people.

I'm not being sarcastic --- I'm seriously curious, if you want to reply, as to what it is about the actual situation that's so hard to understand?

let's say this ----- you are albert haynesworth and the redskins sign you to a big deal and then sign shanahan and change their defensive scheme, asking you to play a somewhat different role than you've become accustomed to, show up for team meetings, speak to the coaching staff, do as they ask, and act like an adult who's a member of a team.

that's the situation.

we really don't need to change haynesworth to warren moon, tom brady, tom brady's wife, a bosc pear, a box of chocolates, or whatever else.

I think it's pretty straightforward.

 

[The Westin]

There is no excuse. Hi is supposed to be a professional.

Aaron Kampman went from a DE to an OLB when Green Bay switched to the 3-4 defense. This is a more extreme change than Haynesworth had to go through. Kampman finished out his contract and signed with the Jaguars the next offseason. Hell...after he signed with JAX he took out a front page ad in the two Wisconsin newspapers thanking the fans for his time there.

Nobody is saying he has to be a classy guy like Kampman. But how about not being a complete child?

 

[jackdubl]

So here is something I heard Ross Tucker say yesterday about Albert Haynesworth. He said that Haynesworth had told the team, before signing, that he wanted to play in a 4-3 because he wants to get into the the Hall of Fame. It's very difficult to get there as a nose-tackle because you can't compile the stats. The team told him sure, no problem. Then they hired Shanahan and announced they will run a 3-4. They then told Albert that he didn't have to take the $21 million option bonus, but if they didn't hear from him, they would assume he will show up and play hard.

Tucker therefore says both parties are to blame, because the Redskins both reneged on their promise and went ahead with this big deal knowing that Haynesworth wasn't really on board, and of course Albert for being a greedy malcontent. But it's not like Albert was going to give back $21 million after he has it in his hands, for whatever reason. Therefore, I put most of the onus on the team here. They need to be more responsible with their money and their promises. They got exactly what they paid for; they knew he wouldn't buy in but did it anyway.

 

[Sidewinder16]

Tucker therefore says both parties are to blame, because the Redskins both reneged on their promise and went ahead with this big deal knowing that Haynesworth wasn't really on board, and of course Albert for being a greedy malcontent. But it's not like Albert was going to give back $21 million after he has it in his hands, for whatever reason. Therefore, I put most of the onus on the team here. They need to be more responsible with their money and their promises. They got exactly what they paid for; they knew he wouldn't buy in but did it anyway.

That's all well and good, as long as you realize that those making Albert promises at the time of his signing (other than Snyder; who has all but disappeared when it comes to personnel moves), are no longer with the organization. The biggest culprit on that end of the deal was Vinny Cerrato. Vinny was notorious, all the way back to his recruiting days at Notre Dame, for making all kinds of promises and sales pitches that were basically meaningless. Vinny would bad-mouth his mother if he thought it would close a deal.Bruce Allen and Mike Shanahan were brought in to rebuild a dilapidated roster. They have every right to do that in whatever manner they deem best, despite what promises were made by the people that previously wore their hats within the organization.

Obviously, the buck has to ultimately stop with Snyder, and I'm more than willing to lay the blame at this feet. But when you say "the Redskins" or "the team" is to blame, I hope you realize that those terms refer to a group of entirely different people (again, other than Snyder) than it did 12 months ago, and especially when Haynesworth was originally signed.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

Saying it's the Skins' fault for signing a selfish baby does not absolve Haynesworth from blame for being a selfish baby. The idea that the Redskins "knew what they were getting" is not a defense of Haynesworth: it is an indictment of him.