Mattews versus Moreno (1 Viewer)

[DansRams]

Who would you pick? I like Mattews a lot more. I think he is in the much better situation, has better break away speed, I think they are close on power, close on recieving.

In terms of ceiling/floor, I think their floors are the same (middle to lower rb2 for the next 5 yrs+) but I see Moreno's ceiling as low end rb1/high end rb2 versus Mattews (Top 5-6 rb1)

 

[benson_will_lead_the_way]

Put me down for Mathews.

This is simple to me.....Moreno disappointed last season....Mathews has yet to disappoint in the NFL.

 

[DansRams]

Put me down for Mathews.This is simple to me.....Moreno disappointed last season....Mathews has yet to disappoint in the NFL.

What would it take to get you to give up Mattews (if you had him) for Moreno? A 2011 1st? 2011 2nd?

 

[benson_will_lead_the_way]

Put me down for Mathews.This is simple to me.....Moreno disappointed last season....Mathews has yet to disappoint in the NFL.

What would it take to get you to give up Mattews (if you had him) for Moreno? A 2011 1st? 2011 2nd?

These questions are meant for the Assistant Coach forum

 

[socrates]

Although I would take Matthews over Moreno, the margin for me is not so wide. Moreno was somewhat of a disappointment last season. He failed to reach the century mark, and did not post a single 100-yard game. He is, however, a tremendously talented back. I think he is being undervalued by some.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlig...reno-highlights

Also, keep in mind San Diego was unable to generate much of a running game last year. Sure, LT2 had tired legs and lacked the burst to manufacture some yards on his own, but I did not see too many holes for him to run through either.

All of that said, I really like Matthews. He is a well-rounded back in a good situation, and I would rank him slightly higher than Moreno at this point.

http://www.vidoemo.com/yvideo.php?i=d2xaT0...2009-highlights

 

[EBF]

Mathews AINEC.

Better. Faster. Stronger.

 

[shader]

At this point, you have to go with Mathews. He was drafted in the same area, he's going to a better team, and he seems to have better physical tools.

Moreno had his chance at rookie success and wasn't that great. Now it's possible that he'll turn it around, and I think he will to some degree. But he was getting shown up by Buckhalter last year.

Mathews all the way.

 

[Gottabesweet]

so in dynasty leagues Moreno for 1.2 could be very interesting.

 

[SSOG]

so in dynasty leagues Moreno for 1.2 could be very interesting.

Only for the person getting the 1.2.

 

[Ernol]

so in dynasty leagues Moreno for 1.2 could be very interesting.

Only for the person getting the 1.2.

Somewhere between a 1.04 and 1.05 is fair value for Moreno imo. I still own Moreno in a league or two and would definitely take the 1.04 for him.

 

[socrates]

so in dynasty leagues Moreno for 1.2 could be very interesting.

Only for the person getting the 1.2.

Somewhere between a 1.04 and 1.05 is fair value for Moreno imo. I still own Moreno in a league or two and would definitely take the 1.04 for him.

So you would compare Moreno's value with that of Ben Tate or Montario Hardesty?Perhaps I am guilty of over-valuing Moreno, but I would put him more on par with Ryan Matthews.

 

[Warpig]

As a new owner of Ryan Mathews in one of my 16 team dynasties...I like Mathews compared to Moreno. However, I was pretty high on Moreno coming out of Georgia. I liked him more than Mendenhall. I'm willing to give Moreno a free pass for last year. Being a rookie and having your O-line fall apart on you isn't a good combination. The biggest situation to overcome for Moreno is having McDaniels as a head coach...I just don't like McDaniels as a HC...he seems inept and in over his head.

I'd honestly say they are pretty similar in abilities. Mathews may be playing for a team that had a subpar O-line last year and may only get worse this year if McNeil holds out. Add to that the possibility of V-Jax also holding out into the season...not as many weapons to keep defense honest...not that Moreno's situation got any better with the loss of Marshall though.

While I think they are similar, at this point in time I'd have to lean towards having Mathews over Moreno.

 

[moderated]

so in dynasty leagues Moreno for 1.2 could be very interesting.

Only for the person getting the 1.2.

Somewhere between a 1.04 and 1.05 is fair value for Moreno imo. I still own Moreno in a league or two and would definitely take the 1.04 for him.

So you would compare Moreno's value with that of Ben Tate or Montario Hardesty?Perhaps I am guilty of over-valuing Moreno, but I would put him more on par with Ryan Matthews.

 

[mtblackngold]

so in dynasty leagues Moreno for 1.2 could be very interesting.

Only for the person getting the 1.2.

Somewhere between a 1.04 and 1.05 is fair value for Moreno imo. I still own Moreno in a league or two and would definitely take the 1.04 for him.

Dont be so quick to judge, I can see why people want to post their questions on the shark pool.....Who do I start or should i make this trade...You get little to no response on the assitant coach page. Then when they put the question out there they are demeaned for doing so... are all subscribers involved with this website so egotistical that they can't share a little knowledge with the new comers... Seems to me that this is good business sense (attract new customers).I Love the Shark Pool...Gives a geat feel for the trends. I think that "the powers that be" should pay a little more attenion to the little guys , and offer them advise...The assitant Coach page needs a little more attention..... Just posting my evaluation, feel free (i'm waiting).........

 

[Nagle2998]

I'm a pretty big Moreno guy and I'm a little shocked he has been written off as a top rb after one good not great rookie year. Moreno held out last year which I think hurt him some but it wasn't the main reason he wasn't a 1200 yard guy. For whatever reason certain rookies hit a wall and I think Moreno hit that wall the last four weeks of the season which makes his numbers look much worse then they are. He averaged 2.7 YPC the final four weeks prior to that he was averaging a little over 4.25 YPC and his team really wasn't that good. I expect a very strong year for Moreno and I wouldn't trade him for pick 1.1 this year considering the Chargers are a pass first time and they don't have a great line.

 

[Go deep]

so in dynasty leagues Moreno for 1.2 could be very interesting.

Only for the person getting the 1.2.

Somewhere between a 1.04 and 1.05 is fair value for Moreno imo. I still own Moreno in a league or two and would definitely take the 1.04 for him.

Dont be so quick to judge, I can see why people want to post their questions on the shark pool.....Who do I start or should i make this trade...You get little to no response on the assitant coach page. Then when they put the question out there they are demeaned for doing so... are all subscribers involved with this website so egotistical that they can't share a little knowledge with the new comers... Seems to me that this is good business sense (attract new customers).I Love the Shark Pool...Gives a geat feel for the trends. I think that "the powers that be" should pay a little more attenion to the little guys , and offer them advise...The assitant Coach page needs a little more attention..... Just posting my evaluation, feel free (i'm waiting).........

There is a reason peolpe dont frequent the ACF, because they dont really enjoy discussing other peoples teams. If ACF questions were allowed in the Sharkpool, then the tumble weeds would be blowing through here as well. I dont even really come to the Shark pool during the season because it is so littered with "no so well hidden" ACF questions. Im not being stuck up. but i come here to discuss and learn, and threads like "who are you benching for ______" doesnt do much for me.

 

[Spark026]

I'd take Moreno, and it'd be a pretty easy decision. The situation is pretty meh for both, but for totally different reasons. I'd take Moreno just because I think he'll take another step forward this year, and is less of an unknown, and is unquestionably the guy in th Den running game this year.

 

[mtblackngold]

so in dynasty leagues Moreno for 1.2 could be very interesting.

Only for the person getting the 1.2.

Somewhere between a 1.04 and 1.05 is fair value for Moreno imo. I still own Moreno in a league or two and would definitely take the 1.04 for him.

Dont be so quick to judge, I can see why people want to post their questions on the shark pool.....Who do I start or should i make this trade...You get little to no response on the assitant coach page. Then when they put the question out there they are demeaned for doing so... are all subscribers involved with this website so egotistical that they can't share a little knowledge with the new comers... Seems to me that this is good business sense (attract new customers).I Love the Shark Pool...Gives a geat feel for the trends. I think that "the powers that be" should pay a little more attenion to the little guys , and offer them advise...The assitant Coach page needs a little more attention..... Just posting my evaluation, feel free (i'm waiting).........

There is a reason peolpe dont frequent the ACF, because they dont really enjoy discussing other peoples teams. If ACF questions were allowed in the Sharkpool, then the tumble weeds would be blowing through here as well. I dont even really come to the Shark pool during the season because it is so littered with "no so well hidden" ACF questions. Im not being stuck up. but i come here to discuss and learn, and threads like "who are you benching for ______" doesnt do much for me.

I agree, and disagree with your evaluation. I agree that we all come here to learn, which was stated earlier. My point here is the lack of involvement that attracts the questions that should be in the ACF. I'm not saying that guppie questions should be in the Shark Pool. If A new comer could get a response to a question they would be less likely to post a guppie comment in the Shark Pool, and less likely to be degrated for trying to get an answer (which turns them off). I'm just trying to draw attention to the fact that the creators of this website, which I love, ignore the new comers, and that is where they need to build their business. Thanks for your response.

 

[Go deep]

I agree, and disagree with your evaluation. I agree that we all come here to learn, which was stated earlier. My point here is the lack of involvement that attracts the questions that should be in the ACF. I'm not saying that guppie questions should be in the Shark Pool. If A new comer could get a response to a question they would be less likely to post a guppie comment in the Shark Pool, and less likely to be degrated for trying to get an answer (which turns them off). I'm just trying to draw attention to the fact that the creators of this website, which I love, ignore the new comers, and that is where they need to build their business. Thanks for your response.

"Guppies" have always, and will always be welcome here, and can feel free to participate or start any discussion they would like. However, if they have question about team specifics, they just need to post them in the ACF.

 

[mtblackngold]

I agree, and disagree with your evaluation. I agree that we all come here to learn, which was stated earlier. My point here is the lack of involvement that attracts the questions that should be in the ACF. I'm not saying that guppie questions should be in the Shark Pool. If A new comer could get a response to a question they would be less likely to post a guppie comment in the Shark Pool, and less likely to be degrated for trying to get an answer (which turns them off). I'm just trying to draw attention to the fact that the creators of this website, which I love, ignore the new comers, and that is where they need to build their business. Thanks for your response.

"Guppies" have always, and will always be welcome here, and can feel free to participate or start any discussion they would like. However, if they have question about team specifics, they just need to post them in the ACF.

And be degraded if they don't know thy're place.........

 

[mtblackngold]

I agree, and disagree with your evaluation. I agree that we all come here to learn, which was stated earlier. My point here is the lack of involvement that attracts the questions that should be in the ACF. I'm not saying that guppie questions should be in the Shark Pool. If A new comer could get a response to a question they would be less likely to post a guppie comment in the Shark Pool, and less likely to be degrated for trying to get an answer (which turns them off). I'm just trying to draw attention to the fact that the creators of this website, which I love, ignore the new comers, and that is where they need to build their business. Thanks for your response.

"Guppies" have always, and will always be welcome here, and can feel free to participate or start any discussion they would like. However, if they have question about team specifics, they just need to post them in the ACF.

And be degraded if they don't know they're place.........

by the way....Mathews

 

[DansRams]

I agree, and disagree with your evaluation. I agree that we all come here to learn, which was stated earlier. My point here is the lack of involvement that attracts the questions that should be in the ACF. I'm not saying that guppie questions should be in the Shark Pool. If A new comer could get a response to a question they would be less likely to post a guppie comment in the Shark Pool, and less likely to be degrated for trying to get an answer (which turns them off). I'm just trying to draw attention to the fact that the creators of this website, which I love, ignore the new comers, and that is where they need to build their business. Thanks for your response.

"Guppies" have always, and will always be welcome here, and can feel free to participate or start any discussion they would like. However, if they have question about team specifics, they just need to post them in the ACF.

And be degraded if they don't know they're place.........

by the way....Mathews

But by how much? As an example...Is Matthews your #9 Dynasty back and Moreno your #12...and how big a drop is it? Are they same tier?I see Mattews as a low 2nd tier back behind huys like Gore, Stewert, S Jackson, D Williams and Moreno in Tier 3 among Mendenhall, Mccoy, Wells,Turner. Within your own Tiers, where do they fall......The real value question then becomes, what is the difference in value between the Tiers

 

[Go deep]

I agree, and disagree with your evaluation. I agree that we all come here to learn, which was stated earlier. My point here is the lack of involvement that attracts the questions that should be in the ACF. I'm not saying that guppie questions should be in the Shark Pool. If A new comer could get a response to a question they would be less likely to post a guppie comment in the Shark Pool, and less likely to be degrated for trying to get an answer (which turns them off). I'm just trying to draw attention to the fact that the creators of this website, which I love, ignore the new comers, and that is where they need to build their business. Thanks for your response.

"Guppies" have always, and will always be welcome here, and can feel free to participate or start any discussion they would like. However, if they have question about team specifics, they just need to post them in the ACF.

And be degraded if they don't know thy're place.........

Who is degrading them?

 

[SSOG]

So you would compare Moreno's value with that of Ben Tate or Montario Hardesty?Perhaps I am guilty of over-valuing Moreno, but I would put him more on par with Ryan Matthews.

I would trade Moreno for the 1.03 pick.I would trade the 1.04 pick for Moreno.If I were to lump Moreno in with the rookies, I'd rank them Bryant > Mathews > (gap) > Best > Moreno > Spiller > (huge gap) > everyone else

 

[LawFitz]

Matthews is going in the third round of ten team drafts and Moreno, the fifth. So it's clear that most people at this point would take Matthews.

So the better question to ask is would you take Matthews and a Tier III WR or a Tier II WR and Moreno?

 

[socrates]

So you would compare Moreno's value with that of Ben Tate or Montario Hardesty?Perhaps I am guilty of over-valuing Moreno, but I would put him more on par with Ryan Mathews.

I would trade Moreno for the 1.03 pick.I would trade the 1.04 pick for Moreno.If I were to lump Moreno in with the rookies, I'd rank them Bryant > Mathews > (gap) > Best > Moreno > Spiller > (huge gap) > everyone else

Fair enough. That does not seem out of line. I would rank him amongst this year's rookie crop of RB's as follows: Mathews > Moreno > (gap) > Spiller > Best > (gap) > Tate > Hardesty > (gap) . . .Mathews and Moreno both are talented backs with solid opportunities to be the centerpiece of their respective offenses. Moreno, although a disappointment to some degree last season, will be given every opportunity to prove he can be the feature back in Denver.

 

[Zimm]

This is a hard choice here but i would have to go with Mathews. Moreno did not impress me one bit last year.

 

[SSOG]

Mathews and Moreno both are talented backs with solid opportunities to be the centerpiece of their respective offenses. Moreno, although a disappointment to some degree last season, will be given every opportunity to prove he can be the feature back in Denver.

Jay Cutler is gone. Brandon Marshall is gone. Mike Shanahan is gone, Bobby Turner is gone, Alex Gibbs is gone, Rick Dennison is gone. Gary Kubiak is gone. The ZBS is gone. Ben Hamilton is gone. Ryan Clady is possibly gone for the season. The days of "the featured back in Denver" carrying a high degree of intrinsic value are gone.Moreno does look like he'll be given every opportunity to be a starting NFL RB, but in Denver's offense that doesn't automatically give him RB1 upside, and it doesn't make a bit of difference if he's as untalented as he looked last season (see also: Forte, Matt and Slaton, Steve). Besides, I could say the same thing about Jahvid Best (he'll be given every opportunity to prove he can be the featured back in Detroit). If given the choice between three RBs who all have very strong pedigree, I'm going to take the two that haven't already played and looked untalented while doing so.

 

[Gottabesweet]

Great read guys, It's still a toss up for me as Moreno has proven to be a viable RB2 in the league Matthews hasn't yet. I'm comfortable plugging in Moreno some weeks at RB2 or flex in a 12 team league. Currently still in limbo if I should make the offer and try getting 1.2 for Moreno

I already pick 1.1, 1.3, 1.4 so don't want to have too many incoming rookies to count on.

 

[Ernol]

so in dynasty leagues Moreno for 1.2 could be very interesting.

Only for the person getting the 1.2.

Somewhere between a 1.04 and 1.05 is fair value for Moreno imo. I still own Moreno in a league or two and would definitely take the 1.04 for him.

So you would compare Moreno's value with that of Ben Tate or Montario Hardesty?Perhaps I am guilty of over-valuing Moreno, but I would put him more on par with Ryan Matthews.

I like Moreno ahead of Hardesty and Tate. The 1.04 has been (in most of my leagues) CJ Spiller. The 1.05, usually Demaryius Thomas (sometimes Ben Tate). I like Moreno ahead of Thomas and Tate, but I like Spiller/Best/Dez Bryant ahead of Moreno. That puts him in between 1.04 and 1.05 on my board.

 

[treat88]

so in dynasty leagues Moreno for 1.2 could be very interesting.

Only for the person getting the 1.2.

Somewhere between a 1.04 and 1.05 is fair value for Moreno imo. I still own Moreno in a league or two and would definitely take the 1.04 for him.

So you would compare Moreno's value with that of Ben Tate or Montario Hardesty?Perhaps I am guilty of over-valuing Moreno, but I would put him more on par with Ryan Matthews.

I like Moreno ahead of Hardesty and Tate. The 1.04 has been (in most of my leagues) CJ Spiller. The 1.05, usually Demaryius Thomas (sometimes Ben Tate). I like Moreno ahead of Thomas and Tate, but I like Spiller/Best/Dez Bryant ahead of Moreno. That puts him in between 1.04 and 1.05 on my board.

I agree with this. Good concise breakdown.The gap between Mathews and Moreno is huge. I understand some of the variables that led to Moreno's down season, be it injury, the learning curve, etc. but at the end of the day the guy has average (by NFL standards) physical tools to work with. Even if he succeeds in out playing Buckhalter this year and gets the majority of the snaps, he is a guy who is going to put up pedestrian numbers. I don't think he will ever outgrow that "okay for a RB2" crowd.Mathews on the other hand has the tools to be a consistent top 8 producer for a number of seasons. Every week RB1 upside. I honestly see Moreno as the floor for Mathews.I know other will disagree and I respect that opinion, but that's what I see when I watch the two of them.

 

[DoubleG]

As long as we're going down this road - still assuming dynasty - would you trade an older, but more proven commodity for Matthews?

I'm thinking of guys ranked generally ahead of Mathews in redraft - guys like Cedric Benson, SJax, or Ryan Grant?

 

[EBF]

As long as we're going down this road - still assuming dynasty - would you trade an older, but more proven commodity for Matthews?I'm thinking of guys ranked generally ahead of Mathews in redraft - guys like Cedric Benson, SJax, or Ryan Grant?

Yes to all three. SJax is the only one who's close, but with his mileage I would rather gamble on Mathews, who I think is a safe bet to produce Mendenhall numbers at worst.

 

[34=Sweetness]

I find Matthews talents and situation to be vastly overrated. The o-line is weak, and if McNeil and VJax hold out into the season it could get ugly. And for his talent, the Chargers reached big time on Matthews. I still like Moreno, even if only had a mediocre rookie season.