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Need your help, just took over league, uses tiebreaker player in playoffs (never used), but not regular season (1 Viewer)

JohnnyU

Footballguy
We use MFL. In one league that I just took over as commissioner late in the season because the previous commissioner has resigned and is leaving the league for personal reasons. We use victory points scoring. Awards are: Win-2 tie-1 loss-0. Points will also be awarded based upon points scored per week. Scoring is separated into 3 tiers. The top 4 weekly scorers in tier 1, the middle 4 weekly scorers in tier 2 and the lowest 4 scorers in tier 3. Awards are: Tier 1 - 2 points., Tier 2 - 1 point, and tier 3 - 0 points.

We have a listed rule for handling ties during the playoffs that no one ever used. The commish never set league to use a tiebreaker player in the playoffs, even though it's in the rules. Good thing we've never had a tie in the playoffs. It states, For playoff games, each team will designate a player whose points will count only in the event of a tie. If the teams are still tied after the tiebreaker, total bench points will be used to break the tie.

The commissoner has a setting he can change to have teams enter a tiebreaker player, no problem. For the current playoffs I set this for playoff teams to use a tiebreaker player when they submit their lineup. However, the setting throughout the year was "allow ties". We've never had a tie in the regular season or playoffs and they are rare, but came close during the regular season a couple of times. My issue is that I don't want to have to keep changing this setting between the regular season (don't use tiebreaker player), then set it to use the tiebreaker player when the playoffs start. Which is best, just have the highest seed advance during the playoffs in the event of a tie and remove tiebreaker player, or have the tiebreaker player during the regular season and playoffs? Again, I don't want to have to keep flipping this setting between the regular season and the playoffs, thus the reason why if we use the tiebreaker player during the playoffs I want to leave it alone during the regular season too. My preference is to put it like it was during the season, where we don't use it, and remove the rule using a tiebreaker player for the playoffs, and advance the higher seed if there is a tie during the playoffs. That would be for next season and beyond. For this year, since the rules say use a tiebreaker player, which we've never used, we will.
 
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I know a lot of you play usiing victory points and I would love to hear how you handle ties in the playoffs. Some of you may not and this thread could be a red flag for your league.
Why does using victory point have any bearing on the subject?

We have a tie breaker system that uses the highest scoring player in your starting lineup as the tie break. If two teams are tied then it's a quick look to see which team had the highest scoring starter. If that is the same go to the next and so forth. There is no need for the commish to do anything other than in the off chance you have a tie push through the team that wins that tie break (highest scoring starter). It works very well.

The rationale for using the highest scoring starter is that he essentially equates to the best player on the field for that matchup. Seems like a good way to break a tie by giving the win to the team with the best player. At least that is what my leagues have all agreed to.
 
I know a lot of you play usiing victory points and I would love to hear how you handle ties in the playoffs. Some of you may not and this thread could be a red flag for your league.
Why does using victory point have any bearing on the subject?

We have a tie breaker system that uses the highest scoring player in your starting lineup as the tie break. If two teams are tied then it's a quick look to see which team had the highest scoring starter. If that is the same go to the next and so forth. There is no need for the commish to do anything other than in the off chance you have a tie push through the team that wins that tie break (highest scoring starter). It works very well.

The rationale for using the highest scoring starter is that he essentially equates to the best player on the field for that matchup. Seems like a good way to break a tie by giving the win to the team with the best player. At least that is what my leagues have all agreed to.
Just giving context to the league. Thanks for your post. The main point to the post is that a tiebreaker player isn't used during the regular season, but is during the playoffs and was never set up to use. I took over as commish and saw this in the rules, so I set it to use a tiebreaker at lineup submission time since it's the playoffs. The previous commish never did this, even though it's in the rules. My issue is that I want to set this and leave it, not flip back and forth between the regular season and playoffs, or get rid of it altogher in the rule for the playoffs. Hope that clears that up.
 
My issue is that I want to set this and leave it, not flip back and forth between the regular season and playoffs, or get rid of it altogher in the rule for the playoffs. Hope that clears that up.
I totally get your reasoning for wanting to set something up where the site handles it automatically. It is never good (as a commish) to have things you need to stay on top of for changes because it lends itself to being forgotten and causing issues.

I just wasn't sure if I was missing something with regards to VP in this scenario. They are irrelevant to the question being asked of figuring out a method that can play out as a tie break without ever changing it. My answer to that is why not just have no ties during the regular season as well? Then just set up the league with the tie break player lineup spot for all games. I guess the limit there is what happens when the tie breaker players tie? It's why I like our tie break scenario of using the highest scoring starter. Nothing to do as commish unless a tie happens. Then you just need to adjust the win-loss records of those teams in the regular season or advance the winner in the playoffs. Simple and easy for everyone to see and understand.
 
My issue is that I want to set this and leave it, not flip back and forth between the regular season and playoffs, or get rid of it altogher in the rule for the playoffs. Hope that clears that up.
I totally get your reasoning for wanting to set something up where the site handles it automatically. It is never good (as a commish) to have things you need to stay on top of for changes because it lends itself to being forgotten and causing issues.

I just wasn't sure if I was missing something with regards to VP in this scenario. They are irrelevant to the question being asked of figuring out a method that can play out as a tie break without ever changing it. My answer to that is why not just have no ties during the regular season as well? Then just set up the league with the tie break player lineup spot for all games. I guess the limit there is what happens when the tie breaker players tie? It's why I like our tie break scenario of using the highest scoring starter. Nothing to do as commish unless a tie happens. Then you just need to adjust the win-loss records of those teams in the regular season or advance the winner in the playoffs. Simple and easy for everyone to see and understand.
In the off season I’ll create a poll in the league. Use tibreaker player all the time, not just in te playoffs, or never use it and advance highest seed if a tie in playoffs. Again current rules say to use it in the playoffs, but was never used.
 
My issue is that I want to set this and leave it, not flip back and forth between the regular season and playoffs, or get rid of it altogher in the rule for the playoffs. Hope that clears that up.
I totally get your reasoning for wanting to set something up where the site handles it automatically. It is never good (as a commish) to have things you need to stay on top of for changes because it lends itself to being forgotten and causing issues.

I just wasn't sure if I was missing something with regards to VP in this scenario. They are irrelevant to the question being asked of figuring out a method that can play out as a tie break without ever changing it. My answer to that is why not just have no ties during the regular season as well? Then just set up the league with the tie break player lineup spot for all games. I guess the limit there is what happens when the tie breaker players tie? It's why I like our tie break scenario of using the highest scoring starter. Nothing to do as commish unless a tie happens. Then you just need to adjust the win-loss records of those teams in the regular season or advance the winner in the playoffs. Simple and easy for everyone to see and understand.
In the off season I’ll create a poll in the league. Use tibreaker player all the time, not just in te playoffs, or never use it and advance highest seed if a tie in playoffs. Again current rules say to use it in the playoffs, but was never used.
How often do ties happen? I dont think weve ever had one in our 20+ years of this league. Decimal scoring obviously. In our league, better seed advances in the unlikely event of a tie in the playoffs. And during the regular season ties are possible (but have never happened).
 
FFPC, which a lot of people here play, uses VP's and here is their playoff tiebreaker formula and it seems reasonable to me.

1. Total Victory Points during the regular season


2. Head-to-head in the regular season


3. Regular season win/loss record (weeks 1-14)


4. Starting QB points in League Playoff game.


5. Coin toss
 
1. Victory points is awesome and the only way a league should be run IMO. However, it has no real bearing on your question.

2. Pick a different playoff tie breaker. I like higher seed wins, but you could easily do something like 'most touchdowns" that week.

3. All this is pretty moot if you use double decimal places, but still good to have just in case.
 
Ok, I get what you’re saying that VP is irrelevant. Let’s move past that.. We don’t use a tiebreaker player during the regular season, but list it for the playoffs, which was never used. I took over as commissioner late in the season and set it to use a tiebreaker player for the playoffs per the rules. I want to either not use it in 2025 and beyond ,and for the playoffs advance highest seed if tie, or use the tiebreaker player for both regular season and playoffs. Not for one and not the other, because I want to set it and leave it.
 
My issue is that I want to set this and leave it, not flip back and forth between the regular season and playoffs, or get rid of it altogher in the rule for the playoffs. Hope that clears that up.
I totally get your reasoning for wanting to set something up where the site handles it automatically. It is never good (as a commish) to have things you need to stay on top of for changes because it lends itself to being forgotten and causing issues.

I just wasn't sure if I was missing something with regards to VP in this scenario. They are irrelevant to the question being asked of figuring out a method that can play out as a tie break without ever changing it. My answer to that is why not just have no ties during the regular season as well? Then just set up the league with the tie break player lineup spot for all games. I guess the limit there is what happens when the tie breaker players tie? It's why I like our tie break scenario of using the highest scoring starter. Nothing to do as commish unless a tie happens. Then you just need to adjust the win-loss records of those teams in the regular season or advance the winner in the playoffs. Simple and easy for everyone to see and understand.
In the off season I’ll create a poll in the league. Use tibreaker player all the time, not just in te playoffs, or never use it and advance highest seed if a tie in playoffs. Again current rules say to use it in the playoffs, but was never used.
How often do ties happen? I dont think weve ever had one in our 20+ years of this league. Decimal scoring obviously. In our league, better seed advances in the unlikely event of a tie in the playoffs. And during the regular season ties are possible (but have never happened).
Never happened, but want the rules to cover it in some way, but not as written. Not to use a tiebreaker player in playoffs and not in the regular season. That’s a hassle since you have to flip the setting. Desired to set and leave it. Funny thing is, no one has ever used it, even though it’s in the rules.
 
Funny thing is, no one has ever used it, even though it’s in the rules.
Most people don't actually read the rules. One of the more frustrating part of being a commish. So many times simple questions that are easy to find in the rules and most owners never go look at them.
 
Funny thing is, no one has ever used it, even though it’s in the rules.
Most people don't actually read the rules. One of the more frustrating part of being a commish. So many times simple questions that are easy to find in the rules and most owners never go look at them.
Yeah, I've got a few lazy people in some of my leagues that ask the same quesiton every year instead of just looking for themselves.
 
I reworded the title, taking out the victory point aspect, for more clarity. I left it in the descripption for league context.
 
I reworded the title, taking out the victory point aspect, for more clarity. I left it in the descripption for league context.
Why don't you have the league vote on this before next years draft.. Give them 2 options & go from there
 
Assuming your league uses fractional scoring to the 1/100th, it's almost certainly going to be an afterthought that won't matter until it happens ten years from now. Regular season victory points / standings as the first tiebreak mentioned in the above posts sounds completely reasonable to me. High individual score is fine. It really doesn't matter as long as everyone knows what the tiebreak is going forward.

Do whatever vote you want to do in the offseason, document the hell out of it so it's easy to point to when it matters years down the road.

FWIW, our league has not had an actual tie in the regular season or playoffs since switching from whole point scoring to fractional 14 years ago. We designated OT players from our bench before the switch. I do kind of miss having that pop up once or twice a season, but fractional scoring is clearly the way to go.
 
Look if you like the rule then just have the teams designate their tie breaker on the message board for all to see, IF and there is a slim chance it will ever matter, you end in a tie then things can always be changed manually. Then you dont have to keep changing the setting. Best ofr both worlds imo.
 
Look if you like the rule then just have the teams designate their tie breaker on the message board for all to see, IF and there is a slim chance it will ever matter, you end in a tie then things can always be changed manually. Then you dont have to keep changing the setting. Best ofr both worlds imo.
In the off-season I may start a poll with 3 options. If it ends in a tie I will break the tie.

1). Have tiebreaker player in both regular season and playoffs, done via MFL at lineup submission time. If regular season and still tied, it's a tie. If playoffs and still tied, use total bench points.
2). No tiebreaker player at all and highest seed advances if tie in the playoffs. If regular season and it ends in a tie, it's a tie.
3). For playoffs only, post a tiebreaker player on the league message board, if still a tie, use total bench points
 
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My issue is that I want to set this and leave it, not flip back and forth between the regular season and playoffs, or get rid of it altogher in the rule for the playoffs. Hope that clears that up.
I totally get your reasoning for wanting to set something up where the site handles it automatically. It is never good (as a commish) to have things you need to stay on top of for changes because it lends itself to being forgotten and causing issues.

I just wasn't sure if I was missing something with regards to VP in this scenario. They are irrelevant to the question being asked of figuring out a method that can play out as a tie break without ever changing it. My answer to that is why not just have no ties during the regular season as well? Then just set up the league with the tie break player lineup spot for all games. I guess the limit there is what happens when the tie breaker players tie? It's why I like our tie break scenario of using the highest scoring starter. Nothing to do as commish unless a tie happens. Then you just need to adjust the win-loss records of those teams in the regular season or advance the winner in the playoffs. Simple and easy for everyone to see and understand.
In the off season I’ll create a poll in the league. Use tiebreaker player all the time, not just in te playoffs, or never use it and advance highest seed if a tie in playoffs. Again current rules say to use it in the playoffs, but was never used.
This is first step to correct this for sure. Cant have different rules like this.

As for short term, it doesn't help you but I don't believe that highest seed should not automatically advance in event of a tie. If they were the better team they should have shown it.

So many alternatives but you only just took over as commish, This complicates it.

I would make an announcement like, I just took over, we don't have a tie break formula for rest of season it is total bench points or whatever you want. Obviously total bench points rewards those that have 3QB rostered but you get the idea.
 
You're probably overthinking this, given how infrequently ties occur in fractional scoring. But I agree that going forward you should have a single standard that doesn't require the commish to do anything. It doesn't really matter whether the tiebreaker is higher seed, most TDs, best individual score, etc, as long as the tiebreaking process is in place ahead of time and unbiased
 
You're probably overthinking this, given how infrequently ties occur in fractional scoring. But I agree that going forward you should have a single standard that doesn't require the commish to do anything. It doesn't really matter whether the tiebreaker is higher seed, most TDs, best individual score, etc, as long as the tiebreaking process is in place ahead of time and unbiased
Yes, ties are rare, but we need something in place that is consistent. I believe the poll I'll create after the season accomplishes that, so I'll just go with it.
 
As commissioner, you have access to the "Break Ties" feature. You can simply pick a winner and even write up a short explanation in the free form box.
 
As commissioner, you have access to the "Break Ties" feature. You can simply pick a winner and even write up a short explanation in the free form box.
I'm assuming you're just talking about polls, not actual games themelves :) Of course you are. I'm a believer in leagues trying to eliminate as many loopholes as possible and I think I've laid out a good plan for the poll I will create in the off-season.
 
I don't see a problem, at all.

Leave everything set the way it is for the regular season. Leave it set that way for the playoffs also.

Leave the rule in place requiring a tiebreaker to be named (before the games) in the case of playoff ties.

Simply ask that everyone in the playoffs post their tiebreaker for the week on the Chat Board for everyone to see. League members either do it, or not. This is what we do. Ties during regular season stand. Ties in playoffs, which rarely happen, in fact never have, are dealt with on a personal level. We use MFL also. I do not see a need for the tiebreak player to be set from the page where you set your lineup.

The only thing you'll possibly have to do is go in and advance the tiebreak winner into the next playoff round.

It is 100% up to the League Members to remember to post their tiebreaker. You may feel generous and post a reminder prior to the playoffs starting but, that is entirely up to you, as commissioner. These are adults in this league, no? Let them be adults.

Forget your off-season poll. It'll just create headaches, which I am assuming you're trying to eliminate.
 
My league used to do this too. We'd email the +1 player to the commission before Sunday. I think we had it 5 or 6 years but there was never a tie.

OTOH, setting a calendar reminder to be responsible enough to log in to the league website once, and then clicking a button, doesn't seem too onerous a demand to ask of a person acting as the league "commissioner" if that's how the other 11 owners want to have their rules. :shrug:
 
My league used to do this too. We'd email the +1 player to the commission before Sunday. I think we had it 5 or 6 years but there was never a tie.

OTOH, setting a calendar reminder to be responsible enough to log in to the league website once, and then clicking a button, doesn't seem too onerous a demand to ask of a person acting as the league "commissioner" if that's how the other 11 owners want to have their rules. :shrug:
The other 11 members apparently didn't care about that in their rules, even though it was there for playoffs only, because no one ever posted a tiebreaker player and the commissioner never did a flip of the rules to have one submitted on lineup submission duriing the playoffs. I'm just trying to get this set in the event there ever was a tie. You know, avoid the "what do we do now" scenario. If you were / are a commissioner you would know what I'm talking about.
 
I don't see a problem, at all.

Leave everything set the way it is for the regular season. Leave it set that way for the playoffs also.

Leave the rule in place requiring a tiebreaker to be named (before the games) in the case of playoff ties.

Simply ask that everyone in the playoffs post their tiebreaker for the week on the Chat Board for everyone to see. League members either do it, or not. This is what we do. Ties during regular season stand. Ties in playoffs, which rarely happen, in fact never have, are dealt with on a personal level. We use MFL also. I do not see a need for the tiebreak player to be set from the page where you set your lineup.

The only thing you'll possibly have to do is go in and advance the tiebreak winner into the next playoff round.

It is 100% up to the League Members to remember to post their tiebreaker. You may feel generous and post a reminder prior to the playoffs starting but, that is entirely up to you, as commissioner. These are adults in this league, no? Let them be adults.

Forget your off-season poll. It'll just create headaches, which I am assuming you're trying to eliminate.
I don't think a poll is a headache at all. Takes two minutes or less. It lays it out there in plain English to determine course of action on ties, both regular season and playoffs.
 
I don't see a problem, at all.

Leave everything set the way it is for the regular season. Leave it set that way for the playoffs also.

Leave the rule in place requiring a tiebreaker to be named (before the games) in the case of playoff ties.

Simply ask that everyone in the playoffs post their tiebreaker for the week on the Chat Board for everyone to see. League members either do it, or not. This is what we do. Ties during regular season stand. Ties in playoffs, which rarely happen, in fact never have, are dealt with on a personal level. We use MFL also. I do not see a need for the tiebreak player to be set from the page where you set your lineup.

The only thing you'll possibly have to do is go in and advance the tiebreak winner into the next playoff round.

It is 100% up to the League Members to remember to post their tiebreaker. You may feel generous and post a reminder prior to the playoffs starting but, that is entirely up to you, as commissioner. These are adults in this league, no? Let them be adults.

Forget your off-season poll. It'll just create headaches, which I am assuming you're trying to eliminate.
I don't think a poll is a headache at all. Takes two minutes or less. It lays it out there in plain English to determine course of action on ties, both regular season and playoffs.
It is still more than you need to do. There is no need to determine a course of action. The rules are set. The only member of the league having any anxiety about this non-issue is you. Simply post a reminder about the tiebreaker rule and tell your league mates to post their tiebreaker player in the chat room. Done. No poll. No changes in settings. No headaches. Takes 30 seconds or less.
 
As commissioner, you have access to the "Break Ties" feature. You can simply pick a winner and even write up a short explanation in the free form box.
I'm assuming you're just talking about polls, not actual games themelves :) Of course you are. I'm a believer in leagues trying to eliminate as many loopholes as possible and I think I've laid out a good plan for the poll I will create in the off-season.

We have bylaws and the tie-breakers are laid out there. Everyone knows it. In the event of a tie, the commissioner simply "breaks it" in accordance with the bylaws. Its worked for 32 years... before, and after, the internet and MFL.com.
 

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