***OFFICIAL*** 2013 MINNESOTA VIKINGS SEASON THREAD (2 Viewers)

[BigJim®]

So the Vikings will do just well enough this season to f*** themselves out of a QB in the draft.

They'll be in position to draft either Manziel or Fresno State's Derek Carr (who will be a fast riser).

I actually wouldn't mind positioning for Manziel. The guy is tough as nails and a competitor who knows how to play the game. We were likely going to be out of the running for Bridgewater no matter what, and Mariota showed some serious red flags yesterday.

I decided during the 4th quarter yesterday that I'm not going to care about draft jockeying. I'd rather see the players we have live up to expectations and play hard than watch them lay down like dogs for a draft pick. There a lot of ways to find a QB... look at Houston getting a guy like Case Keenum as an UDFA. Look at Seattle getting Russell Wilson in the 3rd, SF getting Kaepernick in the 2nd. What the Vikes need is an eye for NFL QB talent in the front office/scouting, because they clearly have no clue what that is if they found themselves wasting 6 years on mentally fragile projects like TJack/Ponder. Other than bringing Favre in, this team has been embarrassingly bad bringing in QBs since drafting Culpepper.

 

[snogger]

So the Vikings will do just well enough this season to f*** themselves out of a QB in the draft.

They'll be in position to draft either Manziel or Fresno State's Derek Carr (who will be a fast riser).

I actually wouldn't mind positioning for Manziel. The guy is tough as nails and a competitor who knows how to play the game. We were likely going to be out of the running for Bridgewater no matter what, and Mariota showed some serious red flags yesterday.

I decided during the 4th quarter yesterday that I'm not going to care about draft jockeying. I'd rather see the players we have live up to expectations and play hard than watch them lay down like dogs for a draft pick. There a lot of ways to find a QB... look at Houston getting a guy like Case Keenum as an UDFA. Look at Seattle getting Russell Wilson in the 3rd, SF getting Kaepernick in the 2nd. What the Vikes need is an eye for NFL QB talent in the front office/scouting, because they clearly have no clue what that is if they found themselves wasting 6 years on mentally fragile projects like TJack/Ponder. Other than bringing Favre in, this team has been embarrassingly bad bringing in QBs since drafting Culpepper.

Don't forget the GREAT move of spending $3 Million dollars for someone that is now 3rd string behind the likes of Ponder and Cassell

 

[Funkley]

Sad thing is that they created such a poor situation where spending $3 mill to test drive Freeman doesn't seem as dumb as it would for most teams.

 

[Donnybrook]

I thought they were taking the timeouts in order to save time for when Washington scored their touchdown, so they would have some time to get to field goal range...I didn't mind the timeouts at all. Washington had 40 seconds to get 3 plays in anyway, it wasn't like they were going to run out of time.

Didn't mind the timeout? I think people would be singing a different tune had they lost.

 

[BigJim®]

I thought they were taking the timeouts in order to save time for when Washington scored their touchdown, so they would have some time to get to field goal range...I didn't mind the timeouts at all. Washington had 40 seconds to get 3 plays in anyway, it wasn't like they were going to run out of time.

Didn't mind the timeout? I think people would be singing a different tune had they lost.

Yeah, absolutely true. But setting aside right/wrong based on outcome, I guess the question is did that defense have a better chance to stop them while spiralling at the end of a 70 yard drive, or rested, set and coached up on assignments? There was no doubt in my own mind Washington was going to score before the time out was used. It didn't feel like the timeout could worsen our odds.

 

[sports_fan]

Here's what Frazier said regarding the late timeouts:

“I wanted to make sure for one, our guys were getting a little fatigued,” Frazier said. “But also if they were to get a score, I wanted us to have a chance to go back and respond. I didn’t want then to be able to run the clock out and us not have a chance on offense. Fortunately for us, because our guys were gassed, they got their breath and made some big stops at the end.”

http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/231102531.html

They were 25 yards out when he called the 1st timeout and already he was assuming they were going to score a TD. It's just ridiculous. A timeout in that situation is clearly more beneficial to the offense than the defense. They don't have to hurry to the line, they can carefully select a play, the QB has time to make a pre-snap read, etc. Just look at what happened. Immediately following the timeout the Redskins completely a 17 yard pass to make it first and goal.

Frazier just got lucky the Skins couldn't capitalize and the refs missed a holding call on Henderson.

 

[SayWhat?]

Dumbest logic for a head coach in the NFL, EVER. He's so fortunate they won.

 

[Donnybrook]

Dumbest logic for a head coach in the NFL, EVER. He's so fortunate they won.

"I wanted us to have a chance to go back and respond" Frazier said. The game would have been tied. Barrring a amazing kick return, most teams would be kneeling and taking their chances in overtime.

 

[FunkyPlutos]

Dumbest logic for a head coach in the NFL, EVER. He's so fortunate they won.

"I wanted us to have a chance to go back and respond" Frazier said. The game would have been tied. Barrring a amazing kick return, most teams would be kneeling and taking their chances in overtime.

Maybe, but letting the clock run didn't work in Chicago, vs the Browns or in Dallas, so maybe it was just good strategy?

Also, I could see calling the timeouts to help regroup a secondary and linebacking corps that consists of about 60% special teamers.

 

[Fruitbat]

I would have been more forgiving of the TOs for rest/recovery if they at least waited until Wash was almost set. Maximize the time running off the clock. If i recall they took them shortly after the previous play was dead. Stupid.

 

[sports_fan]

I would have been more forgiving of the TOs for rest/recovery if they at least waited until Wash was almost set. Maximize the time running off the clock. If i recall they took them shortly after the previous play was dead. Stupid.

that was because he was trying to preserve time. which was idiotic

 

[FunkyPlutos]

So with Simpson and his predicament, does Greg Childs get a shot or have they officially shut him down? Seems like the perfect spot for him to get some time...if not I wouldn't mind seeing Rodney Smith in some red zone packages.

 

[Zow]

So the Vikings will do just well enough this season to f*** themselves out of a QB in the draft.

They'll be in position to draft either Manziel or Fresno State's Derek Carr (who will be a fast riser).

I actually wouldn't mind positioning for Manziel. The guy is tough as nails and a competitor who knows how to play the game. We were likely going to be out of the running for Bridgewater no matter what, and Mariota showed some serious red flags yesterday.

I decided during the 4th quarter yesterday that I'm not going to care about draft jockeying. I'd rather see the players we have live up to expectations and play hard than watch them lay down like dogs for a draft pick. There a lot of ways to find a QB... look at Houston getting a guy like Case Keenum as an UDFA. Look at Seattle getting Russell Wilson in the 3rd, SF getting Kaepernick in the 2nd. What the Vikes need is an eye for NFL QB talent in the front office/scouting, because they clearly have no clue what that is if they found themselves wasting 6 years on mentally fragile projects like TJack/Ponder. Other than bringing Favre in, this team has been embarrassingly bad bringing in QBs since drafting Culpepper.

Agree wholeheartedly. I was unabashedly cheering for losses, but it's just so much more fun to see wins.

I'd also be stoked to get Manziel in the draft. Kid is a winner.

 

[Zow]

Sad thing is that they created such a poor situation where spending $3 mill to test drive Freeman doesn't seem as dumb as it would for most teams.

If, you know, we actually tried him out...

 

[snogger]

Sad thing is that they created such a poor situation where spending $3 mill to test drive Freeman doesn't seem as dumb as it would for most teams.

If, you know, we actually tried him out...

throwing him to the wolves when he CLEARLY wasn't ready was one of many glaring mistakes from the coaching staff this year.

FWIW.. With Tampa and Jags winning this weekend also, the Vikings are only 1 game out of the #1 draft spot.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

WAY TO GO TAMPA!

 

[BigJim®]

Hoping that the Simpson debacle speeds up Patterson's integration into the offense.

 

[Donnybrook]

Jags and Arizona tied 14-14 at the half

Tampa with a nice lead on Atlanta.

Vikings could be inching closer to #1 pick by the end of the day.

 

[Jobber]

Does Ponder ever start another NFL game?

 

[snogger]

Does Ponder ever start another NFL game?

If Fraizer even considers starting him at Green Bay, then it will be official that he wants out.. You can't continue to march out a QB as your starter who is completely over his head..

Just drove me nuts listening to Fraizer before the game and the announcers early in the game talking about how well Ponder played last week.

Any chance at all that could be that he was playing against a Defense that is WORSE then the Vikings?? Naw, that can't be it.

and By the way ponder.. It's been 3 year of hearing you say this..

"I was trying to make plays that weren't there and just have to be smarter with the football,'' said Ponder, who also had a fumble on Minnesota's first possession that led to a Seattle field goal. "Games like that are unfortunately going to happen. It sucks.''

If you haven't learned how to "Be Smarter" after 3 years you never will.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

Does Ponder ever start another NFL game?

Well, let's not be hasty. Leslie has to go back and look at the tape first before he can make a decision.

 

[skol asylum]

What's frustrating is you got guy s like McGloin that can come in and play better than Ponder.

 

[cutter]

What's frustrating is you got guy s like McGloin that can come in and play better than Ponder.

And Foles, and McCown, and Tolzien, and Keenum, and Pryor, and Glennon, and every single other backup that has come in this year.

Jack Del Rio would look fantastic heading a new coaching staff next year on the Vikings sideline.

 

[mr roboto]

Was mbt so bad? Always wanted to know if he could play.

 

[sports_fan]

Was mbt so bad? Always wanted to know if he could play.

I don't think they wanted to lose him but it'd be hard to justify carrying 4 QBs on a team with so many holes.

 

[mr roboto]

Was mbt so bad? Always wanted to know if he could play.

I don't think they wanted to lose him but it'd be hard to justify carrying 4 QBs on a team with so many holes.

Yea, lets go get a QB with a sub-50% completion rate. This org sucks.

 

[snogger]

Can't see any logical reason NOT to start Freeman the rest of the season.. Make him earn that $3 Million.

Ponder is NOT the future.. Cassell is NOT the future.. Freeman isn't a hell of a lot better but at this point what do they have to lose?

But I see my failure in this thinking is the 4th word in my first sentence so they will probably go to Cassel

 

[FunkyPlutos]

This season shows two things to me (well, more than two, but I only have a little bit of time):

1. Peterson was soooo good last year that it covered up most of the team's deficiencies. I thought I realized how good he was last year, but now it is even more impressive.

2. Shows how valuable Harrison Smith is to this defense. The defense was half way decent when he was in there.

 

[sports_fan]

This season shows two things to me (well, more than two, but I only have a little bit of time):

1. Peterson was soooo good last year that it covered up most of the team's deficiencies. I thought I realized how good he was last year, but now it is even more impressive.

2. Shows how valuable Harrison Smith is to this defense. The defense was half way decent when he was in there.

They were less terrible but the defense was well below average even with him.

 

[Jobber]

Can't see any logical reason NOT to start Freeman the rest of the season.. Make him earn that $3 Million.

Ponder is NOT the future.. Cassell is NOT the future.. Freeman isn't a hell of a lot better but at this point what do they have to lose?

But I see my failure in this thinking is the 4th word in my first sentence so they will probably go to Cassel

I agree with this. Put Freeman in there to see if he can earn a spot on a team next year. The other two had their chance.

 

[jestertj]

Does Bevell get an interview for HC in MN?

 

[Gopher State]

I can see the Bears not signing Cutler, and then Jay heads to MN. No need to draft a QB, just cut the three back ups that they have and pay Jay.

 

[Herb]

I can see the Bears not signing Cutler, and then Jay heads to MN. No need to draft a QB, just cut the three back ups that they have and pay Jay.

This is my worst nightmare. And something I could totally see this organization doing. It's not even that I dislike Cutler, it's that this team needs a young guy that they can build around for a decade at least. It's time. This is the best opportunity they've had to do it since 99 when they drafted Culpepper. They CANNOT screw this up.

ETA: They'll probably screw this up.

 

[Frostillicus]

I can see the Bears not signing Cutler, and then Jay heads to MN. No need to draft a QB, just cut the three back ups that they have and pay Jay.

Yes. Yes please.

 

[BigJim®]

Does Bevell get an interview for HC in MN?

Bevell looks great with Russell Wilson running the show, but who wouldn't? Call me a skeptic. He couldn't develop Tarvaris Jackson, so I'm wary handing him a new ball of clay. Of former OCs, I'd call Linehan first. He had oodles of WR talent, but he got a lot out of Culpepper, and has been involved with Bradford/Stafford. I do hope the Vikes go bigger than a prior OC though. That would be disappointing.

Agree that it should be Freeman time. AP Guy was on KFAN today and mentioned (a couple times) that the staff has been underwhelmed with Freeman's practice habits. That raised an eyebrow, but who knows and who cares. Regardless, it's time to resolve whether Freeman has a future here. There is nothing else to learn about this team, and winning a single game because of Ponder/Cassell play is pointless.

 

[JMon348]

Wow, Ponder named QB. Frazier is so clueless.

I guess the Wilfs paid 3.5 million to watch Freeman for one game, after a week's worth of practice.

Unless this is a tanking strategy, in which I would be fully on board for!

Go Jacksonville, Tampa Bay, Atlanta, and Houston!!!!!

 

[snogger]

Wow, Ponder named QB. Frazier is so clueless.

I guess the Wilfs paid 3.5 million to watch Freeman for one game, after a week's worth of practice.

Unless this is a tanking strategy, in which I would be fully on board for!

Go Jacksonville, Tampa Bay, Atlanta, and Houston!!!!!

As I said earlier.. Fraizer must want out.. Playing Ponder and going down with the ship as the captain seems to be his only move now.

 

[FunkyPlutos]

I guess we know what they think of Freeman, but I can't blame them for bringing him in...I was all for it. But if he isn't better than Ponder, then you just as well play the guy that you have under contract for next year.

 

[mr roboto]

Assuming they draft or sign a QB, is Ponder the backup? Would they keep Cassel?

 

[Andy Dufresne]

I wonder if it's easier to find another job if you're fired rather than resign.

Maybe Frazier doesn't want to be a head coach but doesn't want to flush his whole career?

 

[sports_fan]

Assuming they draft or sign a QB, is Ponder the backup? Would they keep Cassel?

I think Cassel will opt out.

Ponder might get a few starts early in the season if they bring in someone young. But yeah, I think he'll be the backup for the majority of the season.

 

[BigJim®]

I'm having difficulty figuring out the end game strategy. If it is to allow Ponder more opportunity to show he's maybe possibly the guy beyond 2013, this front office is officially off the rails. If it's to bottom out for Bridgewater, then by all means shut AP down with the injury.

From a team politics standpoint, I'm shocked coaches don't take a public stance if they oppose the direction. As dead in the water as coaches seem, it's conceivable some could redeem themselves by reeling of a string of wins with Freeman (i.e. 'we can win, just not while hamstrung by Spielman's QB'). It's one thing to walk the company line until a season is lost, but at some point they have to recognize they are being set up to look like owners of these personnel decisions. Spielman has been curiously invisible these last several weeks.

 

[snogger]

last night when they talked about the ground breaking for the new stadium the sports reporter for I believe Fox9 said:

"The actual demolition of the Dome won't take place until the Viking season is over. Although many would say it already is".

 

[Donnybrook]

Was mbt so bad? Always wanted to know if he could play.

I don't think they wanted to lose him but it'd be hard to justify carrying 4 QBs on a team with so many holes.

Yea, lets go get a QB with a sub-50% completion rate. This org sucks.

This might be the thing that bothers me most about Speilman. How can they protect MBT for the better part of 2 years if they did not believe he had the potential to start in the NFL. How does the QB coach work with him for over 2 years and decide that he can't play in this league? Was it a waste of time and a roster spot?

After watching MBT play in preseason, I thought he should have been promoted to #2 and Cassel should have been on the bubble. When they signed Freeman, I knew that they were giving up on MBT. I knew if he had talent some one would claim him. A little surprised he made it as far as down the wavier wire as the 49ers.

It going to be interesting to watch and see if MBT ever get a chance to start for some team. Will MBT's terrible flaws be revealed or will be another late bloomer ala Rich Gannon?

 

[FunkyPlutos]

Why kick a game tying field goal in overtime? Either win or lose...at this point in the season, why would you do anything other than go for the win?

 

[Beo]

I put this comment on another thread talking about the tiebreakers for #1 pick so I thought I would put it up on this thread also just to see if anyone agrees or disagrees.

"As a Vikings fan I think this tie just makes everything simpler for us. There are no tiebreakers now. Either we have a worse record for the draft, or a better. We aren't going to leave anything to "strength of schedule". I am just hoping that the Texans can beat the Jaguars in their rematch, Atlanta gets a win over Buffalo or Was, and the Jaguars can pull one off against the Browns or Buffalo."

I feel pretty confident that Atlanta and Jacksonville will win one more but the Texans I think are done. Are they a lock to take Bridgewater if they get the #1 or would they be tempted to pair Clowney or Barr with JJ Watt and try and make that Defense just scary?

 

[mr roboto]

Of the 2 win teams, the Vikings may be the best team. ATL looks horrible, same with Jax. Vikes have lost several games by less than a touchdown. If we get a top 3 pick I like the opportunity to go from 3-12-1 to 9-7 or 10-6 next year.

 

[BigJim®]

Of the 2 win teams, the Vikings may be the best team. ATL looks horrible, same with Jax. Vikes have lost several games by less than a touchdown. If we get a top 3 pick I like the opportunity to go from 3-12-1 to 9-7 or 10-6 next year.

Interesting take. Atlanta has Roddy White back and put up a pretty good fight against New Orleans... a top notch team. Their next three seem winnable... Buffalo, GB, Washington.

 

[Beo]

Of the 2 win teams, the Vikings may be the best team. ATL looks horrible, same with Jax. Vikes have lost several games by less than a touchdown. If we get a top 3 pick I like the opportunity to go from 3-12-1 to 9-7 or 10-6 next year.

Oh I agree with you completely. We have really let a few games slip from our grasp but we do have the hardest schedule down the stretch. Jacksonville is bad but they have not given up at all and have played some good teams tough like Denver and they seem to be getting better. They will win 1 or 2 games here in the end. You are right about Atlanta they are horrible and have given up but I think they get 1 more win. They played the Saints pretty tough and just cant see them losing out. The Texans I think have 1 chance at a win and that is Jacksonville next Thursday night. If Watt and Johnson and any of the other team leaders can get the others to pull their heads out of their butts I think a primetime game against a division rival that they should be better than is the 1 game they can pull off. Now saying all this the Vikes will probably go 3-2 in the last 5 and get the 12th pick and reach on AJ McCarron and none of this will matter....lol.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

Nice job by Rhodes yesterday. He has the makings of a keeper. But Cook just sucks.

Patterson really isn't much of a hands catcher is he? He's going to be more of a YAC guy than one you send on streaks.

Their d-line is going to have to be re-tooled next year. Actually the entire front 7, IMO.