Indefinite New England Patriots Thread (9 Viewers)

[Boston]

Zolak saying that cutting Diggs is on the table.

I find that hard to believe.

Unfortunately, I don't...Diggs has put Vrabel in a real tough spot...the last few years under Mayo and when BB went from a great HC to Jordon's BF the team culture has been awful...Vrabel has been banging the culture drum non-stop and now a very high-profile veteran player pulls this stunt...not good...I bet this is 50/50 on what happens...it would be a big time statement by cutting Diggs that would most certainly get the culture message sent throughout the organization...the negative is very obvious as the WR room is subpar to begin with and losing Diggs would be a huge short-term hit...I heard Breer say that this will be taken care of very quickly and probably comes down to the Vrabel/Diggs meeting and how that goes...after a fun offseason we are now into reality and dealing with adversity...the good news is we have an HC I fully trust to make a wise decision.

Just watched A. Breer's take on it. Similar to yours. He speaks to Vrabels 26 years in NFL locker rooms.

It's only May, but I bet Diggs only gets one more strike here. Anything remotely close to another slip up and he's gone.

That would be my guess...as long as he shows he is legit sorry for the distraction he comes back but Vrabel definitely addresses it in a stern manner...no one is gonna be able to BS Vrabel...my question (and it is an old guy question) is why the F do people need to video everything they do in today's world...go do white, pink, green or purple blow...I don't care but why do you have to video everything...so childish.

 

[Bri]

"We're putting plays in today that I don't have much experience doing, but I know that they're good for our team. These guys have a lot of experience doing those things where they've been," McDaniels said. "We're a first-year staff together, and we're all just grinding away trying to make sure that we're ready each day. They've done a tremendous job with their position groups, and I really enjoy the process."

"When you take a lot of people from different backgrounds, they have such good experience and wisdom, it makes a lot of sense for me to learn from them. That stuff is going to be used to help our team produce more points, more yards, more first downs, and hopefully good plays," McDaniels continued."

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Pats site
I think y'all wanted to hear this quote. Tiny, I know, but you wanted Belichick stuff McDaniels offense but with some change and...there ya go.
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I would guess it's two TE throwback to 80s football time.
All technique til contact is allowed in camp.
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Also, the recent is it 3-4 or 4-3 articles and questions of couple weeks ago. It's Belichick's hybrid. Vrabel loves it.
In Ten, he took over a Lebeau team (a famous D he played in) to uproot it all and instill this. People questioned and he became headstrong and I know what's best and all that.
The writers are....well they're not Boston and David. Those two would recognize the defense in ten seconds

 

[Anarchy99]

Trying to figure out what the offense will be might be next to impossible. NE is on their 4th OC in as many season (technically 5th . . . McDaniels, Van Pelt, O'Brien, and the Patricia / Judge combo). They've also rolled out 6 different starting QBs in 6 years (Brady, Newton, Jones, Zappe, Brissett, and Maye). They have a bunch of new faces, but even the guys that have been around for a while will have a new set of circumstances, teammates, and plays to work through. Consistency and stability have not been a thing in a long time. Change is good, but never-ending change is just chaotic. I have no idea how long it will take to get everyone on the same page, and we've seen how many dumb mistakes, penalties, turnovers, and mental errors they made the last few years. If all they did was clean that stuff up, they'd be a lot more competitive.

 

[Anarchy99]

LT Will Campbell has agreed to terms on a four-year, $43.66M fully guaranteed rookie contract with a $28.39M signing bonus.

 

[ratbast]

After the offseason fog has settled I still just cringe at the WRs. Diggs has to be healthy and still be 90% of his former self for this to work.
Who has a worse WR room?
Jets? I’d take Wilson and company
Bills? Close but I’d take bills WRs.
Fins? Give me Hill/Waddle of course.
How many other teams have a worse WR situation than the Pats?

The two pieces of the Pats WR room that could really change the direction of this team are Williams and Polk. But those are high hopes.

 

[Anarchy99]

PFF came out with their roster rankings for the upcoming season. They have NE ranked 26th, ahead of NYG, NYJ, CAR, NOS, TEN, and CLE.

2025 NFL Roster Rankings: Strengths, weaknesses and X-factors for every starting lineup

NFL rosters have taken shape following free agency and the 2025 NFL Draft.

www.pff.com

They also ranked the Top 32 players at each position. Here are the NE guys on those positional lists . . .

QB: Maye (22)
RB: Henderson (28), Stevenson (29)
WR: None
TEL Henry (16)
OT: None
G: Onwenu (17)
C: Bradbury (25)
DI: Williams (14)
LB: Spillane (23)
CB: Gonzalez (13), Davis (18)
S: Peppers (12)

Surprised to see 6 guys on offense but only 5 on defense.

 

[Boston]

Pretty good guess for 6/15:

Perry's 53-man roster projection: How will Pats' WR room shake out?

Phil Perry shares his early Patriots 53-man roster projection after watching the team’s OTA and minicamp practices.

www.nbcsportsboston.com

 

[Anarchy99]

Not a ton of position battles other than WR or OL. From what I have seen, it's too soon to tell what's going to happen and how things might shape out. Let's start with the WRs . . .

Diggs: I've heard everything from he's way ahead of schedule, the boat incident is in the past, and he will be 100% on Week 1 . . . all the way to NE is not convinced that he will be good to go for health or off-field issues and are not rushing to give him a physical (once he passes they have to give him $12M). It's one thing to be running on the sidelines and another to be going full bore and getting lit up by defenders. Still whispers that he could open camp on the PUP or start the season on PUP or IR (and miss the first 4 games). Bottom line, very unclear.

Williams: Curran said it best when he said he's a rookie, and rookie WRs on other teams have raised the expectations on what new guys should be able to do. Curran didn't sound like Williams was going to step in and do much, and he said maybe they'll find some situations / routes / combinations for him later in the season where he could contribute. Curran pretty much said he is a work in progress and don't expect much to start the season. He made some nice grabs and looked good in camp so far, but if you read the reports or watch the clips, those plays were usually against scrub receivers.

Bourne: Curran made it sound like Bourne is locked in as a starter, as he did well with JMD before, plays every WR spot, and they can move him around. More importantly, McDaniels likes him. It also sounded like Curran was told this and it wasn't his opinion. I saw a couple of other people / places echo this info. However, others have Bourne on the wrong side of the roster bubble, getting traded, or getting flat out released. Again, that's a wide range of options.

Boutte: He also falls anywhere from a likely starter by some to either being traded or released by others. One thing people point out (which I think is misleading) is how much Boutte played with the starters in minicamp. A couple things on that 1) a bunch of WRs didn't participate, so someone had to play with the starters and 2) if history repeats itself, guys that are set for starting roles or extensive playing time generally don't play a ton in the offseason and are saved for the regular and postseason. Instead, NE has treated the offseason as a chance to get backups and young guys more reps, as they will never see that many snaps in practice during the actual season. I have also seen people point out that Boutte had great chemistry with Maye, as evidenced by his 7-117-1 line in the final game of the season . . . except that game was with Milton not Maye. Boutte is another WR with a wide range of outcomes.

Douglas: He's another one that played a ton at minicamp / OTAs. A couple of people pointed out that this offseason Douglas lined up on the outside a ton and not in the slot (way more than he was used that way the past two seasons). Who knows what that means. Maybe he was one of the few guys available that knew the plays. I have seen projections from him catching 100 balls to him losing a lot of snaps to other WRs. I don't think he has the frame to take on a ton of targets, so I would guess his role won't be as one of the heavy workload guys. Also, some reports made it out like he might be a red zone darling this year (based on having 2 red zone TD in one practice). I'm guessing he may not be on the field much in the red zone . . . potentially because I heard several reports that NE has been running a lot of 2 TE and 2 RB sets with Stevenson and Henderson in the backfield at the same time.

Hollins: As pointed out in other threads, Hollins had a career season with JMD and the team just signed him a couple of months ago. It sounds like he is not against coming in as a blocker on run plays, and some of the other guys don't really have that desire or skill set. That's also why Bourne is said to have more value and experience, as he is not against helping out in the run game or blocking in the quick hitting short passing game.

Polk: I have mostly heard that he is a potential candidate for the Island of Misfit Toys. He was banged up and hasn't been on the field this preseason, and I haven't heard much that they have big plans for him. I would guess they could consider moving him for a late round pick to not have to worry about him. Maybe they try to get him on the practice squad. Or maybe they PUP him for a while, and then maybe they stand to have a better chance to get him on the practice squad once the season starts. I have yet to see anyone with a positive prognosis for him. This regime didn't draft him, so they may have no alliance to keep him around.

Baker: He's recovering from a broken thumb, and he is in the same boat as Polk (only without the Round 2 pedigree). He was said to be a potential trade candidate around the draft as he could have been used as a sweetener to move up the draft board somewhere. I have a hard time seeing Baker on the main roster. Not sure there would be much interest from other teams, so maybe he will end up on the practice squad. A lot will depend on whether JMD thinks he can find a way to use him and trust him.

Chism: I don't think Chism has quite the shine as he did at the first set of practices. At minicamp this week, with a couple of WRs coming back, Chism was relegated to mostly practicing on a different field with a bunch of non-starters. In the limited snaps he got on the main field, I don't believe he had a catch in either practice in 11 v 11 plays. He caught a lot of passes a few weeks ago, but that was mostly playing with the 2's and 3's playing against 3's and 4's. It depends on how many WR's they keep on the roster . . . but he would at best be the 7th guy (and likely wouldn't see the field very often if at all).

Considering we are basing this on OTA's and minicamp in non-contact situations with a bunch of WRs not even participating, I don't think we learned much of anything so far. We can see how things shape up in 5 weeks when training camp starts, but for now I don't think there is much to go on to come to many conclusions.

 

[Boston]

Why are the Pats in rebuild mode? From Bedard today:

• By the way, at this point, it would not be a shock to me if by the start of the season, the Patriots will have very little to show from their previous FOUR drafts.

Highly likely to stick:

2024 Draft: Drake Maye

2023 Draft: Christian Gonzalez, Keion White, Demario Douglas, Bryce Baringer

2022 Draft: Marcus Jones

2021: Christian Barmore, Rhamondre Stevenson

That's eight players out of 38.

Fighting for their roster spot this summer (setting aside the players already gone):

2024 Draft: Ja'Lynn Polk, Caeden Wallace, Layden Robinson, Javon Baker, Marcellas Dial, Jaheim Bell (Joe Milton already gone)

2023 Draft: Marte Mapu, Sidy Sow, Kayshon Boutte, Isaiah Bolden

2022 Draft: Cole Strange

 

[Anarchy99]

That's eight players out of 38.

This is why I am squeamish and skeptical that suddenly NE could have a draft for the ages. There are several key people still in the building that have had voices for years when it comes to player evaluation, scouting, and draft consideration. Ultimately the buck stopped with BB, but I think the team of evaluators presented Bill with a pared down / short list of guys to consider (meaning they were the ones that spent years researching players, monitored their development, and evaluated their NFL potential).

- Eliot Wolf has been there since 2020. As Bedard noted, not great results. Going back to the 2020 draft, they only have Dugger and Onwenu left (with Jennings on the roster bubble).
- Matt Groh has been around as a scout and personnel guy since 2011. How many great picks have the Pats had in 15 drafts with him as a contributor?
- Brian Smith has been in scouting and personnel for 20+ years with NE. He's been one of their primary player assessment guys for a long time.
- As the NE OC, McDaniels had to have input in who the team drafted on the offensive side of the ball. NE hit on some OL guys, but who did they hit on or develop since 2010 (see Groh)?

Yeah, I get it. Vrabel is there now. When a new coach takes over, he usually uses the personnel staff and feedback from the prior regime in terms of draft prep, scouting, and player evaluation. Most of the scouting department is still there. Besides the people I already mentioned, they also brought back Fiorini and Highsmith.

IMO, the scouting and player personnel team should have been the first group of people targeted for a makeover and major overhaul. Again, none of the rookies from this draft have played a live snap yet, so it's way too soon to suggest how they will turn out (good, bad, or indifferent). But IMO it's reasonable to question why the same people have their jobs given their decision-making and draft selections going back multiple, multiple drafts. BB has to take the majority of the blame, but lots of other people bear some culpability. Fingers crossed they have more hits than misses from the 2025 draft.