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Minnesota Vikings Team Thread (2 Viewers)

The offense was the same obvious offense it was all year even after the OC change.  The Vikes didn't deserve a playoff appearance if they couldn't win that last game.  I agree with whoever above said the Bears should have thrown the game to make sure they got the Vikes for an easy round 1 playoff victory.  Almost like a bye.  hahaa.

There were times when the play calling was a little more creative and they ran some bootlegs and moving pockets and they were able to move the ball.  They also seemed to have more success when they went hurry up and kept a solid tempo.  Cousins has his limitations and I was disappointed in his play as the season went on as he missed some wide open plays that really hurt in multiple games down the stretch. 

Maybe it's the O-Line but the overall creativity was terrible for the offensive play calling all year.  It just didn't seem like they stayed to the strengths of the team and tried to force a share peg in a round hole. 

 
I think as far as using the personnel of the Vikings offense to do what they do best, the offensive line was supposed to be better at run blocking than pass blocking. Yet the Vikings did not run the ball nearly enough. That is Zimmers main complaint about DeFlippo and the pass to run ratio was too high. Part of that is because the Vikings were playing from behind and had to pass, but other times it was not.

Cook being injured certainly was a part of that, but the Vikings were a balanced offense last season (49% of their plays were runs) copared to this season (40% of the plays were runs) and Cook was out most of last season.

Early on in the season the Vikings were having more success throwing the ball. Adam Theilen 8 100 yard games in a row to start the season but then really tapered off in the second half of the season. I think the Vikings used too many of their good pass plays early on in the season, but teams figured out what the Vikings were doing and found ways to stop it.

The defense did not play as well this season as last either.  Although in a relative sense they still are one of the better defenses in the league.

Going 3 and out 4 times to start the game is Ponder level of ineptitude though. 

 
The losses of Berger and Easton made a poor OL terrible. I underestimated the value of Keenum's ability to scramble - not that I'm second guessing Cousins, but rather the added importance of having a solid OL if you are going to pay a less mobile guy like Cousins.

I was at the game and since I'm a wallower for misery I listened to Barreiro on the 31st, and it left me pretty somber on the state of this team. I think he had a great point on the vaunted defense basically being run over on the 1st drive of the game (when we needed a good start) and then giving up a nearly 10 minute drive the very series after our offense finally scored a TD. This defense is overrated, and really can't even be compared to the Bears D in terms of talent. 

 
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What is the best case scenario for the Vikings’ offensive line this offseason?

So according to PFF grades Elflien was the worst starting center in the league. Mike Remmers was worse than Compton but neither were very good. Brian O'Neil shows promise, the two tackle positions should be set and they have Hill as back up tackle, so the focus should be on guards and centers. As MC states its unlikely the Vikings give up on Elflein yet. He played better his rookie season than he did this year though.

 
BigJim® said:
The losses of Berger and Easton made a poor OL terrible. I underestimated the value of Keenum's ability to scramble - not that I'm second guessing Cousins, but rather the added importance of having a solid OL if you are going to pay a less mobile guy like Cousins.

I was at the game and since I'm a wallower for misery I listened to Barreiro on the 31st, and it left me pretty somber on the state of this team. I think he had a great point on the vaunted defense basically being run over on the 1st drive of the game (when we needed a good start) and then giving up a nearly 10 minute drive the very series after our offense finally scored a TD. This defense is overrated, and really can't even be compared to the Bears D in terms of talent. 
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:shrug: Cousins proved all season that he could deliver while rolling out. His biggest issue was standing, in what he hoped would be a pocket, to deliver the deep balls and not run when he had the chance.

Based on comments from Zimmer it wasn't as much that Cousins can't do it, more that Cousins felt the need to stand in there and deliver rather then take off running if need be.

The first thing the new OC needs to work with Cousins on is taking what the Defense gives him.. Brady made a career out of completing a bunch of short passes until the defense moved up to defend the quick routes.

 
BigJim® said:
The losses of Berger and Easton made a poor OL terrible. I underestimated the value of Keenum's ability to scramble - not that I'm second guessing Cousins, but rather the added importance of having a solid OL if you are going to pay a less mobile guy like Cousins.
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I don't think Cousins is necessarily less mobile.  I just think he was unwilling to be mobile.  That is a fairly big difference.  He moves well on designed roll outs and throws well in a moving pocket.  He is athletic enough to avoid pressure and pick up yards with his feet but he seemed unwilling to do it.  The very few times he did it helped move the chains and kept drives going.  It's not that Cousins can't move it is more that he chose not to.   A big difference in my opinion. 

 
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Biabreakable said:
I love Mike ZImmer but you may be right.

After the Vikings lost to the Eagles in the playoffs DeFlippo got way too much credit for that. It seemed like ZImmer wasn't able to adjust the DEFENSE to what they were doing with RPO and so on. If you can't beat them (with a great defense) then join them right?

Yet after the hired DeFlipp last year and they all sat down watched QB and they decided Cousins was the best option. I still think Cousins was the best option, it just has taken this season for me to see some of his weaknesses that other teams are taking advantage of.

Zimmer has been preaching situational football to all the players every year since he took over a
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The BEST move would have been to trade for Nick Foles. I get after trading for Bradford that would have been a hard sell, but still.  He's like an anti-Cousins, dude has a great record against winning teams.

 
babydemon90 said:
The BEST move would have been to trade for Nick Foles. I get after trading for Bradford that would have been a hard sell, but still.  He's like an anti-Cousins, dude has a great record against winning teams.
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I dont consider team record to be a good measurement of Qb play.

 
Biabreakable said:
I dont consider team record to be a good measurement of Qb play.
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And that's why you have Cousins and his consistent losing against winning teams.  And yea, you also have to ask "was the QB responsible for the win, or was he along for the ride".  Or do you have a QB that chokes in big games?

 
Guys, I don't think I'll be able to hold on of this comes to pass...

The Star Tribune's Ben Goessling reports Hue Jackson landing the Vikings' OC job is "becoming more of a real possibility."

Jackson will interview for the Bengals' head-coaching job, but the Vikings could come calling if he is passed over for that job. Jackson and Vikings coach Mike Zimmer worked together in Cincinnati. Interim OC Kevin Stefanski is interviewing with the Browns and will likely have other coordinating opportunities outside of Minnesota.

 
babydemon90 said:
And that's why you have Cousins and his consistent losing against winning teams.  And yea, you also have to ask "was the QB responsible for the win, or was he along for the ride".  Or do you have a QB that chokes in big games?
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With the O-Line play I really don't see that Foles would have "won" many more games for the Vikings.  The team is flawed at a very important part - the O-Line.  I don't think the offensive game planning helped cover that flaw and that Foles would have ended with a very similar outcome. 

 
babydemon90 said:
And that's why you have Cousins and his consistent losing against winning teams.  And yea, you also have to ask "was the QB responsible for the win, or was he along for the ride".  Or do you have a QB that chokes in big games?
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My opinion on how to measure QB performance has no bearing on the QB the Vikings have, so no I am not responsible for or the reason why Cousins is their QB.

It is a strange way of trying to place blame. Strange indeed.

There are over 53 players and many coaches as well as ownership who all contribute to the bottom line of how a team performs in terms of wins. They get too much praise for when they win and too much blame for when they lose.

 
Andy Dufresne said:
Guys, I don't think I'll be able to hold on of this comes to pass...

The Star Tribune's Ben Goessling reports Hue Jackson landing the Vikings' OC job is "becoming more of a real possibility."

Jackson will interview for the Bengals' head-coaching job, but the Vikings could come calling if he is passed over for that job. Jackson and Vikings coach Mike Zimmer worked together in Cincinnati. Interim OC Kevin Stefanski is interviewing with the Browns and will likely have other coordinating opportunities outside of Minnesota.
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The thought of Jackson even being considered makes me feel sea sick.

 
Zimmer Talks Offensive Coordinator Hire, Getting Team's Identity Back, O-Line + Sparano's Passing, Confidence in Cousins

Zimmer says that last year the team had a chip on their shoulders, and an attitude to win every game. He says they lost that this year, but he has a plan to get it back.

He side steps question about if upgrading the offensive line is a priority.

He is asked if prior relationships with coaches will have any bearing on his decision (Hue Jackson) and he says no. Not really. I know where your going with that question, but its a bad question. I mean its a good question but your probably fishing in the wrong pond. He is smiling about it.

I think what Zimmer is saying is that no Hue Jackson is not a guy he is looking at.

 
Biabreakable said:
Zimmer Talks Offensive Coordinator Hire, Getting Team's Identity Back, O-Line + Sparano's Passing, Confidence in Cousins

Zimmer says that last year the team had a chip on their shoulders, and an attitude to win every game. He says they lost that this year, but he has a plan to get it back.

He side steps question about if upgrading the offensive line is a priority.

He is asked if prior relationships with coaches will have any bearing on his decision (Hue Jackson) and he says no. Not really. I know where your going with that question, but its a bad question. I mean its a good question but your probably fishing in the wrong pond. He is smiling about it.

I think what Zimmer is saying is that no Hue Jackson is not a guy he is looking at.
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That's all we can hope for.  Please say no to Hue.....

 
I'm not sure how reassuring it is for Zimmer to be candid that this team was not nasty. In fact, it was downright soft and lethargic, poorly executing one play after the next. I just don't know if that is something you recapture after you've been repeatedly whipped by every decent team you played.

PA/Leber were speculating trading Rhodes for a 2nd, with Leber saying he just was not the same guy in 2018 (which I think is accurate assessment). I would not trade Rhodes for a 2nd, but think it may make sense to look for the type of defender-for-OL trade Seattle attempted to obtain Duane Brown (later changed to a 3rd rounder when Lane failed his physical). I do think trading a 2nd/3rd for a decent vet OL may be another avenue to look at, in addition to selecting OL at 18.

 
I am hearing that Stepnaski does not want to return as offensive coordinator and that Mike Mularkey may be a candidate but he is considering an offer from Atlanta.

 
mr roboto said:
Biabreakable said:
Kevin Stefanski to remain as Vikings’ offensive coordinator

Thank Odin that it wasn't Hue Jackson.

How do you all feel about the hire?
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I’m happy. Continuity. Develop from within. No one really knows how any coach will work out so I like this better than a retread. 
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:goodposting: ..

Anyone hear what their plans are for the OL Coach?? The Staff site still has "Co-Offensive Line coaches".. Both who seem to have more background as TE coaches, rather then OL.

 
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snogger said:
:goodposting: ..

Anyone hear what their plans are for the OL Coach?? The Staff site still has "Co-Offensive Line coaches".. Both who seem to have more background as TE coaches, rather then OL.
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Not yet.

Zimmer did talk about how losing Sparano just before the season started was difficult for them. Reading into his comments, it sounded like Sparano was a strong voice that he used to listen to and he may have been responsible for some of the running plays and blocking techniques. while Shurmur, DeFlippo and Stefnoski roles more related to the passing game.

I hope they bring in someone good.

At least Stefanski already knows ZImmer and what he wants. There shouldn't be any miscommunication there.

 
Oh yeah and I wanted to say thanks to Charlie Walters for spreading rumors that Stefanski did not want to work with Mike ZImmer.

I see he hasn't changed.

 
Gally said:
Tough to tell for sure.  I still wasn't happy with the creativity once he took over but it's too small a sample size against some not very good defenses.  Hopefully things can get on track. 
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Against Miami the Vikings ran outside a lot. That was refreshing to see.

I think there needs to be improvement to protection before the OC should even be thinking about being cute with scheme.

 
Biabreakable said:
I think there needs to be improvement to protection before the OC should even be thinking about being cute with scheme.
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Agreed and OL should be core focus in the draft this year.  And I dont think they shouldn't spend too much in free agency.  Zimmer knows that he has a small window of opportunity in Super Bowl contention with his current roster. 

 
Aznflyer14 said:
OL should be core focus in the draft this year. And I dont think they shouldn't spend too much in free agency.
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I felt the same last year but it didn't work out that way. I hope Spielman finally realizes that there is a talent shortage at OL throughout the entire league right now (especially interior) , so he won't get caught off guard when those guys fly off the board again.

I'm not going to be one of those over-dramatic fans that is ready to fire fire him if he doesn't take an OL player with the first round pick, but I absolutely believe he's got to come away with 2 quality OL prospects in the first few rounds. As we've already seen with the signings of Reiff and Remmers, free agency alone is not likely to resolve this issue.

 
-arcK- said:
I felt the same last year but it didn't work out that way. I hope Spielman finally realizes that there is a talent shortage at OL throughout the entire league right now (especially interior) , so he won't get caught off guard when those guys fly off the board again.

I'm not going to be one of those over-dramatic fans that is ready to fire fire him if he doesn't take an OL player with the first round pick, but I absolutely believe he's got to come away with 2 quality OL prospects in the first few rounds. As we've already seen with the signings of Reiff and Remmers, free agency alone is not likely to resolve this issue.
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Agreed... Beside, all Spielman needs to look at his team's divisional foes' GM Bob Quinn what he have done in recent past years.  He fortified Lions' OL through draft and free agency and now it has emerged as one of top 5 OL.  

 
Aznflyer14 said:
Agreed... Beside, all Spielman needs to look at his team's divisional foes' GM Bob Quinn what he have done in recent past years.  He fortified Lions' OL through draft and free agency and now it has emerged as one of top 5 OL.  
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I can't even imagine Vikings having a top 5 OL. That would be awesome. Hell I'd settle for top 15.

 
Biabreakable said:
Against Miami the Vikings ran outside a lot. That was refreshing to see.

I think there needs to be improvement to protection before the OC should even be thinking about being cute with scheme.
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By creative I wasn't meaning cute.  I mean don't be so predictable.  I know the O-line was terrible but there were things (planned role outs as an example) that seemed to work every time they did it  -  which was maybe once a game.  To me it seemed that the play calling was very predictable and seemed to play to the o-line weakness more often than not. 

 
Gally said:
By creative I wasn't meaning cute.  I mean don't be so predictable.  I know the O-line was terrible but there were things (planned role outs as an example) that seemed to work every time they did it  -  which was maybe once a game.  To me it seemed that the play calling was very predictable and seemed to play to the o-line weakness more often than not. 
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Stefanski said their intent is to not be predictable. They want to be a balanced offense to keep the other team guessing.

I thought things DeFlippo did were cute and even effective for awhile. Defenses adjusted and he didn't.

Gary Kubiak talking to Vikings about position on coaching staff

This is an interesting development. I guess there wee philosophical differences between Kubiak and what Elway and Fangio wanted to do on offense. Kubiak also wanted to bring two coaches back with him, who the Brocos did not want to hire.

So now Kubiak has interviewed with the Jaguars and is here in Minnesota today.

I guess Kubiak will interview with the Jaguars tomorrow. I misread, thought he had already visited them.

I think Kubiaks experience with the zone blocking system fits right in with what the Vikings have been doing/want to do with Dalvin Cook, moving the pocket and throwing off of play action.

If the Vikings were agreeable to having Klint Kubiak (Garys son) be the QB coach and Dennison could be the offensive line coach/run game coordinator.

 
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liking these additions.. Seems Zimmer realizes this is a "make it or break it" year and bringing in help..

Now to strengthen the OL and get a coach who knows how to get the best out of the OL. :popcorn:

 
snogger said:
liking these additions.. Seems Zimmer realizes this is a "make it or break it" year and bringing in help..

Now to strengthen the OL and get a coach who knows how to get the best out of the OL. :popcorn:
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Well Kubiak is one of the torch bearers for the zone blocking scheme which was so effective with him in Denver and Houston.

Also bootleg play action passing.

I still haven't heard anything about Dennison being hired yet, but I would expect that to be the next move.

The Vikings have already been going in this direction anyways, they just brought in some coaches with a lot of experience running the scheme well.

I guess the TE coach Brian Pariani was the main coach the Broncos did not want back and that was a deal breaker with Kubiak.

 
Does Dalvin Cook appear to be a good one cut runner? If so, bump his stock and the Vikings stock in general. Kubiak is a master at making running backs game breakers if they are good at seeing the hole, cutting, and hitting the hole.

 
dhockster said:
Does Dalvin Cook appear to be a good one cut runner? If so, bump his stock and the Vikings stock in general. Kubiak is a master at making running backs game breakers if they are good at seeing the hole, cutting, and hitting the hole.
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Despite his decent Combine results, he has always elite / exceptional vision.  He'll do well with zone-blocking scheme, showcasing his vision and cutting ability.

 
dhockster said:
Does Dalvin Cook appear to be a good one cut runner? If so, bump his stock and the Vikings stock in general. Kubiak is a master at making running backs game breakers if they are good at seeing the hole, cutting, and hitting the hole.
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Yes.

Although Cook can be successful in power blocking schemes as well the Vikings instantly changed from a more power blocking scheme (used for Adrian Peterson) to more of a zone blocking scheme. They have been drafting players with this scheme in mind. The hiring of Kubiak is just another step further in that direction.

Cook just needs to stay healthy. He will get the ball a lot.

 
Hov34 said:
I'm just going to put this here, because if I troll anymore in that Saints/Rams thread I'll probably get banned.

Enjoy:

https://patelunas.wordpress.com/2019/01/22/a-no-call-10-years-in-the-making/
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We got our revenge last year with the "Minneapolis Miracle".. Time for people to move on..

Since that Saints/Vikings game My Father in-law and brother in-law are constantly chattering about "the fix is in" when talking about the NFL..
I was always the odd man out trying to talk them down..

Sunday though left a VERY bad taste as The Saints got hosed.
I know what they will say the next time I see them.. "The NFL Desperately wanted LA's Market share and team in the Super Bowl and did everything they could to get one of the teams there" .. And after that call I don't have much else to say other then ......   :oldunsure:

 
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Mock Madness 1.0: Experts Picking Offensive Lineman for Vikings in First Round

Below is the first culmination of 16 recent predictions, most of which project the Vikings to beef up their offensive line.

Ole Miss offensive tackle Greg Little was a popular pick as four of the experts had the Vikings taking the 6-foot-6, 325-pound offensive tackle.

Only three of the experts did not pick the Vikings to supplement the offensive line in the first round.
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Linemen

Greg Little

Jonah Williams

Dalton Risner

Jawaan Taylor

 Yodny Cajuste

Cody Ford

Garrett Bradbury

Where does the top talent level drop off from this group? 

The 3 players mocked instead of offensive linemen were defensive end Brian Burns defensive tackle Derrick Brown LB Devin White.

Which defensive players are so good that you think the Vikings should draft them over offensive linemen if they are available at pick 18?

 
It all depends on what they do with Barr. If they do not retain him, then Devin White is the pick if he is still there - no matter who else is available. The top OLinmen will be off in the top 12. The ones that are left aren't that much better than what they can get in rounds 2-3. I think they go White (although I think he is a top 10 talent) and then come back with back to back offensive line in rounds 2 and 3. ****my dream scenario****

I have a feeling they will cut Griffen (or have him restructure)...and if they retain Barr, I still think White is a good choice because we saw how bad the depth was when Kendricks was out at the end of the year. Rumor is that Barr was practicing some DE last year so that flexibility could be used. 

 
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Barr supposedly had his best season since 2015. I know ZImmer loves Barr. When asked if there is a difference between him and Eric Wilson, ZImmer seemed to this the question was silly and he said Barr can do a lot more than Wilson, although he did say Wilson has played well, better than he expected this season.

I don't think they sign Barr because of the $$ and the cap. He will make too much, and I didn't notice the huge difference between Barr and Wilson when Barr was out with injury. However I do think Barr played some of his best football after coming back from the injury.

I am learning that White may be the best off ball LB in the 2019 draft, so landing him at 18 is probably overly optimistic.

What other players besides White do you all think would be too good to pass up for a offensive lineman?

eta - CBS has Smith listed as the 6th best player in the draft. They also have Ed Oliver DT as the 4th overall player. Andy mocked the Vikings to select him in his recent mock. Not sure he will last that long either though. Probably not if these CBS ranking are decent.

Any other players the Vikings should consider over offensive linemen?

 
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