Married to a Shrew (1 Viewer)

[General Malaise]

First of all, I am NOT married to a shrew. My wife is awesome. She hates to spend money, likes Neil Young and almost never nags me. That not why we here.

The weather here in Oregon is glorious, which means 90% of the summer months our windows are open. I was pouring a beer over the kitchen sink, overlooking the neighborhood with the window open when I heard the repulsive, high pitched shrieks of a woman who was obviously upset about something. As the noise grew closer, I peered off to the left of my lawn and noticed a husband and wife walking their baby in a stroller. The woman looked like a paler version of Medusa, with awful hair, no figure and a face for radio. She was just giving her husband the business, gesticulating wildly while the poor dude just looked straight ahead and pushed the stroller. As they crossed my view, she tripped over my neighbors sidewalk, stumbled somewhat, barked out "CHHHHHHHHIITTTTTTTTTT" loudly, then continued her rant to her muted husband who just looked defeated. I tried to video this encounter, but because they were across the street, the phone didn't pick up the sounds. For that, I am blessed. I wanted to race out and tell the guy to RUN.


When my sons were younger, we had them enrolled in a hippie dippie co-op school that required a lot of parental help. I liked it fine, but the other parents were a bit, well....different. One of the moms was a giant whale of a woman with no redeeming qualities in either the looks department or the personality department. She was a hurricane of hideous. Her poor husband was this slight, balding man with glasses, very meek and very nice - WHEN ALLOWED TO SPEAK. She would often times over-talk him, correct him, humiliate him ALL in front of other parents and kids. At a school BBQ, she just verbally undressed him for getting the wrong brand of hot-dog buns. I felt like the guy was going to cry.


I'm sure there are more examples of this, but why the HELL do guys stay in these relationships? If the woman was attractive, I could maybe see it. Maybe. But these shrews would cure every 4 hour, Viagra induced erection on the globe. Let's hear your stories of men married to shrews. Why do you think they stay in these marriages? Kids? Fear? I don't get it. Are you or have you ever been married to a shrew?

 

[AAABatteries]

Oral?

 

[General Malaise]

Oral?

Rather turn to a Hoover, honestly. These women are barf.

 

[rockaction]

I'm on record on this board as criticizing divorce and divorcees, but these sort of situations are staggering. I'm stumped about what to do in these situations. It's one of those things that probably needs to be corrected culture-wide. I see lots of men who are duplicitous in their dealings with women, and tons of shrews. Guess it's been that way since the beginning of time, but egalitarianism and libertinism have sort of exacerbated the whole deal, for better or for worse.

I'd go with worse. I'd like to think that men should aspire to be gentlemanly, tactful, and honest, and women to not over-correct, nag, or do shrew-like things out of frustration.

I've seen a bunch of barf situations that give me pause about my own wisdom in the matter.

 

[Hastur]

I would not entertain the very idea of dating(or marrying for that matter) a shrew. If she was cool until married, then started being a shrew, I would immediately file for divorce. There is no way I could deal with that.

Why do men continue to stay with a shrew? I don't know. Why do women stay with men who physically abuse them? There might be a commonality to them.

 

[tommyboy]

There's a sizable portion of the male population that's a) chubby chaser and/or b) really socially awkward-low self esteem. They also have a fantasy of being a family man, and feel obligated to stay married. It's a recipe for disaster

 

[Zegras11]

Welcome to Oregon

 

[General Malaise]

I would not entertain the very idea of dating(or marrying for that matter) a shrew. If she was cool until married, then started being a shrew, I would immediately file for divorce. There is no way I could deal with that.

Why do men continue to stay with a shrew? I don't know. Why do women stay with men who physically abuse them? There might be a commonality to them.

Thought about that too. Fear for both?

 

[mr roboto]

I have a buddy who has this kind of wife. Verbally abusive and has at times physically lashed out at him or his stuff (broke his windshield, threw his work laptop down the stairs). As most of you know I'm a fairly religious Christian and so is this guy. The church we attend views divorce as the last possible resort (and mainly only for cheating, abuse, extreme emotional neglect). He got counseling from a pastor who advised him to be patient, kind, be the type of husband that she would respect yada yada. Eventually even that pastor advised him to divorce.

After 6 months she filed for divorce (no kids, early 30s and not a ton of money or shared property). He lawyered up, then she changed her mind and wanted to 'make it work.' I spent some time hanging with him, giving advice and drinking beers and trying to be a good friend. I eventually said 'You've gotta get out now while there are no kids and not a huge financial hit. She's crazy.'

One day he told me that they were moving to a new house. That she hadn't changed but said if they got a nicer house that would help her. He also informed me that he and I couldn't hang out anymore because 1. I was advocating he should leave her and 2. She thought being around me and my wife was putting ideas in his head of the type of woman she should be. That's because my wife is nice, keeps herself in shape, let's me do what I want within reason, hardly nags, trusts me to lead the family and generally is the kind of wife most men would want.

His wife hates any woman who isn't a b---- like her. She made them leave the church we attended because she felt everyone was against her (which isn't totally untrue). She actually feels like men need to be controlled and wives should run their husbands lives.

I helped him move a couch into his new house. When I saw her I said 'This place is nice!' Her response - 'Well Matt has a lot of work to do around here to make it how I want it. I'm sure your wife doesn't care if you work around the house but that's not how things go around here.'

I just stood there dumbfounded, turned to my buddy and said 'Good luck man. I'm here if you need anything.' She laughed and stormed off.

I've actually prayed that they not have kids because I'm still holding out hope he gets out. I used to think she could change but she quit 3 separate psychologists when they all eventually concluded she was the cause of 90% of their problems.

 

[comfortably numb]

Maybe the chick is loaded?

Financially I mean

 

[John Bender]

Divorce was best thing to happen to me. Not sure why I ever married the woman in retrospect...a complete self centered controlling immature witch with a mother that was even worse. Had a few people I knew sort of look down their nose at me for not making it work...they can suck my nads sideways . Life is 1000x better since.

 

[Uruk-Hai]

When I was in High School a zillion years ago, I dated a girl who looked like Halle Berry. She was hotter than the heat of 10,000 suns (why she was with me is the subject of a whole other thread, not to mention a #### load of therapy). But, my God, she was a shrieking #####. We couldn't go ANYWHERE without her starting ####. I can't tell you how many times I - the furthest guy from wanting to fight - had to defend us. I think she got off on it. Gorgeous as she was, she wasn't worth the trouble.

Thank goodness she dumped me

 

[5-ish Finkle]

Divorce was best thing to happen to me. Not sure why I ever married the woman in retrospect...a complete self centered controlling immature witch with a mother that was even worse. Had a few people I knew sort of look down their nose at me for not making it work...they can suck my nads sideways . Life is 1000x better since.

Y'know, I've been around people like this(I'm not divorced, but have family/friends who are). And I have to say….this have never computed with me. Ever. No one has any right to judge how another individual chooses to live their life in this regard. They have no idea what goes on day to day in situations such as that. They have no idea how any individual's mental state is affected by what they're dealing with. I don't care what their reasons for judging are; moral, logical, ethical, etc. It's not their business. At. All.

Eff those people.

 

[John Bender]

Divorce was best thing to happen to me. Not sure why I ever married the woman in retrospect...a complete self centered controlling immature witch with a mother that was even worse. Had a few people I knew sort of look down their nose at me for not making it work...they can suck my nads sideways . Life is 1000x better since.

Y'know, I've been around people like this(I'm not divorced, but have family/friends who are). And I have to say.this have never computed with me. Ever. No one has any right to judge how another individual chooses to live their life in this regard. They have no idea what goes on day to day in situations such as that. They have no idea how any individual's mental state is affected by what they're dealing with. I don't care what their reasons for judging are; moral, logical, ethical, etc. It's not their business. At. All.

Eff those people.

True story. Luckily for me, during the whole saga, GM was encouraging me to do the right thing and run for the hills . I still think of him to this day when I look around me and realize how much better life turned out for me since I took his advice.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

Divorce was best thing to happen to me. Not sure why I ever married the woman in retrospect...a complete self centered controlling immature witch with a mother that was even worse. Had a few people I knew sort of look down their nose at me for not making it work...they can suck my nads sideways . Life is 1000x better since.

Y'know, I've been around people like this(I'm not divorced, but have family/friends who are). And I have to say.this have never computed with me. Ever. No one has any right to judge how another individual chooses to live their life in this regard. They have no idea what goes on day to day in situations such as that. They have no idea how any individual's mental state is affected by what they're dealing with. I don't care what their reasons for judging are; moral, logical, ethical, etc. It's not their business. At. All.

Eff those people.

Isn't this whole thread about judging how people choose to live their lives?

 

[Jayrod]

Had a good buddy who was married to one. I didn't know them before they were married, so I don't know the allure, but he never seemed happy.

A year or two after we got to know them, she tells us he is divorcing her. I was kinda surprised, despite their obvious issues as they had kids and I figured he would be willing to do counseling, etc.

So I asked him to lunch to get his side. Come to find out, she'd cheated on him. I'm extremely anti divorce, but I told him to run from her. If she treats him like she does AND cheats on him, screw that.

Now, several years later, he's remarried to a wonderful woman and is a new man. Confident and smiles a lot more. As odd as it sounds, her cheating on him was the best thing that coulda happened to him as it gave him a guilt free out from a soul sucking marriage.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

one of my best friends is engaged to an absolute ####. my wife and i can not stand her. i haven't seen him since my ff draft last year.

 

[5-ish Finkle]

Divorce was best thing to happen to me. Not sure why I ever married the woman in retrospect...a complete self centered controlling immature witch with a mother that was even worse. Had a few people I knew sort of look down their nose at me for not making it work...they can suck my nads sideways . Life is 1000x better since.

Y'know, I've been around people like this(I'm not divorced, but have family/friends who are). And I have to say.this have never computed with me. Ever. No one has any right to judge how another individual chooses to live their life in this regard. They have no idea what goes on day to day in situations such as that. They have no idea how any individual's mental state is affected by what they're dealing with. I don't care what their reasons for judging are; moral, logical, ethical, etc. It's not their business. At. All.

Eff those people.

Isn't this whole thread about judging how people choose to live their lives?

Well, one might say this whole forum is about that.

That said, in this one particular case(judging someone's, I dunno, "worth" or "ability" on whether or not they stayed in a horrible marriage or not)? Eff. Those. People.

Now, if you want to talk about whether someone prefers Munchos to Pringles, naan to yufka, or whether one uses a knife vs. a spoon(like some kind of f@@#ing animal) to get jelly out of a jar, then I'll totally be Judgey McJudgerson right along with the rest of you.

 

[sports_fan]

I don't know anyone in a relationship as bad as the stories being posted but I've known plenty of guys who would rather be in a bad relationship than none at all. These examples are just taking that to the extreme. I'm sure these guys are thinking that if they get out they're going to be alone for a long time. In general they're probably right.

 

[SeveredHorseHeads]

I'm on record on this board as criticizing divorce and divorcees

 

[AAABatteries]

When I was in High School a zillion years ago, I dated a girl who looked like Halle Berry. She was hotter than the heat of 10,000 suns (why she was with me is the subject of a whole other thread, not to mention a #### load of therapy). But, my God, she was a shrieking #####. We couldn't go ANYWHERE without her starting ####. I can't tell you how many times I - the furthest guy from wanting to fight - had to defend us. I think she got off on it. Gorgeous as she was, she wasn't worth the trouble.

Thank goodness she dumped me

The allure here makes sense - hot as hell. I think GM is just talking about the ugly ones.

I plan to keep mouth shut when it comes to the was of the heart forever except my kids. I've opened my mouth in the past and got burned.

 

[belljr]

Now I feel bad "arguing" with my wife when I think she is a slight nag which is hardly ever.

 

[rockaction]

I'm on record on this board as criticizing divorce and divorcees

Yep. I don't find it odd at all to use a traditional moral and ethical judgment about the ability to choose one's life mate and partner, one's ability to use discretion and traditional methods to get to know that person and his or her family before marriage, and then one's fortitude in making it work through tough times.

I think what's ridiculous is people like Finkle who are willing to have a knock-down drag-out over Munchos but then assert that this is somehow more acceptable than the ability to judge a decision like divorce; a decision that affects so many more people than one's self and one's own gratification. It's hard not to mention the historical, social, and religious concern with divorce vs. potato chip preferences. The latter sort of "judgment" sounds like a juvenile with juvenile concerns. Juvenilia can abound all around me; it doesn't mean I have to adopt it.

That said, in extreme (and sometimes just plain) duress, I'm not sure a blanket judgment is appropriate, and there are both social and religious escape hatches from that situation (though these escape hatches, in my estimation, have been abused in recent times.)

For people that would say "tough ####" to me, I'd reply the same.

 

[Officer Pete Malloy]

Some guys aren't happy unless they're miserable.

 

[msudaisy26]

I have seen this a few times, but a friend of my husband and I was married to a woman like this. She stopped letting him hang out with my husband and such and was just a nasty evil woman. He worked 2 jobs, while she went to school. She took 1 class a semester. They had 2 kids, but finally he had a enough and divorced her and it was the best thing he ever did. He lost about 40lbs and he went from being the oldest looking 25 to 30 year old we knew to a normal 35 year old. He recently remarried and even got custody of the children. That was a long battle as well.

 

[Ghost Rider]

I have a buddy who has this kind of wife. Verbally abusive and has at times physically lashed out at him or his stuff (broke his windshield, threw his work laptop down the stairs). As most of you know I'm a fairly religious Christian and so is this guy. The church we attend views divorce as the last possible resort (and mainly only for cheating, abuse, extreme emotional neglect). He got counseling from a pastor who advised him to be patient, kind, be the type of husband that she would respect yada yada. Eventually even that pastor advised him to divorce.

After 6 months she filed for divorce (no kids, early 30s and not a ton of money or shared property). He lawyered up, then she changed her mind and wanted to 'make it work.' I spent some time hanging with him, giving advice and drinking beers and trying to be a good friend. I eventually said 'You've gotta get out now while there are no kids and not a huge financial hit. She's crazy.'

One day he told me that they were moving to a new house. That she hadn't changed but said if they got a nicer house that would help her. He also informed me that he and I couldn't hang out anymore because 1. I was advocating he should leave her and 2. She thought being around me and my wife was putting ideas in his head of the type of woman she should be. That's because my wife is nice, keeps herself in shape, let's me do what I want within reason, hardly nags, trusts me to lead the family and generally is the kind of wife most men would want.

His wife hates any woman who isn't a b---- like her. She made them leave the church we attended because she felt everyone was against her (which isn't totally untrue). She actually feels like men need to be controlled and wives should run their husbands lives.

I helped him move a couch into his new house. When I saw her I said 'This place is nice!' Her response - 'Well Matt has a lot of work to do around here to make it how I want it. I'm sure your wife doesn't care if you work around the house but that's not how things go around here.'

I just stood there dumbfounded, turned to my buddy and said 'Good luck man. I'm here if you need anything.' She laughed and stormed off.

I've actually prayed that they not have kids because I'm still holding out hope he gets out. I used to think she could change but she quit 3 separate psychologists when they all eventually concluded she was the cause of 90% of their problems.

You can't help someone who doesn't want to be helped. It's a safe bet that he ran back to her and told her what you said about her (the "she's crazy" part). Amazing how dumb and gutless some people are.

 

[General Malaise]

Welcome to Oregon

Maybe you're right. Maybe this is just an Oregon thing and men in other parts of the country have balls to stand up for themselves. But I seem to recall some termagants in Texas too. And I saw plenty of college girls lead their boyfriends by the ear in Mississippi.

 

[5-ish Finkle]

I think what's ridiculous is people like Finkle who are willing to have a knock-down drag-out over Munchos but then assert that this is somehow more acceptable than the ability to judge a decision like divorce;

"Judging" someone's choice of snack food is absolutely more acceptable than judging someone's worth/ability/fortitude/level of whatever because they chose to leave a toxic marriage. The snack food thing is completely trivial and effects no one in any meaningful way. It was hyperbole. I thought that was clear. I guess I'll spell it out better in the future

(I guess I should also apologize to anyone who likes Munchos more than Pringles that got offended.)

a decision that affects so many more people than one's self and one's own gratification.

But it's a decision that doesn't effect you(meaning, any outsider to said relationship). So, it's basically none of your business.

If anyone chooses to judge an individual because one day they finally decided "You know what? This situation isn't salvageable and I'm not living like this any more" they're welcome to do so….but they're wrong to do it. To assume that a person decided to end a marriage simply because of "one's own self-gratification" is exactly the kind of horsesh@#$ I'm talking about. You don't know that's the only reason they chose to divorce. Even if they did, your values are not everyone's values. Unless you are involved with the relationship you have zero idea about what really may be going down and what may/may not have been tried to come to some kind of middle ground.

Sometimes things don't work out. Marriages included. Someone wants to judge another person for choosing to end a toxic relationship instead of suffering in silence because it's the logical thing/the ethical thing/"cuz Jesus"? Go for it, I suppose, but "eff them" all the same.

 

[General Malaise]

Divorce was best thing to happen to me. Not sure why I ever married the woman in retrospect...a complete self centered controlling immature witch with a mother that was even worse. Had a few people I knew sort of look down their nose at me for not making it work...they can suck my nads sideways . Life is 1000x better since.

Y'know, I've been around people like this(I'm not divorced, but have family/friends who are). And I have to say.this have never computed with me. Ever. No one has any right to judge how another individual chooses to live their life in this regard. They have no idea what goes on day to day in situations such as that. They have no idea how any individual's mental state is affected by what they're dealing with. I don't care what their reasons for judging are; moral, logical, ethical, etc. It's not their business. At. All.

Eff those people.

Isn't this whole thread about judging how people choose to live their lives?

Questioning. I'm questioning why these guys stick it out. Okay, maybe judging too. Bored on a Sunday.

 

[General Malaise]

Divorce was best thing to happen to me. Not sure why I ever married the woman in retrospect...a complete self centered controlling immature witch with a mother that was even worse. Had a few people I knew sort of look down their nose at me for not making it work...they can suck my nads sideways . Life is 1000x better since.

Y'know, I've been around people like this(I'm not divorced, but have family/friends who are). And I have to say.this have never computed with me. Ever. No one has any right to judge how another individual chooses to live their life in this regard. They have no idea what goes on day to day in situations such as that. They have no idea how any individual's mental state is affected by what they're dealing with. I don't care what their reasons for judging are; moral, logical, ethical, etc. It's not their business. At. All.

Eff those people.

True story. Luckily for me, during the whole saga, GM was encouraging me to do the right thing and run for the hills . I still think of him to this day when I look around me and realize how much better life turned out for me since I took his advice.

Right on, Bender. Happy you're happy!

 

[rockaction]

"Judging" someone's choice of snack food is absolutely more acceptable than judging someone's worth/ability/fortitude/level of whatever because they chose to leave a toxic marriage. The snack food thing is completely trivial and effects no one in any meaningful way. It was hyperbole. I thought that was clear. I guess I'll spell it out better in the future

(I guess I should also apologize to anyone who likes Munchos more than Pringles that got offended.)

Don't mess with my Munchos. Seriously. That said, I did get that it was hyperbole. My point, more broadly, was that the limitation of discussion to trivialities is just that -- trivial. I see no reason why people cannot use their moral compass or judgment to assess what we think of a person by their intimate deeds and acts, especially when broadcast on a message board. It would seem to me that a dogmatic withholding of judgment is indicative of a sort of creeping and yet forced relativism into our discourse, and I don't agree with it.

As far as it affecting me, that is true. It generally doesn't. But I don't think that is relevant. We judge people by how they treat and affect others all the time. I'm certainly allowed to judge people, much like people are allowed to tell me to go eff the pooch. One thing I might quibble with: I'd be careful in characterizing my argument as simply stating that all divorce is about self-gratification. It isn't necessarily. It's one reason why I think divorce is abused in its modern form, but I certainly wouldn't argue that self-gratification is always a reason (primary or secondary) for divorce. I'm aware of that.

On a personal note, my brother and cousin are divorced. I've made it a point to come to terms with their decisions in a manner that I think is fair to all parties. Nobody has ever liked a scold or a ninny; in modern times, nobody likes to be a scold or a ninny. But I can't help but wonder if there isn't a sort of middle ground -- one that allows for a judgment against frivolous and selfish reasons for divorce while also permitting for compassion and understanding when all precautions have been taken going into the marriage and all attempts have been made to reconcile.

That's really my gig. I've taken a shot about divorce here at someone, and I'm not sure it was my place to do so. (Forget that, it wasn't.) That said, the ability to judge or discern a person's moral and ethical makeup from their behavior, both broadcast and in action, is also something I reserve the right to do.

 

[KCitons]

Never marry a shrew. Date a gerbil,fine. But never marry a shrew

 

[SacramentoBob]

Munchos are disgusting.

 

[jon_mx]

I have a buddy who has this kind of wife. Verbally abusive and has at times physically lashed out at him or his stuff (broke his windshield, threw his work laptop down the stairs). As most of you know I'm a fairly religious Christian and so is this guy. The church we attend views divorce as the last possible resort (and mainly only for cheating, abuse, extreme emotional neglect). He got counseling from a pastor who advised him to be patient, kind, be the type of husband that she would respect yada yada. Eventually even that pastor advised him to divorce.

After 6 months she filed for divorce (no kids, early 30s and not a ton of money or shared property). He lawyered up, then she changed her mind and wanted to 'make it work.' I spent some time hanging with him, giving advice and drinking beers and trying to be a good friend. I eventually said 'You've gotta get out now while there are no kids and not a huge financial hit. She's crazy.'

One day he told me that they were moving to a new house. That she hadn't changed but said if they got a nicer house that would help her. He also informed me that he and I couldn't hang out anymore because 1. I was advocating he should leave her and 2. She thought being around me and my wife was putting ideas in his head of the type of woman she should be. That's because my wife is nice, keeps herself in shape, let's me do what I want within reason, hardly nags, trusts me to lead the family and generally is the kind of wife most men would want.

His wife hates any woman who isn't a b---- like her. She made them leave the church we attended because she felt everyone was against her (which isn't totally untrue). She actually feels like men need to be controlled and wives should run their husbands lives.

I helped him move a couch into his new house. When I saw her I said 'This place is nice!' Her response - 'Well Matt has a lot of work to do around here to make it how I want it. I'm sure your wife doesn't care if you work around the house but that's not how things go around here.'

I just stood there dumbfounded, turned to my buddy and said 'Good luck man. I'm here if you need anything.' She laughed and stormed off.

I've actually prayed that they not have kids because I'm still holding out hope he gets out. I used to think she could change but she quit 3 separate psychologists when they all eventually concluded she was the cause of 90% of their problems.

JFC

Typical of a Borderline/Narcissistic B_tch. Not even that extreme of a case. It is impossible for them to admit they are the problem. They know everything and can not be told anything. They have to be in full control and if you try to control them in anyway, it will set off an eruption of anger. When angry there is not limit to the things that will do to spite you. They have no empathy and rarely show remorse. Absolutely no reasoning with them until they calm down, which could be days.

 

[Guest]

I had an aunt like this. Even at a young age I looked at my uncle with pity. He just always looked emotionally and physically beat down. He was a great guy and my dad's best friend. Great/fun guy to be around when my aunt wasn't there.

My aunt died a couple years ago. I always thought it had to be a giant relief to him, but at age 72 I think he's lonely now.

 

[Bonfire]

[SIZE=10.5pt]The inequality still built into divorce laws keeps a lot of men chained. A lot fear the complete wasteland their lives could turn into depending on their situation. I imagine a lot of them are staying in it to at least try and be close to their kids, which would otherwise be pulled out of their lives to a great extent. Figure they will suffer either way, at least if they stay they can see the kiddos every day.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=10.5pt] [/SIZE]

[SIZE=10.5pt]The financial body slam isn't one to be overlooked either; as I've seen some divorced friends turned into working serfs for their ex-wives. Wife stays in the 'home' with the kids and doesn't work (or not much) living the same standard of living more or less, and the guy ends ups up in a one bedroom apartment working a good paying job and sending all his money to his sovereign.[/SIZE]

 

[pats3in4]

Typical of a Borderline/Narcissistic B_tch. Not even that extreme of a case. It is impossible for them to admit they are the problem. They know everything and can not be told anything. They have to be in full control and if you try to control them in anyway, it will set off an eruption of anger. When angry there is not limit to the things that will do to spite you. They have no empathy and rarely show remorse. Absolutely no reasoning with them until they calm down, which could be days.

I divorced my borderline personality disordered wife. Granted, she wasn't a sow, but her behaviors sometimes were exactly like what GM observed. The *sometimes* was why I stayed as long as I did. She was often a wonderful wife, but like the bad times, the good times were just part of a cycle built into her disorder. Took me years to figure it out.

If she was bad all of the time, no way I would have stayed.

 

[tommyboy]

nomarriage.com

 

[Joe Summer]

They're never bad all the time.

 

[comfortably numb]

"Judging" someone's choice of snack food is absolutely more acceptable than judging someone's worth/ability/fortitude/level of whatever because they chose to leave a toxic marriage. The snack food thing is completely trivial and effects no one in any meaningful way. It was hyperbole. I thought that was clear. I guess I'll spell it out better in the future

(I guess I should also apologize to anyone who likes Munchos more than Pringles that got offended.)

Don't mess with my Munchos. Seriously. That said, I did get that it was hyperbole. My point, more broadly, was that the limitation of discussion to trivialities is just that -- trivial. I see no reason why people cannot use their moral compass or judgment to assess what we think of a person by their intimate deeds and acts, especially when broadcast on a message board. It would seem to me that a dogmatic withholding of judgment is indicative of a sort of creeping and yet forced relativism into our discourse, and I don't agree with it.

As far as it affecting me, that is true. It generally doesn't. But I don't think that is relevant. We judge people by how they treat and affect others all the time. I'm certainly allowed to judge people, much like people are allowed to tell me to go eff the pooch. One thing I might quibble with: I'd be careful in characterizing my argument as simply stating that all divorce is about self-gratification. It isn't necessarily. It's one reason why I think divorce is abused in its modern form, but I certainly wouldn't argue that self-gratification is always a reason (primary or secondary) for divorce. I'm aware of that.

On a personal note, my brother and cousin are divorced. I've made it a point to come to terms with their decisions in a manner that I think is fair to all parties. Nobody has ever liked a scold or a ninny; in modern times, nobody likes to be a scold or a ninny. But I can't help but wonder if there isn't a sort of middle ground -- one that allows for a judgment against frivolous and selfish reasons for divorce while also permitting for compassion and understanding when all precautions have been taken going into the marriage and all attempts have been made to reconcile.

That's really my gig. I've taken a shot about divorce here at someone, and I'm not sure it was my place to do so. (Forget that, it wasn't.) That said, the ability to judge or discern a person's moral and ethical makeup from their behavior, both broadcast and in action, is also something I reserve the right to do.

Whew, thank goodness.

I'm sure it's not easy for you. Stay strong. You'll get through this.

 

[mquinnjr]

I would not entertain the very idea of dating(or marrying for that matter) a shrew. If she was cool until married, then started being a shrew, I would immediately file for divorce. There is no way I could deal with that.

Why do men continue to stay with a shrew? I don't know. Why do women stay with men who physically abuse them? There might be a commonality to them.

Fear of the abuser coupled with the fear of not finding someone else, like an imprisonment of the mind.

 

[rockaction]

"Judging" someone's choice of snack food is absolutely more acceptable than judging someone's worth/ability/fortitude/level of whatever because they chose to leave a toxic marriage. The snack food thing is completely trivial and effects no one in any meaningful way. It was hyperbole. I thought that was clear. I guess I'll spell it out better in the future

(I guess I should also apologize to anyone who likes Munchos more than Pringles that got offended.)

Don't mess with my Munchos. Seriously. That said, I did get that it was hyperbole. My point, more broadly, was that the limitation of discussion to trivialities is just that -- trivial. I see no reason why people cannot use their moral compass or judgment to assess what we think of a person by their intimate deeds and acts, especially when broadcast on a message board. It would seem to me that a dogmatic withholding of judgment is indicative of a sort of creeping and yet forced relativism into our discourse, and I don't agree with it.

As far as it affecting me, that is true. It generally doesn't. But I don't think that is relevant. We judge people by how they treat and affect others all the time. I'm certainly allowed to judge people, much like people are allowed to tell me to go eff the pooch. One thing I might quibble with: I'd be careful in characterizing my argument as simply stating that all divorce is about self-gratification. It isn't necessarily. It's one reason why I think divorce is abused in its modern form, but I certainly wouldn't argue that self-gratification is always a reason (primary or secondary) for divorce. I'm aware of that.

On a personal note, my brother and cousin are divorced. I've made it a point to come to terms with their decisions in a manner that I think is fair to all parties. Nobody has ever liked a scold or a ninny; in modern times, nobody likes to be a scold or a ninny. But I can't help but wonder if there isn't a sort of middle ground -- one that allows for a judgment against frivolous and selfish reasons for divorce while also permitting for compassion and understanding when all precautions have been taken going into the marriage and all attempts have been made to reconcile.

That's really my gig. I've taken a shot about divorce here at someone, and I'm not sure it was my place to do so. (Forget that, it wasn't.) That said, the ability to judge or discern a person's moral and ethical makeup from their behavior, both broadcast and in action, is also something I reserve the right to do.

Whew, thank goodness.

I'm sure it's not easy for you. Stay strong. You'll get through this.

Oh, I know. #### me, right? Especially when there are kids and quick and young weddings involved, and I'm involved as a sibling to one. I mean, it's never affected me or the SIL I built a relationship with over the years, nor my nieces and nephews. Seriously, I'm never going to have to worry about their custody battles and other arrangements -- everything down to gatherings, funerals, second weddings, second wives, step kids, etc. -- in my life. I mean, it all just magically sorts itself out, you know?

I'd faint elegantly away out of pleasure if I didn't come to terms with it, I'm sure. It'd be reality, too.

 

[Ned]

"Judging" someone's choice of snack food is absolutely more acceptable than judging someone's worth/ability/fortitude/level of whatever because they chose to leave a toxic marriage. The snack food thing is completely trivial and effects no one in any meaningful way. It was hyperbole. I thought that was clear. I guess I'll spell it out better in the future

(I guess I should also apologize to anyone who likes Munchos more than Pringles that got offended.)

Don't mess with my Munchos. Seriously. That said, I did get that it was hyperbole. My point, more broadly, was that the limitation of discussion to trivialities is just that -- trivial. I see no reason why people cannot use their moral compass or judgment to assess what we think of a person by their intimate deeds and acts, especially when broadcast on a message board. It would seem to me that a dogmatic withholding of judgment is indicative of a sort of creeping and yet forced relativism into our discourse, and I don't agree with it.

As far as it affecting me, that is true. It generally doesn't. But I don't think that is relevant. We judge people by how they treat and affect others all the time. I'm certainly allowed to judge people, much like people are allowed to tell me to go eff the pooch. One thing I might quibble with: I'd be careful in characterizing my argument as simply stating that all divorce is about self-gratification. It isn't necessarily. It's one reason why I think divorce is abused in its modern form, but I certainly wouldn't argue that self-gratification is always a reason (primary or secondary) for divorce. I'm aware of that.

On a personal note, my brother and cousin are divorced. I've made it a point to come to terms with their decisions in a manner that I think is fair to all parties. Nobody has ever liked a scold or a ninny; in modern times, nobody likes to be a scold or a ninny. But I can't help but wonder if there isn't a sort of middle ground -- one that allows for a judgment against frivolous and selfish reasons for divorce while also permitting for compassion and understanding when all precautions have been taken going into the marriage and all attempts have been made to reconcile.

That's really my gig. I've taken a shot about divorce here at someone, and I'm not sure it was my place to do so. (Forget that, it wasn't.) That said, the ability to judge or discern a person's moral and ethical makeup from their behavior, both broadcast and in action, is also something I reserve the right to do.

Whew, thank goodness.

I'm sure it's not easy for you. Stay strong. You'll get through this.

Oh, I know. #### me, right? Especially when there are kids and quick and young weddings involved, and I'm involved as a sibling to one. I mean, it's never affected me or the SIL I built a relationship with over the years, nor my nieces and nephews. Seriously, I'm never going to have to worry about their custody battles and other arrangements -- everything down to gatherings, funerals, second weddings, second wives, step kids, etc. -- in my life. I mean, it all just magically sorts itself out, you know?

I'd faint elegantly away out of pleasure if I didn't come to terms with it, I'm sure. It'd be reality, too.

 

[[icon]]

One day he told me that they were moving to a new house. That she hadn't changed but said if they got a nicer house that would help her. He also informed me that he and I couldn't hang out anymore because 1. I was advocating he should leave her and 2. She thought being around me and my wife was putting ideas in his head of the type of woman she should be. That's because my wife is nice, keeps herself in shape, let's me do what I want within reason, hardly nags, trusts me to lead the family and generally is the kind of wife most men would want.

His wife hates any woman who isn't a b---- like her. She made them leave the church we attended because she felt everyone was against her (which isn't totally untrue). She actually feels like men need to be controlled and wives should run their husbands lives.

I helped him move a couch into his new house. When I saw her I said 'This place is nice!' Her response - 'Well Matt has a lot of work to do around here to make it how I want it. I'm sure your wife doesn't care if you work around the house but that's not how things go around here.'

I just stood there dumbfounded, turned to my buddy and said 'Good luck man. I'm here if you need anything.' She laughed and stormed off.

Whoa...

 

[jon_mx]

"Judging" someone's choice of snack food is absolutely more acceptable than judging someone's worth/ability/fortitude/level of whatever because they chose to leave a toxic marriage. The snack food thing is completely trivial and effects no one in any meaningful way. It was hyperbole. I thought that was clear. I guess I'll spell it out better in the future

(I guess I should also apologize to anyone who likes Munchos more than Pringles that got offended.)

Don't mess with my Munchos. Seriously. That said, I did get that it was hyperbole. My point, more broadly, was that the limitation of discussion to trivialities is just that -- trivial. I see no reason why people cannot use their moral compass or judgment to assess what we think of a person by their intimate deeds and acts, especially when broadcast on a message board. It would seem to me that a dogmatic withholding of judgment is indicative of a sort of creeping and yet forced relativism into our discourse, and I don't agree with it.

As far as it affecting me, that is true. It generally doesn't. But I don't think that is relevant. We judge people by how they treat and affect others all the time. I'm certainly allowed to judge people, much like people are allowed to tell me to go eff the pooch. One thing I might quibble with: I'd be careful in characterizing my argument as simply stating that all divorce is about self-gratification. It isn't necessarily. It's one reason why I think divorce is abused in its modern form, but I certainly wouldn't argue that self-gratification is always a reason (primary or secondary) for divorce. I'm aware of that.

On a personal note, my brother and cousin are divorced. I've made it a point to come to terms with their decisions in a manner that I think is fair to all parties. Nobody has ever liked a scold or a ninny; in modern times, nobody likes to be a scold or a ninny. But I can't help but wonder if there isn't a sort of middle ground -- one that allows for a judgment against frivolous and selfish reasons for divorce while also permitting for compassion and understanding when all precautions have been taken going into the marriage and all attempts have been made to reconcile.

That's really my gig. I've taken a shot about divorce here at someone, and I'm not sure it was my place to do so. (Forget that, it wasn't.) That said, the ability to judge or discern a person's moral and ethical makeup from their behavior, both broadcast and in action, is also something I reserve the right to do.

Whew, thank goodness.

I'm sure it's not easy for you. Stay strong. You'll get through this.

 

[St. Louis Bob]

First of all, I am NOT married to a shrew.

Which is good because a shrew can get pregnant immediately after giving birth and only has a two week gestation.

 

[General Malaise]

First of all, I am NOT married to a shrew.

Which is good because a shrew can get pregnant immediately after giving birth and only has a two week gestation.

 

[Willie Neslon]

Why are you pouring a beer over the sink? Haven't mastered the getting the liquid into the glass thing yet?

 

[General Malaise]

Why are you pouring a beer over the sink? Haven't mastered the getting the liquid into the glass thing yet?

Sounded more masculine than doing dishes.

 

[NCCommish]

"Judging" someone's choice of snack food is absolutely more acceptable than judging someone's worth/ability/fortitude/level of whatever because they chose to leave a toxic marriage. The snack food thing is completely trivial and effects no one in any meaningful way. It was hyperbole. I thought that was clear. I guess I'll spell it out better in the future

(I guess I should also apologize to anyone who likes Munchos more than Pringles that got offended.)

Don't mess with my Munchos. Seriously. That said, I did get that it was hyperbole. My point, more broadly, was that the limitation of discussion to trivialities is just that -- trivial. I see no reason why people cannot use their moral compass or judgment to assess what we think of a person by their intimate deeds and acts, especially when broadcast on a message board. It would seem to me that a dogmatic withholding of judgment is indicative of a sort of creeping and yet forced relativism into our discourse, and I don't agree with it.

As far as it affecting me, that is true. It generally doesn't. But I don't think that is relevant. We judge people by how they treat and affect others all the time. I'm certainly allowed to judge people, much like people are allowed to tell me to go eff the pooch. One thing I might quibble with: I'd be careful in characterizing my argument as simply stating that all divorce is about self-gratification. It isn't necessarily. It's one reason why I think divorce is abused in its modern form, but I certainly wouldn't argue that self-gratification is always a reason (primary or secondary) for divorce. I'm aware of that.

On a personal note, my brother and cousin are divorced. I've made it a point to come to terms with their decisions in a manner that I think is fair to all parties. Nobody has ever liked a scold or a ninny; in modern times, nobody likes to be a scold or a ninny. But I can't help but wonder if there isn't a sort of middle ground -- one that allows for a judgment against frivolous and selfish reasons for divorce while also permitting for compassion and understanding when all precautions have been taken going into the marriage and all attempts have been made to reconcile.

That's really my gig. I've taken a shot about divorce here at someone, and I'm not sure it was my place to do so. (Forget that, it wasn't.) That said, the ability to judge or discern a person's moral and ethical makeup from their behavior, both broadcast and in action, is also something I reserve the right to do.

Whew, thank goodness.

I'm sure it's not easy for you. Stay strong. You'll get through this.

Oh, I know. #### me, right? Especially when there are kids and quick and young weddings involved, and I'm involved as a sibling to one. I mean, it's never affected me or the SIL I built a relationship with over the years, nor my nieces and nephews. Seriously, I'm never going to have to worry about their custody battles and other arrangements -- everything down to gatherings, funerals, second weddings, second wives, step kids, etc. -- in my life. I mean, it all just magically sorts itself out, you know?

I'd faint elegantly away out of pleasure if I didn't come to terms with it, I'm sure. It'd be reality, too.

Amazing how no one realizes you are the real victim here.