NFL might start suspending over flagrant hits that are currently illeg (1 Viewer)

[hefectus]

Who gave him a nickname of an ape?

That's been his nickname ever since he has been a Steeler......

I believe it was Bill Cowher who gave him the nickname because Harrison was the strongest player on the team.

Also, neither of these hits were dirty. In both cases, Harrison went low and the other player ducked to avoid a hit (Cribbs) or while bobbling a pass (Massaquoi). If you don't believe that, watch the video of Harrison's hits on these two, then try to find a video of a receiver who bobbles a pass in front of him that does NOT duck down in an attempt to catch the ball, or of a runner who is about to get tackled who does NOT duck his head to absorb the blow. The helmet-to-helmet contact was incidental, at best, but Harrison is a very physical, very violent tackler and if he makes contact with a player's helmet, they are going to sleep. Period. That's just the way it is. Heck, that's just the way football is.

Other team's fans will cry foul or claim Harrison is a dirty player. And yet they'd love to have 11 guys on defense who play just like him.

 

[Slevin Kelevra]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5706748

The Pittsburgh Steelers excused James Harrison from practice Wednesday as the Pro Bowl linebacker contemplated retirement, according to his agent.

Harrison's agent Bill Parise said Wednesday his client is "very serious" about retiring after getting fined $75,000 for a hit that knocked Mohamed Massaquoi out of the Steelers' win over the Cleveland Browns. Harrison met Wednesday with Steelers coach Mike Tomlin, who excused his linebacker from the Steelers preparations for Sunday's game against the Dolphins.

"We wouldn't joke about this," Parise said. "This is a very serious issue. James is very concerned about how to play football. If James is going to be fined $75,000 for making a legal tackle, then how do you go play football? It's quite frustrating to James, to Coach Tomlin, to me, to everybody."

Asked how real these retirement threats were, Parise said, "We're working very hard to make sure that we make good decisions."

Tomlin said he expects Harrison to return to practice on Thursday.

"We had a meeting this morning, he and I did. It was a very productive one," Tomlin said in a conference call with Miami reporters. "I thought part of being productive and moving forward was excusing him for today and coming back starting new tomorrow."

Asked if Harrison would return to the Steelers on Thursday or even at all this week, Parise said, "I sure hope so."

Harrison said Tuesday on Fox Sports Radio's "Into The Night with Tony Bruno" that he might consider retirement.

"I'm going to sit down and have a serious conversation with my coach tomorrow and see if I can actually play by NFL rules and still be effective," Harrison told guest host Judy McDonald. "If not, I may have to give up playing football."

Harrison was not penalized on the plays that resulted in Massaquoi and Josh Cribbs leaving the game with concussions.

The hit on Cribbs was deemed a legal hit because Cribbs, running out of the wildcat formation, was a runner in possession of the ball. Harrison's head-first hit of Massaquoi during a pass attempt drew the fine.

"I really truly hope it's something that can be done," said Harrison, a three-time Pro Bowl selection who was named The Associated Press' defensive player of the year in 2008. "But the way that things were being explained to me today and the reasoning for it, I don't feel I can continue to play and be effective and, like I say, not have to worry about injuring someone else or risking injury to myself."

Massaquoi's agent, Brian Ayrault, didn't think the league was tough enough on Harrison.

"Harrison has made $20 million over the past three years, and they only fined him $75,000?" he said. "To me, that's not going to be a deterrent. The Browns are probably going to be without a starter this week. I don't think that fine is a deterrent or fair to competitive balance.

"The punishment did not fit the crime."

<_<

 

[Bad_Mo]

<_<

Waaaaa waaaa sliverback

 

[NinerFan49]

Steelers' Harrison takes day off, considers retiring

Wednesday, October 20, 2010

Ed Bouchette, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

Steelers coach Mike Tomlin met with linebacker James Harrison today and decided to excuse him for the rest of the work day, a team spokesman said this morning.

Harrison said in some radio interviews that he would rather retire than be hamstrung by the kinds of rules that the NFL charged he violated with a hit Sunday on Cleveland Browns receiver Mohamed Massaquoi. The NFL fined Harrison $75,000 on Tuesday for that hit.

"How can I continue to play this game the way that I've been taught to play this game since I was 10 years old?" Harrison said on Sirius XM Radio this morning. "And now you're telling me that everything that they've taught me from that time on, for the last 20-plus years, is not the way you're supposed to play the game anymore. If that's the case I can't play by those rules. You're handicapping me."

Bill Parise, Harrison's agent, confirmed that the linebacker is contemplating retirement, which is why he met with Tomlin this morning.

"That's exactly true,'' Parise said. "He met with the coach and left for today. He's in the process of contemplating is it possible to play football under these new rules . . . 'if I go to work and tackle somebody and get a fine.'"

Parise said there is "no fighting, no arguing," just discussions. He said Harrison has been talking with his coaches, the Steelers, his mother and the agent.

Harrison signed a six-year, $51.2 million contract in April 2009 that included a reported $20 million in bonuses. If Harrison would retire before the contract expires, the Steelers could demand he pay back some of those bonuses.

A source had told the Post-Gazette that Harrison called the Steelers Tuesay and told them he would not be coming to work today. However, he did report to their facility on the city's South Side to meet with Tomlin.

The Steelers said Tomlin would be available after practice today to discuss the situation.

------------------------------

While I think he is overdramatizing things here, he does have a point. A point most defensive players are now sharing.

Yes, James Harrison has a point. But his helmet hides it well. He broke a rule that he should have known and hit a "defenseless receiver" in the head. The he crowed about how he doesn't try to "injure" players, but he does try to "hurt" them. He deserved to get fined. Hell, he deserved to get suspended. It's about time the NFL started hitting the thugs where they hurt.He's so upset that he might retire? Cue the world's smallest violin.

Of course defensive players are going to complain about this. I'm sure they complained when clotheslining was made illegal. They were wrong then and they are wrong now. Those kinds of hits are bad for the game.

 

[NinerFan49]

Also QBs and Coaches putting their tiny WR in a situation to get rocked should be held accountable. They should really be the ones protecting their players.

Very valid point. I don't know how you hold them accountable though???

Media and NFL need to stop putting it all on the Defense and start talking about how Coaches are having their receivers run these plays.If the viewpoint keeps showing the defense at fault the NFL will keep adding protective rules until the league is playing 2 hand touch.

Fans like seeing high scoring games so giving the offensive players more protection is good for the game. All teams will play by the same rules so no team will be hurt by having suspensions handed out for dangerous hits to the head. Well... except for teams that have taught their defensive players to play like thugs.

 

[NinerFan49]

The rules state you have to let the receiver catch and then defend himself before hitting him in the head/neck area. It is not the coaches fault that defensive players are breaking the rules.

That is such an offensive biased rule right there but whatever, its done. Defenses will be at a disadvantage because receivers can keep pushing the edge and have no fear going down the middle. Most of them are already taller, jump higher and can catch better.Wonder why the NFL is so pass heavy? It because Def players are pulling up constantly instead of going full speed. Gotta pull up if the QB gets rid of the ball, gotta pull up if the WR don't catch the ball....

The same kind of thing has been happening in the NBA. There, like in the NFL, there have been more rule changes to benefit the offense than the defense. That has led to more high scoring games and increased popularity for both sports.

 

[NinerFan49]

I get the Football is a physical sport. Why does it have to be a violent sport?

THe players themselves are causing more physical damage to each other than is necessary to play the game. YOu would think the players would look around at some of the disabled former players and think twice before trying to inflict damage for the sake of the game.

In 20 years they will regret it, why not start thinking about it now.

+1Players can still hit other players hard... just not in the head or neck area. A rule that they all should have known.

 

[Adebisi]

To be fair to Harrison, as a Lions fan you know nothing about football.

Right, because a fan's knowledge is directly correlated to the success of the team he follows. Harrison is acting like a spoiled baby. Deal with it.

 

[treat88]

Also QBs and Coaches putting their tiny WR in a situation to get rocked should be held accountable. They should really be the ones protecting their players.

Very valid point. I don't know how you hold them accountable though???

Media and NFL need to stop putting it all on the Defense and start talking about how Coaches are having their receivers run these plays.If the viewpoint keeps showing the defense at fault the NFL will keep adding protective rules until the league is playing 2 hand touch.

Fans like seeing high scoring games so giving the offensive players more protection is good for the game. All teams will play by the same rules so no team will be hurt by having suspensions handed out for dangerous hits to the head. Well... except for teams that have taught their defensive players to play like thugs.

You seem to be the most outspoken proponent of enforcing the fines/suspensions.I am 100% in favor of eliminating deliberate shots to the head on any player defenseless or otherwise.How though do you reconcile unintentional shots that are caused by the offensive player changing his pad level with no time for the defensive player to adapt?It just amazes me that in watching the Harrison/Mass hit that people think Harrison is so superhuman as to be able to change anything about his tackle in the split second Mass drops his helmet, causing the helmet to helmet collision, as he braces for contact. Harrison should have his facemask up 100% agreed, but heads still would have collided and Harrison would still be getting 100% of the blame.Honest question.

 

[Choke]

Also QBs and Coaches putting their tiny WR in a situation to get rocked should be held accountable. They should really be the ones protecting their players.

Very valid point. I don't know how you hold them accountable though???

Media and NFL need to stop putting it all on the Defense and start talking about how Coaches are having their receivers run these plays.If the viewpoint keeps showing the defense at fault the NFL will keep adding protective rules until the league is playing 2 hand touch.

Fans like seeing high scoring games so giving the offensive players more protection is good for the game. All teams will play by the same rules so no team will be hurt by having suspensions handed out for dangerous hits to the head. Well... except for teams that have taught their defensive players to play like thugs.

You seem to be the most outspoken proponent of enforcing the fines/suspensions.I am 100% in favor of eliminating deliberate shots to the head on any player defenseless or otherwise.

How though do you reconcile unintentional shots that are caused by the offensive player changing his pad level with no time for the defensive player to adapt?

It just amazes me that in watching the Harrison/Mass hit that people think Harrison is so superhuman as to be able to change anything about his tackle in the split second Mass drops his helmet, causing the helmet to helmet collision, to brace for contact. Harrison should have his facemask up 100% agreed, but heads still would have collided and Harrison would still be getting 100% of the blame.

Honest question.

After getting both hands on the ball... MoMass took 4 steps before being hit. Harrison gets low enough to deliver the blow to the mdiscection and actually hits MoMass in the chest with both hands initially.

The only reason MoMass gets helmet contact is becase MoMass screwed up.

1 (With ball in both hands.)

2

3

4 (and his derp-derp ball skills and positioning.)

double handed punch to the chest. whammo.

 

[maxwjom0]

The most storied franchise in the NFL has always had a legacy of having the toughest/loud mouthed linebackers in the league.

Jack Lambert

Greg Lloyd

Joey Porter

James Harrison

 

[Choke]

Harrison is acting like a spoiled baby. Deal with it.

True. But he is also making a point. And its getting noticed. The same point almost every other football player is trying to make.It was the squeaky wheel that got the grease on the new rule (dungy/harrison being talking heads on tv) and now Harrison is using the same approach.

 

[Godsbrother]

Wasn't ther a quote from Harrison about "not intending to injure players, only to hurt them?"Shouldn't his intent only to be to tackle them or to prevent a catch? When does the intent to hurt a player become ok?

Players like Harrison and Ray Lewis want to intimidate as well. You hit hard and all of a sudden WRs start getting alligator arms or not running their routes. This can help you win a game and ultimately a championship. This is nothing new and has been a part of football since it's inception. The way people are acting, you would think that Harrison is the only player in NFL history to play this way.Previously in this thread I posted similar quotes made by other great players saying they want to hurt their opponent. They aren't out to injure but they do want to inflict pain on their opponent, which is exacty what Harrison was saying.As far as him retiring goes we all know it isn't going to happen. He is blowing off some steam and trying to make a point: He was fined $75k for two hits that did not draw a penalty and he doesn't like it.

 

[Adebisi]

Harrison is acting like a spoiled baby. Deal with it.

True. But he is also making a point. And its getting noticed. The same point almost every other football player is trying to make.It was the squeaky wheel that got the grease on the new rule (dungy/harrison being talking heads on tv) and now Harrison is using the same approach.

People were talking about this long before Harrison made this ridiculous & empty threat.

 

[Adebisi]

Wasn't ther a quote from Harrison about "not intending to injure players, only to hurt them?"Shouldn't his intent only to be to tackle them or to prevent a catch? When does the intent to hurt a player become ok?

Players like Harrison and Ray Lewis want to intimidate as well. You hit hard and all of a sudden WRs start getting alligator arms or not running their routes. This can help you win a game and ultimately a championship. This is nothing new and has been a part of football since it's inception. The way people are acting, you would think that Harrison is the only player in NFL history to play this way.Previously in this thread I posted similar quotes made by other great players saying they want to hurt their opponent. They aren't out to injure but they do want to inflict pain on their opponent, which is exacty what Harrison was saying.As far as him retiring goes we all know it isn't going to happen. He is blowing off some steam and trying to make a point: He was fined $75k for two hits that did not draw a penalty and he doesn't like it.

There is a difference between putting a great hit on a player (and the physical intimidation that goes with it) and head-hunting.

 

[Godsbrother]

I get the Football is a physical sport. Why does it have to be a violent sport?

THe players themselves are causing more physical damage to each other than is necessary to play the game. YOu would think the players would look around at some of the disabled former players and think twice before trying to inflict damage for the sake of the game.

In 20 years they will regret it, why not start thinking about it now.

+1Players can still hit other players hard... just not in the head or neck area. A rule that they all should have known.

The problem is that in many cases the ball carrier or receiver changes the position of his head a moment before the hit is delivered and contact to the head and/or neck is unavoidable. I don't have the problem ejecting or suspending a player that is intentionally using the helmet as a weapon. I just didn't see it that way last week and, at least in Harrison's case, neither did the officials on the field.For the league to use super slow and stop motion after the fact and suspend players in my opinion is wrong.

 

[Choke]

Harrison is acting like a spoiled baby. Deal with it.

True. But he is also making a point. And its getting noticed. The same point almost every other football player is trying to make.

It was the squeaky wheel that got the grease on the new rule (dungy/harrison being talking heads on tv) and now Harrison is using the same approach.

People were talking about this long before Harrison made this ridiculous & empty threat.

But this remains the absolute squeakiest wheel on that side of the debate yet.

 

[NinerFan49]

Also QBs and Coaches putting their tiny WR in a situation to get rocked should be held accountable. They should really be the ones protecting their players.

Very valid point. I don't know how you hold them accountable though???

Media and NFL need to stop putting it all on the Defense and start talking about how Coaches are having their receivers run these plays.If the viewpoint keeps showing the defense at fault the NFL will keep adding protective rules until the league is playing 2 hand touch.

The rules state you have to let the receiver catch and then defend himself before hitting him in the head/neck area. It is not the coaches fault that defensive players are breaking the rules.

I agree with VATerp that it's a good thing the league is moving the direction that it is. I also agree that they are doing it in an imperfect manner.That said though as a defender, now knowing that if I go high and even inadvertently hit a receiver above the chest, that I will get suspended I am absolutely going to err on the side of hitting him too low.

In a perfect world the defender could hit the receiver with perfect technique in the midsection every time, but given the fact the game is too fast for perfection the defense now has no choice but to err in hitting lower rather than higher.

If Robinson had dropped down and cut Jackson's knees is that still going to be called dirty given the direction things are moving? Because that is going to be the absolute result of the newly enforced policy.

Is it a better thing for Jackson to tear a ligament or bust his femur than get concussed? I guess so. That is really the choice the league is making here.

I'm fine with that choice, but let's be willing to redefine what we consider "dirty" as fans.

It's not like defenders have only two choices, hitting head or the knees...One of the commentators on NFL Total Access made the point that on most of Ronnie Lott's big hits, he made contact with his head first... which prevented "accidental" head hits. If he could do that, others can, too...

 

[Godsbrother]

Wasn't ther a quote from Harrison about "not intending to injure players, only to hurt them?"Shouldn't his intent only to be to tackle them or to prevent a catch? When does the intent to hurt a player become ok?

Players like Harrison and Ray Lewis want to intimidate as well. You hit hard and all of a sudden WRs start getting alligator arms or not running their routes. This can help you win a game and ultimately a championship. This is nothing new and has been a part of football since it's inception. The way people are acting, you would think that Harrison is the only player in NFL history to play this way.Previously in this thread I posted similar quotes made by other great players saying they want to hurt their opponent. They aren't out to injure but they do want to inflict pain on their opponent, which is exacty what Harrison was saying.As far as him retiring goes we all know it isn't going to happen. He is blowing off some steam and trying to make a point: He was fined $75k for two hits that did not draw a penalty and he doesn't like it.

There is a difference between putting a great hit on a player (and the physical intimidation that goes with it) and head-hunting.

Agreed. I don't think Harrison was head hunting and neither did the officials.

 

[Godsbrother]

One of the commentators on NFL Total Access made the point that on most of Ronnie Lott's big hits, he made contact with his head first... which prevented "accidental" head hits. If he could do that, others can, too...

So he was leading with the head?

 

[NinerFan49]

Guys get hit in the legs all the time. When you are running or making a play then its usually not a injury. What they are trying to stop is the defenseless hits on unsuspecting players. I see nothing wrong with this.

So you'd have been good if Robinson dropped down and put his shoulder into Jackson's knees?

Since when are the head and knees the only target areas available to defenders?

 

[Johnny Ice]

After getting both hands on the ball... MoMass took 4 steps before being hit.

Harrison gets low enough to deliver the blow to the mdiscection and actually hits MoMass in the chest with both hands initially.

The only reason MoMass gets helmet contact is becase MoMass screwed up.

1 (With ball in both hands.)

2

3

4 (and his derp-derp ball skills and positioning.)

double handed punch to the chest. whammo.

Thank you. MoMass is the one ducking his head because he is fumbling around with the ball. I guess Harrison was supposed to anticipate that as well. It's good to hear that every defensive player is pretty much saying F this new enforcement of the rule and they will play like they always have and not worry about it. Good for them.

 

[Adebisi]

Harrison is acting like a spoiled baby. Deal with it.

True. But he is also making a point. And its getting noticed. The same point almost every other football player is trying to make.

It was the squeaky wheel that got the grease on the new rule (dungy/harrison being talking heads on tv) and now Harrison is using the same approach.

People were talking about this long before Harrison made this ridiculous & empty threat.

But this remains the absolute squeakiest wheel on that side of the debate yet.

The NFL is not going to back down when it comes to head and neck injuries. And no one believes that any of these players are seriously going to forfeit millions of dollars by retiring over this. If anything, it will extend careers.

 

[3C's]

Wasn't ther a quote from Harrison about "not intending to injure players, only to hurt them?"Shouldn't his intent only to be to tackle them or to prevent a catch? When does the intent to hurt a player become ok?

Players like Harrison and Ray Lewis want to intimidate as well. You hit hard and all of a sudden WRs start getting alligator arms or not running their routes. This can help you win a game and ultimately a championship. This is nothing new and has been a part of football since it's inception. The way people are acting, you would think that Harrison is the only player in NFL history to play this way.Previously in this thread I posted similar quotes made by other great players saying they want to hurt their opponent. They aren't out to injure but they do want to inflict pain on their opponent, which is exacty what Harrison was saying.As far as him retiring goes we all know it isn't going to happen. He is blowing off some steam and trying to make a point: He was fined $75k for two hits that did not draw a penalty and he doesn't like it.

There is a difference between putting a great hit on a player (and the physical intimidation that goes with it) and head-hunting.

Agreed. I don't think Harrison was head hunting and neither did the officials.

Meriweather sure was though.

 

[Adebisi]

Wasn't ther a quote from Harrison about "not intending to injure players, only to hurt them?"Shouldn't his intent only to be to tackle them or to prevent a catch? When does the intent to hurt a player become ok?

Players like Harrison and Ray Lewis want to intimidate as well. You hit hard and all of a sudden WRs start getting alligator arms or not running their routes. This can help you win a game and ultimately a championship. This is nothing new and has been a part of football since it's inception. The way people are acting, you would think that Harrison is the only player in NFL history to play this way.Previously in this thread I posted similar quotes made by other great players saying they want to hurt their opponent. They aren't out to injure but they do want to inflict pain on their opponent, which is exacty what Harrison was saying.As far as him retiring goes we all know it isn't going to happen. He is blowing off some steam and trying to make a point: He was fined $75k for two hits that did not draw a penalty and he doesn't like it.

There is a difference between putting a great hit on a player (and the physical intimidation that goes with it) and head-hunting.

Agreed. I don't think Harrison was head hunting and neither did the officials.

And neither do I. But I also do not believe Harrison would have been suspended for it had the new consequences been in place last week.

 

[Adebisi]

Wasn't ther a quote from Harrison about "not intending to injure players, only to hurt them?"Shouldn't his intent only to be to tackle them or to prevent a catch? When does the intent to hurt a player become ok?

Players like Harrison and Ray Lewis want to intimidate as well. You hit hard and all of a sudden WRs start getting alligator arms or not running their routes. This can help you win a game and ultimately a championship. This is nothing new and has been a part of football since it's inception. The way people are acting, you would think that Harrison is the only player in NFL history to play this way.Previously in this thread I posted similar quotes made by other great players saying they want to hurt their opponent. They aren't out to injure but they do want to inflict pain on their opponent, which is exacty what Harrison was saying.As far as him retiring goes we all know it isn't going to happen. He is blowing off some steam and trying to make a point: He was fined $75k for two hits that did not draw a penalty and he doesn't like it.

There is a difference between putting a great hit on a player (and the physical intimidation that goes with it) and head-hunting.

Agreed. I don't think Harrison was head hunting and neither did the officials.

Meriweather sure was though.

No question about that.

 

[NinerFan49]

Also QBs and Coaches putting their tiny WR in a situation to get rocked should be held accountable. They should really be the ones protecting their players.

Very valid point. I don't know how you hold them accountable though???

Media and NFL need to stop putting it all on the Defense and start talking about how Coaches are having their receivers run these plays.If the viewpoint keeps showing the defense at fault the NFL will keep adding protective rules until the league is playing 2 hand touch.

Fans like seeing high scoring games so giving the offensive players more protection is good for the game. All teams will play by the same rules so no team will be hurt by having suspensions handed out for dangerous hits to the head. Well... except for teams that have taught their defensive players to play like thugs.

You seem to be the most outspoken proponent of enforcing the fines/suspensions.I am 100% in favor of eliminating deliberate shots to the head on any player defenseless or otherwise.

How though do you reconcile unintentional shots that are caused by the offensive player changing his pad level with no time for the defensive player to adapt?

It just amazes me that in watching the Harrison/Mass hit that people think Harrison is so superhuman as to be able to change anything about his tackle in the split second Mass drops his helmet, causing the helmet to helmet collision, as he braces for contact. Harrison should have his facemask up 100% agreed, but heads still would have collided and Harrison would still be getting 100% of the blame.

Honest question.

First of all, it didn't look to me as if Harrison hit Mossaquoi on the head accidentally, it looked to me as if he did it deliberately. But, to answer, your question... Let's assume that Harrison wanted to play within the rules and not risk the kind of illegal hit that he was penalized for... If instead of firing his forearms at Mossaquoi, he had led with his chest... as Ronnie Lott used to do, he wouldn't have have been fined, even if Mossaquoi had lowered his head. There's nothing in the rules about not hitting players on the head with your chest. Read it again:

h) If a receiver has completed a catch and has not had time to protect himself, a defensive player is prohibited from launching (springing forward and upward) into him in a way that causes the defensive player's helmet, facemask, shoulder, or forearm to forcibly strike the receiver's head or neck area -- even if the initial contact of the defender's helmet, facemask, shoulder, or forearm is lower than the receiver's neck.

 

[NinerFan49]

One of the commentators on NFL Total Access made the point that on most of Ronnie Lott's big hits, he made contact with his head first... which prevented "accidental" head hits. If he could do that, others can, too...

So he was leading with the head?

No. He led with his chest. That's why he made the initial contact with his chest.

 

[NinerFan49]

After getting both hands on the ball... MoMass took 4 steps before being hit.

Harrison gets low enough to deliver the blow to the mdiscection and actually hits MoMass in the chest with both hands initially.

The only reason MoMass gets helmet contact is becase MoMass screwed up.

1 (With ball in both hands.)

2

3

4 (and his derp-derp ball skills and positioning.)

double handed punch to the chest. whammo.

Thank you. MoMass is the one ducking his head because he is fumbling around with the ball. I guess Harrison was supposed to anticipate that as well. It's good to hear that every defensive player is pretty much saying F this new enforcement of the rule and they will play like they always have and not worry about it. Good for them.

Oh... one of Harrison's fanboys claims the fault lay with Massaquoi, not with Harrison? I guess that settles it. Too bad for Harrison that the NFL officials who reviewed the play (in slow motion and frame-by-frame, I'm sure), aren't Harrison fanboys.

 

[Johnny Ice]

One of the commentators on NFL Total Access made the point that on most of Ronnie Lott's big hits, he made contact with his head first... which prevented "accidental" head hits. If he could do that, others can, too...

So he was leading with the head?

No. He led with his chest. That's why he made the initial contact with his chest.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bx20th1gT4kI barely watched 1 minute of this video and Lott couldn't even make it under today's rules. At the 9 second mark he lays out a defenseless WR extending both forearms.

Edit: Starting at 1:19 he destroys 3 more defenseless wideouts. 1:35 he would be banished from the NFL forever. 1:52 forearm shot to the back of Collinsworth's head. Great recommendation NinerFan.

 

[Choke]

After getting both hands on the ball... MoMass took 4 steps before being hit.

Harrison gets low enough to deliver the blow to the mdiscection and actually hits MoMass in the chest with both hands initially.

The only reason MoMass gets helmet contact is becase MoMass screwed up.

1 (With ball in both hands.)

2

3

4 (and his derp-derp ball skills and positioning.)

double handed punch to the chest. whammo.

Thank you. MoMass is the one ducking his head because he is fumbling around with the ball. I guess Harrison was supposed to anticipate that as well. It's good to hear that every defensive player is pretty much saying F this new enforcement of the rule and they will play like they always have and not worry about it. Good for them.

Oh... one of Harrison's fanboys claims the fault lay with Massaquoi, not with Harrison? I guess that settles it. Too bad for Harrison that the NFL officials who reviewed the play (in slow motion and frame-by-frame, I'm sure), aren't Harrison fanboys.

Claims?You can see the truth in the pictures. MoMass screwed up the play and got himself into a very bad position.

He brings his helmet down to Harrisons helmet level at the last split second.

Dont talk about me, just look at the actual photos of what transipred. You can be thoughtful about it, its ok.

 

[NinerFan49]

One of the commentators on NFL Total Access made the point that on most of Ronnie Lott's big hits, he made contact with his head first... which prevented "accidental" head hits. If he could do that, others can, too...

So he was leading with the head?

No. He led with his chest. That's why he made the initial contact with his chest.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bx20th1gT4kI barely watched 1 minute of this video and Lott couldn't even make it under today's rules. At the 9 second mark he lays out a defenseless WR extending both forearms.

Lott hits that receiver on the chest, not the head. If Harrison doesn't want to play by the rules, he can find something else to do.

And he can whine about how unfair it is that he is being held accountable for being penalized for breaking a rule he should have known all he wants... that and a few bucks will get him a cup of coffee.

 

[Johnny Ice]

One of the commentators on NFL Total Access made the point that on most of Ronnie Lott's big hits, he made contact with his head first... which prevented "accidental" head hits. If he could do that, others can, too...

So he was leading with the head?

No. He led with his chest. That's why he made the initial contact with his chest.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bx20th1gT4kI barely watched 1 minute of this video and Lott couldn't even make it under today's rules. At the 9 second mark he lays out a defenseless WR extending both forearms.

Lott hits that receiver on the chest, not the head. If Harrison doesn't want to play by the rules, he can find something else to do.

And he can whine about how unfair it is that he is being held accountable for being penalized for breaking a rule he should have known all he wants... that and a few bucks will get him a cup of coffee.

I'm convinced you are blind. If you don't want to acknowledge Lott's obvious decapitation attempt on that guy then it's clear you're just

 

[Choke]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bx20th1gT4k

I barely watched 1 minute of this video and Lott couldn't even make it under today's rules. At the 9 second mark he lays out a defenseless WR extending both forearms.

Starting at 1:19 he destroys 3 more defenseless wideouts. 1:35 he would be banished from the NFL forever. 1:52 forearm shot to the back of Collinsworth's head. Great recommendation NinerFan.

I'll take Ronnie Lott... all day long and twice on Sundays. A wonderful defensive player who knows how to play - PHYSICAL.

 

[Choke]

One of the commentators on NFL Total Access made the point that on most of Ronnie Lott's big hits, he made contact with his head first... which prevented "accidental" head hits. If he could do that, others can, too...

So he was leading with the head?

No. He led with his chest. That's why he made the initial contact with his chest.

HAHA!Watch that video. He is killing people up high.

*and we arent talking about hitting at waist level and having helmet-to-helmet. We are talking about climbing the ladder and going up high at the neck/head with purpose.

** youre comment on Lott is golden to this thread.

 

[NinerFan49]

Has Harrison stopped crying yet about having to play by the rules?

 

[jbz]

you forgot Kevin Greene

 

[Choke]

:curbstomped:

 

[dickey moe]

Harrison will never retire over this but I'm glad that he's trying to make his point.

This is football we're talking about, right?

 

[Steeler]

Has Harrison stopped crying yet about having to play by the rules?

Hypothetical question: a defender leads with his chest, wraps up a WR, and then accidentally slides up where helmet to helment contact is made... should that defender be flagged, fined, or suspended?

 

[NinerFan49]

Harrison HAS made his point. He's a dirty player and a crybaby who doesn't think he should be held to the same rules all other players have to follow.

 

[DropKick]

During Monday night's game, they showed some of Chuck Cecil's (Titans coordinator) big hits. What I noticed was strong tackling technique. He hit hard with his head up and wrapped up the player with his arms and still delivered a hell of a wallop. I would like to see this technique more widely used than the battering ram approach used by some of these guys today. Are we surprised when this technique yields a violent head to head shot?

Sure, it is a physical game. Eliminating cheap shots and dangerous technique can make the game safer without a compromise in physicality.

 

[DropKick]

Has Harrison stopped crying yet about having to play by the rules?

Hypothetical question: a defender leads with his chest, wraps up a WR, and then accidentally slides up where helmet to helment contact is made... should that defender be flagged, fined, or suspended?

Of course not. But the fact remains that many hits should be flagged. Let's not pretend they can't or shouldn't be managed because there is incidental head to head contact that is unavoidable.

 

[Steeler]

Harrison HAS made his point. He's a dirty player and a crybaby who doesn't think he should be held to the same rules all other players have to follow.

Actually, I think he's saying he doesn't like the new over-enforcement of the rules.

 

[treat88]

First of all, it didn't look to me as if Harrison hit Mossaquoi on the head accidentally, it looked to me as if he did it deliberately.

But, to answer, your question... Let's assume that Harrison wanted to play within the rules and not risk the kind of illegal hit that he was penalized for... If instead of firing his forearms at Mossaquoi, he had led with his chest... as Ronnie Lott used to do, he wouldn't have have been fined, even if Mossaquoi had lowered his head. There's nothing in the rules about not hitting players on the head with your chest. Read it again:

h) If a receiver has completed a catch and has not had time to protect himself, a defensive player is prohibited from launching (springing forward and upward) into him in a way that causes the defensive player's helmet, facemask, shoulder, or forearm to forcibly strike the receiver's head or neck area -- even if the initial contact of the defender's helmet, facemask, shoulder, or forearm is lower than the receiver's neck.

Look man I understand and agree with the rule...that isn't in question.Thing is to suggest any football player "leads with their chest" in an attempt to make a tackle just completely invalidates your entire opinion. It is a very overused phrase, but "knows nothing about the sport" applies in your case.

To suggest that Ronnie Lott "led with his chest" is just totally asinine.

I can't even imagine a guy trying intentionally to stick his sternum in the other guys helmet to make a tackle.

What little credibility you had is just 100% gone.

You can make whatever smarmy, pseudo-witty comeback you want you aren't even worth the effort.

 

[Steeler]

Has Harrison stopped crying yet about having to play by the rules?

Hypothetical question: a defender leads with his chest, wraps up a WR, and then accidentally slides up where helmet to helment contact is made... should that defender be flagged, fined, or suspended?

Of course not. But the fact remains that many hits should be flagged. Let's not pretend they can't or shouldn't be managed because there is incidental head to head contact that is unavoidable.

But what I described is exactly the way the rule is written! I don't think anyone is "for" more head injuries... but as the NFL rule is written, the defender can be flagged, fined, suspended if helmet-to-helmet contact is made regardless of where the initial contact occured. I think THAT is what many of us are arguing against in this thread.

 

[NinerFan49]

Harrison HAS made his point. He's a dirty player and a crybaby who doesn't think he should be held to the same rules all other players have to follow.

Actually, I think he's saying he doesn't like the new over-enforcement of the rules.

When traumatic brain damage is at stake, I think rules should be enforced strongly.And it's the height of hypocrisy for a player who brags that he wants to hurt people to act as if he's the victim when he is penalized for a hit that could have broken another player's neck.

 

[Choke]

Harrison HAS made his point. He's a dirty player and a crybaby who doesn't think he should be held to the same rules all other players have to follow.

Actually, I think he's saying he doesn't like the new over-enforcement of the rules.

When traumatic brain damage is at stake, I think rules should be enforced strongly.And it's the height of hypocrisy for a player who brags that he wants to hurt people to act as if he's the victim when he is penalized for a hit that could have broken another player's neck.

He didnt brag. Harrison avoids the media, but when the media asks him a question, he states the truth. And often that truth is ugly and brutal.

 

[Steeler]

When traumatic brain damage is at stake, I think rules should be enforced strongly.

So you are in the camp that says "all" helmet to helmet contact should be flagged, fined, or suspended?

 

[NinerFan49]

Has Harrison stopped crying yet about having to play by the rules?

Hypothetical question: a defender leads with his chest, wraps up a WR, and then accidentally slides up where helmet to helment contact is made... should that defender be flagged, fined, or suspended?

Of course not. But the fact remains that many hits should be flagged. Let's not pretend they can't or shouldn't be managed because there is incidental head to head contact that is unavoidable.

But what I described is exactly the way the rule is written! I don't think anyone is "for" more head injuries... but as the NFL rule is written, the defender can be flagged, fined, suspended if helmet-to-helmet contact is made regardless of where the initial contact occured. I think THAT is what many of us are arguing against in this thread.

here is the rule again:h) If a receiver has completed a catch and has not had time to protect himself, a defensive player is prohibited from launching (springing forward and upward) into him in a way that causes the defensive player's helmet, facemask, shoulder, or forearm to forcibly strike the receiver's head or neck area -- even if the initial contact of the defender's helmet, facemask, shoulder, or forearm is lower than the receiver's neck.

If the defender does not strike with the helmet, facemask, shoulder, or forearm, he won't be penalized. If the defender aims to strike with the chest and then wrap his arms around the ball carrier (textbook tackling technique), the chances of him being penalized are almost zero.

If the defender tries to hurt the ball carrier by striking him with the helmet, facemask, shoulder, or forearm and he gets penalized, he has nothing to cry about. He chose to do something that he should have known could result in an illegal hit.