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LB: Jamie Winborn (Den) - How much upside with DJ Williams out? (1 Viewer)

Some, but not a lot. He was already an every-down player after the loss of Boss Bailey. His increase in value will come from an increase in potential tackle opportunity, but Denver's defense was already seeing an above-average amount of tackle opportunity. He may finish with LB3 value, but I don't see huge late season upside.

 
Some, but not a lot. He was already an every-down player after the loss of Boss Bailey. His increase in value will come from an increase in potential tackle opportunity, but Denver's defense was already seeing an above-average amount of tackle opportunity. He may finish with LB3 value, but I don't see huge late season upside.
I'm not sure I agree with this... If he does make the switch to Will, I could see him easily netting 6+ solos every week, with the potential for those 10+ solo games that we grew accustomed to seeing from DJ. In no way does he have the talent of DJ, but with Denver's propensity to give up long drives, he'll have plenty of opportunity and he has shown that he plays with a lot of energy. I see him being a solid start in DJ's absence.
 
Some, but not a lot. He was already an every-down player after the loss of Boss Bailey. His increase in value will come from an increase in potential tackle opportunity, but Denver's defense was already seeing an above-average amount of tackle opportunity. He may finish with LB3 value, but I don't see huge late season upside.
I'm not sure I agree with this... If he does make the switch to Will, I could see him easily netting 6+ solos every week, with the potential for those 10+ solo games that we grew accustomed to seeing from DJ. In no way does he have the talent of DJ, but with Denver's propensity to give up long drives, he'll have plenty of opportunity and he has shown that he plays with a lot of energy. I see him being a solid start in DJ's absence.
True. Winborn definitely could approach LB2 value if he assumes the Will job. Most of what we've been hearing suggests that Woodyard will get the first shot at those snaps, though. That would seem to make sense, as he's been on the field at times in recent weeks and there's very little chance he plays MLB or SLB.
 
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Some, but not a lot. He was already an every-down player after the loss of Boss Bailey. His increase in value will come from an increase in potential tackle opportunity, but Denver's defense was already seeing an above-average amount of tackle opportunity. He may finish with LB3 value, but I don't see huge late season upside.
I'm not sure I agree with this... If he does make the switch to Will, I could see him easily netting 6+ solos every week, with the potential for those 10+ solo games that we grew accustomed to seeing from DJ. In no way does he have the talent of DJ, but with Denver's propensity to give up long drives, he'll have plenty of opportunity and he has shown that he plays with a lot of energy. I see him being a solid start in DJ's absence.
True. Winborn definitely could approach LB2 value if he assumes the Will job. Most of what we've been hearing suggests that Woodyard will get the first shot at those snaps, though. That would seem to make sense, as he's been on the field at times in recent weeks and there's very little chance he plays MLB or SLB.
whats your take on Woodyard? Hes listed at only 212? Seems very undersized for a LB. Do you think he has any long term value in dynasty leagues or is he just a ww grab and hope for the best until Williams comes back?
 
Some, but not a lot. He was already an every-down player after the loss of Boss Bailey. His increase in value will come from an increase in potential tackle opportunity, but Denver's defense was already seeing an above-average amount of tackle opportunity. He may finish with LB3 value, but I don't see huge late season upside.
I'm not sure I agree with this... If he does make the switch to Will, I could see him easily netting 6+ solos every week, with the potential for those 10+ solo games that we grew accustomed to seeing from DJ. In no way does he have the talent of DJ, but with Denver's propensity to give up long drives, he'll have plenty of opportunity and he has shown that he plays with a lot of energy. I see him being a solid start in DJ's absence.
True. Winborn definitely could approach LB2 value if he assumes the Will job. Most of what we've been hearing suggests that Woodyard will get the first shot at those snaps, though. That would seem to make sense, as he's been on the field at times in recent weeks and there's very little chance he plays MLB or SLB.
whats your take on Woodyard? Hes listed at only 212? Seems very undersized for a LB. Do you think he has any long term value in dynasty leagues or is he just a ww grab and hope for the best until Williams comes back?
We discussed Woodyard some on the podcast this week, too, if you're interested in some other takes.Woodyard's scouting report caught my eye before the draft as a guy to watch, but it's hard to overlook the 212 number. Even the undersized guys who've succeeded in recent years -- Michael Boley, Leroy Hill, Demorrio Williams. Cato June -- are 225+. This isn't Will Witherspoon, Justin Durant, etc. Those pounds are a big deal. If he can be protected, he's got enough pursuit and range to be an effective WLB. I think his upside is similar to that of Demorrio Williams. But him on a team where he can run all over the place and you'll get some numbers from him. Put him on a team where an offense can regularly run at him and he'll probably be a weak link.It would appear that the Broncos have finally decided on DJ at WLB. That leaves no clear role for Woodyard in the long term. If he can prove he can cover a bit, he's one of those tweeners that could move back to safety, but that's been hard to pull off in recent years.
 
Some, but not a lot. He was already an every-down player after the loss of Boss Bailey. His increase in value will come from an increase in potential tackle opportunity, but Denver's defense was already seeing an above-average amount of tackle opportunity. He may finish with LB3 value, but I don't see huge late season upside.
I'm not sure I agree with this... If he does make the switch to Will, I could see him easily netting 6+ solos every week, with the potential for those 10+ solo games that we grew accustomed to seeing from DJ. In no way does he have the talent of DJ, but with Denver's propensity to give up long drives, he'll have plenty of opportunity and he has shown that he plays with a lot of energy. I see him being a solid start in DJ's absence.
being in the SLB/Every Down Role, Winborn turned into a 6 solo producer LB... now w/ out DJ out there I'm sure Win can net a couple more Solos... a late season must grab; but I don't think he'll be worth anything after this season.
 
Some, but not a lot. He was already an every-down player after the loss of Boss Bailey. His increase in value will come from an increase in potential tackle opportunity, but Denver's defense was already seeing an above-average amount of tackle opportunity. He may finish with LB3 value, but I don't see huge late season upside.
I'm not sure I agree with this... If he does make the switch to Will, I could see him easily netting 6+ solos every week, with the potential for those 10+ solo games that we grew accustomed to seeing from DJ. In no way does he have the talent of DJ, but with Denver's propensity to give up long drives, he'll have plenty of opportunity and he has shown that he plays with a lot of energy. I see him being a solid start in DJ's absence.
True. Winborn definitely could approach LB2 value if he assumes the Will job. Most of what we've been hearing suggests that Woodyard will get the first shot at those snaps, though. That would seem to make sense, as he's been on the field at times in recent weeks and there's very little chance he plays MLB or SLB.
whats your take on Woodyard? Hes listed at only 212? Seems very undersized for a LB. Do you think he has any long term value in dynasty leagues or is he just a ww grab and hope for the best until Williams comes back?
We discussed Woodyard some on the podcast this week, too, if you're interested in some other takes.Woodyard's scouting report caught my eye before the draft as a guy to watch, but it's hard to overlook the 212 number. Even the undersized guys who've succeeded in recent years -- Michael Boley, Leroy Hill, Demorrio Williams. Cato June -- are 225+. This isn't Will Witherspoon, Justin Durant, etc. Those pounds are a big deal. If he can be protected, he's got enough pursuit and range to be an effective WLB. I think his upside is similar to that of Demorrio Williams. But him on a team where he can run all over the place and you'll get some numbers from him. Put him on a team where an offense can regularly run at him and he'll probably be a weak link.It would appear that the Broncos have finally decided on DJ at WLB. That leaves no clear role for Woodyard in the long term. If he can prove he can cover a bit, he's one of those tweeners that could move back to safety, but that's been hard to pull off in recent years.
Woodyard's listed at 230 on NFL.com. Where is the 212 number coming from?
 
haha...yeah, that was pretty awesome, but might've been situational if you look at the offense quinn was running.

 
Hmmm.....I need to replace DJ and I might bite. Even Woodward had a good game. Bronco's D is horrid and they'll be on the field a lot. News flash. lol.

 
I dropped David Harris and picked up Winborn on a flyer Tuesday. Then I proceeded to start Nate Webster and leave Winborn on the bench. Painful to watch. :wall:

 
haha...yeah, that was pretty awesome, but might've been situational if you look at the offense quinn was running.
Winborn was just making plays along with woodyard. I didn't really notice them go into a dime which should just be winborn now that webster is hurt.
 
grtwhtsk said:
Some, but not a lot. He was already an every-down player after the loss of Boss Bailey. His increase in value will come from an increase in potential tackle opportunity, but Denver's defense was already seeing an above-average amount of tackle opportunity. He may finish with LB3 value, but I don't see huge late season upside.
I'm not sure I agree with this... If he does make the switch to Will, I could see him easily netting 6+ solos every week, with the potential for those 10+ solo games that we grew accustomed to seeing from DJ. In no way does he have the talent of DJ, but with Denver's propensity to give up long drives, he'll have plenty of opportunity and he has shown that he plays with a lot of energy. I see him being a solid start in DJ's absence.
True. Winborn definitely could approach LB2 value if he assumes the Will job. Most of what we've been hearing suggests that Woodyard will get the first shot at those snaps, though. That would seem to make sense, as he's been on the field at times in recent weeks and there's very little chance he plays MLB or SLB.
whats your take on Woodyard? Hes listed at only 212? Seems very undersized for a LB. Do you think he has any long term value in dynasty leagues or is he just a ww grab and hope for the best until Williams comes back?
We discussed Woodyard some on the podcast this week, too, if you're interested in some other takes.Woodyard's scouting report caught my eye before the draft as a guy to watch, but it's hard to overlook the 212 number. Even the undersized guys who've succeeded in recent years -- Michael Boley, Leroy Hill, Demorrio Williams. Cato June -- are 225+. This isn't Will Witherspoon, Justin Durant, etc. Those pounds are a big deal. If he can be protected, he's got enough pursuit and range to be an effective WLB. I think his upside is similar to that of Demorrio Williams. But him on a team where he can run all over the place and you'll get some numbers from him. Put him on a team where an offense can regularly run at him and he'll probably be a weak link.It would appear that the Broncos have finally decided on DJ at WLB. That leaves no clear role for Woodyard in the long term. If he can prove he can cover a bit, he's one of those tweeners that could move back to safety, but that's been hard to pull off in recent years.
Woodyard's listed at 230 on NFL.com. Where is the 212 number coming from?
The 212 number was what I had from before the combine apparently. From what I can gather, he was around 215-219 at the Senior Bowl, then put on in the neighborhood of 10-12 pounds in the two weeks before the combine, where he weighed in at 227. I wasn't able to see the game last night unfortunately, but he looked closer to 225 than 215 from the little I've seen. I'm not a big ht/wt guy necessarily, but those 10 pounds matter for a linebacker. Can't really give a considered opinion yet, but the line score and play-by-play look very favorable. And it's certainly not going to hurt that the Broncos will have to use Koutouvides at MLB for a couple more weeks at least. That nearly guarantees plenty of pursuit opportunities and every-down duty for Woodyard.Looking forward to watching more highlights today. If he played like his scouting report read, he's a keeper for now. Whether he'll be Demorrio Williams or Justin Durant is another matter, however.
 
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Winborn and Woodyard were all over the place last night. Woodyard definitely has some wheels. Even better is both are available on my WW. The question is, who to grab in a dynasty format, 1pt per tackle, 3 p sack?

 
Winborn would be my choice. Once DJ returns, Woody goes to the bench unless Webster misses alot of time with his injury.

 
I say woodyard.
Im not so sure.. I think it depends on Websters injury. Before he was hurt early in the game, it looked to be Webster and Winborn playing in the nickle. After Webster got hurt, both Winborn and Woodyard were playing and it seemed that Winborn had more opportunities that he barely missed. Both should be good but with DJ out, I think the coach would prefer Winborn and Webster (both veterans), on the field in nickle packages. Again I would keep an eye on Webster's injury, but I still like Winborn better here.
 
well, I say woodyard because I feel winborn is more of a known commodity, and last night's game just happened to play out in a way that probably puffed his stats.

woodyard, on the other hand, looks like he might be more likely to repeat that production next week.

while it's true that all this might change in a few weeks, I'd rather take the production today than try to figure out who's going to be healthy and who's going to be playing a month from now.

playoff production is definitely valuable, but I'm not carrying any lb on my roster just to play him next month, and when winborn comes back to earth, as I expect he will, he wouldn't be in my line-up anyway.

at least woodyard has the tantalizing unknown to produce a bandwagon thread.

 
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So who is the pick up this week? I saw Fujita for the Saints had a good day vs ATL so I'm curious if Woodyard is the play here?

 
well, I say woodyard because I feel winborn is more of a known commodity, and last night's game just happened to play out in a way that probably puffed his stats.woodyard, on the other hand, looks like he might be more likely to repeat that production next week.while it's true that all this might change in a few weeks, I'd rather take the production today than try to figure out who's going to be healthy and who's going to be playing a month from now.playoff production is definitely valuable, but I'm not carrying any lb on my roster just to play him next month, and when winborn comes back to earth, as I expect he will, he wouldn't be in my line-up anyway.at least woodyard has the tantalizing unknown to produce a bandwagon thread.
Winborn has been good since Boss went down. Winborn is production today and in the future.
 
Winborn's always been a REALLY aggressive and active tackler. Super-talented player back with the 49ers, just extremely injury-prone.

Big-time sleeper here... I think he's good for 6-7 tackles MINIMUM every game and a few big games in between.

 
Jene, I'm curious as to what is allowing Winborn to be so productive as the Sam backer... Even Boss was putting up good numbers in that position before his injury. We all saw what being moved to Sam did to DJ - he became more or less worthless as is typical of most Sam LB's.

Is it simply due to the amount of tackles there are to go around on this putrid defense? Or is Denver doing something schematically that is putting the Sam backer in position to make more plays than was the case in years past? Because it seems at this point that any Denver LB, regardless of position, is good for 6+ solos per game.

 
Jene, I'm curious as to what is allowing Winborn to be so productive as the Sam backer... Even Boss was putting up good numbers in that position before his injury. We all saw what being moved to Sam did to DJ - he became more or less worthless as is typical of most Sam LB's. Is it simply due to the amount of tackles there are to go around on this putrid defense? Or is Denver doing something schematically that is putting the Sam backer in position to make more plays than was the case in years past? Because it seems at this point that any Denver LB, regardless of position, is good for 6+ solos per game.
I don't think there's anything schematic. It's all opportunity. The Broncos are third in tackle opportunity, well above average at 55 per game and are also facing an above average number of rush attempts. Winborn also has benefited greatly from playing in the nickel with Bailey and Williams out. His game logs show a clear improvement before he had an every-down role and after.
 
Jene, I'm curious as to what is allowing Winborn to be so productive as the Sam backer... Even Boss was putting up good numbers in that position before his injury. We all saw what being moved to Sam did to DJ - he became more or less worthless as is typical of most Sam LB's. Is it simply due to the amount of tackles there are to go around on this putrid defense? Or is Denver doing something schematically that is putting the Sam backer in position to make more plays than was the case in years past? Because it seems at this point that any Denver LB, regardless of position, is good for 6+ solos per game.
I don't think there's anything schematic. It's all opportunity. The Broncos are third in tackle opportunity, well above average at 55 per game and are also facing an above average number of rush attempts. Winborn also has benefited greatly from playing in the nickel with Bailey and Williams out. His game logs show a clear improvement before he had an every-down role and after.
When DJ was the Sam backer in '05 and '06, was he used in the nickel, or was it typically Wilson and Gold?
 
Jene, I'm curious as to what is allowing Winborn to be so productive as the Sam backer... Even Boss was putting up good numbers in that position before his injury. We all saw what being moved to Sam did to DJ - he became more or less worthless as is typical of most Sam LB's. Is it simply due to the amount of tackles there are to go around on this putrid defense? Or is Denver doing something schematically that is putting the Sam backer in position to make more plays than was the case in years past? Because it seems at this point that any Denver LB, regardless of position, is good for 6+ solos per game.
I don't think there's anything schematic. It's all opportunity. The Broncos are third in tackle opportunity, well above average at 55 per game and are also facing an above average number of rush attempts. Winborn also has benefited greatly from playing in the nickel with Bailey and Williams out. His game logs show a clear improvement before he had an every-down role and after.
When DJ was the Sam backer in '05 and '06, was he used in the nickel, or was it typically Wilson and Gold?
Wilson and Gold were the nickel backers in those seasons.
 
I guess the Winborn Train ride is about over. 4 Solos in each of the last 2 weeks... really not good enough to start for me.

 

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