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***Official Soccer Discussion Thread*** (5 Viewers)

For all the flack LVG gets, and ManU gets, they are in 3rd place and really don't seem to have played all that well this year. I think if I were a United fan, i'd be happy with the season so far.

 
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Native said:
CletiusMaximus said:
Native said:
WILLIAN!!!
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Cech saved the day. Willian and Matic were awesome. A bit of luck but deserved result imo.

Back to my day job ...
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I'm probably in the minority of folks who still rates Cech higher than Courtois. And very happy for Willian who doesn't get nearly the attention of Hazard, Fabergas, Oscar or Costa yet is equally as important to the squad's attack.
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I like the guy, but that's a stretch of a hot-take.

 
Good luck selling your club Randy Lerner. A Championship team doesn't have the same meaning in England as it does in the US.

 
shader said:
For all the flack LVG gets, and ManU gets, they are in 3rd place and really don't seem to have played all that well this year. I think if I were a United fan, i'd be happy with the season so far.
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Unfortunately until they are securely in the champions league next year you cant be happy with the season. 5 points behind city, 5 points out of 7th place (Liverpool). With LVG and the money spent they should be looking better and handling teams like Burnley, Leicester etc without issue.

Happy that they are in contention and could still play better sure. Under Moyes you never felt that was possible. Its results driven so wins are good but this team looks lucky to be where they are.

 
roadkill1292 said:
Probably better to put this conversation on hold while the afternoon games are on but things would be better without owners.

I see that one result of the new contract is that the Espanyol president just said he's ready to shut La Liga down unless they get a collectively bargained TV contract like PL has. For all I know, however, this may be a routine threat tendered every couple of years.
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FWIW, I believe the non-RM/Barca sides made similar waves 2-3 years ago. This is a pretty good write-up on the state of European TV rights. The EPL teams will dwarf the others so badly that it's not even funny. The non-EPL leagues really have to come into the 21st century in terms of their TV deals (of course it may already be too late).

http://www.worldsoccer.com/features/mediawatch-rest-europe-made-premier-leagues-record-tv-deal-359644

The interesting part is it may mean winning the EPL is probably worth more than winning the CL. There's a dynamic developing that success in the EPL may end up being more important than advancing in the CL for these EPL teams.

 
Does this new deal put teams like Liverpool and Arsenal on something closer to even footing with non-EPL huge sides like Real, Barca and Bayern?

If there were 5-6 teams in England all paying top transfers and wages the EPL might get into some sort of virtuous cycle for a time.

 
wdcrob said:
Does this new deal put teams like Liverpool and Arsenal on something closer to even footing with non-EPL huge sides like Real, Barca and Bayern?

If there were 5-6 teams in England all paying top transfers and wages the EPL might get into some sort of virtuous cycle for a time.
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Short answer is RM, Barca, and Bayern will all be 3 of the top 4 earners no matter what, but it will separate them from AC, Juve, and Inter along with any other non-EPL club besides PSG. Basically it will be a top 8-10 now of RM, Barca, Bayern, PSG, ManU, Chelsea, City, Arsenal, Tottenham, and Liverpool.

It's a TBD how the Champions League money will matter for the EPL that finish 5th and 6th, but any EPL team will be top 40 European club for revenue.

 
wdcrob said:
Does this new deal put teams like Liverpool and Arsenal on something closer to even footing with non-EPL huge sides like Real, Barca and Bayern?

If there were 5-6 teams in England all paying top transfers and wages the EPL might get into some sort of virtuous cycle for a time.
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It will move them closer. According to the Deloitte money league, the only non-English sides in a better position than Arsenal and Liverpool are Real, Barca, Bayern, and PSG. And that's before the new deal. PSG is always in a precarious revenue position if UEFA adopts rules that really scrutinize self-interested sponsorship deals. There's virtually no other source of revenue available to PSG unless they start moving on players.

14 of the top 30 clubs in the last money league were English. The previous year it was 8, but it had hovered around 11 for the past 5 years or so. You have to think that will only be exacerbated going forward.

 
Sammy3469 said:
Short answer is RM, Barca, and Bayern will all be 3 of the top 4 earners no matter what, but it will separate them from AC, Juve, and Inter along with any other non-EPL club besides PSG. Basically it will be a top 8-10 now of RM, Barca, Bayern, PSG, ManU, Chelsea, City, Arsenal, Tottenham, and Liverpool.
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Exactly what I was looking for. If 5-6 teams are on close to equal footing with the top 3-4 teams across the rest of Europe combined, England has a chance to become the dominant league IMO. The place to play.

 
Some fun teams in and around the relegation fight this year. Villa looks in serious trouble and Everton is way closer to danger than a team of their stature ought to be. If Everton finds a way to lose to Leicester City the real fun begins :)

-QG

 
wdcrob said:
Sammy3469 said:
Short answer is RM, Barca, and Bayern will all be 3 of the top 4 earners no matter what, but it will separate them from AC, Juve, and Inter along with any other non-EPL club besides PSG. Basically it will be a top 8-10 now of RM, Barca, Bayern, PSG, ManU, Chelsea, City, Arsenal, Tottenham, and Liverpool.
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Exactly what I was looking for. If 5-6 teams are on close to equal footing with the top 3-4 teams across the rest of Europe combined, England has a chance to become the dominant league IMO. The place to play.
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It helps, but even assuming Liverpool win the league (and get 160 million pounds), they're only making up 40 million on Real (who sells their own tv rights which went for 120 million last time).

The talk is that La Liga is going to try to bargain collectively this time. We'll have to see how that goes.

 
I would like to think that Barca and Real would realize that having a really competitive league would not only be beneficial in the long run but necessary for them to keep up with PL. But their domestic market dominance is so great that it seems like they could line up against any 18 humpty-dumpties for league mates and fans, television and sponsors would still line up to throw money at them. It's like they see Chelsea and United and each other the real competitors and Cesena can take their 5-0 lumps and like it.

 
Looks like MLS and MLSPU have brought in a mediator. I still think there is a pretty good chance of a late deal. So much of what I read is that the owners won't accept free agency because it would endanger single-entity. But I just don't think they'd be collectively bargaining if they really thought single-entity was doing any work for them in a possible Sherman Act suit.

 
I took my daughter to our town's high school's girls' game last night. They're pretty good! And they were playing a local private school which is also pretty good.

They won 2-0, clinched the league title, but the big highlight was a kid (presumably a student at the HS) streaking the field during the second half. Thankfully he was wearing underwear. In the school colors, even.

 
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
Looks like MLS and MLSPU have brought in a mediator. I still think there is a pretty good chance of a late deal. So much of what I read is that the owners won't accept free agency because it would endanger single-entity. But I just don't think they'd be collectively bargaining if they really thought single-entity was doing any work for them in a possible Sherman Act suit.
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I believe in 2010, they brought in a federal mediator(George Cohen) and that helped them close the deal late. I look at this as a good sign overall that both sides are agreeing to independent mediation.

You might enjoy this article on single entity and free agency.

http://americansoccernow.com/articles/mls-could-retain-single-entity-amp-offer-free-agency

 
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NewlyRetired said:
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
Looks like MLS and MLSPU have brought in a mediator. I still think there is a pretty good chance of a late deal. So much of what I read is that the owners won't accept free agency because it would endanger single-entity. But I just don't think they'd be collectively bargaining if they really thought single-entity was doing any work for them in a possible Sherman Act suit.
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I believe in 2010, they brought in a federal mediator(George Cohen) and that helped them close the deal late. I look at this as a good sign overall that both sides are agreeing to independent mediation.

You might enjoy this article on single entity and free agency.

http://americansoccernow.com/articles/mls-could-retain-single-entity-amp-offer-free-agency
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Yeah, I've read what Bank has been writing. Where I differ from him and many other commentators that I've read is that I think the horse is already out of the barn on single-entity. It was really iffy when Fraser was decided, and if anything, the league has moved further away from operating in a true single-entity structure.

The league clearly understands that because the only reason why a sports league would agree to collective bargaining is to enjoy the non-statutory labor exemption. If MLS were truly a single-entity, collective bargaining would be a pretty lousy deal for the owners because they'd face no antitrust exposure whatsoever under the Copperweld doctrine.

 
Looks like the rights deals that were extended where Fox, Telemundo, and the Canadian rights deal.

I'm pondering what this means for a US World Cup in 2026. I actually think it might make the odds worse as the TV package for a World Cup in the US would be massively more here. FIFA giving that kind of coin up as a make-good seems odd. Unless of course the deals contain some sort of contingency price if the US gets 2026, which wouldn't be a total surprise I guess.

But seriously as abhorrent as Sepp is, the guy is a master of politics.

-QG

 
QuizGuy66 said:
Looks like the rights deals that were extended where Fox, Telemundo, and the Canadian rights deal.

I'm pondering what this means for a US World Cup in 2026. I actually think it might make the odds worse as the TV package for a World Cup in the US would be massively more here. FIFA giving that kind of coin up as a make-good seems odd. Unless of course the deals contain some sort of contingency price if the US gets 2026, which wouldn't be a total surprise I guess.

But seriously as abhorrent as Sepp is, the guy is a master of politics.

-QG
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'26 is theoretically a "european" cup, no? Or, have they abandoned rotating the world with Europe?

ETA - I guess we have had two outside of Europe, so maybe Europe gets it every 3 cups now :shrug:

 
QuizGuy66 said:
Looks like the rights deals that were extended where Fox, Telemundo, and the Canadian rights deal.

I'm pondering what this means for a US World Cup in 2026. I actually think it might make the odds worse as the TV package for a World Cup in the US would be massively more here. FIFA giving that kind of coin up as a make-good seems odd. Unless of course the deals contain some sort of contingency price if the US gets 2026, which wouldn't be a total surprise I guess.

But seriously as abhorrent as Sepp is, the guy is a master of politics.

-QG
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I have no doubt this is payback for Gulati publically nominating Prince Ali earlier this week and being coy with a potential US WC bid lately. Something like this just doesn't "happen".

This is all to shore up his support in the coming election by ensuring the '22 WC payoffs continue to happen.

 
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Sinn Fein said:
QuizGuy66 said:
Looks like the rights deals that were extended where Fox, Telemundo, and the Canadian rights deal.

I'm pondering what this means for a US World Cup in 2026. I actually think it might make the odds worse as the TV package for a World Cup in the US would be massively more here. FIFA giving that kind of coin up as a make-good seems odd. Unless of course the deals contain some sort of contingency price if the US gets 2026, which wouldn't be a total surprise I guess.

But seriously as abhorrent as Sepp is, the guy is a master of politics.

-QG
Click to expand...
'26 is theoretically a "european" cup, no? Or, have they abandoned rotating the world with Europe?

ETA - I guess we have had two outside of Europe, so maybe Europe gets it every 3 cups now :shrug:
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It's supposedly a non-Euro, non-Asia WC. The only confirmed bidders are Canada, Mexico, and Colombia with Canada seemingly the only real option (I seriously doubt FIFA would let Mexico be the first country to host 3 of them). There's not much difference for the rest of the world between a Canadian or US WC. Ottawa, Toronto, and Montreal are already publically supporting the effort. Throw in the other cities with Canadian football teams and you get to the necessary number of cities (not that that really matters).

 
roadkill1292 said:
Sepp is 79. Surely he won't be running things by the time the 2022 and 2026 WCs come around.
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The '26 vote is in '17, so he (when he wins) will "control" that vote. The ironic thing is the same thing could be said about the '18 and '22 votes, but he was at least surprised with the Qatar vote.

 
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Sammy3469 said:
roadkill1292 said:
Sepp is 79. Surely he won't be running things by the time the 2022 and 2026 WCs come around.
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The '26 vote is in '17, so he (when he wins) will "control" that vote. The ironic thing is the same thing could be said about the '18 and '22 votes, but he was at least surprised with the Qatar vote.
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But if he croaks in the interim not only will there be an immediate power vacuum and subsequent shift but somebody might even be able to come in and undo some of the past atrocities. I'll keep a happy thought.

 
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