*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread. Fresh epidemic fears as child pneumonia cases surge in Europe after China outbreak. NOW in USA (25 Viewers)

[JaxBill]

Flip side of the online education rants-

My wife is a 5th grade teacher at a small Catholic school. Two homerooms per grade. She teaches science and language arts to both homerooms. Before this crisis, the class had vastly underperformed.  Several kids barely were promoted from 4th grade. Quite a few ESL kids. 

The school has seen declining enrollment since previous principal was in over his head and previous pastor ran parish into ground since he really just wanted to retire.  Early in the pandemic, the diocese announced that her 42k salary (and teacher salaries acrosd the board) would be frozen and not see her next step raise - similar to 2008 when they did the same and never made up for it.

Unlike the public schools who lengthened spring break to come up with plan, the diocese basically said figure it out over a weekend. After several failed plans, they finally arrived at a schedule where the other teacher would do a zoom class at 10 am and my wife would do one at 1 pm. Class is recorded and posted online (schoology).

Sounds simple right? Well my wife has been busting her ### with 12 to 14 hour days. Every kid that has a work sheet assigned, the kid has to scan and upload while she downloads the image, marks it by hand, notes what questions they missed, records the grade. Everything is manual using hard copy books/workbooks retrieved from school. The previous administration did not take my wife's advice a couple years ago to go with a certain book company across grades since they would then throw in online access for free.

She has to provide lesson plans and assignments 7 to 10 days out. Everything is posted there. Yet several kids refuse to do the work.  You think she enjoys having to track down 2 week old missing English homework? She is forced to because the administration wants to give them every to avoid failing. You think she enjoys having a student turn in an overdue assignment at 10 pm then getting pinged by the mother at 7am wondering why the student's grade wasn't updated yet?

Like everything else with this crisis, your experience is very local.

 

[Coach Morris Buttermaker]

https://nypost.com/2020/05/01/flight-path-curses-michigan-governor-over-coronavirus-lockdown/?utm_source=NYPTwitter&utm_campaign=SocialFlow&utm_medium=SocialFlow

Flightaware

 

[JaxBill]

In Duval county there have been 22 deaths attributed to Covid. There have also been 30 murders since March 1.

 

[BobbyLayne]

Huntington Beach

no comment

About 2 miles from my house.  All over local news.  No, I am not going to join. 

Science has unmasked the wee virus

 

[Tecumseh]

Yeah, I’ve read quite a few articles indicating the expectation Fauci has set (12-18 months) is extremely optimistic.

Not arguing, but the rationale that I have heard is that the shortened timeline is because there is a global cooperative effort rather than a competitive effort. It's not just a few companies or countries working on a vaccine, it's literally thousands of companies in dozens of countries. I don't know how that jibes with each company holding their work close to the vest, but that is the explanation I have heard.

 

[DocHolliday]

Flip side of the online education rants-

My wife is a 5th grade teacher at a small Catholic school. Two homerooms per grade. She teaches science and language arts to both homerooms. Before this crisis, the class had vastly underperformed.  Several kids barely were promoted from 4th grade. Quite a few ESL kids. 

The school has seen declining enrollment since previous principal was in over his head and previous pastor ran parish into ground since he really just wanted to retire.  Early in the pandemic, the diocese announced that her 42k salary (and teacher salaries acrosd the board) would be frozen and not see her next step raise - similar to 2008 when they did the same and never made up for it.

Unlike the public schools who lengthened spring break to come up with plan, the diocese basically said figure it out over a weekend. After several failed plans, they finally arrived at a schedule where the other teacher would do a zoom class at 10 am and my wife would do one at 1 pm. Class is recorded and posted online (schoology).

Sounds simple right? Well my wife has been busting her ### with 12 to 14 hour days. Every kid that has a work sheet assigned, the kid has to scan and upload while she downloads the image, marks it by hand, notes what questions they missed, records the grade. Everything is manual using hard copy books/workbooks retrieved from school. The previous administration did not take my wife's advice a couple years ago to go with a certain book company across grades since they would then throw in online access for free.

She has to provide lesson plans and assignments 7 to 10 days out. Everything is posted there. Yet several kids refuse to do the work.  You think she enjoys having to track down 2 week old missing English homework? She is forced to because the administration wants to give them every to avoid failing. You think she enjoys having a student turn in an overdue assignment at 10 pm then getting pinged by the mother at 7am wondering why the student's grade wasn't updated yet?

Like everything else with this crisis, your experience is very local.

Your wife and this example is not the norm.  My daughter is in fourth grade.  For the first weeks of home schooling, she had a packet of papers to complete and online tests.   She was engaged with school work for 5-6 hours/day.   For the last 2 weeks, she joins a zoom classroom with each of her two teachers for 30 minutes each.   There are no tests.  There is no direction.  There is no learning happening from the school.   My wife and I keep our daughter learning   She has to read for at least 30 minutes each day.   I make her math tests on multiplication and long division every other day.   We have her watch an educational program from amazon prime every day as well   

I have friends and family all over that have kids in school and have many relatives and friends that are teachers.  I don’t know of any teachers that are working more than a few hours of work each week at this point.  Two neighbors are principals making six figures and their work consists of joining a conference call each day to discuss the current state of the school.   They admit that they are not working and are bored.   This isnt the fault of the teachers or school staff.   We were not prepared for this school closure.   Human nature is typically to work as hard as necessary and not much more.   The school staff knows that this years schooling is over.   Their unions aren’t going to permit school sessions.  

 

[parasaurolophus]

Flip side of the online education rants-

My sister is a teacher and she is quite frustrated right now. She cant even hold a required online meeting. There is no way to establish any kind of routine for kids when you cant require them to be participating at set times. 

She has to make meetings and class times optional. 

 

[need2know]

My sons teacher is about to go on vaca to the beach for the third time since this started.   She has stopped by once and given us some worksheets. We might get an email from her once per week.   Its a joke

 

[msommer]

Best estimates I have seen on state by state basis - https://rt.live

Wow, that's a very nice graph (hope it's accurate!)

Surprised at the high numbers in the "upper mid west", MN, WI, IL, IN, IA, NE, SD...

 

[msommer]

There have also been 30 murders since March 1.

More or less than normal?

 

[boots11234]

It’s is not dumb that we quarantined. Had we not, a multiple of deaths would have occurred.

This is just false.  Sweden does not bare this out.  Or at least we should not have had the  same rules apply in NY apply in ND.  The stats just dont show this.  Sorry you are so willing to give up your liberty.

 

[DallasDMac]

Our local theaters began opening today. Just saw a report on the news that they will NOT require masks. So that option is not an option for us. That is just idiotic.

 

[eoMMan]

On the beach right now, nearest person is stationed about 100 feet away. 

Usual beach walkers are walking about 50 feet in front of us.

Law enforcement just rolled by on an ATV making sure all is good.

 

[Kal El]

This is just false.  Sweden does not bare this out.  Or at least we should not have had the  same rules apply in NY apply in ND.  The stats just dont show this.  Sorry you are so willing to give up your liberty.

Sweden has double the cases and triple the deaths of the rest of Scandinavia combined. Liberty is fun and all, but not when there's a killer virus that doesn't care about whether or not we got to go hang out this month.

 

[eoMMan]

Our local theaters began opening today. Just saw a report on the news that they will NOT require masks. So that option is not an option for us. That is just idiotic.

Are they at least requiring customers to sit in every other seat?

 

[JaxBill]

More or less than normal?

I think slightly above normal. And they're mostly drug or gang related in the hood. There is probably an increase in domestic violence but not seeing many escalate to murder.

Stay At Home...unless you're going to do a drive by.

 

[DallasDMac]

Are they at least requiring customers to sit in every other seat?

They have to. Governor mandated 25% capacity, social distancing, etc. Ain't gonna stop Mr. and Mrs. Moron from coughing and sneezing on everything though. We'll avoid theaters like the plague (pun intended) for now.

 

[JaxBill]

My sister is a teacher and she is quite frustrated right now. She cant even hold a required online meeting. There is no way to establish any kind of routine for kids when you cant require them to be participating at set times. 

She has to make meetings and class times optional. 

My wife's school is still making things required (wink wink) and that's part of thd problem.

She has to take attendance.  You are present if you attend either zoom class that day or...you turn in any handout from that day. So you could blow off everything all week go to Friday morning zoom, do 1 handout each for Monday thru Thursday and, bam, perfect attendance.

And part of the required work is that suddenly you can turn in weeks old work for credit. My wife is literally getting emailed by parents trying to track down homework from midMarch. 

This class didn't do work last school year or in November or in February.  The online teaching didn't cause a problem.  It brought it front and center.

She just told me she refuses to do any schoolwork today. I think the only other day she hasn't spent at least a couple hours doing school related stuff was Easter Sunday.

Yeah,  she'll be drinking wine this evening and trying to hold on until Memorial Day.

 

[jobarules]

Our local theaters began opening today. Just saw a report on the news that they will NOT require masks. So that option is not an option for us. That is just idiotic.

I don't get this. Are there any new movies even out?

 

[Sammy3469]

FWIW...I think there’s also a big misconception on how much learning happens especially in elementary school.  Between lunch, recess, specials, etc. they might spend 4 hours doing class work a day on the high side.  Between the reading, assignments, and 1-2 times a week video conferences, my kid ends up spending 5 hours or so a day doing some type of work.  I personally think that’s fine, but I know experiences vary (this is for a 3rd grader in NYC school).  
 

 

[jplvr]

Barber Shops / Hair Salons - You can easily schedule appointments so that proper distancing can happen.  Cutter/Cuttee both wear masks.  Bottle of Purell at the pay station.

While I've got Einstein hair right now, this isn't even about my needs being met.  It's just being sympathetic towards someone that's being shut down needlessly and getting hammered economically. 

Golf - It never made sense why this was shut down in the first place.  Golf by it's nature "social distances" on its own.  There's some easy rules you can put in place (one to a cart, for example) and I think @jplvr posted some rules the course by him is following also (the cup is raised, and if hit counts as 'in the cup').  Lots of fresh air, probably the only exercise some of these guys will get, with social distancing requirements easily met.  Comparatively, I was in WAY more danger at the supermarket than I would have been on the golf course.

"Non-Essential" Shopping - I'd drift off into PSF land if I got too deep into this one, but essentially I have a problem with the government picking which legal enterprises can continue to thrive economically and which ones can't by fiat.  As long as common sense measures are being taken with masks and distancing, it's madness that we can't go buy a pair of socks or a new toaster.  Again, this isn't to meet my needs.  As long as I've got the internet and can read my credit card I can buy anything online I want.  Not everyone is in that position.

The sad truth in all this is that if we all use common sense we'd come out of this fine.  But there's a segment of our population that needs to be 'ordered' to use common sense.  Unfortunately that segment of the population REALLY hates being ordered to do anything.  Cover your nose / mouth, wash your hands, keep your booger hook out of your eyes, and most importantly get the F away from me.

The fact that you had to “define your position” tells me I want MJ part of whatever politicized discussion was probably going on here. 

 

[jobarules]

People still don't think China and the WHO did nothing wrong?

https://nypost.com/2020/05/02/intelligence-report-says-china-lied-about-origin-of-coronavirus/

 

[sho nuff]

I don't get this. Are there any new movies even out?

Also...after basically being stuck inside...lets rush out to go....inside!

 

[The Commish]

Exactly. And that is why quarantining is dumb. It’s not working. 

We are avoiding being a larger Italy by quarantining....I think that's a great thing  

 

[beer 30]

So cool story and since we’re talking teachers, relatable. My oldest is a 2nd grade teacher. Their curriculum has been a bit of a joke and it frustrates her but there are a ton of variables associated as well, that’s not the story, just my $.02.

Yesterday was her birthday and she is very much a gift person. If you’ve ever read about the 5 Love Languages her #1 is receiving gifts. She’s been really down because she really loves her class this year and hasn’t been able to see them for quite a while. So yesterday her husband gets her breakfast but then goes off to work leaving her at home by herself until they come over to our house for a little birthday party at 6pm. She calls my wife at 9am complaining because she has done everything she needed to get done for the day by then and now has nothing to do until she comes over to our house. She’s also bummed because the school puts out a weekly email with updates & stuff that also lets parents know which teachers are having birthdays that week and they forgot to put my daughters on it. Only 2 of her kids knew it was her birthday so now she was super bummed, hub’s isn’t much of a gift giver so he had nothing for her yesterday, did the “it’s coming in the mail” thing so all told, her day was less than stellar so far.

Finally 6pm rolls around, they come over, we eat and then go out front to take some pictures. As we’re doing that, a line of cars starts to drive into the cul de sac and we tell her to look. She’s not really paying much attention so we tell her to look again, it’s her kids. She looks up, still not believing us but we all start walking toward the end of the driveway so she kinda has to follow along and finally realizes it really is carloads of her class. My wife had called the room mom the night before to see if she could organize a parade to come by. We thought a couple kids would show but the whole class came out! Everyone got out, properly social distanced around the cul de sac and sang happy birthday to her. It was super cool. They all had cards and she got to walk around to each family and catch up a little bit before they left. After all the doom & gloom, little things like this provide that ray of hope that keep us moving forward.

 

[Mr Anonymous]

Nevada's governing health authority is now joining California in confirming that Covid-19 was circulating here in December and January...

Earlier coronavirus cases confirmed in Nevada after 13 investigation

Within just two days of our story airing, the Nevada Health Response team confirmed what the people we spoke to suspected. That they got sick here in Las Vegas in December and January, and the illness was COVID-19.

Well I guess it turns out that I'm not crazy so that's nice.

 

[Redwes25]

Wow, that's a very nice graph (hope it's accurate!)

Surprised at the high numbers in the "upper mid west", MN, WI, IL, IN, IA, NE, SD...

Most of the country’s meat packing plants are in that region and those places have been hit hard. Once it gets into one of those plants it spreads like crazy. 

 

[JbizzleMan]

Nevada's governing health authority is now joining California in confirming that Covid-19 was circulating here in December and January...

Earlier coronavirus cases confirmed in Nevada after 13 investigation

Well I guess it turns out that I'm not crazy so that's nice.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/espn-s-ed-aschoff-dead-34-after-battling-pneumonia-n1107056

I remember reading about this. Later they discovered he had Stage 4 non-Hodgkins Lymphoma, but it certainly makes you wonder. How many other cases like this could there be?

 

[jobarules]

Nevada's governing health authority is now joining California in confirming that Covid-19 was circulating here in December and January...

Earlier coronavirus cases confirmed in Nevada after 13 investigation

Well I guess it turns out that I'm not crazy so that's nice.

That article never really says how they confirmed it

 

[Mr Anonymous]

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/espn-s-ed-aschoff-dead-34-after-battling-pneumonia-n1107056

I remember reading about this. Later they discovered he had Stage for non-Hodgkins Lymphoma, but it certainly makes you wonder. How many other cases like this could there be?

Wow, don't remember hearing about this. Died in late December and of a pneumonia that wasn't responding to the typical treatments. Could very well be coronavirus. People have to understand that people who were dying of Covid-19 in Dec/Jan were being recorded as presumed flu and pneumonia deaths. This signifies two things: a much longer presence and also more deaths. I'm curious if Aschoff had any other underlying health issues. 

 

[msommer]

Our local theaters began opening today. Just saw a report on the news that they will NOT require masks. So that option is not an option for us. That is just idiotic.

The Danish CDC made a list of closed things and ranked them in terms of what would be least or most dangerous to open in various categories. They called it a simplified and generalized list

Translating:

Low Risk

Partying, eating and shopping

• Outdoor areas
  

Culture and faith

• Libraries
  
• Museums
  
• Zoos
  

Medium Risk

Partying, eating and shopping

• Restaurants
  
• Cafés
  
• Malls
  
• Hookah cafés (yeah, we have a bunch of people smoking waterpipes) - (medium high)
  

Schools

• HS equivalent single material studies
  
• Universities
  
• Art Schools
  

Culture and faith

• Theatres
  
• Movie theaters
  
• Churches, mosques, synagogues (medium high with singing and or physical activity)
  

Activities and Sports

• Skating rinks
  
• Swimming pools
  
• Outdoor activity areas with physical spacing
  

High Risk

Partying, eating and shopping

• Hookah cafés (medium high)
  
• Bars and pubs
  

Schools

• 6-10th grade
  
• HS
  

Culture and faith

• Churches, mosques, synagogues (medium high with singing and or physical activity)
  

Activity and Sports

• Youth clubs
  
• Day activities for physically or mentally handicapped or socially more exposed kids and youth
  
• Tropical themeparks w indoor pools
  
• Indoor playgrounds
  
• Indoor sports arenas 
  

Very High Risk

Partying, eating and shopping

• Concert halls
  
• Nightclubs
  

Schools

• Boarding schools
  

Culture and Faith

• Amusement parks
  

Activity and Sports

• Fitness centres 
  
• Indoor sports arenas - sports with physical contact
  

Not sure I agree with all of this but in most cases the logic is sound

 

[JbizzleMan]

Wow, don't remember hearing about this. Died in late December and of a pneumonia that wasn't responding to the typical treatments. Could very well be coronavirus. People have to understand that people who were dying of Covid-19 in Dec/Jan were being recorded as presumed flu and pneumonia deaths. This signifies two things: a much longer presence and also more deaths. I'm curious if Aschoff had any other underlying health issues. 

He did. His autopsy discovered Non-Hodgkins Lymphoma. Stage 4. Which would certainly make him high-risk for Covid.

However, there was no way to test for, or even know to test for COVID 

 

[Mr Anonymous]

That article never really says how they confirmed it

They're not going back with coroners and re-checking just yet but they're confirming via people who visited Las Vegas in Dec and Jan and returned to their home states and fell ill. I believe some of those people have been tracked down and tested where they reside. The story doesn't go into great detail so I'll have to dig up more info but the Nevada Health District is running the show here so it's a pretty big step for them to make this declaration.

 

[parasaurolophus]

Also...after basically being stuck inside...lets ush out to go....inside!

I am not in favor of opening theaters unless they had incredibly strict limits on how many people per theater. 

Confined space with continued close proximity with no movement seems like things we should be focused on limiting. 

 

[Joe Bryant]

Sorry everyone. Frustrating because they called off school for the rest of the year. Which is the right call. But the teachers here have been acting abhorrently IMO, really taking advantage right now. I’ll stop now. 

I'm sorry to hear it's been that way for you.

In Knoxville where I live, the teachers I've seen have been doing excellent. I talked to a friend in NY yesterday and he couldn't stop raving about how great some of his children's teachers have been. Of course, that's anecdotal. But I was happy to hear it. 

 

[Mr Anonymous]

That article never really says how they confirmed it

They're not going back with coroners and re-checking just yet but they're confirming via people who visited Las Vegas in Dec and Jan and returned to their home states and fell ill. I believe some of those people have been tracked down and tested where they reside. The story doesn't go into great detail so I'll have to dig up more info but the Nevada Health District is running the show here so it's a pretty big step for them to make this declaration.

Here's the original reporting and investigation done by a local news station that the Nevada Health District confirmed was accurate via the link I posted above...

https://www.ktnv.com/13-investigates/were-las-vegas-conventions-corona-super-spreaders

The station contacted attendees of Las Vegas conventions from all over the country who got sick after visiting here around those times who have since had positive tests for Covid-19.

 

[Alex P Keaton]

They're not going back with coroners and re-checking just yet but they're confirming via people who visited Las Vegas in Dec and Jan and returned to their home states and fell ill. I believe some of those people have been tracked down and tested where they reside. The story doesn't go into great detail so I'll have to dig up more info but the Nevada Health District is running the show here so it's a pretty big step for them to make this declaration.

The link doesn’t confirm that people were infected with COVID in Las Vegas back in December.   It makes the assertion, but really provides zero facts.

 

[Mr Anonymous]

Not quite confirmation, more like presumption, but Santa Clara County in California is considered one of the early hot spots and it's Silicon Valley residents were in Las Vegas en masse in early January for the CES convention. For those not familiar, it's Las Vegas' largest yearly convention...

https://www.mercurynews.com/2020/04/29/is-there-a-las-vegas-silicon-valley-coronavirus-connection-from-january-tech-trade-show/

 

[Alex P Keaton]

Here's the original reporting and investigation done by a local news station that the Nevada Health District confirmed was accurate via the link I posted above...

https://www.ktnv.com/13-investigates/were-las-vegas-conventions-corona-super-spreaders

The station contacted attendees of Las Vegas conventions from all over the country who got sick after visiting here around those times who have since had positive tests for Covid-19.

My family had very similar symptoms — back in October/November.  We didn’t have COVID then.  Most of my extended family in Wisconsin, if they saw this article, would say “yes, I had it last fall too!”

Anyway, time will tell when the first cases actually existed.  I appreciate you sharing these links, but IMO there is nothing remotely definitive about them (yet).  Open to facts as always though.

 

[Mr Anonymous]

The link doesn’t confirm that people were infected with COVID in Las Vegas back in December.   It makes the assertion, but really provides zero facts.

Fair enough. The Nevada Health District making this confirmation means something to me. The story doesn't indicate what their reasoning for confirming cases of Covid-19 in December and January is but they did confirm it. I'm assuming they have their reasons.

 

[JbizzleMan]

are there any new numbers in Georgia?

 

[Mr Anonymous]

My family had very similar symptoms — back in October/November.  We didn’t have COVID then.  Most of my extended family in Wisconsin, if they saw this article, would say “yes, I had it last fall too!”

Anyway, time will tell when the first cases actually existed.  I appreciate you sharing these links, but IMO there is nothing remotely definitive about them (yet).  Open to facts as always though.

The Nevada Health District is the governing body of health in the state and the Nevada Health Response was created to lead up the state's response to Covid-19. This isn't some study or wild speculation. They're the entity that provides the state's official case and death totals. It IS a big deal for them to confirm that Covid-19 was responsible for sicknesses in the state in December and January. I'll share again when greater detail is provided.

 

[Biff84]

Unfortunately, it’ll take 6-8 weeks to see any major upward trends resulting from their experiment.

Right, positive cases don’t mean much when a lot of the places are ramping up testing. I’d say that in 2-4 weeks you’d be able to start seeing upticks in hospitalizations and deaths. Either way by the time you see the uptick, it’s already too late to do much to stop it.

 

[jobarules]

Here's the original reporting and investigation done by a local news station that the Nevada Health District confirmed was accurate via the link I posted above...

https://www.ktnv.com/13-investigates/were-las-vegas-conventions-corona-super-spreaders

The station contacted attendees of Las Vegas conventions from all over the country who got sick after visiting here around those times who have since had positive tests for Covid-19.

You're probably more right than wrong but the original article doesn't confirm anything really. 

 

[parasaurolophus]

Right, positive cases don’t mean much when a lot of the places are ramping up testing. I’d say that in 2-4 weeks you’d be able to start seeing upticks in hospitalizations and deaths. Either way by the time you see the uptick, it’s already too late to do much to stop it.

Depends on hospital capacity and where you are at with current cases. 

If you have tons of hospital capacity and not a ton of current cases and you have limted the potential for large events, this isnt true at all. 

 

[Mr Anonymous]

You're probably more right than wrong but the original article doesn't confirm anything really. 

Dunno. Again, this story is in it's infancy. The Nevada Health District hasn't provided it's reasoning for confirming that Covid-19 was behind illnesses in Nevada in Dec/Jan but they did in fact confirm that it was. They didn't say it might have been here then, they definitively said there were ill people in Nevada back then that they're confirming had Covid-19. I'm just as anxious as anyone else to hear what their conformation is based upon. So far they confirmed it via a response to an investigation conducted by a local news station. I think it's safe to say they have something concrete behind their confirmation.

 

[Redwes25]

are there any new numbers in Georgia?

They had a 1000 cases yesterday which seemed high from a week ago. Would think we would see a significant increase for at least another week if the reopening plan doesn’t go well. 
 

I really hope it goes well as we need to be able to open up but I have my concerns. 

 

[Slapdash]

Here's the original reporting and investigation done by a local news station that the Nevada Health District confirmed was accurate via the link I posted above...

https://www.ktnv.com/13-investigates/were-las-vegas-conventions-corona-super-spreaders

The station contacted attendees of Las Vegas conventions from all over the country who got sick after visiting here around those times who have since had positive tests for Covid-19.

I caught a flu in Vegas over Super Bowl weekend

 

[SoBeDad]

Yesterday, I attended a virtual meeting of the 30+  NIA-funded Alzheimer's Disease Research Centers. Attendance was a record 500+. I've been invited to attend these biannual in-person meetings in the past, but the logistics didn't work out. IMO, the meeting was a success and there is little justification for NIA to hold in-person meetings in the near future - the October meeting is still scheduled for LA. The meeting used zoom. Meeting platforms will get better.

 

[GroveDiesel]

This is just false.  Sweden does not bare this out.  Or at least we should not have had the  same rules apply in NY apply in ND.  The stats just dont show this.  Sorry you are so willing to give up your liberty.

Sweden has a death rate 6 times higher than their Nordic neighbors who all quarantined. And it’s continuing to rise while the other countries have mostly leveled off. This is useful because the Nordic countries are very similar in most ways, so they’re almost like an experiment with a control. And so far it seems to be proving that Sweden’s solution leads to 6 times more people dying than locking things down.

The caveat is that if the true solution ends up being herd immunity because we can’t get a vaccine, then it’s possible that Sweden will hit that faster and their numbers will drop suddenly while the other countries take much much longer to hit her immunity but end up with the same percentage of deaths in the long run. That seems like a risky bet though IMO.

Honestly I’m not really sure why anyone is using Sweden as a model of success.