*** OFFICIAL *** Baseball Offseason Moves (2006-07)... (2 Viewers)

[ThisGuy]

What will you all say if Dotel/Gagne (FA) and Lieber (possible trade) come here....will those be mistakes too?????

If Gagne can pass a physical, he'd be a huge addition to that team. They've had a glaring need for a veteran closer for a while now.

It would be risky, but it's certainly worth a shot. A trade for Lieber is good if they aren't giving much up.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

What will you all say if Dotel/Gagne (FA) and Lieber (possible trade) come here....will those be mistakes too?????

Dotel would have to pay me to play if I was a GM. And then I'd stick him in AA for at least half a season before letting him see real game action. Gagne is a good risk if you can get him for middle relief price. Lieber is so-so. Overpaid, but pretty reliable if your expectations are reasonable.

The Cards are going to sign Dotel over the weekend, if you believe everything you read.

 

[Statorama]

What will you all say if Dotel/Gagne (FA) and Lieber (possible trade) come here....will those be mistakes too?????

Depends on what they pay them. This isn't difficult. at a KC fan screaming East Coast bias. There's no bias, your team just sucks.

 

[shadyridr]

Meche to the Royals. 5 yrs, $55 million.

Wow.

This is why teams like the Royals stay in the cellar forever. That's essentially the same contract that AJ Burnett is playing under IIRC ($11mil per). AJ > Gil. Is it THAT hard to get guys to come play in KC? Does Gil Meche @ 11 mil per really excite the KC faithful?

Spend 11 million on your scouting system and produce some actual players, and not simply just depend on getting a top ten slot in the draft every year.

This is Derrek Bell signing with the Pirates all over again.

Sorry for the KC fans, but this signing is the worst of the offseason...done by a team in desperate need of talent.

Glad I can take your hard hitting opinion to the bankthe fact is that NO ONE will say ANYTHING good about KC until they make the postseason. the east coast media doesn't care what happens here. KC could go and get Zito and people would say it was a bad signing.

Spending just to spend is hardly a defendable position. Sorry but Meche sucks. Take that money and throw it back into scouting. Send it to your season ticket holders as a rebate. Throw it into the streets of Kansas City. But giving it to Gil Meche is just insane. Credibility is also a factor in trying to get people to take your organization seriously. Moves like this aren't helping.

He's no worse than Padilla or Maddux (at this point) or Eaton or Lilly. If nothing else it's a start...plus if he's as average as everyone thinks, they can always trade him down the line since SP is always at a premium at the deadline.

Is this a fair comparison?Maddux > Lilly > Meche > Eaton > Padilla

 

[Kevin Ashcraft]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.

Do you all realize that KC's payroll has been 1/3 of that of even the Cardinals most seasons? Saving money is what has HURT this team and city for the last 10 years.

 

[shadyridr]

What will you all say if Dotel/Gagne (FA) and Lieber (possible trade) come here....will those be mistakes too?????

Dotel would have to pay me to play if I was a GM. And then I'd stick him in AA for at least half a season before letting him see real game action. Gagne is a good risk if you can get him for middle relief price. Lieber is so-so. Overpaid, but pretty reliable if your expectations are reasonable.

The Cards are going to sign Dotel over the weekend, if you believe everything you read.

We rehab him for a year and then we let him go

 

[Dan Gladden's Mustache]

Meche to the Royals. 5 yrs, $55 million.

Wow.

This is why teams like the Royals stay in the cellar forever. That's essentially the same contract that AJ Burnett is playing under IIRC ($11mil per). AJ > Gil. Is it THAT hard to get guys to come play in KC? Does Gil Meche @ 11 mil per really excite the KC faithful?

Spend 11 million on your scouting system and produce some actual players, and not simply just depend on getting a top ten slot in the draft every year.

This is Derrek Bell signing with the Pirates all over again.

Sorry for the KC fans, but this signing is the worst of the offseason...done by a team in desperate need of talent.

Glad I can take your hard hitting opinion to the bankthe fact is that NO ONE will say ANYTHING good about KC until they make the postseason. the east coast media doesn't care what happens here. KC could go and get Zito and people would say it was a bad signing.

Spending just to spend is hardly a defendable position. Sorry but Meche sucks. Take that money and throw it back into scouting. Send it to your season ticket holders as a rebate. Throw it into the streets of Kansas City. But giving it to Gil Meche is just insane. Credibility is also a factor in trying to get people to take your organization seriously. Moves like this aren't helping.

He's no worse than Padilla or Maddux (at this point) or Eaton or Lilly. If nothing else it's a start...plus if he's as average as everyone thinks, they can always trade him down the line since SP is always at a premium at the deadline.

Actually I'd argue that he is worse. He was a headcase in Seattle of Lohseian proportions and usually found himself sent to the minors (when he wasn't hurt) for portions of the season until last year. And last year all he did was get battered around in a pretty friendly home park for pitchers. I think brutal would be a kind word.

I like that.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

What will you all say if Dotel/Gagne (FA) and Lieber (possible trade) come here....will those be mistakes too?????

Dotel would have to pay me to play if I was a GM. And then I'd stick him in AA for at least half a season before letting him see real game action. Gagne is a good risk if you can get him for middle relief price. Lieber is so-so. Overpaid, but pretty reliable if your expectations are reasonable.

The Cards are going to sign Dotel over the weekend, if you believe everything you read.

We rehab him for a year and then we let him go

FAR from final. Speculation. They were speculating he or possibly Kolb (Word from the Cards was that they were close with a reliever).

 

[Kevin Ashcraft]

What will you all say if Dotel/Gagne (FA) and Lieber (possible trade) come here....will those be mistakes too?????

Depends on what they pay them. This isn't difficult. at a KC fan screaming East Coast bias. There's no bias, your team just sucks.

And they are trying to fix it buddy....and there is an east coast bias.

 

[Capella]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.Do you all realize that KC's payroll has been 1/2 of that of even the Cardinals most seasons? Saving money is what has HURT this team and city for the last 10 years.

The Rays spend less money than KC but have a brighter future. Stop spending all your money on crappy free agent signings like Mark Grudzelanwhatever, Reggie Sanders and Gil f'n Meche, rewind 3 years to trade Sweeney when he had value (seriously, keeping that guy was a disaster) and don't trade your most valuable chip in 20 years (Beltran) for a bunch of sucky players. That would be a start. Draft well, scout well, don't clog your system with 38-year-old has-beens and maybe you'll get somewhere. Would it kill you guys to develop some talent? You have top-5 picks every year, what do you guys spend them, Ho-Hos and twinkies? What a wreck that franchise is.

 

[shadyridr]

Meche to the Royals. 5 yrs, $55 million.

Wow.

This is why teams like the Royals stay in the cellar forever. That's essentially the same contract that AJ Burnett is playing under IIRC ($11mil per). AJ > Gil. Is it THAT hard to get guys to come play in KC? Does Gil Meche @ 11 mil per really excite the KC faithful?

Spend 11 million on your scouting system and produce some actual players, and not simply just depend on getting a top ten slot in the draft every year.

This is Derrek Bell signing with the Pirates all over again.

Sorry for the KC fans, but this signing is the worst of the offseason...done by a team in desperate need of talent.

Glad I can take your hard hitting opinion to the bankthe fact is that NO ONE will say ANYTHING good about KC until they make the postseason. the east coast media doesn't care what happens here. KC could go and get Zito and people would say it was a bad signing.

Spending just to spend is hardly a defendable position. Sorry but Meche sucks. Take that money and throw it back into scouting. Send it to your season ticket holders as a rebate. Throw it into the streets of Kansas City. But giving it to Gil Meche is just insane. Credibility is also a factor in trying to get people to take your organization seriously. Moves like this aren't helping.

He's no worse than Padilla or Maddux (at this point) or Eaton or Lilly. If nothing else it's a start...plus if he's as average as everyone thinks, they can always trade him down the line since SP is always at a premium at the deadline.

Actually I'd argue that he is worse. He was a headcase in Seattle of Lohseian proportions and usually found himself sent to the minors (when he wasn't hurt) for portions of the season until last year. And last year all he did was get battered around in a pretty friendly home park for pitchers. I think brutal would be a kind word.

Woah woah woah. I dont think he was THAT bad. Hes a solid middle to bottom of the rotation guy. Certainly better than Lohse. Maybe Im just biased cuz he always seemed to dominate vs the Yankees.

 

[Dan Gladden's Mustache]

Meche to the Royals. 5 yrs, $55 million.

Wow.

This is why teams like the Royals stay in the cellar forever. That's essentially the same contract that AJ Burnett is playing under IIRC ($11mil per). AJ > Gil. Is it THAT hard to get guys to come play in KC? Does Gil Meche @ 11 mil per really excite the KC faithful?

Spend 11 million on your scouting system and produce some actual players, and not simply just depend on getting a top ten slot in the draft every year.

This is Derrek Bell signing with the Pirates all over again.

Sorry for the KC fans, but this signing is the worst of the offseason...done by a team in desperate need of talent.

Glad I can take your hard hitting opinion to the bankthe fact is that NO ONE will say ANYTHING good about KC until they make the postseason. the east coast media doesn't care what happens here. KC could go and get Zito and people would say it was a bad signing.

Spending just to spend is hardly a defendable position. Sorry but Meche sucks. Take that money and throw it back into scouting. Send it to your season ticket holders as a rebate. Throw it into the streets of Kansas City. But giving it to Gil Meche is just insane. Credibility is also a factor in trying to get people to take your organization seriously. Moves like this aren't helping.

He's no worse than Padilla or Maddux (at this point) or Eaton or Lilly. If nothing else it's a start...plus if he's as average as everyone thinks, they can always trade him down the line since SP is always at a premium at the deadline.

Is this a fair comparison?Maddux > Lilly > Meche > Eaton > Padilla

I'd go with: Maddux > Lilly> Padilla > Meche > Eaton

 

[shadyridr]

What will you all say if Dotel/Gagne (FA) and Lieber (possible trade) come here....will those be mistakes too?????

Depends on what they pay them. This isn't difficult. at a KC fan screaming East Coast bias. There's no bias, your team just sucks.

And they are trying to fix it buddy....and there is an east coast bias.

By signing Meche to a 5yr, 55mil deal? If they really wanted to make a splash they shouldve thrown 20mil per year at Zito. At least they wouldve gotten something for their money then other than a bottom of the rotation guy.

 

[Funkley]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.

You don't see the Twins signing Gil Meche. Small market teams have to work smart, not just work. I'd imagine the Central division is looking at the Royals new ace and thinking "s##t, our guys are going to earn arbitration wins hitting against him."

 

[Capella]

What will you all say if Dotel/Gagne (FA) and Lieber (possible trade) come here....will those be mistakes too?????

Depends on what they pay them. This isn't difficult. at a KC fan screaming East Coast bias. There's no bias, your team just sucks.

And they are trying to fix it buddy....and there is an east coast bias.

What is there to be biased about? People tend to be biased towards teams that are good. Nobody is sitting around screaming about Temple football or the Columbus Blue Jackets.Hey man I really hate those Royals...they took one out of four from the Sox this week.

Yea ### #### them, I'm going to move them down in my power rankings this week.

Well...they're already 30th dude.

 

[Kevin Ashcraft]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.Do you all realize that KC's payroll has been 1/2 of that of even the Cardinals most seasons? Saving money is what has HURT this team and city for the last 10 years.

The Rays spend less money than KC but have a brighter future. Stop spending all your money on crappy free agent signings like Mark Grudzelanwhatever, Reggie Sanders and Gil f'n Meche, rewind 3 years to trade Sweeney when he had value (seriously, keeping that guy was a disaster) and don't trade your most valuable chip in 20 years (Beltran) for a bunch of sucky players. That would be a start. Draft well, scout well, don't clog your system with 38-year-old has-beens and maybe you'll get somewhere. Would it kill you guys to develop some talent? You have top-5 picks every year, what do you guys spend them, Ho-Hos and twinkies? What a wreck that franchise is.

i would have DONE THE SAME THING! BUT..........WE CANT CHANGE THE PAST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Statorama]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.Do you all realize that KC's payroll has been 1/2 of that of even the Cardinals most seasons? Saving money is what has HURT this team and city for the last 10 years.

It just seems like KC doesn't have a plan when they throw ace money to a #4 starter. There are better gambles. Hell, even throwing an $11mil contract at Bonds to have him be your full time DH would be a better gamble. He'll sell tickets, he'll break the HR record wearing a KC cap, and he might help you win some games. KC would be on a lot of sportscenter highlights, etc. That's the kind of thing I'm talking about. Tell me KC couldn't promote the hell out of having a hall of fame player in their lineup every night.

 

[Funkley]

Woah woah woah. I dont think he was THAT bad. Hes a solid middle to bottom of the rotation guy. Certainly better than Lohse. Maybe Im just biased cuz he always seemed to dominate vs the Yankees.

Kyle Lohse has done 3 things in his career that Meche has never done.Win at least 13 games twice.Finish with an ERA below 4.20Pitch at least 200 innings in a season. Game, set, match to Kyle ####ing Lohse.

 

[Keys Myaths]

Meche to the Royals. 5 yrs, $55 million.

Wow.

This is why teams like the Royals stay in the cellar forever. That's essentially the same contract that AJ Burnett is playing under IIRC ($11mil per). AJ > Gil. Is it THAT hard to get guys to come play in KC? Does Gil Meche @ 11 mil per really excite the KC faithful?

Spend 11 million on your scouting system and produce some actual players, and not simply just depend on getting a top ten slot in the draft every year.

This is Derrek Bell signing with the Pirates all over again.

Sorry for the KC fans, but this signing is the worst of the offseason...done by a team in desperate need of talent.

Glad I can take your hard hitting opinion to the bankthe fact is that NO ONE will say ANYTHING good about KC until they make the postseason. the east coast media doesn't care what happens here. KC could go and get Zito and people would say it was a bad signing.

Dude's WARP-1 over the last three seasons has been 2.5. His ERA two years ago was near SIX.

His VORP for last year was 18, good for SEVENTH on his own team! The Mariners weren't exactly the hallmark of the AL last year. That was also good for 132nd in the major leagues, BEHIND such studs as Ruddy Lugo, Jake Woods, Scott Linebrink and Ramon Ramirez.

I'm from Missouri, so no east coast bias. This was just a bad, bad signing.

 

[Kevin Ashcraft]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.Do you all realize that KC's payroll has been 1/2 of that of even the Cardinals most seasons? Saving money is what has HURT this team and city for the last 10 years.

It just seems like KC doesn't have a plan when they throw ace money to a #4 starter. There are better gambles. Hell, even throwing an $11mil contract at Bonds to have him be your full time DH would be a better gamble. He'll sell tickets, he'll break the HR record wearing a KC cap, and he might help you win some games. KC would be on a lot of sportscenter highlights, etc. That's the kind of thing I'm talking about. Tell me KC couldn't promote the hell out of having a hall of fame player in their lineup every night.

He might get shot here with his views in things...so that would be a "no thanks"Now, signing Soriano, I would have been all for that

 

[Tough As Nails]

What will you all say if Dotel/Gagne (FA) and Lieber (possible trade) come here....will those be mistakes too?????

Dotel would have to pay me to play if I was a GM. And then I'd stick him in AA for at least half a season before letting him see real game action. Gagne is a good risk if you can get him for middle relief price. Lieber is so-so. Overpaid, but pretty reliable if your expectations are reasonable.

The Cards are going to sign Dotel over the weekend, if you believe everything you read.

We rehab him for a year and then we let him go

FAR from final. Speculation. They were speculating he or possibly Kolb (Word from the Cards was that they were close with a reliever).

The only thing I can see in the future of Dotel that would make him worth anything is a $600k contract (with some incentives for appearances that could maybe double it) and a long stint in the minors. Dude had nasty stuff for about 3 years there...but has completely lost it with the injury problems. I wouldn't want him in a game unless I saw him throw 75 successful innings in the minors at a bare minimum. He'll probably get $2 million a year in this market. THAT would be a blunder.

 

[shadyridr]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.

Do you all realize that KC's payroll has been 1/2 of that of even the Cardinals most seasons? Saving money is what has HURT this team and city for the last 10 years.

It just seems like KC doesn't have a plan when they throw ace money to a #4 starter. There are better gambles. Hell, even throwing an $11mil contract at Bonds to have him be your full time DH would be a better gamble. He'll sell tickets, he'll break the HR record wearing a KC cap, and he might help you win some games. KC would be on a lot of sportscenter highlights, etc. That's the kind of thing I'm talking about. Tell me KC couldn't promote the hell out of having a hall of fame player in their lineup every night.

To be fair he wouldve gotten that kind of money from another team (not saying it wouldnt have been a mistake)

 

[Northern Voice]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.

Do you all realize that KC's payroll has been 1/2 of that of even the Cardinals most seasons? Saving money is what has HURT this team and city for the last 10 years.

It just seems like KC doesn't have a plan when they throw ace money to a #4 starter. There are better gambles. Hell, even throwing an $11mil contract at Bonds to have him be your full time DH would be a better gamble. He'll sell tickets, he'll break the HR record wearing a KC cap, and he might help you win some games. KC would be on a lot of sportscenter highlights, etc. That's the kind of thing I'm talking about. Tell me KC couldn't promote the hell out of having a hall of fame player in their lineup every night.

To be fair he wouldve gotten that kind of money from another team (not saying it wouldnt have been a mistake)

Of course on those other teams he would have actually been a #4 starter.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Do you all realize that KC's payroll has been 1/3 of that of even the Cardinals most seasons? Saving money is what has HURT this team and city for the last 10 years.

You're going to use the Cardinals method of building a team to justify this contract?Do you realize the Cardinals haven't signed a big money free agent for... I can't even recall a name to throw out to you?

Isringhausen and Encarnacion have probably been the biggest in the last 10 years. And I think those were something like a 4 year, $30 million and 3 years, $15 million. Not exactly bank breakers.

Pujols - Farm

Mulder - trade

Edmonds - trade, then sign to extension

Rolen - same

Carpenter - rehab at low cost, then extend

Those have been the Cardinals big money players.

 

[Sammy3469]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.

You don't see the Twins signing Gil Meche. Small market teams have to work smart, not just work. I'd imagine the Central division is looking at the Royals new ace and thinking "s##t, our guys are going to earn arbitration wins hitting against him."

Is this the same smartness that got Liriano injuried?

 

[Funkley]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.

You don't see the Twins signing Gil Meche. Small market teams have to work smart, not just work. I'd imagine the Central division is looking at the Royals new ace and thinking "s##t, our guys are going to earn arbitration wins hitting against him."

Is this the same smartness that got Liriano injuried?

He was going to need TJ anyway. You don't heal a tear to ulnar nerve w/o surgery. Besides, do I really need to trot out all the names the Twins have been right on?

 

[Statorama]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.

Do you all realize that KC's payroll has been 1/2 of that of even the Cardinals most seasons? Saving money is what has HURT this team and city for the last 10 years.

It just seems like KC doesn't have a plan when they throw ace money to a #4 starter. There are better gambles. Hell, even throwing an $11mil contract at Bonds to have him be your full time DH would be a better gamble. He'll sell tickets, he'll break the HR record wearing a KC cap, and he might help you win some games. KC would be on a lot of sportscenter highlights, etc. That's the kind of thing I'm talking about. Tell me KC couldn't promote the hell out of having a hall of fame player in their lineup every night.

To be fair he wouldve gotten that kind of money from another team (not saying it wouldnt have been a mistake)

Yeah, but if the Yankees sign him for that and he never pitches an inning, NY won't feel the bite. If the same thing happens in KC, it would be devastating for them.The blueprints are there for KC to be a successful franchise. The Twins and A's manage to be in the hunt for a post season berth every season, with small payrolls. Heck, even look at a team like the Marlins. They go for broke every 5 years and win a championship. Or Cleveland, that grows their own talent and signs it long term. There are several plans out there for them to choose from. If a small market team like KC takes the plan of a team like the Cubs, they're doomed.

 

[Sammy3469]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.

You don't see the Twins signing Gil Meche. Small market teams have to work smart, not just work. I'd imagine the Central division is looking at the Royals new ace and thinking "s##t, our guys are going to earn arbitration wins hitting against him."

Is this the same smartness that got Liriano injuried?

He was going to need TJ anyway. You don't heal a tear to ulnar nerve w/o surgery. Besides, do I really need to trot out all the names the Twins have been right on?

 

[Funkley]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.

You don't see the Twins signing Gil Meche. Small market teams have to work smart, not just work. I'd imagine the Central division is looking at the Royals new ace and thinking "s##t, our guys are going to earn arbitration wins hitting against him."

Is this the same smartness that got Liriano injuried?

He was going to need TJ anyway. You don't heal a tear to ulnar nerve w/o surgery. Besides, do I really need to trot out all the names the Twins have been right on?

Exactly, let's not argue and bicker over who killed who. This is a Royals bashing thread.

 

[Dan Gladden's Mustache]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.

You don't see the Twins signing Gil Meche. Small market teams have to work smart, not just work. I'd imagine the Central division is looking at the Royals new ace and thinking "s##t, our guys are going to earn arbitration wins hitting against him."

Is this the same smartness that got Liriano injuried?

He was going to need TJ anyway. You don't heal a tear to ulnar nerve w/o surgery. Besides, do I really need to trot out all the names the Twins have been right on?

Les StrakerPat Mahomes

Willie Banks

 

[Tremendous Upside]

One additonal Rule V pick I haven't seen analyzed here...

Yanks select former Baseball Prospectus cover boy Josh Phelps...

I think he has a chance to stick...

He's a better righty bat than Andy Phillips anyway...

 

[Funkley]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.

You don't see the Twins signing Gil Meche. Small market teams have to work smart, not just work. I'd imagine the Central division is looking at the Royals new ace and thinking "s##t, our guys are going to earn arbitration wins hitting against him."

Is this the same smartness that got Liriano injuried?

He was going to need TJ anyway. You don't heal a tear to ulnar nerve w/o surgery. Besides, do I really need to trot out all the names the Twins have been right on?

Les StrakerPat Mahomes

Willie Banks

Thanks for not mentioning Ortiz. GB.

 

[Sammy3469]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.

You don't see the Twins signing Gil Meche. Small market teams have to work smart, not just work. I'd imagine the Central division is looking at the Royals new ace and thinking "s##t, our guys are going to earn arbitration wins hitting against him."

Is this the same smartness that got Liriano injuried?

He was going to need TJ anyway. You don't heal a tear to ulnar nerve w/o surgery. Besides, do I really need to trot out all the names the Twins have been right on?

Exactly, let's not argue and bicker over who killed who. This is a Royals bashing thread.

That's like kicking the dead dog in the corner though...can we bash a team that I actually see on TV like oh....the Cubs?

 

[Funkley]

One additonal Rule V pick I haven't seen analyzed here...Yanks select former Baseball Prospectus cover boy Josh Phelps...I think he has a chance to stick...He's a better righty bat than Andy Phillips anyway...

I've thought that he'd stick eveywhere he's landed and he just keeps failing.

 

[Yankee23Fan]

What will you all say if Dotel/Gagne (FA) and Lieber (possible trade) come here....will those be mistakes too?????

If I was KC I would love to get Gagne. If he can even regain 75% of his form he's 1000000 times better then anything they've had for years and will give the SP's a lot of confidence. He might be a building block.

 

[Sammy3469]

One additonal Rule V pick I haven't seen analyzed here...Yanks select former Baseball Prospectus cover boy Josh Phelps...I think he has a chance to stick...He's a better righty bat than Andy Phillips anyway...

BP seems to agree. I thought Phillips was going to be the "savior" at first.

 

[Funkley]

That's like kicking the dead dog in the corner though...can we bash a team that I actually see on TV like oh....the Cubs?

It's a good point, they've gotten by way too lightly on the Lilly signing. Only slightly less stupid than Meche with the edge going to the Tribune Co. who print their own money.

 

[ThisGuy]

One additonal Rule V pick I haven't seen analyzed here...Yanks select former Baseball Prospectus cover boy Josh Phelps...I think he has a chance to stick...He's a better righty bat than Andy Phillips anyway...

BP seems to agree. I thought Phillips was going to be the "savior" at first.

Converted 2nd basemen aren't usually saviors at 1B.

 

[Kevin Ashcraft]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.

Do you all realize that KC's payroll has been 1/2 of that of even the Cardinals most seasons? Saving money is what has HURT this team and city for the last 10 years.

It just seems like KC doesn't have a plan when they throw ace money to a #4 starter. There are better gambles. Hell, even throwing an $11mil contract at Bonds to have him be your full time DH would be a better gamble. He'll sell tickets, he'll break the HR record wearing a KC cap, and he might help you win some games. KC would be on a lot of sportscenter highlights, etc. That's the kind of thing I'm talking about. Tell me KC couldn't promote the hell out of having a hall of fame player in their lineup every night.

To be fair he wouldve gotten that kind of money from another team (not saying it wouldnt have been a mistake)

Yeah, but if the Yankees sign him for that and he never pitches an inning, NY won't feel the bite. If the same thing happens in KC, it would be devastating for them.The blueprints are there for KC to be a successful franchise. The Twins and A's manage to be in the hunt for a post season berth every season, with small payrolls. Heck, even look at a team like the Marlins. They go for broke every 5 years and win a championship. Or Cleveland, that grows their own talent and signs it long term. There are several plans out there for them to choose from. If a small market team like KC takes the plan of a team like the Cubs, they're doomed.

A do agree here for the most part....s I have another question for the masses who hate the Meche deal....Did you all crap on the Bannister deal also? Because I was happy with the deal.

What did you think the deal getting Tyler Lumbsden for Macdougal?

We also have acquired Huber, Teahan, Shealy and others via trade.

I would really like to hear honest assessments, because IIRC, many of thsoe moves were deemed as stupid and short-sighted by many people.

 

[Tremendous Upside]

One additonal Rule V pick I haven't seen analyzed here...Yanks select former Baseball Prospectus cover boy Josh Phelps...I think he has a chance to stick...He's a better righty bat than Andy Phillips anyway...

BP seems to agree. I thought Phillips was going to be the "savior" at first.

I think the Yanks liked Phillips' glove and hoped he'd hit enough to warrant PT given pretty solid .300+ seasons at AAA...I think the 250 ABs he got last year showed he is a quad A player...He had a sub .300 OBP and was often useless at the plate...Now I'm not saying Phelps is the be all and end all, but even despite hiss bouncing around, he's vener been truly bad anywhere he's been, just disappointing...Well worth the claiming fee, IMO...

 

[Funkley]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.

Do you all realize that KC's payroll has been 1/2 of that of even the Cardinals most seasons? Saving money is what has HURT this team and city for the last 10 years.

It just seems like KC doesn't have a plan when they throw ace money to a #4 starter. There are better gambles. Hell, even throwing an $11mil contract at Bonds to have him be your full time DH would be a better gamble. He'll sell tickets, he'll break the HR record wearing a KC cap, and he might help you win some games. KC would be on a lot of sportscenter highlights, etc. That's the kind of thing I'm talking about. Tell me KC couldn't promote the hell out of having a hall of fame player in their lineup every night.

To be fair he wouldve gotten that kind of money from another team (not saying it wouldnt have been a mistake)

Yeah, but if the Yankees sign him for that and he never pitches an inning, NY won't feel the bite. If the same thing happens in KC, it would be devastating for them.The blueprints are there for KC to be a successful franchise. The Twins and A's manage to be in the hunt for a post season berth every season, with small payrolls. Heck, even look at a team like the Marlins. They go for broke every 5 years and win a championship. Or Cleveland, that grows their own talent and signs it long term. There are several plans out there for them to choose from. If a small market team like KC takes the plan of a team like the Cubs, they're doomed.

A do agree here for the most part....s I have another question for the masses who hate the Meche deal....Did you all crap on the Bannister deal also? Because I was happy with the deal.

What did you think the deal getting Tyler Lumbsden for Macdougal?

We also have acquired Huber, Teahan, Shealy and others via trade.

I would really like to hear honest assessments, because IIRC, many of thsoe moves were deemed as stupid and short-sighted by many people.

Shealy was a steal and after almost ruining Teahan they got lucky that he rebounded and had a nice season. Burgos was a headcase but he's got an amazing arm. Bannister can't break glass with his fastball and will get ##### slapped playing against the AL Central. Trading a legit arm for average is always bad for a team re-building. I'm not a big fan of Burgos but Bannister is the suck. Poor use of assets there.

 

[Tremendous Upside]

Well, KC cannot win either way maybe the solution is to close up shop until they don't suck? What do you want them to do? Putting the money in scouting is all well and good and I think the new GM is on his way to doing that, but to tell a team that they should not be signing FA's is asanine.

Do you all realize that KC's payroll has been 1/2 of that of even the Cardinals most seasons? Saving money is what has HURT this team and city for the last 10 years.

It just seems like KC doesn't have a plan when they throw ace money to a #4 starter. There are better gambles. Hell, even throwing an $11mil contract at Bonds to have him be your full time DH would be a better gamble. He'll sell tickets, he'll break the HR record wearing a KC cap, and he might help you win some games. KC would be on a lot of sportscenter highlights, etc. That's the kind of thing I'm talking about. Tell me KC couldn't promote the hell out of having a hall of fame player in their lineup every night.

To be fair he wouldve gotten that kind of money from another team (not saying it wouldnt have been a mistake)

Yeah, but if the Yankees sign him for that and he never pitches an inning, NY won't feel the bite. If the same thing happens in KC, it would be devastating for them.The blueprints are there for KC to be a successful franchise. The Twins and A's manage to be in the hunt for a post season berth every season, with small payrolls. Heck, even look at a team like the Marlins. They go for broke every 5 years and win a championship. Or Cleveland, that grows their own talent and signs it long term. There are several plans out there for them to choose from. If a small market team like KC takes the plan of a team like the Cubs, they're doomed.

A do agree here for the most part....s I have another question for the masses who hate the Meche deal....Did you all crap on the Bannister deal also? Because I was happy with the deal.

What did you think the deal getting Tyler Lumbsden for Macdougal?

We also have acquired Huber, Teahan, Shealy and others via trade.

I would really like to hear honest assessments, because IIRC, many of thsoe moves were deemed as stupid and short-sighted by many people.

I think the Bannister deal was fine, as was the Lumbsden one...But the thing is, they are low risk deals with decent potential reward for the Royals...The Meche signing almost cannot help but strangle the team...

In order to be "worth" his money, he has to significantly outperform his entire resume to date...That just doesn't happen too frequently with 800 major league innings uner his belt...

For a team with the limited resources of the Royals to tie up this much $$ in Meche is just awful, there's no other way around it...

This signing will remove any flexibility they have for the length of the deal...

 

[Kevin Ashcraft]

Final post on this......I posted this on another board and I think it is a valid argument......

What if, just for the sake of argument, Meche becomes a decent SP...I am talking 3.7-ish ERA, throws 180 innings and is relatively injury-free?

Would it still be a bad move? Probably not.

The point is, that too many times, armchair GMs on message boards think they know more than a real GM. What is to say meche doesn't rebound back to pre-2000 form.............

[waits for answer]

That is right, there is nothing to say that he does or he doesn't. So why don't you hold off on crapping or applauding every deal 5 minutes after it happens.

 

[Tremendous Upside]

Final post on this......I posted this on another board and I think it is a valid argument......What if, just for the sake of argument, Meche becomes a decent SP...I am talking 3.7-ish ERA, throws 180 innings and is relatively injury-free?Would it still be a bad move? Probably not.The point is, that too many times, armchair GMs on message boards think they know more than a real GM. What is to say meche doesn't rebound back to pre-2000 form.............[waits for answer]That is right, there is nothing to say that he does or he doesn't. So why don't you hold off on crapping or applauding every deal 5 minutes after it happens.

You mean his sterling 1999 season when he had a 4.73 ERA in 85 innings?Ahhh, those were the days...

 

[Dan Gladden's Mustache]

Final post on this......I posted this on another board and I think it is a valid argument......

What if, just for the sake of argument, Meche becomes a decent SP...I am talking 3.7-ish ERA, throws 180 innings and is relatively injury-free?

Would it still be a bad move? Probably not.

The point is, that too many times, armchair GMs on message boards think they know more than a real GM. What is to say meche doesn't rebound back to pre-2000 form.............

[waits for answer]

That is right, there is nothing to say that he does or he doesn't. So why don't you hold off on crapping or applauding every deal 5 minutes after it happens.

So you want us to not discuss things on a message board? Interesting.

 

[shadyridr]

I wouldnt mind the Yankees signing Hillenbrand to play 1B but who knows how much ####### money he wants.

 

[Kevin Ashcraft]

For a team with the limited resources of the Royals to tie up this much $$ in Meche is just awful, there's no other way around it...This signing will remove any flexibility they have for the length of the deal...

The Royals DO NOT have limited resources. They have a cheap owner, who has never spent any money. KC had one of the highest payrolls in MLB until 1995, when Ewing Kaufman died....they left it to Glass and he promptly traded David Cone...Glass has the money, it is just that he is cheap. That is what you will hear from any KC fan. We could have paid Damon, Dye, Beltran, etc but we CHOSE not to.

 

[Funkley]

Final post on this......I posted this on another board and I think it is a valid argument......What if, just for the sake of argument, Meche becomes a decent SP...I am talking 3.7-ish ERA, throws 180 innings and is relatively injury-free?Would it still be a bad move? Probably not.The point is, that too many times, armchair GMs on message boards think they know more than a real GM. What is to say meche doesn't rebound back to pre-2000 form.............[waits for answer]That is right, there is nothing to say that he does or he doesn't. So why don't you hold off on crapping or applauding every deal 5 minutes after it happens.

Sure. *If* he adds 25 lbs of muscle and improves his 40 time he could be a good RB too. Equally as likely.There's nothing in Meche's track record to suggest this type of improvement can occur and remember, he's moving to a more friendly hitting park (mainly because of KC's pitching, lol) and a worse defense. But yeah, it could happen.

 

[shadyridr]

Final post on this......I posted this on another board and I think it is a valid argument......

What if, just for the sake of argument, Meche becomes a decent SP...I am talking 3.7-ish ERA, throws 180 innings and is relatively injury-free?

Would it still be a bad move? Probably not.

The point is, that too many times, armchair GMs on message boards think they know more than a real GM. What is to say meche doesn't rebound back to pre-2000 form.............

[waits for answer]

That is right, there is nothing to say that he does or he doesn't. So why don't you hold off on crapping or applauding every deal 5 minutes after it happens.

What pre-2000 form?

 

[Tremendous Upside]

Final post on this......I posted this on another board and I think it is a valid argument......What if, just for the sake of argument, Meche becomes a decent SP...I am talking 3.7-ish ERA, throws 180 innings and is relatively injury-free?Would it still be a bad move? Probably not.The point is, that too many times, armchair GMs on message boards think they know more than a real GM. What is to say meche doesn't rebound back to pre-2000 form.............[waits for answer]That is right, there is nothing to say that he does or he doesn't. So why don't you hold off on crapping or applauding every deal 5 minutes after it happens.

And by the way, when your defense of a signing is, "maybe he'll pitch as mediocrely as he did 6 years ago and not as God-awfully as he has since," you should probably just give up on defending the signing...