*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread. Fresh epidemic fears as child pneumonia cases surge in Europe after China outbreak. NOW in USA (8 Viewers)

[renesauz]

No, I get it clearly and shouldn't need to repeat it a hundred times for those who miss it. This is worse than any flu season by far. I'm speaking to the notion that hospitals don't deal with surges every year. Not in this quantity, no, but surges happen every year. Someone just expressed an appreciation of having all facts. Sharing all of them doesn't mean anyone is attempting to downplay things. It's adding to the picture in the presence of media that doesn't trust us to deal with a complete picture. People here need to stop freaking out when more of the story is told. Grow up.

But your repeated insistence that "surges are normal" is misleading to those who don't have a clear picture of what a "normal surge" is vs what we are seeing now. I'm not accusing you of lying, but of (unintentionally) misleading folks.  The situation is dire, and your statements don't make it less dire....but they could make it SEEM less dire, and your statement here shows you understand how this is not normal....THIS IS NOT NORMAL, not even close to it, so please stop repeating a fact that is not helpful to any portion of the dialogue

 

[Doug B]

Same goes for teachers of young kids. Are they not getting covid either?

If Stadler’s conjecture — that kids are inefficient COVID vectors — pans out, then teachers are relatively safe IMHO. More research is needed, of course.

The other angle — whether exposure to kids helps confer general coronavirus immunity to teachers — is more questionable IMHO. Teachers don’t interact with kids as intimately as parents do.

 

[shadyridr]

You call it fear, I call it being smart.

And we've played 17 games in the last 3 weeks

I didn't mean it as an insult. I think a healthy fear of the virus is a good thing but I don't know anyone IRL that acts like the members of this forum.

 

[Alex P Keaton]

I didn't mean it as an insult. I think a healthy fear of the virus is a good thing but I don't know anyone IRL that acts like the members of this forum.

I know plenty of people IRL who act like the virus is extremely deadly.  I also know plenty of people IRL who think this is “just the flu.”  Not sure what your point is.

 

[Capella]

yes my son has been playing baseball for about 2 weeks now and there is zero social distancing and no masks. The members on this site are the far minority in their fear.

Well I mean that’s why we are getting 50,000 new cases a day. Lol you say this like it’s a bad thing. If the US was half as smart as this thread we’d be out of this by now.

 

[RUSF18]

That was never spoken of.

And that's one of many examples why far too many people are tuning this thing out. You're a great example of the phenomena here actually. So afraid that when something good is pointed out, that everyone is going to drop their guard. The next positive news shared here that you don't leap to spin or counteract will be the first time. It's not your intent that's the issue, it's how little respect you have for people to understand what's going on. Like they're not going to be able to process how when any progress is made, it doesn't mean we're out of the woods. The media goes one step further and adds the aspect of ill intent though. I don't question your intent at all, you have nothing to gain by fueling paranoia.

How could you possibly claim that declining deaths were "never spoken of" when that was the clearest reason why so many states started opening back up in the first place?

 

[shader]

I didn't mean it as an insult. I think a healthy fear of the virus is a good thing but I don't know anyone IRL that acts like the members of this forum.

Yeah that’s the problem.  At least half of the people I work with think this is all a media hoax.  People irl are far less informed than most posters in this thread. 

 

[JaxBill]

If Stadler’s conjecture — that kids are inefficient COVID vectors — pans out, then teachers are relatively safe IMHO. More research is needed, of course.

The other angle — whether exposure to kids helps confer general coronavirus immunity to teachers — is more questionable IMHO. Teachers don’t interact with kids as intimately as parents do.

Not sure how it applies to Covid, but I know that my teacher wife has a much higher immune system built up from all the sick kids sent to school anyway. Every once in a while it will make her mildly sick for a day or two and then I catch the bug and I'm worthless for 3 to 4 days.

Speaking of which, is there going to be a campaign about "If your kid needs a fever reducer to make it to school, then they need to stay home." Covid or no Covid, long overdue.

 

[NotSmart]

I didn't mean it as an insult. I think a healthy fear of the virus is a good thing but I don't know anyone IRL that acts like the members of this forum.

If you genuinely didn't mean it to be belittling, then replace "fear" with "respect" in the future.

 

[TheWinz]

There are a lot of smart people to learn from here.

Thanx.  I'm doing my best to educate everyone.  

What's up with the lack of testing in certain states?
Colorado - last in the nation at just over 7% tested, while being one of only 2 western states with over 300 deaths per million
Oregon - not so concerned here, as OR has an overall positivity half that of the national average, and are in the bottom 7 in both cases and deaths per capita
Pennsylvania - No way should they be 48th in testing when they are 6th in overall deaths, and 10th in deaths per capita.

 

[eoMMan]

The question of mask mandates came up for my area and our city "leaders" said that they wouldn't know how to even enforce it and that they think many more people would be against required masks than for them. 

So they refused to even have a meeting/discussion about it. At least talk about the issue and hear what the people are saying...that's what you were voted in for.

 

[Terminalxylem]

Of course it is...we don't have a good study giving exact numbers, but we DO HAVE pretty good data on who has been sick, and good data on the ages of those killed, and this data is pretty convincing that kids aren't getting sick anywhere near as easily. 

Again, I know they aren’t being hospitalized or dying, but I don’t have a good idea about their relative risk of infection with few to no symptoms.

 

[DocHolliday]

Thanx.  I'm doing my best to educate everyone.  

What's up with the lack of testing in certain states?
Colorado - last in the nation at just over 7% tested, while being one of only 2 western states with over 300 deaths per million
Oregon - not so concerned here, as OR has an overall positivity half that of the national average, and are in the bottom 7 in both cases and deaths per capita
Pennsylvania - No way should they be 48th in testing when they are 6th in overall deaths, and 10th in deaths per capita.

PA is a very poorly run state and has been for decades.   Their poor performance during Covid is just another indicator.   If nothing else, this pandemic really shines light on how horrible our government system has been in the US.   

 

[The Commish]

Of all the bizarre narratives that I've seen in this thread, "Why don't people talk more about the declining death numbers that are no longer declining" just might take the cake.

I don't know about that.  I can't put my finger on it but this latest narrative about hospitals experiencing surges but not surges similar to the ones we are seeing now on (or something like that...I think?) is up there.  No idea where that's headed unless apples and oranges are now the same thing. This is an unprecedented time that hasn't been experienced in the era of modern medicine.  There is nothing to compare it to, but we're still going to try.

Not to be outdone...there seems to be another variation of the "fear" narrative beginning.  I wouldn't cast final conclusions on this just yet GB.

 

[The Z Machine]

PA is a very poorly run state and has been for decades.   Their poor performance during Covid is just another indicator.  

Can you give some examples?

 

[shadyridr]

So I am 100% hoping for good news on vaccines, but didn’t really see any positive news in the Moderna release. They don’t even know if it prevents infection in the people they’re testing it on, just that there aren’t any major side effects. Ok???

It created antibodies in every person injected.

 

[Doug B]

The question of mask mandates came up for my area and our city "leaders" said that they wouldn't know how to even enforce it and that they think many more people would be against required masks than for them. 

So they refused to even have a meeting/discussion about it. At least talk about the issue and hear what the people are saying...that's what you were voted in for.

Where is this?

 

[Joe Bryant]

It looks like our overall per capita beds is low, but ICU per capita is high. Some of this may relate to the definition of an ICU bed based on staffing rather than technological capabilities. If those numbers are correct, over 1 in 10 beds in the US are appropriate for ICU care, which seems high for every hospital I’ve worked in.

Although I think those numbers in part reflect creative bookkeeping, I’ll change my post to ensure it’s accuracy. Thanks for pointing out the discrepancy.

Thanks Doc. 

 

[Coach Morris Buttermaker]

 If the US was half as smart as this thread we’d be out of this by now.

Just curious, how would we be out of this w/o a vaccine yet? It seems like whoever opens up, has a rise in cases, etc. 

So if we locked down everything until now, sure we'd have low cases, but what would be the strategy going forward as we wait possibly 6-9 mos for a vaccine?

 

[Capella]

Just curious, how would we be out of this w/o a vaccine yet? It seems like whoever opens up, has a rise in cases, etc. 

So if we locked down everything until now, sure we'd have low cases, but what would be the strategy going forward as we wait possibly 6-9 mos for a vaccine?

The virus is only carried by person. If everybody was wearing a mask and only going out when needed while keeping proper distancing it would be wiped out. Check Asia and Europe. 

 

[pollardsvision]

The question of mask mandates came up for my area and our city "leaders" said that they wouldn't know how to even enforce it and that they think many more people would be against required masks than for them. 

So they refused to even have a meeting/discussion about it. At least talk about the issue and hear what the people are saying...that's what you were voted in for.

Yeah, it's tough in places where a lot of the public sees masks as a great tyranny.

I don't know the answer, but government leaders just giving up on it doesn't seem like answer.

 

[The Commish]

Where is this?

Sounds like Florida.

 

[The Commish]

Just curious, how would we be out of this w/o a vaccine yet? It seems like whoever opens up, has a rise in cases, etc. 

So if we locked down everything until now, sure we'd have low cases, but what would be the strategy going forward as we wait possibly 6-9 mos for a vaccine?

Wear a mask and stay away from each other.  Not more complicated than that  

 

[beer 30]

Yeah, it's tough in places where a lot of the public sees masks as a great tyranny.

I don't know the answer, but government leaders just giving up on it doesn't seem like answer.

Our local school district passed an ordinance requiring all students to wear a mask this upcoming year. I posted it on FB in a favorable manner because 1. I believe it's the right thing to do and 2. my daughter is a 3rd grade teacher and I'd like to see her not catch the virus from a little germ factory.

Within about an hour or so the conversation devolved to the point we were discussing the conspiracy that the virus will disappear on November 5th and China released the virus in retaliation for trade tariffs put in place by the current administration. I don't have the strength to continue the fight with these people

 

[The Commish]

I swear to God...the first person that managed to get the US population on board with simply wearing a mask should get a Nobel Prize...I mean, seriously!

 

[Andy Dufresne]

So tell me...what's your guys' opinions on Americans wearing masks?

I'm getting the impression it's something you're all in favor of. I'll stay tuned for more.

 

[bcat01]

I have no idea what to make of this.  I am in the suburbs of Chicago for a reference.  School down the street has a baseball field.  Took one of my kids for a walk and we stopped at the park next to the school.  There was a baseball game about to start.  Ump was standing behind the pitcher (which seems to be the new normal), but all the kids were sitting next to each other in the dugouts.  Before the game, each coach had his team in a huddle and the did the "1 2 3 shout something" type of thing, seems counter productive to social distancing to scream in each others face.  It looked like the parents from both teams were gathered along the shady side of the field and each family was directly next to the next family.   I know they were all outside, but seems like other than the Ump they did not seem to care about anything Covid related.

Going to the stores there has been an almost 100% mask compliance, so this seemed wierd to me.  We have not heard from the school districts what the plans are for school, I think they have their meeting this week to figure that out.

Saw the same thing last night at the local pool.  They were having a swim meet and around the pool it was shoulder to shoulder kids.  The couple of bleachers set up were full of families.  Zero social distancing going on, but at least it was outside.

 

[the moops]

If Stadler’s conjecture — that kids are inefficient COVID vectors — pans out, then teachers are relatively safe IMHO. More research is needed, of course.

The other angle — whether exposure to kids helps confer general coronavirus immunity to teachers — is more questionable IMHO. Teachers don’t interact with kids as intimately as parents do.

Some kindergarten teachers probably do. Or at least as intimately to some of their students. There are many students that rarely get affection and attention at home and school is the place and their teacher is the person that gives them that

 

[shadyridr]

NY's quarantine of travelers from other states seems pretty strict

http://www.nydailynews.com/coronavirus/ny-coronavirus-jfk-laguardia-airport-contact-tracing-20200714-qvluluq4g5ac7oalhik7sylcya-story.html

 

[pollardsvision]

Our local school district passed an ordinance requiring all students to wear a mask this upcoming year. I posted it on FB in a favorable manner because 1. I believe it's the right thing to do and 2. my daughter is a 3rd grade teacher and I'd like to see her not catch the virus from a little germ factory.

Within about an hour or so the conversation devolved to the point we were discussing the conspiracy that the virus will disappear on November 5th and China released the virus in retaliation for trade tariffs put in place by the current administration. I don't have the strength to continue the fight with these people

Are you from NC?

That's where I'm from and much of my Facebook feed a consist of NC folks. It's wild. 

 

[Andy Dufresne]

NY's quarantine of travelers from other states seems pretty strict

http://www.nydailynews.com/coronavirus/ny-coronavirus-jfk-laguardia-airport-contact-tracing-20200714-qvluluq4g5ac7oalhik7sylcya-story.html

You know, if Trump did something like that...

 

[the moops]

NY's quarantine of travelers from other states seems pretty strict

http://www.nydailynews.com/coronavirus/ny-coronavirus-jfk-laguardia-airport-contact-tracing-20200714-qvluluq4g5ac7oalhik7sylcya-story.html

It takes common decency for these contact tracing procedures to work here in the states. When people are all like "well, I could just rip the form up and risk the fine" there is nothing any state can really do about it. There are too many people travelling into NY from too many places. 

 

[The Commish]

NY's quarantine of travelers from other states seems pretty strict

http://www.nydailynews.com/coronavirus/ny-coronavirus-jfk-laguardia-airport-contact-tracing-20200714-qvluluq4g5ac7oalhik7sylcya-story.html

Florida has been allegedly doing this since April.  My brother and his family came down over the fourth and the site on 95 was closed.  It was opened again when they were going home after the big holiday though.  That said, our local news group has been trying to find a single person who's been followed up with AFTER coming through the checkpoint to make sure they were doing what they were supposed to.  Surprise...can't find a single person who's been followed up with.  Hopefully, if NY is going to throw the funds behind this, they'll do it correctly, otherwise it becomes a big financial drain.  Yeah, it makes for a good headline, but that's about it.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

People are dumb but not dumb. They know it's just political theater and there's no reason to comply. 

 

[Jackstraw]

Just curious, how would we be out of this w/o a vaccine yet? It seems like whoever opens up, has a rise in cases, etc. 

So if we locked down everything until now, sure we'd have low cases, but what would be the strategy going forward as we wait possibly 6-9 mos for a vaccine?

Test, track, isolate. 

 

[beer 30]

Are you from NC?

That's where I'm from and much of my Facebook feed a consist of NC folks. It's wild. 

Worse...SC and even worse than that...Fort Mill, SC so Charlotte South w/plenty of redneck.

 

[worrierking]

ICU beds are full in Southwest Louisiana.  Some hospitals are struggling with staffing because multiple staffers are out in quarantine.  Also, our hospitals have been getting multiple requests from Texas about sending patients here, which is obviously impossible.  One of the worst parts of this current outbreak is that it is regional and not local.  We can't send our overflow to Houston, Beaumont, Lafayette or New Orleans like we normally could because they are all full, and the small-town hospitals can't send their overflow to us.  It appears our daily cases are plateauing, but there are still a lot of sick people around and it will take weeks before the numbers stop straining the hospitals.

 

[shadyridr]

The virus is only carried by person. If everybody was wearing a mask and only going out when needed while keeping proper distancing it would be wiped out. Check Asia and Europe. 

I know this is the current narrative (Europe did things right, USA did things wrong) and the #s certainly play that out but Europe did not wipe it out and they can easily have a resurgence due to the same reason we had one. Their young people are no different than our young people. Bars opened in Italy in early June and young people are flocking to bars/resorts in Spain and not wearing masks.

https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/majorca-travel-incidents-scli-intl/index.html

 

[Brony]

Remember that instance of a hair stylist with COVID in Missouri and all of the people that were going to get infected? 

Outcome

Among 139 clients exposed to two symptomatic hair stylists with confirmed COVID-19 while both the stylists and the clients wore face masks, no symptomatic secondary cases were reported; among 67 clients tested for SARS-CoV-2, all test results were negative. Adherence to the community’s and company’s face-covering policy likely mitigated spread of SARS-CoV-2.

 

[Capella]

I know this is the current narrative (Europe did things right, USA did things wrong) and the #s certainly play that out but Europe did not wipe it out and they can easily have a resurgence due to the same reason we had one. Their young people are no different than our young people. Bars opened in Italy in early June and young people are flocking to bars/resorts in Spain and not wearing masks.

https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/majorca-travel-incidents-scli-intl/index.html

It’s not a narrative it’s a fact that they suppressed the virus and we haven’t. Only people with agendas are trying to make it into some narrative and that’s why we are where we are. 
 

And of course it can come back if proper protocols are continued to be followed but it’s less likely because there will be...less carriers. This is really just the basic stuff we should be doing. 

 

[eoMMan]

Sounds like Florida.

Yup. More right wing area of FL.

 

[Ignoratio Elenchi]

NY's quarantine of travelers from other states seems pretty strict

http://www.nydailynews.com/coronavirus/ny-coronavirus-jfk-laguardia-airport-contact-tracing-20200714-qvluluq4g5ac7oalhik7sylcya-story.html

I know a couple guys who were here from Australia.  Around mid-March when it became clear that stuff was about to be locked down, they flew back to Australia.  Upon arriving they immediately were put up in a hotel for mandatory 14-day quarantine.  At the end of that period when they had demonstrated no symptoms, they were allowed to go home.  Here we can't even get people to fill out a form before leaving the airport.   

 

[AAABatteries]

+65,488 cases yesterday per Worldometer.  +465 deaths.

+65,594 cases yesterday per Worldometer.  +937 deaths.

 

[The Commish]

Yup. More right wing area of FL.

It's popular here in pockets too...where in FL are you?  I feel like I've asked that before but I forget...sorry GB.

 

[The Commish]

I know this is the current narrative (Europe did things right, USA did things wrong) and the #s certainly play that out but Europe did not wipe it out and they can easily have a resurgence due to the same reason we had one. Their young people are no different than our young people. Bars opened in Italy in early June and young people are flocking to bars/resorts in Spain and not wearing masks.

https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/majorca-travel-incidents-scli-intl/index.html

Sure...and they have contact tracing in place and are proactive.  We don't and are totally reactive.  What's the point you think you're making here?  In those areas you have many COUNTRIES on the same page.  We can't even get counties/cities/towns in the same state on the same page.  The "young people" are the least of our worries.

 

[Biff84]

I know this is the current narrative (Europe did things right, USA did things wrong) and the #s certainly play that out but Europe did not wipe it out and they can easily have a resurgence due to the same reason we had one. Their young people are no different than our young people. Bars opened in Italy in early June and young people are flocking to bars/resorts in Spain and not wearing masks.

https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/majorca-travel-incidents-scli-intl/index.html

They got their viral level down far enough that it significantly decreases the risk of a new spike. We never did that here and that’s a huge reason why there are spikes in so many states yet very few in Europe or Asia.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

Just curious, how would we be out of this w/o a vaccine yet? It seems like whoever opens up, has a rise in cases, etc. 

So if we locked down everything until now, sure we'd have low cases, but what would be the strategy going forward as we wait possibly 6-9 mos for a vaccine?

Other countries are preparing to open schools in the fall and are already enjoying the excitement of nil-nil draws on the pitch.  We're still tripping over our own shoelaces.

 

[Franknbeans]

No CDC data for you

 

[culdeus]

So yesterday Dallas had 20 deaths which is an all time high.  Tuesday usually is the highest death day for reporting issues, so that's expected.  However there was some good news.

• Lowest acute care cases since July 4th in hospital.
  
• Fewer positive cases each day in prior 7 days than the last week in all but one day.
  
• Unlike Houston the data has not been quite so sporadic as to suggest testing lags are present, although there is complaints about it from the county co.
  

Feel like momentum is there that 20 is the peak for this wave in Dallas Co.  Case counts might pick back up but like Houston the worst of this wave may be behind us.

 

[shadyridr]

So yesterday Dallas had 20 deaths which is an all time high.  Tuesday usually is the highest death day for reporting issues, so that's expected.  However there was some good news.

• Lowest acute care cases since July 4th in hospital.
  
• Fewer positive cases each day in prior 7 days than the last week in all but one day.
  
• Unlike Houston the data has not been quite so sporadic as to suggest testing lags are present, although there is complaints about it from the county co.
  

Feel like momentum is there that 20 is the peak for this wave in Dallas Co.  Case counts might pick back up but like Houston the worst of this wave may be behind us.

With a lot of these hot spots rolling back on their opening plans I think that is to be expected.