*** Official Barack Obama FBG campaign headquarters *** (1 Viewer)

[skol asylum]

Unfortunately, i am realizing yet again that this sort of empathy and understanding is preached by many, but practiced by few. Deep down, much of America is still hard headed, incapable of forming their own opinions, and follow the loudest and most boisterous soap box speakers (Limbaugh et al).

That always get a chuckle out of me. The media constantly misquotes and twists things that Rush Limbaugh says. When anyone else makes a supposedly controversial statement, the media bends over backwards to try to give them a second, third, or fourth chance to correct the record. Take Michelle Obama for example when she said it was first time she'd ever been proud of America. When she said that, the media gave her every opportunity to fix it. But when Rush says something, all too often the media will immediately to the worst conclusion possible and run with that as gospel. I'm at a point where the mainstream press has lost any and all credibility here. I don't care if the press has an axe to grind with Rush, it is their job to get the story right. If that is too much trouble, if they can't let Rush correct the record on a regular basis, then they have stopped being media worth listening to. Its tiring seeing CNN toss the "limbaugh" card out there with impunity and never get called on it. I trust Rush more (which in its own way is sad because I know he is half comedian).

I'd have never guessed.

 

[NorvilleBarnes]

No mail-in vote for Florida

No re-vote either. Not sure how they'll deal with the delegate issue at this point.

Hello Supreme Court

Hello back room deal.

 

[NorvilleBarnes]

Unfortunately, i am realizing yet again that this sort of empathy and understanding is preached by many, but practiced by few. Deep down, much of America is still hard headed, incapable of forming their own opinions, and follow the loudest and most boisterous soap box speakers (Limbaugh et al).

That always get a chuckle out of me. The media constantly misquotes and twists things that Rush Limbaugh says. When anyone else makes a supposedly controversial statement, the media bends over backwards to try to give them a second, third, or fourth chance to correct the record. Take Michelle Obama for example when she said it was first time she'd ever been proud of America. When she said that, the media gave her every opportunity to fix it. But when Rush says something, all too often the media will immediately to the worst conclusion possible and run with that as gospel. I'm at a point where the mainstream press has lost any and all credibility here. I don't care if the press has an axe to grind with Rush, it is their job to get the story right. If that is too much trouble, if they can't let Rush correct the record on a regular basis, then they have stopped being media worth listening to. Its tiring seeing CNN toss the "limbaugh" card out there with impunity and never get called on it. I trust Rush more (which in its own way is sad because I know he is half comedian).

I'd have never guessed.

Poor Rush. So misunderstood.

 

[Josie Maran]

Wow. Jim Cramer just RIPPED Obama's speech on the economy.

Yeah, but he did it by saying what an awesome state American manufacturing is in. I had to give a pretty hearty

 

[Pai Mei]

I'd have never guessed.

Poor Rush. So misunderstood.

Asbolutely. You can tell it really fires up Limbaugh's base of support every time he gets attacked. I credit the attacks by the press on Limbaugh for firing up the base to cross party lines and vote for Hillary to fracture the democrat primary. The grass roots can see that Rush is seemingly the only conservative left standing willing to fight for the beliefs.

 

[skol asylum]

I'd have never guessed.

Poor Rush. So misunderstood.

Asbolutely. You can tell it really fires up Limbaugh's base of support every time he gets attacked.

You mean if someone has a base of support that gets fired up when the person they support is attacked that gives said attackee some sort of legitimacy? Interesting.

 

[Pai Mei]

I'd have never guessed.

Poor Rush. So misunderstood.

Asbolutely. You can tell it really fires up Limbaugh's base of support every time he gets attacked.

You mean if someone has a base of support that gets fired up when the person they support is attacked that gives said attackee some sort of legitimacy? Interesting.

I think we're pretty much at a point where a conservative either supports Rush Limbaugh, or is a pansy that is willing to let the mainstream liberal press bully them around on most issues. I do respect the fact that Bush43 is becoming increasingly vocal in his support of Rush. I think we're seeing what the Bush family really believes in with decisions like that and that has been a big factor in hoping Jeb wins in 2012.

 

[skol asylum]

I'd have never guessed.

Poor Rush. So misunderstood.

Asbolutely. You can tell it really fires up Limbaugh's base of support every time he gets attacked.

You mean if someone has a base of support that gets fired up when the person they support is attacked that gives said attackee some sort of legitimacy? Interesting.

I think we're pretty much at a point where a conservative either supports Rush Limbaugh, or is a pansy that is willing to let the mainstream liberal press bully them around on most issues. I do respect the fact that Bush43 is becoming increasingly vocal in his support of Rush. I think we're seeing what the Bush family really believes in with decisions like that and that has been a big factor in hoping Jeb wins in 2012.

You completely missed my point.:softball:

 

[NorvilleBarnes]

I'd have never guessed.

Poor Rush. So misunderstood.

Asbolutely. You can tell it really fires up Limbaugh's base of support nutjob followers every time he gets attacked. I credit the attacks by the press on Limbaugh for firing up the base fringe to cross party lines and vote for Hillary to fracture the democrat primary. The grass roots listeners who refer to themselves as dittoheads can see that Rush is seemingly the only conservative left standing willing to fight for their beliefs dilusions.

Agreed. Oops, another vote for Hillary.

 

[Arsenal of Doom]

sounds like Obama is planning on making a major speech on race tomorrow

Some details. I'm glad he's going to address this issue in a broader context.Link

 

[djcolts]

Wow. Jim Cramer just RIPPED Obama's speech on the economy.

You mean the guy that told a viewer on his show last week to absolutely hold on to Bear Stearns stock?

 

[The Commish]

Wow. Jim Cramer just RIPPED Obama's speech on the economy.

You mean the guy that told a viewer on his show last week to absolutely hold on to Bear Stearns stock?

I think this Cramer guy is a dolt and makes dumb comments, but to be fair, he was suggesting leaving your money in their banks, and he was right. He wasn't suggesting holding onto the stocks...at least in the segments I saw of him. People were asking if they should withdraw their money and he told them not to worry about it that the gov't would make sure their deposits were secure.

 

[djcolts]

Wow. Jim Cramer just RIPPED Obama's speech on the economy.

You mean the guy that told a viewer on his show last week to absolutely hold on to Bear Stearns stock?

I think this Cramer guy is a dolt and makes dumb comments, but to be fair, he was suggesting leaving your money in their banks, and he was right. He wasn't suggesting holding onto the stocks...at least in the segments I saw of him. People were asking if they should withdraw their money and he told them not to worry about it that the gov't would make sure their deposits were secure.

They showed the clip on Fox and Friends this morning. It was clear-cut.

 

[Jeremy]

sounds like Obama is planning on making a major speech on race tomorrow

Some details. I'm glad he's going to address this issue in a broader context.Link

Sigh. I have to stop reading the "comments" section. Just depresses me. I love how people assume this guy has been preaching this way all the time for the last 20 years, based on a few 15 second video clips. I sometimes think Obama's biggest fault is that he overestimates the American people. He's going to try to teach us something about race in the US tonight, but I think it's going to be lost on most people.

 

[phthalatemagic]

I sometimes think Obama's biggest fault is that he overestimates the American people. He's going to try to teach us something about race in the US tonight, but I think it's going to be lost on most people.

I don't know that the speech will do much. Most of the Obama supporters have their minds made up that it was a fantastic speech, and most of the Obama detractors have their minds made up that Obama is a black panther.

 

[The Commish]

Wow. Jim Cramer just RIPPED Obama's speech on the economy.

You mean the guy that told a viewer on his show last week to absolutely hold on to Bear Stearns stock?

I think this Cramer guy is a dolt and makes dumb comments, but to be fair, he was suggesting leaving your money in their banks, and he was right. He wasn't suggesting holding onto the stocks...at least in the segments I saw of him. People were asking if they should withdraw their money and he told them not to worry about it that the gov't would make sure their deposits were secure.

They showed the clip on Fox and Friends this morning. It was clear-cut.

Do you have a link? I am the first to admit that I zone out a bit when he starts screaming on my TV, so I don't really pay close attention. Just going by the clips I saw.

 

[The Commish]

I sometimes think Obama's biggest fault is that he overestimates the American people. He's going to try to teach us something about race in the US tonight, but I think it's going to be lost on most people.

I don't know that the speech will do much. Most of the Obama supporters have their minds made up that it was a fantastic speech, and most of the Obama detractors have their minds made up that Obama is a black panther.

People have their minds made up at this point. Most have made their assumptions/decisions and thus their choice. It's unfortunate since we don't really know a TON about him. The longer we keep open minds the better off we are with a guy like this. Some politicians have actions that prove their words wrong and have long track records in Congress to predict future actions, but that's not the case here.

 

[culdeus]

Below is a statement by Texas Democratic Chairman Boyd Richie regarding the Delegate Selection Process:

The Texas Democratic Party and local Democratic Party organizations around our state are working to turn the enormous opportunity created by the record Democratic turnout experienced on March 4th into a positive outcome for Texas Democrats this fall and in 2010. We are proud of both our Presidential candidates who helped create that turnout. We ask now that the campaigns work with us rather than become an impediment to this extraordinary opportunity to build our party.

On March 4th, our Democratic precinct conventions experienced record turnout of roughly one million precinct convention attendees, a ten-fold increase from the previous high attendance mark. As expected in any record turnout involving hundreds of thousands of people, there were reports of problems caused by long lines and crowded facilities. These problems are not unique to Texas. Similar problems, in proportionately similar numbers, occurred in pure caucus states like Iowa and Nevada.

The overwhelming majority of problems reported in Texas do not affect the legitimacy of delegate allocation. It is important to remember that the precinct conventions are just the first of three steps where delegates and alternates are selected. "Final results" will not be determined until June 6-7 at the Texas Democratic State convention. And at each convention step, Texas Democratic Party rules provide a credentials process to address problems and provide an avenue to register complaints and make formal challenges

For that reason, the Texas Democratic Party will not do as suggested by one campaign and circumvent Party rules to set up an unnecessary, ad hoc "verification" process that could effectively disqualify delegates selected at their precinct conventions after the fact. The Party has never stated any intention to set up a verification process of this nature because Party rules already provide for "verification" through our credentials process. Candidates who wish to disqualify delegates must pursue formal challenges based on evidence filed appropriately in accordance with our party's rules.

The Texas Democratic Party plans to conduct our district and county conventions on March 29 and our June State Convention in accordance with procedures set forth in Texas law and party rules. Both campaigns have the opportunity and responsibility to do their jobs by documenting evidence, filing challenges if warranted, and turning out their delegates in a system that rewards such an effort when final delegate results are determined at the State Convention in June.

 

[Sweet J]

Below is a statement by Texas Democratic Chairman Boyd Richie regarding the Delegate Selection Process:The Texas Democratic Party and local Democratic Party organizations around our state are working to turn the enormous opportunity created by the record Democratic turnout experienced on March 4th into a positive outcome for Texas Democrats this fall and in 2010. We are proud of both our Presidential candidates who helped create that turnout. We ask now that the campaigns work with us rather than become an impediment to this extraordinary opportunity to build our party.On March 4th, our Democratic precinct conventions experienced record turnout of roughly one million precinct convention attendees, a ten-fold increase from the previous high attendance mark. As expected in any record turnout involving hundreds of thousands of people, there were reports of problems caused by long lines and crowded facilities. These problems are not unique to Texas. Similar problems, in proportionately similar numbers, occurred in pure caucus states like Iowa and Nevada.The overwhelming majority of problems reported in Texas do not affect the legitimacy of delegate allocation. It is important to remember that the precinct conventions are just the first of three steps where delegates and alternates are selected. "Final results" will not be determined until June 6-7 at the Texas Democratic State convention. And at each convention step, Texas Democratic Party rules provide a credentials process to address problems and provide an avenue to register complaints and make formal challengesFor that reason, the Texas Democratic Party will not do as suggested by one campaign and circumvent Party rules to set up an unnecessary, ad hoc "verification" process that could effectively disqualify delegates selected at their precinct conventions after the fact. The Party has never stated any intention to set up a verification process of this nature because Party rules already provide for "verification" through our credentials process. Candidates who wish to disqualify delegates must pursue formal challenges based on evidence filed appropriately in accordance with our party's rules.The Texas Democratic Party plans to conduct our district and county conventions on March 29 and our June State Convention in accordance with procedures set forth in Texas law and party rules. Both campaigns have the opportunity and responsibility to do their jobs by documenting evidence, filing challenges if warranted, and turning out their delegates in a system that rewards such an effort when final delegate results are determined at the State Convention in June.

Awesome.

 

[Arsenal of Doom]

Here is the transcript from Obama's speech today.

We the people, in order to form a more perfect union.Two hundred and twenty one years ago, in a hall that still stands across the street, a group of men gathered and, with these simple words, launched America's improbable experiment in democracy. Farmers and scholars; statesmen and patriots who had traveled across an ocean to escape tyranny and persecution finally made real their declaration of independence at a Philadelphia convention that lasted through the spring of 1787.The document they produced was eventually signed but ultimately unfinished. It was stained by this nation's original sin of slavery, a question that divided the colonies and brought the convention to a stalemate until the founders chose to allow the slave trade to continue for at least 20 more years, and to leave any final resolution to future generations.Of course, the answer to the slavery question was already embedded within our Constitution -- a Constitution that had at its very core the ideal of equal citizenship under the law; a Constitution that promised its people liberty, and justice, and a union that could be and should be perfected over time.And yet words on a parchment would not be enough to deliver slaves from bondage, or provide men and women of every color and creed their full rights and obligations as citizens of the United States. What would be needed were Americans in successive generations who were willing to do their part -- through protests and struggle, on the streets and in the courts, through a civil war and civil disobedience and always at great risk -- to narrow that gap between the promise of our ideals and the reality of their time.This was one of the tasks we set forth at the beginning of this campaign -- to continue the long march of those who came before us, a march for a more just, more equal, more free, more caring and more prosperous America. I chose to run for the presidency at this moment in history because I believe deeply that we cannot solve the challenges of our time unless we solve them together -- unless we perfect our union by understanding that we may have different stories, but we hold common hopes; that we may not look the same and we may not have come from the same place, but we all want to move in the same direction -- towards a better future for our children and our grandchildren.This belief comes from my unyielding faith in the decency and generosity of the American people. But it also comes from my own American story.I am the son of a black man from Kenya and a white woman from Kansas. I was raised with the help of a white grandfather who survived a Depression to serve in Patton's Army during World War II and a white grandmother who worked on a bomber assembly line at Fort Leavenworth while he was overseas. I've gone to some of the best schools in America and lived in one of the world's poorest nations. I am married to a black American who carries within her the blood of slaves and slaveowners -- an inheritance we pass on to our two precious daughters. I have brothers, sisters, nieces, nephews, uncles and cousins, of every race and every hue, scattered across three continents, and for as long as I live, I will never forget that in no other country on Earth is my story even possible.It's a story that hasn't made me the most conventional candidate. But it is a story that has seared into my genetic makeup the idea that this nation is more than the sum of its parts -- that out of many, we are truly one.Throughout the first year of this campaign, against all predictions to the contrary, we saw how hungry the American people were for this message of unity. Despite the temptation to view my candidacy through a purely racial lens, we won commanding victories in states with some of the whitest populations in the country. In South Carolina, where the Confederate Flag still flies, we built a powerful coalition of African-Americans and white Americans.This is not to say that race has not been an issue in the campaign. At various stages in the campaign, some commentators have deemed me either "too black" or "not black enough." We saw racial tensions bubble to the surface during the week before the South Carolina primary. The press has scoured every exit poll for the latest evidence of racial polarization, not just in terms of white and black, but black and brown as well.And yet, it has only been in the last couple of weeks that the discussion of race in this campaign has taken a particularly divisive turn.On one end of the spectrum, we've heard the implication that my candidacy is somehow an exercise in affirmative action, that it's based solely on the desire of wide-eyed liberals to purchase racial reconciliation on the cheap. On the other end, we've heard my former pastor, Rev. Jeremiah Wright, use incendiary language to express views that have the potential not only to widen the racial divide, but views that denigrate both the greatness and the goodness of our nation -- that rightly offend white and black alike.I have already condemned, in unequivocal terms, the statements of Rev. Wright that have caused such controversy. For some, nagging questions remain. Did I know him to be an occasionally fierce critic of American domestic and foreign policy? Of course. Did I ever hear him make remarks that could be considered controversial while I sat in church? Yes. Did I strongly disagree with many of his political views? Absolutely -- just as I'm sure many of you have heard remarks from your pastors, priests or rabbis with which you strongly disagreed.But the remarks that have caused this recent firestorm weren't simply controversial. They weren't simply a religious leader's effort to speak out against perceived injustice. Instead, they expressed a profoundly distorted view of this country -- a view that sees white racism as endemic, and that elevates what is wrong with America above all that we know is right with America, a view that sees the conflicts in the Middle East as rooted primarily in the actions of stalwart allies like Israel, instead of emanating from the perverse and hateful ideologies of radical Islam.As such, Rev. Wright's comments were not only wrong but divisive, divisive at a time when we need unity; racially charged at a time when we need to come together to solve a set of monumental problems -- two wars, a terrorist threat, a falling economy, a chronic health care crisis and potentially devastating climate change; problems that are neither black or white or Latino or Asian, but rather problems that confront us all.Given my background, my politics, and my professed values and ideals, there will no doubt be those for whom my statements of condemnation are not enough. Why associate myself with Rev. Wright in the first place, they may ask? Why not join another church? And I confess that if all that I knew of Rev. Wright were the snippets of those sermons that have run in an endless loop on the television and YouTube, or if Trinity United Church of Christ conformed to the caricatures being peddled by some commentators, there is no doubt that I would react in much the same wayBut the truth is, that isn't all that I know of the man. The man I met more than 20 years ago is a man who helped introduce me to my Christian faith, a man who spoke to me about our obligations to love one another; to care for the sick and lift up the poor. He is a man who served his country as a U.S. Marine, who has studied and lectured at some of the finest universities and seminaries in the country, and who for over thirty years led a church that serves the community by doing God's work here on Earth -- by housing the homeless, ministering to the needy, providing day care services and scholarships and prison ministries, and reaching out to those suffering from HIV/AIDS.In my first book, "Dreams From My Father," I described the experience of my first service at Trinity:"People began to shout, to rise from their seats and clap and cry out, a forceful wind carrying the reverend's voice up into the rafters....And in that single note -- hope! -- I heard something else; at the foot of that cross, inside the thousands of churches across the city, I imagined the stories of ordinary black people merging with the stories of David and Goliath, Moses and Pharaoh, the Christians in the lion's den, Ezekiel's field of dry bones. "Those stories -- of survival, and freedom, and hope -- became our story, my story; the blood that had spilled was our blood, the tears our tears; until this black church, on this bright day, seemed once more a vessel carrying the story of a people into future generations and into a larger world. "Our trials and triumphs became at once unique and universal, black and more than black; in chronicling our journey, the stories and songs gave us a means to reclaim memories that we didn't need to feel shame about...memories that all people might study and cherish -- and with which we could start to rebuild."That has been my experience at Trinity. Like other predominantly black churches across the country, Trinity embodies the black community in its entirety -- the doctor and the welfare mom, the model student and the former gang-banger. Like other black churches, Trinity's services are full of raucous laughter and sometimes bawdy humor. They are full of dancing, clapping, screaming and shouting that may seem jarring to the untrained ear. The church contains in full the kindness and cruelty, the fierce intelligence and the shocking ignorance, the struggles and successes, the love and yes, the bitterness and bias that make up the black experience in America.And this helps explain, perhaps, my relationship with Rev. Wright. As imperfect as he may be, he has been like family to me. He strengthened my faith, officiated my wedding, and baptized my children. Not once in my conversations with him have I heard him talk about any ethnic group in derogatory terms, or treat whites with whom he interacted with anything but courtesy and respect. He contains within him the contradictions -- the good and the bad -- of the community that he has served diligently for so many years.I can no more disown him than I can disown the black community. I can no more disown him than I can my white grandmother -- a woman who helped raise me, a woman who sacrificed again and again for me, a woman who loves me as much as she loves anything in this world, but a woman who once confessed her fear of black men who passed by her on the street, and who on more than one occasion has uttered racial or ethnic stereotypes that made me cringe.These people are a part of me. And they are a part of America, this country that I love.Some will see this as an attempt to justify or excuse comments that are simply inexcusable. I can assure you it is not. I suppose the politically safe thing would be to move on from this episode and just hope that it fades into the woodwork. We can dismiss Rev. Wright as a crank or a demagogue, just as some have dismissed Geraldine Ferraro, in the aftermath of her recent statements, as harboring some deep-seated racial bias.But race is an issue that I believe this nation cannot afford to ignore right now. We would be making the same mistake that Rev. Wright made in his offending sermons about America -- to simplify and stereotype and amplify the negative to the point that it distorts reality.The fact is that the comments that have been made and the issues that have surfaced over the last few weeks reflect the complexities of race in this country that we've never really worked through -- a part of our union that we have yet to perfect. And if we walk away now, if we simply retreat into our respective corners, we will never be able to come together and solve challenges like health care, or education, or the need to find good jobs for every American.Understanding this reality requires a reminder of how we arrived at this point. As William Faulkner once wrote, "The past isn't dead and buried. In fact, it isn't even past." We do not need to recite here the history of racial injustice in this country. But we do need to remind ourselves that so many of the disparities that exist in the African-American community today can be directly traced to inequalities passed on from an earlier generation that suffered under the brutal legacy of slavery and Jim Crow.Segregated schools were, and are, inferior schools; we still haven't fixed them, fifty years after Brown v. Board of Education, and the inferior education they provided, then and now, helps explain the pervasive achievement gap between today's black and white students.Legalized discrimination -- where blacks were prevented, often through violence, from owning property, or loans were not granted to African-American business owners, or black homeowners could not access FHA mortgages, or blacks were excluded from unions, or the police force, or fire departments -- meant that black families could not amass any meaningful wealth to bequeath to future generations. That history helps explain the wealth and income gap between black and white, and the concentrated pockets of poverty that persists in so many of today's urban and rural communities.A lack of economic opportunity among black men, and the shame and frustration that came from not being able to provide for one's family, contributed to the erosion of black families -- a problem that welfare policies for many years may have worsened. And the lack of basic services in so many urban black neighborhoods -- parks for kids to play in, police walking the beat, regular garbage pick-up and building code enforcement -- all helped create a cycle of violence, blight and neglect that continue to haunt us.This is the reality in which Rev. Wright and other African-Americans of his generation grew up. They came of age in the late fifties and early sixties, a time when segregation was still the law of the land and opportunity was systematically constricted. What's remarkable is not how many failed in the face of discrimination, but rather how many men and women overcame the odds; how many were able to make a way out of no way for those like me who would come after them.But for all those who scratched and clawed their way to get a piece of the American Dream, there were many who didn't make it -- those who were ultimately defeated, in one way or another, by discrimination. That legacy of defeat was passed on to future generations -- those young men and, increasingly, young women who we see standing on street corners or languishing in our prisons, without hope or prospects for the future. Even for those blacks who did make it, questions of race, and racism, continue to define their worldview in fundamental ways. For the men and women of Rev. Wright's generation, the memories of humiliation and doubt and fear have not gone away; nor has the anger and the bitterness of those years. That anger may not get expressed in public, in front of white co-workers or white friends. But it does find voice in the barbershop or around the kitchen table. At times, that anger is exploited by politicians, to gin up votes along racial lines, or to make up for a politician's own failings.And occasionally it finds voice in the church on Sunday morning, in the pulpit and in the pews. The fact that so many people are surprised to hear that anger in some of Rev. Wright's sermons simply reminds us of the old truism that the most segregated hour in American life occurs on Sunday morning. That anger is not always productive; indeed, all too often it distracts attention from solving real problems; it keeps us from squarely facing our own complicity in our condition, and prevents the African-American community from forging the alliances it needs to bring about real change. But the anger is real; it is powerful; and to simply wish it away, to condemn it without understanding its roots, only serves to widen the chasm of misunderstanding that exists between the races.In fact, a similar anger exists within segments of the white community. Most working- and middle-class white Americans don't feel that they have been particularly privileged by their race. Their experience is the immigrant experience -- as far as they're concerned, no one's handed them anything, they've built it from scratch. They've worked hard all their lives, many times only to see their jobs shipped overseas or their pension dumped after a lifetime of labor. They are anxious about their futures, and feel their dreams slipping away; in an era of stagnant wages and global competition, opportunity comes to be seen as a zero sum game, in which your dreams come at my expense. So when they are told to bus their children to a school across town; when they hear that an African-American is getting an advantage in landing a good job or a spot in a good college because of an injustice that they themselves never committed; when they're told that their fears about crime in urban neighborhoods are somehow prejudiced, resentment builds over time.Like the anger within the black community, these resentments aren't always expressed in polite company. But they have helped shape the political landscape for at least a generation. Anger over welfare and affirmative action helped forge the Reagan Coalition. Politicians routinely exploited fears of crime for their own electoral ends. Talk show hosts and conservative commentators built entire careers unmasking bogus claims of racism while dismissing legitimate discussions of racial injustice and inequality as mere political correctness or reverse racism.Just as black anger often proved counterproductive, so have these white resentments distracted attention from the real culprits of the middle-class squeeze -- a corporate culture rife with inside dealing, questionable accounting practices and short-term greed; a Washington dominated by lobbyists and special interests; economic policies that favor the few over the many. And yet, to wish away the resentments of white Americans, to label them as misguided or even racist, without recognizing they are grounded in legitimate concerns -- this too widens the racial divide, and blocks the path to understanding.This is where we are right now. It's a racial stalemate we've been stuck in for years. Contrary to the claims of some of my critics, black and white, I have never been so naive as to believe that we can get beyond our racial divisions in a single election cycle, or with a single candidacy -- particularly a candidacy as imperfect as my own.But I have asserted a firm conviction -- a conviction rooted in my faith in God and my faith in the American people -- that working together we can move beyond some of our old racial wounds, and that in fact we have no choice if we are to continue on the path of a more perfect union.For the African-American community, that path means embracing the burdens of our past without becoming victims of our past. It means continuing to insist on a full measure of justice in every aspect of American life. But it also means binding our particular grievances -- for better health care, and better schools, and better jobs -- to the larger aspirations of all Americans, the white woman struggling to break the glass ceiling, the white man whose been laid off, the immigrant trying to feed his family. And it means taking full responsibility for own lives -- by demanding more from our fathers, and spending more time with our children, and reading to them, and teaching them that while they may face challenges and discrimination in their own lives, they must never succumb to despair or cynicism; they must always believe that they can write their own destiny.Ironically, this quintessentially American -- and yes, conservative -- notion of self-help found frequent expression in Rev. Wright's sermons. But what my former pastor too often failed to understand is that embarking on a program of self-help also requires a belief that society can change.The profound mistake of Rev. Wright's sermons is not that he spoke about racism in our society. It's that he spoke as if our society was static; as if no progress has been made; as if this country -- a country that has made it possible for one of his own members to run for the highest office in the land and build a coalition of white and black, Latino and Asian, rich and poor, young and old -- is still irrevocably bound to a tragic past. But what we know -- what we have seen -- is that America can change. That is the true genius of this nation. What we have already achieved gives us hope -- the audacity to hope -- for what we can and must achieve tomorrow.In the white community, the path to a more perfect union means acknowledging that what ails the African-American community does not just exist in the minds of black people; that the legacy of discrimination -- and current incidents of discrimination, while less overt than in the past -- are real and must be addressed. Not just with words, but with deeds -- by investing in our schools and our communities; by enforcing our civil rights laws and ensuring fairness in our criminal justice system; by providing this generation with ladders of opportunity that were unavailable for previous generations. It requires all Americans to realize that your dreams do not have to come at the expense of my dreams; that investing in the health, welfare and education of black and brown and white children will ultimately help all of America prosper.In the end, then, what is called for is nothing more, and nothing less, than what all the world's great religions demand -- that we do unto others as we would have them do unto us. Let us be our brother's keeper, Scripture tells us. Let us be our sister's keeper. Let us find that common stake we all have in one another, and let our politics reflect that spirit as well.For we have a choice in this country. We can accept a politics that breeds division, and conflict, and cynicism. We can tackle race only as spectacle -- as we did in the O.J. trial -- or in the wake of tragedy, as we did in the aftermath of Katrina -- or as fodder for the nightly news. We can play Rev. Wright's sermons on every channel, every day and talk about them from now until the election, and make the only question in this campaign whether or not the American people think that I somehow believe or sympathize with his most offensive words. We can pounce on some gaffe by a Hillary supporter as evidence that she's playing the race card, or we can speculate on whether white men will all flock to John McCain in the general election regardless of his policies.We can do that.But if we do, I can tell you that in the next election, we'll be talking about some other distraction. And then another one. And then another one. And nothing will change.That is one option. Or, at this moment, in this election, we can come together and say, "Not this time." This time we want to talk about the crumbling schools that are stealing the future of black children and white children and Asian children and Hispanic children and Native American children. This time we want to reject the cynicism that tells us that these kids can't learn; that those kids who don't look like us are somebody else's problem. The children of America are not those kids, they are our kids, and we will not let them fall behind in a 21st Century economy. Not this time.This time we want to talk about how the lines in the emergency room are filled with whites and blacks and Hispanics who do not have health care, who don't have the power on their own to overcome the special interests in Washington, but who can take them on if we do it together.This time we want to talk about the shuttered mills that once provided a decent life for men and women of every race, and the homes for sale that once belonged to Americans from every religion, every region, every walk of life. This time we want to talk about the fact that the real problem is not that someone who doesn't look like you might take your job; it's that the corporation you work for will ship it overseas for nothing more than a profit.This time we want to talk about the men and women of every color and creed who serve together, and fight together, and bleed together under the same proud flag. We want to talk about how to bring them home from a war that never should've been authorized and never should've been waged, and we want to talk about how we'll show our patriotism by caring for them, and their families, and giving them the benefits they have earned.I would not be running for president if I didn't believe with all my heart that this is what the vast majority of Americans want for this country. This union may never be perfect, but generation after generation has shown that it can always be perfected. And today, whenever I find myself feeling doubtful or cynical about this possibility, what gives me the most hope is the next generation -- the young people whose attitudes and beliefs and openness to change have already made history in this election.There is one story in particularly that I'd like to leave you with today -- a story I told when I had the great honor of speaking on Dr. King's birthday at his home church, Ebenezer Baptist, in Atlanta.There is a young, 23-year-old white woman named Ashley Baia who organized for our campaign in Florence, South Carolina. She had been working to organize a mostly African-American community since the beginning of this campaign, and one day she was at a roundtable discussion where everyone went around telling their story and why they were there.And Ashley said that when she was 9 years old, her mother got cancer. And because she had to miss days of work, she was let go and lost her health care. They had to file for bankruptcy, and that's when Ashley decided that she had to do something to help her mom.She knew that food was one of their most expensive costs, and so Ashley convinced her mother that what she really liked and really wanted to eat more than anything else was mustard and relish sandwiches. Because that was the cheapest way to eat.She did this for a year until her mom got better, and she told everyone at the roundtable that the reason she joined our campaign was so that she could help the millions of other children in the country who want and need to help their parents, too.Now Ashley might have made a different choice. Perhaps somebody told her along the way that the source of her mother's problems were blacks who were on welfare and too lazy to work, or Hispanics who were coming into the country illegally. But she didn't. She sought out allies in her fight against injustice.Anyway, Ashley finishes her story and then goes around the room and asks everyone else why they're supporting the campaign. They all have different stories and reasons. Many bring up a specific issue. And finally they come to this elderly black man who's been sitting there quietly the entire time. And Ashley asks him why he's there. And he does not bring up a specific issue. He does not say health care or the economy. He does not say education or the war. He does not say that he was there because of Barack Obama. He simply says to everyone in the room, "I am here because of Ashley.""I'm here because of Ashley." By itself, that single moment of recognition between that young white girl and that old black man is not enough. It is not enough to give health care to the sick, or jobs to the jobless, or education to our children.But it is where we start. It is where our union grows stronger. And as so many generations have come to realize over the course of the two-hundred and twenty one years since a band of patriots signed that document in Philadelphia, that is where the perfection begins.

 

[BuddyKnuckles]

The lines appear to have been drawn at this point. As phthalatemagic says people either love him or hate him. The fact that so many people have so much hate for a man with a positive message tells me a lot about Obama. I cant think of one instance in American history when someone professing a positive message has been well received by the entrenched establishment. Most of the time those individuals ended up becoming a very positive influence on our country. When they weren't gunned down that is.

ETA; actually edit to recant a Wright-esque statement

 

[BuddyKnuckles]

Speaking of completely unscientific, MSNBC currently has a poll up regarding Obama's speech. LINK

So far, after 80k votes, 2/3 agree that Obama successfully tackled the issue of race in his speech. Another 2/3 say that America is ready for a black president.

Highly unscientific, but interesting nonetheless

 

[D_House]

It's weird, but now that he probably doesn't have a chance, I'm IN.

 

[culdeus]

The lines appear to have been drawn at this point. As phthalatemagic says people either love him or hate him. The fact that so many people have so much hate for a man with a positive message tells me a lot about Obama. I cant think of one instance in American history when someone professing a positive message has been well received by the entrenched establishment. Most of the time those individuals ended up becoming a very positive influence on our country. When they weren't gunned down that is.



Lastly, and this wont make me popular on this board, this yet again reaffirms my belief that Religion, why good in many respects, is the most divisive force ever created by man. The sooner we all become thinking, rational, scientific atheists, the better off everyone will be

What's this have to do with anything? You saying that if there was no church he wouldn't have been exposed to this guy and ergo this is not an issue?

 

[cosjobs]

Wow. Jim Cramer just RIPPED Obama's speech on the economy.

You mean the guy that told a viewer on his show last week to absolutely hold on to Bear Stearns stock?

I think this Cramer guy is a dolt and makes dumb comments, but to be fair, he was suggesting leaving your money in their banks, and he was right. He wasn't suggesting holding onto the stocks...at least in the segments I saw of him. People were asking if they should withdraw their money and he told them not to worry about it that the gov't would make sure their deposits were secure.

They showed the clip on Fox and Friends this morning. It was clear-cut.

Do you have a link? I am the first to admit that I zone out a bit when he starts screaming on my TV, so I don't really pay close attention. Just going by the clips I saw.

Showed the same bit on the Daily Show last night.He was emphatic in telling the listener to NOT sell Bear Stearns

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

It's weird, but now that he probably doesn't have a chance, I'm IN.

Why doesn't he have a chance? From InTrade.com:Obama: 45%McCain: 38%Hillary: 17%

 

[D_House]

It's weird, but now that he probably doesn't have a chance, I'm IN.

Why doesn't he have a chance? From InTrade.com:Obama: 45%McCain: 38%Hillary: 17%

It just seems like this whole Wright thing has been blown way out of proportion, and is not going to help Obama with the voters that Clinton has been winning. Just seems like a lot of negative momentum lately. Or maybe I just feel that way BECAUSE I now officially endorse him. (Full disclosure: I'm also a Bills fan) :(

 

[Josie Maran]

It's weird, but now that he probably doesn't have a chance, I'm IN.

Why doesn't he have a chance? From InTrade.com:Obama: 45%McCain: 38%Hillary: 17%

It just seems like this whole Wright thing has been blown way out of proportion, and is not going to help Obama with the voters that Clinton has been winning. Just seems like a lot of negative momentum lately. Or maybe I just feel that way BECAUSE I now officially endorse him. (Full disclosure: I'm also a Bills fan)

Oof.Could you please hop over into Clinton Country for a bit?

 

[whitem0nkey]

video of full speech

Linky

 

[BuddyKnuckles]

The lines appear to have been drawn at this point. As phthalatemagic says people either love him or hate him. The fact that so many people have so much hate for a man with a positive message tells me a lot about Obama. I cant think of one instance in American history when someone professing a positive message has been well received by the entrenched establishment. Most of the time those individuals ended up becoming a very positive influence on our country. When they weren't gunned down that is.



Lastly, and this wont make me popular on this board, this yet again reaffirms my belief that Religion, why good in many respects, is the most divisive force ever created by man. The sooner we all become thinking, rational, scientific atheists, the better off everyone will be

What's this have to do with anything? You saying that if there was no church he wouldn't have been exposed to this guy and ergo this is not an issue?

Sorry, that was a combination of venting with lack of sleep. It was uncalled for and inappropriate and i will edit it out of my postETA: I reject and denounce my comments

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

video of full speech

Linky

"We're sorry, this video is no longer available."

 

[whitem0nkey]

video of full speech

Linky

"We're sorry, this video is no longer available."

Edit: new linkHere you go!

if its gone again, I would just do a you tube search for "Obama" than sort by date.

sounds like captain chaos and his dittoheads are emailing youtube that this is copyrigheted.

 

[Sweet J]

Wow. Jim Cramer just RIPPED Obama's speech on the economy.

You mean the guy that told a viewer on his show last week to absolutely hold on to Bear Stearns stock?

I think this Cramer guy is a dolt and makes dumb comments, but to be fair, he was suggesting leaving your money in their banks, and he was right. He wasn't suggesting holding onto the stocks...at least in the segments I saw of him. People were asking if they should withdraw their money and he told them not to worry about it that the gov't would make sure their deposits were secure.

They showed the clip on Fox and Friends this morning. It was clear-cut.

Do you have a link? I am the first to admit that I zone out a bit when he starts screaming on my TV, so I don't really pay close attention. Just going by the clips I saw.

Showed the same bit on the Daily Show last night.He was emphatic in telling the listener to NOT sell Bear Stearns

:reading from letter last tuesday: "Dear Jim, I'm worried about Bear Stearns. Should I sell?":looking at the camera with crazy eyes: "No, no, no, no, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO!!!!!"

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

Wow. Jim Cramer just RIPPED Obama's speech on the economy.

You mean the guy that told a viewer on his show last week to absolutely hold on to Bear Stearns stock?

I think this Cramer guy is a dolt and makes dumb comments, but to be fair, he was suggesting leaving your money in their banks, and he was right. He wasn't suggesting holding onto the stocks...at least in the segments I saw of him. People were asking if they should withdraw their money and he told them not to worry about it that the gov't would make sure their deposits were secure.

They showed the clip on Fox and Friends this morning. It was clear-cut.

Do you have a link? I am the first to admit that I zone out a bit when he starts screaming on my TV, so I don't really pay close attention. Just going by the clips I saw.

Showed the same bit on the Daily Show last night.He was emphatic in telling the listener to NOT sell Bear Stearns

:reading from letter last tuesday: "Dear Jim, I'm worried about Bear Stearns. Should I sell?":looking at the camera with crazy eyes: "No, no, no, no, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO!!!!!"

I know hindsight is 20/20, but he probably should have said "Yes."

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

I want to put together a little Vote For Obama packet to give to my family. My mother is one of four 100% Italian stubborn, hardnosed, tough, borderline feminazi sisters. Right now I know two of them are for Hillary, one of them has said she is going to vote for McCain if Obama wins the nomination, and another mentioned the "muslim email" over thanksgiving (i corrected her then, but havent spoken much about Obama to her since). We vote April 22 in a suburb of Pittsburgh, PA.

I'm looking for suggestions of how to format it and what I should include. I am obviously going to include his 2002 Iraq speech text and today's piece of brilliance (which really hits home with me and my family being that I graduated from a school formed out of a segregation lawsuit and all of the above aunts pa taxes in that school district). I also think that Chicago Trib article "The Obama I Know" (or something like that) is very good as well. What else from page 1 of this thread and/or Obama's site should be included in your opinions? I have other ideas for this of my own as well, but I want more input.

I will also be giving these out to my father and uncles. My father voted for Bush twice, but admitted today that this may the the worst administration in U.S. History and could not name a single accomplishment. This is significant considering my grandfather (his father) ran for U.S. House of Rep. as a Republican and my father was a history major and is a huge presidential politics history buff. He will not vote Hillary, but Obama intrigues him.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

I want to put together a little Vote For Obama packet to give to my family.

Don't answer me, just answer yourself: Why do you care how your family votes?Do you want to show them that they're wrong and you're right? If so, I'd try to overcome that urge and just drop it.Do you think their votes will influence the outcome of the election? They won't.Or do you want to turn them onto a candidate you think they might ultimately appreciate, but they don't currently have the resources or inclination to find out more about him? If this is the reason, I'd probably mention to them that you really like Obama, and tell you can give them links to (or printouts of) his better speeches if they want.But I wouldn't take it personally if they brush you off on this topic, and I wouldn't treat it like it's a big deal. JMHO.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

I want to put together a little Vote For Obama packet to give to my family.

Don't answer me, just answer yourself: Why do you care how your family votes?Do you want to show them that they're wrong and you're right? If so, I'd try to overcome that urge and just drop it.Do you think their votes will influence the outcome of the election? They won't.Or do you want to turn them onto a candidate you think they might ultimately appreciate, but they don't currently have the resources or inclination to find out more about him? If this is the reason, I'd probably mention to them that you really like Obama, and tell you can give them links to (or printouts of) his better speeches if they want.But I wouldn't take it personally if they brush you off on this topic, and I wouldn't treat it like it's a big deal. JMHO.

Basically, they would be for Obama if there wasnt a woman against him, but I am pretty confident that if they had all the information they would forgoe their feminazi instincts. I know that my mother has at least said she wants to vote for the candidate that has the best chance of beating McCain. My one Aunt may be too tied to the feminism thing, but the other two I fell have fallen into the trappings of the smearing of Obama and do not know how right he was on Iraq or about 99% of what we have here in this thread.I've already printed out the Iraq 2002 speech for my father and uncle and have them both leaning this way now. Hell, last year I made my republican for life 82 year old grandfather watch Obama announce his running for POTUS. He at least appreciated it, although he 99% will still vote for McCain.

 

[Sweet J]

Do you think their votes will influence the outcome of the election? They won't.

whoa. hold on there, cowboy. Did mine ears just deceive me? If every strong supporter of one candidate convinced one fence-sitter he knew to vote his way, isn't that an influence on the election?

 

[D_House]

Do you think their votes will influence the outcome of the election? They won't.

whoa. hold on there, cowboy. Did mine ears just deceive me? If every strong supporter of one candidate convinced one fence-sitter he knew to vote his way, isn't that an influence on the election?

Yeah that's crazy talk. By that measure, why would he vote himself, since his single vote clearly won't influence the election.

 

[NorvilleBarnes]

Do you think their votes will influence the outcome of the election? They won't.

whoa. hold on there, cowboy. Did mine ears just deceive me? If every strong supporter of one candidate convinced one fence-sitter he knew to vote his way, isn't that an influence on the election?

Yeah that's crazy talk. By that measure, why would he vote himself, since his single vote clearly won't influence the election.

I agree. My vote means nothing. Especially in Tennessee.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

Do you think their votes will influence the outcome of the election? They won't.

whoa. hold on there, cowboy. Did mine ears just deceive me? If every strong supporter of one candidate convinced one fence-sitter he knew to vote his way, isn't that an influence on the election?

Yeah that's crazy talk. By that measure, why would he vote himself, since his single vote clearly won't influence the election.

I don't know why he'd vote himself. There are lots of possible reasons. If you ask him, he'll probably give you a good answer. But "it's likely to affect the outcome of the election" wouldn't count as a good answer.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

Do you think their votes will influence the outcome of the election? They won't.

whoa. hold on there, cowboy. Did mine ears just deceive me? If every strong supporter of one candidate convinced one fence-sitter he knew to vote his way, isn't that an influence on the election?

Leeroy Jenkins can't cause "every strong supporter" to convince their fence-sitting relatives. Whether they all do, or some do, or none do, Leeroy Jenkins's doing so won't affect the outcome of the election.

 

[Sweet J]

Do you think their votes will influence the outcome of the election? They won't.

whoa. hold on there, cowboy. Did mine ears just deceive me? If every strong supporter of one candidate convinced one fence-sitter he knew to vote his way, isn't that an influence on the election?

Leeroy Jenkins can't cause "every strong supporter" to convince their fence-sitting relatives. Whether they all do, or some do, or none do, Leeroy Jenkins's doing so won't affect the outcome of the election.

hmmmm. I sense an interesting philosophical discussion. Respond when your left-coast ### wakes up, and I'll start a thread.

 

[Clayton Gray]

Do you think their votes will influence the outcome of the election? They won't.

whoa. hold on there, cowboy. Did mine ears just deceive me? If every strong supporter of one candidate convinced one fence-sitter he knew to vote his way, isn't that an influence on the election?

Leeroy Jenkins can't cause "every strong supporter" to convince their fence-sitting relatives. Whether they all do, or some do, or none do, Leeroy Jenkins's doing so won't affect the outcome of the election.

hmmmm. I sense an interesting philosophical discussion. Respond when your left-coast ### wakes up, and I'll start a thread.

Seems like a mathematical discussion. Leeroy Jenkins can probably influence a couple dozen votes at the very most. When was the last time a state was decided by such a margin?

 

[Sweet J]

Do you think their votes will influence the outcome of the election? They won't.

whoa. hold on there, cowboy. Did mine ears just deceive me? If every strong supporter of one candidate convinced one fence-sitter he knew to vote his way, isn't that an influence on the election?

Leeroy Jenkins can't cause "every strong supporter" to convince their fence-sitting relatives. Whether they all do, or some do, or none do, Leeroy Jenkins's doing so won't affect the outcome of the election.

hmmmm. I sense an interesting philosophical discussion. Respond when your left-coast ### wakes up, and I'll start a thread.

Seems like a mathematical discussion. Leeroy Jenkins can probably influence a couple dozen votes at the very most. When was the last time a state was decided by such a margin?

I do think this warrants its own thread. Maurile has posted before, I think, something about mountains being made up by pebbles. I don't think it is as simple as "only a few votes."

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

Do you think their votes will influence the outcome of the election? They won't.

whoa. hold on there, cowboy. Did mine ears just deceive me? If every strong supporter of one candidate convinced one fence-sitter he knew to vote his way, isn't that an influence on the election?

Leeroy Jenkins can't cause "every strong supporter" to convince their fence-sitting relatives. Whether they all do, or some do, or none do, Leeroy Jenkins's doing so won't affect the outcome of the election.

hmmmm. I sense an interesting philosophical discussion. Respond when your left-coast ### wakes up, and I'll start a thread.

Feel free to start a thread, but I'll be in a mediation all day today, so I won't be able to participate until tonight or tomorrow.

 

[Jeremy]

If 1 Obama supporter out of every 10 can convince someone to switch to Obama from another candidate, or convert an undecided over to Obama, he'd be a lock. It's absolutely not a waste of time to try to get people on the bandwagon.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

I want to put together a little Vote For Obama packet to give to my family.

Don't answer me, just answer yourself: Why do you care how your family votes?Do you want to show them that they're wrong and you're right? If so, I'd try to overcome that urge and just drop it.Do you think their votes will influence the outcome of the election? They won't.Or do you want to turn them onto a candidate you think they might ultimately appreciate, but they don't currently have the resources or inclination to find out more about him? If this is the reason, I'd probably mention to them that you really like Obama, and tell you can give them links to (or printouts of) his better speeches if they want.But I wouldn't take it personally if they brush you off on this topic, and I wouldn't treat it like it's a big deal. JMHO.

Why have you spent hundreds of hours on this website trying to convince creationists that they're wrong?

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

I want to put together a little Vote For Obama packet to give to my family.

Don't answer me, just answer yourself: Why do you care how your family votes?Do you want to show them that they're wrong and you're right? If so, I'd try to overcome that urge and just drop it.Do you think their votes will influence the outcome of the election? They won't.Or do you want to turn them onto a candidate you think they might ultimately appreciate, but they don't currently have the resources or inclination to find out more about him? If this is the reason, I'd probably mention to them that you really like Obama, and tell you can give them links to (or printouts of) his better speeches if they want.But I wouldn't take it personally if they brush you off on this topic, and I wouldn't treat it like it's a big deal. JMHO.

Why have you spent hundreds of hours on this website trying to convince creationists that they're wrong?

So that bystanders will understand that creationist arguments are wrong. (I'm not trying to convince the creationists -- that's never been done before, and I don't expect to be the first. Just the bystanders.)But the difference is that the people I'm discussing that with are here looking to discuss it (and the onlookers are looking to read those discussions). I don't bring the issue up with my relatives, even though I suspect my uncle may be a creationist, and probably my niece as well. If they want to discuss it, I'm happy to -- but I suspect they don't.

 

[Sweet J]

Do you think their votes will influence the outcome of the election? They won't.

whoa. hold on there, cowboy. Did mine ears just deceive me? If every strong supporter of one candidate convinced one fence-sitter he knew to vote his way, isn't that an influence on the election?

Leeroy Jenkins can't cause "every strong supporter" to convince their fence-sitting relatives. Whether they all do, or some do, or none do, Leeroy Jenkins's doing so won't affect the outcome of the election.

Isn't this analogous to voting himself? It is an awful lot like saying, "Dude, sure, take the afternoon off to vote if you want to get out of the office. But don't bother to do it because you want to influence the outcome of the election. Your vote doesn't make a difference."