****OFFICIAL**** 2008 Washington Redskins Off Season Thread! (1 Viewer)

[fatness]

The more I read about Gibbs' second tenure the more disgusted I am at how disorganized and ill-conceived a lot of the management was, even as I admire how he unified and strengthened what had been a very week and demoralized and fragmented squad.

You can't say that here. I said it awhile back and was told I had a negative attitude.

 

[fatness]

LaCanfora has some info on Cerrato's hirings and firings in the FO this off season.

I thought the relationship between Riddick and Williams was particularly interesting.

Wow.

There was lots of internal fingerpointing, then team president Joe Gibbs came very close to making major changes within the front office, nearly making a major hiring that could have left even Cerrato without a job, sources said, and chasms formed.

Under Gibbs the offense made very little use of the Redskins' advanced scouting work, according to team sources, (the consistently uneven performances of the offense may have had something to do with that). The defense, however, incorporated the work of the scouts heavily into game planning, team sources said.

While the Redskins have long set records in spending on coaches and players, their rep around the NFL in terms of scouting and front office staff is for the just the opposite, Under Snyder the big money has stayed at the top and the Redskins were woefully thin and under-represented in the scouting ranks as recently as 2004 (Gibbs immediately bolstered that staff, reinforcing the importance of the in-the-press-box eyes and ears of the organization throughout the NFL and college ranks). They traditionally pay their scouts less than most other clubs, several league sources said.

 

[redman]

There was lots of internal fingerpointing, then team president Joe Gibbs came very close to making major changes within the front office, nearly making a major hiring that could have left even Cerrato without a job, sources said, and chasms formed.

This has me very curious. I wonder if there was a specific person in mind for this hire, and who it was.

 

[Sidewinder16]

Rich Tandler

The Washington Redskins' roster is about 96% complete.

Of the 53 players who will be on the team's opening-day roster, all but one or two of them currently are with the team.

Don't look for post-June 1 cuts to add that depth at cornerback or along the lines.

Anyone want to relieve some mid-May football boredom and take a shot at what the 53-man roster will look like for week 1?Here's my off-the-cuff shot, mostly based on who's on the roster now:

OL

Rabach, Casey

Kendall, Pete

Thomas, Randy

Albright, Ethan

Fabini, Jason

Rinehart, Chad

Wade, Todd

Heyer, Stephon

Jansen, Jon

Samuels, Chris

QB

Brennan, Colt

Campbell, Jason

Collins, Todd

FB

Broughton, Nehemiah

Sellers, Mike

RB

Betts, Ladell

Cartwright, Rock

Portis, Clinton

TE

Cooley, Chris

Davis, Fred

Yoder, Todd

WR

Kelly, Malcolm

Mix, Anthony

Moss, Santana

Randle El, Antwaan

Thomas, Devin

DE

Carter, Andre

Daniels, Phillip

Evans, Demetric

Jackson, Rob

Wilson, Chris

DT

Alexander, Lorenzo

Boschetti, Ryan

Golston, Kedric

Griffin, Cornelius

Montgomery, Anthony

LB

Blades, H.B.

Campbell, Khary

Fletcher, London

McIntosh, Rocky

Washington, Marcus

player to be added

CB

Rogers, Carlos/player to be added

Smoot, Fred

Springs, Shawn

Torrence, Leigh

Tryon, Justin

Westbrook, Byron

S

Doughty, Reed

Fox, Vernon

Landry, LaRon

K/P

Suisham, Shaun

Brooks, Durant

With Rogers almost certainly starting the season on the PUP I see them bringing in another CB, at least for the first half of the season. 5 DTs seems like a lot (especially since Daniels and Evans can slide inside some, too), but that's what Alexander is currently listed as, and I think his versatility guarantees him a roster spot. I'd love to see Kerry Brown turn in to this year's Stephon Heyer and maybe replace Fabini. We definitely need an addition (depth) at LB. I think Randall Godfrey is still a FA and I wouldn't mind seeing him back as depth. S could probably use another body, as well, but I'm not sure who to cut to get that extra body.

Anyone think I'm really off on someone? Which of the backups do you think I have wrong?

 

[Swing 51]

Posted at 3:51 PM ET, 05/15/2008Skins Release MathisWide receiver/return specialist Jerome Mathis, the only outside free agent the Redskins have signed this offseason, has been released, according to the team. Mathis, who has been injury prone and has had legal issues, was a longshot to make the team in the first place. After the Redskins selected pass-catchers with their first three picks of the draft last month, Mathis became expendable.Posted by Jon DeNunzio

 

[Sidewinder16]

Posted at 3:51 PM ET, 05/15/2008Skins Release MathisWide receiver/return specialist Jerome Mathis, the only outside free agent the Redskins have signed this offseason, has been released, according to the team. Mathis, who has been injury prone and has had legal issues, was a longshot to make the team in the first place. After the Redskins selected pass-catchers with their first three picks of the draft last month, Mathis became expendable.Posted by Jon DeNunzio

Good thing I didn't have him making the final 53.

 

[buster c]

just caught the last 20mins of America's Game on the NFLN featuring the '82 Skins.

I feel sad for those Skins fan who are too young to have lived thru this era.

the coolest part was Joey T saying that in the huddle, Russ Grimm overruled Gibbs' play calling at the end of the game, instructing the team that 50 gut was the play, and running out the clock in a Riggo drill.

seems like so long ago

 

[dgreen]

Anyone think I'm really off on someone? Which of the backups do you think I have wrong?

I think Marcus Mason could make a run at the roster. Not sure who he'd replace on your list, though. Will they carry two FBs?

 

[Sidewinder16]

Anyone think I'm really off on someone? Which of the backups do you think I have wrong?

I think Marcus Mason could make a run at the roster. Not sure who he'd replace on your list, though. Will they carry two FBs?

Probably not, but they probably won't keep 4 RBs either. I checked a few of the gamebooks from last season to see what kind of distribution there was between the positions. I'll be editing my selections shortly.

 

[Sidewinder16]

Here's another shot at the final roster, after I checked out generally how the number of players was distributed between the positions last year (OL=9-10, QB=3, RB=3, FB=1, WR=6-7, TE=3, DE=4, DT=5, LB=6-7, CB=5, S=4-5, K/P=2):

OL

Rabach, Casey

Kendall, Pete

Thomas, Randy

Albright, Ethan

Fabini, Jason

Rinehart, Chad

Wade, Todd

Heyer, Stephon

Jansen, Jon

Samuels, Chris

QB

Brennan, Colt

Campbell, Jason

Collins, Todd

FB

Sellers, Mike

RB

Betts, Ladell

Cartwright, Rock

Portis, Clinton

TE

Cooley, Chris

Davis, Fred

Yoder, Todd

WR

Kelly, Malcolm

Mix, Anthony

Moss, Santana

Randle El, Antwaan

Thomas, Devin

Thrash, James

DE

Carter, Andre

Daniels, Phillip

Evans, Demetric

Wilson, Chris

DT

Alexander, Lorenzo

Boschetti, Ryan

Golston, Kedric

Griffin, Cornelius

Montgomery, Anthony

LB

Blades, H.B.

Campbell, Khary

Fletcher, London

McIntosh, Rocky

Sinclair, Matt

Washington, Marcus

player to be added

CB

Rogers, Carlos/player to be added

Smoot, Fred

Springs, Shawn

Torrence, Leigh

Tryon, Justin

S

Doughty, Reed

Fox, Vernon

Moore, Kareem

Landry, LaRon

K/P

Suisham, Shaun

Brooks, Durant

Again, who am I way off on?

 

[DCThunder]

You guys SURE that Lorenzo Alexander is going to end up on the defensive side of the ball? I could easily see him getting more reps on offense, perhaps at guard. And they signed Crummey, the OT from Mayland who'd have been drafted fairly high if he hadn't broken his leg twice in his senior season. He might find a way onto the roster or at least the practice squad when all is said and done.

Also, don't be surprised in Jon Jansen gets cut this preseason. Some vet of his type always gets whacked when they least expect it, especially if Heyer has a decent camp and pre-season.

 

[Sidewinder16]

You guys SURE that Lorenzo Alexander is going to end up on the defensive side of the ball? I could easily see him getting more reps on offense, perhaps at guard. And they signed Crummey, the OT from Mayland who'd have been drafted fairly high if he hadn't broken his leg twice in his senior season. He might find a way onto the roster or at least the practice squad when all is said and done.

Seemed to me like he played just as much, if not more, OL than DL last year and he was always listed as a DT (and still is). Anyway they list him, though, they could release one of the OL I have listed and still have decent depth at OL and DT because of his versatility. Maybe add an extra DB instead. DB looks awfully thin.

Also, don't be surprised in Jon Jansen gets cut this preseason. Some vet of his type always gets whacked when they least expect it, especially if Heyer has a decent camp and pre-season.

Now that would be something. Jansen seems to be more of a locker room leader than some of the other vets that have been released the past couple of seasons. I could see him losing his starting job, but I'd be surprised, and somewhat disappointed, if he got cut.

 

[Bizkiteer]

You guys SURE that Lorenzo Alexander is going to end up on the defensive side of the ball? I could easily see him getting more reps on offense, perhaps at guard. And they signed Crummey, the OT from Mayland who'd have been drafted fairly high if he hadn't broken his leg twice in his senior season. He might find a way onto the roster or at least the practice squad when all is said and done. Also, don't be surprised in Jon Jansen gets cut this preseason. Some vet of his type always gets whacked when they least expect it, especially if Heyer has a decent camp and pre-season.

I think it's irrelevant where Alexander gets listed, he will play a little here and there when all is said and done. He knows it and so does the coaching staff.

 

[Sidewinder16]

Tryon gets a slice of humble pie.

Some quotes:

He admitted to being "humbled" after completing his first Redskins mini-camp.

Turns out that lining up against Santana Moss and Antwaan Randle El is nothing like the competition he faced in the PAC-10.

Defensive coordinator Greg Blache jokingly referred to Tryon as Smoot's "mini-me."

Said Blache: "I like the confidence. I like the swagger. I just hope that when it gets to it, he'll back it up. He'll be humbled a time or two, and then he'll come back."

"He's a natural corner," Smoot said. "The first thing I look at in cornerbacks is their hips and their ability to get out of cuts. He looks like he's a strong guy."

As Tryon wrapped up mini-camp on May 4, he felt like he held his own covering Moss, Randle El, James Thrash, Anthony Mix and talented rookies Devin Thomas and Malcolm Kelly.

"No one has beaten me deep yet, so I'm looking all right," he said.

 

[Marvelous]

Just off the top of my head, the veterans that are most likely to be cut are:

Pete Kendall

Marcus Washington

Philip Daniel

I think Thrash will somehow make the team.

Jon Jansen could be one more injury away from being no longer part of the future. I also think Santana Moss' days are numbered, but he will be around in 2008.

 

[thayman]

You guys SURE that Lorenzo Alexander is going to end up on the defensive side of the ball? I could easily see him getting more reps on offense, perhaps at guard. And they signed Crummey, the OT from Mayland who'd have been drafted fairly high if he hadn't broken his leg twice in his senior season. He might find a way onto the roster or at least the practice squad when all is said and done.



Also, don't be surprised in Jon Jansen gets cut this preseason. Some vet of his type always gets whacked when they least expect it, especially if Heyer has a decent camp and pre-season.

Didn't Jansen restructure this past off-season?? If so what does his cap hit look like over the next few years? As far as him being cut I see him staying on the team until they can minimize the cap hit.

 

[Ripleys]

Just off the top of my head, the veterans that are most likely to be cut areete KendallMarcus WashingtonPhilip DanielI think Thrash will somehow make the team.Jon Jansen could be one more injury away from being no longer part of the future. I also think Santana Moss' days are numbered, but he will be around in 2008.

Why would they cut Kendall? They just traded to get him, and he was solid most of the year. And Washington is one of the leaders on that team, would be shocked to see him gone.

 

[Marvelous]

Just off the top of my head, the veterans that are most likely to be cut areete KendallMarcus WashingtonPhilip DanielI think Thrash will somehow make the team.Jon Jansen could be one more injury away from being no longer part of the future. I also think Santana Moss' days are numbered, but he will be around in 2008.

Why would they cut Kendall? They just traded to get him, and he was solid most of the year. And Washington is one of the leaders on that team, would be shocked to see him gone.

I was under the impression (read it on the internet somewhere) that the weak links in the OL last year were Kendall and Rabach. Obviously there were weaknesses, since the OL did not dominate. Samuels was a pro bowler, so it clearly wasn't him. The article thought the Fabini and Heyer/Wade did reasonably well filling in.So, if Rinehart has a good camp, I could see him starting in place of Kendall. Washington has missed major chunks of time due to injuries. If HB Blades develops (or even if the resign Godfrey), I could see them cutting Washington. It is a new HC, although they have held onto a lot of the assistants. Usually a change in coaching staff results in some new personel. Even with the same coaches, some turnover of players is expected. So it shouldn't be a surprise if some longtime veterans are let go.

 

[Sebowski]

Here's another shot at the final roster, after I checked out generally how the number of players was distributed between the positions last year (OL=9-10, QB=3, RB=3, FB=1, WR=6-7, TE=3, DE=4, DT=5, LB=6-7, CB=5, S=4-5, K/P=2):

QB

Brennan, Colt

Campbell, Jason

Collins, Todd

Colt will will be on the PUP for the season. I think 2 QBs are fine. It is rare, but it happens. That would leave room for 6 WRs.

 

[Sebowski]

Just off the top of my head, the veterans that are most likely to be cut areete KendallMarcus WashingtonPhilip DanielI think Thrash will somehow make the team.Jon Jansen could be one more injury away from being no longer part of the future. I also think Santana Moss' days are numbered, but he will be around in 2008.

Kendall is the only one on that list with a shot at not making the team, and I think that is a long shot.

 

[fatness]

So, if Rinehart has a good camp

I'm really rooting for Rinehart, not for any personal reasons but because it's such a big need.

 

[Sebowski]

Devin Thomas won the rookie Madden tournament!



He played with the Cowboys



Devin Thomas over Matt Forte in Madden 08

SANTA MONICA -- So last night, Mike Wilkening and I headed over to the Loews Hotel and checked out the 2008 Rookie Madden Bowl sponsored by EA Sports. The tournament matched up eight rookies in a Madden 08 tournament:

Matt Ryan vs. Brian Brohm

Kevin O'Connell vs. Matt Forte

Devin Thomas vs. Rashard Mendenhall

Mario Manningham vs. DeSean Jackson

Ryan beat Brohm, Forte killed O'Connell, and Thomas and Jackson won. And then Thomas -- playing with the Cowboys, I might add -- beat Forte in the finals, setting off a flurry of excitement among the gaming media community (actually, I am serious). It's a fun event and the rookies generally are very approachable. In fact, there wasn't a guy I talked tolast night who didn't have something interesting to offer.

Jake Long is a very down-to-earth guy. He talked at ease about the pressure he faces as the highest-paid offensive lineman in the game despite not taking a snap yet, and he looks ready to go.

Thomas is a character. He called the Madden win "the greatest moment of his NFL career to date" to which one gaming reporter mouthed, "Wow" and scribbled notes on a pad. Funny stuff. But Thomas has a big personality and all the confidence in the world. He just might fit in well in D.C.

Jackson is a confident kid, too. He said he's working primarily in the slot but thinks he'll make a big impact as a returner. The Eagles hope so too.

Ryan is a classy kid. I think he's born to be a star. He has Tom Brady's poise and maturity - and we'll find out if he's close to the player Brady is, but I can't help but root for the kid.

Dustin Keller carries himself well. He said he's excited to find out how he'll be used, and he's sick of hearing he's a deficient blocker. He told me he will be an effective blocker in the NFL. Period.

Jordy Nelson admitted to me he didn't expect to be a Packer. But he is excited to work up there and will be heading out Sunday night straight from L.A. He did admit, though, that it would have been nice to play with Brett Favre. I told him to hang tight, his chance might just come.

I have plenty more on the event, as does Mr. Wilkening, who will file later. In a few hours, we're going to the L.A. Coliseum to watch these guys run around in their new unis, and we'll talk to a few more of them and report back.

 

[fatness]

Thomas is a character. He called the Madden win "the greatest moment of his NFL career to date" to which one gaming reporter mouthed, "Wow" and scribbled notes on a pad. Funny stuff.

 

[Swing 51]

By Jason La CanforaWashington Post Staff WriterWednesday, May 21, 2008; Page E03Washington Redskins rookie tight end Fred Davis apologized to teammates and the front office yesterday for missing a mandatory minicamp practice earlier this month. Davis, a second-round pick out of Southern California, says he missed the third and final session of minicamp May 4 because he overslept.There were questions about Davis's maturity and off-field habits entering the NFL draft -- he was suspended for a bowl game in 2005 while at USC -- but Davis says he has learned from the past and aims to make others forget about what he called a "minor mistake" from minicamp."I just wanted to let everybody know that I'm apologetic about what happened," Davis said yesterday at Redskins Park in his first public remarks since the incident. "I want them to know that when I come here I'm going to work hard and try to make as much progress as I can on the field and off."The Redskins were not aware of Davis's whereabouts as the team took the field on the morning of May 4. Several members of the organization have said privately that there were rumors that Davis was partying in downtown Washington on May 3, a Saturday night, but he has denied those allegations to team officials, sources said, and reiterated again yesterday that he did not leave the Ashburn area."I didn't even go out," Davis said, adding that he got a private room around 8 p.m. because he wanted to stay on his own without a team-assigned roommate. "I was at the hotel the whole night. Just being on my own, it was probably a mistake on my part."Redskins Coach Jim Zorn did not have a curfew or bed checks during minicamp, and Davis missed calls from team officials on his cellphone. When he woke up, he called vice president of football operations Vinny Cerrato while practice was ongoing (the session began at 9:30, and players were to report to Redskins Park around 7:30). Zorn addressed the issue with Davis that afternoon. Davis then flew home because rookies are not allowed to work out with NFL teams until after his school holds its graduation ceremonies. Davis's representatives also investigated the matter, and, like the Redskins, are taking him at his word, said Melvin Bratton, a former personnel executive with the Redskins and the vice president of DeBartolo sports, which represents Davis."I know how this would look with Fred, because I've been in the position of Vinny Cerrato," said Bratton, who has counseled Davis on his misstep and spoke to him again Monday night. "And you don't want a guy who you think is going to be a problem, and that's a signal you're sending to the team and the city, and I've explained that to him and he knows that he's got to go out and prove what kind of person and player he is."Redskins Notes: Starting wide receiver Antwaan Randle El, who had minor arthroscopic knee surgery early this month, said that his recovery is going well and that he hopes to begin running shortly. . . . The team announced the hiring of Morocco Brown as director of pro personnel.

 

[fatness]

The Redskins have a new personnel director who sounds like quite a good hire --- Morocco Brown (cool name, too).

Like I mentioned briefly yesterday while I was reporting on Brown's hiring, he has a sparkling reputation around the league and is definitely seen as a potential leader of an organization down the road. He will be a major force in the scouting and acquisition of professional talent, and the import of the reshaping of this front office, to me, has been the biggest development of this entire offseason for the Redskins.

The Bears were loathe to lose Brown, but they did not have an opening or a title available to match Washington's vacancy, and he's someone who they think very highly of and want to see succeed. Spent almost an hour on the phone this morning with Melvin Bratton, a former personnel director with the Redskins and one of Brown's mentors. Bratton said the Arizona Cardinals were also hot for Brown, with GM Rod Graves interviewing him for a pro director job, but Brown already has strong ties to Vinny Cerrato (Brown interned for Cerrato from 1999-2001) as well as the team and this area (Brown is a native of Hampton and his brother, Milan, coaches men's b-ball at Mt. St. Mary's in MD)..

 

[Sidewinder16]

The Redskins have a new personnel director who sounds like quite a good hire --- Morocco Brown (cool name, too).

His brother's names are Milan and Marseilles. Their parents must have been quite the jetsetters. Either that, or really devoted geography teachers.

 

[fatness]

I'd like to see them corner the market on cool names. The next hire should be Tanzania O'Shaughnessey.

 

[DCThunder]

The Redskins have a new personnel director who sounds like quite a good hire --- Morocco Brown (cool name, too).

Like I mentioned briefly yesterday while I was reporting on Brown's hiring, he has a sparkling reputation around the league and is definitely seen as a potential leader of an organization down the road. He will be a major force in the scouting and acquisition of professional talent, and the import of the reshaping of this front office, to me, has been the biggest development of this entire offseason for the Redskins.

The Bears were loathe to lose Brown, but they did not have an opening or a title available to match Washington's vacancy, and he's someone who they think very highly of and want to see succeed. Spent almost an hour on the phone this morning with Melvin Bratton, a former personnel director with the Redskins and one of Brown's mentors. Bratton said the Arizona Cardinals were also hot for Brown, with GM Rod Graves interviewing him for a pro director job, but Brown already has strong ties to Vinny Cerrato (Brown interned for Cerrato from 1999-2001) as well as the team and this area (Brown is a native of Hampton and his brother, Milan, coaches men's b-ball at Mt. St. Mary's in MD)..

But how could any of this be true sin Vinny has such a poor reputation around the league that no body would want to be associated with him.

 

[fatness]

Cooley is getting married tonight. He's marrying the ex-cheerleader he had been fooling around with, causing her to get fired and causing his wife to divorce him.

2 wives, 3 years, slow down Chris.

 

[fatness]

JLC about Jason Taylor

Yes, the Skins have a need an end, but unless the Dolphins decide to give the guy away, then it's no. And, according to league sources, the Fins have already denied an overture for a fourth round pick for Taylor from one NFL team and may in fact holdout for at least a pick in the first three rounds. Again, the Skins are not and have not been players here, and at that price it's a no-go.

As one NFL executive put it:

"Blache is not a guy who is infatuated with stats and sacks. There's a lot of other things you need to be able to do to play for him, and at this stage of his career can Jason Taylor give you those things for 65-70 snaps a game for 16 games? No, he can't, and he's a guy making $8 million a year. "

 

[fatness]

Redskins Trade for Erasmus James

The Redskins have traded a conditional seventh-round pick in the 2009 draft to Minnesota for defensive end Erasmus James. James has fallen out of favor with the Vikings but Washington has had a glaring need on the defensive line.

Redskins new defensive line coach John Palermo knows James well - he coached him at Wisconsin - and the Redskins are in essence giving up nothing for a player who has had some issues but certainly has potential. The deal is contingent upon James making Washington's 53-man roster. Could be a very favorable move if it works out and kudos to them for finally addressing the lack of depth in the trenches.

The Vikings placed James on waivers last week, but then withdrew him from the waiver wire prior to the deadline for doing so in order to deal him to Washington. Waivers work in reverse order from the 2007 standings, and with the Redskins reaching the playoffs another club could have claimed James before he fell to their spot, hence the trade.

James, 25, is 6-4, 266 pounds and was selected by the Vikings 18th overall in the 2005 draft. His production has been scant - just five career sacks - and injuries have limited him to just eight games in the past two seasons. He was waived by the Vikings last week after failing to pass a physical, and is scheduled to take a physical for the Redskins Wednesday.

 

[Sebowski]

No risk, high reward. Great move. Hope his old coach gets the best out of him. I loved this could coming out of college, but injuries have always been an issue with him.

 

[fatness]

I think "conditional 7th round pick" means "7th round pick only if he passes a physical and makes the roster". You're right, no risk at all there.

 

[T Bell]

I think "conditional 7th round pick" means "7th round pick only if he passes a physical and makes the roster". You're right, no risk at all there.

Yup. According to Canfora, he's got to make the 53-man roster for the trade to go through. I love the trade.

 

[Sidewinder16]

Apparently, Blache wanted to draft James in '05.

 

[buster c]

Apparently, Blache wanted to draft James in '05.

from the same blog, I found this:Wednesday, May 28, 2008

Sellers: Players were treated like “little kids”

While Jim Zorn may need to be careful and tiptoe around saying anything critical about Joe Gibbs' coaching, it's apparent that at least one Washington Redskins player doesn't feel so restrained.

Last week, when talking about the differences between how things are going this year as opposed to recent seasons, fullback Mike Sellers said, "We don't have people watching us constantly and telling us what to do like we're little kids. He (Zorn) puts it on ourselves. We're being treated like men."

It's hard to figure out where to start with this one.

There isn't any context given in the quote, which I found on the Pro Football Weekly website (there's no permalink to the one-paragraph blurb, so it may scroll down off of this page over time).

I'll look at it on the assumption that he's referring to on-field matters. I don't think that Gibbs had "people" watching players in the lounge at Redskins Park or following them home.

So, they had "people" watching them while they did their jobs? Uh, isn't that, you know, why coaches get paid? Are Zorn and his staff not watching and correcting mistakes and refining technique? I doubt it.

The part about being treated like "little kids" under Gibbs while Zorn treats them like "grown men" is the real slap in the face to Coach Joe. Didn't Gibbs take Mike Sellers off of the scrap heap after he'd been out of the NFL for two years when nobody wanted him after some substance abuse problems? Didn't Gibbs go to great lengths to give Sellers a bigger role in the offense the last couple of years even though he rarely came through?

All that being said, it would be a mistake to write off Sellers' comments as those of some kind of ingrate. If you don't parse the words and look at the general feeling, there seemed to be some frustration at the performance of the coaching staff in general and Gibbs in particular.

While there is universal respect for Gibbs the man, especially after the strength he gave everyone in the wake of the murder of Sean Taylor, there apparently isn't such reverence for how he handled the mechanics of coaching the team.

Even in their better seasons—2005 and 2007—Gibbs' Redskins were maddeningly inconsistent. Both playoff teams had good starts, extended midseason losing streaks, and then hot finishes to scrape into Wild Card spots.

I have heard that Gibbs often had trouble keeping his herd of 20 assistant coaches on the same page. In particular, as much as they tried to minimize it and sweep it under the rug, there was always some tension between Gibbs and Al Saunders. It's been rumored that Gibbs took over the play calling when the Skins got into the Red Zone. At the very least, Gibbs would overrule Saunders on occasion in such situations.

And such situations certainly create confusion on the part of the players. They need to know who's in charge and what to expect.

Now, does that equate to being treated like "little kids"? It wouldn't seem like it. Gibbs went out of his way to get high-character players on his team, the kind of men you don't constantly have to watch.

Mike Sellers is an emotional type of player who doesn't always have that filter between the brain and the mouth activated. He may have been thinking about a particular incident or issue when the spoke of little kids vs. grown men. Or he may have articulated his general frustration in an odd way.

Or, maybe he should be taken literally and he really does believe that Gibbs treated his players like children.

Regardless, it will be interesting to see if other players make similar comments. I believe that Gibbs retired at least partly because he didn't think he was 100% up to the job any more. If that was the case, the players would be the first ones to notice it and we will see if others choose to talk about it.

Again, the Sellers quote was out of context, so take that into consideration when you evaluate it. However, it's hard to imagine any context in which it wouldn't be, to some degree, a potshot at a Hall of Fame coach.

 

[fatness]

An interview was done 11 days ago with Sellers on Redskin.com. and while the thoughts are similar it contains no quote about being treated like kids. I'm assuming that is what PFW is reporting (if misquoting is reporting).

Link

Q: What have Jim Zorn and offensive coaches told you about how players will fit in to the new offense?

A: "Basically, they said, 'We're not going to come in here and change everything you've done in the past. You've been here--we're going to do what works for you. We're not going to tell you to do it this way or that way.' They know we can play. They know we play hard. It's just a matter of getting things done in their offense. It's great. We're out there having fun. Everybody is jumping around. It's relaxed, but everybody is ready to go. Everybody is full speed ahead."...............

..............Q: Do you see a difference in learning this offense versus learning Al Saunders' offense in 2006?

A: "With Al's offense--not to disrespect him or anything like that--we had a lot of plays that we had to learn in a short time period every day. With Coach Zorn, he's teaching us little spurts [of learning plays]. He makes it easy for us to learn. He's real energetic. He's joking around with us in meetings, so he makes it fun to learn, too.".........................

..................Does the Portis-Landry race suggest that there's a different feeling around Redskins Park this year?

A: "Not only that, but I don't think there's any way Coach [Joe] Gibbs would have ever let them do that [in years past]. We're all having fun. I think that's the new fresh start we're getting. He's just letting us be us. He's not really trying to control us or tell us what to do. He's telling us, 'This is a veteran team. You guys know what to do. You know how to win, it's just a matter of winning the games.'"

 

[T Bell]

Sellers is talking a LOT this offseason. I hope that that's a good thing, and not indicative of a lack of accountability like we grew so tired of under Turner and Spurrier.

 

[DCThunder]

Sellers is talking a LOT this offseason. I hope that that's a good thing, and not indicative of a lack of accountability like we grew so tired of under Turner and Spurrier.

This is my worry, too. Remember when such a big deal was made of a player's cell phone ringing during a team meeting and the OBC just letting it go? And how Joe was brought in to bring some discipline and order to the team? Let's hope we aren't back-sliding while they are "having fun and jumping around" We've had enough false start penalties...

 

[Sidewinder16]

Sellers is talking a LOT this offseason. I hope that that's a good thing, and not indicative of a lack of accountability like we grew so tired of under Turner and Spurrier.

Wait. Did you get another time out?A number of quotes from the players have been coming out with the underlying theme that Zorn is a "players coach". That has set off a red flag or two for me because it seems that, around the league, "players coach" is generally synonymous for "soft" and/or "not in control".

I hope that's not the case, too, but I'm starting to get skeptical.

 

[T Bell]

Sellers is talking a LOT this offseason. I hope that that's a good thing, and not indicative of a lack of accountability like we grew so tired of under Turner and Spurrier.

Wait. Did you get another time out?A number of quotes from the players have been coming out with the underlying theme that Zorn is a "players coach". That has set off a red flag or two for me because it seems that, around the league, "players coach" is generally synonymous for "soft" and/or "not in control".

I hope that's not the case, too, but I'm starting to get skeptical.

Essentially yes. I got a 24 hour time out (can't even remember why now - I think it was the Ted Kennedy thread in the FFA) and now I can log back into "redman" but whenever I try to post something I get "Your posting privileges have been removed". No response to my PM to Joe as to why, so here I am.

 

[fatness]

Essentially yes. I got a 24 hour time out (can't even remember why now - I think it was the Ted Kennedy thread in the FFA) and now I can log back into "redman" but whenever I try to post something I get "Your posting privileges have been removed". No response to my PM to Joe as to why, so here I am.

Man, you might want to take a step back. I kinda miss the old, genial, wisecracking redman guy. You've gotten more contentious over more things in the past year and the change is very noticeable to those of us reading. I'd bet you'd enjoy it more the old way, too. No need to listen to me, of course, but I used to consider you a friend within the context of the board. And I still do now, but I wonder more often if I'm going to have to duck. About Sellers and Zorn, I'm not concerned yet. There is a world of room in between tight-### babysitting that Gibbs apparently did and the wide-open undisciplined way Norv did it. Most coaches and teams operate between those 2 extremes, and there's no reason to think the Redskins can't do it also.

Zorn made a big deal out of an early defensive play where they got a turnover and lateraled, running all the way down the field yelling at the guy that did it. He made a big deal initially out of Fred Davis being late. I don't get the sense he's not in control. Unprepared maybe (we'll have to see), but not a guy who's not in control.

 

[T Bell]

Essentially yes. I got a 24 hour time out (can't even remember why now - I think it was the Ted Kennedy thread in the FFA) and now I can log back into "redman" but whenever I try to post something I get "Your posting privileges have been removed". No response to my PM to Joe as to why, so here I am.

Man, you might want to take a step back. I kinda miss the old, genial, wisecracking redman guy. You've gotten more contentious over more things in the past year and the change is very noticeable to those of us reading. I'd bet you'd enjoy it more the old way, too. No need to listen to me, of course, but I used to consider you a friend within the context of the board. And I still do now, but I wonder more often if I'm going to have to duck.

Why you little - !

Yeah, I probably will have to dial things back. Fewer political threads would be a good thing, though that's tough in an election year.

I hope you're right about Zorn. I feel like he can be something special as a coach, but I definitely recognize the high bust risk with him too. It's probably worth noting that if he's scored points in Blache's book, then we probably don't need to worry too much about the team being out of control.

 

[fatness]

Good article on Clinton Portis

Four seasons and a revolving door of runningbacks later, Denver is still lacking a top-flight back. NFL fans and analysts alike said he was just another product of the Bronco’s assembly line, and that he would struggle mightily in Washington. 4,616 yards, 34 touchdowns, 1 single season franchise rushing record, and 2 playoff trips later, Clinton Portis has laid to rest any blasphemous notion that he is another product of Denver’s system. Now as he closes in on NFL rushing milestones it is is time to give Portis his due, he’s earned it.

His 63 rushing touchdowns are 14 shy of tying the great Tony Dorsett, who sits at the 20th spot in that category all-time. Three out of his six NFL seasons Portis has rushed for over 1500 yards, if he does it for the fourth time in 2008 he will break into the top 30 of all-time rushers. Throw in his 4.5 career yard per carry, and the fact that he is only 26 and still has much left in the tank, it isn’t far fetched to envision Portis donning the yellow jacket 10 years from now as he is immortalized in Canton, Ohio. Yet, his greatest attribute can’t be measured, there is no statistical category for it. It is something that reveals itself in adverse situations, it can’t be manufactured by ESPN ( looking at you Reggie Bush).

It is the tenacity and fearlessness Portis displays every Sunday in the arena. It, is walking into his first position meeting as a freshman at Miami, and boldly asking the incumbent backs who wants to be his fullback. Then he proceeds to set Miami’s freshman rushing record. When he took his first ever carry as a Redskin for a 64 yards touchdown, we saw it. In late 2005 and 2007 when Joe Gibbs needed him to carry the load to make the playoffs, he did so despite the grueling fashion in which the yards came. It is on display for everyone to see when he attacks oncoming blitzers like a kamikaze. Ask Brian Urlacher, Ray Lewis, or any other defender who they would least like to see on a blitz-pickup, and Portis will be the unanimous choice. More often than not, it is Portis who looks like the linebacker as he puts men much bigger than himself on their backs. That attitude is infectious and his teammates most definitely feed off of it. There are only a handful of backs who you can say are the heart and soul of a team and Portis one of them.

I love watching this guy play. When does the season start?

 

[fatness]

Yeah, I probably will have to dial things back. Fewer political threads would be a good thing, though that's tough in an election year.

That would probably help, yeah. Once you realize that all the political arguing you've done (and everyone else has done) online has never changed one tangible thing in the world it becomes easier to walk away from. The convictions are still there (I have some strong ones too; I got that from my dad), but in many situations those convictions are useless and kind of like having Tourette's. They lead to nothing but loud noise WHORE WHORE and putting people off.

 

[DCThunder]

Yeah, I probably will have to dial things back. Fewer political threads would be a good thing, though that's tough in an election year.

That would probably help, yeah. Once you realize that all the political arguing you've done (and everyone else has done) online has never changed one tangible thing in the world it becomes easier to walk away from. The convictions are still there (I have some strong ones too; I got that from my dad), but in many situations those convictions are useless and kind of like having Tourette's. They lead to nothing but loud noise WHORE WHORE and putting people off.

:( You should put this up over at the FFA or in some LHUCKS thread (or in a Arctic Edge thread if more appropriate).

 

[dallas428]

any time frame on when the skins will have a complete playbook...just curious...

 

[T Bell]

any time frame on when the skins will have a complete playbook...just curious...

It will definitely happen before Dallas wins a playoff game. We'll keep you posted.

 

[Sebowski]

any time frame on when the skins will have a complete playbook...just curious...

It will definitely happen before Dallas wins a playoff game. We'll keep you posted.

ZING!

 

[Sebowski]

Good article on Clinton Portis

Four seasons and a revolving door of runningbacks later, Denver is still lacking a top-flight back. NFL fans and analysts alike said he was just another product of the Bronco’s assembly line, and that he would struggle mightily in Washington. 4,616 yards, 34 touchdowns, 1 single season franchise rushing record, and 2 playoff trips later, Clinton Portis has laid to rest any blasphemous notion that he is another product of Denver’s system. Now as he closes in on NFL rushing milestones it is is time to give Portis his due, he’s earned it.

His 63 rushing touchdowns are 14 shy of tying the great Tony Dorsett, who sits at the 20th spot in that category all-time. Three out of his six NFL seasons Portis has rushed for over 1500 yards, if he does it for the fourth time in 2008 he will break into the top 30 of all-time rushers. Throw in his 4.5 career yard per carry, and the fact that he is only 26 and still has much left in the tank, it isn’t far fetched to envision Portis donning the yellow jacket 10 years from now as he is immortalized in Canton, Ohio. Yet, his greatest attribute can’t be measured, there is no statistical category for it. It is something that reveals itself in adverse situations, it can’t be manufactured by ESPN ( looking at you Reggie Bush).

It is the tenacity and fearlessness Portis displays every Sunday in the arena. It, is walking into his first position meeting as a freshman at Miami, and boldly asking the incumbent backs who wants to be his fullback. Then he proceeds to set Miami’s freshman rushing record. When he took his first ever carry as a Redskin for a 64 yards touchdown, we saw it. In late 2005 and 2007 when Joe Gibbs needed him to carry the load to make the playoffs, he did so despite the grueling fashion in which the yards came. It is on display for everyone to see when he attacks oncoming blitzers like a kamikaze. Ask Brian Urlacher, Ray Lewis, or any other defender who they would least like to see on a blitz-pickup, and Portis will be the unanimous choice. More often than not, it is Portis who looks like the linebacker as he puts men much bigger than himself on their backs. That attitude is infectious and his teammates most definitely feed off of it. There are only a handful of backs who you can say are the heart and soul of a team and Portis one of them.

I love watching this guy play. When does the season start?

Thanks for posting. That was a great read. I am so glad this guy is a Redskin. I would do that trade over again in a heartbeat.