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Kyle Shanahan Browns OC, Johnny Manziel NOT a good fit (1 Viewer)

Bracie Smathers

Bracie Smathers

Footballguy
Not going to allow spin doctors to say that Johnny Manziel is a good fit for his system.

No he's not.

Shanahan is NOT a great fit for Johnny Manziel.

This podcat has a Washington beat writer who says QB Brian Hoyer is a 'great fit' for Shanahan. He thinks they will work well together.

Doesn't think a clashing personality like a Johnny Football would be a good fit for Kyle. Stated he clashed with RG III when RG III last year and with Donovan McNabb. Um if you recal last year RG III's team mates didn't help to pick him up off the turf when he got sacked. The owner seemed to publically back RG III over the Shanahan so they were ostricized by the owner who favored his star QB. We've all seen the huge ego of McNabb and it seems RG III's ego got out of control last year when the owner puffed him up but his own team mates didn't seem to inclined to help out the guy. So a guy like Johnny Football may not be the best fit.

Shanny likes to 'throw the ball' so it could mean big things for WR Josh Gordon and TE Jordan Cameron.

Kyle really wants to establish his own NFL identity and this could be thee-job for him to make a name for himself.

Good listen, check it out.

http://cleveland.cbs...hanahans-style/

CBS Washinton’s David Elfin Says Manziel Not Good Fit For Kyle Shanahan’s Style

With Baskin & Phelps - Weekdays - 10am-2pmJanuary 30, 2014 11:08 AM

------------------------------------------------

Here is yet another podcast with a different guest who also says that Manziel and Shanahan is not a good fit. Both of these podcasts were aired PRIOR to the hire.

So lets nip this nonsense about Kyle Shanahan being a great fit for Johnny Manziel. BS, no he's not

http://cleveland.cbslocal.com/2014/01/30/browns-beat-still-a-grudge-against-denver-kyle-shanahan-as-o-c/
Kyle Shanahan As O.C?With Baskin & Phelps - Weekdays - 10am-2pm

 
They aren't going to take a QB from what Ive heard and what I believe.

At least not in the first round.

 
The personality issue is a Kyle problem. Definitely concerned about that no matter the qb. If our oc thinks he is bigger than the qb as Kyle is perceived that may be an uncorrectable problem.

 
Only a Browns homer is going to argue that the Shanahan/RG3 relationship was mostly RG3's fault. Laughable. Kyle was a brat, at least under his father in D.C. The other coaches couldn't stand him either.

I truly hope for the sake of Brown's fans that he learned from those four years. Otherwise, this is going to look like a very "typical Browns" hire very soon.

 
MAC_32 said:
Bracie Smathers said:
MAC_32 said:
The personality issue is a Kyle problem. Definitely concerned about that no matter the qb. If our oc thinks he is bigger than the qb as Kyle is perceived that may be an uncorrectable problem.
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Yeah, its not like the QB's ego was bigger than the team.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r18-FBS8iPw

RG III Reportedly Bragged That He Had Influence Over Franchise Direction
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yep, I'm sure rg3 is 100% to blame for everything.
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No obviously you and Bob have it all figured out.

Kyle Shanahan was the problem to fill your hate of the Cleveland front office and ofcourse Kyle Shanahan is the perfect fit for Johnny Football so that means you get to slam the Cleveland front office and Bob gets to continue the illusion that Cleveland wants to move up to the #2 pick and give up their two first-round draft picks for the honor giving picks to Bob's team.

Oh and a homer Redskin fan obviously see things with pure insight. He's no homer.

Redskin homer says Kyle Shanahan was a brat.

Yeah. That is what everyone says. Shanahan was the brat, not RG III.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SInJkdrEgw

Fred Smoot Explains Calling RG III a "Brat"

Published on Nov 6, 2013

Former Redskin Fred Smoot gives the reason why we called Robert Griffin III a "brat" in a previous radio interview and why he feels RG III was set up to be humbled.
 
One of the best articles pointing out there are two sides to the Shanahan/RGIII saga. It is highly unlikely Shanahan was 0% of the problm an RGII was 100% of the problem. I followed the WAS thread (2013 iteration) closely at the end of the year because of STL having their pick, it was virtually unanimous that there was a lot of rumor mongering going on and Shanahan was using mouthpieces. Leaks about meddlesome owners and villifying RGIII obviously didn't come from Snyder or RGIII, that was pretty transparent and obvious to the WAS thread.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/redskins/mike-shanahan-by-hiring-his-son-kyle-has-created-an-untenable-situation/2013/12/04/80b55ee4-5cfe-11e3-be07-006c776266ed_story.html

 
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As a Cameron owner, I'm very interested to hear more about how this could impact him moving forward. He did a great job keeping Reed involved in the Wash O

 
You are correct Shanahan. Winners don't fit with losers. That is why you are in Cleveland and Johnny Football isn't.

 
ConnSKINS26 said:
Only a Browns homer is going to argue that the Shanahan/RG3 relationship was mostly RG3's fault. Laughable. Kyle was a brat, at least under his father in D.C. The other coaches couldn't stand him either.

I truly hope for the sake of Brown's fans that he learned from those four years. Otherwise, this is going to look like a very "typical Browns" hire very soon.
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no, I have mental issues because I am not a blind homer. don't you know that? Duh.
 
How is that defensive rookie of the year doing Mac? You said he would be the defensive rookie of the year and you said that anyone who didn't think so was insane. I must be insane Mac because I didn't buy into your crap.

You? You're analytical. You told me so. You are not negative. I'm a homer. You told me that too.

How bout we let things play out?

 
I could care less what team STL might trade with, have just explored some of the options (I do think it might be a good idea to not let another 15 years go by without geting a competent QB, but maybe that's just me?).

I liked the scenario you noted in the CLE thread. There are pros and cons to getting an extra first this year or next. Trading down to 1.4 or 1.6 could be an important decision depending on who they are targeting.

"St. Louis wants to trade and would be sitting on Jadeveon Clowney and Atlanta has stated they are open to trading-up and they have needs for a pass rusher and Clowney is the best to come out in sometime. Makes sense for Atlanta to trade-up and get their pass rusher in Clowney and for St. Louis to move-down and pick up an extra 2nd this year and a 2015 1st round pick where they would have the 6th pick and would have a shot at either of the top-two OTs or WR Watkins."

One of the things you were most vehement about early on was the 1.2 wasn't worth much because, despite four of the top five (and six of he top eight) teams needing a QB, it wasn't a good QB draft (Bridgewater is skinny, etc.). Since than, Manziel and Bortles have shot up the board. Below is from the MIN thread, where you have at least three QBs (Bridgewater, Carr and Bortles) going in the top 5. You have backpedaled on the 1.2 not being valuable, and the QBs not being in demand. My take has remained consistent throughout.

"Rumor is that Jacksonville likes Derek Carr, as noted above the Jags coaching staff worked with him at the Senior Bowl all week and Jacksonville's owner stated they would take a QB in the draft.

Wouldn't suprise me in the least if they take Carr with the third pick.

Houston will inevitably take a QB with the first pick, more than likely Bridgewater.

The only top rated QB left who is a perfect fit for Norv Turner's system is Blake Bortles but he'd go to Oakland unless the Vikings move-up ahead of them."

I'm not claiming to know who anybody will pick. Are you? Do you know who CLE will or won't pick? Assuming you don't, than you are expressing your opinion, as others are. That doesn't make them spin doctors.

About RGIII, a lot of the leaks stating unflattering things abut the owner and QB were due to Shanahan trying to goad Snyder into firing him, this was common knowledge. You can go into the WAS 2013 thread if you want to get educated. I posted a lot there. Am I WAS homer, too? How do you define WAS homer, someone who doesn't 100% agree with you?

Remember when the leak came out that Shanahan didn't want to draft RGIII? PFT said baloney, and used the exact same line of reasoning that occurred to me before reading it. IF it were true, how come when he was basking in the glow of being a genius for drafting him after one of the greatest rookie seasons in NFL history, he didn't distance himself and say, "Wasn't me, that is all on Dan Snyder, he is the real genius for being the impetus of he trade!" The reason why, of course, is because it is complete hogwash and illogical nonsense.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/12/12/report-snyder-was-the-impetus-for-griffin-trade/

 
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Bracie Smathers said:
How is that defensive rookie of the year doing Mac? You said he would be the defensive rookie of the year and you said that anyone who didn't think so was insane. I must be insane Mac because I didn't buy into your crap.
Click to expand...
Are you talking about Mingo, the rookie who's every tackle, sack, pressure and snap you chronicled with glee throughout the season?

 
FGITLOTR said:
As a Cameron owner, I'm very interested to hear more about how this could impact him moving forward. He did a great job keeping Reed involved in the Wash O
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When Shanahan's name first popped up, long time Browns beat writer Mary Kay Cabot of the Cleveland Plain Dealer gave a quick over-view of his offensive system and this is what she had to say. Nothing specific about tight ends or RBs but Al Morris had a big rookie season and as you said, he did a nice job with TE Jeed.

I'm sure more will come out but here's a brief overview.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Kyle Shanahan – Once looked at as a future coaching star, the shine is starting to fade a bit. Fired along with his father after a 3-13 season in Washington, Shanahan is looking for a fresh start. Aside from this past season, his resume looks appealing. He helped Robert Griffin III become Offensive Rookie of the Year in 2012. Before that, Shanahan became the youngest coordinator in the league when he took over Houston's offense in 2008. He has helped two different offenses rise to the Top 10. A former college wideout, his system is very WR-friendly. First it was Andre Johnson in Houston, who recorded career highs in yards and touchdowns with Shanahan calling plays. This past season it was Pierre Garcon in Washington. With Josh Gordon emerging as a star, it could be a very good marriage between the Browns and the 34-year-old offensive mind.

 
ConnSKINS26 said:
Bracie Smathers said:
How is that defensive rookie of the year doing Mac? You said he would be the defensive rookie of the year and you said that anyone who didn't think so was insane. I must be insane Mac because I didn't buy into your crap.
Click to expand...
Are you talking about Mingo, the rookie who's every tackle, sack, pressure and snap you chronicled with glee throughout the season?
Click to expand...
no, Arthur Brown, who actually suffered a similar fate as Mingo. He got injured preseason and never got caught up.
 
MAC_32 said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
Bracie Smathers said:
How is that defensive rookie of the year doing Mac? You said he would be the defensive rookie of the year and you said that anyone who didn't think so was insane. I must be insane Mac because I didn't buy into your crap.
Click to expand...
Are you talking about Mingo, the rookie who's every tackle, sack, pressure and snap you chronicled with glee throughout the season?
Click to expand...
no, Arthur Brown, who actually suffered a similar fate as Mingo. He got injured preseason and never got caught up.
Click to expand...
Ah, my bad.

 
Bracie Smathers said:
How is that defensive rookie of the year doing Mac? You said he would be the defensive rookie of the year and you said that anyone who didn't think so was insane. I must be insane Mac because I didn't buy into your crap.

You? You're analytical. You told me so. You are not negative. I'm a homer. You told me that too.

How bout we let things play out?
Click to expand...
since your cognitive bias only allows you to see negative things I write I was positive about this team for the ten days under hoyer. Other than that, yeah, negative. Because there was nothing positive. Just failures. I want a winner as badly as anyone, but when I see bad I'm not going to spin it positive because I'm a fan.I didn't even say Kyle was going to fail, but that doesn't fit bracies narrative so he spun it how he wanted. Me having mental issues...apparently...giggle. I said he can't bring those same personality issues with him. If he does he will fail. If he learned and adapts then we will see.

 
ConnSKINS26 said:
MAC_32 said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
Bracie Smathers said:
How is that defensive rookie of the year doing Mac? You said he would be the defensive rookie of the year and you said that anyone who didn't think so was insane. I must be insane Mac because I didn't buy into your crap.
Click to expand...
Are you talking about Mingo, the rookie who's every tackle, sack, pressure and snap you chronicled with glee throughout the season?
Click to expand...
no, Arthur Brown, who actually suffered a similar fate as Mingo. He got injured preseason and never got caught up.
Click to expand...
Ah, my bad.
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I was, and still am a huge Arthur Brown fan, way before Baltimore drafted him. He is going to team up very well with Smith next year. Unfortunately.
 
MAC_32 said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
Bracie Smathers said:
How is that defensive rookie of the year doing Mac? You said he would be the defensive rookie of the year and you said that anyone who didn't think so was insane. I must be insane Mac because I didn't buy into your crap.
Click to expand...
Are you talking about Mingo, the rookie who's every tackle, sack, pressure and snap you chronicled with glee throughout the season?
Click to expand...
no, Arthur Brown, who actually suffered a similar fate as Mingo. He got injured preseason and never got caught up.
Click to expand...
No we're talk'n bout Mac's boi.

Mac said Aurthur Brown would be Defensive Rookie of the Year. Then when people had the audacity to question that he said you guys are insane who are questioning him.

Rookie year? 15 tackles, zero sacks. How many starts Mac?

Why did you state he'd be rookie of the year?

Have anything to do with Ozzie Newsome picking him?

Hell you don't have any such bias now do ya Mac?

You are analytical. Not some slub with an agenda of being a whiney guy with 12,000 posts with all the same thing to say. My team bad your team good that makes me an analytical smart fan and anyone who says different is a homer.

Yep, smart analytical fan like you who can spot those DROY, err as long as they come from anyoine other than your team. Beause 12,001 post of Mac saying my team bad your team good and that makes me an analytical smart fan and you're the dumb homer. Go ahead Mac, you post 4-1 with the same speel. Time to give it a rest kid. Your schitck is old and you're been called out.

 
Arthur Brown was probably the consensus choice to be Defensive Rookie of the Year at the time of dynasty IDP drafts.

I have immense respect for Dr. Jene Bramel, and my recollection was he was very high on him.

He who laughs last laughs hardest.

* I talked to a New Orleans-based independent scout once, and asked him what he keyed on and thought most important in evaluating LBs. He mentioned first step (instincts, not taking false steps) and I agreed. Brown's are outstanding. He did get hurt, fell behind and couldn't catch up. Maybe for some reason, he won't be a great pro, but he looked like a star in college, I remain confident in my initial impression. One reason he was coveted was because Lewis retired, and this was before they signed Daryl Smith (great addition for BAL, I have thought for years he is one of the most underrated/appreciated defensive players in the league). He could play at a high level still, but isn't the future. We give a lot of credit to Ozzie and his scouting team, they have been one of the best front offices in terms of talent evaluation for the past few decades, even the most enthusiastic CLE supporter should be able to acknowledge that. Time will tell, but I trust they knew what what they were doing in drafting Brown.

 
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MAC_32 said:
I said he can't bring those same personality issues with him. If he does he will fail. If he learned and adapts then we will see.
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Not trying to get in the middle of you lady's slap fight, but this absolutely :goodposting: . The thought the Browns may have to pass on the best QB available when their pick comes because the OC may not be able to get along with him makes me want to puke.

 
Bob Magaw said:
"Rumor is that Jacksonville likes Derek Carr, as noted above the Jags coaching staff worked with him at the Senior Bowl all week and Jacksonville's owner stated they would take a QB in the draft.

Wouldn't suprise me in the least if they take Carr with the third pick.
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Love this rumor. I wish it was true. Is there anything behind it besides the mere coincidence that the Jaguars coaching staff and David Carr were put on the same team.

 
There really needs to be a nepotism rule in addition to the Rooney rule. Sometimes it works like with the Harbaugh brothers, but usually it doesn't.

 
Manziel seems like a slightly better version of McCoy, who was a slightly better version of Frye.

so whatever it takes for Cleveland to pass on him, i'm cool with.

 
I love it when franchises make personnel decisions that will affect them for 10 years based on coaches or assistant coaches that may be around for two. It seems like it's always the same dysfunctional franchises that continue to do this.

The question should be whether Johnny Football is/can be a good NFL QB, not whether he's a good fit with Shanahan. The probability that Shanahan will still be with the Browns 3-4 years from now are virtually nil. He'll either do poorly and be fired by then, or he'll do well and take a head coaching job somewhere by then. Either way, he'll be gone and the Browns will be left holding the results of a personnel decision based on a coach that is no longer there.

 
Bracie Smathers said:
MAC_32 said:
ConnSKINS26 said:
Bracie Smathers said:
How is that defensive rookie of the year doing Mac? You said he would be the defensive rookie of the year and you said that anyone who didn't think so was insane. I must be insane Mac because I didn't buy into your crap.
Click to expand...
Are you talking about Mingo, the rookie who's every tackle, sack, pressure and snap you chronicled with glee throughout the season?
Click to expand...
no, Arthur Brown, who actually suffered a similar fate as Mingo. He got injured preseason and never got caught up.
Click to expand...
No we're talk'n bout Mac's boi. Mac said Aurthur Brown would be Defensive Rookie of the Year. Then when people had the audacity to question that he said you guys are insane who are questioning him.

Rookie year? 15 tackles, zero sacks. How many starts Mac?

Why did you state he'd be rookie of the year?

Have anything to do with Ozzie Newsome picking him?

Hell you don't have any such bias now do ya Mac?

You are analytical. Not some slub with an agenda of being a whiney guy with 12,000 posts with all the same thing to say. My team bad your team good that makes me an analytical smart fan and anyone who says different is a homer.

Yep, smart analytical fan like you who can spot those DROY, err as long as they come from anyoine other than your team. Beause 12,001 post of Mac saying my team bad your team good and that makes me an analytical smart fan and you're the dumb homer. Go ahead Mac, you post 4-1 with the same speel. Time to give it a rest kid. Your schitck is old and you're been called out.
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Aren't you the guy who tried to make some bizarre case in the IDP forum that Baltimore was overrated in their ability to draft? I think it was you, if I'm mistaken I apologize. If I recall one of your pieces of "evidence" was that Torrey Smith isn't a "true" #1 WR, or some nonsense like that (meaning whether or not he's a 1 WR has nothing to do with the success of that pick). You draw some very bizarre conclusions and this is a bizarre conclusion too.

 
I don't know how anyone outside the Skins can pretend to know what was Kyle's doing and what was Mike's. Positive or negative.

 
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There are a few questionable assumptions in the thread. As far as I can tell, a podcast interview of a WAS beat reporter is the basis of a few of them. It is one person's take, not dog[pound]ma. He may not have done deep scouting of Hoyer or Manziel. In the OP, the podcasts don't say what they are "paraphrased" as saying.

The first one doesn't say anywhere Manziel has a "clashing" personality. He opinionated he has "his own agenda". Does that mean he likes to party? Does everybody who likes to have fun (like Joe Namath) have a clashing personality? The second podcast is unrecognizeable from how it was characterized. The few comments talked about not knowing whether CLE is even interested in Manziel, and IF they didn't get along, he didn't know if it would be a deal breaker with Shanahan getting the job. Sounds like he was addressing rumors with a maybe, not making a definitive judgement (but I can see how they got confused, they sound so much alike). This is not court reporter, UN translator level accuracy going on. Sort of like how a post in the CLE thread making a suggestion titled Possible Dot Connecting pointing out that Shanahan did a good job with a running QB in the 2012 ROY season equates to saying he absolutely, positively, definitely will be a great fit... and that the casual remark made in passing requires a separate thread to suppress and stamp out this heinous, unthinkable heresy. :)

1) Because Shanahan and RGIII didn't get along, this necessarily means Manziel wouldn't. This begs the question, if they don't have identical personalities, why would we assume Shanahan would have the same issues with Manziel?

2) All RGIII's issues with the Shanahan's were due to a "big ego". No back story about the coaches putting him at risk calling running playing when his knee was strained contributing to a torn ACL, loss of confidence with the coaches, and when anything was questioned about the OC with the HC, predictably the HC sided with the OC along nepotism-based lines.

3) That Shanahan could or would request Manziel not be drafted.

 
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Donnybrook said:
Bob Magaw said:
"Rumor is that Jacksonville likes Derek Carr, as noted above the Jags coaching staff worked with him at the Senior Bowl all week and Jacksonville's owner stated they would take a QB in the draft.

Wouldn't suprise me in the least if they take Carr with the third pick.
Click to expand...
Love this rumor. I wish it was true. Is there anything behind it besides the mere coincidence that the Jaguars coaching staff and David Carr were put on the same team.
Click to expand...
I was quoting somebody, not me.

 
amnesiac said:
Manziel seems like a slightly better version of McCoy, who was a slightly better version of Frye.

so whatever it takes for Cleveland to pass on him, i'm cool with.
Click to expand...
He has elicited comparisons with Tarkenton and independent scouts like Gil Brandt made him #1 on his board. Yeah, that sounds a lot like McCoy.

 
At least we hired someone with experience, and we wont have a rookie defensive minded head coach with a rookie QB and rookie OC.

Sign Ben Tate

MAYBE draft a rookie QB at 4

should be good WRs left near the end of the first round

Let's score a few points.....................I still want to trade down though with one of the 1sts. If not, F it, lets lose high scoring games from now on.

 
IMO Manziel seems like a slightly better version of McCoy, who was a slightly better version of Frye.

so whatever it takes for Cleveland to pass on him, i'm cool with.

didn't think the imo was necessary, but apparently it was. hth.

 
amnesiac said:
IMO Manziel seems like a slightly better version of McCoy, who was a slightly better version of Frye.

so whatever it takes for Cleveland to pass on him, i'm cool with.

didn't think the imo was necessary, but apparently it was. hth.
Click to expand...
Half the people on this forum are a slightly better verson of Mccoy.

 
amnesiac said:
IMO Manziel seems like a slightly better version of McCoy, who was a slightly better version of Frye.

so whatever it takes for Cleveland to pass on him, i'm cool with.

didn't think the imo was necessary, but apparently it was. hth.
Click to expand...
It wasn't necessary, got that it was your opinion, just don't agree with the comp. They are all humans, so they have that in common, I guess. :)

 
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Bob Magaw said:
amnesiac said:
Manziel seems like a slightly better version of McCoy, who was a slightly better version of Frye.

so whatever it takes for Cleveland to pass on him, i'm cool with.
Click to expand...
He has elicited comparisons with Tarkenton and independent scouts like Gil Brandt made him #1 on his board. Yeah, that sounds a lot like McCoy.
Click to expand...
Posted on: Tuesday, February 16, 2010NFL: Gil Brandt: Colt McCoy is Drew Brees on and off the field

By Jimmy Burch

McClatchy Newspapers

FORT WORTH, Texas In the copycat world run by NFL executives, former Texas quarterback Colt McCoy may have caught a break in Super Bowl XLIV.

At least that is the opinion of Gil Brandt, personnel analyst for NFL.com.

Like many peers who draw paychecks as NFL talent evaluators, Brandt compares McCoy winner of the 2009 Davey OBrien National Quarterback Award to Drew Brees, the New Orleans Saints accurate-but-undersized quarterback who became a Super Bowl MVP by leading his team to a 31-17 upset of the Indianapolis Colts.

McCoy (6-foot-2, 215 pounds) is 2 inches taller than Brees (6-0, 209). But he remains short by NFL standards, where Colts quarterback Peyton Manning (6-5, 230) is considered the prototype.

Manning, of course, was outplayed by Brees arguably the leagues shortest starting quarterback during that game. Brees completed 32 of 39 passes for 288 yards and two touchdowns, without an interception.

Brandt said Brees prime-time performance should make NFL executives take a closer look at McCoy, who set an NCAA record for career victories by a starting quarterback (45) and finished with a career completion rate of 70.3 percent, before pulling the trigger in favor of a taller quarterback in the 2010 NFL Draft.

I think it opens some eyes. No question about it, said Brandt, the former Dallas Cowboys director of player personnel. To me, Colt is Drew Brees on the field and Drew Brees off the field. But hes about two and a half inches taller and hes faster.

For undersized quarterbacks, Brandt said Brees emergence as a Super Bowl winner could have similar repercussions to the Cowboys decision to select Bob Hayes, an Olympic sprint champion, with a seventh-round pick in the 1964 draft. Despite a limited football background in college, Hayes morphed into a 2009 inductee into the Pro Football Hall of Fame.

This is like when we drafted Hayes, Brandt said of Brees potential impact on future NFL thinking. After that, everyone started drafting those kinds of receivers. People emulate what has proven to be successful ... in every business, including the football business.

In Brandts estimation, that could boost McCoys stock in relation to taller quarterbacks who will join him at the NFL Combine, Feb. 24 through March 2 in Indianapolis. But that does not prevent ESPN draft analyst Mel Kiper Jr. from projecting Oklahomas Sam Bradford (6-4, 223) and Notre Dames Jimmy Clausen (6-3, 223) as the top two quarterbacks available in the draft.

Kiper projects both players as first-round picks likely to be taken among the top 10 overall selections. Kiper rates McCoy as the third-best quarterback prospect but not as a first-round pick.

Todd McShay, ESPN Scouts Inc. director of college scouting, goes even further, saying theres not a lot of elite quarterback prospects available in the 2010 draft. After Bradford and Clausen, McShay said, You have a little bit of a dropoff in the quarterback talent pool, especially with McCoy coming off a pinched nerve in his throwing shoulder that knocked him out of the Jan. 7 BCS National Championship Game in his final college start.

I think Colt McCoy is a second- or third-rounder, McShay said.

Brandt said he views McCoy as a potential top 10 guy worthy of a first-round pick because of his work ethic, accuracy, leadership skills and long-term value. In short, the same attributes he admires most in Brees, a second-round pick by San Diego in the 2001 draft.

Brandt is far from alone in making the connection. Archie Manning, a former Saints player who is Peytons father, got to know McCoy last summer at the Manning Passing Academy in Thibodaux, La. The elder Manning echoed the McCoy-Brees comparisons, saying McCoy reminds me a lot of Drew Brees, because both players are accurate passers with quick releases who have better arm strength than scouts acknowledge.

Brad McCoy, Colts father, said the Brees comparisons cant hurt as his son prepares to begin his NFL career.

Colt McCoy said he has heard the Brees comparisons, understands them and embraces them. But he knows he must prove his mettle to scouts after departing with an injury five plays into Texas 37-21 loss to Alabama in the BCS title game.

He said he is fully confident he will be able to do so, either at the combine or during individual workouts later this spring.

My body has responded very well so far to the things that Ive done, said McCoy, who has been going through rehabilitation workouts in Southern California for the past month. Im really looking forward to ... proving that my shoulders OK and being ready to go.

 
"When Holmgren selected McCoy, it was on the urging of respected NFL analyst Gil Brandt, who proclaimed, If you draft Colt McCoy and run the West Coast Offense, youre going to forget about Joe Montana."

 
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Where did he rank him pre-draft?

I definitely don't recall McCoy being a seeming consensus top 5-10 overall pick in his respective draft, but I'm not looking things up (I appreciate you doing it, I'm just watching Mel Brooks High Anxiety during this exchange).

You might be right, amnesiac (about Manziel only being a little better than McCoy), I just don't see it. I think Manziel is more than a little better as a scrambler and runner.

 
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