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***Official Pro Wrestling Thread*** (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter NewlyRetired
- Start date
Bogart
Footballguy
The longest workout is just over an hour. Most fall into the 30 - 40 mins per session. Some are 15 mins long. The program recommends starting at 3 days a week, and moving up to 5-7 days.
Bogart
Footballguy
I need to be better about my diet. I'm not doing the diet plan with the DDP Yoga book, I'm going Slow-Carb from Tim Ferriss' book "The 4 Hour Body"
And I really wasn't as strict as I wanted to be with the workouts. Which is stupid. I felt great when I did it, not as great when I didn't. Trying to start my day with it now.
Thx. Think I'm going to order this. I can't believe they only have DVDs and no digital option. Any special yoga mat you recommend?
Bogart
Footballguy
Agree about the Digital. Would love to have the workouts on my iPad. The MP3s don't do me a lot of good, I need to see the moves.
I think I got the cheapest one I could find on Amazon, ProSource maybe?, and it's been great. Jericho talks about just using a towel.
He's got an App that's supposed to be releasing this month that I believe will have all of the moves. I'm not sure if it is tied directly to DDPYoga and would be an add-on to it or if it is going to be a standalone product, but something to keep a look out for.
Bogart
Footballguy
He did mention the App at the movie premiere. Coming out on Black Friday. Monthly fee. Giving all the current owners of DDPYoga a free three months or so. I would imagine the workouts will be on there. That's a good point.
JB Breakfast Club
Footballguy
MSG show was a really good show. Brock Lesnar matches are so special.
KiddLattimer
Footballguy
Jeremy
Footballguy
Jeremy
Footballguy
Smackdown was good this week too. They seem to do better when they're not trying to be commercials for the next WWE Network show, which is what Raw feels like.
Maybe I'm a harsher critic, but I didn't think the MSG show was anything special. I thought this week's NXT was better.
Jericho-Owens was good, Lesnar-Show was fun and New Day-Dudleyz was ok, but everything else was boring as hell. Its not the performers fault, Seth Rollins doing a frog splash off the top of a cage should matter, but it just didn't. There was ZERO drama in that match, it was just a wait for Kane deal.
The biggest problem I had with it, is that WWE has ZERO idea what makes for a good feud. People fighting every week, regardless of objective match quality, doesn't make a good feud, it just makes lazy storytelling, and it is by far the #1 reason the ratings are down, bigger the Monday Night Football even.
I mean, Sheamus and Orton could have a 5* back and forth akin to Hart-Austin, and would anyone care? They need to separate them permanently, because its basically a cue to start paying attention to anything else whenever they have a match. Likewise, I like Neville, I like Stardust. Have either of them had a match against anyone else since July?
What is the logic in these "feuds?" I know people complain that too much of NXT is jobber squashes, but that is 100% better than repetitive matches that just don't matter at all. I feel like we've been getting about 6 matches a week on Raw, and 4-5 of them are the same every week, only with either non-finishes, or distraction finishes, building to a PPV match that is exactly the same but has a 50-50 shot of a clean finish, and then the "feuds" continue for some reason.
They employ over 100 wrestlers, why are there only seemingly like 6 combinations of them available? I hate to armchair quarterback and say I could do a better job writing this stuff, but I could do a better job writing this stuff. Frankly, so could they, they do it on NXT every week. I'll never understand how in any walk of life, how if something is losing money, or viewers, or popularity, that defaulting to the status quo time after time, is somehow a logical solution.
Also, the stories they have been telling lately have such weird heel-face dynamics, that it comes across like a bad game of telephone. Look at Seth Rollins last 4 months. He's had all the odds stacked against him, by the very people who are supposed to essentially be his biggest allies, not only has he kept the World title, but he won the US title, and possibly only lost it because he had to defend both titles, the same night, against 2 HOF guys. He's the one never giving up and overcoming all the odds of late. Logically, he should be the biggest face in the company right now, but the crowd is supposed to boo him, because...? It just seems so weird that they run these stories where the heel does one bad thing, and then gets infinite comeuppance for it, and the crowd is supposed to see them as the bad guy when logically, they are basically bullying victims at that point, I mean Rollins has somehow become arguably the most sympathetic character on the show of late.
So yeah, I enjoyed Jericho-Owens, it was a fresh matchup and had an unexpected finish. Lesnar-Show was a relatively fresh matchup, and New Day-Dudleyz was relatively fresh as well, though they will obviously milk that cow until its dry soon enough. Hell, I'm sure they will have some 6-man match or something with a distraction or non-finish on Raw tonight.
I'll keep looking forward to NXT: Respect, knowing that it will be the best show since NXT:Brooklyn, and will be until NXT:London, because at least things matter, and make sense on NXT.
Jericho-Owens was good, Lesnar-Show was fun and New Day-Dudleyz was ok, but everything else was boring as hell. Its not the performers fault, Seth Rollins doing a frog splash off the top of a cage should matter, but it just didn't. There was ZERO drama in that match, it was just a wait for Kane deal.
The biggest problem I had with it, is that WWE has ZERO idea what makes for a good feud. People fighting every week, regardless of objective match quality, doesn't make a good feud, it just makes lazy storytelling, and it is by far the #1 reason the ratings are down, bigger the Monday Night Football even.
I mean, Sheamus and Orton could have a 5* back and forth akin to Hart-Austin, and would anyone care? They need to separate them permanently, because its basically a cue to start paying attention to anything else whenever they have a match. Likewise, I like Neville, I like Stardust. Have either of them had a match against anyone else since July?
What is the logic in these "feuds?" I know people complain that too much of NXT is jobber squashes, but that is 100% better than repetitive matches that just don't matter at all. I feel like we've been getting about 6 matches a week on Raw, and 4-5 of them are the same every week, only with either non-finishes, or distraction finishes, building to a PPV match that is exactly the same but has a 50-50 shot of a clean finish, and then the "feuds" continue for some reason.
They employ over 100 wrestlers, why are there only seemingly like 6 combinations of them available? I hate to armchair quarterback and say I could do a better job writing this stuff, but I could do a better job writing this stuff. Frankly, so could they, they do it on NXT every week. I'll never understand how in any walk of life, how if something is losing money, or viewers, or popularity, that defaulting to the status quo time after time, is somehow a logical solution.
Also, the stories they have been telling lately have such weird heel-face dynamics, that it comes across like a bad game of telephone. Look at Seth Rollins last 4 months. He's had all the odds stacked against him, by the very people who are supposed to essentially be his biggest allies, not only has he kept the World title, but he won the US title, and possibly only lost it because he had to defend both titles, the same night, against 2 HOF guys. He's the one never giving up and overcoming all the odds of late. Logically, he should be the biggest face in the company right now, but the crowd is supposed to boo him, because...? It just seems so weird that they run these stories where the heel does one bad thing, and then gets infinite comeuppance for it, and the crowd is supposed to see them as the bad guy when logically, they are basically bullying victims at that point, I mean Rollins has somehow become arguably the most sympathetic character on the show of late.
So yeah, I enjoyed Jericho-Owens, it was a fresh matchup and had an unexpected finish. Lesnar-Show was a relatively fresh matchup, and New Day-Dudleyz was relatively fresh as well, though they will obviously milk that cow until its dry soon enough. Hell, I'm sure they will have some 6-man match or something with a distraction or non-finish on Raw tonight.
I'll keep looking forward to NXT: Respect, knowing that it will be the best show since NXT:Brooklyn, and will be until NXT:London, because at least things matter, and make sense on NXT.
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NewlyRetired
Footballguy
ok this might seem silly but did anyone notice something really odd with the audio mixing tonight on raw of you have a home theater sound system?
The crowd and Haymen sounded correct.
But the announcers were mixed only into the rear channels. Cole only on the rear right and JBL only on the rear left channel.
I am only in the first segment so I don't know if this continues through out the episode..
The crowd and Haymen sounded correct.
But the announcers were mixed only into the rear channels. Cole only on the rear right and JBL only on the rear left channel.
I am only in the first segment so I don't know if this continues through out the episode..
Jeremy
Footballguy
Dogg, you make some good points. I do think the MSG show was meant more as a house show than a Raw or a PPV in terms of advancing storylines. Lesnar/Show was a way to show just how powerful and dominant Lesnar is. Otherwise I saw it as a way to say "hey, come see our shows live. This is what they're like".
But I agree with most of what you wrote. The booking is very confusing and disjointed. It's impossible to tell who's heel or face in many cases. My wife who sits in the room doing needlework only half paying attention asked last night why Stephanie is giving Seth a hard time when previously they had hand picked him and even built a statue for him. I was hard pressed to give her an answer that made sense. The best I could come up with is that Seth is so annoying even his allies can't stand him. But why not pick somebody else then? I've heard that Vince wants to move away from traditional good guy/bad guy stuff, but I think that's the wrong approach. It's just confusing to the audience.
I suppose part of that is due to the audience itself. A guy like Kevin Owens is just about the most perfect heel there is. For all the anti-bullying stuff out there, he's an easy guy to hate for the kids in the audience. When the odds aren't in his favor, he retreats. Classic heel behavior. But the 20-somethings love him. So he kind of falls in the grey area by default.
Still, they can do better. The only explanation I can come up with is that they're saving the good stuff for the "major" PPVs, especially WrestleMania.
NXT is kind of hit or miss for me. The stuff about them that's good is really good. The rest is guys who will be back in the Indies in a few months. But if you have a 1 hour show and 20 minutes of it is excellent, it still leaves you feeling satisfied. Instead of seeing your favorites 2-3 times a week, you might only see them once or twice a month, which makes it seems like a real treat. Would we be looking as forward to Bailey vs Sasha tomorrow if we were getting a steady stream of promos, tag matches, and skirmishes several times a week for the last month?
But I agree with most of what you wrote. The booking is very confusing and disjointed. It's impossible to tell who's heel or face in many cases. My wife who sits in the room doing needlework only half paying attention asked last night why Stephanie is giving Seth a hard time when previously they had hand picked him and even built a statue for him. I was hard pressed to give her an answer that made sense. The best I could come up with is that Seth is so annoying even his allies can't stand him. But why not pick somebody else then? I've heard that Vince wants to move away from traditional good guy/bad guy stuff, but I think that's the wrong approach. It's just confusing to the audience.
I suppose part of that is due to the audience itself. A guy like Kevin Owens is just about the most perfect heel there is. For all the anti-bullying stuff out there, he's an easy guy to hate for the kids in the audience. When the odds aren't in his favor, he retreats. Classic heel behavior. But the 20-somethings love him. So he kind of falls in the grey area by default.
Still, they can do better. The only explanation I can come up with is that they're saving the good stuff for the "major" PPVs, especially WrestleMania.
NXT is kind of hit or miss for me. The stuff about them that's good is really good. The rest is guys who will be back in the Indies in a few months. But if you have a 1 hour show and 20 minutes of it is excellent, it still leaves you feeling satisfied. Instead of seeing your favorites 2-3 times a week, you might only see them once or twice a month, which makes it seems like a real treat. Would we be looking as forward to Bailey vs Sasha tomorrow if we were getting a steady stream of promos, tag matches, and skirmishes several times a week for the last month?
Jeremy
Footballguy
Hmmm...
WWEalerts @WWEalerts 6m6 minutes ago
Vince McMahon is reportedly back to micro-managing WWE creative and overseeing all aspects of the company.
WWEalerts @WWEalerts 6m6 minutes ago
Vince McMahon is reportedly back to micro-managing WWE creative and overseeing all aspects of the company.
GoFishTN
Footballguy
soothsayer
Footballguy
And every time I turn the channel. Same with Ziggler/Rusev. Same with Neville/Goldust. Ugh.
lardonastick
Footballguy
Yeah, I thought it was really strange. Very hard to listen to with that mix.
Craig_MiamiFL
Footballguy
Most of these RAWs just feel like reruns with no storylines.
I only watch bits and pieces these days but the same stuff happens week after week after week.......and then you get it again on Smackdown for 2 hours. Only thing I liked on Raw was what's looking like the start of Ziggler (hopefully heel turning upcoming) vs. Cena. Kane should have retired years ago but the only time he's ever been the least bit interesting the past 10-15 years is in a semi-comedic role. They've destroyed the Big Red Machine/Monster gimmick long long ago.
Even the Brock thing felt like a rerun (with Heyman cutting the same promos he's cut for 6 months now) and him destroying Big Show again like he did 2 days earlier
On unrelated note, the Network's 'Table for 3' shows are pretty interesting if haven't watched them.
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GoFishTN
Footballguy
We've hit essentially the same point in time where Vince stole ECW's ideas (which they stole from Memphis) to create the Attitude Era. But since they've basically put everyone of consequence out of business. where do they steal form now?
Bogart
Footballguy
New Japan. Vince will see a Bullet Club video and think he could do it better. He starts asking everyone to find him this Prince Devitt guy to learn more. HHH finally just puts the old man out of his misery.
MindCrime
Footballguy
Bogart
Footballguy
The Jericho podcast with Insane Clown Posse was a really fun one. I didn't expect it. I knew ICP were/are wrestlers, but didn't realize just how much work they put into it before they were famous and afterwards. Lots of talk about DIY music and wrestling. Lots of talk about backstage beefs in just about every company.
Jericho annoyed me with one too many times mentioning that only he and ICP made it big in both wrestling and music, but I will give him a pass.
Jericho annoyed me with one too many times mentioning that only he and ICP made it big in both wrestling and music, but I will give him a pass.
Jeremy
Footballguy
Wonderful match, even if it couldn't quite match the storytelling of the Brooklyn show. Bayley defending isn't quite as compelling as her being the underdog challenger. But they sure put on a show. By far the most memorable of the night and there was plenty of other good stuff on that show as well.
Sasha is the best, but Bayley is going to make them so much money if they don't eff it up. Which they probably will. Hopefully they put off moving her up to the main roster until Sasha, Charlotte, and Becky are more firmly established. I'd hate to see her get lost in the shuffle.
I don't remember if it was Raw or Smackdown, but one of the Bellas pointed out that "The Boss" was kind of taking over team BAD in an attempt to create dissention. Hopefully Sasha does like the Rock did with the Nation of Domination back in the day. And with the Paige heel turn, hopefully we're starting to see these factions split up to where we can get some singles feuds.
Jeremy
Footballguy
This is one of the few things that's kind of working for me right now. I thought they had a nice match on RAW. I also liked the New Day taking their heelish ways to a new level on RAW.
They do feel like re-runs. 5 hours is just too much. This is part of what makes NXT more enjoyable. Between the Sasha and Bayley match in Brooklyn and the rematch last night, I think Bayley wrestled once on TV against an "enhancement talent" and maybe a promo or two with the 2 women. The anticipation for the rematch felt like waiting for Christmas to arrive when you were a kid.
If this feud had taken place in the WWE we'd have those promos twice a week, then recaps of what we just saw after the commercial, maybe a few run-ins, interruptions, beat downs and tag team matches, before finally having a match during the PPV. Like the earlier example of the Wyatts vs Shield, after 2 months we're sick of it.
You almost can't blame the writers for running out of ideas after a while. "Let's see. We've got Rusev and Ziggler fued, but we can't have them wrestle until the PPV. And... ummm... Ryback is feuding with Owens. Even though there's no connection whatsoever between Rusev and Owens that would make them team with each other, let's make them partners is tag team match". Then let's have that match again the next week with the other team winning, and then let's try some new seemingly random combination.
Craig_MiamiFL
Footballguy
Just finished watching NXT show. Sasha-Bayley tremendous again. It's really just sad to see her having to go to RAW full time.
Wish they'd have put over the legitimate tag teams in the tournament. But looks like they'll go the Joe turning on Balor route. Speaking of Balor, w/o the paint i always wonder why/what they see so much in him, but yet refused to put Tyson Kidd on TV at all for so long. I think it's going to be a struggle for Balor having to be on TV every week live.....and expected to speak.
JMO Too little too late for a Samoa Joe big push. They signed him about 10 years too late. Still a decent worker and at least gotten himself into better shape than his later TNA days, but he's not close to what he was. They really haven't let him do much yet, but his biggest asset is probably on the mic.
------------------
Funny watching CM Punk rip to shreds on Twitter the Susan G Komen Foundation WWE shoves down their programming .
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Cena reportedly taking a couple months off very soon. Should be interesting given their historically low ratings right now.......and that his US Open Challenge has been the only interesting thing on their programming for most of this year.
It's got to come to a head soon that they've got to change up their programming. People simply aren't watching 3 hours of wrestling. They should mix it up with something like a reality type show with their Superstars or something to fill the 3rd hour.
Perhaps USA Network will go to them about cutting to 2 at some point. Something has to be done.
Wish they'd have put over the legitimate tag teams in the tournament. But looks like they'll go the Joe turning on Balor route. Speaking of Balor, w/o the paint i always wonder why/what they see so much in him, but yet refused to put Tyson Kidd on TV at all for so long. I think it's going to be a struggle for Balor having to be on TV every week live.....and expected to speak.
JMO Too little too late for a Samoa Joe big push. They signed him about 10 years too late. Still a decent worker and at least gotten himself into better shape than his later TNA days, but he's not close to what he was. They really haven't let him do much yet, but his biggest asset is probably on the mic.
------------------
Funny watching CM Punk rip to shreds on Twitter the Susan G Komen Foundation WWE shoves down their programming .
-----------------------
Cena reportedly taking a couple months off very soon. Should be interesting given their historically low ratings right now.......and that his US Open Challenge has been the only interesting thing on their programming for most of this year.
It's got to come to a head soon that they've got to change up their programming. People simply aren't watching 3 hours of wrestling. They should mix it up with something like a reality type show with their Superstars or something to fill the 3rd hour.
Perhaps USA Network will go to them about cutting to 2 at some point. Something has to be done.
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A couple(dozen?) thoughts on the NXT Show:
You ever have those moments where you think somebody’s a great wrestler and could get over in WWE, and then they show up and you’re like, “wow, I had NO IDEA?” That was Asuka’s debut at TakeOver. I’ve been watching Kana for years, and it wasn’t until she popped Dana Brooke’s pose and spun around in place between everything that I realized how perfect she is for WWE TV. She’s beautiful and great at wrestling, sure, but she’s also enough of a showboaty dork (a la Finn) to seem larger than life. She just … fits.
And God bless Dana Brooke for hanging in there and being the perfect character to make the story work. Her patting Asuka on the head was amazing. The crowd reaction was just a horrified gasp, like as a collective group, like the audience was just internally screaming, "Oh my god, what are you doing?" as if they had just seen a small child kick a sleeping bear or something. Dana deserves a high-five for being half of maybe my favorite NXT debut ever. She also won with a crossface chickenwing, AKA my favorite finishing move EVER, its awesome someone is finally doing it again.
Also, maybe my favorite part was the after match, where Emma is about to go collect her friend and help her to the back, and Asuka walks over to Emma. Often in these situations, the heel will shove, or taunt the face and a brawl will start, but that was not what happened. Emma doesn't do any of those things, because she is terrified of Asuka. Emma was great here, her demeanor was that she was so scared of what could happen to her, that she couldn't even make eye contact. It was like her internal monologue was just softly repeating, "please don't hurt me, please don't hurt me" until Asuka left. One night in the company, and it wouldn't be out of line to already call Asuka the #1 contender.
As for Bayley-Sasha, this is what it feels like to watch wrestling that matters. Everything WWE’s patting themselves on the back over here is true. It’s awesome that the women have been given the main event of a live special, and a thousand times more awesome that they deserve it. It’s not a situation where they say, “people want women’s equality, let’s put a women’s match in the main to make them happy.” They learned in Brooklyn that when you have two women who are this good and have been in the company this long and have this much history, nothing can follow it. Owens and Finn in a ladder match can’t follow it. An awesome tag tournament wouldn’t follow it, either. It’s the main event because it’s the main event, and NXT’s the one place in the WWE Universe where you can trust the people in charge will notice what’s happening in front of them.
As serious as this got, I loved the funny thing on the preshow, where they asked Bayley why she wore gold at Brooklyn(because it was a championship match) and why she was wearing red and gold tonight(because it is an ironman match, and those are Iron Man's colors)
The thing you want to point out when you watch this match is the callbacks. One of the odd things WWE does is say that every PPV cycle is a fresh start, and everyone’s in-ring rivalries reset. If you wrestle John Cena once, he’ll be able to hit you with the same moves in the same way the next time you wrestle. If you learn to reverse it, it doesn’t really matter … you reversed it because you reversed it, not because of anything specific you learned from the story told in the previous match.
The callbacks to Brooklyn allowed the Iron Man match to feel like a sequel, and not look like an attempt to top it. There’s no way to “top” an emotional situation like Bayley and Sasha in Brooklyn, but if you say, “that happened, so now THIS is happening,” you allow Brooklyn to make Respect matter more than it would’ve before. There’s so much here, from the way Sasha responds with silence instead of taunting when Bayley’s in the corner, to the catching of the counter later in the match. The Banks Statement rolled back into the center of the ring saw Bayley counter it in Brooklyn, so she goes for the same counter here, and Sasha counters the counter. The poisoned rana from the top rope that meant the end for Sasha in Brooklyn gets countered at Full Sail. In Brooklyn, Sasha took advantage of Bayley’s injured hand and crushed it against the ring steps. Here, Bayley smashes SASHA’s hand in the steps.
The best part is that the moments aren’t just fan service or whatever, they tell the story of the match. Sasha’s finish is a crossface. If her hand is injured, she can’t get a grip and lock in the move like she needs. This allows Bayley to stay in the move longer, and increase the drama at the end of the match without making it look ridiculous that Bayley hasn’t tapped. Even better, Sasha sells on offense … she can’t lock in the grip, so she has to grab her wrist with her good hand for the torque. Bayley’s able to counter by gripping the injured hand and bending it back. When Sasha’s able to hit a backstabber in the final moments of the match, Bayley has a full grip of the injured hand … Sasha can’t hit the move like she wants, and Bayley’s able to roll with it, deal with the pain and lock in an armbar WITH THE HAND(almost like a modified Rings of Saturn) for the win. Even better, she stomps Sasha in the back of the head while she does it. It all ties together. It’s a story that makes wrestling real. It makes wrestling matter. The actual wrestling, I mean. The stuff they do is supposed to lead to something, not just exist to fill time before they do the cooler moves.
That sounds like a dorky point of view, but it works. Look at the crowd. Listen to them. Read the feedback from almost anyone who watched it. These matches are AMAZING, and not because they did cool stuff on a show WWE told us was important … they used pro wrestling to make pro wrestling fans feel the way they desperately, absolutely want to feel about pro wrestling. Cool entrances and funny spots and are one thing. Pro wrestling working like it’s supposed to is irreplaceable.
The emotional component missing from Brooklyn was Izzy. It sounds ridiculous to say “this ONE FAN has to be there,” but that’s part of the NXT experience. If you aren’t familiar with her, Izzy is Bayley’s superfan. She dresses like her, wears her shirt, cries when she watches her win big matches on TV and wears a special, sparkly headband that Bayley gave her, and only her and Bayley have. When Bayley returned to Full Sail as NXT Champion, she brought Izzy into the ring to pose with her.
Sasha tosses Bayley into the LED screen at the entrance, then gets in Izzy’s face and steals her headband. Her special headband that she and Bayley have.She puts it on and makes crying gestures in the ring, and Izzy’s inconsolable. When she’s in tears, Sasha gets on all fours and TAUNTS HER SOME MORE, then THROWS THE HEADBAND AT HER. It’s brutal and wonderful, and the reason why shows like this and fans like Izzy matter … there’s some stuff about wrestling you just can’t do in a WrestleMania stadium, and NXT’s size, location, history and increasing popularity allows them to show that stuff to a WWE-style universe. Of course, when Bayley pulls out the victory in the final seconds, we jump to a triumphant Izzy, wearing a different kind of tears. But, you know, the same amount.
That heel work by Sasha during that moment was as good as anything I've seen in AT LEAST 5 years. Listen to the crowd, they were pretty 50-50 and doing dueling chants, and all of a sudden it was like Sasha personally offended 95% of the arena. Even watching at home, I wasn't sure how to react. I felt a bit of a lump in my throat and my eyes beginning to well when they zoomed in on Izzy's reaction, but at the same time I was also laughing, because it was such a great card to play. I don't think there is another form of entertainment that can get that reaction, at least not from me.
The roster showing up to applaud them was perfect. Watch Regal and Sara Amato share a parental hug. Watch Regal’s face when he stops being able to hold in the emotion. Watch Sasha’s when she realizes the flowers are for her, and she just collapses into herself. Everything about this was perfect, and I can’t thank everyone involved enough for letting me be a part of it as a fan.
You ever have those moments where you think somebody’s a great wrestler and could get over in WWE, and then they show up and you’re like, “wow, I had NO IDEA?” That was Asuka’s debut at TakeOver. I’ve been watching Kana for years, and it wasn’t until she popped Dana Brooke’s pose and spun around in place between everything that I realized how perfect she is for WWE TV. She’s beautiful and great at wrestling, sure, but she’s also enough of a showboaty dork (a la Finn) to seem larger than life. She just … fits.
And God bless Dana Brooke for hanging in there and being the perfect character to make the story work. Her patting Asuka on the head was amazing. The crowd reaction was just a horrified gasp, like as a collective group, like the audience was just internally screaming, "Oh my god, what are you doing?" as if they had just seen a small child kick a sleeping bear or something. Dana deserves a high-five for being half of maybe my favorite NXT debut ever. She also won with a crossface chickenwing, AKA my favorite finishing move EVER, its awesome someone is finally doing it again.
Also, maybe my favorite part was the after match, where Emma is about to go collect her friend and help her to the back, and Asuka walks over to Emma. Often in these situations, the heel will shove, or taunt the face and a brawl will start, but that was not what happened. Emma doesn't do any of those things, because she is terrified of Asuka. Emma was great here, her demeanor was that she was so scared of what could happen to her, that she couldn't even make eye contact. It was like her internal monologue was just softly repeating, "please don't hurt me, please don't hurt me" until Asuka left. One night in the company, and it wouldn't be out of line to already call Asuka the #1 contender.
As for Bayley-Sasha, this is what it feels like to watch wrestling that matters. Everything WWE’s patting themselves on the back over here is true. It’s awesome that the women have been given the main event of a live special, and a thousand times more awesome that they deserve it. It’s not a situation where they say, “people want women’s equality, let’s put a women’s match in the main to make them happy.” They learned in Brooklyn that when you have two women who are this good and have been in the company this long and have this much history, nothing can follow it. Owens and Finn in a ladder match can’t follow it. An awesome tag tournament wouldn’t follow it, either. It’s the main event because it’s the main event, and NXT’s the one place in the WWE Universe where you can trust the people in charge will notice what’s happening in front of them.
As serious as this got, I loved the funny thing on the preshow, where they asked Bayley why she wore gold at Brooklyn(because it was a championship match) and why she was wearing red and gold tonight(because it is an ironman match, and those are Iron Man's colors)
The thing you want to point out when you watch this match is the callbacks. One of the odd things WWE does is say that every PPV cycle is a fresh start, and everyone’s in-ring rivalries reset. If you wrestle John Cena once, he’ll be able to hit you with the same moves in the same way the next time you wrestle. If you learn to reverse it, it doesn’t really matter … you reversed it because you reversed it, not because of anything specific you learned from the story told in the previous match.
The callbacks to Brooklyn allowed the Iron Man match to feel like a sequel, and not look like an attempt to top it. There’s no way to “top” an emotional situation like Bayley and Sasha in Brooklyn, but if you say, “that happened, so now THIS is happening,” you allow Brooklyn to make Respect matter more than it would’ve before. There’s so much here, from the way Sasha responds with silence instead of taunting when Bayley’s in the corner, to the catching of the counter later in the match. The Banks Statement rolled back into the center of the ring saw Bayley counter it in Brooklyn, so she goes for the same counter here, and Sasha counters the counter. The poisoned rana from the top rope that meant the end for Sasha in Brooklyn gets countered at Full Sail. In Brooklyn, Sasha took advantage of Bayley’s injured hand and crushed it against the ring steps. Here, Bayley smashes SASHA’s hand in the steps.
The best part is that the moments aren’t just fan service or whatever, they tell the story of the match. Sasha’s finish is a crossface. If her hand is injured, she can’t get a grip and lock in the move like she needs. This allows Bayley to stay in the move longer, and increase the drama at the end of the match without making it look ridiculous that Bayley hasn’t tapped. Even better, Sasha sells on offense … she can’t lock in the grip, so she has to grab her wrist with her good hand for the torque. Bayley’s able to counter by gripping the injured hand and bending it back. When Sasha’s able to hit a backstabber in the final moments of the match, Bayley has a full grip of the injured hand … Sasha can’t hit the move like she wants, and Bayley’s able to roll with it, deal with the pain and lock in an armbar WITH THE HAND(almost like a modified Rings of Saturn) for the win. Even better, she stomps Sasha in the back of the head while she does it. It all ties together. It’s a story that makes wrestling real. It makes wrestling matter. The actual wrestling, I mean. The stuff they do is supposed to lead to something, not just exist to fill time before they do the cooler moves.
That sounds like a dorky point of view, but it works. Look at the crowd. Listen to them. Read the feedback from almost anyone who watched it. These matches are AMAZING, and not because they did cool stuff on a show WWE told us was important … they used pro wrestling to make pro wrestling fans feel the way they desperately, absolutely want to feel about pro wrestling. Cool entrances and funny spots and are one thing. Pro wrestling working like it’s supposed to is irreplaceable.
The emotional component missing from Brooklyn was Izzy. It sounds ridiculous to say “this ONE FAN has to be there,” but that’s part of the NXT experience. If you aren’t familiar with her, Izzy is Bayley’s superfan. She dresses like her, wears her shirt, cries when she watches her win big matches on TV and wears a special, sparkly headband that Bayley gave her, and only her and Bayley have. When Bayley returned to Full Sail as NXT Champion, she brought Izzy into the ring to pose with her.
Sasha tosses Bayley into the LED screen at the entrance, then gets in Izzy’s face and steals her headband. Her special headband that she and Bayley have.She puts it on and makes crying gestures in the ring, and Izzy’s inconsolable. When she’s in tears, Sasha gets on all fours and TAUNTS HER SOME MORE, then THROWS THE HEADBAND AT HER. It’s brutal and wonderful, and the reason why shows like this and fans like Izzy matter … there’s some stuff about wrestling you just can’t do in a WrestleMania stadium, and NXT’s size, location, history and increasing popularity allows them to show that stuff to a WWE-style universe. Of course, when Bayley pulls out the victory in the final seconds, we jump to a triumphant Izzy, wearing a different kind of tears. But, you know, the same amount.
That heel work by Sasha during that moment was as good as anything I've seen in AT LEAST 5 years. Listen to the crowd, they were pretty 50-50 and doing dueling chants, and all of a sudden it was like Sasha personally offended 95% of the arena. Even watching at home, I wasn't sure how to react. I felt a bit of a lump in my throat and my eyes beginning to well when they zoomed in on Izzy's reaction, but at the same time I was also laughing, because it was such a great card to play. I don't think there is another form of entertainment that can get that reaction, at least not from me.
The roster showing up to applaud them was perfect. Watch Regal and Sara Amato share a parental hug. Watch Regal’s face when he stops being able to hold in the emotion. Watch Sasha’s when she realizes the flowers are for her, and she just collapses into herself. Everything about this was perfect, and I can’t thank everyone involved enough for letting me be a part of it as a fan.
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Craig_MiamiFL
Footballguy
WWE is crazy if they pass up Kurt Angle vs. Chad Gable IMO
I really don't understand them giving part time deal to someone like RVD but having no interest in Angle.
I really don't understand them giving part time deal to someone like RVD but having no interest in Angle.
SlaX
Footballguy
Is RVD on the verge of crippling himself with a neck injury? I wanna see Angle back too, but he's one corner powerbomb away from being a vegetable.
Bogart
Footballguy
Sat down Sunday and watched NXT:Respect. I honestly can't say anything more or better than travdogg, but I will say it's some of the most fun I have had watching wrestling this year. Possible Finn heel turn in the works? Loved Asuka. Tyler Breeze is the NXT MVP in my opinion. I really want to know what conversations they have with him to keep him there when a Main Roster callup seems like it should have happened a long time ago. Sasha/Bailey was amazing, every part of it. The training montage felt like tip of the cap to Bret/Shawn. The intros starting backstage were amazing. The match was super outstanding. And the presentation of the flowers at the end was the perfect end.
You could almost see HHH giving Vince the finger on what type of show he can put on. It gives me hope that the main product will be in good hands when the Old Man finally steps down.
Which is good, because I tried watching the MSG special after, and it was a letdown. Didn't get to the Brock/Big Show match.
You could almost see HHH giving Vince the finger on what type of show he can put on. It gives me hope that the main product will be in good hands when the Old Man finally steps down.
Which is good, because I tried watching the MSG special after, and it was a letdown. Didn't get to the Brock/Big Show match.
Craig_MiamiFL
Footballguy
Great worker. That gimmick is just so bad it's hard to take serious with his whole selfie crap. I've skipped quite a bit of his stuff because of it.
JMO He won't last long on TV on main roster with that gimmick
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JB Breakfast Club
Footballguy
Agree. There's nothing wrong with being NXT's gatekeeper. If he does go to the main roster, I'd be interested in him and Ziggler becoming a modern Hollywood Blonds type team. That also gets Ziggler out of the singles scene, where he's just taking up space.
Bogart
Footballguy
I agree there is nothing wrong with being NXT's gatekeeper, but you are only going to make so much. At 27 years old and now 5 years in the same spot (FCW then NXT), if I am Breeze, I want that chance to get some of the bigger paychecks.
Maybe with the Adam Rose debacle, HHH is being more careful with which gimmicks translate well to the bigger screen. Love the idea of a tag team with Ziggler.
Craig_MiamiFL
Footballguy
I'm not sure how long he's had the gimmick (Breeze), but it gets absolutely no reaction in front of a crowd of wrestling marks at Fail Sail. I'm surprised they haven't already repackaged him.
The Ziggler idea sounds as good as any. With the Lana/Russev news, probably all but eliminates possible alignment of heel Ziggler & Lana. Guy is just stuck in neutral. They've reportedly played up an angle between him and Cena on Total Divas so maybe he's the one to get the US Title from Cena when Cena's on his 2 month vacation upcoming to film reality show. Cena's made the belt worth something, but Ziggler been at the US/IC Title level for too long.
The weekly product with storylines is so ####### awful. I can imagine it w/o Cena and the only good storyline on their weekly shows right now. I'm wondering if the ratings fall into the 1's while he's gone.
The Ziggler idea sounds as good as any. With the Lana/Russev news, probably all but eliminates possible alignment of heel Ziggler & Lana. Guy is just stuck in neutral. They've reportedly played up an angle between him and Cena on Total Divas so maybe he's the one to get the US Title from Cena when Cena's on his 2 month vacation upcoming to film reality show. Cena's made the belt worth something, but Ziggler been at the US/IC Title level for too long.
The weekly product with storylines is so ####### awful. I can imagine it w/o Cena and the only good storyline on their weekly shows right now. I'm wondering if the ratings fall into the 1's while he's gone.
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Bogart
Footballguy
I am kind of looking forward to the Cena vacation. Let's see who can rise to the occasion and fill the void. It might will probably suck early on, but something good has to come out of it.
And the pop when he returns should be huge. And I fully expect a chase for number 16 for WM season.
And the pop when he returns should be huge. And I fully expect a chase for number 16 for WM season.
Brady Marino
Footballguy
When I went to NXT in Columbus in June, he got a major babyface reaction even before it was announced he was facing Corbin.
Bogart
Footballguy
I'll admit, I like the model/selfie gimmick. I feel like it could work on the Main Roster using the bigger screens/better tech. Extras as paparazzi?When I went to NXT in Columbus in June, he got a major babyface reaction even before it was announced he was facing Corbin.
But then again I liked Adam Rose in NXT as well, so what do I know?
What I like about Breeze recently is that he is somehow mixing the classic narcissist heel outside the ring, with the gritty never give up babyface type behavior inside the ring. It's pretty cool.
If only he could steal Dalton Castle's ring entrance. That would be epic.
GoFishTN
Footballguy
Breeze is his repackage. He was Mike Dalton before and they told him they were releasing him if he couldn't come up with a better gimmick.
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