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Khiry Robinson is CLEARLY the best Saints RB (1 Viewer)

A

Ack88

Footballguy
Know he's been written about before on these boards, but he's impressive. Very smart, slippery runner who hits the hole decisively and has a nice burst.

 
Ack88 said:
Know he's been written about before on these boards, but he's impressive. Very smart, slippery runner who hits the hole decisively and has a nice burst.
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Just thought I should let you know this is a trap.

They are all bad, every former saints RB is also bad.

Exception, healthy Sproles.

 
I think he's legit. He impressed me today. Given the volume of rbs they have and Peyton's proclivity to mix and match, he may never gain fantasy traction, but I like him.

 
He is a solid runner with good vision. looked good today but needs to develop other areas of his game if he wants to see more reps. Right now Ingram is ahead of him in that department but then again coughing up a football on your 20 in a playoff game will set your standing with the coach back a bit. So who knows going forward.

 
I liked what I saw from him but seems like an almost impossible scenario to predict except maybe for Sproles and possibly PT who always seems to be undervalued. Is Ingram a FA this season or next season?

 
It's obvious Payton needs to learn how to stop rotatig guys. They're all pretty great when they get consistent carries, but he inexplicably pulls them out. It was absolutely absurd he gave Ingram the entire first drive of the second half after what Robinson had been doing.

 
valhallan said:
It's obvious Payton needs to learn how to stop rotatig guys. They're all pretty great when they get consistent carries, but he inexplicably pulls them out. It was absolutely absurd he gave Ingram the entire first drive of the second half after what Robinson had been doing.
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Disagree strongly, both had excellent games(fumble excluded). Neither is good enough to keep the other off the field, so keep them fresh.

 
Zigg said:
valhallan said:
It's obvious Payton needs to learn how to stop rotatig guys. They're all pretty great when they get consistent carries, but he inexplicably pulls them out. It was absolutely absurd he gave Ingram the entire first drive of the second half after what Robinson had been doing.
Click to expand...
Disagree strongly, both had excellent games(fumble excluded). Neither is good enough to keep the other off the field, so keep them fresh.
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It was the first drive after halftime. Robinson was fresh.Loomis himself said in an interview this week that all Mark needed was the consistent carries. That's how RBs work. Payton needs to pick one and let him play until he needs a breather, not leave him on the sidelines for entire drives.

 
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valhallan said:
Zigg said:
valhallan said:
It's obvious Payton needs to learn how to stop rotatig guys. They're all pretty great when they get consistent carries, but he inexplicably pulls them out. It was absolutely absurd he gave Ingram the entire first drive of the second half after what Robinson had been doing.
Click to expand...
Disagree strongly, both had excellent games(fumble excluded). Neither is good enough to keep the other off the field, so keep them fresh.
Click to expand...
It was the first drive after halftime. Robinson was fresh.Loomis himself said in an interview this week that all Mark needed was the consistent carries. That's how RBs work. Payton needs to pick one and let him play until he needs a breather, not leave him on the sidelines for entire drives.
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That "entire" drive was 5 plays, so I wouldn't call that "absolutely absurd" that Robinson didn't get in there.

That being said, I'll never understand their RB usage. I actually think it's better when they give guys the entire drive- it gives them more of a chance to get into a rhythm- but so many times I see one of their RBs take a carry and then run off the field.

 
valhallan said:
Zigg said:
valhallan said:
It's obvious Payton needs to learn how to stop rotatig guys. They're all pretty great when they get consistent carries, but he inexplicably pulls them out. It was absolutely absurd he gave Ingram the entire first drive of the second half after what Robinson had been doing.
Click to expand...
Disagree strongly, both had excellent games(fumble excluded). Neither is good enough to keep the other off the field, so keep them fresh.
Click to expand...
It was the first drive after halftime. Robinson was fresh.Loomis himself said in an interview this week that all Mark needed was the consistent carries. That's how RBs work. Payton needs to pick one and let him play until he needs a breather, not leave him on the sidelines for entire drives.
Click to expand...
Agree to disagree, unless you have a stud, a rotation of good RBs can be very effective and tough to prepare for.

 
Zigg said:
valhallan said:
Zigg said:
valhallan said:
It's obvious Payton needs to learn how to stop rotatig guys. They're all pretty great when they get consistent carries, but he inexplicably pulls them out. It was absolutely absurd he gave Ingram the entire first drive of the second half after what Robinson had been doing.
Click to expand...
Disagree strongly, both had excellent games(fumble excluded). Neither is good enough to keep the other off the field, so keep them fresh.
Click to expand...
It was the first drive after halftime. Robinson was fresh.Loomis himself said in an interview this week that all Mark needed was the consistent carries. That's how RBs work. Payton needs to pick one and let him play until he needs a breather, not leave him on the sidelines for entire drives.
Click to expand...
Agree to disagree, unless you have a stud, a rotation of good RBs can be very effective and tough to prepare for.
Click to expand...
Certainly, but we'll never know who's a stud if they don't get workhorse carries. I mean, Bush has been downright studly since he left.
 
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The sign in the front yard reads…"FF owners should avoid most Saints RB" I know they had 2 RBs with 70+ receptions, I owned Sproles int he FFPC, I'm telling you that despite 70 receptions he was largely not good.

I would not get excited about Robinson, in fact him being on the field and trying to run the ball and get the team back into the football game, great story but I thought more of an indictment of New Orleans and reasons to question the coach down in New Orleans.

 
Not sure if it 's been discussed elsewhere, but I keep hearing that Parcells compared Khiry to Curtis Martin.

I thought it was maybe too much, but is there any there there?

I kept thinking he looked like he could bust one any moment vs the Hawks.

Any observations just in general in playing style and what to expect for next year?

 
Breesisdaman said:
He is a solid runner with good vision. looked good today but needs to develop other areas of his game if he wants to see more reps. Right now Ingram is ahead of him in that department but then again coughing up a football on your 20 in a playoff game will set your standing with the coach back a bit. So who knows going forward.
Click to expand...
Robinson had a clear fumble as well, but the refs blew the call and the Hawks failed to challenge it.

 
Doesn't matter how good he is or can be. Saints use of RB's is laughable. Pierre Thomas is a helluva lot more similar to Curtis Martin than Robinson and his skills have been wasted in New Orleans.

 
Two Deep said:
Doesn't matter how good he is or can be. Saints use of RB's is laughable. Pierre Thomas is a helluva lot more similar to Curtis Martin than Robinson and his skills have been wasted in New Orleans.
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They got over 2500 YFS out of their RBs this year dude. The RBBC sucks for FF, sure, but it works just fine from an NFL perspective.

 
Coeur de Lion said:
Two Deep said:
Doesn't matter how good he is or can be. Saints use of RB's is laughable. Pierre Thomas is a helluva lot more similar to Curtis Martin than Robinson and his skills have been wasted in New Orleans.
Click to expand...
They got over 2500 YFS out of their RBs this year dude. The RBBC sucks for FF, sure, but it works just fine from an NFL perspective.
Click to expand...
They had more than KC, which might surprise some people.

 
Dr. Octopus said:
Breesisdaman said:
He is a solid runner with good vision. looked good today but needs to develop other areas of his game if he wants to see more reps. Right now Ingram is ahead of him in that department but then again coughing up a football on your 20 in a playoff game will set your standing with the coach back a bit. So who knows going forward.
Click to expand...
Robinson had a clear fumble as well, but the refs blew the call and the Hawks failed to challenge it.
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as a seahawk fan, no he didnt fumble...he was tripped with a bare hand about 2 steps before stumbling down untouched...the call would have stood imo. i was frustrated why they didnt challenge, all the replays showed him AFTER the hand tripped him , had to rewind back one more second.

 
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Two Deep said:
Doesn't matter how good he is or can be. Saints use of RB's is laughable. Pierre Thomas is a helluva lot more similar to Curtis Martin than Robinson and his skills have been wasted in New Orleans.
Click to expand...
I would agree, Pierre should have been used more over Bush and Ingram. But his body of work is 90% complete and he not close to Curtis Martin, statistically or talent wise. All it took was four meaningless carries at the end of the Arizona game for me to add Khiry to all three of my dynasty teams. He had a good preseason, looked like the best runner on the team. Those four carries were enough confirmation for me. We don't know what he might turn out to be. He is in direct competition with Ingram who played much better this year. So much so, my initial thought was/is PED's. So, far Khiry hasn't shown that he can take some those 140 receptions Pierre and Sproles shared. Though I would give him a leg up on Ingram in that respect, because Ingram has shown the hands are not that good and blocking is just average.
 
Nero said:
Two Deep said:
Doesn't matter how good he is or can be. Saints use of RB's is laughable. Pierre Thomas is a helluva lot more similar to Curtis Martin than Robinson and his skills have been wasted in New Orleans.
Click to expand...
I would agree, Pierre should have been used more over Bush and Ingram. But his body of work is 90% complete and he not close to Curtis Martin, statistically or talent wise. All it took was four meaningless carries at the end of the Arizona game for me to add Khiry to all three of my dynasty teams. He had a good preseason, looked like the best runner on the team. Those four carries were enough confirmation for me. We don't know what he might turn out to be. He is in direct competition with Ingram who played much better this year. So much so, my initial thought was/is PED's. So, far Khiry hasn't shown that he can take some those 140 receptions Pierre and Sproles shared. Though I would give him a leg up on Ingram in that respect, because Ingram has shown the hands are not that good and blocking is just average.
Click to expand...
If you give Thomas the attempts that Martin had it may be a different story. Without looking Thomas probably never rushed the ball more than 125 times in a year.

 
Two Deep said:
Nero said:
Two Deep said:
Doesn't matter how good he is or can be. Saints use of RB's is laughable. Pierre Thomas is a helluva lot more similar to Curtis Martin than Robinson and his skills have been wasted in New Orleans.
Click to expand...
I would agree, Pierre should have been used more over Bush and Ingram. But his body of work is 90% complete and he not close to Curtis Martin, statistically or talent wise. All it took was four meaningless carries at the end of the Arizona game for me to add Khiry to all three of my dynasty teams. He had a good preseason, looked like the best runner on the team. Those four carries were enough confirmation for me. We don't know what he might turn out to be. He is in direct competition with Ingram who played much better this year. So much so, my initial thought was/is PED's. So, far Khiry hasn't shown that he can take some those 140 receptions Pierre and Sproles shared. Though I would give him a leg up on Ingram in that respect, because Ingram has shown the hands are not that good and blocking is just average.
Click to expand...
If you give Thomas the attempts that Martin had it may be a different story. Without looking Thomas probably never rushed the ball more than 125 times in a year.
Click to expand...
If you replaced Pierre Thomas with Martin, Martin would have had 300 carries. Pierre has good vision and balance and is an awesome 3rd down back. However, he is not good enough to have gotten the touches Martin would have gotten. There is a reason the Saints were always trying to replace him.
 
Run It Up said:
Ack88 said:
Know he's been written about before on these boards, but he's impressive. Very smart, slippery runner who hits the hole decisively and has a nice burst.
Click to expand...
Just thought I should let you know this is a trap.

They are all bad, every former saints RB is also bad.

Exception, healthy Sproles.
Click to expand...
Maybe Sproles, circa 2011, because he has lost his burst. I saw no explosion out of him for at least the last 1/2 of the season. I would not be surprised if he gets cut this offseason.

 
Sean Payton needs to just pick a guy and play him, seems to me he gets way too cute with his packages.

Let a runner get some touches, get some carries and get in a rhythm. Shuffling people in and out all time seems to be a waste

 
Nero said:
Two Deep said:
Doesn't matter how good he is or can be. Saints use of RB's is laughable. Pierre Thomas is a helluva lot more similar to Curtis Martin than Robinson and his skills have been wasted in New Orleans.
Click to expand...
I would agree, Pierre should have been used more over Bush and Ingram. But his body of work is 90% complete and he not close to Curtis Martin, statistically or talent wise. All it took was four meaningless carries at the end of the Arizona game for me to add Khiry to all three of my dynasty teams. He had a good preseason, looked like the best runner on the team. Those four carries were enough confirmation for me. We don't know what he might turn out to be. He is in direct competition with Ingram who played much better this year. So much so, my initial thought was/is PED's. So, far Khiry hasn't shown that he can take some those 140 receptions Pierre and Sproles shared. Though I would give him a leg up on Ingram in that respect, because Ingram has shown the hands are not that good and blocking is just average.
Click to expand...
Comparing him to Martin is a stretch since he doesn't have Martin's straight line speed but both are/were extremely quick on the field and make people miss. His elusiveness is what stands out to me about Robinson since it's looks easy for him to beat someone to pick up an extra 5-10 yards.

 
bicycle_seat_sniffer said:
Sean Payton needs to just pick a guy and play him, seems to me he gets way too cute with his packages.

Let a runner get some touches, get some carries and get in a rhythm. Shuffling people in and out all time seems to be a waste
Click to expand...
Substituting RBs isn't the problem. Empty backfield on the road against great pass rushes with mediocre tackles and bad WRs is. Every single play against Seattle should have been a run from a running formation or play action. Empty backfield and shotgun should have been tossed out of the playbook.

Both backs and the run blocking looked great. They had tremendous success running the ball, and that roll-out play to Josh Hill was wide open, despite Drew screwing it up. Why more plays like that weren't run I'll never know. I know this is an FF board, and we all like work horses, but that isn't the problem. Both are very effective, and so are Sproles and Thomas.

The New Orleans backfield is simply not where you want to look for consistent fantasy production.

 
Dr. Octopus said:
Breesisdaman said:
He is a solid runner with good vision. looked good today but needs to develop other areas of his game if he wants to see more reps. Right now Ingram is ahead of him in that department but then again coughing up a football on your 20 in a playoff game will set your standing with the coach back a bit. So who knows going forward.
Click to expand...
Robinson had a clear fumble as well, but the refs blew the call and the Hawks failed to challenge it.
Click to expand...
Forearm was down.

 
Zigg said:
bicycle_seat_sniffer said:
Sean Payton needs to just pick a guy and play him, seems to me he gets way too cute with his packages.

Let a runner get some touches, get some carries and get in a rhythm. Shuffling people in and out all time seems to be a waste
Click to expand...
Substituting RBs isn't the problem. Empty backfield on the road against great pass rushes with mediocre tackles and bad WRs is. Every single play against Seattle should have been a run from a running formation or play action. Empty backfield and shotgun should have been tossed out of the playbook.

Both backs and the run blocking looked great. They had tremendous success running the ball, and that roll-out play to Josh Hill was wide open, despite Drew screwing it up. Why more plays like that weren't run I'll never know. I know this is an FF board, and we all like work horses, but that isn't the problem. Both are very effective, and so are Sproles and Thomas.

The New Orleans backfield is simply not where you want to look for consistent fantasy production.
Click to expand...
Yeah this could use some defining of terms.

Total yards from scrimmage for RBs, I think NO was 4th.

Total FFP scored by team RBs I think NO was 7th or so? (Not checking now).

Two RBs with 70+ catches, there were only three others in the NFL, no team had two, and 2 of the 3 were Charels and Forte (other was Woodhead).

Obviously there is FF production.

The things I see are:

  • The NFC despite all their awesome QBs saw 3 of the final 4 teams be running and defense oriented. NO was the 4th and they ran the ball over 50 for ~270 yards in RB production in the last 2 games.
  • Combine that with the Ryan defense.
  • Ingram improved. Hated that stinkin' fumble but he was (gasp) fun to watch in the 2nd half.
  • Robinson: he runs where the defense is not, ie runs to open spaces, but he also is totally unafraid of contact if the defender takes him on; I think he has breakaway ability. He also was the one non-Sproles RB to catch a damn screen and he took it 13 yards.
  • It may be in the other Khiry thread (credit Valhallan) but (2006-2011) Payton actually has run the ball a lot inside the 5 yard line and his RBs have produced a lot of TDs, top 5 both numbers. I wish I knew how to use the data dominator to verify this but that's what was posted (citing DD).
  • He has breakaway ability. He did not get the carries this year (54 or so) but next year it's going to happen in a game or two (or more).
I don't know what will happen, but I have this idea that Payton has a vision of a 2 RB system that he can whip out and beat teams with. Personally, though I was happy with Ingram 2nd half of this year, I think Robinson looks great and maybe there is a paradigm shift coming up next year.

I don't know what happens with Pierre. He's so effective, but Sproles has been reduced to the background in the run game, he may see the same thing happen.

IMO, the biggest problem with the Saints run game and Payton is frankly if Brees wants to, especially in the Dome, he can basically pass the ball at will and sometimes just kill a drive with a big play TD (which he loves to do right between the 40s).

 
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Zigg said:
bicycle_seat_sniffer said:
Sean Payton needs to just pick a guy and play him, seems to me he gets way too cute with his packages.

Let a runner get some touches, get some carries and get in a rhythm. Shuffling people in and out all time seems to be a waste
Click to expand...
Substituting RBs isn't the problem. Empty backfield on the road against great pass rushes with mediocre tackles and bad WRs is. Every single play against Seattle should have been a run from a running formation or play action. Empty backfield and shotgun should have been tossed out of the playbook.

Both backs and the run blocking looked great. They had tremendous success running the ball, and that roll-out play to Josh Hill was wide open, despite Drew screwing it up. Why more plays like that weren't run I'll never know. I know this is an FF board, and we all like work horses, but that isn't the problem. Both are very effective, and so are Sproles and Thomas.

The New Orleans backfield is simply not where you want to look for consistent fantasy production.
Click to expand...
good posting.. what could brees do with graham, colston and an another wr (benjamin, matthews etc).

(off-topic)

i know they have some other needs, but their was much improved and they could really use a big play wr.. i know its not really a need for them but would seem like a good pick

 
cstu said:
Coeur de Lion said:
Pauli Walnuts said:
Anyone made a move to acquire or sell Robinson recently? What would you pay for him. What would you want in return for him?
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He's a throw-in level player. Worth a WW claim or a stash at the end of your bench, but I certainly wouldn't give up anything of value for him.
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And you certainly won't get him with that attitude.
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I actually picked him up in most leagues off of waivers this year, sold high in a few and have him stashed in others, so not too worried about it. Just being realistic -- he's a Saints RB that doesn't catch passes. Ingram outplayed him most of the year. He's a huge longshot. If you guys want to invest heavily in him, have at it. If we're in any leagues together where I have him, hit me up, I won't want much.

 
SaintsInDome2006 said:
Not sure if it 's been discussed elsewhere, but I keep hearing that Parcells compared Khiry to Curtis Martin.

I thought it was maybe too much, but is there any there there?

I kept thinking he looked like he could bust one any moment vs the Hawks.

Any observations just in general in playing style and what to expect for next year?
Click to expand...
I watched a bunch of Curtis Martin runs on You Tube after I heard Parcells say that. Robinson has the same running style and has a similar football build. I can see the comparison.

 
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