What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

***OFFICIAL*** Minnesota Vikings 2016 Season Thread (1 Viewer)

Regarding QB's, after cutting Stave any rumbles about whether they are going to stick with Heinicke as their developmental QB or look at other options like Aaron Murray?

 
scott46984 said:
Regarding QB's, after cutting Stave any rumbles about whether they are going to stick with Heinicke as their developmental QB or look at other options like Aaron Murray?
Click to expand...
IIRC they really like(d) Heinecke. He would have had a chance to at least be Hill or Bradfords backup and who knows, maybe the FO wouldn't have been so aggressive if he was in camp healthy. 

 
Prediction...

2016 - Hill starts until the bye, Bradford after that. Total QB play similar to Teddy last year. 

Heinecke is healthy halfway through this season and Stave is on PS. 

2017 - Bradford starts. Hill is 3rd string. Heinecke is backup. Teddy on PUP. When Teddy is healthy Hill is cut. If Bradford is playing poorly Teddy starts some games. 

2018 - Who knows. Teddys 5th year option is pick up, Bradford would need to be resigned...

 
Garrett Grayson... not a Viking topic but find myself admiring how the Saints went about this. They had an elite QB already in Brees and holes up and down the line up, but still took a stab with pick #75 to select the 3rd QB off the board in the 2015 draft. Clearly a player the front office and scouts pegged as being the heir apparent. He never saw the field, but the Saints invested an NFL season and this past offseason grooming him. So I guess they were all in, right? Nope. They didn't feel like this had to work out to save face; didn't say he needs more time and subject the fan base to 2 years of misery before recognizing a mistake - they cut bait and moved on. How refreshing.

 
I hear ya Jim. I am not opposed to using a 3rd round pick on developmental QB next season even if Bridgewaters recovery is going well and we are happy with Bradfords play and give him a new contract.

Better to let these guys fail in practice than on the field.

The QB position is so important. We have invested 2nd round pick into back up RB Toby Gerhart, no reason they shouldn't be doing this at QB as well.

The Vikings seem like they may have found a good player in Kearse, but a safety that can handle playing single high besides Smith would still be nice. I would also like to see the Vikings invest more into the offensive line with higher draft picks as we have discussed before.

I don't think having too many good QB is ever a problem. Look at what we just paid for one.

 
Totally agree. I don't think it even has to be a 3rd if the right guy slides. But if the right guy slides, we need to throw away the original plan and take him. Case in point, I said in critique of the 2015 draft that I was going to track the choices made:

4.11 TJ Clemmings

5.07 MyCole Pruitt

5.10 Stefan Diggs

5.11 Brett Hundley (Green Bay)

I don't think we took bad players or anything, in fact the pick of Diggs was a gem. Yet, 2 or 4 years down the road I felt it was a string of decisions we'd look back on. Loved what I saw of Hundley taking control in Gruden's QB Camp. Could be stomach turning to watch since he's now a cheese head, but I think any football fan would be impressed with that clip from 12:30-16:30, and from 19:30 on. Just a cognitive leader with positive energy who you can tell has the tools and is going to be very receptive to coaching. I don;t think an NFL team can go wrong having a gun like that in reserve at all times. That's the sort of prospect a fanbase can get energized by if the starter goes down, as compared to, well, being left with the likes of Shawn Hill and Stave (or the longer list of QB2/QB3 options we've rostered over the past decade). I actually think fans will tolerate losing in that situation so long as it is losing with the sort of prospect who gives a glimpse of a promising alternate future. Not sure we have that yet even after sacrificing for the Bradford trade. But man, to pass on Hundley twice in the 5th and grab Heineke as a UDFA prospect, that's going to sting me for a while. Next year, we have to grab 'that guy' if he's there.  

 
Last edited by a moderator:
I do think having quality WR for new QB to work with really helps with their development. Back when we had Chris Carter and Moss, the Vikings were able to plug a lot of different QB into the offense and still be successful because the WR made those QB look better than they are.

The Vikings have had a pretty long drought at WR recently. Percy Harvin being a jerk extended that problem, then Patterson not developing and it has been pretty poor suppoting cast for any QB to work with. I think we found a gem in Diggs that can help turn this situation around. If Charles Johnson plays well and Treadwell develops, this looks like the best WR the Vikings have had in a long time.

With Zimmer as the coach and how bad the defense was before he got here I am glad they have focused so many resources into the defense. I think the team is really solid across the board with the only remaining weakness being at safety, that is possibly solved if Kearse and Harris develop into starting caliber players. Then the only hole would be a 3rd LB, which the Vikings do not use that much anyways. Kearse if he continues to improve his tackling might fill that 3rd LB role as a WLB/SS hybrid.

Robison is getting old but I think Hunter is great. Weatherly showed some nice push and some quickness as a DE that seems promising. The Vikings have been really good at identifying DE talent and getting players like Robison, Hunter and Griffen with 3rd and 4th round picks. I think they have done a great job there. In the Denny Green years and after that, the VIkings really struggled finding DLine talent. It kind of took the trade for Jared Allen to turn that around.

Maybe having good players at a position already on the team helps the team judge player prospects from those positions better? Just looking at it from historical point of view, it somewhat seems that way. Maybe it is because of good players also being good examples and teachers of other players at their position. Maybe it is mostly coaching and the coaches being in tune with the scouting department. I am not sure. It does seem kind of like a trend however.

With the defense pretty much settled for the next few seasons (assuming we can retain the talented players) the Vikings should be able to focus draft picks towards the offense next season I think. Offensive line help and perhaps a developmental QB or one of those good TE coming out.

 
I recall Zimmer making positive comments about him before.

I did not think Sirles looked good at all. Shepherd and Bykowski seemed more promising to me.

I do think Celmmings looked a bit better than last season. But he still made mistakes and lost guys too quickly.

I am not sure if the Vikings are very good at identifying  offensive line talent right now. The Beavers pick suggests that. The Kalil picks suggests that (although everyone loved Kalil). The Vikings seem to be able to find good centers, but that is maybe about it.

It is hard to say though as a 4th round pick is a relatively high investment in a offensive lineman recently. They have been willing to use high picks on tackles, which we need one to replace Loadholt, so a tackle pick in the future seems like a good idea if a good one should be available in the 2nd round.

Trying to find athletes they have drafted linemen who were converted from the defensive side but lack experience playing offense. There is a longer development curve involved with that and I don't know of many examples of that working out well.

 
Well, I finally cut ties with Cordarrelle from my dynasty team. I won't turn this into a AC post but man, I feel sick after choosing to keep two other 3rd round rookie WRs on a 26 player deep roster. I kept thinking that maybe, just maybe, the new trifecta of OC geniuses might find a way to work an obvious physical freak like Patterson into the offense - at least to the extent "3x5 play card" Musgraves did. I consider myself a reasoned guy; a no-nonsense FFer. It's to the point though that a Dolphin fan in my league suggested I put Patterson on Let Go. 

 
The Vikings are still rumored to be shopping Jarius Wright who Patterson is actually ahead of currently on the depth chart. That's kind of progress.

Likely safe on the wire for the time being though. If Bradford gets hurt then maybe they resort to some crazy wildcat stuff, which in that situation, makes Patterson possibly interesting.

26 roster spots is some wiggle room to hold a few long term guys like this, but if there is something more exciting on the wire I don't see much reason to hesitate cutting CP84.

Thielen seems pretty solidly ahead of him at this point.

 
Biabreakable said:
The Vikings are still rumored to be shopping Jarius Wright who Patterson is actually ahead of currently on the depth chart. That's kind of progress.

Likely safe on the wire for the time being though. If Bradford gets hurt then maybe they resort to some crazy wildcat stuff, which in that situation, makes Patterson possibly interesting.

26 roster spots is some wiggle room to hold a few long term guys like this, but if there is something more exciting on the wire I don't see much reason to hesitate cutting CP84.

Thielen seems pretty solidly ahead of him at this point.
Click to expand...
I would love if they did try to integrate Cordarrell and run some of that stuff this season.  Isn't Tony Sparono the Oline coach now and if I remember correctly he was the HC in Maimi that implement he wildcat?

Thielen is underrated IMO that dude has done nothing but make plays with pretty much every opportunity he's been given.

I was shocked and embarrassed upon first hearing of the Bradford trade as I really don't think he is any good....After reading more into it (on these boards and some of the SI articles about it) these past days I have really come around and feel like it was a pretty good move for all involved and I am gald they did it.

 
In ZImmers press conference he jokes that they plan to run the single wing offense this week.

Sparano did have success with that in Miami but teams seemed to solve it in the season after that. Similar to teams adjusting to the read option a bit better after 2013. Read option has not gone away the way the wildcat did however.

Thee should be some plays like this they will use once in awhile. I get the understanding from Zimmer that the offensive line will be pretty different than what they have been doing in the past. I hope different means better, but that remains to be seen.

 
Biabreakable said:
I do think having quality WR for new QB to work with really helps with their development. Back when we had Chris Carter and Moss, the Vikings were able to plug a lot of different QB into the offense and still be successful because the WR made those QB look better than they are.
Click to expand...
Yes, we've had a lot of reasons why Vikes QBs have been unsuccessful. A key part of that though is TJack and Ponder were bad. Their subsequent irrelevance at other NFL stops has carved that into history. The difference between Tarvaris and a rookie Russell Wilson in the same Seattle offense was night/day. They were not franchise QBs, and should never have been treated as if they were during their time in Minnesota. That's why I admired the New Orleans situation... they planned ahead instead of waiting for, and operating under, significant QB desperation. They were able to make a reasoned decision assessing a guy on the practice field. It didn't work out this time, but the reality is a drafted QB is not always going to be that guy. More frequently he won't be. Maybe Teddy is that guy, or maybe he isn't, but the process for determining that has been operating like he definitely is for 2 years.   

I guess that's what bothers me the most. I'm still guzzling the purple kool-aid and hoping for the best because this seems to be an excellent overall team. What the past week tells me though is that, in their hearts, the Vikes weren't actually true believers in their own plan at QB. They did not believe that Hill or Stave could win in the NFL, and hopefully should not even play at all for a team with such high hopes and a new stadium. The Bradford trade tells me there was no way they were starting one of those guys in the stadium opener on national TV. Wouldn't surprise me a bit if they opt to hold Bradford out the first 2 weeks just to ensure that doesn't happen. That's astonishing to me. 

 
BigJim  If you think your backup is trully a winner at QB   An offer will be made, thats too good to rebuke

It is possible we see much older vets see the field and surprise, but its rare

When ya start doing math   ie.  15 NFL teams have Franchise QB's?

Its near impossible for there to be 32 winning QB's, much less two on a few teams..

Bottom line this aint Denver..  Sam is a nice addition  

Hopefully Hill or Stave could help finish out a Big game if needed (which would be fantastic imho)

 
VikesGuys, thanks for all the early replies. Need your help one more time: anything worth knowing about McKinnon's foot or Charles Johnson's quad that would hold you back from making a deal that would include either of them? Not giving up a great deal, just want McKinnon as AP insurance, and willing to take Johnson's contract off the McKinnon owner to get the deal done, but I see Jet isn't practicing at all, and CJ is limited. Would appreciate some local knowledge. Thanks!

 
nittanylion,

Right now I think it is pretty impossible to know because Mike Zimmer won't say and won't allow any of his staff or players go into detail about injuries either. If there is information about it, that info could easily be false. Remember HC Rivera saying that Benjamin would only play 30-35 snaps? Not sure how many he played but it looked like more than that to me.

Charles Johnson is back practicing in full

That is about as positive as you can really hope for that Johnson is practicing in full.

Jerick McKinnon, Charles Johnson Questionable vs. Titans

So it sounds like McKinnon was limited Wed, sat out Thursday and practice was limited Friday.

I don't see these things as serious enough to have it affect a trade, but a foot injury for a RB is a concern. If McKinnon has turf toe for example, that is something that can linger for months and impairs the players ability to cut well. It becomes pain management for the player as only time really heals that. See CJ Anderson last season. If it is another part of the foot besides the toes I don't really know.

 
Zimmer on Titans Prep, Evaluating After Week One

He says McKinnon is fine without any hesitation. Right after he does so, he teases the press about the injury report asking them was he questionable or probable? Oh yeah there is no probable anymore (laughing). 

He makes some interesting comments about the first game of the season being kind of a wildcard. More randomness. More unknowns. He also says that what happens in the first week is not necessarily what the team(s) will be like for most of the season. Kind of alluding back to the Vikings losing the first game last year, but showing resilience to play better than that for the rest of the season. 

I am reading into this that if they still had the probable category on the injury report, that is likely how they would list McKinnon. They don't have that anymore though, so he is questionable.

Coaches lie too so who knows.

 
:sadbanana:  Sad to hear multiple ligaments needed repair for Teddy. Is there anyone that has come back from multiple torn ligaments in one knee at the same time and been anything close to what they were? This just screams Robert Edwards to me.

 
jestertj said:
:sadbanana:  Sad to hear multiple ligaments needed repair for Teddy. Is there anyone that has come back from multiple torn ligaments in one knee at the same time and been anything close to what they were? This just screams Robert Edwards to me.
Click to expand...
Want to say Edwards had nerve damage, which would be a huge difference. They already said that did not occur with Teddy, assuming the initial report is reliable.

 
The PCL being torn is an injury many players have struggled to come back from, and having multiple ligaments torn is more severe than only one.

From what I have heard the surgery was successful though and that they expect Teddy to make a full recovery.

There is no way to really know how well Teddy will play when he comes back. It is certainly possible he loses some of his former mobility even with a full recovery.

Teddy is still very young, which does help the healing process. I read quite a bit about this a few years ago in regards to Marcus Lattimore and also because of Peterson's injury. It sounded like college football players recovered at a higher rate than some of the older pro players have. If the player was 23 or 24 years old or younger, they had a higher percentage of recovery.

Teddy Bridgewater had his left knee surgically repaired yesterday. The procedure was performed by Dr. Dan Cooper at the Carrell Clinic in Dallas, TX. The knee dislocation resulted in Teddy needing a multi-ligament reconstruction. I was able to be present in Dallas, support Teddy and observe the entire procedure. The repair was excellent and gives Teddy every reason to be very optimistic  LINK
Click to expand...
I have a lot of faith in the Vikings medical staff to support Teddy through the recovery process. 

A QB does need to be mobile, but it isn't as essential for a QB as it is for a RB, which was the position I was mostly focused on in regard to injuries. I think the recovery rate for players from the QB position is higher than running back, but I could be wrong about that.

Each injury and player is different. Teddy's injury was more serious than an injury of a single ligament.

 
20 minutes to game time :excited:

Vikes D comes out fired up causing a few turnovers, and ADP runs all over the Titans D...  23-13 Vikings!

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Nice win by the Vikes today..

Norv REALLY needs to change his game plan.. When the D is daring you to throw by putting 8, 9 and sometimes 10 on the line, get your QB, whomever it is, to audible out to a pass.

25-16  Pretty close to my pregame call.

Next up, home opener vs. Packers... and a week of Who will be the starting QB.. :oldunsure:

 
snogger said:
Nice win by the Vikes today..

Norv REALLY needs to change his game plan.. When the D is daring you to throw by putting 8, 9 and sometimes 10 on the line, get your QB, whomever it is, to audible out to a pass.

25-16  Pretty close to my pregame call.

Next up, home opener vs. Packers... and a week of Who will be the starting QB.. :oldunsure:
Click to expand...
This team is built to win games but damn it's not very fun to watch. 

 
mr roboto said:
snogger said:
Nice win by the Vikes today..

Norv REALLY needs to change his game plan.. When the D is daring you to throw by putting 8, 9 and sometimes 10 on the line, get your QB, whomever it is, to audible out to a pass.

25-16  Pretty close to my pregame call.

Next up, home opener vs. Packers... and a week of Who will be the starting QB.. :oldunsure:
Click to expand...
This team is built to win games but damn it's not very fun to watch. 
Click to expand...
Thanks to Teddy's injury you better get use to it for this year.. Even if they go to Bradford they are not going to change the game plan up.. Season looks like it will be "Game Manager" QB, with lots of dead-end runs up the middle, a few Play action passes, 1 or 2 deep attempts and leave it to the Defense to win it.. :mellow:

 
Andy Dufresne said:
If that's all we're going to get out of him then this will be AP's last year as a Viking
Click to expand...
Too be expected.. No way are they paying him what he is due next year.. And can't put all the blame on him.. Play calling sucked most of the game.. All his runs were straight up the middle vs. sometimes 10 men .. Asiata didn't fare much better on his runs... No RB is going to get much running into a :wall:

 
Let's see, who's out there for free agent kickers besides Gould?

Cause the way they're playing, they need one better than Walsh.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
jestertj said:
Let's see, who's out there for free agent kickers besides Gould?

Cause the way they're playing, they need one better than Walsh.
Click to expand...
Naw, they just need to make sure all tries are 40 yards or longer.. If it is inside that range, tell the OL to Hold, jump Off sides, do whatever it takes to get outside 40 ;)

 
Things were looking pretty grim in the 1st half. Just no fire really on either side of the ball. The defense looked a bit flat footed due to the many run option looks being presented. A few times Murray and Henry both being on the field.

The second half a different story as the defense made some great plays and got a bit lucky with Mariota shooting the foot on the zone read option.

I don't mind winning ugly. I enjoy watching good defense. Patterson sparked the team with his return to start the second half.

Great defense against the run by the Titans. Peterson always seems to start a bit slow from not playing in preseason. They had a lot of defenders at the line though.

From what I saw Saun Hill was often going to Charles Johnson on 3rd down against McCourtey in single coverage. Not sure if they were doubling Diggs in those situations or not. Johnson was open on several of those but the ball just off target.

Happy to come away with the win. Not sure if Hill or Bradford will start next week. Hill did ok though, could have been worse.

 
Given Johnson's lack of production, do you think that we'll see Treadwell a few weeks sooner than expected? CJ hasn't really been able to put it together during a game, despite sounding like he is great in practice. It was interesting that Wright was the inactive WR today, makes me wonder if Treadwell is closer than the Vikings have been letting on.

Happy to come out with a win, DF stepped up big. I don't put the lack of production only on AP's shoulders - there was too many people up in the box on DF and Norv didn't try to disguise his runs up the gut at all. You do have to pound the ball, but try swinging it out or something.

 
Charles Johnson was open Hill just overthrew him on one of those. There was a contested catch on one I think where McCourtey played it well.

It is only one game. I would assume Johnson has been playing better than Treadwell otherwise they wouldn't have named Johnson the starter. One game doesn't change that. From what I could tell Charles Johnson was doing his job.

Johnson has more speed than Treadwell, so I think they have different roles in the offense anyways. Still waiting for Treadwell to develop into his.

Bradford should be able to take better advantage of Johnson than Hill, once Bradford is ready.

With Teddy I think the Vikings may have thrown the ball a bit more and been more successful on some of those throws When Bradford does take over as the starter, they will likely still try to be conservative as they can with him early on.

 
Unfortunately I have kind of lost faith in CJ - I want to, and he has the measurements, but he's only put it together for about 1/2 a year. Other than that he's been injured or ineffective, and generally unable to handle being the #1 (or maybe #2 if you put Diggs as the #1) WR. I believe Treadwell is currently slotted behind his position, I don't think they'd be moving Diggs or Thielen if Treadwell comes on the field.

Better sort out the offensive woes by next week, you aren't going to win on 2 DF TDs each week.

 
9 man fronts are definitely frustrating. I'm not convinced we were going to be rid of them in 2016 even with a healthy Teddy, because we'd first need to demonstrate downfield threat of some sort. It sort of puzzles me though, that a 9 man front both frustrates the run and shortens the time a QB has to look downfield on play action. Unless you're playing against Drew Brees or a QB like Wilson who is a threat to run past it, you'd think it would be a base defense used by more NFL teams - given how effective it seems against the Vikes. Would love to see more slants to Diggs and Patterson to try to get them quickly into 1-1 in space.    

 
Doesn't feel like "Packer week".. not sure if it is because it is so early in the season or the Teddy injury :shrug:

At least my stress level for the game won't be nearly as high as it normally would be... seeing how the Jags D held them basically in check I think the Vikes D will keep it close... 

Will wait until they announce the starting QB ( I think it will be Bradford ) before I make my prediction :popcorn:

 
BigJim® said:
9 man fronts are definitely frustrating. I'm not convinced we were going to be rid of them in 2016 even with a healthy Teddy, because we'd first need to demonstrate downfield threat of some sort. It sort of puzzles me though, that a 9 man front both frustrates the run and shortens the time a QB has to look downfield on play action. Unless you're playing against Drew Brees or a QB like Wilson who is a threat to run past it, you'd think it would be a base defense used by more NFL teams - given how effective it seems against the Vikes. Would love to see more slants to Diggs and Patterson to try to get them quickly into 1-1 in space.    
Click to expand...
More than other teams, the Vikings feed on running the ball, and it opens up everything they do. They aren't built to go throw the ball a ton, so when the run isn't working, it leads to short drives and leaves the defense on the on the field a long time.

 
Maelstrom said:
More than other teams, the Vikings feed on running the ball, and it opens up everything they do. They aren't built to go throw the ball a ton, so when the run isn't working, it leads to short drives and leaves the defense on the on the field a long time.
Click to expand...
I could probably count on one hand the teams that pass to set up the run (New England, New Orleans, maybe Pittsburgh and Giants although each of those try to get the run game going). Most others follow the age old practice of using run to set up the pass, albeit perhaps with less predictability. I'm just sort of confused that this is not a 1 or 2 game unexpected thing but rather a multi year weekly thing. Clearly the book is out on the Vikes until they can make defenses pay for it. 

 
snogger said:
Doesn't feel like "Packer week".. not sure if it is because it is so early in the season or the Teddy injury :shrug:

At least my stress level for the game won't be nearly as high as it normally would be... seeing how the Jags D held them basically in check I think the Vikes D will keep it close... 

Will wait until they announce the starting QB ( I think it will be Bradford ) before I make my prediction :popcorn:
Click to expand...
Zimmer maybe took the wind out of our sails a bit saying we need to beat Green Bush more for it to be a rivalry. Seems like the right approach making this just another game.

I usually get more pumped up for it as well, but we are in damage control mode right now, so it doesn't really matter who we are playing. Just consider all the games to be hard, each one is as important as the others.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

The Noid
2025 Philadelphia Eagles - Just keep throwing second-tier CB darts until one hits the bullseye is certainly a strategy.
60 61 62
Replies
3K
Views
346K
Snotbubbles
Snotbubbles
F
Shark Pool Home League #4 (FBG Home Leagues)
2 3
Replies
149
Views
3K
OldMilwaukee
OldMilwaukee
Joe Bryant
Vikings WR2 not currently on roster?
Replies
28
Views
885
Bri
B

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 1 (members: 0, guests: 1)
Back
Top