***Official Soccer Discussion Thread*** (1 Viewer)

[Native]

One of the least inspiring games Ive seen the US play in some time. Poor communication between the defenders and no spacing in the attack through 80 minutes.

* Beasely was terrible. He played off his man for most of the game which allowed for EASY crosses into the box. Absolutely inexcusable for a guy whose supposed to have a tremendous work rate. He also lost control in his own half which led to the first goal. As for offense, Harkes said it best - he made more back passes than forward passes. Finally, he didnt use his speed to make plays down the wing to widen the field. Very frustrating to watch. The coaching staff either needs to rethink how they use Beas at LB or move him back to the MF as a winger because this experiment has gone wildly wrong.

* Boca and Oneyu were sloppy in the counterattack and didnt do well marking their men on crosses and set pieces.

* Marvel Wynne was awful. No ball control, no football sense, and doesnt really even look like a soccer player.

* In the midfield, Bradley's distribuition was very poor. We played a 4-3-3 which requires the the MF to create down the sidelines or over the top. Jozy and Landon werent put in any kind of position to make plays and that falls on Bradley's shoulders. Even worse, he flat out gave up on the last goal. If he didnt already have two yellows, I would bench him for the next game.

* Pablo is on the field to hold and tackle, yet was primarilly responsible for the first goal

* Torres/Adu - I thought Adu was much more adept at maintaining possession and creating attacking opportunities than Torres. I wish Bradley would give him more opportunities

* Jozy - not a lot of opportunities and looked tired out there. Still, he had a few good touches to keep possession in the Costa Rica side but they were all for naught. Still, I dont blame him as the attack leading upto goal want there

* Landon was invisible in the first half. IMO Bradley had him playing to close to goal when he should have been deeper to help with the buildup and distribuition - something we lacked sorely in the first half. Played better in the second half and the goal was important for psychologcal reasons.

* Dempsey - A non-factor in attack; he did get back on defense a few times. I just dont like this kid - seems selfish and lacks requisite creativity and control to play an attacking role

The game on Saturday night will be interesting as we need a victory to regain some composure as automatic qualification is still far from certain.

 

[prefontaine]

Lots of love for Dempsey, I see. I hope he gets to come in as a sub in the 2nd half- they could really use him.

Sad thing is that Dempsey played the first 75 minutes and it really was tough to know it. In his 15 minutes or whatever, Davies made twice (or more) the impact that Dempsey did all game.

They sub Torres out

wtf?Must've been missing his defensive duties (off-camera)... or he's dinged. ####... he looked like the best player out ther for the US.

He played well at times but I think the idea is for him and DMB to overlap and he needs to fill in at the back. He was MIA a few times when Beasley came out of position and it led to a few opportunities. I tend to think its DMB not understanding his role well enough but I can see Bradley laying the blame for that a bit on Torres. But either way, clearly the position on the field Torres was supposed to be covering created several good and more importantly, uncontested opportunities for CR. Several times Wynne got beat it was from a cross from right where Torres should have been. And while I think Torres was okay (considering this game, that's saying something) our best player was undoubtedly Bradley. He worked tirelessly from start to finish. He's really turning into a passable central midfielder on an international level. At 21 or whatever, that bodes well.

I would ask where the defense was on that goal, but I know the answer. They were standing around watching the Tico player dribble around Bradley when there were THREE players that easily could have stepped in to help.

The problem is DMB left his spot open and both Sascha and Bradley whiffed on that guy. At the end, the 3 players standing around were Beasley who came in late but had come from the spot on the other end of the pitch, Sascha who whiffed on the guy the first time and then kind of gave up on it and Boca. Boca is our captain, our central defender, and hadn't just sprinted the length of the field like the other 3. Boca has to step into that guy and take away the shot. He wasn't marking anyone else and he had Gooch behind him who should cover a drop to the middle. The defense was awful from start to finish. The positioning, particularly Wynne's, was atrocious. You can't let a guy have enough space to receive every pass on the edge of the box. DMB has no idea what he is doing - and that is obvious - but he was working hard at at least being in a guy's grill. Wynne was giving time and space to everyone like he was scared he was going to get beat. And yet he still played the roll of a Salvation Army drum the entire game. We simply don't have the talent in other spots to hide the embarrassment that is our full backs. God help us Saturday without Bradley, Sascha, Dolo, Hejduk, and Edu. I don't know who is going to play defense and cover the gaps.

 

[Moe.]

We look like we don't realize that we are playing a game. Perhaps this wouldn't happen if some of our players would earn playing time on their league squads.

Other than Beasley and Altidore don't most of the starters play pretty regularly?

 

[prefontaine]

* In the midfield, Bradley's distribuition was very poor. We played a 4-3-3 which requires the the MF to create down the sidelines or over the top. Jozy and Landon werent put in any kind of position to make plays and that falls on Bradley's shoulders. Even worse, he flat out gave up on the last goal. If he didnt already have two yellows, I would bench him for the next game. * Dempsey - A non-factor in attack; he did get back on defense a few times. I just dont like this kid - seems selfish and lacks requisite creativity and control to play an attacking role

Sometimes I see posts on here and I wonder if I'm insane or what. For Bradley, distribution starts with other players working to receive a pass and putting themselves in a position to do so. I thought the only player on our side that did that all game was Bradley. Because of this he often had the ball with no one to pass to. It's hard to tell that from the camera angles ESPN chooses to give us but I feel pretty comfortable saying that since each time a pass went upfield you could see the forwards and other mids were standing around. As for the last goal, the guy was covering for someone else (DMB) and had literally just run from the top of the penalty box to the left back position and pressured the ball after being the only guy working hard the whole game. I'm not sure what you expect but a lot of people seem to penalize players for working hard. It's certainly fair to say he failed to make the play there but to say he gave up is simply absurd.As for Demps, that comment is like bizarro to me. The thing he does bring to the table is creativity and control in attack. He does not play defense and is rather lazy at times when he is off the ball. His work rate is suspect and so he disappears too often when we don't have total control of the ball.

 

[Native]

* In the midfield, Bradley's distribuition was very poor. We played a 4-3-3 which requires the the MF to create down the sidelines or over the top. Jozy and Landon werent put in any kind of position to make plays and that falls on Bradley's shoulders. Even worse, he flat out gave up on the last goal. If he didnt already have two yellows, I would bench him for the next game. * Dempsey - A non-factor in attack; he did get back on defense a few times. I just dont like this kid - seems selfish and lacks requisite creativity and control to play an attacking role

Sometimes I see posts on here and I wonder if I'm insane or what. For Bradley, distribution starts with other players working to receive a pass and putting themselves in a position to do so. I thought the only player on our side that did that all game was Bradley. Because of this he often had the ball with no one to pass to. It's hard to tell that from the camera angles ESPN chooses to give us but I feel pretty comfortable saying that since each time a pass went upfield you could see the forwards and other mids were standing around. As for the last goal, the guy was covering for someone else (DMB) and had literally just run from the top of the penalty box to the left back position and pressured the ball after being the only guy working hard the whole game. I'm not sure what you expect but a lot of people seem to penalize players for working hard. It's certainly fair to say he failed to make the play there but to say he gave up is simply absurd.As for Demps, that comment is like bizarro to me. The thing he does bring to the table is creativity and control in attack. He does not play defense and is rather lazy at times when he is off the ball. His work rate is suspect and so he disappears too often when we don't have total control of the ball.

I guess we were watching two different games. How you can blame anyone but Bradley for goal number three is beyond me. He had him marked in the box, followed him out of the box, and then let him go by him back in the box for the goal. He simply stopped running. My mouth dropped as it was happening. I agree that Bradley suffered from not having guys like Beasely making runs down the side, but there was also no control on his part and ability to get the ball to the forwards in positions where they can create. Its not like Costa Rica was Germany on defense. Poor communication in midfield all around between Bradley and the forwards. As for Dempsey, what exactly did he do that was creative? He made very few runs on his side and was totally out of sync with his line....

 

[Christo]

* Dempsey - A non-factor in attack; he did get back on defense a few times. I just dont like this kid - seems selfish and lacks requisite creativity and control to play an attacking role

So he lacks requisite creativity and control to play an attacking role for the US but he manages to play an integral role in the attack for a team that finished seventh in the EPL?I think that says a lot more about the US than Dempsey.

 

[The Z Machine]

Kinda glad I played video games and forgot to watch tonight. Ugh. What a hot mess.

 

[TenTimes]

Is it fair to say the US has taken steps backwards since the 90's, when they seemed on th verge of becoming a world player?

Only one superstar, donovan, and seems like it'd be a great feat if they got past group play in 2010.

Are any of you happy with where the US is? Please correct me if I'm wrong

 

[TenTimes]

Kinda glad I played video games and forgot to watch tonight. Ugh. What a hot mess.

What you playing? I'm back to mario kart wii lately

 

[prefontaine]

How you can blame anyone but Bradley for goal number three is beyond me. He had him marked in the box, followed him out of the box, and then let him go by him back in the box for the goal. He simply stopped running. My mouth dropped as it was happening.

I'm guessing you've never played defense or midfield. The guy literally just made an 80 yard sprint to cover for a teammate who had gotten out of position. It's his job to do so, so let's not laud him for it. But his job is to challenge the player. He did so and got beat while gassed. That happens. Boca's job is to provide secondary support when a player crosses the middle of the box. That's his entire job. He didn't cover for the left back as Gooch did all night for Wynne. Getting beat one on one happens against skilled players. It happens even more often when you are out of breath. But unlike what had happened over and over in the game, he didn't allow the player to have space on the ball to make an easy cross. Instead, he forced him inside where he should have support from a number of players. To be clear, I'm certainly not saying he made a great play on the ball. What I'm saying is that there were a number of players on the pitch who also had responsibilities in this spot. That includes DMB, Sascha, and Pablo (was he still in the game at that point or was it Adu? Regardless, one of them). That most especially includes Boca. How you can seriously bag on the one guy that got himself in position to make a play when 4 others failed to give the effort to even be around the ball is beyond me. Again, bag on Bradley for skill, but to say he gave up on it is to totally misunderstand the situation altogether. He was the only player not to give up on the play.

 

[El Floppo]

How you can blame anyone but Bradley for goal number three is beyond me. He had him marked in the box, followed him out of the box, and then let him go by him back in the box for the goal. He simply stopped running. My mouth dropped as it was happening.

I'm guessing you've never played defense or midfield. The guy literally just made an 80 yard sprint to cover for a teammate who had gotten out of position. It's his job to do so, so let's not laud him for it. But his job is to challenge the player. He did so and got beat while gassed. That happens. Boca's job is to provide secondary support when a player crosses the middle of the box. That's his entire job. He didn't cover for the left back as Gooch did all night for Wynne. Getting beat one on one happens against skilled players. It happens even more often when you are out of breath. But unlike what had happened over and over in the game, he didn't allow the player to have space on the ball to make an easy cross. Instead, he forced him inside where he should have support from a number of players. To be clear, I'm certainly not saying he made a great play on the ball. What I'm saying is that there were a number of players on the pitch who also had responsibilities in this spot. That includes DMB, Sascha, and Pablo (was he still in the game at that point or was it Adu? Regardless, one of them). That most especially includes Boca. How you can seriously bag on the one guy that got himself in position to make a play when 4 others failed to give the effort to even be around the ball is beyond me. Again, bag on Bradley for skill, but to say he gave up on it is to totally misunderstand the situation altogether. He was the only player not to give up on the play.

Sascha and then Boca dropped the ball on that particular play- as mentioned, Bradley had just sprinted forward and then back 80 yards... would like to think he shoudln't get beat by the guy, but he did. would like to think after all that sprinting in the 80th minute (and he'd been working his ### off all game) he'd still be able to keep on his man... but Sascha and Boca were] there for support and it was them that ultimately opened up tthe opportunity. Don't forget too- Bradley was carrying a yellow and while "chasing" the attacker after getting beat, didn't really have much he could do (yeah- other than keep running).

 

[El Floppo]

Is it fair to say the US has taken steps backwards since the 90's, when they seemed on th verge of becoming a world player?

Only one superstar, donovan, and seems like it'd be a great feat if they got past group play in 2010.

Are any of you happy with where the US is? Please correct me if I'm wrong

The sky is falling, the sky is falling.The US is right where they need to be in the grand scheme of things, despite this abberation of a game.

They routinely beat Mexico anywhere but Mexico- unthinkable in the 90s. They routinely win their games at home and occasionally win games away- also unthinkable in the 90s. They routinely qualify for the WC.

There isn't a person out there who actually thought the US was on the verge of becoming a "world player" in the 90s after only having a professional league for a couple of years. But again- just look at the improvement in terms of results and in terms of producing quality- not world-class- professionals.

They're still a generation away from being a "world player" where the players develop into more than just quality by having professional soccer culture as second nature. But they are at least now at a point where on a given day they can beat any team in the world.

 

[El Floppo]

* Dempsey - A non-factor in attack; he did get back on defense a few times. I just dont like this kid - seems selfish and lacks requisite creativity and control to play an attacking role

So he lacks requisite creativity and control to play an attacking role for the US but he manages to play an integral role in the attack for a team that finished seventh in the EPL?I think that says a lot more about the US than Dempsey.

I do think Ching's absence hurt the US's shape on attack, and Dempsey in particular suffered (but he certainly didn't help himself much).

 

[Kendall]

We simply don't have the talent in other spots to hide the embarrassment that is our full backs. God help us Saturday without Bradley, Sascha, Dolo, Hejduk, and Edu. I don't know who is going to play defense and cover the gaps.

If Ching is out too then the US is really going to struggle.

 

[Kendall]

How you can blame anyone but Bradley for goal number three is beyond me. He had him marked in the box, followed him out of the box, and then let him go by him back in the box for the goal. He simply stopped running. My mouth dropped as it was happening.

Bradley should never have even had to be in that position. It should have been Beasley, who got left flatfooted, and then in the event of that, Boca needs to be the one to step up. Bradley was doing what he has been doing for the US for the last year or so, working his ### off all over the pitch. Just because one player is on a guy in the box doesn't mean you can't step in and apply additional defensive pressure to a player, this isn't field hockey.

 

[Kendall]

How you can blame anyone but Bradley for goal number three is beyond me. He had him marked in the box, followed him out of the box, and then let him go by him back in the box for the goal. He simply stopped running. My mouth dropped as it was happening.

I'm guessing you've never played defense or midfield. The guy literally just made an 80 yard sprint to cover for a teammate who had gotten out of position. It's his job to do so, so let's not laud him for it. But his job is to challenge the player. He did so and got beat while gassed. That happens. Boca's job is to provide secondary support when a player crosses the middle of the box. That's his entire job. He didn't cover for the left back as Gooch did all night for Wynne. Getting beat one on one happens against skilled players. It happens even more often when you are out of breath. But unlike what had happened over and over in the game, he didn't allow the player to have space on the ball to make an easy cross. Instead, he forced him inside where he should have support from a number of players. To be clear, I'm certainly not saying he made a great play on the ball. What I'm saying is that there were a number of players on the pitch who also had responsibilities in this spot. That includes DMB, Sascha, and Pablo (was he still in the game at that point or was it Adu? Regardless, one of them). That most especially includes Boca. How you can seriously bag on the one guy that got himself in position to make a play when 4 others failed to give the effort to even be around the ball is beyond me. Again, bag on Bradley for skill, but to say he gave up on it is to totally misunderstand the situation altogether. He was the only player not to give up on the play.

Sascha and then Boca dropped the ball on that particular play- as mentioned, Bradley had just sprinted forward and then back 80 yards... would like to think he shoudln't get beat by the guy, but he did. would like to think after all that sprinting in the 80th minute (and he'd been working his ### off all game) he'd still be able to keep on his man... but Sascha and Boca were] there for support and it was them that ultimately opened up tthe opportunity. Don't forget too- Bradley was carrying a yellow and while "chasing" the attacker after getting beat, didn't really have much he could do (yeah- other than keep running).

And I see that Pre and Floppo handled this.

 

[Kendall]

God our fullbacks are crap. I know that last night probably isn't the best way to judge a player, but I would be happy if Wynne doesn't see the field again for the USMNT for another three years. And then only in a friendly against Turks and Caicos.

 

[Desert_Power]

We look like we don't realize that we are playing a game. Perhaps this wouldn't happen if some of our players would earn playing time on their league squads.

Other than Beasley and Altidore don't most of the starters play pretty regularly?

Adu doesn't either. It is pretty problematic to have three players like that when you are suppose to have be the 14th ranked side in the world.

 

[El Floppo]

We look like we don't realize that we are playing a game. Perhaps this wouldn't happen if some of our players would earn playing time on their league squads.

Other than Beasley and Altidore don't most of the starters play pretty regularly?

Adu doesn't either. It is pretty problematic to have three players like that when you are suppose to have be the 14th ranked side in the world.

I know you know this, but I"m saying it for the benefit of some fo the other people out there...the US is ranked #14 per FIFA rankings... but this doesn't mean they are the 14th best team in the world. It means their results, based on whatever bizarro format FIFA uses, are the 14th best in the world.

I'd have to look at the other teams, but I'd guess the US is somewhere between 25-40 in terms of real-world rankings.

 

[Desert_Power]

We look like we don't realize that we are playing a game. Perhaps this wouldn't happen if some of our players would earn playing time on their league squads.

Other than Beasley and Altidore don't most of the starters play pretty regularly?

Adu doesn't either. It is pretty problematic to have three players like that when you are suppose to have be the 14th ranked side in the world.

I know you know this, but I"m saying it for the benefit of some fo the other people out there...the US is ranked #14 per FIFA rankings... but this doesn't mean they are the 14th best team in the world. It means their results, based on whatever bizarro format FIFA uses, are the 14th best in the world.

I'd have to look at the other teams, but I'd guess the US is somewhere between 25-40 in terms of real-world rankings.

True, but it is still embarrassing not to have players that start for our national team not get playing time in club. And you can tell it hurts their performance which was my point despite a misuse of should in my post.

 

[El Floppo]

God our fullbacks are crap. I know that last night probably isn't the best way to judge a player, but I would be happy if Wynne doesn't see the field again for the USMNT for another three years. And then only in a friendly against Turks and Caicos.

The spacing was horrible- Gooch and Boca were routinely nowhere near Wynne and DMB. Not trying to excuse terrible performance by either of those guys, but the US plays defense positionally, not man-to-man, so it wasn't just the flanks that hurt the team last night. Who am I kidding- they were horrible on both sides of the ball.So Torres- despite looking great with the ball at his feet, do we assume that Bradley was unhappy with his performance off the ball?

 

[El Floppo]

God our fullbacks are crap. I know that last night probably isn't the best way to judge a player, but I would be happy if Wynne doesn't see the field again for the USMNT for another three years. And then only in a friendly against Turks and Caicos.

The spacing was horrible- Gooch and Boca were routinely nowhere near Wynne and DMB. Not trying to excuse terrible performance by either of those guys, but the US plays defense positionally, not man-to-man, so it wasn't just the flanks that hurt the team last night. Who am I kidding- they were horrible on both sides of the ball.So Torres- despite looking great with the ball at his feet, do we assume that Bradley was unhappy with his performance off the ball?

 

[The Z Machine]

FYI, I was playing Civ III.

 

[El Floppo]

FYI, I was am still playing Civ III.

That game sucked a lot of years out of my life.

 

[El Floppo]

We look like we don't realize that we are playing a game. Perhaps this wouldn't happen if some of our players would earn playing time on their league squads.

Other than Beasley and Altidore don't most of the starters play pretty regularly?

Adu doesn't either. It is pretty problematic to have three players like that when you are suppose to have be the 14th ranked side in the world.

I know you know this, but I"m saying it for the benefit of some fo the other people out there...the US is ranked #14 per FIFA rankings... but this doesn't mean they are the 14th best team in the world. It means their results, based on whatever bizarro format FIFA uses, are the 14th best in the world.

I'd have to look at the other teams, but I'd guess the US is somewhere between 25-40 in terms of real-world rankings.

True, but it is still embarrassing not to have players that start for our national team not get playing time in club. And you can tell it hurts their performance.

Definitely. Asking those guys to step in and produce without getting quality minutes for their clubs was a lot- on a field like that in a place like that- a whole lot.

 

[Kendall]

I mean, I'm still at a loss here. By no means was I expecting a win last night, but I was hoping for a hard fought draw.

I didn't know Ching was going to be out, but Bradley actually picked the line-up I was kind of hoping to see (except for Wynne, before the match I was hoping more for Spector).

Howard - Played okay. There wasn't much he could do about any of the goals, and he did make some saves, but when it became apparent that Boca's head was not in the game I would have hoped Howard organized the defense a little better. Maybe he tried, I have no idea. I felt bad for him all night though.

Wynne - Pretty obvious the guy is an athlete, but a soccer player? Not so much. Guy looks like he might be the RB version of Eddie Johnson. Meaning he relies on his speed and athleticism and never really bothered to develop an understanding of the game like positioning, where and when to challenge for the ball, etc etc. Which obviously isn't going to cut it at the National team level.

Gooch - Hard to tell what his performance was really like because he spent most of the game covering up for Wynne's mistakes. At least he was trying to cover up those mistakes though, which the same could not be said about...

Boca - He had a completely inexcussable game. As the team captain and CB in charge of organizing the defense Boca just failed to show up. The back-line was completely out of sync all game long (I'll give him that the starting Full-backs in this game were both green, but still). Boca seemed lazy, out-of-position and didn't show any desire to lead these guys at all last night. Just extremely disappointing.

Beasley - I would say his time in the Starting XI might be coming to an end, but for the love of Pete he is still probably a better option at LB than Pearce. It was pretty clear DMB isn't the player he was two years ago. What surprised me most was the lack of connection between him and Donovan.

Dempsey - Largely absent most of the game. Dempsey can be nails and it really pisses me off when he is pretty much unheard of the majority of a game.

Pablo - Well Pablo got the start because he was a veteran that is composed, can tackle well and hold the ball. He did none of this last night. He brought nothing to the game. Which was surprising.

Bradley - I'm really starting to feel that outside of Howard, Bradley is the most consistent performer on the USMNT. His work rate is unmatched on the team and he is the only player on the field that seems like he cares for the full 90. Probably the best player on the field last night for us Yanks.

Torres - I didn't get to see as much of the first half as would have liked, but from what I saw he looked good on the ball, but his side of the midfield was getting run over. But well, so was Wynne on the right. I didn't think he deserved to get subbed at the half. That should have been Pablo. With Bradley and Sascha out Saturday, looks like Torres will get the nod again though.

Donovan - Delivered nothing from set pieces all game. Would either hit it right into the first defender or send it over. The US has excelled at set pieces in recent years. It has been one of the equalizing aspects of the National Team, but nothing was doing last night, and it started with the service. Other than that Donovan seemed out of it until about midway through the second half. Great kick from the spot though.

Jozy - Bless his heart. The kid got spotty service, but still, I think he did a poor job of bringing other players into the attack with him. I'm sure he can grow into a balance of distributor and focused striker, but at this point he's not there yet. This is something I would lay on Bob though. He knows Ching can't go, he knows that Jozy isn't the type of player that can slow it down and bring the mid field in at this point in his young career, so the style of play needs to be changed. Again though, maybe it was, maybe Dempsey and Donovan just weren't doing their jobs at all. I have no idea because the US played such a poor game all around.

Sacha - Did better than his game at T&T, but that's not saying a whole lot. He was okay, he tried to attack, but there just wasn't any energy from the team all game.

Adu - Wasn't on the field much, but he didn't exactly do much with the time he had. He didn't make any impact on the game, which is what you hope for a sub. He pretty much played as well as Pablo. Which isn't encouraging.

Davies - Hey! This guy tried at least. Even though he may or may not have kicked a guy in the nuts.

Just a really crappy all around game.

The line-up for Honduras could be equally as scary:

Howard

Spector Gooch Boca ?Pearce?

Dempsey Pablo Torres Beasley

Donovan

Jozy

 

[Kendall]

God our fullbacks are crap. I know that last night probably isn't the best way to judge a player, but I would be happy if Wynne doesn't see the field again for the USMNT for another three years. And then only in a friendly against Turks and Caicos.

The spacing was horrible- Gooch and Boca were routinely nowhere near Wynne and DMB. Not trying to excuse terrible performance by either of those guys, but the US plays defense positionally, not man-to-man, so it wasn't just the flanks that hurt the team last night. Who am I kidding- they were horrible on both sides of the ball.So Torres- despite looking great with the ball at his feet, do we assume that Bradley was unhappy with his performance off the ball?

Re: TorresI would imagine he got yanked because he was missing some defensive assignments and because he was the least experinced midfielder out there. I still think Pablo should have been yanked. Torres has offensive talent and was messing up his defense. Pablo has defensive talent and was messing up his defense.

 

[scoobygang]

Wynne - Pretty obvious the guy is an athlete, but a soccer player? Not so much. Guy looks like he might be the RB version of Eddie Johnson. Meaning he relies on his speed and athleticism and never really bothered to develop an understanding of the game like positioning, where and when to challenge for the ball, etc etc. Which obviously isn't going to cut it at the National team level.Gooch - Hard to tell what his performance was really like because he spent most of the game covering up for Wynne's mistakes. At least he was trying to cover up those mistakes though, which the same could not be said about...

I don't disagree with this per se, but I think that Gooch played too high and too wide in an attempt to cover for Wynne when that might not have been necessary. The one thing Wynne has is ridiculous recovery speed. If we're going to play him, then I think we need to trust him to get back when a wing beats him. I think Gooch was just as guilty on the second goal as Wynne because he was way too high to be able to take the guy who received the 1-2. Obviously, Wynne had plenty of other problems. He was willing but useless going forward and who knows how many times he let a guy sneak behind him to get to a cross?There certainly weren't many positives last night. Torres did show a knack for maintaining possession under pressure. And I did think that Bradley played hard. I though Jozy looked listless and a bit out of shape early, but he worked himself into the match a bit. He showed some effort and drew a foul or two in the middle portion of the game. He was still trying when I thought other players gave up. Even more than the funny bounces, I think the turf really affected the tackling. Did we see anyone slide for a tackle all game?

 

[Kendall]

Wynne - Pretty obvious the guy is an athlete, but a soccer player? Not so much. Guy looks like he might be the RB version of Eddie Johnson. Meaning he relies on his speed and athleticism and never really bothered to develop an understanding of the game like positioning, where and when to challenge for the ball, etc etc. Which obviously isn't going to cut it at the National team level.Gooch - Hard to tell what his performance was really like because he spent most of the game covering up for Wynne's mistakes. At least he was trying to cover up those mistakes though, which the same could not be said about...

I don't disagree with this per se, but I think that Gooch played too high and too wide in an attempt to cover for Wynne when that might not have been necessary. The one thing Wynne has is ridiculous recovery speed. If we're going to play him, then I think we need to trust him to get back when a wing beats him. I think Gooch was just as guilty on the second goal as Wynne because he was way too high to be able to take the guy who received the 1-2. Obviously, Wynne had plenty of other problems. He was willing but useless going forward and who knows how many times he let a guy sneak behind him to get to a cross?There certainly weren't many positives last night. Torres did show a knack for maintaining possession under pressure. And I did think that Bradley played hard. I though Jozy looked listless and a bit out of shape early, but he worked himself into the match a bit. He showed some effort and drew a foul or two in the middle portion of the game. He was still trying when I thought other players gave up. Even more than the funny bounces, I think the turf really affected the tackling. Did we see anyone slide for a tackle all game?

You make some good points. Gooch being out of position certainly has to do with lack of playing time with Wynne, but also I feel falls in part on coaching and on Boca. At the least Boca should be the one out there yelling at and reminding the back line when they're too high up or not deep enough and so on. Those should be his responsibilities.I saw Gooch and Sacha get to the ground a couple of times towards the end of the game. But yes, there were far less sliding challenges. I know that FIFA approved the field turf in 2003 (?) and one of the cited reasons was that Costa Rica's climate was too unstable to maintain a good grass surface, but that field is absurd. Costa Rica is opening a new National Stadium next year and I can only assume it will have turf as well. I realize that all stadiums are different, and can create a homefield advantage, but I don't see how FIFA can allow such an advantage for teams such as Costa Rica. I think the best sides in the World would have difficulty beating Costa Rica in Costa Rica simply because of the playing surface and how drastically different it is from every other pitch in the world.

 

[Native]

How you can blame anyone but Bradley for goal number three is beyond me. He had him marked in the box, followed him out of the box, and then let him go by him back in the box for the goal. He simply stopped running. My mouth dropped as it was happening.

I'm guessing you've never played defense or midfield. The guy literally just made an 80 yard sprint to cover for a teammate who had gotten out of position. It's his job to do so, so let's not laud him for it. But his job is to challenge the player. He did so and got beat while gassed. That happens. Boca's job is to provide secondary support when a player crosses the middle of the box. That's his entire job. He didn't cover for the left back as Gooch did all night for Wynne. Getting beat one on one happens against skilled players. It happens even more often when you are out of breath. But unlike what had happened over and over in the game, he didn't allow the player to have space on the ball to make an easy cross. Instead, he forced him inside where he should have support from a number of players. To be clear, I'm certainly not saying he made a great play on the ball. What I'm saying is that there were a number of players on the pitch who also had responsibilities in this spot. That includes DMB, Sascha, and Pablo (was he still in the game at that point or was it Adu? Regardless, one of them). That most especially includes Boca. How you can seriously bag on the one guy that got himself in position to make a play when 4 others failed to give the effort to even be around the ball is beyond me. Again, bag on Bradley for skill, but to say he gave up on it is to totally misunderstand the situation altogether. He was the only player not to give up on the play.

After watching the replay of the third goal, I agree that Boca is at fault as much as Bradley for failing to step up. Poor defending. That said, it doesnt excuse Bradley's failure to mark the man and keep him outside of the box. Its not like he was defending Ribery out there. The player didnt put any special moves to shake free of Bradley. Bradley either got gassed or took his foot off the pedal. Either way hes at fault and its hard to believe that so many of you are unwilling to admit that. The whole "running 80 yards" argument is moot. I understand that many of you like him for his work rate but that doesn't give him a free pass.

 

[The Z Machine]

Wow did Bradley look terrible on that 3rd goal. Like he was moving in slow motion and the other guy was at regular speed. It looked pretty lackadaisical all around on those highlights.

Oh and I'm sure that I gripe about Wynne a number of pages back. The fullbacks are not in good shape for the US.

 

[SmoovySmoov]

Not to pile on, but man..............

After trying to follow the US Men's team for years, I finally accepted after the 02 World Cup that they just weren't that good. And so, basically all the soccer I watch is in Europe. I can't stand to watch MLS, but I digress.

Anywho, I flipped over there for a minute last night, just to see if things had gotten any better. It was in the 17th minute, and they were already down 2-0. Can't really comment as to how anybody played, as I quickly turned to something else, but to be 2-0 down 17 minutes in, pretty much means you suck..............or were at least outclassed by a much better team. I never knew Costa Rica was such a powerhouse.

 

[Moe.]

We look like we don't realize that we are playing a game. Perhaps this wouldn't happen if some of our players would earn playing time on their league squads.

Other than Beasley and Altidore don't most of the starters play pretty regularly?

Adu doesn't either. It is pretty problematic to have three players like that when you are suppose to have be the 14th ranked side in the world.

Adu didn't start last night, he's not really a regular starter for the national team at this point is he? I was under the impression that Beasley probably wouldn't have been on the field if Pearce had been available. I think he's about done, he needs to come to the MLS, like you said lack of playing time and injuries have killed him, but he's not really our first choice at any particular position anymore is he? I'm sure Jozy will get to see the field a lot more next season, wasn't he injured quite a bit this year? Did Xerez get promoted? It might be good for him to get some serious pt in Spain's second division next year.Agree that Adu is not in a very good situation right now in terms of his club. Is he still owned by Benfica? It seemed like he did a good job with his limited opportunities there, and the fans really took a liking to him. I have no idea why they would loan him to a team that had no intention of playing him regularly, seems like the opposite of what you would want to accomplish with a loan. I think if we have our first choice team out there pretty much all of them get more than enough pt at the club level. By all accounts Adu and Altidore work hard in training, there isn't really much else you can ask of them, they can't force the coach to play them. You think Adu and Altidore would be better off back in the MLS playing every match?

 

[Christo]

* Dempsey - A non-factor in attack; he did get back on defense a few times. I just dont like this kid - seems selfish and lacks requisite creativity and control to play an attacking role

So he lacks requisite creativity and control to play an attacking role for the US but he manages to play an integral role in the attack for a team that finished seventh in the EPL?I think that says a lot more about the US than Dempsey.

I do think Ching's absence hurt the US's shape on attack, and Dempsey in particular suffered (but he certainly didn't help himself much).

How many times did the ball come out of the back through Wynne and Mastroeni to Dempsey? I don't remember it happening once. They were completely left-handed last night. Maybe by design. Actually, probably by design given Wynne's lack of experience. But that essentially puts one of their two best ball-handlers on an island and forcing him to pick up scraps on loose balls in the midfield.

 

[Christo]

God our fullbacks are crap.

Where the hell is Jonathon Spector?

 

[Kendall]

God our fullbacks are crap.

Where the hell is Jonathon Spector?

I hope to see him live on Saturday.

 

[prefontaine]

After watching the replay of the third goal, I agree that Boca is at fault as much as Bradley for failing to step up. Poor defending. That said, it doesnt excuse Bradley's failure to mark the man and keep him outside of the box.

There has not been one post excusing Bradley's tackling on the play. No question, he missed his assignment.

Either way hes at fault and its hard to believe that so many of you are unwilling to admit that.

This is a total strawman. Reference my multiple posts above. In each I have pointed out that Bradley missed his assignment. Or did you miss: "It's certainly fair to say he failed to make the play there but to say he gave up is simply absurd" or "To be clear, I'm certainly not saying he made a great play on the ball"?El Floppo also stressed this point by saying "would like to think he shoudln't get beat by the guy, but he did. would like to think after all that sprinting in the 80th minute (and he'd been working his ### off all game) he'd still be able to keep on his man." Everyone agrees that he made a costly mistake. What everyone doesn't agree on is your laying singular blame on him. There is quite a large difference between giving a guy a pass and recognizing the situation for what it was: a complete jailbreak where multiple people failed in their assignments.

The whole "running 80 yards" argument is moot.

Why? It goes to your original contention that: "Even worse, he flat out gave up on the last goal. If he didnt already have two yellows, I would bench him for the next game. " Several players didn't make the sprint up and down the field at all. Yet you single out the guy that did because he got beat. No one is defending Bradley's play in that sequence. But that is not what you attacked. You attacked his effort and of all the players on the field last night to attack their effort, you clearly picked the single worst example. You are giving all the players that weren't even trying to fill their assignments a free pass and blaming the guy that failed trying for not trying hard enough.

I understand that many of you like him for his work rate but that doesn't give him a free pass.

Again, strawman. No one has given him a free pass. He clearly missed the tackle in that spot. He clearly makes way too many mental mistakes. He clearly lacks the creativity out of the midfield we so desperately need. But he is also clearly our best and most consistent option at central mid at the moment and clearly gave more effort than anyone else last night by a wide margin.

 

[prefontaine]

God our fullbacks are crap.

Where the hell is Jonathon Spector?

I hope to see him live on Saturday.

How can we not? What options do we have? I figure we see something like: Jozy LD-Demps DMB-Torres-PabloPearce-Boca-Gooch-Spector

 

[The Z Machine]

I would start DMB in a 4-2-3-1, 4-5-1, or 4-3-2-1 alignment in the left winger spot. I think he's got the speed and just enough touch to make stuff happen up the left sideline. Torres might be a better option for WC2010, but I haven't seen enough to prove that to me yet. I wouldn't play DMB at left back ever again. He simply doesn't have the mentality to be a fullback, which entails making far fewer mistakes (with the ball as well as marking and tackling) than it does as a winger. A good winger can win games by providing good service and a nice structure to the offense. A bad winger looks like Dempsey last night. A good fullback looked like Puyol mixing it up with Ronaldo in the CL Final. A bad defender loses games like Wynne and DMB last night.

I'll take the shot at "not a loss" over "maybe a win" any day.

 

[walnutz]

After watching the replay of the third goal, I agree that Boca is at fault as much as Bradley for failing to step up. Poor defending. That said, it doesnt excuse Bradley's failure to mark the man and keep him outside of the box.

There has not been one post excusing Bradley's tackling on the play. No question, he missed his assignment.

Either way hes at fault and its hard to believe that so many of you are unwilling to admit that.

This is a total strawman. Reference my multiple posts above. In each I have pointed out that Bradley missed his assignment. Or did you miss: "It's certainly fair to say he failed to make the play there but to say he gave up is simply absurd" or "To be clear, I'm certainly not saying he made a great play on the ball"?El Floppo also stressed this point by saying "would like to think he shoudln't get beat by the guy, but he did. would like to think after all that sprinting in the 80th minute (and he'd been working his ### off all game) he'd still be able to keep on his man." Everyone agrees that he made a costly mistake. What everyone doesn't agree on is your laying singular blame on him. There is quite a large difference between giving a guy a pass and recognizing the situation for what it was: a complete jailbreak where multiple people failed in their assignments.

The whole "running 80 yards" argument is moot.

Why? It goes to your original contention that: "Even worse, he flat out gave up on the last goal. If he didnt already have two yellows, I would bench him for the next game. " Several players didn't make the sprint up and down the field at all. Yet you single out the guy that did because he got beat. No one is defending Bradley's play in that sequence. But that is not what you attacked. You attacked his effort and of all the players on the field last night to attack their effort, you clearly picked the single worst example. You are giving all the players that weren't even trying to fill their assignments a free pass and blaming the guy that failed trying for not trying hard enough.

I understand that many of you like him for his work rate but that doesn't give him a free pass.

Again, strawman. No one has given him a free pass. He clearly missed the tackle in that spot. He clearly makes way too many mental mistakes. He clearly lacks the creativity out of the midfield we so desperately need. But he is also clearly our best and most consistent option at central mid at the moment and clearly gave more effort than anyone else last night by a wide margin.

There are some good responses in here in my opinion. I am not the biggest Bradley fan. He has come a long way over the past 12 months. But my God, piling on the guy on that 3rd goal. Jesus, he just ran 80 yeards after running his #### off the whole match. Has anyone heard the concept of 2nd and 3rd defender. That is exactly what the heck Boca was in that situation and there he is standing at least 5 yards away from the attacker refusing to close any space. Instead he stands there and covers his nuts. That was weak. Boca was weak the whole match. Where was the 3rd defender in that sequence? The whole back line refused to close any space on the attackers. Who knows, maybe they were all a little unsure of each other with the outside defenders of Wynne and DMB. I dunno. I just think the last guy who needs to be singled out from this game is Bradley. They guy clearly gave it his all and while his all was not good enough last night he clearly outworked every single player on the US squad. Had any of the rest of the team put in half as much work as that guy the result could have been drastically different. The match Saturday is now critically important. We have to get 3 points on our home turf. The line up again will be intersting from Bradley. A mix if inexperience and experience. I never thought I would see the day I would say this but hopefully heydude can play. At least he briangs some effort back there.

 

[El Floppo]

Good comments guys...

I think it's all been said about Bradley- beaten badly for the third goal but the hardest working most consistent guy on the field for the US. (and again- the US doesn't play man-to-man, they play more of a zone which means 2nd and 3rd defenders are supposed to be there to help, which they didn't- Sascha and Boca were right there but just didn't get it done.)

re: Torres- read in an article where Bradley was asked about taking him out- response was something along the lines of "I wanted to put Sascha in there to liven up our attack". ORLY? You take out the one guy who already has been livening up the attack to try and achieve the same goal? I've got to think this is Bradley doing his best to not single out players negatively to the press and given that, he must have been unhappy with Torres' defensive work (looked terrible on that first goal... but it's hard to know what he's doing off the ball/camera).

I'm still suprised at CR's dominance in the air over Gooch and Boca.

Great posting above about LD's miserable night delivering free kicks.

In retrospect, I am really impressed with Jozy's performance. Again, the spacing between him and his MFs left a lot to be desired, but I can't fault his work (at least, on camera) and touch (although he did flub his first touch with his one real opportunity in the box in the 2nd half). Very suprised to see him go the 90.

Agree with Christo about Dempsey getting no delivery from Wynne, which denied him getting involved- good point.

Let's be honest though- even a point would've been a win for the US in CR, so 0 points isn't that shocking. Of course, the nature of the loss is that shocking. And it was always going to be a must-win v Honduras (who again looked really, really good against Mexico- suprisingly strong and fast).

If Honduras is as fast as I recall them being, don't be suprised if we see Wynne again instead of Spector. Ugh. No. I feel dirty for even writing that. We're going to see Spector.

eta: and given that MUST-WIN v Honduras... it's a reflection of how the team has grown that we are now expecting results away and wins every time the US plays at home.

 

[walnutz]

Good comments guys...

I think it's all been said about Bradley- beaten badly for the third goal but the hardest working most consistent guy on the field for the US. (and again- the US doesn't play man-to-man, they play more of a zone which means 2nd and 3rd defenders are supposed to be there to help, which they didn't- Sascha and Boca were right there but just didn't get it done.)

re: Torres- read in an article where Bradley was asked about taking him out- response was something along the lines of "I wanted to put Sascha in there to liven up our attack". ORLY? You take out the one guy who already has been livening up the attack to try and achieve the same goal? I've got to think this is Bradley doing his best to not single out players negatively to the press and given that, he must have been unhappy with Torres' defensive work (looked terrible on that first goal... but it's hard to know what he's doing off the ball/camera).

I'm still suprised at CR's dominance in the air over Gooch and Boca.

Great posting above about LD's miserable night delivering free kicks.

In retrospect, I am really impressed with Jozy's performance. Again, the spacing between him and his MFs left a lot to be desired, but I can't fault his work (at least, on camera) and touch (although he did flub his first touch with his one real opportunity in the box in the 2nd half). Very suprised to see him go the 90.

Agree with Christo about Dempsey getting no delivery from Wynne, which denied him getting involved- good point.

Let's be honest though- even a point would've been a win for the US in CR, so 0 points isn't that shocking. Of course, the nature of the loss is that shocking. And it was always going to be a must-win v Honduras (who again looked really, really good against Mexico- suprisingly strong and fast).

If Honduras is as fast as I recall them being, don't be suprised if we see Wynne again instead of Spector. Ugh. No. I feel dirty for even writing that. We're going to see Spector.

eta: and given that MUST-WIN v Honduras... it's a reflection of how the team has grown that we are now expecting results away and wins every time the US plays at home.

re: Donovan and his service -- Are we really just realizing that Donovan can not get the ball over the first defender? I am about as big a fan of Donovan as is around. However, his service off of set pieces has always sucked. Seems like he got a little bit better but really the majority of his corners and free kicks are generally sent into the wall on set pieces or too low and direct off of corners. I really wish that he would stand down and let others take those kicks.re: the expectations of how the team has grown -- Spot on there. Not too long ago most people would not even have been talking about getting a draw in Saprissa. Now there was talk of getting 3 points out there by some and that a draw would be just fine. The expectations have changed for the US team.

 

[Native]

OK I'm going to politely retire from the Bradley debate. Didn't mean to stir the pot with my comments. After all, were all rooting for the same team here.

 

[andy_b]

There is suppose to be a huge crowd at the game tonight in Soldier Field.

Sadly, but I guess predictably the media is saying that the majority of the crowd will be pulling for Honduras. This seems to happen any time we play against a Hispanic team in a large stadium. Makes it all the more strange why this game was not put in Toyota Park where they could have controlled the crowd more like they do in Columbus.

The last time the US lost a home WCQ was against Honduras in a similar situation where their fans took over RFK.

 

[walnutz]

There is suppose to be a huge crowd at the game tonight in Soldier Field.Sadly, but I guess predictably the media is saying that the majority of the crowd will be pulling for Honduras. This seems to happen any time we play against a Hispanic team in a large stadium. Makes it all the more strange why this game was not put in Toyota Park where they could have controlled the crowd more like they do in Columbus.The last time the US lost a home WCQ was against Honduras in a similar situation where their fans took over RFK.

This is dissapointing but as you say happens all too often here in the US. My wife and I were going to drive up to Chicago for the game to support the team. Unfortunately, we had some last challenges and could not make it. So, I will be watching it in TV from my house.

 

[Steve Tasker]

Wynne - Pretty obvious the guy is an athlete, but a soccer player? Not so much. Guy looks like he might be the RB version of Eddie Johnson.

 

[Steve Tasker]

Last comments since I'm out of town....

Currently in Chicago, went to the Fire game last night, have to leave in a few though. At the museums in Chicago yesterday, I saw an overwhelming number of people wearing Honduras jerseys, hats, shirts, etc. At dinner, the family next to us were decked out in all blue/white Honduras garb. I wouldn't be surprised if it's a fairly hostile environment tonight.

I didn't see the game on Wednesday (I was at the Tigers - Red Sox game that you guys were #####ing about ), only the highlights....thanks for the more in-depth recap in here. I think I'd go so far as to say it's a must-win tonight. If they draw or, God forbid, lose.....I'm going to start to get really nervous.

 

[LHUCKS]

* Torres/Adu - I thought Adu was much more adept at maintaining possession and creating attacking opportunities than Torres. I wish Bradley would give him more opportunities

Exactly, Bradley is way too hesitant with the young guys...Adu should be getting significant playing time IMHO. He was way too slow on Altidore too.I'm starting to get on the anti-Bradley train.

 

[LHUCKS]

re: Torres- read in an article where Bradley was asked about taking him out- response was something along the lines of "I wanted to put Sascha in there to liven up our attack". ORLY? You take out the one guy who already has been livening up the attack to try and achieve the same goal? I've got to think this is Bradley doing his best to not single out players negatively to the press and given that, he must have been unhappy with Torres' defensive work (looked terrible on that first goal... but it's hard to know what he's doing off the ball/camera).

Did he really say that? Torres was one of the few players not intimidated by the environment/turf.If Torres doesn't get significant playing time with Bradley out I will definitely be on the anti-Bradley Sr. train.

 

[The Z Machine]

This game is gonna be a tough one for the US. They have the quality to outplay Honduras, but the environment won't be hospitible, and they are coming off only 2 days rest, whereas Honduras is fresh.

BTW, why hasn't Kenny Cooper been given a shot? Especially with Ching hurt...

The game is at 8:00 Eastern BTW.