LHUCKS' "On the Rise" (1 Viewer)

[LHUCKS]

20) Marcel Shipp - Is emerging as the clear compliment to Arrington in the AZ backfield.

19) David Terrel -Name the last time Givens and Branch have played anything close to an entire season :crickets:

Terrel has been clicking with his old teammate in camp. He could put up monster numbers once given the opportunity.

18) Mark Clayton - Got his butt into camp and has been impressive. Baltimore will find a way to get their most athletically gifted WR on the field.

17) Brian Westbrook - With his holdout short-lived, he will be more heavily relied upon than ever with the WR situation disintegrating at an alarming rate.

16) Courtney Anderson - Recently named the #1 in Oakland, if you're looking for a starter with upside late in drafts, he's worth the flier.

15) Ricky Williams - You don't have to like him to realize he's the back with the most ability that's currently in camp.

14) Fred Taylor - Appears on track to be ready for the season opener and all reports have been positive regarding his in-camp play.

13) Bobby Engram - Still running with the first team in an offense that is usually among the passing yardage leaders. Up to this point, nobody appears to be making a serious push for Engram's spot.

12) Jerome Bettis - Staley is out for an extended period of time and Bettis showed he could carry the load for stretches at a time last year.

11) Thomas Jones - Jones has looked great in preseason thus far and Benson is still holding out...btw, Jones is more talented than Benson.

10) Roydell Williams - Early camp news had been focused on Brandon Jones but homers have long been reporting that Williams is making the most noise in camps. Williams validated the buzz by hauling in two receptions for 80 yards in his first preseason game. With Calico still ailing Roydell might be the sleeper out of Tennessee

9) Cedrick Wilson - The Ward holdout is beginning to get ugly and reports from camp state that Ced is giving Randle El all that he can handle in the starting WR competition. At worst he's a #3 that gets a lot of looks, at best he's the #1 WR in week 1.

8) LJ Smith - The TO situation is grim to say the least and the WRs are inexperienced. This could be the year where the talent and opportunity collide.

7) Steve McNair - Looked great in his first preseason action and reports are unanimous that he's in his old form. He was 3rd in ppg in 2003.

6) Reggie Brown - Despite his inexperience he's been turning heads in camp. Given the TO situation and Pinkston injury the opportunity may present itself for Brown before many of us had anticipated it would.

5) Larry Johnson - I still don't advocate his selection at his current ADP but Priest is stating he's only at 80% and LJ has looked like a star in camp.

4) Gus Frerotte - put up 140 yards in limited action in his first preseason game and his WRs have been receiving praise from coach Saban...even David Boston.

3) Ben Troupe - Is healing faster than expected and as previously mentioned his MVP QB hasn't looked too shabby either. OBTW, Chow is predicting big reception totals for his TEs.

2) Reggie Williams - Early reports are that he is a different player in this year's camp.

1) Mike Anderson - Less than a month away from the beginning of the season and Anderson is still #1 on the depth chart...easily worth his ADP.

 

[gman8343]

Good stuff. Is Shipp going to see a lot of action?

 

[LHUCKS]

Good stuff.

Is Shipp going to see a lot of action?

yep

 

[EBF]

I disagree with almost all of your picks, but I do like Reggie Williams, Ben Troupe, and Brian Westbrook.

 

[jurb26]

11) Thomas Jones - Jones has looked great in preseason thus far and Benson is still holding out...btw, Jones is more talented than Benson.

Funny, I didn't know that NFL teams were in the practice of drafting RBs in the top 5 that they thougth were of inferior talent then one they already habve on the roster.

 

[LHUCKS]

11) Thomas Jones - Jones has looked great in preseason thus far and Benson is still holding out...btw, Jones is more talented than Benson.

Funny, I didn't know that NFL teams were in the practice of drafting RBs in the top 5 that they thougth were of inferior talent then one they already habve on the roster.

My opinion obviously differs from that of the Bears. I was fishing a bit as well

 

[dotman]

I somewhat agree on Reggie....although I think it should be Reggie Brown/Greg Lewis. I strongly agree on Bettis...I'd put him higher up the list.

 

[LHUCKS]

I disagree with almost all of your picks, but I do like Reggie Williams, Ben Troupe, and Brian Westbrook.

They're not really "my picks"...they're just rising in my rankings.

 

[Mighty Mice]

Bobby Engram as a late round flyer. Looked pretty solid last night also, from what I've heard.

 

[LHUCKS]

I somewhat agree on Reggie....although I think it should be Reggie Brown/Greg Lewis.

thought about doing the Lewis/Brown thing, afterall both are rising in my rankings. Focused on Brown though because I like what I've heard and seen.

 

[LHUCKS]

  Bobby Engram as a late round flyer. Looked pretty solid last night also, from what I've heard.

Yep...he's solid. He wont break many, if any 80 yarders, but he could easily put up 80/1000/7.

 

[pigskinliquors]

Great post Lhucks. While I agree with the vast majority of what you've stated, I'd like to add the following:1) Shipp appears to be in position to take more carries than expected, but I still believe Arrington will see the majority of carries.2) As a Bears fan I love Thomas Jones; but having seen Benson play the last four year I believe he is even more talented than Jones. I'd love to see him in camp, as the two of them may be needed with Grossman down.3) Frerotte's value is up, ONLY bc it looks like he will win the starting job. The O-line looks awful thus far. IF the line improves during camp, I'll go with you that Gus could hold some value, but not until then. 4) Ditto for Ricky. 5) I'd rather Westbrook be in the same role as he was last year, instead of the focal point of the offense. While he is an amazing athlete, I don't believe he can shoulder the load for a full season. my .02

 

[lebowski]

Good stuff.

Is Shipp going to see a lot of action?

yep

I haven't seen anything saying shipp is going to be a major player in the Arizona running game. Last I heard he was gimping. I'm not arguing, I would just like to know where you are getting your info. on that one.I strongly agree with McNair...I think he is going to be a super sleeper this year. If you can get volek too I think that pair could start on a lot of FF teams this year.

 

[LHUCKS]

1) Shipp appears to be in position to take more carries than expected, but I still believe Arrington will see the majority of carries.

I agree, but Shipp has been nearly non-existent in deep drafts.

2) As a Bears fan I love Thomas Jones; but having seen Benson play the last four year I believe he is even more talented than Jones. I'd love to see him in camp, as the two of them may be needed with Grossman down.

Yeah, as I stated that was a bit of fishing. I really think they're two different backs. Benson is a better pure rusher and Jones is a better pass catcher...both talented. Which one I'd rather have would depend on the offense.

3) Frerotte's value is up, ONLY bc it looks like he will win the starting job. The O-line looks awful thus far. IF the line improves during camp, I'll go with you that Gus could hold some value, but not until then.

There was nowhere to go but up for Frerotte, currently being selected as the #31 QB(roughly) I've bumped him up to #25 in my rankings.

4) Ditto for Ricky.

The longer Brown holds out, the greater the likelihood that Ricky gets to tote the rock in '05.

5) I'd rather Westbrook be in the same role as he was last year, instead of the focal point of the offense. While he is an amazing athlete, I don't believe he can shoulder the load for a full season.

This is true.

 

[LHUCKS]

Good stuff.

Is Shipp going to see a lot of action?

yep

I haven't seen anything saying shipp is going to be a major player in the Arizona running game. Last I heard he was gimping. I'm not arguing, I would just like to know where you are getting your info. on that one.

I listen to AZ sports talk radio every morning and evening during my commute. I've got buddies that go up North to camp as well...I'm very up to speed on the Cards. Shipp will be getting a large workload this year. Redmond is a darkhorse if Shipp's health fails. Bergen is currently running as the #1 TE while Edwards misses time with a minor injury. Bryant Johnson has looked good, Denny is worried about Warner tonight with the O-line ailing and sucking. I know AZ.

 

[lebowski]

Good stuff.

Is Shipp going to see a lot of action?

yep

I haven't seen anything saying shipp is going to be a major player in the Arizona running game. Last I heard he was gimping. I'm not arguing, I would just like to know where you are getting your info. on that one.

I listen to AZ sports talk radio every morning. I've got buddies that go up North to camp as well...I'm very up to speed on the Cards. Shipp will be getting a large workload this year. Redmond is a darkhorse if Shipp's health fails. Bergen is currently running witht as the #1 TE while Edwards misses time with a minor injury.

How much will this affect JJ's workload? 50/50, 60/40, etc?

 

[Wilbur Wood]

Good stuff.

Is Shipp going to see a lot of action?

yep

I haven't seen anything saying shipp is going to be a major player in the Arizona running game. Last I heard he was gimping. I'm not arguing, I would just like to know where you are getting your info. on that one.

I listen to AZ sports talk radio every morning. I've got buddies that go up North to camp as well...I'm very up to speed on the Cards. Shipp will be getting a large workload this year. Redmond is a darkhorse if Shipp's health fails. Bergen is currently running witht as the #1 TE while Edwards misses time with a minor injury.

What do you mean by "large"?I see a 60-65%/35-30% split between JJ and Shipp on carries and JJ getting many more receptions.

 

[LHUCKS]

Good stuff.

Is Shipp going to see a lot of action?

yep

I haven't seen anything saying shipp is going to be a major player in the Arizona running game. Last I heard he was gimping. I'm not arguing, I would just like to know where you are getting your info. on that one.

I listen to AZ sports talk radio every morning. I've got buddies that go up North to camp as well...I'm very up to speed on the Cards. Shipp will be getting a large workload this year. Redmond is a darkhorse if Shipp's health fails. Bergen is currently running witht as the #1 TE while Edwards misses time with a minor injury.

How much will this affect JJ's workload? 50/50, 60/40, etc?

That's anybody's guess. Arrington is the clear #1 so I seriously doubt 50/50. somewhere between 60/40 and 80/20 would be my guess...which is probably obvious, but it's really still up in the air.

 

[LHUCKS]

Good stuff.

Is Shipp going to see a lot of action?

yep

I haven't seen anything saying shipp is going to be a major player in the Arizona running game. Last I heard he was gimping. I'm not arguing, I would just like to know where you are getting your info. on that one.

I listen to AZ sports talk radio every morning. I've got buddies that go up North to camp as well...I'm very up to speed on the Cards. Shipp will be getting a large workload this year. Redmond is a darkhorse if Shipp's health fails. Bergen is currently running witht as the #1 TE while Edwards misses time with a minor injury.

What do you mean by "large"?I see a 60-65%/35-30% split between JJ and Shipp on carries and JJ getting many more receptions.

That looks about right...but like I said in the previous post nobody knows for certain.

 

[boubucarow]

This is not an opinion based on any particular thing I have witnessed or heard except learning about the talents of Westbrook and Moats. Yet, I am thinking that Westbrook will be playing a Metcalf style role as much as possible in the absence of Owens with Buckhalther and/or Moats handling a ton of the running. Without a healthy Buckhalter or Owens, I could see Westbrook approaching 100 catches with maybe 175 carries or so. Moats would see around 200 carries.

 

[hydroxybear]

This is not an opinion based on any particular thing I have witnessed or heard except learning about the talents of Westbrook and Moats. Yet, I am thinking that Westbrook will be playing a Metcalf style role as much as possible in the absence of Owens with Buckhalther and/or Moats handling a ton of the running. Without a healthy Buckhalter or Owens, I could see Westbrook approaching 100 catches with maybe 175 carries or so. Moats would see around 200 carries.

I honestly could not see Moats having the ability to hold up to the pounding of 200 carries. I saw him at training camp and the guy is S M A L L. I thought he looked about 185 lbs, tops.I think westy will be money for 1600 combined yards, 10 tds....as his floor

 

[boubucarow]

This is not an opinion based on any particular thing I have witnessed or heard except learning about the talents of Westbrook and Moats. Yet, I am thinking that Westbrook will be playing a Metcalf style role as much as possible in the absence of Owens with Buckhalther and/or Moats handling a ton of the running. Without a healthy Buckhalter or Owens, I could see Westbrook approaching 100 catches with maybe 175 carries or so. Moats would see around 200 carries.

I honestly could not see Moats having the ability to hold up to the pounding of 200 carries. I saw him at training camp and the guy is S M A L L. I thought he looked about 185 lbs, tops.I think westy will be money for 1600 combined yards, 10 tds....as his floor

So, Westbrook can handle such a heavy load at 5-8 203 but Moats can't get 13 carries a game at 5-8 210.

 

[Obie Wan]

This is not an opinion based on any particular thing I have witnessed or heard except learning about the talents of Westbrook and Moats.  Yet, I am thinking that Westbrook will be playing a Metcalf style role as much as possible in the absence of Owens with Buckhalther and/or Moats handling a ton of the running.  Without a healthy Buckhalter or  Owens, I could see Westbrook approaching 100 catches with maybe 175 carries or so.  Moats would see around 200 carries.

I honestly could not see Moats having the ability to hold up to the pounding of 200 carries. I saw him at training camp and the guy is S M A L L. I thought he looked about 185 lbs, tops.I think westy will be money for 1600 combined yards, 10 tds....as his floor

185 is about what Thurman Thomas played at (if not less)- definitely too small to be do much.

 

[SammyJankis]

I too live in AZ and listen to the sports talk radio all the time. Haven't heard word one about Shipp seeing many carries.There are two many things that I've heard:- Dennis Green has said that Arrington will be in on first and third downs and will be spelled on some second downs.- Rowen and Green have both predicted a 1200 yard season for Arrington.I don't see much value in Shipp.

 

[SammyJankis]

Also, Ricky is on the rise in my rankings, but not in most other folks. He generally got panned for his MNF performance, but I think he plays better when he is lighter. He had his worst season in New Orleans when the Saints had him bulk up. His best season for the Dolphins was when he was light.Plus Ronnie Brown continues to hold out, and I'm not sold on him anyway.But ask the average guy on the street, and he'll say "five carries for eight yards? Ricky doesn't have it anymore." I think he's becoming a better value all the time.

 

[Fantasy Strategist]

I too live in AZ and listen to the sports talk radio all the time. Haven't heard word one about Shipp seeing many carries.

There are two many things that I've heard:

- Dennis Green has said that Arrington will be in on first and third downs and will be spelled on some second downs.

- Rowen and Green have both predicted a 1200 yard season for Arrington.

I don't see much value in Shipp.

Denny also said Michael Bennett was good for 1500 yds and 15 TD's as a rookie...not even close...However Denny does like to prove he's right...we shall see

 

[Family Matters]

20) Marcel Shipp - Is emerging as the clear compliment to Arrington in the AZ backfield. Forget about this. Only an injury would allow his Shipp to come in.

19) David Terrel -Name the last time Givens and Branch have played anything close to an entire season :crickets:

Terrel has been clicking with his old teammate in camp. He could put up monster numbers once given the opportunity. Monster numbers? Not likely. Maybe a game or two but that's about it. Ben Watson is the one to watch out for in NE.

18) Mark Clayton - Got his butt into camp and has been impressive. Baltimore will find a way to get their most athletically gifted WR on the field. If you didn't already know this then you weren't paying attention.

17) Brian Westbrook - With his holdout short-lived, he will be more heavily relied upon than ever with the WR situation disintegrating at an alarming rate. Really? He's good?

16) Courtney Anderson - Recently named the #1 in Oakland, if you're looking for a starter with upside late in drafts, he's worth the flier. I agree with this.

15) Ricky Williams - You don't have to like him to realize he's the back with the most ability that's currently in camp. I'm surprised how many people have let their emotions dictate their rankings. Guess what? He's pretty good. The O-line isn't. That line will get better as the season wears on.

14) Fred Taylor - Appears on track to be ready for the season opener and all reports have been positive regarding his in-camp play. I wouldn't trust this situation. I know you're high on him for his draft position but I doubt he gets 200 carries this year.

13) Bobby Engram - Still running with the first team in an offense that is usually among the passing yardage leaders. Up to this point, nobody appears to be making a serious push for Engram's spot. He's going to do well as the WR2. Jackson's going to do even better as the WR1.

12) Jerome Bettis - Staley is out for an extended period of time and Bettis showed he could carry the load for stretches at a time last year. Of course but everyone's going to be after this guy now. The steal might be Staley now.

11) Thomas Jones - Jones has looked great in preseason thus far and Benson is still holding out...btw, Jones is more talented than Benson. Benson is creating opportunities for TJ but 2 things are going to work against him:

1. Fumbles.

2. Chicago management. They want Benson and he'll be their guy once signed.

10) Roydell Williams - Early camp news had been focused on Brandon Jones but homers have long been reporting that Williams is making the most noise in camps. Williams validated the buzz by hauling in two receptions for 80 yards in his first preseason game. With Calico still ailing Roydell might be the sleeper out of Tennessee. You may be right on this one. Still up in the air however.

9) Cedrick Wilson - The Ward holdout is beginning to get ugly and reports from camp state that Ced is giving Randle El all that he can handle in the starting WR competition. At worst he's a #3 that gets a lot of looks, at best he's the #1 WR in week 1. Good call on this one. If Ward holds out he'll be a steal. I do think Ward will make it in at the last minute. At least they are not pissing at each other like TO-Philly.

8) LJ Smith - The TO situation is grim to say the least and the WRs are inexperienced. This could be the year where the talent and opportunity collide. You should of had this bumped up from the beginning. I said in my "under valued" plays that he will do better than the #11 ranking he has. And if TO is gone he'll be even more valuable.

7) Steve McNair - Looked great in his first preseason action and reports are unanimous that he's in his old form. He was 3rd in ppg in 2003. Knowing he is healthy is a good thing. I'm still wondering if he has enough offensive weapons to make a real valuable play.

6) Reggie Brown - Despite his inexperience he's been turning heads in camp. Given the TO situation and Pinkston injury the opportunity may present itself for Brown before many of us had anticipated it would. What happened to Lewis?

5) Larry Johnson - I still don't advocate his selection at his current ADP but Priest is stating he's only at 80% and LJ has looked like a star in camp. I wouldn't get too worried about Holmes. What did he have over 10 YPC last night? Wonder what he'll do when he's feeling closer to 100%?

4) Gus Frerotte - put up 140 yards in limited action in his first preseason game and his WRs have been receiving praise from coach Saban...even David Boston. Most saw this coming becaise of 2 reasons:

1. Gus Frerotte.

2. AJ Feeley.

Seriouly, AJ isn't very good. That's why he was the QB3 in Philly. Besides, with the relationship Gus has with the OC it was likely anyway.

3) Ben Troupe - Is healing faster than expected and as previously mentioned his MVP QB hasn't looked too shabby either. OBTW, Chow is predicting big reception totals for his TEs. Nice call. I didn't know he was healy so quickly. When are they saying he'll be back?

2) Reggie Williams - Early reports are that he is a different player in this year's camp. I'm not sold on this. They selected Jones for a reason. Could be that Williams isn't as good as they thought?

1) Mike Anderson - Less than a month away from the beginning of the season and Anderson is still #1 on the depth chart...easily worth his ADP. What value will he have if he's not the starter? This value for ADP thing is getting carried away. There's a reason he's going in the 10th and later, he's not going to be the starter.

I added some thoughts but some of these guys should of been "on the rise" long before now. A few shouldn't be taken too seriously. Then there are a few I like as well.

 

[BoltBacker]

All the other picks are pretty predestrian, but I was really surprised by the ShipPimping. Not close to the team at all but have been watching/reading that situation closely because this spring I really thought Shipp was in position to be a great mid round steal a la T.Jones but LHUCKS info is the first good info I've heard about Shipp since last season ended.A few "?"s for those close to the situation;- Is Shipp getting most of the goal line work in training camp/preseason?- Is Shipp even healthy?- Are the Cardinals still looking to add RB's? This really will have an effect on drafts because Arrington will go in the third round in most drafts over some very good WR's. Probably too early if he comes anywhere near 60/40 and loses goal line attempts to Shipp. LHUCKS and SammyJ please keep us posted!

 

[RBM]

11) Thomas Jones - Jones has looked great in preseason thus far and Benson is still holding out...btw, Jones is more talented than Benson.

Funny, I didn't know that NFL teams were in the practice of drafting RBs in the top 5 that they thougth were of inferior talent then one they already habve on the roster.

They arent. It was an assinine comment, probably just looking for a reactionAnd David Terrell isnt putting up monster #s anytime soon...c'mon

Other than that, list looks pretty solid. Nice job huckles

 

[hydroxybear]

This is not an opinion based on any particular thing I have witnessed or heard except learning about the talents of Westbrook and Moats.   Yet, I am thinking that Westbrook will be playing a Metcalf style role as much as possible in the absence of Owens with Buckhalther and/or Moats handling a ton of the running.  Without a healthy Buckhalter or  Owens, I could see Westbrook approaching 100 catches with maybe 175 carries or so.  Moats would see around 200 carries.

I honestly could not see Moats having the ability to hold up to the pounding of 200 carries. I saw him at training camp and the guy is S M A L L. I thought he looked about 185 lbs, tops.I think westy will be money for 1600 combined yards, 10 tds....as his floor

185 is about what Thurman Thomas played at (if not less)- definitely too small to be do much.

So Ryan Moats = Thurman Thomas ? Hi, I'm reality. Welcome back...

Just because there is one example of a guy of the same physical stature doing something, doesn't mean that it will be done by someone else.

Seeing Westbrook and Moats together, it looks as if Westy dwarfs him.

Just my $.02 on the topic. But you preseason hype machines can keep pimpin Moats all you want.

I'd say he winds up closer to 20 carries than 200

 

[realamerican85]

Time to update this and put Brandon Jacobs now.

 

[mario8723]

Time to update this and put Brandon Jacobs now.

Based on what, exactly?And don't start in with the whole "his performance against Cleveland" crap either. We all know that the Browns are closer to a Div 1 team right now than a NFL one so what he did was what he should have done against a team of that caliber.

I like the kid, don't get me wrong, but please don't start up the Brandon Jacobs hype machine. Tiki is the man there and will continue to be barring injury.

 

[NYG Endzone]

Don't start talking about the SOD (dynasty) in this thread. Keep it all in one thread

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...howtopic=174292

 

[Billy Bats]

Ricky Williams? You people do know he's suspended for 4 games, right? I wouldn't take him until after I drafted my kicker...which means waiver wire after week 1. Let someone else have him waste away on their bench.

 

[LHUCKS]

Ricky Williams? You people do know he's suspended for 4 games, right? I wouldn't take him until after I drafted my kicker...which means waiver wire after week 1. Let someone else have him waste away on their bench.

Did you see him play tonight?

 

[Chaka]

20) Marcel Shipp - Is emerging as the clear compliment to Arrington in the AZ backfield.

He's still limping and the team signed Redmond and J.Jackson. Temper your enthusiasm.

19) David Terrel -Name the last time Givens and Branch have played anything close to an entire season :crickets:

Terrel has been clicking with his old teammate in camp. He could put up monster numbers once given the opportunity.

David Terrel 4 seasons 53 games 128 catches 1602 yards (12.5ypc) and 9 TDs. David Givens 3 seasons 39 games 99 catches 1476 yards (14.9ypc) 10 TDs.

Deion Branch 3 seasons 37 games 135 catches 1746 yards (12.9ypc) 9 TDs.

I'll take either of those guys loooooong before Terrel.

16) Courtney Anderson - Recently named the #1 in Oakland, if you're looking for a starter with upside late in drafts, he's worth the flier.

He is a decent player but how many opportunities is the TE going to see in that offense?

10) Roydell Williams - Early camp news had been focused on Brandon Jones but homers have long been reporting that Williams is making the most noise in camps. Williams validated the buzz by hauling in two receptions for 80 yards in his first preseason game. With Calico still ailing Roydell might be the sleeper out of Tennessee

Who???

9) Cedrick Wilson - The Ward holdout is beginning to get ugly and reports from camp state that Ced is giving Randle El all that he can handle in the starting WR competition. At worst he's a #3 that gets a lot of looks, at best he's the #1 WR in week 1.

IF Ward holds out then this is a nice call if not see Roydell Williams.

7) Steve McNair - Looked great in his first preseason action and reports are unanimous that he's in his old form. He was 3rd in ppg in 2003.

great call here.

4) Gus Frerotte - put up 140 yards in limited action in his first preseason game and his WRs have been receiving praise from coach Saban...even David Boston.

Another very good call. He does not have the physical tools of a McNair but he has much better weapons. Chambers, Booker, maybe Boston (maybe) and that P.O.S. wife beating TE is pretty good too, throw in a good running game and Frerotte is in a nice position to pull a Rich Gannon.

2) Reggie Williams - Early reports are that he is a different player in this year's camp.

The Reggie Williams hype train has slowly been gaining momentum, he may no longer be a value pick when I draft on 9/3

1) Mike Anderson - Less than a month away from the beginning of the season and Anderson is still #1 on the depth chart...easily worth his ADP.

I agree with this completely. Posession is 9/10ths of the law and right now MA is in posession of the #1 RB gig in Denver and he will hold onto it as long as he keeps producing.

 

[LHUCKS]

20) Marcel Shipp - Is emerging as the clear compliment to Arrington in the AZ backfield.

He's still limping and the team signed Redmond and J.Jackson. Temper your enthusiasm.

19) David Terrel -Name the last time Givens and Branch have played anything close to an entire season  :crickets: 

Terrel has been clicking with his old teammate in camp.  He could put up monster numbers once given the opportunity.

David Terrel 4 seasons 53 games 128 catches 1602 yards (12.5ypc) and 9 TDs. David Givens 3 seasons 39 games 99 catches 1476 yards (14.9ypc) 10 TDs.

Deion Branch 3 seasons 37 games 135 catches 1746 yards (12.9ypc) 9 TDs.

I'll take either of those guys loooooong before Terrel.

16) Courtney Anderson - Recently named the #1 in Oakland, if you're looking for a starter with upside late in drafts, he's worth the flier.

He is a decent player but how many opportunities is the TE going to see in that offense?

10) Roydell Williams - Early camp news had been focused on Brandon Jones but homers have long been reporting that Williams is making the most noise in camps.  Williams validated the buzz by hauling in two receptions for 80 yards in his first preseason game.  With Calico still ailing Roydell might be the sleeper out of Tennessee

Who???

As previously stated, Shipp has been better than many expected. The word here is that he's the most likely back to compliment Arrington...compliment being the key word. If you want to know who the handcuff is, Shipp is your guy IMHO...Redmond did look good tonight though.I'd take Givens and Branch before Terrel as well, I'm simply stating Terrel has been climbing in my rankings.

Courtney Anderson was going undrafted in most drafts. He can be value in deep drafts.

Roydell Williams

 

[Chaka]

As previously stated, Shipp has been better than many expected. The word here is that he's the most likely back to compliment Arrington...compliment being the key word. If you want to know who the handcuff is, Shipp is your guy IMHO...Redmond did look good tonight though.

Better at what? He did not play tonight, he's not practicing at full speed, he was not drafted by Green and two other guys with similar skills were brought in to compete for the spot, I understand that both Redmond and Jackson suck but what does that say about Green's opinion of Shipp? Shipp was demoted from the first team last year in camp and may not even be on the team when the regular season starts this year.Shipp may end up being the guy but I think it is likely you will see a committee approach if Arrington goes down.Personally I do not handcuff Arrington at all.

 

[LHUCKS]

As previously stated, Shipp has been better than many expected.  The word here is that he's the most likely back to compliment Arrington...compliment being the key word.  If you want to know who the handcuff is, Shipp is your guy IMHO...Redmond did look good tonight though.

Better at what? He did not play tonight, he's not practicing at full speed, he was not drafted by Green and two other guys with similar skills were brought in to compete for the spot, I understand that both Redmond and Jackson suck but what does that say about Green's opinion of Shipp? Shipp was demoted from the first team last year in camp and may not even be on the team when the regular season starts this year.Shipp may end up being the guy but I think it is likely you will see a committee approach if Arrington goes down.

Personally I do not handcuff Arrington at all.

To each his own, speculation here in AZ is that Shipp could see a bigger role than many anticipate. He was off my radar completely and now I've moved him into handcuff range. Don't shoot the messenger.

 

[Chaka]

As previously stated, Shipp has been better than many expected. The word here is that he's the most likely back to compliment Arrington...compliment being the key word. If you want to know who the handcuff is, Shipp is your guy IMHO...Redmond did look good tonight though.

Better at what? He did not play tonight, he's not practicing at full speed, he was not drafted by Green and two other guys with similar skills were brought in to compete for the spot, I understand that both Redmond and Jackson suck but what does that say about Green's opinion of Shipp? Shipp was demoted from the first team last year in camp and may not even be on the team when the regular season starts this year.Shipp may end up being the guy but I think it is likely you will see a committee approach if Arrington goes down.

Personally I do not handcuff Arrington at all.

To each his own, speculation here in AZ is that Shipp could see a bigger role than many anticipate. He was off my radar completely and now I've moved him into handcuff range. Don't shoot the messenger.

Gotta shoot somebody...

 

[DonnyT33]

19) David Terrel -Name the last time Givens and Branch have played anything close to an entire season :crickets: Terrel has been clicking with his old teammate in camp. He could put up monster numbers once given the opportunity.no chance in hell.

 

[Marvin88]

11) Thomas Jones - Jones has looked great in preseason thus far and Benson is still holding out...btw, Jones is more talented than Benson.

Funny, I didn't know that NFL teams were in the practice of drafting RBs in the top 5 that they thougth were of inferior talent then one they already habve on the roster.

Funny, I didn't know you got rushing yards and TD's just because you were drafted high. Funny, I thought you actually had to sign and be on the field to play and have stats.

 

[Marvin88]

20) Marcel Shipp - Is emerging as the clear compliment to Arrington in the AZ backfield. Forget about this. Only an injury would allow his Shipp to come in.

19) David Terrel -Name the last time Givens and Branch have played anything close to an entire season  :crickets: 

Terrel has been clicking with his old teammate in camp.  He could put up monster numbers once given the opportunity. Monster numbers? Not likely. Maybe a game or two but that's about it. Ben Watson is the one to watch out for in NE.

18) Mark Clayton - Got his butt into camp and has been impressive.  Baltimore will find a way to get their most athletically gifted WR on the field. If you didn't already know this then you weren't paying attention.

17) Brian Westbrook - With his holdout short-lived, he will be more heavily relied upon than ever with the WR situation disintegrating at an alarming rate. Really? He's good?

16) Courtney Anderson - Recently named the #1 in Oakland, if you're looking for a starter with upside late in drafts, he's worth the flier. I agree with this.

15) Ricky Williams - You don't have to like him to realize he's the back with the most ability that's currently in camp. I'm surprised how many people have let their emotions dictate their rankings. Guess what? He's pretty good. The O-line isn't. That line will get better as the season wears on.

14) Fred Taylor - Appears on track to be ready for the season opener and all reports have been positive regarding his in-camp play. I wouldn't trust this situation. I know you're high on him for his draft position but I doubt he gets 200 carries this year.

13) Bobby Engram - Still running with the first team in an offense that is usually among the passing yardage leaders.  Up to this point, nobody appears to be making a serious push for Engram's spot. He's going to do well as the WR2. Jackson's going to do even better as the WR1.

12) Jerome Bettis - Staley is out for an extended period of time and Bettis showed he could carry the load for stretches at a time last year. Of course but everyone's going to be after this guy now. The steal might be Staley now.

11) Thomas Jones - Jones has looked great in preseason thus far and Benson is still holding out...btw, Jones is more talented than Benson. Benson is creating opportunities for TJ but 2 things are going to work against him:

1. Fumbles.

2. Chicago management. They want Benson and he'll be their guy once signed.

10) Roydell Williams - Early camp news had been focused on Brandon Jones but homers have long been reporting that Williams is making the most noise in camps.  Williams validated the buzz by hauling in two receptions for 80 yards in his first preseason game.  With Calico still ailing Roydell might be the sleeper out of Tennessee. You may be right on this one. Still up in the air however.

9) Cedrick Wilson - The Ward holdout is beginning to get ugly and reports from camp state that Ced is giving Randle El all that he can handle in the starting WR competition.  At worst he's a #3 that gets a lot of looks, at best he's the #1 WR in week 1. Good call on this one. If Ward holds out he'll be a steal. I do think Ward will make it in at the last minute. At least they are not pissing at each other like TO-Philly.

8) LJ Smith - The TO situation is grim to say the least and the WRs are inexperienced.  This could be the year where the talent and opportunity collide. You should of had this bumped up from the beginning. I said in my "under valued" plays that he will do better than the #11 ranking he has. And if TO is gone he'll be even more valuable.

7) Steve McNair - Looked great in his first preseason action and reports are unanimous that he's in his old form.  He was 3rd in ppg in 2003. Knowing he is healthy is a good thing. I'm still wondering if he has enough offensive weapons to make a real valuable play.

6) Reggie Brown - Despite his inexperience he's been turning heads in camp.  Given the TO situation and Pinkston injury the opportunity may present itself for Brown before many of us had anticipated it would. What happened to Lewis?

5) Larry Johnson - I still don't advocate his selection at his current ADP but Priest is stating he's only at 80% and LJ has looked like a star in camp.  I wouldn't get too worried about Holmes. What did he have over 10 YPC last night? Wonder what he'll do when he's feeling closer to 100%?

4) Gus Frerotte - put up 140 yards in limited action in his first preseason game and his WRs have been receiving praise from coach Saban...even David Boston.  Most saw this coming becaise of 2 reasons:

1. Gus Frerotte.

2. AJ Feeley.

Seriouly, AJ isn't very good. That's why he was the QB3 in Philly. Besides, with the relationship Gus has with the OC it was likely anyway.

3) Ben Troupe - Is healing faster than expected and as previously mentioned his MVP QB hasn't looked too shabby either.  OBTW, Chow is predicting big reception totals for his TEs. Nice call. I didn't know he was healy so quickly. When are they saying he'll be back?

2) Reggie Williams - Early reports are that he is a different player in this year's camp.  I'm not sold on this. They selected Jones for a reason. Could be that Williams isn't as good as they thought?

1) Mike Anderson - Less than a month away from the beginning of the season and Anderson is still #1 on the depth chart...easily worth his ADP. What value will he have if he's not the starter? This value for ADP thing is getting carried away. There's a reason he's going in the 10th and later, he's not going to be the starter.

I added some thoughts but some of these guys should of been "on the rise" long before now. A few shouldn't be taken too seriously. Then there are a few I like as well.

As far as Anderson goes, him starting is "gravy"!!! He will get goal line touches because Bell can't get into the end zone.

 

[switz]

11) Thomas Jones - Jones has looked great in preseason thus far and Benson is still holding out...btw, Jones is more talented than Benson.

Funny, I didn't know that NFL teams were in the practice of drafting RBs in the top 5 that they thougth were of inferior talent then one they already habve on the roster.

Funny, I didn't know you got rushing yards and TD's just because you were drafted high. Funny, I thought you actually had to sign and be on the field to play and have stats.

Nice comeback, but you didn't answer his point. Benson is more talented than Jones, period. But, true, if CB doesn't sign (BTW that deal WILL be done this week) then TJ gets the start and some stats.

 

[Iwannabeacowboybaby!]

20) Marcel Shipp - Is emerging as the clear compliment to Arrington in the AZ backfield.

19) David Terrel -Name the last time Givens and Branch have played anything close to an entire season :crickets:

Terrel has been clicking with his old teammate in camp. He could put up monster numbers once given the opportunity.

18) Mark Clayton - Got his butt into camp and has been impressive. Baltimore will find a way to get their most athletically gifted WR on the field.

17) Brian Westbrook - With his holdout short-lived, he will be more heavily relied upon than ever with the WR situation disintegrating at an alarming rate.

16) Courtney Anderson - Recently named the #1 in Oakland, if you're looking for a starter with upside late in drafts, he's worth the flier.

15) Ricky Williams - You don't have to like him to realize he's the back with the most ability that's currently in camp.

14) Fred Taylor - Appears on track to be ready for the season opener and all reports have been positive regarding his in-camp play.

13) Bobby Engram - Still running with the first team in an offense that is usually among the passing yardage leaders. Up to this point, nobody appears to be making a serious push for Engram's spot.

12) Jerome Bettis - Staley is out for an extended period of time and Bettis showed he could carry the load for stretches at a time last year.

11) Thomas Jones - Jones has looked great in preseason thus far and Benson is still holding out...btw, Jones is more talented than Benson.

10) Roydell Williams - Early camp news had been focused on Brandon Jones but homers have long been reporting that Williams is making the most noise in camps. Williams validated the buzz by hauling in two receptions for 80 yards in his first preseason game. With Calico still ailing Roydell might be the sleeper out of Tennessee

9) Cedrick Wilson - The Ward holdout is beginning to get ugly and reports from camp state that Ced is giving Randle El all that he can handle in the starting WR competition. At worst he's a #3 that gets a lot of looks, at best he's the #1 WR in week 1.

8) LJ Smith - The TO situation is grim to say the least and the WRs are inexperienced. This could be the year where the talent and opportunity collide.

7) Steve McNair - Looked great in his first preseason action and reports are unanimous that he's in his old form. He was 3rd in ppg in 2003.

6) Reggie Brown - Despite his inexperience he's been turning heads in camp. Given the TO situation and Pinkston injury the opportunity may present itself for Brown before many of us had anticipated it would.

5) Larry Johnson - I still don't advocate his selection at his current ADP but Priest is stating he's only at 80% and LJ has looked like a star in camp.

4) Gus Frerotte - put up 140 yards in limited action in his first preseason game and his WRs have been receiving praise from coach Saban...even David Boston.

3) Ben Troupe - Is healing faster than expected and as previously mentioned his MVP QB hasn't looked too shabby either. OBTW, Chow is predicting big reception totals for his TEs.

2) Reggie Williams - Early reports are that he is a different player in this year's camp.

1) Mike Anderson - Less than a month away from the beginning of the season and Anderson is still #1 on the depth chart...easily worth his ADP.

Good stuff Lhucks..................in your top 5 are two of TommyGunz backups to his starting RB corps , he's not going to like your list. I've been saying for awhile how I think Larry Johnson is going to get playing time somehow someway. It's just hard to keep good players on the bench, we'll see how this one plays out. Priest is still a super star and will get most of the reps but if the Chiefs are thinking playoffs, he better not have 300 carries heading into week 15 and 16.

Like the idea of Engram, definately worth at least a draft pick as he's gone undrafted in a lot of leagues.

Brian Westbrook and a late round pick in Ryan Moates in PPr leagues is a solid move.

 

[boubucarow]

This is not an opinion based on any particular thing I have witnessed or heard except learning about the talents of Westbrook and Moats. Yet, I am thinking that Westbrook will be playing a Metcalf style role as much as possible in the absence of Owens with Buckhalther and/or Moats handling a ton of the running. Without a healthy Buckhalter or Owens, I could see Westbrook approaching 100 catches with maybe 175 carries or so. Moats would see around 200 carries.

I honestly could not see Moats having the ability to hold up to the pounding of 200 carries. I saw him at training camp and the guy is S M A L L. I thought he looked about 185 lbs, tops.I think westy will be money for 1600 combined yards, 10 tds....as his floor

185 is about what Thurman Thomas played at (if not less)- definitely too small to be do much.

So Ryan Moats = Thurman Thomas ? Hi, I'm reality. Welcome back...

Just because there is one example of a guy of the same physical stature doing something, doesn't mean that it will be done by someone else.

Seeing Westbrook and Moats together, it looks as if Westy dwarfs him.

Just my $.02 on the topic. But you preseason hype machines can keep pimpin Moats all you want.

I'd say he winds up closer to 20 carries than 200

If Buckhalter is healthy and Owens is playing, you might be right. However, Moats and Westbrook are of similar size. Even if Westbrook is bigger like you say, you still would need to explain to me why Moats could not carry the ball 13 times a game. In the absence of Buckhalter and Owens, Westbrook getting about 11 or 12 carries and 10 targets a game while Moats gets about 12 or 13 carries a game is feasible as reality. How small would a back have to be to not be able to carry the ball 13 times a game?

 

[Marvin88]

11) Thomas Jones - Jones has looked great in preseason thus far and Benson is still holding out...btw, Jones is more talented than Benson.

Funny, I didn't know that NFL teams were in the practice of drafting RBs in the top 5 that they thougth were of inferior talent then one they already habve on the roster.

Funny, I didn't know you got rushing yards and TD's just because you were drafted high. Funny, I thought you actually had to sign and be on the field to play and have stats.

Nice comeback, but you didn't answer his point. Benson is more talented than Jones, period. But, true, if CB doesn't sign (BTW that deal WILL be done this week) then TJ gets the start and some stats.

I didn't address his point because his point had nothing to do with this thread. So what if Benson is more talented (which I find a hard argument to make when Benson hasn't even played a game in the NFL - ever heard of Tony Mandarich?)? This thread is about guys moving up the chart and exceeding their ADP.

 

[KnowledgeReignsSupreme]

19) David Terrel -Name the last time Givens and Branch have played anything close to an entire season :crickets:

Terrel has been clicking with his old teammate in camp. He could put up monster numbers once given the opportunity.

Name the last time Terrell was GOOD for an entire season :crickets:

17) Brian Westbrook - With his holdout short-lived, he will be more heavily relied upon than ever with the WR situation disintegrating at an alarming rate.

He put up good numbers when the best WRs in town were Pinkston and Thrash so its possible he can do it again.

14) Fred Taylor - Appears on track to be ready for the season opener and all reports have been positive regarding his in-camp play.

Dual ligament tear surgery a mere seven months ago. It's good that he's practicing, but is he going to be effective and can he finish the season?

13) Bobby Engram - Still running with the first team in an offense that is usually among the passing yardage leaders. Up to this point, nobody appears to be making a serious push for Engram's spot.

I like Engram. I don't expect much to come out of a bunch of semi-decent guys on their 2nd and 3rd teams int he last 5 years or so.

10) Roydell Williams - Early camp news had been focused on Brandon Jones but homers have long been reporting that Williams is making the most noise in camps. Williams validated the buzz by hauling in two receptions for 80 yards in his first preseason game. With Calico still ailing Roydell might be the sleeper out of Tennessee

When you're in the last round of the draft looking to take that rookie WR, his name belongs in the random pick out of a hat.

9) Cedrick Wilson - The Ward holdout is beginning to get ugly and reports from camp state that Ced is giving Randle El all that he can handle in the starting WR competition. At worst he's a #3 that gets a lot of looks, at best he's the #1 WR in week 1.

A #3 that gets a lot of looks would be good in STL, MIN or IND. PIT?

7) Steve McNair - Looked great in his first preseason action and reports are unanimous that he's in his old form. He was 3rd in ppg in 2003.

I had this weird dream a couple of months ago. I was looking at the espn final year totals for 2005 and Steve McNair was the #1 QB. He threw for like 4,000 yards.

6) Reggie Brown - Despite his inexperience he's been turning heads in camp. Given the TO situation and Pinkston injury the opportunity may present itself for Brown before many of us had anticipated it would.

I don't question his talent, but I do question Reid's draft history with WRs and Brown's ability to pick up the offense quick enough. Reid has shown that he is more than happy to throw to backs and TEs all season long in lieu of WRs.

5) Larry Johnson - I still don't advocate his selection at his current ADP but Priest is stating he's only at 80% and LJ has looked like a star in camp.

I don't get this whole LJ in the 4th thing either. If you are that worried about Priest, why are you drafting him anyway?I'll take Priest at 80% over just about any other RB in the league.

1) Mike Anderson - Less than a month away from the beginning of the season and Anderson is still #1 on the depth chart...easily worth his ADP.

I have my eye on MA, but I don't think Shanahan intends to use him as his starter. We've all seen this game before. Shanahan already knows what he has in Tatum Bell based on practice and game performance last year. He probably made up his mind at the end of 2004 whether or not Bell is his starter. Featuring MA heavily in the pre-season and running him with the 1st team is just one of those games he plays.It serves a couple of purposes.

1) It gives him an opportunity to see how well MA can play at his age and recovering from the injury last year. He needs to know if MA is good enough to start if Bell falters or gets hurt.

2) Gives other teams a solid look at him if they are needy for a RB at the start of the season (Jax/Pit).

3) Lets the other teams know MA is still good enough of a threat that he has to be accounted for when he's on the field with Bell as the blocking FB.

 

[LHUCKS]

19) David Terrel -Name the last time Givens and Branch have played anything close to an entire season  :crickets: 

Terrel has been clicking with his old teammate in camp.  He could put up monster numbers once given the opportunity.

Name the last time Terrell was GOOD for an entire season :crickets:

Dude...he's been playing for the Bears :X

9) Cedrick Wilson - The Ward holdout is beginning to get ugly and reports from camp state that Ced is giving Randle El all that he can handle in the starting WR competition.  At worst he's a #3 that gets a lot of looks, at best he's the #1 WR in week 1.

A #3 that gets a lot of looks would be good in STL, MIN or IND. PIT?

As I stated, he's competing for the #2 and could possibly be the #1 if Ward continues to hold out...regardless, I think it's safe to move him up from wherever most had him in their rankings.

 

[Gr00vus]

20) Marcel Shipp - Is emerging as the clear compliment to Arrington in the AZ backfield.

I understand you've been getting local info (which doesn't seem to jive with Sammy's info, and he's usually good at keeping his ear to the ground), but I just don't see Shipp playing that much. And here's the thing, even if he does play much I don't think he'll do much with the opportunity, he's just not that good.

19) David Terrel -Name the last time Givens and Branch have played anything close to an entire season :crickets:

Terrel has been clicking with his old teammate in camp. He could put up monster numbers once given the opportunity.

No receiver/te is going to put up monster numbers in the Patriots' system. Moving to NE makes Terrell a possibility at FF WR3, which is a marked improvement for him.

18) Mark Clayton - Got his butt into camp and has been impressive. Baltimore will find a way to get their most athletically gifted WR on the field.

Kyle Boller?

14) Fred Taylor - Appears on track to be ready for the season opener and all reports have been positive regarding his in-camp play.

Stick a fork in him. Gamble on Toefiled or Pearman.

13) Bobby Engram - Still running with the first team in an offense that is usually among the passing yardage leaders. Up to this point, nobody appears to be making a serious push for Engram's spot.

I still can't get the image of that last dropped TD pass from last year's playoff loss out of my head. I can't believe Hasselbeck is excited about having this guy on the field all game. Engram just isn't that great - his best is pedestrian stats. You don't want to have to start this guy, and if you do you'll be looking for someone better all year long (as will the Seahawks). He's an NFL wr3/4 being forced into WR2, I see the other guys on the roster really cutting into his numbers, and there wasn't a whole lot to cut into to start with. I think this year the TE's could be a better play than any non-Jackson Seattle WR. I don't see the Seattle offense doing much better than it did last year, meaning I'd figure you'll get from Engram about what he got last year - which isn't very good.

11) Thomas Jones - Jones has looked great in preseason thus far and Benson is still holding out...btw, Jones is more talented than Benson.

Please, not again. Even if Benson stays out Jones has proved he can't carry the load on his own, which he'd have to do since Grossman is out again. At this point Benson's the only Bear worth taking a shot on.

9) Cedrick Wilson - The Ward holdout is beginning to get ugly and reports from camp state that Ced is giving Randle El all that he can handle in the starting WR competition. At worst he's a #3 that gets a lot of looks, at best he's the #1 WR in week 1.

If Ward and Staley are out, the Steelers are going to be hurting on offense (they weren't exactly Air Coryell to start with), and Cedric Wilson is not the answer. He's value if he takes the #2 job and Ward is playing, if not he's not going to help you much.

4) Gus Frerotte - put up 140 yards in limited action in his first preseason game and his WRs have been receiving praise from coach Saban...even David Boston.

It all boils down to whether Houck can work his magic for the second year in a row. If he can this may pay off, if not you can write the Dolphins off again. I think he can, so I think there is value in just about all the Dolphins.

3) Ben Troupe - Is healing faster than expected and as previously mentioned his MVP QB hasn't looked too shabby either. OBTW, Chow is predicting big reception totals for his TEs.

There's been tons of pub on this guy on the boards this year - he's getting 2004 Antonio Gates pub. Makes me think it'll be tough to get him for "value." He may be worth paying full ticket price for however.

1) Mike Anderson - Less than a month away from the beginning of the season and Anderson is still #1 on the depth chart...easily worth his ADP.

To buy into this you have to believe one of several things which have never happened will happen:1)Shannahan will make Anderson the starter for opening day. He's 32 coming off a major injury.

2)Shannahan will use a goalline/short yardage specialist. I mean, he let QDog take short yardage for frigs sake.

3)Shannahan will turn his back on a running back he drafted before he's busted out or even had the chance to bust out.

I don't see it. His value is if Bell goes down, which makes his ADP about right.