Mr. Chumley
Footballguy
Who do you guys think has the most upside this year? I torn between Simms and Kitna.
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Mr. Chumley
Footballguy
That's who I'm leaning towards. I have R. Williams and I'm not sure I like a qb and wr on the same team especially the Lions.
PatsWillWin
Footballguy
Yeah, assuming we're talking redraft, I'd go Kitna.
Vick is my #1 QB, although we start 2.This is a kind of a tough call.
Kitna looked good a couple of years ago in Cinci, before Palmer took over. He's not particularly mobile, but he can make most of the throws. The Mike Martz offense has made stars of quarterbacks that appear to be no better than Kitna (except for opportunity). A couple of questions about Kitna & the Lions though. 1) will Marinelli let Martz be Martz, or will he insist on more ball control? 2) will the Lions pick up on the Martz offense. I think Roy Williams will be a stud, but I'm not sure who plays the 2nd, 3rd & 4th receivers. 3) will KJ be able to present enough of a rushing threat to keep defenses from teeing off on Kitna? 4) will the Lions offensive line be able to block well enough to enable the offense to click. Overall, I'm not convinced the Lions will have a productive offense this year.
Simms is big, has a strong arm, and can make most throws. The Bucs offensive line is average at best, but Simms can move around a little in the pocket. Caddy Williams is a rushing threat that takes some pressure off of Simms. Either Caddy has learned to catch the ball in the offseason, or we will see Pittman on 3rd down again, but either way, Simms will have an outlet. The Chucky offense can really move the ball. Last year was kind of a learning curve for Simms, and from the reports out of Tampa, he has done a good job of learning the offense. If Galloway can stay healthy, and Clayton returns to form, I think Simms can be a very good QB. When I think of Chucky offense, I keep thinking of Rich Gannon. Gannon was much more mobile than Simms will ever be, but Simms has a better arm. Gannon was ranked in the TOP 4 QB's for 4 years in a row.
Overall, Kitna has potential with many questions. Simms has potential due to his offense. I rank Simms above Kitna. If things go right for Kitna, I see finish around QB10 (at best). If things go right for Simms, I think he could finish at QB5.
Of course, I wouldn't take either one of these guys early. I'm the type to wait for QB, so I'd target Simms as around QB15-18 and Kitna around QB20. FBG's has Kitna earlier than I do, and Simms later.
Just my
Kitna looked good a couple of years ago in Cinci, before Palmer took over. He's not particularly mobile, but he can make most of the throws. The Mike Martz offense has made stars of quarterbacks that appear to be no better than Kitna (except for opportunity). A couple of questions about Kitna & the Lions though. 1) will Marinelli let Martz be Martz, or will he insist on more ball control? 2) will the Lions pick up on the Martz offense. I think Roy Williams will be a stud, but I'm not sure who plays the 2nd, 3rd & 4th receivers. 3) will KJ be able to present enough of a rushing threat to keep defenses from teeing off on Kitna? 4) will the Lions offensive line be able to block well enough to enable the offense to click. Overall, I'm not convinced the Lions will have a productive offense this year.
Simms is big, has a strong arm, and can make most throws. The Bucs offensive line is average at best, but Simms can move around a little in the pocket. Caddy Williams is a rushing threat that takes some pressure off of Simms. Either Caddy has learned to catch the ball in the offseason, or we will see Pittman on 3rd down again, but either way, Simms will have an outlet. The Chucky offense can really move the ball. Last year was kind of a learning curve for Simms, and from the reports out of Tampa, he has done a good job of learning the offense. If Galloway can stay healthy, and Clayton returns to form, I think Simms can be a very good QB. When I think of Chucky offense, I keep thinking of Rich Gannon. Gannon was much more mobile than Simms will ever be, but Simms has a better arm. Gannon was ranked in the TOP 4 QB's for 4 years in a row.
Overall, Kitna has potential with many questions. Simms has potential due to his offense. I rank Simms above Kitna. If things go right for Kitna, I see finish around QB10 (at best). If things go right for Simms, I think he could finish at QB5.
Of course, I wouldn't take either one of these guys early. I'm the type to wait for QB, so I'd target Simms as around QB15-18 and Kitna around QB20. FBG's has Kitna earlier than I do, and Simms later.
Just my
jurb26
Footballguy
I'd reverse this. I would say that Kitna could be a top 5 QB, hell top 3 even, if things go just right. Simms top 10 if things go just right. I own Simms FWIW.
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Lauryn
Footballguy
kitna... martz is proven, kitna has shown he can put together a decent season, and you figure the offense has to jell at some point. tampa won't ask simms to win many games for them, but kitna will probably be forced to bring them back in games most of the time this year. i see detroit in more garbage-time situations winging it all over the field than i do tampa.
C
CrossEyed
Guest
With Detroit's defense, Kitna will be throwing a LOT. He definitely has the bigger fantasy upside in a redraft league.
jurb26
Footballguy
It really don't matter who you think has a better chance of holding the job. The question is who has the most upside if things go just about perfect for them. I can't see how a Martz QB who has things go just about perfect is outside of the top 5 in FF.
NY/NJMFDIVER
Footballguy
I think the answer to this question lies in Michael Clayton. And in full disclosure, I haven't seen a snap of the preseason of either team this year, and I don't know what Clayton's status is, as relates to the skill he showed his rookie year, but I've been keeping a big eye on Detroit and while they won't be the Second Greatest Show on Turf, I think if Clayton can't come back in a big way, Kitna's ceiling is higher.
I think the risk is also higher. McCown and a crappy o-line are red flags, more so the o-line as I think he could get dinged sooner than Simms(who's line is no great shakes). I think Simms is a safer bet to through for 3000 and 20 TDs, but Kitna is a safer bet to throw for 3500+ and 25 TDs+. Both have appeal, and I usually gamble, so I'm targeting Kitna over Simms.
I think the risk is also higher. McCown and a crappy o-line are red flags, more so the o-line as I think he could get dinged sooner than Simms(who's line is no great shakes). I think Simms is a safer bet to through for 3000 and 20 TDs, but Kitna is a safer bet to throw for 3500+ and 25 TDs+. Both have appeal, and I usually gamble, so I'm targeting Kitna over Simms.
-OZ-
Footballguy
The only red flag involving McCown is that he may very well not even be the #2.Kitna is one of my value picks in QBs this year. The others being Warner, McNair and Brooks. In every redraft league I'm in, I'm getting one of those 4 as my #2.
LawFitz
Footballguy
Simms will have a non-MVP Rich Gannon-like season. Efficient, pretty consistent but limited production. Unless Caddie gets hurt, many of Simms chances will be constrained by Gru's playcalling in favor of his star RB.
Kitna's line is shaky, but he's got Martz. If eminem can get the line playing better, Kitna has much more upside, but a lot greater downside too.
Kitna's line is shaky, but he's got Martz. If eminem can get the line playing better, Kitna has much more upside, but a lot greater downside too.
Warhogs
Footballguy
I am sorry but that does matter. If I think Kitna will not be starting come fantasy football playoff time why would I want him? Basically, because I believe that is a strong possibility Kitna has basically zero upside for me. I am done with the trap of thinking the Lions offense will do anything. Simms is really growing and maturing in TB. Kitna is a journeyman. I would easily take the potential of Simms this year over Kitna.jurb26 said:
Lauryn
Footballguy
simms was trash the minute he stunk on ice and FAKED INJURY to weasel his way out of the big 12 championship game vs CU and you can't convince me otherwise. kitna all the way, at least the little bald guy has some moxie, unlike simms the whipped pup.
WilyCoyote
Footballguy
Still, the question is who has the HIGHEST upside, not necessarily who you think will have the better year. And for the reasons that jurb outlined above, I agree that Kitna's ceiling is higher than Simms'.
Warhogs
Footballguy
Still, the question is who has the HIGHEST upside, not necessarily who you think will have the better year. And for the reasons that jurb outlined above, I agree that Kitna's ceiling is higher than Simms'.
I guess your defintion of upside is different than mine. I guess I would just take the guy who I thought was going to have the better year then.
At least Simms is throwing to two WR that have both had over 1000 yards in a season. The Tampa Bay offensive players have a better history of success.
I guess your defintion of upside is different than mine. I guess I would just take the guy who I thought was going to have the better year then. At least Simms is throwing to two WR that have both had over 1000 yards in a season. The Tampa Bay offensive players have a better history of success.
