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Official Donald Trump for President thread (4 Viewers)

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Ministry of Pain said:
That's part of it. Christians are asked to put up with everything these days. They have to bend bend bend and they do it with a smile on their face for the most part. 

Part of Christianity is spreading the good news IIRC, and we have by and large asked them to stop doing that and those wishes have been honored. They are in a way bending on something that is practiced by Christians in other parts of the World. Sure they broadcast on TV some. 

By and large they keep to themselves in this country outside of their weekly church gatherings. Maybe it's different in Indiana, they passed a bill to try and battle back against federal regulations. 

To act like there isn't a silent backlash among Christians in this country is hard to ignore IMO. It gets confusing when they are faced with a choice of trump who doesn't seem to be a good choice for their values or Clinton. And these people tend to like to vote so it's a real mystery I guess if they all stay home or decide to vote for Clinton since obviously not a one of them can stomach Trump, right?
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I feel for ya man.  stay strong.  you'll get through it.

 
cobalt_27 said:
badmojo1006 said:
Meredith McIver Trump speechwriter, scapegoat for the Melania Trump plagiarism controversy

What a crock of :bs:
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Total crock.  They're all lying, got caught in the lie, denied any plagiarism occurred, and then when that didn't work, they made up this insanely stupid excuse.  I've taught as a professor for years at the university level and have heard all the excuses.  This ranks as among the least plausible, least believable, and most absurd.  
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Yeah this doesn't quite jibe, does it?

McIver wrote every single word from Melania as they were read out, then typed that out, and then did not check it? No, that does not make sense.

 
Ministry of Pain said:
That's part of it. Christians are asked to put up with everything these days. They have to bend bend bend and they do it with a smile on their face for the most part. 

Part of Christianity is spreading the good news IIRC, and we have by and large asked them to stop doing that and those wishes have been honored. They are in a way bending on something that is practiced by Christians in other parts of the World. Sure they broadcast on TV some. 

By and large they keep to themselves in this country outside of their weekly church gatherings. Maybe it's different in Indiana, they passed a bill to try and battle back against federal regulations. 
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You ought to get a stableboy job at Hialeah.  

 
Ministry of Pain said:
That's part of it. Christians are asked to put up with everything these days. They have to bend bend bend and they do it with a smile on their face for the most part. 

Part of Christianity is spreading the good news IIRC, and we have by and large asked them to stop doing that and those wishes have been honored. They are in a way bending on something that is practiced by Christians in other parts of the World. Sure they broadcast on TV some. 

By and large they keep to themselves in this country outside of their weekly church gatherings. Maybe it's different in Indiana, they passed a bill to try and battle back against federal regulations. 

To act like there isn't a silent backlash among Christians in this country is hard to ignore IMO. It gets confusing when they are faced with a choice of trump who doesn't seem to be a good choice for their values or Clinton. And these people tend to like to vote so it's a real mystery I guess if they all stay home or decide to vote for Clinton since obviously not a one of them can stomach Trump, right?
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Well, let's talk about what they shouldn't have to put up with that they're bending so much on. Fred and Ted openly holding hands? Can't have a prayer to start the day in a public school? 

 
MattFancy said:
Can't say my life as a Christian has been difficult. In fact, life has been pretty good the past 8 years.
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MOP's life has been good the last 8 years...financially speaking has to be what you are talking about.  We doubled our income and bought/sold a SFR in Miami, it's been a fantastic run with Obama in office. We would have done all that anyways IMHO.  I've also seen a lot of people perish and suffer like no other time I can remember. 

Most FBGs have had it good the last 8 years creating wealth as Middle Class Citizens under Obama.

You couldn't be talking Christian and post 8 years...that's a direct link to Obama.

 
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Ministry of Pain said:
That's part of it. Christians are asked to put up with everything these days. They have to bend bend bend and they do it with a smile on their face for the most part. 

Part of Christianity is spreading the good news IIRC, and we have by and large asked them to stop doing that and those wishes have been honored. They are in a way bending on something that is practiced by Christians in other parts of the World. Sure they broadcast on TV some. 

By and large they keep to themselves in this country outside of their weekly church gatherings. Maybe it's different in Indiana, they passed a bill to try and battle back against federal regulations. 

To act like there isn't a silent backlash among Christians in this country is hard to ignore IMO. It gets confusing when they are faced with a choice of trump who doesn't seem to be a good choice for their values or Clinton. And these people tend to like to vote so it's a real mystery I guess if they all stay home or decide to vote for Clinton since obviously not a one of them can stomach Trump, right?
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You mean federal regulations that enforce the First Amendment establishment clause?  That the government can not endorse one religion over another?

 
Amused to Death said:
I'm for letting people live they way they choose.  We are NOT a Christian nation.  If you're religious, that's cool.  Keep it to yourself.  No one is telling anyone to change their views or how they live.

OK, I'm out.
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Wow, really? 

ABC News 83% are Christian...you guys are just fishing right? It's hard to continue talking when I have to go find basic to link.

How could you post that or say that? You might WISH it were so, you might THINK it is so, but the REALITY which is how you keep score in life is that 83% of these foul humans ID themselves as Christian. 

And then I'm getting pummeled for intelligence, it's just incredible. I genuinely think many of you want a board with only one voice and no contrast or differing points of views. It makes me sad 15 years into this place or longer and we haven't grown much. 

When is MOP so closed minded? I think I do a good job of listening and sometimes adapting or changing my view if things make sense. I cannot say the same about many of you.  

 
Ministry of Pain said:
Wow, really? 

ABC News 83% are Christian...you guys are just fishing right? It's hard to continue talking when I have to go find basic to link.

How could you post that or say that? You might WISH it were so, you might THINK it is so, but the REALITY which is how you keep score in life is that 83% of these foul humans ID themselves as Christian. 

And then I'm getting pummeled for intelligence, it's just incredible. I genuinely think many of you want a board with only one voice and no contrast or differing points of views. It makes me sad 15 years into this place or longer and we haven't grown much. 

When is MOP so closed minded? I think I do a good job of listening and sometimes adapting or changing my view if things make sense. I cannot say the same about many of you.  
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:lmao:  We're a nation with a lot of Christians in it which is not the same thing as a "Christian nation." We shouldn't have to explain basic things like this to you.

BTW, that 83% number is hugely misleading to the point of being criminally inaccurate. Over 20% -- and rising -- of us openly identify as having no religious affiliation.

:lmao: :lmao:

 
Amused to Death said:
You mean federal regulations that enforce the First Amendment establishment clause?  That the government can not endorse one religion over another?
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Woah Tonto, I don't live there. I'm somewhere between agnostic to atheist myself so please don't aim that pistol at me. 

From down here in Florida, it seemed like a lot of citizens outraged that they were forced to take part in gay weddings thru their businesses. I'm not taking sides, just reporting what appeared to happen.

I think a lot of you want to believe desperately that you live in a country where as soon as a law is passed that everyone automatically ends their prejudices and that simply is not the case, look back to 1964. And you believe so desperately that you will stop at nothing to shut the other folks up who have a different mindset. 

AtD: "MOP...knock knock, you in there"

Sorry AtD, I jumped the shark a bit there and I'm talking more in general than you in particular. 

 
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Ministry of Pain said:
Wow, really? 

ABC News 83% are Christian...you guys are just fishing right? It's hard to continue talking when I have to go find basic to link.

How could you post that or say that? You might WISH it were so, you might THINK it is so, but the REALITY which is how you keep score in life is that 83% of these foul humans ID themselves as Christian. 

And then I'm getting pummeled for intelligence, it's just incredible. I genuinely think many of you want a board with only one voice and no contrast or differing points of views. It makes me sad 15 years into this place or longer and we haven't grown much. 

When is MOP so closed minded? I think I do a good job of listening and sometimes adapting or changing my view if things make sense. I cannot say the same about many of you.  
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ya, truly incredible.

 
roadkill1292 said:
:lmao:  We're a nation with a lot of Christians in it which is not the same thing as a "Christian nation." We shouldn't have to explain basic things like this to you.

BTW, that 83% number is hugely misleading to the point of being criminally inaccurate. Over 20% -- and rising -- of us openly identify as having no religious affiliation.

:lmao: :lmao:
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You can hit the laughter emoticon 15 times, doesn't make you right, in fact it makes you look like a bleep hole.

 
Ministry of Pain said:
Wow, really? 

ABC News 83% are Christian...you guys are just fishing right? It's hard to continue talking when I have to go find basic to link.

How could you post that or say that? You might WISH it were so, you might THINK it is so, but the REALITY which is how you keep score in life is that 83% of these foul humans ID themselves as Christian. 

And then I'm getting pummeled for intelligence, it's just incredible. I genuinely think many of you want a board with only one voice and no contrast or differing points of views. It makes me sad 15 years into this place or longer and we haven't grown much. 

When is MOP so closed minded? I think I do a good job of listening and sometimes adapting or changing my view if things make sense. I cannot say the same about many of you.  
Click to expand...
Oh my, where to begin.

Why not start with the first amendment?

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

Then follow with a little Jefferson:
"Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof", thus building a wall of separation between Church & State."

And then a dash of Supreme Court rulings:
"The "establishment of religion" clause of the First Amendment means at least this: Neither a state nor the Federal Government can set up a church. Neither can pass laws which aid one religion, aid all religions, or prefer one religion to another . . . in the words of Jefferson, the [First Amendment] clause against establishment of religion by law was intended to erect 'a wall of separation between church and State' . . . That wall must be kept high and impregnable. We could not approve the slightest breach."

So no, per the constitution we are not a "Christian Nation". Or is this one of those pesky parts of the constitution you conveniently ignore?

 
Ministry of Pain said:
Wow, really? 

ABC News 83% are Christian...you guys are just fishing right? It's hard to continue talking when I have to go find basic to link.

How could you post that or say that? You might WISH it were so, you might THINK it is so, but the REALITY which is how you keep score in life is that 83% of these foul humans ID themselves as Christian. 

And then I'm getting pummeled for intelligence, it's just incredible. I genuinely think many of you want a board with only one voice and no contrast or differing points of views. It makes me sad 15 years into this place or longer and we haven't grown much. 

When is MOP so closed minded? I think I do a good job of listening and sometimes adapting or changing my view if things make sense. I cannot say the same about many of you.  
Click to expand...
We are NOT governed by Christian law nor morality.  And I don't believe your 83% stat.

Ministry of Pain said:
Woah Tonto, I don't live there. I'm somewhere between agnostic to atheist myself so please don't aim that pistol at me. 

From down here in Florida, it seemed like a lot of citizens outraged that they were forced to take part in gay weddings thru their businesses. I'm not taking sides, just reporting what appeared to happen.

I think a lot of you want to believe desperately that you live in a country where as soon as a law is passed that everyone automatically ends their prejudices and that simply is not the case, look back to 1964. And you believe so desperately that you will stop at nothing to shut the other folks up who have a different mindset. 

AtD: "MOP...knock knock, you in there"

Sorry AtD, I jumped the shark a bit there and I'm talking more in general than you in particular. 
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I'm not trying shut anyone up.  Quite the contrary.  Everyone has a voice and equal rights.  Christians, OTOH, try to shut out all non-believers and think they can force everyone else to live by their beliefs.  Who's shutting out who?

 
This is very much a Christian Nation with 83% of people ID as Christians, that's the problem though is folks like Roadkill trying to have you doubt yourself. 

And that's why I say Christians put up with a lot. You can practice anything you want in this country but it better not interfere with most Christians. Politicians and elitists are finding that out now.  

 
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Harry Manback said:
Oh my, where to begin.

Why not start with the first amendment?

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

Then follow with a little Jefferson:
"Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof", thus building a wall of separation between Church & State."

And then a dash of Supreme Court rulings:
"The "establishment of religion" clause of the First Amendment means at least this: Neither a state nor the Federal Government can set up a church. Neither can pass laws which aid one religion, aid all religions, or prefer one religion to another . . . in the words of Jefferson, the [First Amendment] clause against establishment of religion by law was intended to erect 'a wall of separation between church and State' . . . That wall must be kept high and impregnable. We could not approve the slightest breach."

So no, per the constitution we are not a "Christian Nation". Or is this one of those pesky parts of the constitution you conveniently ignore?
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For recency, add in some of St. Ronnie:

“We establish no religion in this country. We command no worship. We mandate no belief, nor will we ever. Church and state are and must remain separate.” – Ronald Reagan

 
Ministry of Pain said:
This is very much a Christian Nation with 83% of people ID as Christians, that's the problem though is folks like Roadkill trying to have you doubt yourself. 

And that's why I say Christians put up with a lot. You can practice anything you want in this country but it better not interfere with most Christians. Politicians and elitists are finding that out now.  
Click to expand...
So, the Constitution is only valid when convenient. #Republican

 
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Ministry of Pain said:
This is very much a Christian Nation with 83% of people ID as Christians, that's the problem though is folks like Roadkill trying to have you doubt yourself. 

And that's why I say Christians put up with a lot. You can practice anything you want in this country but it better not interfere with most Christians. Politicians and elitists are finding that out now.  
Click to expand...
Which "politicians and elitists" are opposed to Christianity? Care to name a few? 

 
Ministry of Pain said:
Time to expand the ignore list. You don't come to the boards for any other reason than to try and get under folks skin, good bye. 
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You haven't actually addressed a single factual thing I've said. You haven't answered my honest questions about Trump's tax plan. You haven't provided any examples of people being sued for practicing free speech. You haven't commented on the first amendment and how it dictates we are NOT a Christian Nation. 

Go ahead, block me. It's the cowards way.

 
timschochet said:
Which "politicians and elitists" are opposed to Christianity? Care to name a few? 
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They aren't opposed to it, they simply want Christians to bend over and put up with everything. Most religions are allowed to scream bloody murder when something doesn't gel with their little rules or guidelines. Christians are just expected to put up and allow everything to fly. 

You can post otherwise but I bet we could find some devout Christians who agree. Just because you might think Christians do put up with a lot in America doesn't mean you are an auto vote for Trump, it feels like no matter what I post now, simply because I have voiced the possibility I am voting for Trump, "Everything that boy posts must be met with fire and hell"

That's sad but that's where we have arrived with the secret Clinton in Sheep's Wool crowd. 

 
MoP really did block me, I tried to send him a PM to see if he'd address some of my points privately, as he doesn't seem willing to address them publicly. 

Anyone care to ask him for me?

 
JerseyToughGuys said:
Here's one:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/feb/26/trump-pledges-curb-press-freedom-libel-laws-first-amendment

:lmao:
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I agree that Trump's position is laughable, but that's one proposal that has been widely panned by Republicans and Conservatives.  Many of whom don't view Trump as either a Republican or Conservative.

So we have one outlandish suggestion by a man known for his outlandish suggestions, and that suggestion doesn't have broad support of either the GOP or Conservatives.  And that's somehow proof of Conservatives being the greatest proponents of limiting free speech for the past half century? 

For the most part, people on both sides of the aisle overstate the threat to speech in America.  Thankfully.

 
Ministry of Pain said:
They aren't opposed to it, they simply want Christians to bend over and put up with everything. Most religions are allowed to scream bloody murder when something doesn't gel with their little rules or guidelines. Christians are just expected to put up and allow everything to fly. 
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Can you give an actual concrete example already?

 
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My experience has been that whenever I get into these discussions with religious conservatives, they're always the ones that get worked up and disappear - yet its the atheist liberals that are trying to force everyone to our views.  I can have a well-reasonsed, fact-based discussion.  They usually are the ones that unfriend me or end by telling me to "wake up!".

I'm the unreasonable one though.  :loco:

 
Harry Manback said:
You haven't actually addressed a single factual thing I've said. You haven't answered my honest questions about Trump's tax plan. You haven't provided any examples of people being sued for practicing free speech. You haven't commented on the first amendment and how it dictates we are NOT a Christian Nation. 

Go ahead, block me. It's the cowards way.
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:popcorn:

 
Ministry of Pain said:
They aren't opposed to it, they simply want Christians to bend over and put up with everything. Most religions are allowed to scream bloody murder when something doesn't gel with their little rules or guidelines. Christians are just expected to put up and allow everything to fly. 

You can post otherwise but I bet we could find some devout Christians who agree. Just because you might think Christians do put up with a lot in America doesn't mean you are an auto vote for Trump, it feels like no matter what I post now, simply because I have voiced the possibility I am voting for Trump, "Everything that boy posts must be met with fire and hell"

That's sad but that's where we have arrived with the secret Clinton in Sheep's Wool crowd. 
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WHO are these elites and politicians who want Christians to "bend over"? Please be specific with names. In what way do they want Christians to bend over? Please offer some examples. Thanks. 

 
FYI...I make one post and get hit with 6, I can't keep up that fast, you don't even give me a chance to even process your post.

It's so obvious the level of hate, it's ridiculous. You can't handle that someone other than the same old boring schmuck got nominated...did you see Bob Dole at the RNC? This party thought he was a good candidate when he ran vs Clinton.

Bush wasn't really a winner in the first election, barely beat Kerry of all folks in '04...the GOP needed a shot of Trump, maybe not this much but they didn't take heed of any warning signs. In fact they turned away from what brought them to this spot in the first place. 

Anyways, you can have your thread back, go back to rubbing each others stones and nodding a lot. 

 
Gary Coal Man said:
I agree that Trump's position is laughable, but that's one proposal that has been widely panned by Republicans and Conservatives.  Many of whom don't view Trump as either a Republican or Conservative.

So we have one outlandish suggestion by a man known for his outlandish suggestions, and that suggestion doesn't have broad support of either the GOP or Conservatives.  And that's somehow proof of Conservatives being the greatest proponents of limiting free speech for the past half century? 

For the most part, people on both sides of the aisle overstate the threat to speech in America.  Thankfully.
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you wanted recent examples. Here is another:

http://www.cnn.com/2016/07/11/politics/gop-platform-republican-convention-internet-pornography/

 
Harry Manback said:
You haven't actually addressed a single factual thing I've said. You haven't answered my honest questions about Trump's tax plan. You haven't provided any examples of people being sued for practicing free speech. You haven't commented on the first amendment and how it dictates we are NOT a Christian Nation. 

Go ahead, block me. It's the cowards way.
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 In other words, MOP being MOP. 

He made this statement a few pages back:

"It's similar to antisemitism laws to shut down any conversation that isn't Pro-whatever. "

and I asked him:

"What anti-Semitism laws are you referring to and what conversation have they shut down?"

and his response?

:crickets:

 
Amused to Death said:
We are NOT governed by Christian law nor morality.  And I don't believe your 83% stat.

I'm not trying shut anyone up.  Quite the contrary.  Everyone has a voice and equal rights.  Christians, OTOH, try to shut out all non-believers and think they can force everyone else to live by their beliefs.  Who's shutting out who?
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That's where are going to differ big time. I have a lot of Christian friends who know I dislike their religion. They put up with me anyways. 

 
Ministry of Pain said:
FYI...I make one post and get hit with 6, I can't keep up that fast, you don't even give me a chance to even process your post.

It's so obvious the level of hate, it's ridiculous. You can't handle that someone other than the same old boring schmuck got nominated...did you see Bob Dole at the RNC? This party thought he was a good candidate when he ran vs Clinton.

Bush wasn't really a winner in the first election, barely beat Kerry of all folks in '04...the GOP needed a shot of Trump, maybe not this much but they didn't take heed of any warning signs. In fact they turned away from what brought them to this spot in the first place. 

Anyways, you can have your thread back, go back to rubbing each others stones and nodding a lot. 
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MOP, please don't go away without offering at least one example of elites and politicians "sticking it" to Christians. You make these blatant accusations over and over again and when challenged you refuse to back them up or be specific in any way.  

 
Ministry of Pain said:
They aren't opposed to it, they simply want Christians to bend over and put up with everything. Most religions are allowed to scream bloody murder when something doesn't gel with their little rules or guidelines. Christians are just expected to put up and allow everything to fly. 

You can post otherwise but I bet we could find some devout Christians who agree. Just because you might think Christians do put up with a lot in America doesn't mean you are an auto vote for Trump, it feels like no matter what I post now, simply because I have voiced the possibility I am voting for Trump, "Everything that boy posts must be met with fire and hell"

That's sad but that's where we have arrived with the secret Clinton in Sheep's Wool crowd. 
Click to expand...
Really?  Like what?

It seems like maybe you're conflating laws that regulate what a person can and can't do with laws that regulate what other people can and can't do.  "Putting up with" someone telling you what you can do with your body/stuff/self/legal relationships is very different from "putting up with" someone doing things to their own body/stuff/self/legal relationships.

 
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