What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Jamal Lewis ready for fresh start at minicamp (1 Viewer)

Noahs Troopers

Footballguy
Important content in bold, This is highly valuable information, don't let your leaguemates see this, this will give you an edge in your upcoming drafts. :thumbup:

By Len Pasquarelli

ESPN.com

With the continuing anticipation over the potential acquisition of Tennessee Titans quarterback Steve McNair, and the competition with incumbent starter Kyle Boller which would then ensue, the arrival of tailback Jamal Lewis for the Baltimore Ravens' mandatory minicamp this week elicited only a ripple.

And given Lewis' travails over the past 18 months -- a stretch that included a guilty plea to federal drug charges, stints in a federal corrections facility in Florida and a halfway house in Atlanta, ankle surgery and a disappointing 2005 season -- that's not an altogether bad thing.

A brute power runner, and one of only four men in NFL history to rush for 2,000 yards in a season, Lewis is never going sneak up on anyone. But being able to report for minicamp and not be the center of attention, with the media instead focusing principally on when or if McNair will be added to the roster, is a bit of a relief for the former first-round draft choice.

"Right now, I'm free and clear," said Lewis, who spent the offseason in Atlanta, fulfilling the 500-hour community service commitment that was part of his plea bargain agreement last year. "I'm free and clear of everything that's behind me. It's just a much better situation. I'm back on the right track."

That the six-year veteran is back in Baltimore at all for another season is mildly surprising. Lewis, 26, tested the unrestricted free agent market earlier in the spring, and there were rumors that he was being pursued by the Denver Broncos. But he re-signed with the Ravens, ironically, only a day after Baltimore signed his presumptive replacement, former Broncos starter Mike Anderson.

The three-year, $26 million contract Lewis signed doesn't provide the long-term security that those big numbers might suggest. The deal is essentially for one year, at $6 million, with the Ravens on the hook for $5 million roster bonuses each in 2007 and 2008. If Lewis doesn't produce this year, in what has to be a rebound season for him, Baltimore isn't likely to invest $10 million in him (the $5 million roster bonus and a $5 million base salary) for 2007.

A solid veteran whose resume includes a pair of 1,000-yard seasons, Anderson not only provides some stiff competition but also gives the Ravens a nice insurance policy. Club officials and coach Brian Billick have said there are enough carries to go around between Lewis and Anderson, and possibly star-crossed three-year veteran Musa Smith, a talented back whose career has been derailed by injuries.

But it would mean a lot to the Baltimore offense, no matter who is playing quarterback, if Lewis can return to his past form and become a punishing workhorse-style runner again. That was hardly the case in 2005, as Lewis' offseason training was interrupted by his legal entanglements and ankle surgery, and he never really got into a rhythm.

Despite starting 15 games, Lewis ran for only 906 yards and three touchdowns on 269 carries. Not counting the 2001 season, when he missed the entire campaign with a torn anterior cruciate ligament, it was Lewis' poorest single-season performance. His anemic 3.4-yard average per attempt was significantly less than the 4.7-yard career average with which he entered the season and Lewis posted just two 100-yard outings.

There is some rust, Lewis acknowledged at the outset of the minicamp on Tuesday, from having not been with the Ravens for the earlier organized team activity drills this spring. But Lewis and the Ravens coaches are optimistic he will round back into shape and, hopefully, return to being the feared back he once was. :thumbup: :popcorn:

 
fluff piece.
:yes: Lewis has a lot to prove after last year, and has a very capable back just waiting to take his job.

He better come out strong or he's probably going to see the pine - for real this time.

 
How much blame from Lewis' performance last year is to be on Lewis and how much on the Ravens offensive line? It seemed that the o-line was quite a bit worse than in the past half dozen years.

 
Last 5 games last year- 506 total yards and 4.1 YPC.
Vs. Cin. (20th in rush defense)

Hou. (32nd who held him to 17 yards rushing)

GB (23rd in rush defense)

Min. (19th in rush defense)

Cle. (30th in rush defense)

While four of those five games were impressive, his final five games came against defenses ranked in the bottom half of the league in rush defense. I think Lewis could have some value as a RB2 (I'd feel better about him as my RB3), but he still carries tremendous risk IMO. I was not impressed with how he run for most of last season -- he looked real sluggish and was slow to hit the hole. And unlike last season when Billick seemed very reluctant to really commit to Taylor when Lewis was playing poorly I don't think that will be the case this season with Anderson as the backup. If Lewis plays poorly again I think Billick will be much more inclined to give the backup a shot given how Anderson has proven he can be a feature RB and run with power.

 
Last 5 games last year- 506 total yards and 4.1 YPC.
Vs. Cin. (20th in rush defense)

Hou. (32nd who held him to 17 yards rushing)

GB (23rd in rush defense)

Min. (19th in rush defense)

Cle. (30th in rush defense)

While four of those five games were impressive, his final five games came against defenses ranked in the bottom half of the league in rush defense. I think Lewis could have some value as a RB2 (I'd feel better about him as my RB3), but he still carries tremendous risk IMO. I was not impressed with how he run for most of last season -- he looked real sluggish and was slow to hit the hole. And unlike last season when Billick seemed very reluctant to really commit to Taylor when Lewis was playing poorly I don't think that will be the case this season with Anderson as the backup. If Lewis plays poorly again I think Billick will be much more inclined to give the backup a shot given how Anderson has proven he can be a feature RB and run with power.
I don't know how many times I will have to state this during this offseason, buuuut: How did you expect Lewis to look after being in jail and not getting proper time to both heal his injuries and workout? The guys was simply way behind in both conditioning and rehab. On top of that, his Oline fell apart last year too. You say that Lewis looked sluggish and slow to the hole. Well, no kidding if you didn't see that coming into last season though you simply were not paying attention to his cercumstances. It should surprise nobody that Lewis played horrible last year. It should also surprise nobody that he greatly improves this year. M.Anderson is an insurance clause and nothing more. Lewis is twice the RB Anderson is so long as he is healthy.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Last 5 games last year- 506 total yards and 4.1 YPC.
Vs. Cin. (20th in rush defense)

Hou. (32nd who held him to 17 yards rushing)

GB (23rd in rush defense)

Min. (19th in rush defense)

Cle. (30th in rush defense)

While four of those five games were impressive, his final five games came against defenses ranked in the bottom half of the league in rush defense. I think Lewis could have some value as a RB2 (I'd feel better about him as my RB3), but he still carries tremendous risk IMO. I was not impressed with how he run for most of last season -- he looked real sluggish and was slow to hit the hole. And unlike last season when Billick seemed very reluctant to really commit to Taylor when Lewis was playing poorly I don't think that will be the case this season with Anderson as the backup. If Lewis plays poorly again I think Billick will be much more inclined to give the backup a shot given how Anderson has proven he can be a feature RB and run with power.
I don't know how many times I will have to state this during this offseason, buuuut: How did you expect Lewis to look after being in jail and not getting proper time to both heal his injuries and workout? The guys was simply way behind in both conditioning and rehab. On top of that, his Oline feel apart last year too. You say that Lewis looked sluggish and slow to the hole. Well, no kidding if you didn't see that coming into last season though you simply were not paying attention to his cercumstances. It should surprise nobody that Lewis played horrible last year. It should also surprise nobody that he greatly improves this year. M.Anderson is an insurance clause and nothing more. Lewis is twice the RB Anderson is so long as he is healthy.
I wasn't high on Lewis last season and didn't own him so I wasn't a disppointed Lewis owner. However, I thought he'd look better sooner than he did. The fact he never showed anything until the final month against some weak run defenses isn't something I would view as a strong sign that he's going to rebound and be a force this season. I think he'll be better and I think he could be a decent RB2 but I would not be surprised if he struggled again -- and if he does, I think Billick will be more inclined to go to the backup option than he was last season when Taylor was there. Just my opinion.

 
Last 5 games last year- 506 total yards and 4.1 YPC.
Vs. Cin. (20th in rush defense)

Hou. (32nd who held him to 17 yards rushing)

GB (23rd in rush defense)

Min. (19th in rush defense)

Cle. (30th in rush defense)

While four of those five games were impressive, his final five games came against defenses ranked in the bottom half of the league in rush defense. I think Lewis could have some value as a RB2 (I'd feel better about him as my RB3), but he still carries tremendous risk IMO. I was not impressed with how he run for most of last season -- he looked real sluggish and was slow to hit the hole. And unlike last season when Billick seemed very reluctant to really commit to Taylor when Lewis was playing poorly I don't think that will be the case this season with Anderson as the backup. If Lewis plays poorly again I think Billick will be much more inclined to give the backup a shot given how Anderson has proven he can be a feature RB and run with power.
I don't know how many times I will have to state this during this offseason, buuuut: How did you expect Lewis to look after being in jail and not getting proper time to both heal his injuries and workout? The guys was simply way behind in both conditioning and rehab. On top of that, his Oline feel apart last year too. You say that Lewis looked sluggish and slow to the hole. Well, no kidding if you didn't see that coming into last season though you simply were not paying attention to his cercumstances. It should surprise nobody that Lewis played horrible last year. It should also surprise nobody that he greatly improves this year. M.Anderson is an insurance clause and nothing more. Lewis is twice the RB Anderson is so long as he is healthy.
:goodposting: I don't think it's coincidental that he had by far his worst season on top of all that adversity. The guy is still only 26 years old, he's going to have a qb that can actually complete a pass for the 1st time in 3-4 years and he'll participate in training and be in shape this year (like he had every other year of his career).

I'm targetting him in each of my drafts.

 
I hate hearing how Mike Anderson will keep the heat on Jamal. Mike Anderson is 33 years old...If he's so good why didn't anyone else want him. I mean it's not like Balt. is paying him big money so why didn't another team sign him. Balt. signed Anderson before they signed Jamal so they could let Jamal think they didn't need him and then 2 days later Jamal resigned with them. I have Anderson unless Jamal gets hurt or if he does absolutely go in the tank (which could happen) but Billeck won't have the quick hook some on this board think and it definetly won't be a rrbc. Jamal is no doubt the guy in Balt. and if you get him in the late third or early fourth your doing very good for yourself. Also, for anyone that doesn't think Jamal ran hard all you needed to do was watch the Pitts game on Monday night last year. His final #'s might not be that impressive but he was running very hard that night. He only had 61 yards on 17 carries but he looked like he wanted to go and the o-line couldn't get him loose.

 
I believe another issue that factored into Jamals poor performance last year, on top of all that was mentioned, was that Jamal had the impression that he had an agreement with management that if he agreed to the charges and settled that the team would sign him to a long term deal. After he realized that the long term deal wasn't happening he felt that the management lied to him and his performance suffered.

 
After he realized that the long term deal wasn't happening he felt that the management lied to him and his performance suffered.
Quite a guy, that Jamal. Selfish and foolish as well - had he pushed himself and put together a better season, he probably would have gotten better offers elsewhere.

 
Last 5 games last year- 506 total yards and 4.1 YPC.
Vs. Cin. (20th in rush defense)

Hou. (32nd who held him to 17 yards rushing)

GB (23rd in rush defense)

Min. (19th in rush defense)

Cle. (30th in rush defense)

While four of those five games were impressive, his final five games came against defenses ranked in the bottom half of the league in rush defense. I think Lewis could have some value as a RB2 (I'd feel better about him as my RB3), but he still carries tremendous risk IMO. I was not impressed with how he run for most of last season -- he looked real sluggish and was slow to hit the hole. And unlike last season when Billick seemed very reluctant to really commit to Taylor when Lewis was playing poorly I don't think that will be the case this season with Anderson as the backup. If Lewis plays poorly again I think Billick will be much more inclined to give the backup a shot given how Anderson has proven he can be a feature RB and run with power.
I don't know how many times I will have to state this during this offseason, buuuut: How did you expect Lewis to look after being in jail and not getting proper time to both heal his injuries and workout? The guys was simply way behind in both conditioning and rehab. On top of that, his Oline fell apart last year too. You say that Lewis looked sluggish and slow to the hole. Well, no kidding if you didn't see that coming into last season though you simply were not paying attention to his cercumstances. It should surprise nobody that Lewis played horrible last year. It should also surprise nobody that he greatly improves this year. M.Anderson is an insurance clause and nothing more. Lewis is twice the RB Anderson is so long as he is healthy.
I thought Lewis said his excuse was he didn't have a long term contract and didn't want to get himself hurt?The jail excuse only holds so much water. So after joining the ravens for 2 months, he was still not in shape? He was still running like a girl late in the season because he missed training camp? What was his excuse in 2004? Was he also put in jail? The guy is injury prone, period.

The guy has been a top 10 RB once. He's the most overrated RB in the league. You have the GM calling for an open competition for the starting job. MA is just the type of back who will look a lot better then Lewis in practice. He always gives 100% and doesn't whine. Remember when MA was killing Bell in practice and everyone said "Don't worry, Bell is the man". If Lewis has another of his 200 leg injuries, MA is going to take that job and run with it.

Take away his one great year, he's had 6 tds, 6tds, 7 tds, 3 tds, 0 tds in the other years. Wow impressive. Then people will yell "he never had a QB!". When he had his BEST year, he had no QB. He's had two injury plagued years. He look HORRIBLE last year. And no one was going to pay him jack on the open market. The guy isn't that good. Period. Move on.

Just because a guy has two crappy years, doesn't mean he'll "bounce back". He's not "great value". He's dropping in drafts because he sucks. He's had two horrible years, and he looks nothing like he did in 2003. You can make a team full of "great value". Go draft Green, Jamal Lewis, DD then toss in Santana Moss and Javon Walker, draft Bulger and Vick as your QBs. Better get Heap at TE. Then come FF playoff time 1/2 of them are on IR. There's a reason people drop, it's because they are "risky – unproven – injury prone". Saying "blame jail!" doesn't ease my fears much. Who does he blame in 2004? 2002? 2001?

Bust in 2004 :X

+

Bust in 2005 :X

=

GREAT VALUE IN 2006!!! :X :X :X

No thanks.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
I believe another issue that factored into Jamals poor performance last year, on top of all that was mentioned, was that Jamal had the impression that he had an agreement with management that if he agreed to the charges and settled that the team would sign him to a long term deal. After he realized that the long term deal wasn't happening he felt that the management lied to him and his performance suffered.
HAHA. Excuse #1 - I sat in jail for 2 months during the offseason

Excuse #2 - I didn't get paid, so I sucked

Wow, I'm bumping this guy up on my draft boards. Hopefully Venus and Mars are aligned correctly so he can't blame the solar alignment this year.

Funny how SA played okay without getting his long term deal. So now Lewis is injury prone and weak of mind? This is getting more encouraging all the time.

 
Where does this perception of Lewis sucking in 2004 come from? I guess its just a simple case of far too demanding FFers getting burnt after his 2000+ season expecting lightening to strike twice.

I would hardly say that 1100 yds and 7 TDs in 12 games is sucking. If that is sucking for Lewis, then the future is even brighter than I had expected. :thumbup:

 
Last 5 games last year- 506 total yards and 4.1 YPC.
Vs. Cin. (20th in rush defense)

Hou. (32nd who held him to 17 yards rushing)

GB (23rd in rush defense)

Min. (19th in rush defense)

Cle. (30th in rush defense)

While four of those five games were impressive, his final five games came against defenses ranked in the bottom half of the league in rush defense. I think Lewis could have some value as a RB2 (I'd feel better about him as my RB3), but he still carries tremendous risk IMO. I was not impressed with how he run for most of last season -- he looked real sluggish and was slow to hit the hole. And unlike last season when Billick seemed very reluctant to really commit to Taylor when Lewis was playing poorly I don't think that will be the case this season with Anderson as the backup. If Lewis plays poorly again I think Billick will be much more inclined to give the backup a shot given how Anderson has proven he can be a feature RB and run with power.
I don't know how many times I will have to state this during this offseason, buuuut: How did you expect Lewis to look after being in jail and not getting proper time to both heal his injuries and workout? The guys was simply way behind in both conditioning and rehab. On top of that, his Oline fell apart last year too. You say that Lewis looked sluggish and slow to the hole. Well, no kidding if you didn't see that coming into last season though you simply were not paying attention to his cercumstances. It should surprise nobody that Lewis played horrible last year. It should also surprise nobody that he greatly improves this year. M.Anderson is an insurance clause and nothing more. Lewis is twice the RB Anderson is so long as he is healthy.
I thought Lewis said his excuse was he didn't have a long term contract and didn't want to get himself hurt?The jail excuse only holds so much water. So after joining the ravens for 2 months, he was still not in shape? He was still running like a girl late in the season because he missed training camp? What was his excuse in 2004? Was he also put in jail? The guy is injury prone, period.

The guy has been a top 10 RB once. He's the most overrated RB in the league. You have the GM calling for an open competition for the starting job. MA is just the type of back who will look a lot better then Lewis in practice. He always gives 100% and doesn't whine. Remember when MA was killing Bell in practice and everyone said "Don't worry, Bell is the man". If Lewis has another of his 200 leg injuries, MA is going to take that job and run with it.

Take away his one great year, he's had 6 tds, 6tds, 7 tds, 3 tds, 0 tds in the other years. Wow impressive. Then people will yell "he never had a QB!". When he had his BEST year, he had no QB. He's had two injury plagued years. He look HORRIBLE last year. And no one was going to pay him jack on the open market. The guy isn't that good. Period. Move on.

Just because a guy has two crappy years, doesn't mean he'll "bounce back". He's not "great value". He's dropping in drafts because he sucks. He's had two horrible years, and he looks nothing like he did in 2003. You can make a team full of "great value". Go draft Green, Jamal Lewis, DD then toss in Santana Moss and Javon Walker, draft Bulger and Vick as your QBs. Better get Heap at TE. Then come FF playoff time 1/2 of them are on IR. There's a reason people drop, it's because they are "risky – unproven – injury prone". Saying "blame jail!" doesn't ease my fears much. Who does he blame in 2004? 2002? 2001?

Bust in 2004 :X

+

Bust in 2005 :X

=

GREAT VALUE IN 2006!!! :X :X :X

No thanks.
Okay, but you obviously are stating then that you think Mike Anderson doesn't get hurt and is more prooven. In the last 2 years he has only started 15 games, came off a season ending injury as well and ran with another 1,000 yard rusher last year. He will join Olandis Gary as guys that Denver made look good. Also you say he was a bust in 2004. I don't know if I can call rushing for 1,000 yards and 7 td's (4.3 ypc) in only 12 games a bust. He was on pace for about 1300 rushing and 9 td's. Last year that would have put him at about the #10 rb. He might have been a bust considering people were taking him early but he had a very heavy load the year before and usually rb's can't take that much work in back-to-back seasons. Let's remember this guys is 2 years removed from one of the best seasons in NFL history. I don't think he's done by any means. I think he's a very safe pick in the late third round or early fourth. He'll be a descent #2rb on your team or a great #3 rb.

 
I believe another issue that factored into Jamals poor performance last year, on top of all that was mentioned, was that Jamal had the impression that he had an agreement with management that if he agreed to the charges and settled that the team would sign him to a long term deal.  After he realized that the long term deal wasn't happening he felt that the management lied to him and his performance suffered.
HAHA. Excuse #1 - I sat in jail for 2 months during the offseason

Excuse #2 - I didn't get paid, so I sucked

Wow, I'm bumping this guy up on my draft boards. Hopefully Venus and Mars are aligned correctly so he can't blame the solar alignment this year.

Funny how SA played okay without getting his long term deal. So now Lewis is injury prone and weak of mind? This is getting more encouraging all the time.
It's so funny how people think that being in jail isn't an excuse. He was in JAIL. I don't remember a player ever going to jail in the offseason and playing the next season in any professional sport but it doesn't surprise me in the least that it would effect a person. View it however you want and don't draft him, that's what FF is all about. Things change, Jamal got a deal, he's a year removed from the turmoil and the injury. I'm betting he'll be closer to his prior history than his one year outlier. I'm banking on the fact that a number of owners will feel exactly like you and his value will be very low.

 
It's so funny how people think that being in jail isn't an excuse. He was in JAIL. I don't remember a player ever going to jail in the offseason and playing the next season in any professional sport but it doesn't surprise me in the least that it would effect a person.
Mike Tyson anyone? Of course there could have been a lot of things that lead to his demise as a professional athlete. Still, remember how excited everyone was about him coming out? How tough and PO'd he was supposed to be. The only question most had was who the poor turd was going to be to get his face beat in by Iron Mike in his first fight back. Oh how wrong we all were... :wall: People really need to do a reality check on the work that these professional athletes HAVE to maintain to perform at the levels they do. Even the guys you all say are "slacking" and have "poor work ethic" do 10 times more in a given week physically then 95% of the world. These guys do not get in shape by pure luck and chance. They need to be healthy, have the time, means (technology/advise) and facilities to get into the kind of shape needed week one. Then you compound all of this with the extreme level of medical care it takes to get these guys recovered in a timely manor. It amazes me some can not see that being in jail may seriously hinder this process. I would say these things are all especially important to RBs because they take the most beating and probably face the most harsh season of all. There is a reason RBs take longer than any other position to recover from injuries. This really isn't a very complex idea.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
I'm still banking on him returning to his 2000+ yard performance. I mean, what would lead you to believe that he won't hit those numbers again, besides all the rest of his seasons?

Let go of the 2000 yard season. Ignore it. Throw it out. When you look at the rest of Lewis' career, he's not bad, but he's not an elite RB. Very doubtful he cracks the top 10 to 12. #15 would be a good season for him. So, he may have value, but I wouldn't want him as my #1 RB or even my #2.

Facts: Positional ranking (from www.pro-football-reference.com)

Code:
Year        Value        Pos. Rank    Overall Rank--------------------------------------------------2000          43            16             412002          67            12             182003         169             4              42004           0            25             832005           0            25             87--------------------------------------------------
 
Last edited by a moderator:
I'm still banking on him returning to his 2000+ yard performance. I mean, what would lead you to believe that he won't hit those numbers again, besides all the rest of his seasons?

Let go of the 2000 yard season. Ignore it. Throw it out. When you look at the rest of Lewis' career, he's not bad, but he's not an elite RB. Very doubtful he cracks the top 10 to 12. #15 would be a good season for him. So, he may have value, but I wouldn't want him as my #1 RB or even my #2.
Lewis' ranks:16

12

4

25 (12 games and on pace for RB #10)

25

Take aways last years disaster and you have yourself a VERY GOOD RB2, not a RB3.

 
Facts: Positional ranking (from www.pro-football-reference.com)

Code:
Year        Value        Pos. Rank    Overall Rank--------------------------------------------------2000          43            16             412002          67            12             182003         169             4              42004           0            25             832005           0            25             87--------------------------------------------------
These facts don't help support your view.
 
Last 5 games last year- 506 total yards and 4.1 YPC.
Vs. Cin. (20th in rush defense)

Hou. (32nd who held him to 17 yards rushing)

GB (23rd in rush defense)

Min. (19th in rush defense)

Cle. (30th in rush defense)

While four of those five games were impressive, his final five games came against defenses ranked in the bottom half of the league in rush defense. I think Lewis could have some value as a RB2 (I'd feel better about him as my RB3), but he still carries tremendous risk IMO. I was not impressed with how he run for most of last season -- he looked real sluggish and was slow to hit the hole. And unlike last season when Billick seemed very reluctant to really commit to Taylor when Lewis was playing poorly I don't think that will be the case this season with Anderson as the backup. If Lewis plays poorly again I think Billick will be much more inclined to give the backup a shot given how Anderson has proven he can be a feature RB and run with power.
I don't know how many times I will have to state this during this offseason, buuuut: How did you expect Lewis to look after being in jail and not getting proper time to both heal his injuries and workout? The guys was simply way behind in both conditioning and rehab. On top of that, his Oline fell apart last year too. You say that Lewis looked sluggish and slow to the hole. Well, no kidding if you didn't see that coming into last season though you simply were not paying attention to his cercumstances. It should surprise nobody that Lewis played horrible last year. It should also surprise nobody that he greatly improves this year. M.Anderson is an insurance clause and nothing more. Lewis is twice the RB Anderson is so long as he is healthy.
I thought Lewis said his excuse was he didn't have a long term contract and didn't want to get himself hurt?The jail excuse only holds so much water. So after joining the ravens for 2 months, he was still not in shape? He was still running like a girl late in the season because he missed training camp? What was his excuse in 2004? Was he also put in jail? The guy is injury prone, period.

The guy has been a top 10 RB once. He's the most overrated RB in the league. You have the GM calling for an open competition for the starting job. MA is just the type of back who will look a lot better then Lewis in practice. He always gives 100% and doesn't whine. Remember when MA was killing Bell in practice and everyone said "Don't worry, Bell is the man". If Lewis has another of his 200 leg injuries, MA is going to take that job and run with it.

Take away his one great year, he's had 6 tds, 6tds, 7 tds, 3 tds, 0 tds in the other years. Wow impressive. Then people will yell "he never had a QB!". When he had his BEST year, he had no QB. He's had two injury plagued years. He look HORRIBLE last year. And no one was going to pay him jack on the open market. The guy isn't that good. Period. Move on.

Just because a guy has two crappy years, doesn't mean he'll "bounce back". He's not "great value". He's dropping in drafts because he sucks. He's had two horrible years, and he looks nothing like he did in 2003. You can make a team full of "great value". Go draft Green, Jamal Lewis, DD then toss in Santana Moss and Javon Walker, draft Bulger and Vick as your QBs. Better get Heap at TE. Then come FF playoff time 1/2 of them are on IR. There's a reason people drop, it's because they are "risky – unproven – injury prone". Saying "blame jail!" doesn't ease my fears much. Who does he blame in 2004? 2002? 2001?

Bust in 2004 :X

+

Bust in 2005 :X

=

GREAT VALUE IN 2006!!! :X :X :X

No thanks.
Okay, but you obviously are stating then that you think Mike Anderson doesn't get hurt and is more prooven. In the last 2 years he has only started 15 games, came off a season ending injury as well and ran with another 1,000 yard rusher last year. He will join Olandis Gary as guys that Denver made look good. Also you say he was a bust in 2004. I don't know if I can call rushing for 1,000 yards and 7 td's (4.3 ypc) in only 12 games a bust. He was on pace for about 1300 rushing and 9 td's. Last year that would have put him at about the #10 rb. He might have been a bust considering people were taking him early but he had a very heavy load the year before and usually rb's can't take that much work in back-to-back seasons. Let's remember this guys is 2 years removed from one of the best seasons in NFL history. I don't think he's done by any means. I think he's a very safe pick in the late third round or early fourth. He'll be a descent #2rb on your team or a great #3 rb.
I never said MA was better. I said MA is a bad fit for Lewis owners. He'll work his butt off, run hard in practice, and when Lewis cries about contracts, not feeling the love, gets injured again, MA will be ready to take over.2004 wasn't a bust? He was drafted in the top 5 overall in a lot of leagues. If you pick Lewis in the top 5, and he runs for 1,000 yards, 7 tds along with missing most of 4 games, he was a bust. It was a 50% drop from the year before. Anyone who took Lewis in the first round mostly got killed that year. So yes, it's a bust.

On pace? Before he got HURT? That helps your argument?

Two years removed? Then had two injury filled seasons? That helps your argument?

Again, I don't see how 2004 BUST, 2005 BUST, equals solid RB2 in 2006.

If Lewis is your RB2, you are in a world of trouble.

 
I believe another issue that factored into Jamals poor performance last year, on top of all that was mentioned, was that Jamal had the impression that he had an agreement with management that if he agreed to the charges and settled that the team would sign him to a long term deal.  After he realized that the long term deal wasn't happening he felt that the management lied to him and his performance suffered.
HAHA. Excuse #1 - I sat in jail for 2 months during the offseason

Excuse #2 - I didn't get paid, so I sucked

Wow, I'm bumping this guy up on my draft boards. Hopefully Venus and Mars are aligned correctly so he can't blame the solar alignment this year.

Funny how SA played okay without getting his long term deal. So now Lewis is injury prone and weak of mind? This is getting more encouraging all the time.
It's so funny how people think that being in jail isn't an excuse. He was in JAIL. I don't remember a player ever going to jail in the offseason and playing the next season in any professional sport but it doesn't surprise me in the least that it would effect a person. View it however you want and don't draft him, that's what FF is all about. Things change, Jamal got a deal, he's a year removed from the turmoil and the injury. I'm betting he'll be closer to his prior history than his one year outlier. I'm banking on the fact that a number of owners will feel exactly like you and his value will be very low.
His ADP is RB18. So if you get him, he's probably your RB2.He went to jail in the off-season. He whined about not getting a contract and didn't want to risk his future by getting hurt. Okay so lets give him a free pass.

What was the excuse for 2004? 50% drop in production? More injuries?

So now we're giving him a pass on two years. Somehow two fairly crappy years equals "come back player of the year - GREAT value pick by sharks!". Or "let someone else deal w/ the mess that Jamal has turned into pick".

 
I'm still banking on him returning to his 2000+ yard performance.  I mean, what would lead you to believe that he won't hit those numbers again, besides all the rest of his seasons? 

Let go of the 2000 yard season.  Ignore it.  Throw it out.  When you look at the rest of Lewis' career, he's not bad, but he's not an elite RB.  Very doubtful he cracks the top 10 to 12.  #15 would be a good season for him.  So, he may have value, but I wouldn't want him as my #1 RB or even my #2.
Lewis' ranks:16

12

4

25 (12 games and on pace for RB #10)

25

Take aways last years disaster and you have yourself a VERY GOOD RB2, not a RB3.
Uh, you need to throw out the last TWO years. He was 25th last year, but 25th in 2004 and that's not a disaster? After he ran for 2k yds, and was a top 10 overall pick. Oh wait, that's not a bust.People need to drop the man crush. Bagger was spouting the same stuff last summer.

Many people seem to think the fact that the ravens are going to pass the ball more will hurt him, I think the exact opposite. I can't help but think that not seeing 8-9 in the box EVERY snap will only help him dominate even more. In the past the only wr defenses needed to respect was Heap and last year he was injured nearly the whole year. Every team knew every series that it was 1st down Jamal, 2nd down Jamal, 3rd down pass and hope to continue the drive. EVERY SERIES. They were the worst passing team the past two years and the guy still averaged over 4 YPC with the most predictable offense in football. That's amazing. Give that offense a little balance and a little unpredictability and there's no telling how good he can be.
How did that work out?
If they can get ANY semblence of a passing game going he will easily hit the 5.0 ypc mark and 12 TDs... easily. He is getting 4.4 by himself. One would hope the TEAM could kick in another 1.0 for him.
Easily? So in 2004, he was a top 10 pick. Bust. In 2005, everyone is arguing what great value he is falling into the 2nd round. Bust. Now it's 2006, and everyone is yelling about GREAT VALUE as an early 3rd round pick (and your RB2 based on ADP). At some point, people need to stop wasting picks on this guy. He's a horrible RB2. He's a decent RB3 for when he plays the Browns. Next year people will be going on about Jamal as a great sleeper in the 6th round.

It's just funny seeing the same people pimp him this year as they were last year. Wood was all over it, called him out as average last year (and Cecil), but everyone pretty much freaked on him.

Lewis is just not dependable. End of story.

 
And lets get over this "great value" stuff. FBGs have him ranked at RB21. He's ADP is RB18. He's OVERRATED. People still cream over that 2,000 yard season. That was 3 years ago. In the NFL, that's ancient history.

Again, if people are drafting him higher then FBG rankings, explain his great value? FBGs are all wrong and he's going to bust out a top 10 RB year? (would be his 2nd best year ever, not sure how you can project that based on two horrible years in a row)

Based on RECENT history, he'll end up RB20-30. So unless you can draft him RB30-40, I don't see this gold rush on Lewis for amazing value. It seems he's getting more love after two horrendous seasons then ever.

 
And lets get over this "great value" stuff. FBGs have him ranked at RB21. He's ADP is RB18. He's OVERRATED. People still cream over that 2,000 yard season. That was 3 years ago. In the NFL, that's ancient history.

Again, if people are drafting him higher then FBG rankings, explain his great value? FBGs are all wrong and he's going to bust out a top 10 RB year? (would be his 2nd best year ever, not sure how you can project that based on two horrible years in a row)

Based on RECENT history, he'll end up RB20-30. So unless you can draft him RB30-40, I don't see this gold rush on Lewis for amazing value. It seems he's getting more love after two horrendous seasons then ever.
OK, so you are predicting an injury then huh. Cause injuries are the only thing that has kept Lewis form being a boarderline RB1 and excelent RB2. While your at it how about next weeks lottery numbers too. :thumbup:
 
Last 5 games last year- 506 total yards and 4.1 YPC.
Vs. Cin. (20th in rush defense)

Hou. (32nd who held him to 17 yards rushing)

GB (23rd in rush defense)

Min. (19th in rush defense)

Cle. (30th in rush defense)

While four of those five games were impressive, his final five games came against defenses ranked in the bottom half of the league in rush defense. I think Lewis could have some value as a RB2 (I'd feel better about him as my RB3), but he still carries tremendous risk IMO. I was not impressed with how he run for most of last season -- he looked real sluggish and was slow to hit the hole. And unlike last season when Billick seemed very reluctant to really commit to Taylor when Lewis was playing poorly I don't think that will be the case this season with Anderson as the backup. If Lewis plays poorly again I think Billick will be much more inclined to give the backup a shot given how Anderson has proven he can be a feature RB and run with power.
I don't know how many times I will have to state this during this offseason, buuuut: How did you expect Lewis to look after being in jail and not getting proper time to both heal his injuries and workout? The guys was simply way behind in both conditioning and rehab. On top of that, his Oline fell apart last year too. You say that Lewis looked sluggish and slow to the hole. Well, no kidding if you didn't see that coming into last season though you simply were not paying attention to his cercumstances. It should surprise nobody that Lewis played horrible last year. It should also surprise nobody that he greatly improves this year. M.Anderson is an insurance clause and nothing more. Lewis is twice the RB Anderson is so long as he is healthy.
I thought Lewis said his excuse was he didn't have a long term contract and didn't want to get himself hurt?The jail excuse only holds so much water. So after joining the ravens for 2 months, he was still not in shape? He was still running like a girl late in the season because he missed training camp? What was his excuse in 2004? Was he also put in jail? The guy is injury prone, period.

The guy has been a top 10 RB once. He's the most overrated RB in the league. You have the GM calling for an open competition for the starting job. MA is just the type of back who will look a lot better then Lewis in practice. He always gives 100% and doesn't whine. Remember when MA was killing Bell in practice and everyone said "Don't worry, Bell is the man". If Lewis has another of his 200 leg injuries, MA is going to take that job and run with it.

Take away his one great year, he's had 6 tds, 6tds, 7 tds, 3 tds, 0 tds in the other years. Wow impressive. Then people will yell "he never had a QB!". When he had his BEST year, he had no QB. He's had two injury plagued years. He look HORRIBLE last year. And no one was going to pay him jack on the open market. The guy isn't that good. Period. Move on.

Just because a guy has two crappy years, doesn't mean he'll "bounce back". He's not "great value". He's dropping in drafts because he sucks. He's had two horrible years, and he looks nothing like he did in 2003. You can make a team full of "great value". Go draft Green, Jamal Lewis, DD then toss in Santana Moss and Javon Walker, draft Bulger and Vick as your QBs. Better get Heap at TE. Then come FF playoff time 1/2 of them are on IR. There's a reason people drop, it's because they are "risky – unproven – injury prone". Saying "blame jail!" doesn't ease my fears much. Who does he blame in 2004? 2002? 2001?

Bust in 2004 :X

+

Bust in 2005 :X

=

GREAT VALUE IN 2006!!! :X :X :X

No thanks.
Okay, but you obviously are stating then that you think Mike Anderson doesn't get hurt and is more prooven. In the last 2 years he has only started 15 games, came off a season ending injury as well and ran with another 1,000 yard rusher last year. He will join Olandis Gary as guys that Denver made look good. Also you say he was a bust in 2004. I don't know if I can call rushing for 1,000 yards and 7 td's (4.3 ypc) in only 12 games a bust. He was on pace for about 1300 rushing and 9 td's. Last year that would have put him at about the #10 rb. He might have been a bust considering people were taking him early but he had a very heavy load the year before and usually rb's can't take that much work in back-to-back seasons. Let's remember this guys is 2 years removed from one of the best seasons in NFL history. I don't think he's done by any means. I think he's a very safe pick in the late third round or early fourth. He'll be a descent #2rb on your team or a great #3 rb.
I never said MA was better. I said MA is a bad fit for Lewis owners. He'll work his butt off, run hard in practice, and when Lewis cries about contracts, not feeling the love, gets injured again, MA will be ready to take over.2004 wasn't a bust? He was drafted in the top 5 overall in a lot of leagues. If you pick Lewis in the top 5, and he runs for 1,000 yards, 7 tds along with missing most of 4 games, he was a bust. It was a 50% drop from the year before. Anyone who took Lewis in the first round mostly got killed that year. So yes, it's a bust.

On pace? Before he got HURT? That helps your argument?

Two years removed? Then had two injury filled seasons? That helps your argument?

Again, I don't see how 2004 BUST, 2005 BUST, equals solid RB2 in 2006.

If Lewis is your RB2, you are in a world of trouble.
I have Portis, Brown Bush and Lewis in a dynasty league. I still don't consider someone getting hurt a "bust." When Priest went down 2 years ago for the last couple of games was he a bust? The year before Portis missed a couple of games, were they bust? Jamal was a bust last year, he was usually drafted in the late first or early second and he didn't stack up. I'm cool with that but if you couldn't see the warning signs then that's your own fault. Jamal has shown that he usually bounces back after bad years. I'm not saying he will be top 10, he usually isn't, but he is consistenly a top 15 rb and he'll return this year. Hell, as bad as he was last year he missed top 15 by 41 points. No doubt next year top 15.
 
"Right now, I'm free and clear," said Jamal Lewis, who spent the offseason in Atlanta, fulfilling the 500-hour community service commitment that was part of his plea bargain agreement last year. "I'm free and clear of everything that's behind me. It's just a much better situation. I'm back on the right track."

Lewis then went and put the oxygen mask over his cakehole for 5 minutes.

 
Last 5 games last year- 506 total yards and 4.1 YPC.
Vs. Cin. (20th in rush defense)

Hou. (32nd who held him to 17 yards rushing)

GB (23rd in rush defense)

Min. (19th in rush defense)

Cle. (30th in rush defense)

While four of those five games were impressive, his final five games came against defenses ranked in the bottom half of the league in rush defense. I think Lewis could have some value as a RB2 (I'd feel better about him as my RB3), but he still carries tremendous risk IMO. I was not impressed with how he run for most of last season -- he looked real sluggish and was slow to hit the hole. And unlike last season when Billick seemed very reluctant to really commit to Taylor when Lewis was playing poorly I don't think that will be the case this season with Anderson as the backup. If Lewis plays poorly again I think Billick will be much more inclined to give the backup a shot given how Anderson has proven he can be a feature RB and run with power.
I don't know how many times I will have to state this during this offseason, buuuut: How did you expect Lewis to look after being in jail and not getting proper time to both heal his injuries and workout? The guys was simply way behind in both conditioning and rehab. On top of that, his Oline fell apart last year too. You say that Lewis looked sluggish and slow to the hole. Well, no kidding if you didn't see that coming into last season though you simply were not paying attention to his cercumstances. It should surprise nobody that Lewis played horrible last year. It should also surprise nobody that he greatly improves this year. M.Anderson is an insurance clause and nothing more. Lewis is twice the RB Anderson is so long as he is healthy.
I thought Lewis said his excuse was he didn't have a long term contract and didn't want to get himself hurt?The jail excuse only holds so much water. So after joining the ravens for 2 months, he was still not in shape? He was still running like a girl late in the season because he missed training camp? What was his excuse in 2004? Was he also put in jail? The guy is injury prone, period.

The guy has been a top 10 RB once. He's the most overrated RB in the league. You have the GM calling for an open competition for the starting job. MA is just the type of back who will look a lot better then Lewis in practice. He always gives 100% and doesn't whine. Remember when MA was killing Bell in practice and everyone said "Don't worry, Bell is the man". If Lewis has another of his 200 leg injuries, MA is going to take that job and run with it.

Take away his one great year, he's had 6 tds, 6tds, 7 tds, 3 tds, 0 tds in the other years. Wow impressive. Then people will yell "he never had a QB!". When he had his BEST year, he had no QB. He's had two injury plagued years. He look HORRIBLE last year. And no one was going to pay him jack on the open market. The guy isn't that good. Period. Move on.

Just because a guy has two crappy years, doesn't mean he'll "bounce back". He's not "great value". He's dropping in drafts because he sucks. He's had two horrible years, and he looks nothing like he did in 2003. You can make a team full of "great value". Go draft Green, Jamal Lewis, DD then toss in Santana Moss and Javon Walker, draft Bulger and Vick as your QBs. Better get Heap at TE. Then come FF playoff time 1/2 of them are on IR. There's a reason people drop, it's because they are "risky – unproven – injury prone". Saying "blame jail!" doesn't ease my fears much. Who does he blame in 2004? 2002? 2001?

Bust in 2004 :X

+

Bust in 2005 :X

=

GREAT VALUE IN 2006!!! :X :X :X

No thanks.
Okay, but you obviously are stating then that you think Mike Anderson doesn't get hurt and is more prooven. In the last 2 years he has only started 15 games, came off a season ending injury as well and ran with another 1,000 yard rusher last year. He will join Olandis Gary as guys that Denver made look good. Also you say he was a bust in 2004. I don't know if I can call rushing for 1,000 yards and 7 td's (4.3 ypc) in only 12 games a bust. He was on pace for about 1300 rushing and 9 td's. Last year that would have put him at about the #10 rb. He might have been a bust considering people were taking him early but he had a very heavy load the year before and usually rb's can't take that much work in back-to-back seasons. Let's remember this guys is 2 years removed from one of the best seasons in NFL history. I don't think he's done by any means. I think he's a very safe pick in the late third round or early fourth. He'll be a descent #2rb on your team or a great #3 rb.
I never said MA was better. I said MA is a bad fit for Lewis owners. He'll work his butt off, run hard in practice, and when Lewis cries about contracts, not feeling the love, gets injured again, MA will be ready to take over.2004 wasn't a bust? He was drafted in the top 5 overall in a lot of leagues. If you pick Lewis in the top 5, and he runs for 1,000 yards, 7 tds along with missing most of 4 games, he was a bust. It was a 50% drop from the year before. Anyone who took Lewis in the first round mostly got killed that year. So yes, it's a bust.

On pace? Before he got HURT? That helps your argument?

Two years removed? Then had two injury filled seasons? That helps your argument?

Again, I don't see how 2004 BUST, 2005 BUST, equals solid RB2 in 2006.

If Lewis is your RB2, you are in a world of trouble.
I have Portis, Brown Bush and Lewis in a dynasty league. I still don't consider someone getting hurt a "bust." When Priest went down 2 years ago for the last couple of games was he a bust? The year before Portis missed a couple of games, were they bust? Jamal was a bust last year, he was usually drafted in the late first or early second and he didn't stack up. I'm cool with that but if you couldn't see the warning signs then that's your own fault. Jamal has shown that he usually bounces back after bad years. I'm not saying he will be top 10, he usually isn't, but he is consistenly a top 15 rb and he'll return this year. Hell, as bad as he was last year he missed top 15 by 41 points. No doubt next year top 15.
Of course you think Lewis is a no doubt top 15, he is on your dynasty team. In a Dominick Davis thread you said:
Not even the season yet and DD is out. If you take him enjoy the 5 games games you get out of him.
OK, so DD who has averaged 13.3 games per year is more injury prone than Lewis who has averaged 12.5 games per year.You also hype Lewis as a lock for top 15 when he has finished top 15 in only 2 of his 6 years. DD has finished top 15 in 2 of 3 years including his rookie year that he played 14 games and only started 10. DD's 2005 ranking of 17 is better than 3 of Lewis' 6 years even though DD played only 11 games.

Oh, and stop the talk (not directed at you Blackjack) about Lewis being top 10 in 2004 if he played 16, because that isn't true because you are ignoring Portis, Holmes, Pittman, Green, McAllister, Bettis, T.Jones, K. Jones, N. Goings, L. Johnson, C. Brown, and J. Jones. If weare going to say Lewis plays 16, then we have to imagine everyone else does as well.

So in reality, if all RBs had started 16 games, Lewis would have finished 24th since only one of LJ or Holmes would have been in front of him and he would have only passed Fred Taylor in PPG.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Last 5 games last year- 506 total yards and 4.1 YPC.
Vs. Cin. (20th in rush defense)

Hou. (32nd who held him to 17 yards rushing)

GB (23rd in rush defense)

Min. (19th in rush defense)

Cle. (30th in rush defense)

While four of those five games were impressive, his final five games came against defenses ranked in the bottom half of the league in rush defense. I think Lewis could have some value as a RB2 (I'd feel better about him as my RB3), but he still carries tremendous risk IMO. I was not impressed with how he run for most of last season -- he looked real sluggish and was slow to hit the hole. And unlike last season when Billick seemed very reluctant to really commit to Taylor when Lewis was playing poorly I don't think that will be the case this season with Anderson as the backup. If Lewis plays poorly again I think Billick will be much more inclined to give the backup a shot given how Anderson has proven he can be a feature RB and run with power.
I don't know how many times I will have to state this during this offseason, buuuut: How did you expect Lewis to look after being in jail and not getting proper time to both heal his injuries and workout? The guys was simply way behind in both conditioning and rehab. On top of that, his Oline fell apart last year too. You say that Lewis looked sluggish and slow to the hole. Well, no kidding if you didn't see that coming into last season though you simply were not paying attention to his cercumstances. It should surprise nobody that Lewis played horrible last year. It should also surprise nobody that he greatly improves this year. M.Anderson is an insurance clause and nothing more. Lewis is twice the RB Anderson is so long as he is healthy.
I thought Lewis said his excuse was he didn't have a long term contract and didn't want to get himself hurt?The jail excuse only holds so much water. So after joining the ravens for 2 months, he was still not in shape? He was still running like a girl late in the season because he missed training camp? What was his excuse in 2004? Was he also put in jail? The guy is injury prone, period.

The guy has been a top 10 RB once. He's the most overrated RB in the league. You have the GM calling for an open competition for the starting job. MA is just the type of back who will look a lot better then Lewis in practice. He always gives 100% and doesn't whine. Remember when MA was killing Bell in practice and everyone said "Don't worry, Bell is the man". If Lewis has another of his 200 leg injuries, MA is going to take that job and run with it.

Take away his one great year, he's had 6 tds, 6tds, 7 tds, 3 tds, 0 tds in the other years. Wow impressive. Then people will yell "he never had a QB!". When he had his BEST year, he had no QB. He's had two injury plagued years. He look HORRIBLE last year. And no one was going to pay him jack on the open market. The guy isn't that good. Period. Move on.

Just because a guy has two crappy years, doesn't mean he'll "bounce back". He's not "great value". He's dropping in drafts because he sucks. He's had two horrible years, and he looks nothing like he did in 2003. You can make a team full of "great value". Go draft Green, Jamal Lewis, DD then toss in Santana Moss and Javon Walker, draft Bulger and Vick as your QBs. Better get Heap at TE. Then come FF playoff time 1/2 of them are on IR. There's a reason people drop, it's because they are "risky – unproven – injury prone". Saying "blame jail!" doesn't ease my fears much. Who does he blame in 2004? 2002? 2001?

Bust in 2004 :X

+

Bust in 2005 :X

=

GREAT VALUE IN 2006!!! :X :X :X

No thanks.
Okay, but you obviously are stating then that you think Mike Anderson doesn't get hurt and is more prooven. In the last 2 years he has only started 15 games, came off a season ending injury as well and ran with another 1,000 yard rusher last year. He will join Olandis Gary as guys that Denver made look good. Also you say he was a bust in 2004. I don't know if I can call rushing for 1,000 yards and 7 td's (4.3 ypc) in only 12 games a bust. He was on pace for about 1300 rushing and 9 td's. Last year that would have put him at about the #10 rb. He might have been a bust considering people were taking him early but he had a very heavy load the year before and usually rb's can't take that much work in back-to-back seasons. Let's remember this guys is 2 years removed from one of the best seasons in NFL history. I don't think he's done by any means. I think he's a very safe pick in the late third round or early fourth. He'll be a descent #2rb on your team or a great #3 rb.
I never said MA was better. I said MA is a bad fit for Lewis owners. He'll work his butt off, run hard in practice, and when Lewis cries about contracts, not feeling the love, gets injured again, MA will be ready to take over.2004 wasn't a bust? He was drafted in the top 5 overall in a lot of leagues. If you pick Lewis in the top 5, and he runs for 1,000 yards, 7 tds along with missing most of 4 games, he was a bust. It was a 50% drop from the year before. Anyone who took Lewis in the first round mostly got killed that year. So yes, it's a bust.

On pace? Before he got HURT? That helps your argument?

Two years removed? Then had two injury filled seasons? That helps your argument?

Again, I don't see how 2004 BUST, 2005 BUST, equals solid RB2 in 2006.

If Lewis is your RB2, you are in a world of trouble.
I have Portis, Brown Bush and Lewis in a dynasty league. I still don't consider someone getting hurt a "bust." When Priest went down 2 years ago for the last couple of games was he a bust? The year before Portis missed a couple of games, were they bust? Jamal was a bust last year, he was usually drafted in the late first or early second and he didn't stack up. I'm cool with that but if you couldn't see the warning signs then that's your own fault. Jamal has shown that he usually bounces back after bad years. I'm not saying he will be top 10, he usually isn't, but he is consistenly a top 15 rb and he'll return this year. Hell, as bad as he was last year he missed top 15 by 41 points. No doubt next year top 15.
Of course you think Lewis is a no doubt top 15, he is on your dynasty team. In a Dominick Davis thread you said:
Not even the season yet and DD is out. If you take him enjoy the 5 games games you get out of him.
OK, so DD who has averaged 13.3 games per year is more injury prone than Lewis who has averaged 12.5 games per year.You also hype Lewis as a lock for top 15 when he has finished top 15 in only 2 of his 6 years. DD has finished top 15 in 2 of 3 years including his rookie year that he played 14 games and only started 10. DD's 2005 ranking of 17 is better than 3 of Lewis' 6 years even though DD played only 11 games.

Oh, and stop the talk (not directed at you Blackjack) about Lewis being top 10 in 2004 if he played 16, because that isn't true because you are ignoring Portis, Holmes, Pittman, Green, McAllister, Bettis, T.Jones, K. Jones, N. Goings, L. Johnson, C. Brown, and J. Jones. If weare going to say Lewis plays 16, then we have to imagine everyone else does as well.

So in reality, if all RBs had started 16 games, Lewis would have finished 24th since only one of LJ or Holmes would have been in front of him and he would have only passed Fred Taylor in PPG.
Good points but Jamal missed the entire year in 2001 so not really fair to include that year and didn't start 8 other games in that span. Does DD have the potential to have one of the best season's ever like Jamal did just 2 years ago. By the way I'm saying top 15, not top 10. If I were drafting tommorrow I would take Jamal before DD cause I just don't care for him, I don't trust him and I don't think he's that good. No scientific facts here just my gut feeling. Don't you want the people you like on your team, why wouls I want to go out and get people I think are going to bad? That's a pretty dumb question. Let's see I think DD is going to suck so I better draft him? Of course I'm going to like the people on my team...that's why I have them.
 
Last 5 games last year- 506 total yards and 4.1 YPC.
Vs. Cin. (20th in rush defense)

Hou. (32nd who held him to 17 yards rushing)

GB (23rd in rush defense)

Min. (19th in rush defense)

Cle. (30th in rush defense)

While four of those five games were impressive, his final five games came against defenses ranked in the bottom half of the league in rush defense. I think Lewis could have some value as a RB2 (I'd feel better about him as my RB3), but he still carries tremendous risk IMO. I was not impressed with how he run for most of last season -- he looked real sluggish and was slow to hit the hole. And unlike last season when Billick seemed very reluctant to really commit to Taylor when Lewis was playing poorly I don't think that will be the case this season with Anderson as the backup. If Lewis plays poorly again I think Billick will be much more inclined to give the backup a shot given how Anderson has proven he can be a feature RB and run with power.
I don't know how many times I will have to state this during this offseason, buuuut: How did you expect Lewis to look after being in jail and not getting proper time to both heal his injuries and workout? The guys was simply way behind in both conditioning and rehab. On top of that, his Oline fell apart last year too. You say that Lewis looked sluggish and slow to the hole. Well, no kidding if you didn't see that coming into last season though you simply were not paying attention to his cercumstances. It should surprise nobody that Lewis played horrible last year. It should also surprise nobody that he greatly improves this year. M.Anderson is an insurance clause and nothing more. Lewis is twice the RB Anderson is so long as he is healthy.
I thought Lewis said his excuse was he didn't have a long term contract and didn't want to get himself hurt?The jail excuse only holds so much water. So after joining the ravens for 2 months, he was still not in shape? He was still running like a girl late in the season because he missed training camp? What was his excuse in 2004? Was he also put in jail? The guy is injury prone, period.

The guy has been a top 10 RB once. He's the most overrated RB in the league. You have the GM calling for an open competition for the starting job. MA is just the type of back who will look a lot better then Lewis in practice. He always gives 100% and doesn't whine. Remember when MA was killing Bell in practice and everyone said "Don't worry, Bell is the man". If Lewis has another of his 200 leg injuries, MA is going to take that job and run with it.

Take away his one great year, he's had 6 tds, 6tds, 7 tds, 3 tds, 0 tds in the other years. Wow impressive. Then people will yell "he never had a QB!". When he had his BEST year, he had no QB. He's had two injury plagued years. He look HORRIBLE last year. And no one was going to pay him jack on the open market. The guy isn't that good. Period. Move on.

Just because a guy has two crappy years, doesn't mean he'll "bounce back". He's not "great value". He's dropping in drafts because he sucks. He's had two horrible years, and he looks nothing like he did in 2003. You can make a team full of "great value". Go draft Green, Jamal Lewis, DD then toss in Santana Moss and Javon Walker, draft Bulger and Vick as your QBs. Better get Heap at TE. Then come FF playoff time 1/2 of them are on IR. There's a reason people drop, it's because they are "risky – unproven – injury prone". Saying "blame jail!" doesn't ease my fears much. Who does he blame in 2004? 2002? 2001?

Bust in 2004 :X

+

Bust in 2005 :X

=

GREAT VALUE IN 2006!!! :X :X :X

No thanks.
Do you watch any of the Ravens games? If you actually watch the games, you'd probably see that Lewis is the toughest RB in the league to bring down and runs hard as hell. Hes a special talent, and it isn't always reflected in the numbers.
 
[

Do you watch any of the Ravens games? If you actually watch the games, you'd probably see that Lewis is the toughest RB in the league to bring down and runs hard as hell. Hes a special talent, and it isn't always reflected in the numbers.
He wasn't last year, though. I did watch all of the Ravens games & Lewis was waaay too tentative. Granted, the o-line was pitiful & he was getting hit behind the line all too often, but my head nearly exploded every time I watched Jamal do his little stutter-step. He's a down-hill runner, not Barry Sanders.There was kind of a "Perfect Storm" confluence of factors last season that I hope was a one-year thing: putrid blocking, time in the slammer, & Lewis' discontent.

 
Last 5 games last year- 506 total yards and 4.1 YPC.
Vs. Cin. (20th in rush defense)

Hou. (32nd who held him to 17 yards rushing)

GB (23rd in rush defense)

Min. (19th in rush defense)

Cle. (30th in rush defense)

While four of those five games were impressive, his final five games came against defenses ranked in the bottom half of the league in rush defense. I think Lewis could have some value as a RB2 (I'd feel better about him as my RB3), but he still carries tremendous risk IMO. I was not impressed with how he run for most of last season -- he looked real sluggish and was slow to hit the hole. And unlike last season when Billick seemed very reluctant to really commit to Taylor when Lewis was playing poorly I don't think that will be the case this season with Anderson as the backup. If Lewis plays poorly again I think Billick will be much more inclined to give the backup a shot given how Anderson has proven he can be a feature RB and run with power.
I don't know how many times I will have to state this during this offseason, buuuut: How did you expect Lewis to look after being in jail and not getting proper time to both heal his injuries and workout? The guys was simply way behind in both conditioning and rehab. On top of that, his Oline fell apart last year too. You say that Lewis looked sluggish and slow to the hole. Well, no kidding if you didn't see that coming into last season though you simply were not paying attention to his cercumstances. It should surprise nobody that Lewis played horrible last year. It should also surprise nobody that he greatly improves this year. M.Anderson is an insurance clause and nothing more. Lewis is twice the RB Anderson is so long as he is healthy.
I thought Lewis said his excuse was he didn't have a long term contract and didn't want to get himself hurt?The jail excuse only holds so much water. So after joining the ravens for 2 months, he was still not in shape? He was still running like a girl late in the season because he missed training camp? What was his excuse in 2004? Was he also put in jail? The guy is injury prone, period.

The guy has been a top 10 RB once. He's the most overrated RB in the league. You have the GM calling for an open competition for the starting job. MA is just the type of back who will look a lot better then Lewis in practice. He always gives 100% and doesn't whine. Remember when MA was killing Bell in practice and everyone said "Don't worry, Bell is the man". If Lewis has another of his 200 leg injuries, MA is going to take that job and run with it.

Take away his one great year, he's had 6 tds, 6tds, 7 tds, 3 tds, 0 tds in the other years. Wow impressive. Then people will yell "he never had a QB!". When he had his BEST year, he had no QB. He's had two injury plagued years. He look HORRIBLE last year. And no one was going to pay him jack on the open market. The guy isn't that good. Period. Move on.

Just because a guy has two crappy years, doesn't mean he'll "bounce back". He's not "great value". He's dropping in drafts because he sucks. He's had two horrible years, and he looks nothing like he did in 2003. You can make a team full of "great value". Go draft Green, Jamal Lewis, DD then toss in Santana Moss and Javon Walker, draft Bulger and Vick as your QBs. Better get Heap at TE. Then come FF playoff time 1/2 of them are on IR. There's a reason people drop, it's because they are "risky – unproven – injury prone". Saying "blame jail!" doesn't ease my fears much. Who does he blame in 2004? 2002? 2001?

Bust in 2004 :X

+

Bust in 2005 :X

=

GREAT VALUE IN 2006!!! :X :X :X

No thanks.
Okay, but you obviously are stating then that you think Mike Anderson doesn't get hurt and is more prooven. In the last 2 years he has only started 15 games, came off a season ending injury as well and ran with another 1,000 yard rusher last year. He will join Olandis Gary as guys that Denver made look good. Also you say he was a bust in 2004. I don't know if I can call rushing for 1,000 yards and 7 td's (4.3 ypc) in only 12 games a bust. He was on pace for about 1300 rushing and 9 td's. Last year that would have put him at about the #10 rb. He might have been a bust considering people were taking him early but he had a very heavy load the year before and usually rb's can't take that much work in back-to-back seasons. Let's remember this guys is 2 years removed from one of the best seasons in NFL history. I don't think he's done by any means. I think he's a very safe pick in the late third round or early fourth. He'll be a descent #2rb on your team or a great #3 rb.
I never said MA was better. I said MA is a bad fit for Lewis owners. He'll work his butt off, run hard in practice, and when Lewis cries about contracts, not feeling the love, gets injured again, MA will be ready to take over.2004 wasn't a bust? He was drafted in the top 5 overall in a lot of leagues. If you pick Lewis in the top 5, and he runs for 1,000 yards, 7 tds along with missing most of 4 games, he was a bust. It was a 50% drop from the year before. Anyone who took Lewis in the first round mostly got killed that year. So yes, it's a bust.

On pace? Before he got HURT? That helps your argument?

Two years removed? Then had two injury filled seasons? That helps your argument?

Again, I don't see how 2004 BUST, 2005 BUST, equals solid RB2 in 2006.

If Lewis is your RB2, you are in a world of trouble.
I have Portis, Brown Bush and Lewis in a dynasty league. I still don't consider someone getting hurt a "bust." When Priest went down 2 years ago for the last couple of games was he a bust? The year before Portis missed a couple of games, were they bust? Jamal was a bust last year, he was usually drafted in the late first or early second and he didn't stack up. I'm cool with that but if you couldn't see the warning signs then that's your own fault. Jamal has shown that he usually bounces back after bad years. I'm not saying he will be top 10, he usually isn't, but he is consistenly a top 15 rb and he'll return this year. Hell, as bad as he was last year he missed top 15 by 41 points. No doubt next year top 15.
Of course you think Lewis is a no doubt top 15, he is on your dynasty team. In a Dominick Davis thread you said:
Not even the season yet and DD is out. If you take him enjoy the 5 games games you get out of him.
OK, so DD who has averaged 13.3 games per year is more injury prone than Lewis who has averaged 12.5 games per year.You also hype Lewis as a lock for top 15 when he has finished top 15 in only 2 of his 6 years. DD has finished top 15 in 2 of 3 years including his rookie year that he played 14 games and only started 10. DD's 2005 ranking of 17 is better than 3 of Lewis' 6 years even though DD played only 11 games.

Oh, and stop the talk (not directed at you Blackjack) about Lewis being top 10 in 2004 if he played 16, because that isn't true because you are ignoring Portis, Holmes, Pittman, Green, McAllister, Bettis, T.Jones, K. Jones, N. Goings, L. Johnson, C. Brown, and J. Jones. If weare going to say Lewis plays 16, then we have to imagine everyone else does as well.

So in reality, if all RBs had started 16 games, Lewis would have finished 24th since only one of LJ or Holmes would have been in front of him and he would have only passed Fred Taylor in PPG.
Good points but Jamal missed the entire year in 2001 so not really fair to include that year and didn't start 8 other games in that span. Does DD have the potential to have one of the best season's ever like Jamal did just 2 years ago. By the way I'm saying top 15, not top 10. If I were drafting tommorrow I would take Jamal before DD cause I just don't care for him, I don't trust him and I don't think he's that good. No scientific facts here just my gut feeling. Don't you want the people you like on your team, why wouls I want to go out and get people I think are going to bad? That's a pretty dumb question. Let's see I think DD is going to suck so I better draft him? Of course I'm going to like the people on my team...that's why I have them.
I understand, but I do think it is fair to include 2001. He missed the entire year, so anyone that had him in 2001 basically got nothing.My point about DD, is that if you drafted him last year and picked up Wells for nothing, you had the #6 RB for 2005, better than Portis. Lewis only missed 1 game, so even if you had Taylor you still didn't even have a top 20 RB with Lewis.

In Jamal's dream year of 2003 he was RB4. In DD's only full starting season (15 games) of 2004, he was RB5, so yes I think that DD in fantasy terms can easily best Lewis if he plays 16 games.

By the way, what do mean you by DD sucking? Do you think he is going to miss games or do you think his PPG will go down? Like I said, PPG wise, his 3 year career is around RB7. Lewis' career PPG is around RB16. The Houston RB position has put up much better #'s the past 2 years than Baltimore's and I think it is a good bet that it will continue.

 
[

Do you watch any of the Ravens games? If you actually watch the games, you'd probably see that Lewis is the toughest RB in the league to bring down and runs hard as hell. Hes a special talent, and it isn't always reflected in the numbers.
He wasn't last year, though. I did watch all of the Ravens games & Lewis was waaay too tentative. Granted, the o-line was pitiful & he was getting hit behind the line all too often, but my head nearly exploded every time I watched Jamal do his little stutter-step. He's a down-hill runner, not Barry Sanders.There was kind of a "Perfect Storm" confluence of factors last season that I hope was a one-year thing: putrid blocking, time in the slammer, & Lewis' discontent.
:goodposting: To be honest, who cares in Fantasy world how hard he is to tackle. Guess what, if his O-line sucks then maybe he is a better NFL RB, but that doesn't change the fact that his O-line sucks. I don't remember hearing of too many changes in Baltimore's O-line this off-season so is anything going to change?

Unfortunately, with McNair, Clayton, Heap and Mason, I see the passing game improving a lot, but not much improvement in the running game. This is Billick's first year in Baltimore with a passing game that seems to have weapons close to what he had in Minny.

So unless we see 2003 again, not likely, you are looking at a guy who is good value if you draft him around RB20+. Based on Antsports Lewis is RB17 and going ahead of Droughns, Parker, Dunn, Dillon, and C. Taylor. Outside of 2003, his top shelf is RB12 and his bottom shelf is RB25. That doesn't seem like good value for the 17th RB selected since his last 2 years are both RB25/bottom shelf and RB12 was 4 years ago.

Oh well, I'm out.

 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top