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My LB Cheatsheet (1 Viewer)

Rovers

Footballguy
:crazy: I am for putting this out there, but here goes. This is my LB cheatsheet which I am always tweaking. You may notice I have not considered some players from certain teams until I have a better idea of who will be starting in what positions. This includes Indy, Arizona, New England and the Seattle and Washington MLB spot. I've also based this on the presumption that few if any of the rookies will get much playing time. Here goes:1. Bullock TEN2. Lewis BAL3. Edwards SDC4. Urlacher CHI5. Vilma NYJ6. Barnett GBP7. Peterson JAC8. Pierce NYG9. Thomas MIA10. Morgan CAR11. Hartwell ATL12. Fletcher BUF13. Davis CLE14. Farrior PIT15. Brooks TBB16. Spikes BUF17. Brooking ATL18. Sharper SEA19. Arrington WAS20. Cowart MIN21. Greenwood HOU22. Witherspoon CAR23. Clark OAK24. Watson N.O.25. Trotter PHI26. Quarles27. Washington WAS28. Briggs CHI29. Barton NYJ30. Holmes DET31. Nguyen DAL32. Ulbrich SFO33. Wilson DEN34. Kassel TEN35. Williams DEN36. Bell KCC37. Gold DEN38. Simmons CIN39. Foley SDC40. Johnson KCC41. Claiborne STL42. Thurman CIN43. Peterson SFO44. Ruud TBB45. Godfrey SDCLet me say I know I have DJ Williams too low, that has to be corrected. Much will change between now and the start of the season, but this is pretty much how I see the LB's at this early stage of developements. I would not presume to think this is a helpful tool, but might stimulate some discussion that would cause me to tweak it further. Fire away, if you like. :popcorn:
 

Weiner Dog

Footballguy
I like your rankings. Great job, Rovers! :thumbup:

IMO, the following LB's are over-valued:

#8: Pierce

#11: Hartwell

#13: A Davis

#18: J Sharper

#26: Quarles

#30: Holmes

#34: Kassell

IMO, the following LB's are under-valued:

#33: Wilson

#37: Gold

#38: B Simmons

#40: D Johnson

#41: Claiborne

I was also surprised (and mildly pleased) to see Ulbrich ranked, but D Smith ommitted. It's a ballsy call.

Like you said...there's a lot of time between now and Week 1 kickoff. Many things can change in the next few months. As the summer progresses, I wouldn't be surprised to see the following guys creep into your Top-45 LB rankings:

Wong

D Smith

Tinoisamoa

Polley

G Hayes

C Brown

June or Gardner (depending on who wins the WLB battle in IND)

B Bailey

Lehman

Ayodele

J Foreman

D Thomas

A Simmons

T Smith

I also wouldn't be surprised to see the following guys fall from your list:

Godfrey

Thurman

Holmes

Quarles or Rudd (depending who wins the MLB battle in TB)

Kassell

 
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Rovers

Footballguy
Dog, great feedback, thanks! :goodposting: I can immediately recognise why you listed each of those backers as over rated. Pierce has only done it one year, and goes to a new team. Serious questions with that. I can see moving him down. Hartwell is a different issue. I think he is going into this year as undervalued. His natural position is MLB, and now, for the first time, he can play there. Yes, with brooking next to him, it might be difficult to get those kinds of numbers, but I think he will. Davis, I agree, I think I have him several spots too high. How much does Sharper have left? The upside is he might be the only real LB in Seattle this year, I hate the rest of the LB corp. Quarles is old, but I see him finishing the year at MLB while Ruud gets time on the outside. I think he'll match his numbers of last year, give or take, so he could move down several spots without issue. Holmes and Kassel.... if they are both starting at MLB, I think they are about where they ought to be. Wilson, I agree, could move up some, but the LB situation in Denver seems a little unsettled to me at this time. This is why I also have Gold so low. I want to see how things play out in Denver. The St loius situation is another that could change, Pisa at SS apperently didnt work out. Let's see what happens there. Polley is right there with that 35 to 45 group. I did mean to include Wong..... i just am not sure if he will actually end up on the inside at Houston. If he does, he's in there in the late 20's somewhere. I think Greenwood will be the playmaker of the two though. There are also questions in Detroit.... if Holmes keeps the MLB job, he'll be fine, if not.... I think it looks like Thurman may be a starter? That bears watching too. You certainly gave me some things to mull over, that's for sure! Slainte! :hifive:

 

Tenacious D

Footballguy
Andra Davis - move to 3-4 doesn't make rebound impossible, but #13 improbable. He's no Ray Lewis.Danny Clark - you didn't fall for Foley's fluke year, so why Clark's? Jay Foreman will be the most productive LB on that team.Antonio Pierce - o-ver-ra-ted :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: Brad Kassell - even if he wins the MLB job, the Titans historically show a lot of time in nickel, which removes the MLB from the equation. Bulluck is the only LB worth a damn over a season, and he cannibalizes everyone else's stats. Nothing about Kassell screams he can change that w/16 starts.It's hard to pick one, but you need A NE LB in there. Someone will step up to fill in for Bruschi or will have enough sacks to place.

 

Rovers

Footballguy
Ten D, no doubt there will be a NE LB added..... once it's known if Bruschi will play, I'll make those adjustments. I also intentionally did not rank LB's from Arizona and Indy, and once the MLB starters in Seattle and Washington are settled, they will need to be added as well. Pierce is perhaps over rated, but I really don't like the rest of the Giants' LB's. I think he'll be forced to make a lot of tackles, some of them well upfield. He has the speed to persue. Two more over sights: Foreman and Lehman. I typed this from several scribbled pages of notes, and like Wong, those two got lost in the sauce. :penalty: I do however think Clark will come close his numbers of last year, while I agree Foreman will be the top FF LB on Oakland. I think those two LB's could rack up ungodly numbers of tackles, as teams try to run and keep the ball away from the Oakland offense. I think the Tennesse D wil also have a lot of time on the field this year, so even as a 'two down" MLB, I think Kassel may be a nice 4th LB for byes and injury insurance. Even Bullock may get tired of making 10 solos a game! LOL! I did rank Ulrich over Smith..... I think with the return of Peterson, opposing offenses will tend to run away from Peterson and Smith, and to Ulrich's side where the ROLB Winborn does not impress me. Young on the left side is also a better run stopper than Engleberger at RDE, so more reason I think teams will run to that side. However, I think Smith should make the list somewhere. Just not sure where that is yet. This is my first pass off my notes this year, and I can see where more tweaking is needed. Thanks for the feedback!

 

Donnybrook

Footballguy
Danny Clark - you didn't fall for Foley's fluke year, so why Clark's? Jay Foreman will be the most productive LB on that team.
:confused: I have had no luck finding any information on the Raider D so far this off-season. According to Ourlads Foreman is 3rd on the depth chart. I have a hard time seeing how he could be their most productive LB.
 

Beaumont

Footballguy
Danny Clark - you didn't fall for Foley's fluke year, so why Clark's? Jay Foreman will be the most productive LB on that team.
:confused: I have had no luck finding any information on the Raider D so far this off-season. According to Ourlads Foreman is 3rd on the depth chart. I have a hard time seeing how he could be their most productive LB.
I agree. If Morrison takes PT from anyone, its Foreman, not Clark IMHO ...
 

Rovers

Footballguy
Danny Clark - you didn't fall for Foley's fluke year, so why Clark's?  Jay Foreman will be the most productive LB on that team.
:confused: I have had no luck finding any information on the Raider D so far this off-season. According to Ourlads Foreman is 3rd on the depth chart. I have a hard time seeing how he could be their most productive LB.
Both of the sites I use for depth chart info have Foreman listed as a third string LB, but so is Morrison. They both show the Oakland D as a 4-3 too. I think this is incorrect. I think Oakland will use the 3-4 much more often, and even though Williams is an Al Davis favorite, I see him as the odd man out. Oakland tried to use the 3-4 last year, but just didn't have the personnel for it. Getting Foreman is supposed to address that situation, I think. I doubt Foreman would have signed with Oakland unless he had some assurances that he'd be starting. However, until that situation becomes resolved, Clark is where he should be for the time being. Dog, I hadn't planned on it, but maybe I will post my rankings on the other IDP positions. They are still in a state of scribblings at this point however. I have a good idea of how I will rank them, but it's not massaged enough to post yet.

 

slayer666

Footballguy
I did mean to include Wong..... i just am not sure if he will actually end up on the inside at Houston. If he does, he's in there in the late 20's somewhere. I think Greenwood will be the playmaker of the two though.
Pro Football Weekly ~ The Way We Hear It The Texans have two new starters at inside linebacker: Kailee Wong and former Dolphins WLB Morlon Greenwood. They replace Jamie Sharper and Jay Foreman, who were released. Texans LB coach Tom Olivadotti, while making it clear he wasn’t criticizing Sharper or Foreman, is excited about what the new starters can do. “I think we can make more plays on the ball with the guys we have,” said Olivadotti. While Greenwood was listed as an outside linebacker in Miami, Olivadotti said he played behind the line as an inside ’backer. The 6-foot, 238-pound Greenwood plays with “good leverage, even for a shorter guy,” said Olivadotti. Wong, who played some middle linebacker in Minnesota, moves back inside after three years outside. Olivadotti likes Wong’s zone-coverage ability and believes it will be an asset to a LB corps that has sometimes struggled in that area.

____________________________________________________________________

Note: Kailee Wong has been named one of the Texans team captains and LB coach Tom Olivadotti has also stated that he will be a 3 down linebacker for the Texans in 2005.

:banned:

 
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Rovers

Footballguy
I did mean to include Wong..... i just am not sure if he will actually end up on the inside at Houston. If he does, he's in there in the late 20's somewhere. I think Greenwood will be the playmaker of the two though.
Pro Football Weekly ~ The Way We Hear It The Texans have two new starters at inside linebacker: Kailee Wong and former Dolphins WLB Morlon Greenwood. They replace Jamie Sharper and Jay Foreman, who were released. Texans LB coach Tom Olivadotti, while making it clear he wasn’t criticizing Sharper or Foreman, is excited about what the new starters can do. “I think we can make more plays on the ball with the guys we have,” said Olivadotti. While Greenwood was listed as an outside linebacker in Miami, Olivadotti said he played behind the line as an inside ’backer. The 6-foot, 238-pound Greenwood plays with “good leverage, even for a shorter guy,” said Olivadotti. Wong, who played some middle linebacker in Minnesota, moves back inside after three years outside. Olivadotti likes Wong’s zone-coverage ability and believes it will be an asset to a LB corps that has sometimes struggled in that area.

____________________________________________________________________

Note: Kailee Wong has been named one of the Texans team captains and LB coach Tom Olivadotti has also stated that he will be a 3 down linebacker for the Texans in 2005.

:banned:
Well, at least one Shark got on my case for talking about this "too much", but here goes again. First, I have a good friend who is a die hard Texans homer, who feels this isn't all in concrete yet. I know Wong has been named the D captain, but there is still some chance he could play on the outside. It isn't so much that either Moreno or Evans can outplay Wong in the middle, it has more to do with the ROLB position. From the Texans' site:Under the radar

By Carter Toole

HoustonTexans.com

Much of the off-season attention in Texanland has been focused on Antwan Peek -- and rightly so.

Peek is sliding into starting the right outside linebacker slot after a season in which he emerged as the Texans' proverbial microwave, making the most of limited snaps with big play after big play.

But Peek's last big play -- a 66-yard fumble return for a touchdown at Jacksonville the day after Christmas -- resulted in an injured shoulder. Thus, the Texans are limiting Peek's participation in these coaching sessions to 7-on-7 drills. And that's created an opportunity for Charlie Anderson.

In many ways, Anderson is where Peek was a year ago, heading into his second year after adjusting to the switch from college defensive end to outside linebacker. And like Peek, Houston's coaching staff is very intrigued.

“Charlie's doing well,” defensive coordinator Vic Fangio said Friday. “He has definitely progressed from last year. He's feeling more comfortable in the system and in executing his assignments. His technique is better and he's moving faster.”

Anderson was considered a project as a sixth-round pick last season but quickly impressed the coaches with his motor and attitude. He made an immediate impact on special teams -- eventually recording 13 special teams tackles -- but didn't see action at linebacker until Oct. 31 against the Jaguars. Anderson finally made a tackle six weeks later against the Colts. That was his lone tackle of the season, but not his biggest play.

That came a week later at frigid Chicago. Cornerback Dunta Robinson sacked Bears quarterback Chad Hutchinson on a blitz. Hutchinson coughed up the ball and Anderson scooped it up and raced 60 yards for the first touchdown by a Texans rookie in their brief history.

“Charlie started to play some and play well at the end of last year,” head coach Dom Capers said. “He’s plenty athletic enough. He just needs to get stronger.”

Fangio agrees.

“We'll see what he does when the pads come on,” he said. “He's got to show that he's strong enough to play outside.”

Anderson played at about 238 pounds as a rookie and tried his best to bulk up in his first NFL off-season without sacrificing his speed. He’s up to 246 at these coaching sessions.

“I did a little bit of everything,” Anderson said. “I tried to work on speed and footwork but also tried put on a few more pounds.

“It will be different when we put the pads on because you're running with 8-10 pounds more and the temperature will be hotter.”

At that point, Anderson’s reps might decrease as Peek works his way back into the fold. But that doesn’t diminish the experience Anderson is getting now.

“When you get those reps, you have to take advantage of them,” he said. “And you're exposed to a lot of things you wouldn't see if you weren't in there. This has helped me. I'm getting different looks from the offense.”

Capers and the rest of the staff aren't sure how well either Peek or Anderson are prepared to play the outside just yet. And, and it's a bigger IF than most people realise, I think, they are keeping the option of moving Wong back outside, just in case. Neither Peek or Anderson have fully learned the system. Peek's injury is hurting him, missing reps in practice, and Anderson was still considered something of a project. While last year Peek made some big plays, he also blew assignments as well. They generally feel that Moreno and Evans are more prepared to play at RILB than Peek and Anderson are ready to start on the outside. Sure, I think it's much better than 50-50 that Wong will play the inside, but I'm not betting the farm on it.... yet.

The fact that Capers romanced Boulware tells me they still don't have confidence in Peek or Anderson. So, I have my reasons for questioning where Wong plays, even if others don't agree. :boxing: The preseason should answer those questions, but I still have Wong on the side notes of my rankings until I get more confidence he's definitely starting on the inside.

 

slayer666

Footballguy
I have my reasons for questioning where Wong plays, even if others don't agree. :boxing: The preseason should answer those questions, but I still have Wong on the side notes of my rankings until I get more confidence he's definitely starting on the inside.
I've already had drafts in two of my IDP leagues. I didn't have the luxury of letting the pre-season answer those questions. :banned:

 

Rovers

Footballguy
I have my reasons for questioning where Wong plays, even if others don't agree.  :boxing:   The preseason should answer those questions, but I still have Wong on the side notes of my rankings until I get more confidence he's definitely starting on the inside.
I've already had drafts in two of my IDP leagues. I didn't have the luxury of letting the pre-season answer those questions. :banned:
I've had one draft myself. I went on the premise that Wong would start on the inside, but he went before some other LB's I had ranked higher, so I didn't have to worry about it much. Gun to my head, I'd put him in at 26 or 27, which is very low compared to other lists I've seen. If he starts on the inside, and stays there, he probably would be around 20 or so on my sheet. I think there are other lower risk options out there.
 

Tenacious D

Footballguy
According to Ourlads Foreman is 3rd on the depth chart. I have a hard time seeing how he could be their most productive LB.
If there were games this Sunday, you'd have a point, but they don't start for several months. Sometimes during the offseason, things change.Ourlads isn't in the prognostication business. Other than the no brainers, until there is some official word or camp reports to go on or change on the team depth chart, they don't make too many guesses when a player is added, be it rookie or free agent. If you scanned up to the offensive depth chart on the Raiders page, Gannon is still listed as QB2. If you looked down a bit, you'd see Fabian Washington as CB6. And so on. The Raiders aren't posting their depth chart until the first preseason game, so technically, my guess is as good as Ourlads.

Raiders | More on Foreman Signing - from www.KFFL.com

Fri, 13 May 2005 07:27:06 -0700

The Santa Rosa Press Democrat reports the contract signed by LB Jay Foreman with the Oakland Raiders was a one-year deal worth roughly $540,000. Oakland defensive coordinator Rob Ryan said Foreman has the flexibility to play inside or out and the Raiders need help at both positions. Foreman might be expecting to start. When earlier asked about the possibility of signing with the Minnesota Vikings as a backup, Foreman commented, "I'm too old to be backing up."

 

Donnybrook

Footballguy
According to Ourlads Foreman is 3rd on the depth chart.  I have a hard time seeing how he could be their most productive LB.
If there were games this Sunday, you'd have a point, but they don't start for several months. Sometimes during the offseason, things change.Ourlads isn't in the prognostication business. Other than the no brainers, until there is some official word or camp reports to go on or change on the team depth chart, they don't make too many guesses when a player is added, be it rookie or free agent. If you scanned up to the offensive depth chart on the Raiders page, Gannon is still listed as QB2. If you looked down a bit, you'd see Fabian Washington as CB6. And so on. The Raiders aren't posting their depth chart until the first preseason game, so technically, my guess is as good as Ourlads.

Raiders | More on Foreman Signing - from www.KFFL.com

Fri, 13 May 2005 07:27:06 -0700

The Santa Rosa Press Democrat reports the contract signed by LB Jay Foreman with the Oakland Raiders was a one-year deal worth roughly $540,000. Oakland defensive coordinator Rob Ryan said Foreman has the flexibility to play inside or out and the Raiders need help at both positions. Foreman might be expecting to start. When earlier asked about the possibility of signing with the Minnesota Vikings as a backup, Foreman commented, "I'm too old to be backing up."
So let me get this straight. Houston cuts Foreman and he is on the street for almost two months until the Raiders finally pick him up. He ends up signing a 1 year deal for the vet minimum. It looks to me that you have more faith in Foreman than the Raiders’ do. They could cut him loose at any time and would have to pay no financial penalty. At best, he shines in training camp and becomes a spot starter. I still think your reaching when you say that he will be the Raiders most productive LB.
 

Rovers

Footballguy
According to Ourlads Foreman is 3rd on the depth chart.  I have a hard time seeing how he could be their most productive LB.
If there were games this Sunday, you'd have a point, but they don't start for several months. Sometimes during the offseason, things change.Ourlads isn't in the prognostication business. Other than the no brainers, until there is some official word or camp reports to go on or change on the team depth chart, they don't make too many guesses when a player is added, be it rookie or free agent. If you scanned up to the offensive depth chart on the Raiders page, Gannon is still listed as QB2. If you looked down a bit, you'd see Fabian Washington as CB6. And so on. The Raiders aren't posting their depth chart until the first preseason game, so technically, my guess is as good as Ourlads.

Raiders | More on Foreman Signing - from www.KFFL.com

Fri, 13 May 2005 07:27:06 -0700

The Santa Rosa Press Democrat reports the contract signed by LB Jay Foreman with the Oakland Raiders was a one-year deal worth roughly $540,000. Oakland defensive coordinator Rob Ryan said Foreman has the flexibility to play inside or out and the Raiders need help at both positions. Foreman might be expecting to start. When earlier asked about the possibility of signing with the Minnesota Vikings as a backup, Foreman commented, "I'm too old to be backing up."
So let me get this straight. Houston cuts Foreman and he is on the street for almost two months until the Raiders finally pick him up. He ends up signing a 1 year deal for the vet minimum. It looks to me that you have more faith in Foreman than the Raiders’ do. They could cut him loose at any time and would have to pay no financial penalty. At best, he shines in training camp and becomes a spot starter. I still think your reaching when you say that he will be the Raiders most productive LB.
This piqued my interest, and since the Raiders are so tight lipped, I went to .... the Raider forums. Probably the biggest homer forum I ever came across, but here is the concesus. The starting OLB's will be T Smith and Williams. In the 3-4, it will be Clark and Foreman on the inside, pretty much what I see happening too. If you thought Sapp was fat last year, he came in with a lot more wieght this year to the OTA's. Clayton said it looked like he had eaten Ted Washington! Most Raider fans think Sapp is at best, or at least should be a part time player now. Ted Washington can play nose tackle, and they have 2 DE's in Burgess and Brayton that should be able to play the 3-4, even if they arent ideally suited to it. The rookie MLB Morrison could challenge for playing time. Yeah, I see Foreman as a starter, and I think that he and Clark will have plenty of opportunities for tackles. Foreman knows the 3-4, and the Raiders just don't have the D lineman to play the 4-3 anymore, unless they think a 400 pound turd like Sapp can do it without having a cardiac. I don't think he can, and even the most rabid Raider homers don't think so either. Stuff like this generally plays itself out in the preseason, but as mentioned, some drafts are starting already. So, at this point in time, it's anyone's best guess, and this is mine.

Oh, one more point.... yes, Foreman came cheap, but Clayton called the Oakland LB corp the worst in the NFL. I don't think he's far off. Perfect place for Foreman to go, if he wants to start.

 

Tenacious D

Footballguy
So let me get this straight. Houston cuts Foreman and he is on the street for almost two months until the Raiders finally pick him up. He ends up signing a 1 year deal for the vet minimum. It looks to me that you have more faith in Foreman than the Raiders’ do. They could cut him loose at any time and would have to pay no financial penalty. At best, he shines in training camp and becomes a spot starter. I still think your reaching when you say that he will be the Raiders most productive LB.
No doubt he could be a bust and they can cut him with no impact. I don't disagree. However, the Raiders LB corp was (is) horrible. Foreman was cut in the heat of draft prep, most teams will wait on mediocre guys or those with question marks that time of year, so I don't think the time it took him to get signed is relevant. He also was a cap cut. While he's not a standout, he is competent, but Houston wanted to shake some things up...Sharper and Glenn were sent packing too, remember. While I do think he can have a very productive year, I'm not saying he is a very good player. The two can be mutually exclusive. See Danny Clark 2004. And that's why I like Foreman's situation, b/c I think Clark was a fluke. If Morrison beats out anyone, I could see it being Clark as easily as Foreman. Other than that, there is no current threats if they favor a 3-4. If they stand pat, I like Foreman to bounce back. It's not like this guy has never proved anything or is far from being productive. He's one season removed from 3 straight 100 tackles seasons, missing it last year b/c he was injured, and is only 29.

I'm not pimping the guy to have a huge year, but in a bad Oakland corp, he should be the tallest midget.

 

coolnerd

Footballguy
Foreman was an IDP star, but was a mediocore defender. he made tons of tackles mostly downfield. In pass coverage he was often chasing the reciever. Pretty average at stuffing the hole and was not a blitzer. While the cap savings was nice, he was cut in order for the team to get more athletic and possibiliy dynamic at the position. He was not an embarassment for the Texans (as the number of tackles indicates), but he was not difference maker. 1/3 of the reserve LBs in the league could have duplicated his performance over the last three year with the Texans.

 

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