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Mathews vs. Tolbert (1 Viewer)

Wait till after he comes back and plays well to start him? I realize this is a super conservative view but come on, hes injured and hasnt had a chance to show if any, what talent he has. In his absence Tolbert has stepped up and performed well above his expectations, its really no more complex than that, I would not be surprised at if SD became a very balanced offense with a RBBC.

 
shortbow said:
Wait till after he comes back and plays well to start him? I realize this is a super conservative view but come on, hes injured and hasnt had a chance to show if any, what talent he has. In his absence Tolbert has stepped up and performed well above his expectations, its really no more complex than that, I would not be surprised at if SD became a very balanced offense with a RBBC.
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I don't think it becomes a RBBC anytime soon. Tolbert gives them the best chance to win now. Matthews is a rookie and Sproles will still ahve a role. 65% tolbert, 20% Matthews, 15% Sproles. Tolbert has separated himself.
 
Nugget said:
shortbow said:
Wait till after he comes back and plays well to start him? I realize this is a super conservative view but come on, hes injured and hasnt had a chance to show if any, what talent he has. In his absence Tolbert has stepped up and performed well above his expectations, its really no more complex than that, I would not be surprised at if SD became a very balanced offense with a RBBC.
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I don't think it becomes a RBBC anytime soon. Tolbert gives them the best chance to win now. Matthews is a rookie and Sproles will still ahve a role. 65% tolbert, 20% Matthews, 15% Sproles. Tolbert has separated himself.
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Finally someone gets it. Mathews did very little with his opportunities and just ended up getting hurt. Tolbert will be the guy to have moving forward.
 
Hipple said:
on second thought, the OP may be onto something here. Whether or not Mathews starts, they are playing AZ (whose run d is poo) I could easily see the chargers blowing out the cards a la what the falcons did to them. With the game out of reach, and while 'killing the clock' etc I could see tollbert getting 10-15 touches in the second half and putting up decent stats. Also you have to think whether Mathews is back or not, the last thing they want is him getting gang tackled/slammed by 3-5 lbs/safeties/DT's as happens in the goalline sets, so those carries likely stay tollberts.
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;)
 
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Hipple said:
Hipple said:
on second thought, the OP may be onto something here. Whether or not Mathews starts, they are playing AZ (whose run d is poo) I could easily see the chargers blowing out the cards a la what the falcons did to them. With the game out of reach, and while 'killing the clock' etc I could see tollbert getting 10-15 touches in the second half and putting up decent stats. Also you have to think whether Mathews is back or not, the last thing they want is him getting gang tackled/slammed by 3-5 lbs/safeties/DT's as happens in the goalline sets, so those carries likely stay tollberts.
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:thumbup:
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;)
 
The elbow thing came out of nowhere... does anyone know anything about this? Did he fall out of the rack this morning? Anyway, I thought that he looked excellent with his limited touches. I think if it wasn't for the elbow crap he would have had the majority of the carries and man, if he had some of the holes that Tolbert had would have had a least one long TD. The situation today kind of reminded me of Thomas Jones V Jamaal Charles. On his TD he showed his ability, tolbert isn't taking the edge and getting into the endzone like that.

 
rowmacks said:
The elbow thing came out of nowhere... does anyone know anything about this? Did he fall out of the rack this morning? Anyway, I thought that he looked excellent with his limited touches. I think if it wasn't for the elbow crap he would have had the majority of the carries and man, if he had some of the holes that Tolbert had would have had a least one long TD. The situation today kind of reminded me of Thomas Jones V Jamaal Charles. On his TD he showed his ability, tolbert isn't taking the edge and getting into the endzone like that.
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How can anyone who watches the games think Mathews will get the carries, he may be good in the future...but lets talk now....He can't hold on to the ball, and he is already injury prone...and Tolbert is unstoppable.Sorry Mathews owners, just like I got mocked for this thread, I'll get mocked for this post....Tolbert is the Man there as long as he is playing like this, regardless of what Mathews does.If Mathews was not a rookie and we were not looking for upside, he would not be rostered in most redrafts. Stats, situation, and durability make that easy to see.
 
Football Critic said:
rowmacks said:
The elbow thing came out of nowhere... does anyone know anything about this? Did he fall out of the rack this morning? Anyway, I thought that he looked excellent with his limited touches. I think if it wasn't for the elbow crap he would have had the majority of the carries and man, if he had some of the holes that Tolbert had would have had a least one long TD. The situation today kind of reminded me of Thomas Jones V Jamaal Charles. On his TD he showed his ability, tolbert isn't taking the edge and getting into the endzone like that.
Click to expand...
How can anyone who watches the games think Mathews will get the carries, he may be good in the future...but lets talk now....He can't hold on to the ball, and he is already injury prone...and Tolbert is unstoppable.

Sorry Mathews owners, just like I got mocked for this thread, I'll get mocked for this post....

Tolbert is the Man there as long as he is playing like this, regardless of what Mathews does.

If Mathews was not a rookie and we were not looking for upside, he would not be rostered in most redrafts. Stats, situation, and durability make that easy to see.
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If you are trying to sell tolbert or buy low on mathews, good job. Watch the games, tolbert is a good story and he runs hard but he has been putting numbers up almost all because of the situation. He is an excellent short yardage and bruiser-type but that is about it. Tolbert is completely unnatural at RB, has questionable hands (watch him catch) and obviously he's no speedster. He had a bad fumble in the last game if I recall correctly and mathews has only had one 'true' fumble in his first game as a pro, the other one was very flukey because he thought the play was over. He was a workhouse in college and is not injury prone and I don't ever remember seeing him fumble before becoming a pro. If you can buy low on him now you will be glad you did. If you want to wager on who finishes with more fantasy points I'd be happy to.

Oh yeah, just saw this:

"Rotoworld) Coach Norv Turner stated in his post-game press conference Sunday that he is "committed" to Ryan Mathews as the Chargers' starting tailback.

Analysis: "I'm committed to Ryan being our starting back, and he showed why," Turner said. "The right thing today was to start with Michael (Tolbert). He was going good, and Ryan gave them a little changeup." Turner cited Mathews' previous high ankle sprain and an elbow injury in Thursday's practice as the primary reasons he didn't start over Tolbert against the Cardinals. Everyone ended up happy, with Mathews totaling 68 yards and a touchdown. The rookie needs to stay in lineups at Oakland in Week 5. Tolbert will stay involved, but his touches figure to decline by the week.

(Article Link)"

 
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rowmacks said:
Football Critic said:
rowmacks said:
The elbow thing came out of nowhere... does anyone know anything about this? Did he fall out of the rack this morning? Anyway, I thought that he looked excellent with his limited touches. I think if it wasn't for the elbow crap he would have had the majority of the carries and man, if he had some of the holes that Tolbert had would have had a least one long TD. The situation today kind of reminded me of Thomas Jones V Jamaal Charles. On his TD he showed his ability, tolbert isn't taking the edge and getting into the endzone like that.
Click to expand...
How can anyone who watches the games think Mathews will get the carries, he may be good in the future...but lets talk now....He can't hold on to the ball, and he is already injury prone...and Tolbert is unstoppable.

Sorry Mathews owners, just like I got mocked for this thread, I'll get mocked for this post....

Tolbert is the Man there as long as he is playing like this, regardless of what Mathews does.

If Mathews was not a rookie and we were not looking for upside, he would not be rostered in most redrafts. Stats, situation, and durability make that easy to see.
Click to expand...
If you are trying to sell tolbert or buy low on mathews, good job. Watch the games, tolbert is a good story and he runs hard but he has been putting numbers up almost all because of the situation. He is an excellent short yardage and bruiser-type but that is about it. Tolbert is completely unnatural at RB, has questionable hands (watch him catch) and obviously he's no speedster. He had a bad fumble in the last game if I recall correctly and mathews has only had one 'true' fumble in his first game as a pro, the other one was very flukey because he thought the play was over. He was a workhouse in college and is not injury prone and I don't ever remember seeing him fumble before becoming a pro. If you can buy low on him now you will be glad you did. If you want to wager on who finishes with more fantasy points I'd be happy to.

Oh yeah, just saw this:

"Rotoworld) Coach Norv Turner stated in his post-game press conference Sunday that he is "committed" to Ryan Mathews as the Chargers' starting tailback.

Analysis: "I'm committed to Ryan being our starting back, and he showed why," Turner said. "The right thing today was to start with Michael (Tolbert). He was going good, and Ryan gave them a little changeup." Turner cited Mathews' previous high ankle sprain and an elbow injury in Thursday's practice as the primary reasons he didn't start over Tolbert against the Cardinals. Everyone ended up happy, with Mathews totaling 68 yards and a touchdown. The rookie needs to stay in lineups at Oakland in Week 5. Tolbert will stay involved, but his touches figure to decline by the week.

(Article Link)"
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Coaches always tell you the truth, and thier gameplan!Also, it looked like Tolbert made a few nice catchesto me, and I have to laugh at the "True" fumble statement...Whats that even mean? if you put it on the ground, you put it on the ground...a fumble is a fumble, thats the true part.

Wager? were u one of the people who doubted Tolbert this week too? and why would u bet on a guy who has injuries we dont even know about? LOL, easy money!

 
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Football Critic said:
Coaches always tell you the truth, and thier gameplan!Also, it looked like Tolbert made a few nice catchesto me, and I have to laugh at the "True" fumble statement...Whats that even mean? if you put it on the ground, you put it on the ground...a fumble is a fumble, thats the true part.Wager? were u one of the people who doubted Tolbert this week too? and why would u bet on a guy who has injuries we dont even know about? LOL, easy money!
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The 'true' fumble statement is going beyond the box score. I consider that fumble the same as an end of half/game hailmary pick. Sure it counts, but was it really bad on the player? PM me your wager if you want, should be fun.
 
how does this play out going forward? RBBC? I dropped Tolbert to waivers but I can always go back with my tail between my legs and pick him back up again. Where would Tolbert rank compared to other waiver gems like Torrain , Bush, and even Felix Jones? who was dumped to waivers in a couple of my leagues

 
bushisdaman said:
how does this play out going forward? RBBC?
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There was a discussion on this in the game thread. Norv has shown a tendency to prefer a workhorse back in his offenses. However, he probably has never had three halfbacks whose upside was so close to equal. All three of them have different strengths and abilities and can beat you badly in the right situation. My guess would be that Norv will try to exploit weaknesses by relying on different guys against different defenses and in different situations. I could even foresee a situation similar to yesterday where Tolbert works most of the 1st half to soften up the defense and then Matthews comes in to capitalize on it.
 
Polar Dude said:
bushisdaman said:
how does this play out going forward? RBBC?
Click to expand...
There was a discussion on this in the game thread. Norv has shown a tendency to prefer a workhorse back in his offenses. However, he probably has never had three halfbacks whose upside was so close to equal. All three of them have different strengths and abilities and can beat you badly in the right situation. My guess would be that Norv will try to exploit weaknesses by relying on different guys against different defenses and in different situations. I could even foresee a situation similar to yesterday where Tolbert works most of the 1st half to soften up the defense and then Matthews comes in to capitalize on it.
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Who is the 3rd RB? Sproles??
 
Alex P Keaton said:
Polar Dude said:
bushisdaman said:
how does this play out going forward? RBBC?
Click to expand...
There was a discussion on this in the game thread. Norv has shown a tendency to prefer a workhorse back in his offenses. However, he probably has never had three halfbacks whose upside was so close to equal. All three of them have different strengths and abilities and can beat you badly in the right situation. My guess would be that Norv will try to exploit weaknesses by relying on different guys against different defenses and in different situations. I could even foresee a situation similar to yesterday where Tolbert works most of the 1st half to soften up the defense and then Matthews comes in to capitalize on it.
Click to expand...
Who is the 3rd RB? Sproles??
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Yes. I doubt we will see him in a situation where he will carry the load like he did against Indy in the playoffs a couple of years ago, but he can still bust out big plays on the ground or in the air.
 
Polar Dude said:
Alex P Keaton said:
Polar Dude said:
bushisdaman said:
how does this play out going forward? RBBC?
Click to expand...
There was a discussion on this in the game thread. Norv has shown a tendency to prefer a workhorse back in his offenses. However, he probably has never had three halfbacks whose upside was so close to equal. All three of them have different strengths and abilities and can beat you badly in the right situation. My guess would be that Norv will try to exploit weaknesses by relying on different guys against different defenses and in different situations. I could even foresee a situation similar to yesterday where Tolbert works most of the 1st half to soften up the defense and then Matthews comes in to capitalize on it.
Click to expand...
Who is the 3rd RB? Sproles??
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Yes. I doubt we will see him in a situation where he will carry the load like he did against Indy in the playoffs a couple of years ago, but he can still bust out big plays on the ground or in the air.
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I can't believe that you think Sproles upside is equal to Mathews (or Tolbert).
 
Just to add something

I was listening to the Chargers broadcast on Sirius yesterday. No idea who their color guy is but he was absolutely raving about Tolbert. Called him a finisher (then explained what that meant). Said that Tolbert needs to be the man in SD and compared him to some really good RB who I cant remember right now

Like I said, no idea who the guy is but found it interesting

 
I held on to Tolbert just in case something like this happened. I'm going to let this play out a little longer before dropping him.

 
I have both Mathews and Tolbert. At this point, I still see myself starting Mathews over Tolbert next week. I'm sure reports will be all over this situation this week though and hopefully we'll all have a clearer picture as to how this will shake out come Friday.

 
AcerFC said:
Just to add somethingI was listening to the Chargers broadcast on Sirius yesterday. No idea who their color guy is but he was absolutely raving about Tolbert. Called him a finisher (then explained what that meant). Said that Tolbert needs to be the man in SD and compared him to some really good RB who I cant remember right nowLike I said, no idea who the guy is but found it interesting
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That's Hank Bauer (former Chargers special teams star from the Air Coryell days). I didn't hear the broadcast yesterday but I did hear an interview with Bauer on Sirius in the preseason and he was raving about Tolbert back then. I remember him saying he expects Tolbert to eventually become a starter for somone else ala Michael Turner.
 
JMJ said:
I have both Mathews and Tolbert. At this point, I still see myself starting Mathews over Tolbert next week. I'm sure reports will be all over this situation this week though and hopefully we'll all have a clearer picture as to how this will shake out come Friday.
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There's already been some coach-speak from Norv that Mathews is the #1... I have no idea what to expect. I have Mendy on a BYE week 5, so I might start both Mathews/Tolbert rather than try to guess who the #1 is this week.
 
cubbie5150 said:
JMJ said:
I have both Mathews and Tolbert. At this point, I still see myself starting Mathews over Tolbert next week. I'm sure reports will be all over this situation this week though and hopefully we'll all have a clearer picture as to how this will shake out come Friday.
Click to expand...
There's already been some coach-speak from Norv that Mathews is the #1... I have no idea what to expect. I have Mendy on a BYE week 5, so I might start both Mathews/Tolbert rather than try to guess who the #1 is this week.
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Link?
 
Football Critic said:
cubbie5150 said:
JMJ said:
I have both Mathews and Tolbert. At this point, I still see myself starting Mathews over Tolbert next week. I'm sure reports will be all over this situation this week though and hopefully we'll all have a clearer picture as to how this will shake out come Friday.
Click to expand...
There's already been some coach-speak from Norv that Mathews is the #1... I have no idea what to expect. I have Mendy on a BYE week 5, so I might start both Mathews/Tolbert rather than try to guess who the #1 is this week.
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Link?
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Somebody posted it in this thread, i think its on this page
 
Norv has already said that he is committed to Matthews. That is good for Matthews owners.

 
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Chargers | Ryan Mathews being eased in

Tue, 05 Oct 2010 14:08:25 -0700

San Diego Chargers RB Ryan Mathews was eased into the game in Week 4 against the Arizona Cardinals with RB Mike Tolbert starting, according to The San Diego Union-Tribune's Kevin Acee. "I'm committed to Ryan being our starting back, and he showed why," head coach Norv Turner said. "The right thing today was to start with Michael. He was going good, and Ryan gave them a little changeup." Mathews wore a protective pad on his elbow from a fall he suffered in practice last week. "It is my (third) game," Mathews said. "I've still got a lot to learn. The more experience you get, the better you get. You can tell a guy like Gates, he's awesome, all those catches like it's nothing. It's because he knows the game so well."

0 Comments | Share: Tweet! Share on Facebook | Source: The San Diego Union-Tribune - Kevin Acee

Read more: http://www.kffl.com/hotw/nfl#ixzz11WjIjOMv :lmao:

 
I own Tolbert, and have no delusions that he'll keep the starting job over a healthy Mathews. You don't move up in the first round to get a guy and then not play him. 5-10 touches max + goal line. Hope I'm wrong.

 
I'm trying to get a gauge on what kind of value these two have going forward as a package. Has anyone traded/traded for either or both of these guys? What did you get/give in return?

 
Tolbert runs with good power and vision, but Matthews is clearly the more gifted. Good problem for the Chargers to have.

 
Man In The Box said:
I'm trying to get a gauge on what kind of value these two have going forward as a package. Has anyone traded/traded for either or both of these guys? What did you get/give in return?
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I'm still working through potential trades, but yesterday I tried selling Mathews / Tolbert / Johnny Knox in exchange for Ray Rice / Colston; it was declined, but he thought about it for most of the day.
 
the Judge is right, Mathews is the 1st round guy so he obviously has a leg up on Tolbert, who was undrafted. Still, NOTHING was said last week about TOlbert starting the game and he racked up good numbers . . . coaches have NO reason to tell the truth about their plans to distribute the carries - why give their opponents a peek at their plans???

 
Shark play to start both this week against a terrible OAK run D? Would've looked nice last week but I was duped into thinking Mathews was back as the starter and dropped Tolbert. Desperately trying to bid on him again this week.

 
cubbie5150 said:
Man In The Box said:
I'm trying to get a gauge on what kind of value these two have going forward as a package. Has anyone traded/traded for either or both of these guys? What did you get/give in return?
Click to expand...
I'm still working through potential trades, but yesterday I tried selling Mathews / Tolbert / Johnny Knox in exchange for Ray Rice / Colston; it was declined, but he thought about it for most of the day.
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OMG that is an awful trade for the Rice owner. He may have taken all day to get back to you, but I suspect he did not think very long about it before deciding to reject it.
 
This kinda belongs in asst coach, so I apologize in advance and I will offer my 2cents after:

I'm having a hard time picking 3 of these 4: Mathews, Hillis, MJD, and Bradshaw. Barring Bradshaw's injury, I think MJD and Hillis are the clearcut starters here.

Considering how bad Oakland is (and how good the chargers are against them historically with Rivers Playing), I could see another arizona repeat to be honest with Mathews and Tolbert both putting up some nice numbers.

Thoughts on who to start above? Thanks.

Lets hope Tolbert doesn't turn into the next LeRon McClain!

 
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