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*NBA THREAD* Abe will be missed (2 Viewers)

As much as I've want to believe the Hawks are legitimate title contenders I can't bring myself to truly believe it - probably unless/until they win something significant in the playoffs (get to a conference finals and we'll talk). Having said that I'm curious what others think and how they would improve the Hawks. I'm not good playing feaux GM so I have no clue what I would do. My gut tells me 1. don't mess with a good thing. most of what they are doing is based on chemistry and team play so why screw around with something working so well. but also tells me 2. they aren't quite good enough to beat the Bulls/Raptors/Wiz in a series and then GS/Portland/Memphis in a series. The only piece on the team I don't like is Mack - never liked him and I think Coach Bud feels the same way as he's had a lot of DNP - Coaches Decision over the last 2 months.

So, what would you do - ride the season out and see what happens or try to make a trade to (in theory) improve your odds of winning this year?
Unless they can somehow score a top flight SF, they shouldn't mess with the big pieces. The could look for a replacement for Mack and Bazemore's minutes (and limit Thabo's as well). Maybe somebody that would come relatively cheap like Jared Dudley.
Probably just depth and if they can get a two way wing who can get into the lane and create. Their offense is humming, but in the playoffs they'll need another playmaker.

 
Did we talk about Mo Williams and his 52 points? That's gotta rank pretty highly as far as unlikely 50 point games.
Yep, maybe 3rd behind Willie Burton and Tony Delk.
No love for T Ross?
Didn't Tracy Murray put up half a bill one time as well? Or was that Don McLean? I always mix up the two.
Yep. Corey Brewer, Andre Miller and Cedric Ceballos would also be more :shock: compared to Mo Williams IMO.
Ceballos had back-to-back 21 PPG seasons for the mediocre mid-90s Lakers and was cutting rap videos with Warren G. He's no surprise on the 50-point games list.

 
Here are some Abe-ish trades:

Denver trades Lawson and Foye to Houston for 2 1st round picks (Houston this year and NO's first rounder), Jason Terry, Clint Capela, Terrence Jones/Donuts and cap filler (the Greek dude, Brewer, or both Canaan and Shved).

Foye is an upgrade over Terry and can defend SGs a bit. Lawson is a huge upgrade at PG offensively over Beverly but the Rockets could still use Beverly if they need defense. Having a legit PG who is both comfortable off ball and with the ball could send Houston over the top.

Denver trades Afflalo to LAC Gee to Chicago, LAC trades Bullock and a 2019 first rounder to Denver and Crawford to Chicago, Chicago sends Snell and filler (Mohammad, Barstow, Moore) to Denver.

The Clippers get a SG/SF that can actually play alongside Redick and Paul, the Bulls get somebody that can actually score for their second unit (Crawford) and a wing defender that can play a bit (Gee). The Clippers could also dump a couple contracts on the Nuggets to help them dip below the tax.

Denver trades Chandler to Detroit for KCP, Joel Anthony (or Anthony Tolliver).

Chandler fits what Detroit is trying to do, he can hit open threes and defend. KCP has been a disappointment to this point of his career, but he has shown flashes of being a good player.

Denver sends Gallinari to Charlotte for Henderson (or Marvin Williams) and Vonleh.

This would depend on Gallinari playing well in the next month, but it would give Charlotte a SF who can shoot and play the 4.
Not enough for Lawson and too much for Afflalo and Gallinari IMO. Lawson is interesting - he's a very good player but there are so many good PGs now I'm not even sure where he ranks. Tough to get equal value for him, so I'd be reluctant to consider trading him.
 
Did we talk about Mo Williams and his 52 points? That's gotta rank pretty highly as far as unlikely 50 point games.
Yep, maybe 3rd behind Willie Burton and Tony Delk.
No love for T Ross?
Didn't Tracy Murray put up half a bill one time as well? Or was that Don McLean? I always mix up the two.
Yep. Corey Brewer, Andre Miller and Cedric Ceballos would also be more :shock: compared to Mo Williams IMO.
Crazier 50-point game anomaly: Mo Williams putting up a 50-point game once, or Jamal Crawford scoring 50 in a game twice?
Mo. Crawford has done it 3 times. 04 / 07 / 08.

I've watched Crawford shred Toronto so many times (50/43/37/36) that it doesn't surprise me in the least when he drops 50.

 
NBA.COM is down... pretty sure that's Kobe's fault too.

An error (502 Bad Gateway) has occured in response to this request.
https://isitup.org/ no it isn't
Damn... and I was CONVINCED they were just going to leave it offline for good.

:mellow:
sorry stupid, it was never offline lol
Did you verify that by traveling back in time 4 minutes in your trusty Walgreens time travel machine, Em?

 
NBA.COM is down... pretty sure that's Kobe's fault too.

An error (502 Bad Gateway) has occured in response to this request.
https://isitup.org/ no it isn't
Damn... and I was CONVINCED they were just going to leave it offline for good.

:mellow:
sorry stupid, it was never offline lol
Did you verify that by traveling back in time 4 minutes in your trusty Walgreens time travel machine, Em?
http://www.isitdownrightnow.com/nba.com.html

last down: 3 days 20 hours ago

haha. You look so dumb now.

 
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are there a lot of ties between atl and san antonio i thought i heard that anyone who can fill me in that would be appreciated take that to the bank
I don't know if this is schtick, but Atl's head coach was an assistant in SA for 17 years before his current gig.
no it is not i know that but i was wondering if the x and o guys could say is atl was running sets similar to what san antonio uses i am a big believer that to much of the nba teams use isolation stuff and try to rely on single guys athletic ability and that the spurs use a team game opposite to that and with the big hawk turnaround i was wondering if they were playing a lot of the san antonio style of team ball i do not get to see them play that it is take that to the bank thanks brohan
There is nothing really special about the sets that the Spurs run. Several teams run the same stuff. They are very efficient on hitting their spots when the actions create an advantage or bring two to the ball. I've actually begun implementing the same sets with my teams. We had some growing pains to start the season but it is going to be a great foundation moving forward. Got to see them practice in Berlin when they played Alba FWIW.

Motion Weak

Motion Strong

 
Here are some Abe-ish trades:

Denver trades Lawson and Foye to Houston for 2 1st round picks (Houston this year and NO's first rounder), Jason Terry, Clint Capela, Terrence Jones/Donuts and cap filler (the Greek dude, Brewer, or both Canaan and Shved).

Foye is an upgrade over Terry and can defend SGs a bit. Lawson is a huge upgrade at PG offensively over Beverly but the Rockets could still use Beverly if they need defense. Having a legit PG who is both comfortable off ball and with the ball could send Houston over the top.

Denver trades Afflalo to LAC Gee to Chicago, LAC trades Bullock and a 2019 first rounder to Denver and Crawford to Chicago, Chicago sends Snell and filler (Mohammad, Barstow, Moore) to Denver.

The Clippers get a SG/SF that can actually play alongside Redick and Paul, the Bulls get somebody that can actually score for their second unit (Crawford) and a wing defender that can play a bit (Gee). The Clippers could also dump a couple contracts on the Nuggets to help them dip below the tax.

Denver trades Chandler to Detroit for KCP, Joel Anthony (or Anthony Tolliver).

Chandler fits what Detroit is trying to do, he can hit open threes and defend. KCP has been a disappointment to this point of his career, but he has shown flashes of being a good player.

Denver sends Gallinari to Charlotte for Henderson (or Marvin Williams) and Vonleh.

This would depend on Gallinari playing well in the next month, but it would give Charlotte a SF who can shoot and play the 4.
Not enough for Lawson and too much for Afflalo and Gallinari IMO. Lawson is interesting - he's a very good player but there are so many good PGs now I'm not even sure where he ranks. Tough to get equal value for him, so I'd be reluctant to consider trading him.
If they go full rebuild, I think they should trade him, even if its for a little less than equal value. He's 5'11", 27 years old and has been bothered by a bad ankle for two full years, I'm not sure his value is going to be much higher than it is now, and by the time the Nuggets could be competitive again he'll be approaching 30. If they can flip him for a couple decent picks (Houston has New Orleans' pick this year which should be late lottery), and a couple of decent prospects, it might not be a bad idea.

If they end up trading Afflalo and Chandler, I think they will get more than market value. There are only going to be a few two way (neither Afflalo or Chandler are shutdown defenders, but both are solidly better than average) wings available, and there are a surprising number of teams with that need.

 
You'd move Lawson for a late lottery pick and filler? If rather keep him, hope he gets healthy, and try to rebuild around him. You almost certainly won't find anyone as good as he is with that pick, unless the idea is to just tank for the next couple of years.

 
You'd move Lawson for a late lottery pick and filler? If rather keep him, hope he gets healthy, and try to rebuild around him. You almost certainly won't find anyone as good as he is with that pick, unless the idea is to just tank for the next couple of years.
He won't be around by the time they get there and if he is hw won't be a key piece. the only thing he will do is take up minutes from young guys you want to develop (sink or swim) and maybe give you an extra win or two along the way.

 
I don't think I've recovered from watching the Lakers/Heat game last night. Truly one of the worst basketball games I've ever seen.

 
You'd move Lawson for a late lottery pick and filler? If rather keep him, hope he gets healthy, and try to rebuild around him. You almost certainly won't find anyone as good as he is with that pick, unless the idea is to just tank for the next couple of years.
I don't think he is the type of guy you build around. He's a very strong piece that you build with, but even at his peak which I don't think we'll ever see again, he was more like a third best player on a contending team. Its possible that Nurkic might be the guy to build around. If the Nuggets think that is the case, they should save Gallinari (if he gets healthy, he is a much better player than what they can trade him for), Faried and Lawson while looking to trade the rest of the vets to clear cap space and acquire picks. If they just think that Nurkic is a building block and not the centerpiece, I think they should look to be trading everybody other than Nurkic and Harris. Sell off Chandler, Afflalo, Foye, Hickson, Arthur, Nelson and McGee this season to the highest bidder by the trade deadline. Then hold onto Gallo, Lawson and Faried and only sell them off if they think they can get a good deal, if that means holding onto them until next season's trade deadline, so be it.

I was probably selling Lawson short with a late lottery pick, what would amount to a late first rounder and a couple young guys, but I don't think they could get significantly more than that for him.

 
Demar returns tonight :excited:

Less minutes for Vasquez and Williams is going to be beautiful. For as poor of a defender as Derozan is, he is light years better than what those two bring.

 
Can someone explain the Pistons to me? They were horribly bad and now they are world beaters. How does that even happen? I haven't watched a full NBA games since Isaiah was playing ball. Senior, not junior.

 
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Can someone explain the Pistons to me? They were horribly bad and now they are world beaters. How does that even happen? I haven't watched a full NBA games since Isaiah was playing ball. Senior, not junior.
Addition by subtraction.

It's a great run they're on but it won't last too long.

 
Magic with back to back wins over the Bulls and Rockets. Crazy. Oladipo with 65 total in those two. He looks incredible.

 
so wait josh smith goes to the houstons and now they lose to orlando and det has won just about every game since he left well there is something all right take that to the bank shot brohans

 
SWC said:
so wait josh smith goes to the houstons and now they lose to orlando and det has won just about every game since he left well there is something all right take that to the bank shot brohans
He's a cancer. The Rockets would be wise to just cut him now.

 
brohans the clippers were a team that i really liked to watch a couple of years ago but now i just get annoyed with them they cry a lot which is exactly the same as how they were when i liked them but now i am just sort of worn out with it maybe it is just that they have big baby i just can not stand him and kendrik perkins they both whine about every call it just gets to me take that to the bank

 
Fun stat: Rose and Kobe are currently have the worst and third worst three point shooting percentages of any player that has attempted at least 5 three point shots a game. Jason Williams (the white one) had held the record by shooting .287. Kobe is currently at .289 and Rose is at .278.

Ultimately, I don't think either of them finish worse than Jason Williams because they'll both tone down their three point shooting and end with fewer than 5 a game.

 
Man, Doc Rivers is a horrible GM.

He's about to get rid of Bullock (trade to Pho), CDR (trade to Bos), Farmar (waive or trade), and maybe even a future 2nd just to get his son on the team.

Oof.

 
Sooo ....

K.C. Johnson ‏@KCJHoop

Jimmy Butler's FG percentage by month. November: .498 in 15 games. December: .465 in 15 games. January: .364 in 7 games.

I swear this is not related to last night's game, and I HATE to go against Zach Lowe on anything, but I'm starting to wonder if this Bulls team really deserves to be the favorite in the East, which I'm pretty sure all the oddsmakers have them as now that the Cavs are floudering. You all know how I feel about Atlanta, but even beyond that I'm not sure the Bulls are all they were cracked up to be back when it looked like they'd developed a two-way Paul George type superstar out of thin air.

 
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Sooo ....

K.C. Johnson ‏@KCJHoop

Jimmy Butler's FG percentage by month. November: .498 in 15 games. December: .465 in 15 games. January: .364 in 7 games.

I swear this is not related to last night's game, and I HATE to go against Zach Lowe on anything, but I'm starting to wonder if this Bulls team really deserves to be the favorite in the East, which I'm pretty sure all the oddsmakers have them as now that the Cavs are floudering. You all know how I feel about Atlanta, but even beyond that I'm not sure the Bulls are all they were cracked up to be back when it looked like they'd developed a two-way Paul George type superstar out of thin air.
That's what happens when you play 40 minutes per game. Thibs is not the greatest minutes manager.

 
Now that I am trying to do Fanduel basketball I am trying to learn the NBA better.

Are the Kings serious about trading a guy they drafted this year and throw in a future 1st for front court help? I feel like teams should be lining up to take this deal.

 
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Sooo ....

K.C. Johnson ‏@KCJHoop

Jimmy Butler's FG percentage by month. November: .498 in 15 games. December: .465 in 15 games. January: .364 in 7 games.

I swear this is not related to last night's game, and I HATE to go against Zach Lowe on anything, but I'm starting to wonder if this Bulls team really deserves to be the favorite in the East, which I'm pretty sure all the oddsmakers have them as now that the Cavs are floudering. You all know how I feel about Atlanta, but even beyond that I'm not sure the Bulls are all they were cracked up to be back when it looked like they'd developed a two-way Paul George type superstar out of thin air.
Bulls are certainly in a funk. They have lacked effort at home and their defense has been the worst it's been in the Thibs era. It's possible they turn it around but I agree with you that they shouldn't be the favorite at this point. I'm not sure I'm sold on Washington, though. Hawks and Raptors certainly are the best at this point.

 
Sooo ....

K.C. Johnson ‏@KCJHoop

Jimmy Butler's FG percentage by month. November: .498 in 15 games. December: .465 in 15 games. January: .364 in 7 games.

I swear this is not related to last night's game, and I HATE to go against Zach Lowe on anything, but I'm starting to wonder if this Bulls team really deserves to be the favorite in the East, which I'm pretty sure all the oddsmakers have them as now that the Cavs are floudering. You all know how I feel about Atlanta, but even beyond that I'm not sure the Bulls are all they were cracked up to be back when it looked like they'd developed a two-way Paul George type superstar out of thin air.
Bulls are certainly in a funk. They have lacked effort at home and their defense has been the worst it's been in the Thibs era. It's possible they turn it around but I agree with you that they shouldn't be the favorite at this point. I'm not sure I'm sold on Washington, though. Hawks and Raptors certainly are the best at this point.
Raps are regressing a bit, too. I saw somewhere that when they started off the season on a tear for those first two months teams were literally shooting 60% from the line against them, which is obviously unsustainable. I'm not sold on Washington either, but I won't be sold on a Washington team until I'm watching them parade down Pennsylvania Ave with a trophy.

I guess I'd make the Bulls #2 in the East right now, just because there's room for growth to compensate for the Butler regression and the exhaustion of playing all those minutes. I like Dunleavy's game too, plus they'll get Doug McD back. And although I don't think Rose will ever be close to what he was pre-injury I also don't think he'll be this bad (last night aside) all season. I think the Hawks are far better than they are, though, and I'm not sure why the books don't reflect that yet.

 
Now that I am trying to do Fanduel basketball I am trying to learn the NBA better.

Are the Kings serious about trading a guy they drafted this year and throw in a future 1st for front court help? I feel like teams should be lining up to take this deal.
That's the first I've heard of that. Teams aren't lining up for that deal because there just aren't many capable PFs that Sacramento would be willing to trade for that fit their needs and who might be available. Maybe Ilyasova?

 
Sooo ....

K.C. Johnson ‏@KCJHoop

Jimmy Butler's FG percentage by month. November: .498 in 15 games. December: .465 in 15 games. January: .364 in 7 games.

I swear this is not related to last night's game, and I HATE to go against Zach Lowe on anything, but I'm starting to wonder if this Bulls team really deserves to be the favorite in the East, which I'm pretty sure all the oddsmakers have them as now that the Cavs are floudering. You all know how I feel about Atlanta, but even beyond that I'm not sure the Bulls are all they were cracked up to be back when it looked like they'd developed a two-way Paul George type superstar out of thin air.
They are all so close that it just depends on the matchup. I like Toronto to beat Atlanta and Washington but not the Bulls or Cavs (assuming they get it together). Washington beats The Bulls but not Atlanta or Toronto. Not sure how a Chicago and Atlanta matchup would play out.

 
Man, Doc Rivers is a horrible GM.

He's about to get rid of Bullock (trade to Pho), CDR (trade to Bos), Farmar (waive or trade), and maybe even a future 2nd just to get his son on the team.

Oof.
Danny Ainge has to have set a record for most draft picks accumulated within a one year (or so) period...he just can't get enough...it may take awhile but I do like his strategy of hoarding picks/assets...as a fan you would much rather have your team win but watching this rebuild definitely has its own entertainment value...I just hope Stevens doesn't get burnt out by all the losing because I do think he has the potential to be a very good NBA coach and I would like to see it be with the Celts...

 
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Sooo ....

K.C. Johnson ‏@KCJHoop

Jimmy Butler's FG percentage by month. November: .498 in 15 games. December: .465 in 15 games. January: .364 in 7 games.

I swear this is not related to last night's game, and I HATE to go against Zach Lowe on anything, but I'm starting to wonder if this Bulls team really deserves to be the favorite in the East, which I'm pretty sure all the oddsmakers have them as now that the Cavs are floudering. You all know how I feel about Atlanta, but even beyond that I'm not sure the Bulls are all they were cracked up to be back when it looked like they'd developed a two-way Paul George type superstar out of thin air.
Apparently Noah is "concerned" about the knee he had surgery on. Not to mention the recurring ankle. Not good for them.

http://fantasynews.cbssports.com/fantasybasketball/update/24964040/report-bulls-joakim-noah-concerned-about-surgically-repaired-knee

Hawks definitely the class of the east at the moment, but the Wiz continue to gel and mature. They're looking really good with greater frequency as the season goes along.

 

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