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*** Official Chargers 2023 Thread - Had A VERY Nice Season *** (1 Viewer)

Gr00vus

Footballguy
After another humiliating kick in the crotch for Charger fans in the form of a top 3 all time NFL playoffs choke job, we move on into the baseless hope of another championshipless offseason.

We begin the offseason saying goodbye to Joe Lombardi and Shane Day, who oversaw an offense that couldn't score in the 3rd quarter and a regression in form of franchise quarterback Justin Herbert. I have no idea who the new coaches will be, and I'm still hoping Staley gets shown the door too (not going to happen), but can they be any worse than the folks responsible for the Bandy jet sweep on 3rd an inches? I want to believe they can't be, but this is the Chargers - so it's probably a 50/50 proposition they get someone even worse.

@Just Win Baby has made us painfully aware of the dire salary cap situation - not much light at the end of that tunnel.

My real question is, besides myself, what Charger fans are left? And why?

Another question I have is what would a coach like Bill Cowher have done to Joey Bosa after his juvenile temper tantrums damaged his team's chances to win a playoff game?
 
Great column IMO: Column: Los Angeles move hasn’t made Chargers big-time winners, so far

Excerpt:

The Los Angeles Chargers show zero AFC West titles in six tries, and you wonder how many more NFL favors and lucky breaks it’ll take for Roger Goodell and the Spanoses to finally celebrate some sort of big splash...

New zip code, same M.O.

When it has come to hiring a head coach and deciding who has the most football clout within their braintrust, the Spanoses may as well still be in San Diego.

They still don’t hire as their head coach anyone who’s gone to a Super Bowl as a head coach.

(Hey, we like young risers, too. Everyone needs to start somewhere, right? A factoid to nibble on: the Chargers’ past three playoffs losses have come against a head coach who’d taken a team to Super Bowl. First was John Fox, nine years ago in Denver; followed by Bill Belichick five years later in New England; and Doug Pederson on Saturday.)

As with Mike McCoy when he took over as the final San Diego Chargers head coach, L.A.-era hires Anthony Lynn and Brandon Staley were new to full-time head coaching, period. Their salaries, coincidentally or not, were near the NFL’s bottom, as was true of several other Spanos hires.

Similarly, relocation to Greater L.A. didn’t change the top bosses’ belief in maintaining a powerful front office. Whoever got the head coaching job wouldn’t be as pushy as, say, Sean McVay, the Rams’ hire who had the NFL chops to throw his weight around even as a first-time head coach. As former NFL GM and Chargers exec Randy Mueller has described the Spanos prototype and manual for a head coach, he’s “more of an assistant, kind of box him in, stay in your lane type, instead of just letting him run with it.”
 
Joey Bosa had another infantile behavioral episode this weekend, getting into it with some Eagles fans (while Joey and his girl were in full 49ers regalia). You can check the innerwebs for more details, I don't want to soil this thread further with it. I've said it before, he's not worth what he's being paid.

More importantly, Herbert had surgery to repair a torn labrum in his non-throwing shoulder. I guess he'd had that injury for like the last month of the season. I know things weren't going to heal up missing a few extra series, but playing him long into the 2nd half of the last Broncos game seems even more stupid given this news.
 
Rappaport reporting that the Chargers have signed Kellen Moore to be the OC.

Can our resident Cowboys heads chime in on whether this will be good for the Chargers?
That last gasp trick play where Zeke was steam rolled doesn't inspire confidence. But as a BSU grad, I like it. I certainly like it better than any of the 19 Rams coaches they were interviewing. Now we just need a blocker or two and someone who can get open down the field.
The list of people they had approached prior to Moore was uninspiring to put it mildly.
 
Ryan Clark just absolutely shredding the hire on ESPN. Says his offense is terrible and he only got the job because of who his agent is.

To be honest, that makes me like the hire more. When is the last time Ryan Clark was ever right about any meaningful coaching hires? Has it ever happened?
 
Ryan Clark just absolutely shredding the hire on ESPN. Says his offense is terrible and he only got the job because of who his agent is.
They were 11th in yards and 4th in points this year, and that was with a healthy dose of Cooper Rush. 1st in both categories last year.
 
Hiring your next head coach and putting him on the staff of your current head coach is the most Chargery thing the Chargers could have done.
 
The parting of ways between Kellen Moore and the Cowboys worked out well for the Chargers. It's not often that an accomplished offensive coordinator seemingly on the upswing of his career is available for a lateral hire.

I've been (silently) critical of Joe Lombardi as the Chargers' OC for the last season and a half. (It took me half a season to catch on.) So I'm not defending him, exactly, but I see people on Twitter citing various stats that don't paint a fair picture of his tenure, IMO.

The two criticisms I most commonly see are:

1. Under Lombardi, the Chargers have lacked a balanced offense: their pass-run ratio has been too high.

2. Under Lombardi, Herbert's average depth of target has been too low.

If point number one is an indirect way of asserting that the Chargers' running game has been weirdly inefficient given the generally competent run-blockers and the borderline elite running back on the roster, I agree. It has been weirdly inefficient. But given the inefficiency, I think the idea that the pass-run ratio was too high is off the mark. An offense should do what works. If passing works for you better than running does, that's an argument in favor of passing more.

Number two hints at a frustrating reality, but it fails to take point number one into account. It's true that, under Lombardi, Herbert hasn't thrown the ball downfield enough. For my tastes, there have been way too many six-yard passes on third and ten. So the spirit of the criticism is on point, but I don't think raw aDOT makes the case very well. A lot of those zero-DOT passes are just rushing attempts in disguise. Technically, the way stats are kept, the Chargers' pass-run ratio has been high and their aDOT has been low. But if you count the zero-DOT passes as runs instead of passes, as they morally are, the pass-run ratio goes down and the aDOT goes up.

A better measure of the passing game's overly conservative nature would be something like longish passes per offensive play (not per pass attempt). Give a point for attempted passes between 12-25 yards downfield and two points for attempted passes 26+ yards downfield and divide by team offensive snaps. I suspect the Chargers would be on the low end of that stat as well, though not by as much as they are with aDOT, and that would be a better reflection of the frustrating reality hinted at by point number two.
 
Well he wasn’t unemployed for long.

I thought that was a scapegoat move. Moore didn’t kneecap the OL or cause Dak to throw mind-boggling interceptions.

LAC was smart to pounce on him. Moore showed plenty of times how dangerous his offenses can be when the team is clicking. Even with the OL injuries, he got an awful lot of juice out of that offense.
 
I thought that was a scapegoat move.
I don't think it's really like that.

Retaining Moore as OC was always a condition of McCarthy accepting the HC job. That's not an easy ask for an offensive minded head coach. The offense that Dallas has been running was Moore's version, not McCarthy's. I've been hearing for years this has made McCarthy uneasy and he yearned for more control of the offense.

This is why I said in some earlier post when Moore did not get the Carolina job the second most disappointed person was McCarthy.

I know people tend to scoff at announced mutual partings as PR BS but I think it's genuine in this case. McCarthy wanted more control of the offense, and Moore knew he had plenty of suitors. Win/win for everyone.
 
I thought that was a scapegoat move.
I don't think it's really like that.

Retaining Moore as OC was always a condition of McCarthy accepting the HC job. That's not an easy ask for an offensive minded head coach. The offense that Dallas has been running was Moore's version, not McCarthy's. I've been hearing for years this has made McCarthy uneasy and he yearned for more control of the offense.

This is why I said in some earlier post when Moore did not get the Carolina job the second most disappointed person was McCarthy.

I know people tend to scoff at announced mutual partings as PR BS but I think it's genuine in this case. McCarthy wanted more control of the offense, and Moore knew he had plenty of suitors. Win/win for everyone.
Certainly possible.

I’m not sure McCarthy is a better OC than Moore, but you could absolutely be correct.

It just seemed like the “who’s gonna get the axe in DAL” rumblings started almost immediately after that game. Jones was cagey about it, too.

That gave me this impression. But yeah, maybe it was mutual.
 
The parting of ways between Kellen Moore and the Cowboys worked out well for the Chargers. It's not often that an accomplished offensive coordinator seemingly on the upswing of his career is available for a lateral hire.

I've been (silently) critical of Joe Lombardi as the Chargers' OC for the last season and a half. (It took me half a season to catch on.) So I'm not defending him, exactly, but I see people on Twitter citing various stats that don't paint a fair picture of his tenure, IMO.

The two criticisms I most commonly see are:

1. Under Lombardi, the Chargers have lacked a balanced offense: their pass-run ratio has been too high.

2. Under Lombardi, Herbert's average depth of target has been too low.

If point number one is an indirect way of asserting that the Chargers' running game has been weirdly inefficient given the generally competent run-blockers and the borderline elite running back on the roster, I agree. It has been weirdly inefficient. But given the inefficiency, I think the idea that the pass-run ratio was too high is off the mark. An offense should do what works. If passing works for you better than running does, that's an argument in favor of passing more.

Number two hints at a frustrating reality, but it fails to take point number one into account. It's true that, under Lombardi, Herbert hasn't thrown the ball downfield enough. For my tastes, there have been way too many six-yard passes on third and ten. So the spirit of the criticism is on point, but I don't think raw aDOT makes the case very well. A lot of those zero-DOT passes are just rushing attempts in disguise. Technically, the way stats are kept, the Chargers' pass-run ratio has been high and their aDOT has been low. But if you count the zero-DOT passes as runs instead of passes, as they morally are, the pass-run ratio goes down and the aDOT goes up.

A better measure of the passing game's overly conservative nature would be something like longish passes per offensive play (not per pass attempt). Give a point for attempted passes between 12-25 yards downfield and two points for attempted passes 26+ yards downfield and divide by team offensive snaps. I suspect the Chargers would be on the low end of that stat as well, though not by as much as they are with aDOT, and that would be a better reflection of the frustrating reality hinted at by point number two.
This is a terse response to your thoughtful post, I don't think the Chargers are even average at run blocking. I don't have access to the football insiders data, but my eyes tell me they're a bad run blocking team. I think they were marginally better with Slater, but still a weakness that needs to be addressed (or they continue to replace straight runs with short passes).
 
The parting of ways between Kellen Moore and the Cowboys worked out well for the Chargers. It's not often that an accomplished offensive coordinator seemingly on the upswing of his career is available for a lateral hire.

I've been (silently) critical of Joe Lombardi as the Chargers' OC for the last season and a half. (It took me half a season to catch on.) So I'm not defending him, exactly, but I see people on Twitter citing various stats that don't paint a fair picture of his tenure, IMO.

The two criticisms I most commonly see are:

1. Under Lombardi, the Chargers have lacked a balanced offense: their pass-run ratio has been too high.

2. Under Lombardi, Herbert's average depth of target has been too low.

If point number one is an indirect way of asserting that the Chargers' running game has been weirdly inefficient given the generally competent run-blockers and the borderline elite running back on the roster, I agree. It has been weirdly inefficient. But given the inefficiency, I think the idea that the pass-run ratio was too high is off the mark. An offense should do what works. If passing works for you better than running does, that's an argument in favor of passing more.

Number two hints at a frustrating reality, but it fails to take point number one into account. It's true that, under Lombardi, Herbert hasn't thrown the ball downfield enough. For my tastes, there have been way too many six-yard passes on third and ten. So the spirit of the criticism is on point, but I don't think raw aDOT makes the case very well. A lot of those zero-DOT passes are just rushing attempts in disguise. Technically, the way stats are kept, the Chargers' pass-run ratio has been high and their aDOT has been low. But if you count the zero-DOT passes as runs instead of passes, as they morally are, the pass-run ratio goes down and the aDOT goes up.

A better measure of the passing game's overly conservative nature would be something like longish passes per offensive play (not per pass attempt). Give a point for attempted passes between 12-25 yards downfield and two points for attempted passes 26+ yards downfield and divide by team offensive snaps. I suspect the Chargers would be on the low end of that stat as well, though not by as much as they are with aDOT, and that would be a better reflection of the frustrating reality hinted at by point number two.

I think there are other legit criticisms besides these two:
  • Lack of explosive plays, in both the passing game and running game
  • Poor red zone performance
  • Lack of creativity and diversity in play calling, route combinations, etc.
  • Inexplicable periods with very little play action despite that being proven effective even without an effective running game
  • Not moving Herbert more, like designed rollouts (understand his injury probably affected this for much of 2022)
  • Personnel usage, like basically not using Guyton in the first 2 games before he got hurt in game 3, using Daniel instead of Stick in week 18, etc.
These examples apply to varying degrees, and some are more important than others. And no doubt this is partly on player execution and affected by injuries, not wholly on Lombardi. But it was Lombardi's offense, so he was accountable for all of it. And we already had a precedent for some of it with Lombardi from his time as Lions OC, so that helped to show it wasn't a fluke.

As for your #2, I agree ADoT doesn't necessarily tell the whole story, but it's not a bad proxy IMO. Consider the splits on Herbert's pass attempts:
  • 2021 - 672 pass attempts
    • Long (20+ yards beyond LOS) - 64 (9.5%)
    • Medium (10-19) - 134 (19.9%)
    • Short (0-9) - 344 (51.2%)
    • Behind LOS - 82 (12.2%)
  • 2022 - 743 pass attempts
    • Long (20+) - 73 (9.8%)
    • Medium (10-19) - 127 (17.1%)
    • Short (0-9) - 339 (45.6%)
    • Behind LOS - 134 (18.0%)
Herbert had 71 more pass attempts in 2022 than in 2021. He had 52 more pass attempts behind the LOS, which seems to match your point about "zero DOT" attempts substituting for the running game. But I don't think the trend shown here of reducing medium attempts in particular was a good thing.

You also mentioned throwing short of the sticks on 3rd down. Per Next Gen Stats:
  • AYTS Air Yards to the Sticks (AYTS) is defined as "the amount of Air Yards ahead or behind the first down marker on all attempts for a passer. The metric indicates if the passer is attempting his passes past the 1st down marker, or if he is relying on his skill position players to make yards after catch."
  • 2021 - Among 38 QBs with 135+ passing attempts, Herbert ranked #18 at -0.9
  • 2022 - Among 40 QBs with 135+ passing attempts, Herbert ranked #34 at -1.9
I don't think any of that data paints a positive picture about Lombardi's offense, and I am cautiously optimistic the offense will improve under Moore.
 
The guy was fired by an offensive guru coach , Mike McCarthy in Dallas, and gets picked up for the same position in L.A. and people are ga-ga over this???
Unfortunately I've had to suffer through Dallas games as they're on the game of the week usually, ya know, being America's team and all. anyways, Here's what you get from Moore. complete absolute incompetence at least half of the games, some games where his stupidity shines through but they win, and then some genuine good games where he calls great plays and they win big.
the problem is, this likely means that the lousy Chargers are once again a borderline .500 team. I know it's not possible with 17 games, but they're going to go 9-8 or 8-9. I really don't think they'll be any better than that. This guy is Clueless Joe Jackson
 
Well he wasn’t unemployed for long.

I thought that was a scapegoat move. Moore didn’t kneecap the OL or cause Dak to throw mind-boggling interceptions.

LAC was smart to pounce on him. Moore showed plenty of times how dangerous his offenses can be when the team is clicking. Even with the OL injuries, he got an awful lot of juice out of that offense.

He got a great gig is what he got. And when it came time to WIN, at home no less, he threw two different series together that will not (or maybe they will, depending) go down in history. And yes, some of the player's mistakes in those series are to take some blame. But better coaching makes sure those are not likely to happen when the rubber meets the road. That was winning time, not teaching or experimenting moments.

More focus will be put on his overall "results" or what have you, but he also had a lot to work with, let's not forget. When it mattered most, it was ugly.

Herbert will save him, though. But that's the Chargers. Thinking they've got this great mind as their next coach, when it's really a great QB holding it down.
 
The guy was fired by an offensive guru coach , Mike McCarthy in Dallas, and gets picked up for the same position in L.A. and people are ga-ga over this???
Unfortunately I've had to suffer through Dallas games as they're on the game of the week usually, ya know, being America's team and all. anyways, Here's what you get from Moore. complete absolute incompetence at least half of the games, some games where his stupidity shines through but they win, and then some genuine good games where he calls great plays and they win big.
the problem is, this likely means that the lousy Chargers are once again a borderline .500 team. I know it's not possible with 17 games, but they're going to go 9-8 or 8-9. I really don't think they'll be any better than that. This guy is Clueless Joe Jackson
The Chargers are already the Dallas Cowboys the AFC. This just makes it more so.
 
The guy was fired by an offensive guru coach , Mike McCarthy in Dallas, and gets picked up for the same position in L.A. and people are ga-ga over this???
Unfortunately I've had to suffer through Dallas games as they're on the game of the week usually, ya know, being America's team and all. anyways, Here's what you get from Moore. complete absolute incompetence at least half of the games, some games where his stupidity shines through but they win, and then some genuine good games where he calls great plays and they win big.
the problem is, this likely means that the lousy Chargers are once again a borderline .500 team. I know it's not possible with 17 games, but they're going to go 9-8 or 8-9. I really don't think they'll be any better than that. This guy is Clueless Joe Jackson

You are keeping your streak alive here.

Moore was forced to emphasize Elliott more than was warranted in Dallas because Jones paid Elliott what he did. He also had to work with Dak there, and Herbert is quite a bit better than Dak.

Moore will have a better situation with the 2023 Chargers than he ever had in Dallas. In part because he is now under a head coach who will completely defer to him on offense, which McCarthy did not, and in part because he has a better QB.

Barring significant injuries, Moore will likely leverage his 2023 Chargers OC season into a head coaching job in 2024.
 
The guy was fired by an offensive guru coach , Mike McCarthy in Dallas, and gets picked up for the same position in L.A. and people are ga-ga over this???
Unfortunately I've had to suffer through Dallas games as they're on the game of the week usually, ya know, being America's team and all. anyways, Here's what you get from Moore. complete absolute incompetence at least half of the games, some games where his stupidity shines through but they win, and then some genuine good games where he calls great plays and they win big.
the problem is, this likely means that the lousy Chargers are once again a borderline .500 team. I know it's not possible with 17 games, but they're going to go 9-8 or 8-9. I really don't think they'll be any better than that. This guy is Clueless Joe Jackson

You are keeping your streak alive here.

Moore was forced to emphasize Elliott more than was warranted in Dallas because Jones paid Elliott what he did. He also had to work with Dak there, and Herbert is quite a bit better than Dak.

Moore will have a better situation with the 2023 Chargers than he ever had in Dallas. In part because he is now under a head coach who will completely defer to him on offense, which McCarthy did not, and in part because he has a better QB.

Barring significant injuries, Moore will likely leverage his 2023 Chargers OC season into a head coaching job in 2024.

I wish he would have emphasized EE and the run game more. He abandons the run way too fast and calls the wrong plays for the wrong players all the time.

How much of that was McCartthy? Not sure it was McCarthy because I think Moore is gone because of how badly prepared the offense l was the last two plays of the last two seasons.

Super predictable routs. (As Banker said- comebacks/digs and go routes all day long).
 
The guy was fired by an offensive guru coach , Mike McCarthy in Dallas, and gets picked up for the same position in L.A. and people are ga-ga over this???
Unfortunately I've had to suffer through Dallas games as they're on the game of the week usually, ya know, being America's team and all. anyways, Here's what you get from Moore. complete absolute incompetence at least half of the games, some games where his stupidity shines through but they win, and then some genuine good games where he calls great plays and they win big.
the problem is, this likely means that the lousy Chargers are once again a borderline .500 team. I know it's not possible with 17 games, but they're going to go 9-8 or 8-9. I really don't think they'll be any better than that. This guy is Clueless Joe Jackson

You are keeping your streak alive here.

Moore was forced to emphasize Elliott more than was warranted in Dallas because Jones paid Elliott what he did. He also had to work with Dak there, and Herbert is quite a bit better than Dak.

Moore will have a better situation with the 2023 Chargers than he ever had in Dallas. In part because he is now under a head coach who will completely defer to him on offense, which McCarthy did not, and in part because he has a better QB.

Barring significant injuries, Moore will likely leverage his 2023 Chargers OC season into a head coaching job in 2024.

I wish he would have emphasized EE and the run game more. He abandons the run way too fast and calls the wrong plays for the wrong players all the time.

How much of that was McCartthy? Not sure it was McCarthy because I think Moore is gone because of how badly prepared the offense l was the last two plays of the last two seasons.

Super predictable routs. (As Banker said- comebacks/digs and go routes all day long).

We're going to find out. I predict the Dallas offense is worse without Moore and the Chargers offense is better with him. I predict McCarthy will be fired after the 2023 season and Moore will get a HC job. But I doubt he will take the Dallas job, having already experienced working under Jerry Jones.
 
Chargers 2023 Roster Thoughts: Solving the Cap Challenge

That post includes my take on a Herbert contract extension. High points:

  • 10 years, $550M contract extension, meaning he would be under contract through his 15th season (2034), his age 36 season
  • "Just" a $10M signing bonus, with $300M guaranteed for injury
  • Other guaranteed money would be in the form of guaranteeing salary and roster bonuses in future seasons
    • How much of that is guaranteed at signing vs. how much is handled via rolling guarantees really depends on what Herbert is willing to accept and what the Chargers can afford to put into escrow
    • I would expect Herbert to get $250M+ guaranteed, but it doesn't have to occur up front, requiring escrow, but can instead occur with rolling guarantees that are virtually certain to trigger in future offseasons, so the escrow requirement gets spread out
  • Use of low salaries through at least the next 5 seasons, then a move to higher salaries and lower roster bonuses to create targets for future restructuring of salary
 
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How bad is the Chargers organization? This bad.

There's a single measure (team travel) for which they barely rank in the top half of the league (15th). Everything else is below average, and they're bottom 5 in 7 measures.

For people who don't understand when the three Charger fans here talk about how bad the ownership is - maybe this will help you grok it. There's a reason this team has zero championships, and it's not just bad luck.
 
Chargers 2023 Roster Thoughts: Solving the Cap Challenge, Part 2

Warning: this is very long. If you make it through, interested in feedback.

You want to do a new version now that they've restructured Keenan Allen and Mike Williams? Or wait to see if they restructure Bosa?

Not now. As I pointed out in there, there was a huge combination of decisions available to them, so it was inevitable I would miss a lot of them. The real point of the post was to show how many decisions there are, how interdependent they are, and how it might all come together.

I will do another post between the first wave of free agency and the draft and another post-draft, assuming I have time. And at some point after the draft, I will write a post about the 2024 cap situation, which is already problematic...

I personally would not have restructured Williams. I think they have now likely ensured that they will have to release, trade, and/or extend one or both of Allen and Williams next offseason, and release/trade will be more negatively impactful now.

I still think they have to do something with Bosa, either trade him or restructure him. I'm open to trading him, but the problem there is that IMO Mack is another possible cap casualty next offseason, and it's hard for me to see them turning over both of them that rapidly. I suppose it is conceivable they could use the first round pick they would presumably get for trading Bosa to draft an Edge player. There would probably be a significant dropoff in performance, but I suppose that may be okay, this team is probably going to need to win with offense, anyway.
 
Chargers 2023 Roster Thoughts: Solving the Cap Challenge, Part 2

Warning: this is very long. If you make it through, interested in feedback.

You want to do a new version now that they've restructured Keenan Allen and Mike Williams? Or wait to see if they restructure Bosa?

Not now. As I pointed out in there, there was a huge combination of decisions available to them, so it was inevitable I would miss a lot of them. The real point of the post was to show how many decisions there are, how interdependent they are, and how it might all come together.

I will do another post between the first wave of free agency and the draft and another post-draft, assuming I have time. And at some point after the draft, I will write a post about the 2024 cap situation, which is already problematic...

I personally would not have restructured Williams. I think they have now likely ensured that they will have to release, trade, and/or extend one or both of Allen and Williams next offseason, and release/trade will be more negatively impactful now.

I still think they have to do something with Bosa, either trade him or restructure him. I'm open to trading him, but the problem there is that IMO Mack is another possible cap casualty next offseason, and it's hard for me to see them turning over both of them that rapidly. I suppose it is conceivable they could use the first round pick they would presumably get for trading Bosa to draft an Edge player. There would probably be a significant dropoff in performance, but I suppose that may be okay, this team is probably going to need to win with offense, anyway.
Yeah those ‘24 numbers are something.
 
Mack and Bosa restructured so they are under the cap. But look at those ‘24 cap hits! I hope they invest heavily in training staff for these 4.
 
I'm assuming @Just Win Baby / Tau is waiting for a few more coins to drop before refreshing his cap breakdown.

In the meantime we can all celebrate another season of Stick. "He's a good locker room influence," says Brandon Staley. Cool. :mellow:
 
I'm assuming @Just Win Baby / Tau is waiting for a few more coins to drop before refreshing his cap breakdown.

In the meantime we can all celebrate another season of Stick. "He's a good locker room influence," says Brandon Staley. Cool. :mellow:

This was my comment in immediate reaction at BFTB:

I was afraid of this. I hope they signed him to a vet minimum contract, but I fully expect to be mortified when contract details become known.

Entering this offseason, just 5 players drafted in Telesco's tenure had received a second contract from the Chargers:
  • Keenan Allen
  • Joey Bosa
  • Derwin James
  • Denzel Perryman (🤢)
  • Mike Williams
That is a real indictment of the quality of the drafts under Telesco.

I expected Pipkins to join this group, but hoped against hope that Stick would not.

Yes, will update cap/roster post in a couple weeks, once the first wave or two of free agency has passed.
 
Lost in all the Stick excitement, I forgot to mention Parham and Fehoko are hitting the FA market (Chargers didn't tender, which makes sense), and Ekeler is asking for a trade because the Chargers and he are too far apart on an extension.

My concern with Parham potentially leaving is that the team then places too much emphasis on TE in their approach to the draft. I don't know if Guyton will be back, regardless they need to add speed on offense.

Fehoko showed flashes last season, but still seems like you could replace him relatively cheaply.

I love Ekeler, but I wouldn't want to pay him a ton, particularly now that he's 28.
 
Lost in all the Stick excitement, I forgot to mention Parham and Fehoko are hitting the FA market (Chargers didn't tender, which makes sense), and Ekeler is asking for a trade because the Chargers and he are too far apart on an extension.

My concern with Parham potentially leaving is that the team then places too much emphasis on TE in their approach to the draft. I don't know if Guyton will be back, regardless they need to add speed on offense.

Fehoko showed flashes last season, but still seems like you could replace him relatively cheaply.

I love Ekeler, but I wouldn't want to pay him a ton, particularly now that he's 28.

Didn't expect the Chargers to tender any of Parham, Fehoko, or Guyton, since minimum tender is $2.6M. I expect they will seek to bring all of them back on vet minimum contracts, or close to it. I wouldn't expect any of them to have a strong market from other teams.

As for Ekeler, I hope they sign him to an extension to keep him.
 
After another humiliating kick in the crotch for Charger fans in the form of a top 3 all time NFL playoffs choke job, we move on into the baseless hope of another championshipless offseason.

We begin the offseason saying goodbye to Joe Lombardi and Shane Day, who oversaw an offense that couldn't score in the 3rd quarter and a regression in form of franchise quarterback Justin Herbert. I have no idea who the new coaches will be, and I'm still hoping Staley gets shown the door too (not going to happen), but can they be any worse than the folks responsible for the Bandy jet sweep on 3rd an inches? I want to believe they can't be, but this is the Chargers - so it's probably a 50/50 proposition they get someone even worse.

@Just Win Baby has made us painfully aware of the dire salary cap situation - not much light at the end of that tunnel.

My real question is, besides myself, what Charger fans are left? And why?

Another question I have is what would a coach like Bill Cowher have done to Joey Bosa after his juvenile temper tantrums damaged his team's chances to win a playoff game?
Justin Herbert is the franchise and he's very good.
I would not play games in extending him before he realizes how awful the LAC organization is
Herbert could easily be the next disgruntled but talented young Quarterback that starts to become the hot topic of conversation.
Herbert could be the best of the 2020 Draft class with the right people around him.
 
After another humiliating kick in the crotch for Charger fans in the form of a top 3 all time NFL playoffs choke job, we move on into the baseless hope of another championshipless offseason.

We begin the offseason saying goodbye to Joe Lombardi and Shane Day, who oversaw an offense that couldn't score in the 3rd quarter and a regression in form of franchise quarterback Justin Herbert. I have no idea who the new coaches will be, and I'm still hoping Staley gets shown the door too (not going to happen), but can they be any worse than the folks responsible for the Bandy jet sweep on 3rd an inches? I want to believe they can't be, but this is the Chargers - so it's probably a 50/50 proposition they get someone even worse.

@Just Win Baby has made us painfully aware of the dire salary cap situation - not much light at the end of that tunnel.

My real question is, besides myself, what Charger fans are left? And why?

Another question I have is what would a coach like Bill Cowher have done to Joey Bosa after his juvenile temper tantrums damaged his team's chances to win a playoff game?
Justin Herbert is the franchise and he's very good.
I would not play games in extending him before he realizes how awful the LAC organization is
Herbert could easily be the next disgruntled but talented young Quarterback that starts to become the hot topic of conversation.
Herbert could be the best of the 2020 Draft class with the right people around him.
I'm sure Charger management will attempt to extend Herbert at the first opportunity and offer him what he deserves. The management is bad, but nobody is that stupid.

Whether Herbert gets fed up and leaves is a completely different question. He doesn't strike me as having a Rodgers personality, but everybody has their limits.
 
After another humiliating kick in the crotch for Charger fans in the form of a top 3 all time NFL playoffs choke job, we move on into the baseless hope of another championshipless offseason.

We begin the offseason saying goodbye to Joe Lombardi and Shane Day, who oversaw an offense that couldn't score in the 3rd quarter and a regression in form of franchise quarterback Justin Herbert. I have no idea who the new coaches will be, and I'm still hoping Staley gets shown the door too (not going to happen), but can they be any worse than the folks responsible for the Bandy jet sweep on 3rd an inches? I want to believe they can't be, but this is the Chargers - so it's probably a 50/50 proposition they get someone even worse.

@Just Win Baby has made us painfully aware of the dire salary cap situation - not much light at the end of that tunnel.

My real question is, besides myself, what Charger fans are left? And why?

Another question I have is what would a coach like Bill Cowher have done to Joey Bosa after his juvenile temper tantrums damaged his team's chances to win a playoff game?
Justin Herbert is the franchise and he's very good.
I would not play games in extending him before he realizes how awful the LAC organization is
Herbert could easily be the next disgruntled but talented young Quarterback that starts to become the hot topic of conversation.
Herbert could be the best of the 2020 Draft class with the right people around him.
I'm sure Charger management will attempt to extend Herbert at the first opportunity and offer him what he deserves. The management is bad, but nobody is that stupid.

Whether Herbert gets fed up and leaves is a completely different question. He doesn't strike me as having a Rodgers personality, but everybody has their limits.
Comes across mature and i see him in the same light as a Joe Burrow although JB is probably the guy i want with the ball in his hands for the go ahead score at the moment.
But I see Herbert being able to achieve the same things Burrow has recently for the Bengals.
Mahomes is in his own special tier, after that i see Herbert as one of the potential elite QBs.
The Chargers were smart to draft him and lucky to have him.
I would have hired a new head coach, not pleased with their results but also think they need a little bit more from their front office.
 
Tranquill must be asking for a lot if they'e moving on to Kendricks. I'm preparing to be really upset when Tranquill signs a $4M one year deal somewhere else.
 
I don't blame Ekeler for wanting a market-price extension. (Rumor is he wants at least $12 million per year?) I also don't blame the Chargers for not wanting to spend that much at the RB position. It'd be great to get a second-rounder for him. Otherwise, I think the best strategy is to let him play out his contract and become an unrestricted free agent in 2024. (Maybe they could promise not to tag him in 2024 in exchange for not holding in.)
 

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