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Indefinite Las Vegas Raiders thread - ☠ Mork and Brady searching for a wet paper bag to see if Pete Carroll can still coach his way out of one ☠ (3 Viewers)

One of the problems with keeping AP is that no good OC is signing on to be part of his staff most likely. The most likely thing that happens here is that he is fired 6-8 games into next season.
 
One of the problems with keeping AP is that no good OC is signing on to be part of his staff most likely. The most likely thing that happens here is that he is fired 6-8 games into next season.
We already have that problem. If we fire him after one full year (after firing McDick after 1.5) what quality HC are we going to get? And what quality OC will they attract? Our best chance at this point is to ride it out with AP, hope he hits on an OC, and get some stability going first. No one's going to trust they will get a full shot until we give someone a full shot.
 
One of the problems with keeping AP is that no good OC is signing on to be part of his staff most likely. The most likely thing that happens here is that he is fired 6-8 games into next season.
We already have that problem. If we fire him after one full year (after firing McDick after 1.5) what quality HC are we going to get? And what quality OC will they attract? Our best chance at this point is to ride it out with AP, hope he hits on an OC, and get some stability going first. No one's going to trust they will get a full shot until we give someone a full shot.
We will have to agree to disagree. Good coaches will always be interested in a NFL HC opening especially if the money is right. McDaniels had to go and AP should have never been given the full time gig to begin with. Gruden was going to have a long leash. I think it will be a lot harder to get a good OC to come join the staff of a guy that everyone knows is on the hot seat before the season starts than it will be to hire a good HC.
 
AP should have never been given the full time gig to begin with
On this we agree, I wasn't too hot on him. But once we did we have to ride it out properly.
Good coaches will always be interested in a NFL HC opening especially if the money is right.
No way. If we fired AP today and called Ben Johnson he's not even going to return our call. I bet a dozen donuts he declines interviews with 1/2 the teams that ask.
 
Still paying Gruden. Still paying whats his butt and some of whats his butt's coordinators.
Don't care one bit about that, it's Davis's money and that wasn't the clown move of firing a guy before his 2nd season was complete.

It was a forgone conclusion Davis was going to keep AP with another year left on his contract. What will be interesting is if he gets any kind of extension. I believe 2025 is his final year on his current contract.
It's not public that know of but I saw one source that said SIX years $26M. I'd bet anything it's a minimum of three though. 2025 almost certainly not the last year.
I thought one of the reasons they only offered kingsbury 2 years was because it corresponded with the length of AP’s conctract. :shrug:
 
AP should have never been given the full time gig to begin with
On this we agree, I wasn't too hot on him. But once we did we have to ride it out properly.
Good coaches will always be interested in a NFL HC opening especially if the money is right.
No way. If we fired AP today and called Ben Johnson he's not even going to return our call. I bet a dozen donuts he declines interviews with 1/2 the teams that ask.
Well Ben Johnson could be the top candidate out there and as you said he could decline interviews with several teams, but if he declines the Raiders I don't think it will be because they fired McDaniels and AP after short stints, it will be because he has options with better QBs and a better roster.
 
Can we officially label Tyree Wilson a bust?

How are we feeling about Powers-Johnson and Glazer? Both played a lot of snaps.
JPJ is legit, solid guard who can also be our center of the future and plays til the whistle. He's got so much energy that he's actually one of the few linemen that are fun to watch each and every play.

DJ Glaze was also pretty damn good as a rookie, he shut down TJ Watt :shrug: enough said.
 
Yes!!!!! Terrible of Davis to wait a day and leave Pierce hanging though.
As Jim Bouton recalled in his awesome book "Ball Four" about a manager who waited to take him out after Bouton was getting shelled for a number of innings: "What took you so long?"
 
Pierce fired. Mixed feeling here obviously. I'm excited we'll get an upgrade but just more clownshow stuff from Mork. The side benefit is that it's a buyer's market. Only 6 openings means less competition for the better candidates.
 
The firing of AP is the least surprising yet kind of surprising turn of events.
The additional day + press conference is an interesting element.

I suspect this has quite a bit to do with giving the brain (Brady) the opportunity to hire a coaching staff HC/OC/DC (Graham's contract is about to lapse), and find a QB for that staff. Maybe more about an opportunity for a clean restart than it has anything to do with the qualifications or non-qualifications of AP.
 
Can we officially label Tyree Wilson a bust?

How are we feeling about Powers-Johnson and Glazer? Both played a lot of snaps.
What? Tyree definitely shot down the "bust" label argument for me this season. He took a lot of positive steps for a player who was so raw and injured. He was always going to be 2-3 years away from being a great player imo. He still has no idea how to use his hands but his get-off improved a lot and he was disrupting some plays as the year went on.

He's an important building block going forward.
 
Pierce never should have been hired so the firing is fine with me. There was absolutely no reason to let him do a press conference yesterday. Mark had to know before Sunday if he was bringing him back. This is how incompetent, inept franchises operate. The Bears did the same thing with Eberflus earlier this year.
 
Pierce fired. Mixed feeling here obviously. I'm excited we'll get an upgrade but just more clownshow stuff from Mork. The side benefit is that it's a buyer's market. Only 6 openings means less competition for the better candidates.
Please stop insulting the memory of Robin Williams.

And please don't pivot to Moe Howard, one of the greatest Americans in the history of Americans.

There has to be a better comp. Is Simple Jack an option in 2025?
 
Pierce fired. Mixed feeling here obviously. I'm excited we'll get an upgrade but just more clownshow stuff from Mork. The side benefit is that it's a buyer's market. Only 6 openings means less competition for the better candidates.
Please stop insulting the memory of Robin Williams.

And please don't pivot to Moe Howard, one of the greatest Americans in the history of Americans.

There has to be a better comp. Is Simple Jack an option in 2025?
Lloyd Christmas.
 
Can we officially label Tyree Wilson a bust?

How are we feeling about Powers-Johnson and Glazer? Both played a lot of snaps.
What? Tyree definitely shot down the "bust" label argument for me this season. He took a lot of positive steps for a player who was so raw and injured. He was always going to be 2-3 years away from being a great player imo. He still has no idea how to use his hands but his get-off improved a lot and he was disrupting some plays as the year went on.

He's an important building block going forward.
I want to believe. I truly do. And I'm excited to see him come back and, hopefully improve.

But the best thing I can think to say about him right now is, he is better than Clelin Ferrell at the same point in their career...maybe?
 
Pierce fired. Mixed feeling here obviously. I'm excited we'll get an upgrade but just more clownshow stuff from Mork. The side benefit is that it's a buyer's market. Only 6 openings means less competition for the better candidates.
Please stop insulting the memory of Robin Williams.

And please don't pivot to Moe Howard, one of the greatest Americans in the history of Americans.

There has to be a better comp. Is Simple Jack an option in 2025?
Lloyd Christmas.
Love it!
 
No consistency. 20 years and running. Ugh.

ETA: I guess the only consistent thing is underperforming and commitment to the opposite of excellence.
 
The Autumn Wind is a pirate
Blustering in from sea,
With a rollicking song, he sweeps along,
Swaggering boisterously.

His face is weather beaten.
He wears a hooded sash,
With a silver hat about his head,
And a bristling black mustache.

He growls as he storms the country,
A villain big and bold.
And the trees all shake and quiver and quake,
As he robs them of their gold.

The Autumn Wind is a raider,
Pillaging just for fun.
He'll knock you 'round and upside down,
And laugh when he's conquered and won.
 
Please stop insulting the memory of Robin Williams.
No insult, it's a tribute to his brilliance that he was able to emulate the clown that Davis has become 40 years before it happened. Kind of like the Simpsons predicting the clown show of a Trump presidency.

ooh I do like the Lloyd Christmas comp as well. It doesn't roll off the tongue like Mork though.
 
Sigh

I wasn’t overwhelmed with AP but really wanted some consistency. Vrabel?
I like the idea of Vrabel. Sure, he had two losing seasons but that roster was pretty bad (as shown by their record after him). It would further make sense with the influence of Brady and Seymour whom I would think would like that idea as well.

More important to me is the OC and DC. I hope we keep Graham and our defensive staff in place. We need to find a good OC to put a decent offense together. This defense, if healthy, has the ability to be a top 10 defense and I think Graham can get that done with a healthy unit.
 

Deion - I want to say hard pass but I can't ignore what he did at Colorado. He connects with the players in a way few do and isn't that what we liked most about AP? Successful coaches do two things - pull a good staff together and get players firing. His OC at Colorado is Pat Shurmur which would be a huge upgrade over anyone else we've put out there recently not named Gruden (and was he even all that good?). It would also give us massive leverage with drafting Shadeur. Would TEN/CLE/NYG even consider drafting him knowing he's gonna Eli his way out of town?​
Ben Johnson - no clue how he's 4th unless they are considering the likelihood he doesn't even return our call. Far and away my #1 choice if he'd consider us.​
Liam Cohen - this is the tier of guy I expect we'll have to swing for. Not the top candidate due to lack of vast experience, but enough flash for a "settle for" kind of guy. See Bobby Slowik for the comp - last year his first as OC he had everyone drooling over the job he did with Houston and CJ Stroud. One year later he's nowhere to be seen.​
Mike Vrabel - hell yes. I'm wary of the infamous "defensive-minded HC" label, but see Deion above - we know this guy can coach and players will produce for him and he should have no issue putting a staff together. Why wouldn't he go elsewhere though that looks like a much rosier immediate future? NEP have their QB, they have $136M in cap space, and they have a fan base that would be licking Vrabel's boots from day one and if he doesn't want to try to dig out from BB's shadow CHI has a franchise QB also.​
Kliff Kingsbury - not sure why he's at the top of this list unless they are going for the amusement park environment effect. I guess we did interview him for OC last year so maybe Davis liked that plus he's an offensive guy which everyone is stressing. I don't hate him, again we're unlikely to get the top guys and I think he got scapegoated in ARI or what turns out to be a pretty bad QB signed to a nearly-historyically awful contract. If he can bring some offensive stability and get whatver young QB we go with coached up I'll be happy with that.​


Kingsbury also named here.​

Here is my wild guess prediction list for vacancies:

NEP - Ben Johnson
CHI - Mike McCarthy
JAX - Vrabel
NYJ - Aaron Glenn
NOS - Todd Monken and they tank for Arch Manning.
LVR - Joe Brady
DAL - Arthur Smith
 
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Sigh

I wasn’t overwhelmed with AP but really wanted some consistency. Vrabel?
I like the idea of Vrabel. Sure, he had two losing seasons but that roster was pretty bad (as shown by their record after him). It would further make sense with the influence of Brady and Seymour whom I would think would like that idea as well.

More important to me is the OC and DC. I hope we keep Graham and our defensive staff in place. We need to find a good OC to put a decent offense together. This defense, if healthy, has the ability to be a top 10 defense and I think Graham can get that done with a healthy unit.
Vrabel is going to be the HC of the Pats
 
As for coordinator spots:

OC
Wes Phillips - maybe he wants to get out from the shadow KO'c and prove he's his own guy?
Josh McCown - if we can't get MIN's OC, we could shoot for their QB coach that wants an OC title. Insane turnaround by Darnold has to be partially credited to McCown, no?
Thomas Brown - interim head coaches that don't get the job usually leave. He handled the back 1/2 of the season respectably and Caleb turned a corner under him.
Doug Johnson - Assistant Head Coach/Assistant OC in WAS. He was once a hot commodity as Philly's OC before a brief disaster (wasn't it all?) in 2024.
Brian Griese - SFO's QB coach, he's gonna get OC shots soon just because of the Shanahan name
Tavita Pritchard - WAS's QB coach, he's done a brilliant job back-to-back with Howell and Daniels. If Kingsbury doesn't get a HC job Pritchard may have to leave to get an OC title.

We may have to recycle a failed HC here for a year or two or dip into the college ranks.

DC
Far and away prefer to keep Graham but this doesn't feel like it's in the cards, this looks like a full flush.
Robert Saleh - no clue what his plan is, he could probably sit on his couch and count Woody's money but he seems like a guy that needs to stay busy. Back up the Brink's truck and make it happen.
Lou Anarumo - scapegoated out of CIN, he was a hot candidate 12 months ago he didn't lose his ability to coach defenses.
Matt Eberflus - he was a massive failure at HC but his defenses weren't the problem.
Dennis Allen - he wasn't ever a bad DC just overmatched at HC. I wouldn't mind mending fences
Jeff Ulbrich - as Brown above, interim coaches usually leave.

My predictions are really just guesses until we know who the coach is - OC McCown, DC Anarumo
 
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Please stop insulting the memory of Robin Williams.
No insult, it's a tribute to his brilliance that he was able to emulate the clown that Davis has become 40 years before it happened. Kind of like the Simpsons predicting the clown show of a Trump presidency.

ooh I do like the Lloyd Christmas comp as well. It doesn't roll off the tongue like Mork though.
I use dumb and dumber
 

Deion - I want to say hard pass but I can't ignore what he did at Colorado. He connects with the players in a way few do and isn't that what we liked most about AP? Successful coaches do two things - pull a good staff together and get players firing. His OC at Colorado is Pat Shurmur which would be a huge upgrade over anyone else we've put out there recently not named Gruden (and was he even all that good?). It would also give us massive leverage with drafting Shadeur. Would TEN/CLE/NYG even consider drafting him knowing he's gonna Eli his way out of town?​
Ben Johnson - no clue how he's 4th unless they are considering the likelihood he doesn't even return our call. Far and away my #1 choice if he'd consider us.​
Liam Cohen - this is the tier of guy I expect we'll have to swing for. Not the top candidate due to lack of vast experience, but enough flash for a "settle for" kind of guy. See Bobby Slowik for the comp - last year his first as OC he had everyone drooling over the job he did with Houston and CJ Stroud. One year later he's nowhere to be seen.​
Mike Vrabel - hell yes. I'm wary of the infamous "defensive-minded HC" label, but see Deion above - we know this guy can coach and players will produce for him and he should have no issue putting a staff together. Why wouldn't he go elsewhere though that looks like a much rosier immediate future? NEP have their QB, they have $136M in cap space, and they have a fan base that would be licking Vrabel's boots from day one and if he doesn't want to try to dig out from BB's shadow CHI has a franchise QB also.​
Kliff Kingsbury - not sure why he's at the top of this list unless they are going for the amusement park environment effect. I guess we did interview him for OC last year so maybe Davis liked that plus he's an offensive guy which everyone is stressing. I don't hate him, again we're unlikely to get the top guys and I think he got scapegoated in ARI or what turns out to be a pretty bad QB signed to a nearly-historyically awful contract. If he can bring some offensive stability and get whatver young QB we go with coached up I'll be happy with that.​


Kingsbury also named here.​

Here is my wild guess prediction list for vacancies:

NEP - Ben Johnson
CHI - Mike McCarthy
JAX - Vrabel
NYJ - Aaron Glenn
NOS - Todd Monken and they tank for Arch Manning.
LVR - Joe Brady
DAL - Arthur Smith
McCarthy is still the Cowboys coach, and the Cowboys denied the Bear's request for an interview. I think this is a strong indication the Cowboys will retain McCarthy.

Ben Johnson is everyone's favorite but everyone needs to slow their roll. Johnson has a wealth of talent to work with in Detriot. He appears to be from the Campbell mold in terms of aggressive play-calling. What happens in the scenario where he doesn't have the same talent to work with? Johnson's tenure may look a lot like Brandon Staley's head coaching tenure. We should also remember that Bobby Slowik was a very hot candidate last year and is on the hot seat now. A great OC does not equate to being a great HC.
 
DC
Far and away prefer to keep Graham but this doesn't feel like it's in the cards, this looks like a full flush.
Robert Saleh - no clue what his plan is, he could probably sit on his couch and count Woody's money but he seems like a guy that needs to stay busy. Back up the Brink's truck and make it happen.
Lou Anarumo - scapegoated out of CIN, he was a hot candidate 12 months ago he didn't lose his ability to coach defenses.
Matt Eberflus - he was a massive failure at HC but his defenses weren't the problem.
Dennis Allen - he wasn't ever a bad DC just overmatched at HC. I wouldn't mind mending fences
Jeff Ulbrich - as Brown above, interim coaches usually leave.
Graham - I think his contract is up and he can leave if he wants, but I'm not 100% sure. I am not as high on him as most. If he was back fine, if he left that's fine with me too
Saleh - I'd hire him to be DC in a heartbeat.
Anarumo - agree with your assessment.
Eberflus - meh
DA - I wouldn't be interested in him.
Ulbrich - Definitely not interested in him. I know he had other responsibilities, but the Jet D fell apart after Saleh was fired.

Also, supposedly Brady has spoken to Belichick to see what it would take for him to bail on NC.
 
McCarthy is still the Cowboys coach, and the Cowboys denied the Bear's request for an interview. I think this is a strong indication the Cowboys will retain McCarthy.
But it takes two to tango. McCarthy is only under contract until the 14th then Jerruh loses all control of what Mike does. The temptation of Caleb over Dak has to be strong.
Ben Johnson is everyone's favorite but everyone needs to slow their roll. Johnson has a wealth of talent to work with in Detriot. He appears to be from the Campbell mold in terms of aggressive play-calling. What happens in the scenario where he doesn't have the same talent to work with? Johnson's tenure may look a lot like Brandon Staley's head coaching tenure. We should also remember that Bobby Slowik was a very hot candidate last year and is on the hot seat now. A great OC does not equate to being a great HC.
You may be right in your assessment of his success but it doesn't matter, he's going to get a shot and he's going to have his choice of where it is. I mentioned Slowik in my Liam Cohhen breakdown, Ben Johnson's done it quite a bit longer. And let's not dismiss his role in making that talent elite. Goff was a castoff when Johnson took over and Chicago couldn't move on from David Montgomery fast enough. ARSB was a 4th round pick - you think he comes into LVR offense and is instantly elite?
 
I liked Kingsbury as an OC but I want no part of him as a HC. Other than Vrabel, I am not really liking any obvious candidates.

I would be very happy with Saleh as DC if we did not keep Graham. The rest mentioned would make me sad to move on from Graham.
 
Let's not forget Monken. Lamar had his two best years as a passer under him.

But, like Johnson he had a lot of talent to work with.

I think it will be difficult to land a top offensive minded candidate with the #6 pick. I can't imagine a candidate being interested without being able to handle pick a QB.
 
More important to me is the OC and DC. I hope we keep Graham and our defensive staff in place. We need to find a good OC to put a decent offense together. This defense, if healthy, has the ability to be a top 10 defenseand I think Graham can get that done with a healthy unit.
It begins...

We'll go into next season talking about how great the defense looks, and how if you look at it from the right angle O'Connell reminds us a little bit of Peyton Manning.

And, if they get a couple good bounces and if the new LBs, DBs, DTs etc live up to their draft position/scouting...they could sneak into the playoffs and make a run.

And, in week four, when they're 1-3, I will be shouting from the mountain top about tanking for college QB ABC and how we need to go after Ben Johnson's offensive coordinator because the Bears are 4-0 and Caleb is an MVP candidate.
 
Glenn is interviewing with everyone except the Patriots. He won’t be as picky or as expensive as Johnson. Everyone predicts Jets or Saints because of his connections with those two.

Ii actually think AG will be a better HC than Johnson. Better leadership skills, has a more well rounded understanding of the game.

IMO
 
I'm excited we'll get an upgrade

How do you know?
A gerbil would be an upgrade. A brain damaged gerbil would be an upgrade. A brainless gerbil would be a wash. A brainless gerbil who had arms and could throw darts at a dartboard would have done a better job at in-game decision making and time management than Pierce.

But seriously Tafur and Reed came up with 10 names in their latest article for the Athletic:
Johnson
Vrabel
Gruden
Coen
Minter
Glenn
Spagnuolo
Flores
Monken
Brady, Joe not Tom

I'd say the first 3 are out for obvious reasons. I can't imagine Spagnuolo leaving the bliss of Kansas City for the morass of Las Vegas.
I'd say the other 6 are in play and I'd take my chances they'd all be upgrades.

Admit it, you just wanted the status quo so Harbaugh could kick Pierce's *** twice a year for the foreseeable future. ;-)
 
I'm excited we'll get an upgrade

How do you know?
A gerbil would be an upgrade. A brain damaged gerbil would be an upgrade. A brainless gerbil would be a wash. A brainless gerbil who had arms and could throw darts at a dartboard would have done a better job at in-game decision making and time management than Pierce.

But seriously Tafur and Reed came up with 10 names in their latest article for the Athletic:
Johnson
Vrabel
Gruden
Coen
Minter
Glenn
Spagnuolo
Flores
Monken
Brady, Joe not Tom

I'd say the first 3 are out for obvious reasons. I can't imagine Spagnuolo leaving the bliss of Kansas City for the morass of Las Vegas.
I'd say the other 6 are in play and I'd take my chances they'd all be upgrades.

Admit it, you just wanted the status quo so Harbaugh could kick Pierce's *** twice a year for the foreseeable future. ;-)

I did like Pierce as Raiders HC. 😬

I surely hope Minter does not leave the Chargers after just one season.
 
Let's not forget Monken. Lamar had his two best years as a passer under him.

But, like Johnson he had a lot of talent to work with.

I think it will be difficult to land a top offensive minded candidate with the #6 pick. I can't imagine a candidate being interested without being able to handle pick a QB.
There are so many headwinds facing LV. A good QB must be added but where is this QB coming from? The lack of QB will likely scare away the best HC candidates. I hope I’m wrong but LV is probably going to have to settle on another inferior HC and the losing will continue. At least LV will be drafting in the top ten in 2026 and there should be more QB talent available. Maybe things will be looking up in 2027.
 
I can't believe Ben Johnson agreed to interview with the Raiders. After being so picky last year and cancelling on the Commanders and Seahawks, he actually chose to take the first step with Vegas?

The Brady sway is unreal.
 
McCarthy is still the Cowboys coach, and the Cowboys denied the Bear's request for an interview. I think this is a strong indication the Cowboys will retain McCarthy.
But it takes two to tango. McCarthy is only under contract until the 14th then Jerruh loses all control of what Mike does. The temptation of Caleb over Dak has to be strong.
Ben Johnson is everyone's favorite but everyone needs to slow their roll. Johnson has a wealth of talent to work with in Detriot. He appears to be from the Campbell mold in terms of aggressive play-calling. What happens in the scenario where he doesn't have the same talent to work with? Johnson's tenure may look a lot like Brandon Staley's head coaching tenure. We should also remember that Bobby Slowik was a very hot candidate last year and is on the hot seat now. A great OC does not equate to being a great HC.
You may be right in your assessment of his success but it doesn't matter, he's going to get a shot and he's going to have his choice of where it is. I mentioned Slowik in my Liam Cohhen breakdown, Ben Johnson's done it quite a bit longer. And let's not dismiss his role in making that talent elite. Goff was a castoff when Johnson took over and Chicago couldn't move on from David Montgomery fast enough. ARSB was a 4th round pick - you think he comes into LVR offense and is instantly elite?
My bad, I forgot the fanbase is still in dream-land (the highlight of being a Raider fan).

Time will tell about McCarthy's situation, but why would the Cowboys deny the Bears permission if they weren't intent on resigning McCarthy?

Goff was a castoff in McVay's eyes, but he was the starter for a team that went to the SB. Is there a QB fitting that description available this offseason?

I doubt the Raiders' offense would become elite if they hired Johnson. One big reason is that the Lions' front office has proven to be much better at identifying elite talent in drafts. Raiders...not so much. Yes, they appeared to have a good draft last year so that stokes the fanbase's optimism. However, given the team's track record, I doubt they sustain that success. From what I glean on social media fans seem to think Brady will be the savior to the decades of mismanagement by the front office. Brady has no track record in this capacity, and I personally feel like this is a case of Mark Davis jock-sniffing. As a reminder, the Broncos hired Elway to work in a similar capacity and it was a disaster.

We can have a debate about whether the AFC west is tougher than the NFC north, but HC talent in the AFC west is far superior to that NFC north.
 

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