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Martz should be fired this week (1 Viewer)

Clifford

Clifford

Footballguy
Any other Bears fans out there who have watched most of the games this year agree? For me, the jury is still out on Cutler. I can't help thinking that he can still be a very good QB but that shambles of a line we have is ruining him. It has dawned on me after watching this poor guy run for his life out there that we simply can not run the Martz offense.

Given the way we draft and the fact none of our starters on o-line should be starting, even if we use every pick in the draft on o-line we still won't have the pieces in place to run it next year. There is no way Cutler can withstand the beatings just for this year. Two years of this and you might as well charge the Bears org with murder.

Now is the time to man up, call it a mistake, admit we were wrong, and fire Martz. This offense simply isn't going to work.

No real need to hire a replacement. We just need to get back to running the football and playing good defense and trying to win close ones by scoring on defense and special teams. Now I know we're going to struggle to run with that line, but we can not let Cutler just sit back and there and take monstrous hit after hit. Time to run some power 1 two-te sets with one wide and a fullback in. Run the #######g single wing, I don't care, I just can't take watching Cutler stand back there and get beaten to a pulp anymore.

 
Eh. We've got 4 wins this year :) ...are in 1st place. Beat our rival the Packers...

Our losses haven been close:

WAS: Lost by 3.

SEA: Lost by 3.

NYG: Lost by 14.

I mean it's not like were getting blown out; and yes I credit much of that to our defense. Let Martz finish off the year; see what we can do with the off-season. Then make a decision. All I know is that our offense looks a hell of a lot better than last-year.

 
Looking back on all of it now, I feel that Kurt Warner may be the biggest reason why Mike Martz is regarded as some kind of offensive genius. Kurt Warner trusted the system, and executed it to perfection… and Martz seems to get all the credit for that success.

I think it takes a cerebral, and very disciplined QB to play “within” Martz’s system… and Cutler is anything but that. He’s got the arm, there’s no denying that… but he comes off as borderline uncoachable as the years tick by. It’s like watching Jeff George all over again.

His press conference was very telling about him last night… blowing off DeAngelo Hall and saying that he would, “Go at him all day long again if they were playing tomorrow.” It’s like Bart Simpson receiving shock after shock while reaching for the Butterfinger; bzzz – OUCH – bzzz – OUCH – bzzz – OUCH…

 
What has Martz done since St. Louis with all that talent? Which brings me to the problem with Cutler's Bears the last two seasons, he has no one to throw the ball to. Devin Hester is not an outside receiver. Cutler is getting blitzed like crazy because no receiver can win one on one. It is going to continue all year. Olsen might as well stay in and block, cause they ain't throwing to him. The defense will keep games close but please Martz, run the ball. They could win if they went run-run-run punt more than Cutler running for his life and throwing to these guys. Play like Parcells Giants not Vermiels Rams.

 
The game yesterday was painful to watch. I have no idea where the blame needs to be placed, but I have come to the conclusion that Jay Cutler has the worst body language in the history of body language. The dude looks defeated before he even steps on the field.

 
Eminence said:
Eh. We've got 4 wins this year :) ...are in 1st place. Beat our rival the Packers...

Our losses haven been close:

WAS: Lost by 3.

SEA: Lost by 3.

NYG: Lost by 14.

I mean it's not like were getting blown out; and yes I credit much of that to our defense. Let Martz finish off the year; see what we can do with the off-season. Then make a decision. All I know is that our offense looks a hell of a lot better than last-year.
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Umm, no. This is the biggest train wreck since John Shoop was calling plays. OP is right, Martz offense isnt the right offense for this team and we have too much invested in Cutler to put him through it any longer.

 
Dizzy said:
Looking back on all of it now, I feel that Kurt Warner may be the biggest reason why Mike Martz is regarded as some kind of offensive genius. Kurt Warner trusted the system, and executed it to perfection… and Martz seems to get all the credit for that success.I think it takes a cerebral, and very disciplined QB to play “within” Martz’s system… and Cutler is anything but that. He’s got the arm, there’s no denying that… but he comes off as borderline uncoachable as the years tick by. It’s like watching Jeff George all over again.
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I think plenty of qbs can look great in the Martz offense, as long as they have a top notch o-line.
 
Dizzy said:
Looking back on all of it now, I feel that Kurt Warner may be the biggest reason why Mike Martz is regarded as some kind of offensive genius. Kurt Warner trusted the system, and executed it to perfection… and Martz seems to get all the credit for that success.I think it takes a cerebral, and very disciplined QB to play “within” Martz’s system… and Cutler is anything but that. He’s got the arm, there’s no denying that… but he comes off as borderline uncoachable as the years tick by. It’s like watching Jeff George all over again.His press conference was very telling about him last night… blowing off DeAngelo Hall and saying that he would, “Go at him all day long again if they were playing tomorrow.” It’s like Bart Simpson receiving shock after shock while reaching for the Butterfinger; bzzz – OUCH – bzzz – OUCH – bzzz – OUCH…
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And Orlando Pace. And Adam Timmerman.
 
urbanhack said:
Martz isn't the one who can't block, throw or make good decisions.
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But he also refuses to adjust and call plays tailored to his personnel. You know your line cant pass block, run the damn ball more or maybe stop with the stupid 7 step drops!
 
Anyone who thinks that we are winning games because our offense is working isn't watching the games. We are winning in spite of our offense almost every game.

Martz's system is famous for two things besides scoring: getting QBs killed and dramatically increasing INTs. Thus far we rank 30th in total offense, 1st in interceptions, and 3rd in turnovers.

I think it's pretty freaking clear his system is not working.

 
Bill Barue said:
What has Martz done since St. Louis with all that talent? Which brings me to the problem with Cutler's Bears the last two seasons, he has no one to throw the ball to. Devin Hester is not an outside receiver. Cutler is getting blitzed like crazy because no receiver can win one on one. It is going to continue all year. Olsen might as well stay in and block, cause they ain't throwing to him. The defense will keep games close but please Martz, run the ball. They could win if they went run-run-run punt more than Cutler running for his life and throwing to these guys. Play like Parcells Giants not Vermiels Rams.
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ZERO. He even failed there as HC. He's trash. Like I said before the season started, one and done. It's only going to get worse offensively for this team as long as he is in the mix. This is his last gig as anything in charge. He may get QB coach somewhere but letting this bozo call plays is a recipe for getting your QB hurt. He can't adapt to personnel. He can't figure out how to use the best players on the team.
 
Dizzy said:
Looking back on all of it now, I feel that Kurt Warner may be the biggest reason why Mike Martz is regarded as some kind of offensive genius.
Click to expand...
I was saying this yesterday, but stretched it to the Rams skill players on the whole. Warner will be a HOFer, Marshall Faulk will be a HOFer, and Bruce & Holt are one of the best receiving tandems in league history. Martz hasn't even cone close to replicating his St. Louis success without that ridiculous array of talent.
 
wdcrob said:
John. Kitna.
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John Kitna didnt have a $1,000,000 arm and a 10 cent head like Cutler. The man has amazing Elway like talent but doesnt have desire to count 1-2-3 release. Kurt Warner said he honed his quick release in the Arena league. Maybe he should go there in the off season.But how Martz has black balled Aromoshadu is sickening :rolleyes:
 
RBM said:
Dizzy said:
Looking back on all of it now, I feel that Kurt Warner may be the biggest reason why Mike Martz is regarded as some kind of offensive genius. Kurt Warner trusted the system, and executed it to perfection… and Martz seems to get all the credit for that success.I think it takes a cerebral, and very disciplined QB to play “within” Martz’s system… and Cutler is anything but that. He’s got the arm, there’s no denying that… but he comes off as borderline uncoachable as the years tick by. It’s like watching Jeff George all over again.
Click to expand...
I think plenty of qbs can look great in the Martz offense, as long as they have a top notch o-line.
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John Kitna's?
 
wdcrob said:
John. Kitna.
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...was sacked 114 times in the two years he played under Martz. Plus the Lions only won 10 games in those same two years.Martz calls plays that take forever to develop and they often result in the QB getting hammered. It only works if you have the best O-Line in the league. Chicago has talent and in the long run I think they would benefit from a different system.

 
told my dad about that as we were watching the game. Like I said, fire Martz, get back to running the football and letting Cutler lock on to his favorite receiver, since Hester can't catch or run routes and Knox is scared of getting hit (no wonder, he looks about 160 soaking wet). I would love to see us try to finish the year in primarily 1WR sets with 2-3 TEs.

 
RBM said:
OP is right, Martz offense isnt the right offense for this team and we have too much invested in Cutler to put him through it any longer.
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I'm not sure what offense would be right for Cutler though. The guy's an enigma. Loads of raw talent but none of the smarts or intangibles that are needed.
 
Jewell said:
Dizzy said:
Looking back on all of it now, I feel that Kurt Warner may be the biggest reason why Mike Martz is regarded as some kind of offensive genius.
Click to expand...
I was saying this yesterday, but stretched it to the Rams skill players on the whole. Warner will be a HOFer, Marshall Faulk will be a HOFer, and Bruce & Holt are one of the best receiving tandems in league history. Martz hasn't even cone close to replicating his St. Louis success without that ridiculous array of talent.
Click to expand...
Been saying it since the Detroit days when he failed miserably. When Jimmy Raye can out coach you (see Vernon Davis 2009), you should not be in the NFL.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Martz is who we thought he was.

If you want to blame someone - blame Angelo and ownership. The Bears have built an identity on excellent defense, and mediocre offense. In the era of salary caps - it is very difficult to be excellent on both sides of the ball. Just not enough money to pay superstars on offense and defense.

Angelo wanted a more prolific offense, so he traded for Cutler - but he did not address other glaring holes on offense - O-Line and WRs. Then he wanted to mask those holes by hiring Martz to deliver a high scoring offense.

What he should have done is saved the money on QB, and bolstered the O-Line and Defense, and then you would have a team that has a chance to win every game with ball control and defense. Now the Bears look like they will be a sub-par team as the defense ages, adn the offense continues to struggle.

 
Does Martz hate Aromashodu or does DA deserve to rarely see the field? From a personnel standpoint, that seems like the one head-scratcher that Martz can control.

 
BallparkFrank said:
Does Martz hate Aromashodu or does DA deserve to rarely see the field? From a personnel standpoint, that seems like the one head-scratcher that Martz can control.
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Martz clearly didn't like that Cutler would look for him and not go through the assigned progressions. DA is sadly the best WR we have, and there is a LOT to read into his situation IMO. Shows that Martz is being given almost total control over the team so long as he doesn't touch the defense. The DA situation is one of the most frustrating things about the Bears and I feel really bad for him. He should be our WR1.
 
BallparkFrank said:
The game yesterday was painful to watch. I have no idea where the blame needs to be placed, but I have come to the conclusion that Jay Cutler has the worst body language in the history of body language. The dude looks defeated before he even steps on the field.
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What would your body language be if you'd been an up-incoming young QB and suddenly you'd been sacked and martzed 3/4s of the way to rex grossman? Don't get me wrong he deserves a whole heaping pile of blame, especially this week, but I'm not that worried about the body language. Ya, its his job to be a leader, but I dont blame him for having very little trust in his team/coaches. :stirspot:
 
Clifford said:
BallparkFrank said:
Does Martz hate Aromashodu or does DA deserve to rarely see the field? From a personnel standpoint, that seems like the one head-scratcher that Martz can control.
Click to expand...
Martz clearly didn't like that Cutler would look for him and not go through the assigned progressions. DA is sadly the best WR we have, and there is a LOT to read into his situation IMO. Shows that Martz is being given almost total control over the team so long as he doesn't touch the defense. The DA situation is one of the most frustrating things about the Bears and I feel really bad for him. He should be our WR1.
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After the lack of effort, especially going hard on routes over the middle, by Knox and Hester this week...he'd better be out there for a lot more snaps after the bye.
 
Dizzy said:
Looking back on all of it now, I feel that Kurt Warner may be the biggest reason why Mike Martz is regarded as some kind of offensive genius. Kurt Warner trusted the system, and executed it to perfection… and Martz seems to get all the credit for that success.I think it takes a cerebral, and very disciplined QB to play “within” Martz’s system… and Cutler is anything but that. He’s got the arm, there’s no denying that… but he comes off as borderline uncoachable as the years tick by. It’s like watching Jeff George all over again.His press conference was very telling about him last night… blowing off DeAngelo Hall and saying that he would, “Go at him all day long again if they were playing tomorrow.” It’s like Bart Simpson receiving shock after shock while reaching for the Butterfinger; bzzz – OUCH – bzzz – OUCH – bzzz – OUCH…
Click to expand...
Any QB should go after DeAngelo Hall. The guy is indeed bad. At least 2 ints were the fault of the WRs though (ask Troy Aikman or Steve Mariucci since my opinion will be counted as homerism). And on one of them, it should have been challenged. Hall himself said after the game that he bobbled it and it probably hit the ground. Oh well, sometimes you run bad. They throw a pick six and they get lucky with the delay of game. The refs screw up the goal line TD that should have been a TD. We cause 5 fumbles and can only recover one....
 
Jewell said:
Dizzy said:
Looking back on all of it now, I feel that Kurt Warner may be the biggest reason why Mike Martz is regarded as some kind of offensive genius.
Click to expand...
I was saying this yesterday, but stretched it to the Rams skill players on the whole. Warner will be a HOFer, Marshall Faulk will be a HOFer, and Bruce & Holt are one of the best receiving tandems in league history. Martz hasn't even cone close to replicating his St. Louis success without that ridiculous array of talent.
Click to expand...
Don't forget Orlando Pace in his prime, one of the best LTs in history.
 
Sweetness_34 said:
Dizzy said:
Looking back on all of it now, I feel that Kurt Warner may be the biggest reason why Mike Martz is regarded as some kind of offensive genius. Kurt Warner trusted the system, and executed it to perfection… and Martz seems to get all the credit for that success.

I think it takes a cerebral, and very disciplined QB to play “within” Martz’s system… and Cutler is anything but that. He’s got the arm, there’s no denying that… but he comes off as borderline uncoachable as the years tick by. It’s like watching Jeff George all over again.

His press conference was very telling about him last night… blowing off DeAngelo Hall and saying that he would, “Go at him all day long again if they were playing tomorrow.” It’s like Bart Simpson receiving shock after shock while reaching for the Butterfinger; bzzz – OUCH – bzzz – OUCH – bzzz – OUCH…
Click to expand...
Any QB should go after DeAngelo Hall. The guy is indeed bad. At least 2 ints were the fault of the WRs though (ask Troy Aikman or Steve Mariucci since my opinion will be counted as homerism). And on one of them, it should have been challenged. Hall himself said after the game that he bobbled it and it probably hit the ground. Oh well, sometimes you run bad. They throw a pick six and they get lucky with the delay of game. The refs screw up the goal line TD that should have been a TD. We cause 5 fumbles and can only recover one....
Click to expand...
Which one? There were two back to back.
 
I'm with you OP.

Some have pointed out that the Bears have a winning record and are tops in their division (for now) so I'll give it to them if they pull a 2000 Ravens and win the Super Bowl. But I don't think that's going to happen and I think its like a train wreck you see coming. If you are watching the games, you know this is going to go south and go south badly!

This just doesn't work. The Bears are winning despite their offense, not because of it. ALthough Cutler has a heck of an arm, I still don't think this style of play works when the Chicago weather gets worse. The Qb is getting killed and tossing Picks like crazy. Its just insane.

And for an OC/QB to throw 4 INTs to the same guy in one game is probably the most alarming thing I have seen all together. That SCREAMS that these guys are either not smart enough or too stubborn/cocky to make an adjustment (or some combo of the two). That cost them the game yesterday and you can't win in the NFL like that. When teams study them and see that their offense is that rigid; that predictable, it will be sooner than later that some other team puts them in the same type of predicament.

This just doesn't work and Lord bless the poor IDPers who had to place against DeAngelo Hall yesterday.

 
Ok, I will continue my rant over here. Martz does not need to be fired...yet. Lovie does need to go. Cutler is a beaten boy, he does not instill confidence in his team, but it is not entirely his fault. Martz was not here last year and Cutler had his issues then also. The Bears winning record is courtesy of the defense, special teams, and bad officiating. They could actually have won yesterday had Lovie threw the red flag to review Cutler's TD. Lovie is aweful as head coach, please leave.

Martz offense can work well with the right players. Unfortunately the Bears do not have the right players. It is amazing to me that as bad as the Bears have been they have been in and had a chance to win every game except the NYG game. :head scratch: DeAngelo and Lovie need to move along. Bill Cowher anyone?

 
Sweetness_34 said:
Dizzy said:
Looking back on all of it now, I feel that Kurt Warner may be the biggest reason why Mike Martz is regarded as some kind of offensive genius. Kurt Warner trusted the system, and executed it to perfection… and Martz seems to get all the credit for that success.

I think it takes a cerebral, and very disciplined QB to play “within” Martz’s system… and Cutler is anything but that. He’s got the arm, there’s no denying that… but he comes off as borderline uncoachable as the years tick by. It’s like watching Jeff George all over again.

His press conference was very telling about him last night… blowing off DeAngelo Hall and saying that he would, “Go at him all day long again if they were playing tomorrow.” It’s like Bart Simpson receiving shock after shock while reaching for the Butterfinger; bzzz – OUCH – bzzz – OUCH – bzzz – OUCH…
Click to expand...
Any QB should go after DeAngelo Hall. The guy is indeed bad. At least 2 ints were the fault of the WRs though (ask Troy Aikman or Steve Mariucci since my opinion will be counted as homerism). And on one of them, it should have been challenged. Hall himself said after the game that he bobbled it and it probably hit the ground. Oh well, sometimes you run bad. They throw a pick six and they get lucky with the delay of game. The refs Lovie & staff screw up the goal line TD that should have been a TD. We cause 5 fumbles and can only recover one....
Click to expand...
FYP.Also just because the receiver's should have continued their routes and at least played defensive back on the play does not make those throws good. None of them really had any business being throw. Hall was cheating on the routes hard...not sure if it was Martz telegraphing the playcalling or just Jay tipping his pitches. On the long pick, Hall backed up nearly 10 years as the ball was snapped. If Jay reads the defense at all he never throws that ball. Same thing with the slant, there was a reason Knox gave up on that play...a stupid one in that you never give up on a quick read like that, but that thing was covered.

 
atcdav said:
Ok, I will continue my rant over here. Martz does not need to be fired...yet. Lovie does need to go. Cutler is a beaten boy, he does not instill confidence in his team, but it is not entirely his fault. Martz was not here last year and Cutler had his issues then also. The Bears winning record is courtesy of the defense, special teams, and bad officiating. They could actually have won yesterday had Lovie threw the red flag to review Cutler's TD. Lovie is aweful as head coach, please leave.Martz offense can work well with the right players. Unfortunately the Bears do not have the right players. It is amazing to me that as bad as the Bears have been they have been in and had a chance to win every game except the NYG game. :head scratch: DeAngelo and Lovie need to move along. Bill Cowher anyone?
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Lovie challenged the play before that which was an even more obvious TD than Cutlers and that was denied, and then the play after Cutler fumbled after breaking the plane we intercepted and ran back for a TD, which was called back. The refs were not our friends yesterday and after seeing the initial challenge do nothing I wouldn't have challenged it either. We weren't going to get either call no matter how obvious it was. You could just tell at that point.
 
I'm so sick of the " cutler has loads of talent" garbage. No he doesn't he sucks. He had two nice seasons under mike shanahn. Guess who else had a couple nice years under shanahan. Yep jake plummer.

 
tangfoot said:
Clifford said:
Lovie challenged the play before that which was an even more obvious TD
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You mean the one where the receiver was down clearly with the ball at the one-yard line? Or a different one?
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No, that's the play, the one where the ball clearly broke the plane before he was down. I watched it about ten times. That was a TD. So was Cutlers. So was the interception. Three plays in a row, three TDs scored, not a single one counted.
 
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