Josh Cribbs "insulted" by Browns latest offer (1 Viewer)

[dickey moe]

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Cribbs insulted by Browns' offer

Associated Press

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Wednesday, Jan. 6, 2010 - 8:35 p.m. ET

CLEVELAND -- Pro Bowler Josh Cribbs feels insulted by the Cleveland Browns' latest contract offer and intends to clean out his locker.

Agent Peter Schaffer said Wednesday night that the Browns failed to live up to previous promises they made to Cribbs. Schaffer said there is "no more middle ground" and that he is "extremely shocked" that new president Mike Holmgren would not understand Cribbs' value to the Browns.

"I'm not threatening anything," Schaffer said. "Josh is either going to be treated fairly or he wants out. He's going there (to the team's facility) tomorrow to clean out his locker."

Schaffer said he gave the Browns until the end of the business day to come up with a better deal than the $1.4 million per year they offered. Cribbs has three years remaining on a six-year, $6.77 million deal.

But Schaffer said Dawn Aponte, the team's vice president of football administration who handles contract negotiations, did not get back to him. The Browns could be excused with more pressing issues since Holmgren just took over on Tuesday and is in the process of deciding whether to bring back coach Eric Mangini.

Cribbs said last month that the team had promised to give him a new contract by the end of the season. Even in the days leading up to Cleveland's season finale against Jacksonville, Cribbs remained optimistic that something would get done.

However, the Browns have not come through. Schaffer and Cribbs' other agent, J.R. Rickert, said they did not want to take things public, but that the team left them no choice.

"I'm extremely shocked," Schaffer said. "I have tremendous respect for Mike Holmgren. I know he knows how to put a team together. I was optimistic that with him coming aboard that he would understand and that Josh would be rewarded. To see there is no change in their position is insulting."

On Tuesday, Holmgren said he had contact with Cribbs' representatives when he was at home in Arizona. He intimated that he planned to take care of Cribbs, but only after fair negotiations.

"I believe players should be rewarded for what they do," he said. "I have no problems with that at all. What happens though on occasion is our view of how much that should be and the agent's view of how much that should be differs. We have made an effort.

"We will continue to make an effort to handle Josh's situation. I want Josh here."

Cribbs was Cleveland's most valuable player this season. He played wide receiver, quarterback and returned and covered kickoffs and punts. The former college QB also set the NFL career record for most kickoff returns for touchdowns.

Also on rtsports:

Agent Says Cribbs Insulted by Browns Offer to Pay Him $1.4 Mil Per Year

Posted by Matt Loede under Cleveland Browns

cribbs

It looked a few days back like Josh Cribbs was going to get a deal done with the Browns and stay happy. Now, there seems to be a division that may end Cribbs’ career in a Browns uniform. Reports are the Browns offered Cribbs a deal that would pay him $1.4 million a year.

His agent, Peter Schaffer, says that his client will demand a trade away from Cleveland if a better offer isn’t made. “They need to treat him fairly or he’ll never play for the Browns again,” Schaffer said in the Plain Dealer. “He will demand a trade and he will walk out of there and they won’t see him for the off-season — they won’t see him ever again.”

“We’re done,” said Schaffer. “There’s no middle ground anymore. We’ve upheld our end of the bargain.” The ongoing feud between Cribbs and the Browns has been headed for a showdown for awhile. He wanted a new deal before the season started, and he didn’t get it.

Instead he went out, played ball, and was the best player on the club. Now, it looks like unless things change in a hurry, there will be no more kick returns for scores from the former Kent State star.

The agent forwarded an email he sent to Browns in regard to his client – “1.4 million dollars per year for a player of Josh’s caliber and character is not only insulting it is unjustifiable under any objective criteria. Further given the three years of history of this matter and the incredibly strong and powerful grassroots support for Josh, we will see how this turns out. Again this is not a threat, we are given the team every chance to respond but given continued silence then we will have no choice. Thanks I am in my office or on my cell all day. Peter

“If you have any questions or wish to discuss this e mail in any further detail, please do not hesitate to call or e mail me. Please have yourself a wonderful and happy day.

“Yours Very Truly,

Peter J. Schaffer, Esq.”

Hmm.

 

[FUBAR]

What does Hester make? Cribbs is probably worth $2.5-3M IMO

Okay, I'm obviously way off on what players make. I don't think he should get $10M, but if Hester's getting that, maybe I'm wrong.

 

[AhrnCityPahnder]

What does Hester make? Cribbs is probably worth $2.5-3M IMO

Hester signed an extension in mid 2008: 4 years, $41M.Cribbs is worth a lot more than $3M, and he's right to feel insulted at $1.4M offer. Hell, he should just wait three months...The Browns wind up trading away anyone on their team who's halfway decent anyway.

 

[Anonymous Internet User]

What does Hester make? Cribbs is probably worth $2.5-3M IMO

Hester signed an extension in mid 2008: 4 years, $41M.Cribbs is worth a lot more than $3M, and he's right to feel insulted at $1.4M offer. Hell, he should just wait three months...The Browns wind up trading away anyone on their team who's halfway decent anyway.

I still can't believe they shipped out Charlie Frye!

 

[ratbast]

I tried typing all kinds of posts but I can only say wow and scratch my head...

This is the type of move that is so obviously bad for a franchise that I feel sorry for the fans.

 

[Routilla]

Is Cribbs a FA or an UFA?

 

[certificate]

That's crazy. Barely even a raise (by NFL standards)

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

Holmgren would be getting off on the wrong foot with Browns fans if he let Cribbs get away. I'm pretty sure they would have gone winless this year without Cribbs.

 

[lyon812]

Holmgren would be getting off on the wrong foot with Browns fans if he let Cribbs get away. I'm pretty sure they would have gone winless this year without Cribbs.

Nah, there was that Buffalo game. Cribbs 2-30 kickoff, 3-7 punts. But still, that offer honestly is insulting.

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

Holmgren would be getting off on the wrong foot with Browns fans if he let Cribbs get away. I'm pretty sure they would have gone winless this year without Cribbs.

Nah, there was that Buffalo game. Cribbs 2-30 kickoff, 3-7 punts. But still, that offer honestly is insulting.

He did have a 31-yard run in that epic struggle.

 

[lyon812]

Holmgren would be getting off on the wrong foot with Browns fans if he let Cribbs get away. I'm pretty sure they would have gone winless this year without Cribbs.

Nah, there was that Buffalo game. Cribbs 2-30 kickoff, 3-7 punts. But still, that offer honestly is insulting.

He did have a 31-yard run in that epic struggle.

True. That's also 8 more yards than Anderson had passing. They should have just run the Wildcat all game.

 

[ang12]

He's a kick returner with 3 years left on his deal. Let him sit out if he feels so insulted.

 

[SuperAwesomeDude]

He's a kick returner with 3 years left on his deal. Let him sit out if he feels so insulted.

he signed the contract right? sadly this isnt how it works though. he can make a scene and be a distration until they trade him and some other team pays him.

 

[nxmehta]

Is Cribbs a FA or an UFA?

Neither, he has three years left on his current deal.The consequences of not paying Josh Cribbs are much greater than losing him as a player. Holmgren will have a virtual mutiny from the players who will see that on field performance doesn't matter to the Browns. Either that, or they just won't give any effort. I would have thought a former coach like Holmgren would have understood that.Also, this isn't the Patriots over here in Cleveland where you can just lowball people and move on. Josh Cribbs is maybe the only really good offensive weapon that's come through here in the last decade. It's not like we'll have a lot left if we force him out.

 

[Ditkaless Wonders]

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Cribbs insulted by Browns' offer

Associated Press

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Wednesday, Jan. 6, 2010 - 8:35 p.m. ET

CLEVELAND -- Pro Bowler Josh Cribbs feels insulted by the Cleveland Browns' latest contract offer and intends to clean out his locker.

Agent Peter Schaffer said Wednesday night that the Browns failed to live up to previous promises they made to Cribbs. Schaffer said there is "no more middle ground" and that he is "extremely shocked" that new president Mike Holmgren would not understand Cribbs' value to the Browns.

"I'm not threatening anything," Schaffer said. "Josh is either going to be treated fairly or he wants out. He's going there (to the team's facility) tomorrow to clean out his locker."

Schaffer said he gave the Browns until the end of the business day to come up with a better deal than the $1.4 million per year they offered. Cribbs has three years remaining on a six-year, $6.77 million deal.

But Schaffer said Dawn Aponte, the team's vice president of football administration who handles contract negotiations, did not get back to him. The Browns could be excused with more pressing issues since Holmgren just took over on Tuesday and is in the process of deciding whether to bring back coach Eric Mangini.

Cribbs said last month that the team had promised to give him a new contract by the end of the season. Even in the days leading up to Cleveland's season finale against Jacksonville, Cribbs remained optimistic that something would get done.

However, the Browns have not come through. Schaffer and Cribbs' other agent, J.R. Rickert, said they did not want to take things public, but that the team left them no choice.

"I'm extremely shocked," Schaffer said. "I have tremendous respect for Mike Holmgren. I know he knows how to put a team together. I was optimistic that with him coming aboard that he would understand and that Josh would be rewarded. To see there is no change in their position is insulting."

On Tuesday, Holmgren said he had contact with Cribbs' representatives when he was at home in Arizona. He intimated that he planned to take care of Cribbs, but only after fair negotiations.

"I believe players should be rewarded for what they do," he said. "I have no problems with that at all. What happens though on occasion is our view of how much that should be and the agent's view of how much that should be differs. We have made an effort.

"We will continue to make an effort to handle Josh's situation. I want Josh here."

Cribbs was Cleveland's most valuable player this season. He played wide receiver, quarterback and returned and covered kickoffs and punts. The former college QB also set the NFL career record for most kickoff returns for touchdowns.

Also on rtsports:

Agent Says Cribbs Insulted by Browns Offer to Pay Him $1.4 Mil Per Year

Posted by Matt Loede under Cleveland Browns

cribbs

It looked a few days back like Josh Cribbs was going to get a deal done with the Browns and stay happy. Now, there seems to be a division that may end Cribbs’ career in a Browns uniform. Reports are the Browns offered Cribbs a deal that would pay him $1.4 million a year.

His agent, Peter Schaffer, says that his client will demand a trade away from Cleveland if a better offer isn’t made. “They need to treat him fairly or he’ll never play for the Browns again,” Schaffer said in the Plain Dealer. “He will demand a trade and he will walk out of there and they won’t see him for the off-season — they won’t see him ever again.”

“We’re done,” said Schaffer. “There’s no middle ground anymore. We’ve upheld our end of the bargain.” The ongoing feud between Cribbs and the Browns has been headed for a showdown for awhile. He wanted a new deal before the season started, and he didn’t get it.

Instead he went out, played ball, and was the best player on the club. Now, it looks like unless things change in a hurry, there will be no more kick returns for scores from the former Kent State star.

The agent forwarded an email he sent to Browns in regard to his client – “1.4 million dollars per year for a player of Josh’s caliber and character is not only insulting it is unjustifiable under any objective criteria. Further given the three years of history of this matter and the incredibly strong and powerful grassroots support for Josh, we will see how this turns out. Again this is not a threat, we are given the team every chance to respond but given continued silence then we will have no choice. Thanks I am in my office or on my cell all day. Peter

“If you have any questions or wish to discuss this e mail in any further detail, please do not hesitate to call or e mail me. Please have yourself a wonderful and happy day.

“Yours Very Truly,

Peter J. Schaffer, Esq.”

Hmm.

I understand having errors in posts or e-mails. I do not understand, however, how an attorney/agent, while representing their client to an NFL club through an e-mail, and then releasing that e-mail for publication as was the intent here all along, could write the matter so poorly. Perhaps Cribbs position would be taken more seriously if he had more impressive and competent representation.

 

[Mikey16x]

The only defense I can see Homgren have is the fact that the Browns have SO many holes. To waste precious salary cap on an above-average kick returner is probably not on his priority list. Hell, resigning Jerome Harrison probably isn't high on his priority list. You can find an above-average kick returner for less then 1.4 million a year, not game-changing but above-average. At the end of the day.. Cribbs is a project, gimmick player.. what-have-you. I just think that a team with this many holes needs to invest in something a little more concrete then a kick returner. Hell, if the defense wasn't as bad as it is.. chances are Cribbs doesn't get that many opportunities which would lower his stats. I can see Holmgren not wanting to overspend. I'd offer 2.5 MAX.

 

[H8fulHuck]

Maybe he's using McDaniel's ousting of Cutler as a business model. Seriously, how do you not reward the team's best player after everything he's accomplished over the past 3 years? Pathetic!

 

[BassNBrew]

I understand having errors in posts or e-mails. I do not understand, however, how an attorney/agent, while representing their client to an NFL club through an e-mail, and then releasing that e-mail for publication as was the intent here all along, could write the matter so poorly. Perhaps Cribbs position would be taken more seriously if he had more impressive and competent representation.

Giving your post, I'd say you don't understand the value of havin a happy day.

 

[Chicago Hooligan]

This is pretty much the same stuff Hester, to name one among many guys, said in the early stages of getting a new deal.

I have absolutely no doubt that Cribbs will get his contract and stay with the Browns. You can get other pretty good kick returners but very few players who are worth an extra 2 or 3 wins per season.

 

[jwb]

He's a kick returner with 3 years left on his deal. Let him sit out if he feels so insulted.

he signed the contract right? sadly this isnt how it works though. he can make a scene and be a distration until they trade him and some other team pays him.

Let's take some perspective here - most NFL contracts are not guaranteed. Thus, it's really not much of a contract. I don't buy the "he signed it - he should honor it" line. I would be more sympathetic to the team if contracts were guaranteed. He was the best guy on that team. They should pay him accordingly.

 

[jwb]

I understand having errors in posts or e-mails. I do not understand, however, how an attorney/agent, while representing their client to an NFL club through an e-mail, and then releasing that e-mail for publication as was the intent here all along, could write the matter so poorly. Perhaps Cribbs position would be taken more seriously if he had more impressive and competent representation.

In my experience, Attorneys generally think they are great writers.

 

[Couch Potato]

I think the team must be really pissed at Cribbs. They had the top QB in the upcoming draft in their grasp, and he screwed it up for them.

 

[gradin123]

He's a kick returner with 3 years left on his deal. Let him sit out if he feels so insulted.

But the Browns could cut him at any point and void his contract and pay him nothing if they wanted.I can understand the need of no guaranteed contracts in the NFL but I can also understand the need of underpaid players holding out if they are in their prime and grossly underpaid. The Question is are the Browns better off as an organization to let him sit out and not pay him at least a decent amount? Of course they aren't.I think ultimately they will offer him more.Right now this is still a non-story in my books.

 

[Neil Beaufort Zod]

He's a kick returner with 3 years left on his deal. Let him sit out if he feels so insulted.

he signed the contract right? sadly this isnt how it works though. he can make a scene and be a distration until they trade him and some other team pays him.

I know people say this, but I think that's short-sighted. Yes, he signed the contract, but in the NFL the team sure doesn't have to honor the contract. They can cut him at any time-- contract or not-- and he doesn't get paid for the remaining years. So why should the "contract" bind one party but not the other? This is one rare time I have to agree with an agent. That is an insulting offer. He probably deserves double what they offered.Edit: Didn't see the post above mine which explained the team's lack of obligation regarding a contract.

 

[Addai's Adidas]

He's a kick returner who has already peaked IMO.

 

[FUBAR]

Just curious, what would they likely get if they traded him?

I would love to see him traded to my Titans who desperately need a kick returner. I don't know that they have the right tradeable pieces but maybe...

 

[CanadianNFLJunkie]

I think the biggest difference between Hester and Cribbs is Hester was supposed to be the #2 (if not the #1) WR on the team PLUS return kicks. Cribbs has shown that he can't beat out stiffs like Massoquo or Stuckey, (sure it would help to have a legit QB). He caught TWENTY balls this past year with a lousy SIX POINT EIGHT average!!!

Considering what the team has, sorry Mr. Cribbs, take it or sit out and make nothing. The team has more pressing needs.

 

[Godsbrother]

He's a kick returner with 3 years left on his deal. Let him sit out if he feels so insulted.

he signed the contract right? sadly this isnt how it works though. he can make a scene and be a distration until they trade him and some other team pays him.

Let's take some perspective here - most NFL contracts are not guaranteed. Thus, it's really not much of a contract. I don't buy the "he signed it - he should honor it" line. I would be more sympathetic to the team if contracts were guaranteed. He was the best guy on that team. They should pay him accordingly.

While the salary quotient of NFL contracts are generally not guaranteed the signing bonus is. Cribbs signed a contract and got his bonus money up front and guaranteed. He now wants to renegotiate the deal since he believe is outperforming the contract. I don't blame him but he did sign the contract.Unfortunately for Cribbs if he wants to get paid what he is worth then he has only one option: hold out.

 

[Chicago Hooligan]

I think the biggest difference between Hester and Cribbs is Hester was supposed to be the #2 (if not the #1) WR on the team PLUS return kicks. Cribbs has shown that he can't beat out stiffs like Massoquo or Stuckey, (sure it would help to have a legit QB). He caught TWENTY balls this past year with a lousy SIX POINT EIGHT average!!!

And yet who helped their team more this year? I don't think you can truthfully say it was Hester.

 

[CanadianNFLJunkie]

I think the biggest difference between Hester and Cribbs is Hester was supposed to be the #2 (if not the #1) WR on the team PLUS return kicks. Cribbs has shown that he can't beat out stiffs like Massoquo or Stuckey, (sure it would help to have a legit QB). He caught TWENTY balls this past year with a lousy SIX POINT EIGHT average!!!

And yet who helped their team more this year? I don't think you can truthfully say it was Hester.

I would still say Hester. Cribbs ran the Wildcat and was more flashy, especially of late. Bottom line here STILL is Cribbs isn't worth $2 mill + at this point of his career.

 

[Ravens]

Is Cribbs a FA or an UFA?

Under contract for 3 more years!

 

[Menace]

Cribbs is a great punt returner but that is all he will ever be, so how can u justify giving him tons more money.

 

[Wyld Stallyns]

I think the biggest difference between Hester and Cribbs is Hester was supposed to be the #2 (if not the #1) WR on the team PLUS return kicks. Cribbs has shown that he can't beat out stiffs like Massoquo or Stuckey, (sure it would help to have a legit QB). He caught TWENTY balls this past year with a lousy SIX POINT EIGHT average!!!

And yet who helped their team more this year? I don't think you can truthfully say it was Hester.

I would still say Hester. Cribbs ran the Wildcat and was more flashy, especially of late. Bottom line here STILL is Cribbs isn't worth $2 mill + at this point of his career.

That's the thing - He's been underpaid for a couple seasons now and the Browns keep putting off giving him the raise he's earned. He was actually going to hold out this year but the team told him if he plays ball and honors his contract that they'd take care of him in the offseason. He went out there and had one of his best seasons and now they're lowballing him. Weak. I guess he should've maybe held out in '08 or '09 instead of putting more tread on the tires, but he was trying to get paid what he was worth without becoming a cancer. I for one hope he gets paid, whether it's by the Browns or another team.

 

[ChuckLiddell]

Cribbs is a great punt returner but that is all he will ever be, so how can u justify giving him tons more money.

He would look great in Miami in their WC packages. Ronnie, Ricky, Cribbs - that could be potent. I woudl love to give up Ginn and a 4th rounder. Not sure that is enough.

 

[Moniker]

That's the thing - He's been underpaid for a couple seasons now and the Browns keep putting off giving him the raise he's earned. He was actually going to hold out this year but the team told him if he plays ball and honors his contract that they'd take care of him in the offseason. He went out there and had one of his best seasons and now they're lowballing him. Weak. I guess he should've maybe held out in '08 or '09 instead of putting more tread on the tires, but he was trying to get paid what he was worth without becoming a cancer. I for one hope he gets paid, whether it's by the Browns or another team.

I agree the man should be paid, he's been put off by the Browns for a couple of years, now. The problem is this: How much is he worth? He's flashy and talented on the field for what he does, but that's it. He's a kick returner who can run the wildcat. He hasn't developed into a receiver, hell, he hasn't even shown any signs that he might still develop into a receiver down the road sometime. Although he's a popular player here in Cleveland, we have a lot of needs and it comes down to what's a (very good, if not the best) kick returner who can run the wildcat and not much else worth?

 

[Gatorman]

The dolphins inquired about cribbs before the trade deadline and were given a "no" when asked if they would move him. He resigns with CLE.

 

[switz]

The only defense I can see Homgren have is the fact that the Browns have SO many holes. To waste precious salary cap on an above-average kick returner is probably not on his priority list. Hell, resigning Jerome Harrison probably isn't high on his priority list. You can find an above-average kick returner for less then 1.4 million a year, not game-changing but above-average. At the end of the day.. Cribbs is a project, gimmick player.. what-have-you. I just think that a team with this many holes needs to invest in something a little more concrete then a kick returner. Hell, if the defense wasn't as bad as it is.. chances are Cribbs doesn't get that many opportunities which would lower his stats. I can see Holmgren not wanting to overspend. I'd offer 2.5 MAX.

I totally disagree. Harrison and Cribbs could be the Browns backfield for a few years. It would be cheaper IMO to lock them up than it would be to invest a high pick in an RB, or to sign a FA RB.

 

[dancingbones]

He's a kick returner with 3 years left on his deal. Let him sit out if he feels so insulted.

But the Browns could cut him at any point and void his contract and pay him nothing if they wanted.I can understand the need of no guaranteed contracts in the NFL but I can also understand the need of underpaid players holding out if they are in their prime and grossly underpaid. The Question is are the Browns better off as an organization to let him sit out and not pay him at least a decent amount? Of course they aren't.I think ultimately they will offer him more.Right now this is still a non-story in my books.

 

[Moniker]

The only defense I can see Homgren have is the fact that the Browns have SO many holes. To waste precious salary cap on an above-average kick returner is probably not on his priority list. Hell, resigning Jerome Harrison probably isn't high on his priority list. You can find an above-average kick returner for less then 1.4 million a year, not game-changing but above-average. At the end of the day.. Cribbs is a project, gimmick player.. what-have-you. I just think that a team with this many holes needs to invest in something a little more concrete then a kick returner. Hell, if the defense wasn't as bad as it is.. chances are Cribbs doesn't get that many opportunities which would lower his stats. I can see Holmgren not wanting to overspend. I'd offer 2.5 MAX.

I totally disagree. Harrison and Cribbs could be the Browns backfield for a few years. It would be cheaper IMO to lock them up than it would be to invest a high pick in an RB, or to sign a FA RB.

Harrison really isn't that good. I know that's blasphemy on this board, lately, as he's one of the most over-hyped players now, but he can't do any of the things that a starting running back needs to be able to do. Did he have a couple of good games running the ball - sure, but in reality he's slow to the hole and lacks vision even in that facet of being a running back.Cribbs is just a kick returner who can run the wildcat and a few gadget plays. As I said before, the guy deserves a raise - without a doubt - but he's not worth 5 million/year.

 

[gianmarco]

That's the thing - He's been underpaid for a couple seasons now and the Browns keep putting off giving him the raise he's earned. He was actually going to hold out this year but the team told him if he plays ball and honors his contract that they'd take care of him in the offseason. He went out there and had one of his best seasons and now they're lowballing him. Weak. I guess he should've maybe held out in '08 or '09 instead of putting more tread on the tires, but he was trying to get paid what he was worth without becoming a cancer.

I for one hope he gets paid, whether it's by the Browns or another team.

I agree the man should be paid, he's been put off by the Browns for a couple of years, now. The problem is this: How much is he worth? He's flashy and talented on the field for what he does, but that's it. He's a kick returner who can run the wildcat. He hasn't developed into a receiver, hell, he hasn't even shown any signs that he might still develop into a receiver down the road sometime. Although he's a popular player here in Cleveland, we have a lot of needs and it comes down to what's a (very good, if not the best) kick returner who can run the wildcat and not much else worth?

It's about market value. When Hester is making $10 million/year (granted, he's also now playing WR but he signed that contract before the 2008 season) and they are offering Cribbs $1.3 million, that's not even remotely close to fair market value. It's, in a word, "insulting".I don't know what his true value is, but it lies somewhere between $1.3 million and $10 million. It's probably closer to the $10 million side considering the contributions he's made and the promises the Browns made. Even if he isn't worth that much, that's market value and you have to suck it up.

 

[Moniker]

That's the thing - He's been underpaid for a couple seasons now and the Browns keep putting off giving him the raise he's earned. He was actually going to hold out this year but the team told him if he plays ball and honors his contract that they'd take care of him in the offseason. He went out there and had one of his best seasons and now they're lowballing him. Weak. I guess he should've maybe held out in '08 or '09 instead of putting more tread on the tires, but he was trying to get paid what he was worth without becoming a cancer.

I for one hope he gets paid, whether it's by the Browns or another team.

I agree the man should be paid, he's been put off by the Browns for a couple of years, now. The problem is this: How much is he worth? He's flashy and talented on the field for what he does, but that's it. He's a kick returner who can run the wildcat. He hasn't developed into a receiver, hell, he hasn't even shown any signs that he might still develop into a receiver down the road sometime. Although he's a popular player here in Cleveland, we have a lot of needs and it comes down to what's a (very good, if not the best) kick returner who can run the wildcat and not much else worth?

It's about market value. When Hester is making $10 million/year (granted, he's also now playing WR but he signed that contract before the 2008 season) and they are offering Cribbs $1.3 million, that's not even remotely close to fair market value. It's, in a word, "insulting".I don't know what his true value is, but it lies somewhere between $1.3 million and $10 million. It's probably closer to the $10 million side considering the contributions he's made and the promises the Browns made. Even if he isn't worth that much, that's market value and you have to suck it up.

It's only the market value if other teams believe it is - see the Roy Williams trade. As to Hester, he barely does returns anymore. He's a receiver - maybe even an overpaid receiver. The Chargers also made a mistake by overpaying for their kick returner - and I'm pretty sure that they, and most other teams, know it. Cribbs, in my opinion, is worth about what the Jets were offering Leon Washington in the offseason - about 3.5 million.

 

[Sweet Love]

He's a kick returner who has already peaked IMO.

I have to say I agree with this. While he should get more than 2 mill/year, I also believe the Hester money was a little out of whack. I understand a dynamic kick returner can add a lot to team and can alter a game, I also feel that it is strange that arguably the three most dynamic kick returners in NFL history played in the last 6 six years (Hall, Hester, Cribbs). This may just be pure circumstance, but with three, I think it is becoming a trend, and if it is, Cribbs was just unluckly that he was the last guy in this great run of returners we have seen as far as getting a big contract goes. I think teams are starting to think these guys are out there now and why pay a guy 40 million when you have a chance to draft him in the 2nd or 3rd round. I also think it is interesting that in three years under three separate regimes, he still has not gotten his contract renegotiated.Now Cribbs is special compared to Hall and even Hester in that (1) he is a better kick returner than either of those two were (2) can run the wildcat or act as a RB (which the other two could not), and (3) at least compared to Hall is a better receiver. He also is a popular player in the city of Cleveland when they have had little to cheer about, so that adds value, but I still don't see breaking the bank for the guy. With 8 kick return TDs, he is the NFL leader all-time. How many more do people expect him to get? I just feel these guys peak very quickly and fall at the same rate (whatever happened to Hall who just 5 years ago was discussed as an NFL MVP candidate), so I would be hesitant to deliver the aroured car to their doorstep.Also, this is a little off topic, but still relates; How does one value what a kick returner brings as far as the game goes. I know that teams alter the way they kick/punt, thereby giving up some yards or facing the chance they run it back, but how many yards on average, does a Hester or Cribbs bring over a guy like Leon Washington or Sproles (maybe not the best example as they are valuable in the running game too, but maybe even whoever returns kicks for Houston or KC, just to throw some teams out there)? I remember in the 90s Jason Elam had about 5 more yards on his leg when kicking field goals than anyone else in the NFL (which would equal about 10%)...Does Hester or Cribbs add more than 10% more yards over the course of the year than the next guys? Even if they do, do they deserve 10X the money that the average kick returner gets?

 

[gianmarco]

That's the thing - He's been underpaid for a couple seasons now and the Browns keep putting off giving him the raise he's earned. He was actually going to hold out this year but the team told him if he plays ball and honors his contract that they'd take care of him in the offseason. He went out there and had one of his best seasons and now they're lowballing him. Weak. I guess he should've maybe held out in '08 or '09 instead of putting more tread on the tires, but he was trying to get paid what he was worth without becoming a cancer.

I for one hope he gets paid, whether it's by the Browns or another team.

I agree the man should be paid, he's been put off by the Browns for a couple of years, now. The problem is this: How much is he worth? He's flashy and talented on the field for what he does, but that's it. He's a kick returner who can run the wildcat. He hasn't developed into a receiver, hell, he hasn't even shown any signs that he might still develop into a receiver down the road sometime. Although he's a popular player here in Cleveland, we have a lot of needs and it comes down to what's a (very good, if not the best) kick returner who can run the wildcat and not much else worth?

It's about market value. When Hester is making $10 million/year (granted, he's also now playing WR but he signed that contract before the 2008 season) and they are offering Cribbs $1.3 million, that's not even remotely close to fair market value. It's, in a word, "insulting".I don't know what his true value is, but it lies somewhere between $1.3 million and $10 million. It's probably closer to the $10 million side considering the contributions he's made and the promises the Browns made. Even if he isn't worth that much, that's market value and you have to suck it up.

It's only the market value if other teams believe it is - see the Roy Williams trade. As to Hester, he barely does returns anymore. He's a receiver - maybe even an overpaid receiver. The Chargers also made a mistake by overpaying for their kick returner - and I'm pretty sure that they, and most other teams, know it. Cribbs, in my opinion, is worth about what the Jets were offering Leon Washington in the offseason - about 3.5 million.

Sorry, but that's incorrect. It's market value whether or not the team believes it is. What the TEAM thinks is irrelevant to what market value is. Now, they may not agree with it and can certainly choose to not pay market value, but they will likely be without Cribbs from now on. Also, under the assumption that he would play for the last couple years was that the Browns would work on renegotiating. There's a certain expectation with that and the Browns look absolutely classless on their end as a result.Now, I'm not saying Cribbs should get $10 million/year. However, the league minimum for Cribbs is $600k. They are offering Cribbs only double the league minimum. How ANYONE can defend that for the BEST PLAYER ON THE TEAM is beyond me. Especially when so many players hold out, they've been stringing him along, he puts out his best year, almost gets injured severely, and this is the offer they make? There's a reason the Browns are what they are.

 

[daveR]

I'm always astounded at people speaking boldly out of ignorance. To say that Cribbs is "only a kick returner" is just nuts!

On a tangent, how does 2010 being an "uncapped" year affect this negotiation?

 

[nxmehta]

1. Cribbs is the best kick/punt returner in the NFL.

2. Cribbs is arguably the best special teams coverage man in the NFL. I don't have the numbers but in the last 3 years he's got to be top 5 in the NFL in tackles.

3. Cribbs has a career rushing average of 6.5 ypc and rushed for almost 400 yards this season.

4. Cribbs plays KR, PR, WR and RB.

5. Cribbs is EASILY worth +2-3 wins a year just by himself.

How the hell is paying him more than $1.4 million a year "overpaying" for him?!?! FYI, Ryan Pontbriand, OUR LONG SNAPPER, made $5 million this year. To those who are saying that he doesn't deserve more money because he's just a KR/PR- are you serious?

 

[daveR]

Cribbs was team MVP by a mile! In fact, the only other player deserving of consideration was Joe Thomas. I can't even name a third!

 

[Stillers Jr.]

As a Stiller fan, I truly hope the Browns mgmt plan to play hardball with Cribbs.



The guys is amazing...and to whoever said he's "just" a punt returner...even if that's true, and I disagree, he single handedly won them a few games b/c of his kick/punt returning abilities. Not many players can say that.

Hopefully this gets ugly, the Browns are forced trade him to the NFC for next to nothing and they can deal with him for a few seasons.

 

[Mr. Retukes]

While the salary quotient of NFL contracts are generally not guaranteed the signing bonus is. Cribbs signed a contract and got his bonus money up front and guaranteed. He now wants to renegotiate the deal since he believe is outperforming the contract. I don't blame him but he did sign the contract.

Then the fairest thing to do is for Cribbs to return a pro-rated portion of his signing bonus.

 

[Moniker]

It's only the market value if other teams believe it is - see the Roy Williams trade. As to Hester, he barely does returns anymore. He's a receiver - maybe even an overpaid receiver. The Chargers also made a mistake by overpaying for their kick returner - and I'm pretty sure that they, and most other teams, know it. Cribbs, in my opinion, is worth about what the Jets were offering Leon Washington in the offseason - about 3.5 million.

Sorry, but that's incorrect. It's market value whether or not the team believes it is. What the TEAM thinks is irrelevant to what market value is. Now, they may not agree with it and can certainly choose to not pay market value, but they will likely be without Cribbs from now on. Also, under the assumption that he would play for the last couple years was that the Browns would work on renegotiating. There's a certain expectation with that and the Browns look absolutely classless on their end as a result.Now, I'm not saying Cribbs should get $10 million/year. However, the league minimum for Cribbs is $600k. They are offering Cribbs only double the league minimum. How ANYONE can defend that for the BEST PLAYER ON THE TEAM is beyond me. Especially when so many players hold out, they've been stringing him along, he puts out his best year, almost gets injured severely, and this is the offer they make? There's a reason the Browns are what they are.

Usually, you and I agree on most things here - but market value isn't some number made by the player - it's determined by the teams. If no team is willing to pay Cribbs the type of money he thinks he's worth then he's not worth it - it's just that simple.I've been both a Saints and Browns fan all of my life (I live in Cleveland) and I can surely say with all certainty that I agree with you that the Browns look totally classless in these three years of negotiating with Cribbs. No doubt in my mind.As to Cribbs being the best player on the Browns -- while true, it isn't saying much. While I like Cribbs and love the way he plays the game, he's not worth the kind of money he's apparently looking for - he's worth more (probably just over double) than the Browns offered, but nowhere near the 10million that Hester fleeced the Bears for.

 

[Moniker]

1. Cribbs is the best kick/punt returner in the NFL.2. Cribbs is arguably the best special teams coverage man in the NFL. I don't have the numbers but in the last 3 years he's got to be top 5 in the NFL in tackles.3. Cribbs has a career rushing average of 6.5 ypc and rushed for almost 400 yards this season.4. Cribbs plays KR, PR, WR and RB.5. Cribbs is EASILY worth +2-3 wins a year just by himself.How the hell is paying him more than $1.4 million a year "overpaying" for him?!?! FYI, Ryan Pontbriand, OUR LONG SNAPPER, made $5 million this year. To those who are saying that he doesn't deserve more money because he's just a KR/PR- are you serious?

I agree with all five of your points, with a few considerations:1. No doubt about it2. Again, no doubt in my mind3. I don't put much stock in a ypc which is comprised mostly of gadget plays4. Yes, he plays all four of those positions, but only KR and PR well. He's, quite possibly, the worst route runner that I've ever seen and can barely get seperation from a linebacker.5. I also agree that Cribbs as a returner and part-time gadget player is worth at least +1 win per year and maybe even 2 -- which is why I believe that he's a kick returner who actually deserves to be paid.With all of this said - an all I've been saying all thread - is that he's not worth more than 3-4million/year. We have too many holes to fill and as the team gets better we will need to rely less and less on the wildcat formation left offtackle play that we run five-seven times every game.